at 10pm, we'll be here with a full round up of the days news. first, it's newscast. so today, basically something massive happened, kind of like every hour politically, so what's the metaphors that you've been using to capture such chaos? mine on the radio earlier was "smorgasbord". oh, i've wondered when someone would say smorgasbord! smorgasbord of news. not sure what smorgasbord actually is, let's hope it is what we think it is. laura? fiasco. 0h, we've upgraded to fiasco now. i said fiasco about the party. ok, that's a significant moment in any news story when... do you think? when the f—word's deployed. let's not have fiascogate about the fiasco. but it was two weeks ago we said on the audio podcast, we said, oh, it could be partygate — and here we are! i've got really into poke bowls from my lunch lately, so i think it's a bit of a poke bowl. a what? it's like a hawaiian... it's like a bowl of rice and some tuna, then you get some edamame beans, and you get some chili, then you get some crispy onions on top, and there's just something about it... it'sjust a big combination of quite different things. so you think, whoa, are those things going to go together? and then it's actually. . . really tasty! magic in the mouth? magic in the mouth! ok, let's have some magic in your ears with this episode of newscast, hopefully it's magic. newscast. newscast from the bbc. hello, it's chris in the newscast studio, feeling very humble about myjam sandwich lunch. no, i love a dairylea triangle myself. it's laura in the same studio, but in adam's seat, i don't know why we've done this tonight. and it's adam in laura's seat in the studio, and i'm going to go in a couple of minutes, cos we've got a former cabinet minister coming in, and cos of the covid rules, we can't all be in the same room at the same time. but that's fine, i'll sit in chris mason's cupboard. so, laura, i think it's one of those weeks where you kind of, you know, open up your notebook and tell us about, as you've described it, fiasco, of this smorgasbord of edamame beans... what are we going to take from the smorgasbord first? shall we talk about plan b and england going into new covid measures first? yeah, cos if you're watching at home, you know, obviously, or listening to the podcast, there are going to be big changes again to how people live their lives, because the government is tightening restrictions on covid in england, because the omicron variant is spreading faster than anybody thought it was going to. and obviously that matters to businesses, it matters to hospitals, it matters to how people live their lives, of course. but it has already run into pretty significant tory resistance. there are a couple of dozen tory mps already on the record saying that they're going to vote against it. and it's really stirred the pot during what's already been a very awkward political moment. and the thing they're really upset about is the introduction of covid passes. so you'll have to show the qr code if you want to go to a nightclub or a larger venue, or even an outdoor venue with lots of people. but you can see the government's tried to blunt some of the criticism in advance by saying it's notjust two vaccine doses. also, they could have said you had to be boosted to get your covid pass, but they also said you could get a negative lateral flow test, and they're available for free from the pharmacy and are no mandatory intrusion in your life. and there's the sunset clause and the review points, so you see they're trying to reassure people, but it hasn't reassured the people who are annoyed, has it? because it has that kind of "papers, please" society thing about it, doesn't it? absolutely. which for plenty, particularly on the conservative backbenches, just isn't british. that's right, so you're hearing words like "draconian". there was one tory mp even yesterday who was talking about these being socialist measures, which from a conservative mp of that particular flavour is just about the worst insult that you could give anyone in their kind of view. the road to hell! yeah, you know, it's really, really stirring things up, and there's a lot of unhappiness about it. let's be clear, labour is very, very, very likely to come in behind the government, even though they don't like the way that the plans have been brought together. but they have, all the way through this pandemic, basically, backed the government. it would be pretty astonishing if they didn't next week, take the opportunity of this tricky political moment. but it is one of these things which is adding to the sense of deep, deep anger and anxiety in the tory party. and this is one on policy, even before we get to all the other shenanigans. partygate — i'm still not comfortable calling it... i don't think it's reached partygate yet. and also, you know when people say to you, "what's happening with the party?" "do you mean the conservative party, or the party that the conservative party had, the conservative party party?" you have to be quite clear which one you're talk about. let's talk about the alleged downing street christmas party on december 18th last year. that's now being investigated by simon case, the cabinet secretary. does that draw a line under the partygate for now? no, no, no. you can see they thought it might do for a bit. about five minutes. and we've learnt today, haven't we, of two other parties, gatherings, as they were euphemistically called, by michael ellis in the commons earlier on, the paymaster general. so there's one from the 27th of november, which is into what we think was this kind of leaving thing. yes, we talked about this last week, a member of staff was leaving, and borisjohnson apparently toddled along, said a few words, there were a few people sitting around drinking. it's been denied that this was a party. it was more a sort of impromptu gathering. the crucial difference between that and 18th is that i've been told by someone who was there, people were invited from outside, and invites went out, and there were food, games and drink. nibbles. yes, and the other one is the department for education. which they've coughed to, they've said it was a mistake. although they did only fess up to it after was exposed in a newspaper, so it's not like they proactively came out and confessed. no! sure, but it does point to the distinction between, in terms of how you respond to something, you say, "you know what, this was a mistake, we shouldn't have done it," it kind of hoses it down. also, the senior civil servant in the department for education was in front of a select committee that day. there was that! and it was in the canteen, and people bought their own stuff, so therefore that's not a party. maybe people had poke bowls! we're about to do something... i thought that was something in pokemon go. i'll buy you a poke bowl one day! the point despite all this, though, isn't it, is the political disturbance it's creating, which is huge. it's not really about whether there were poke bowls or dairylea triangles at a party. as a result of this, i was always surprised when i came back to westminster full time at the start of this year how many people in the conservative party would openly speculate to you about when borisjohnson wasn't prime minister and who could take over from him. and i was really surprised that this early in his prime ministership... that's a never—ending he westminster conversation, who's the next prime minister. because they all want to be it! as a newbie, i was surprised how easy it was to get people to talk about it, but it's actually become even easier this week! yeah, because it's a real serious conversation now, right? so it's not frivolous leadership speculation, which you're right, politicians in all parties love and adore. they love talking about themselves — sorry, but it's true. they love talking about their own ambitions, and often very noble ambitions, to try to do what they think the right thing is for the country. but the fiasco of the last few weeks has meant that this is a conversation that is now happening very overtly in the conservative party. overtly covertly. yeah, very overtly covertly, but also i think seriously. and i think it's far fetched to consider that right now there's going to be an immediate challenge. although one former minister said to me today he'd had two approaches in the last few days to "put in a letter", and that's tory code for putting a letter to the boss of the kind of shop steward for tory mps, greg brady of the 22... and that's proof of organisationing. ..to trigger a leadership contest. but i'm just saying, to underline it, i think to talk about something immediate is a bit far fetched. but there are absolutely conversations about how they might... ..what life after boris johnson might look like. and there were all sorts of sort of great metaphors whizzing around. i mean, one very experienced mp said to me, look, stage one of the tory leadership transition where everybody agrees that the prime minister might be running out of road, is complete. we are at a stage two where we talk about, you know, who, how and when, and stage two often takes a very long time. so there's two different things, you know, you listen to the first half of that, you go, "oh, my god!" imminent! but these conversations are happening. now, another senior mp said to me, look, this is fixable, it can be fixed, and borisjohnson has a chance to do this, but there's such intense pressure on him basically to sharpen up. and i'm going to do it — i'm going to open my notebook because i can't help myself. here we go. so this is someone who backed borisjohnson, 0k, just to be clear. "it's like a theme park of soft decision making in number ten. "the helter—skelter, the lost in space, there's the final ride, which is make the decision and if you can stick to it by the end of the ride. they all have to be shut down — we need not to have a fairground. this is the big moment when every politician has to face up to the reality of who they are. he needs to be honest about himself." a colourful phrase maker! isn't it? a very colourful phrase maker who, of course, shall remain anonymous. but it was interesting, this person went on to compare this situation actually to westland and margaret thatcher. so, you know, when a politician, a prime minister, has a terrible moment, they have to look themselves in the mirror and think, "0k, what do i do?" "do i carry on like this, or do i actually make some tough, honest decisions about how i comport myself?" "or do i need other people around me?" and making those comparisons with those affairs of the past that have defined a leadership or pointed to a kind of pivot point in a leadership — quite something. that's what's so interesting about it. also, that theme—park metaphor is quite a good one as well, because everyone loves a trip to a theme park, but actually you wouldn't want to live there. there you go! you go there for a thrill at the weekend, and then the rest of the time you're at work, knuckling down. and you're relieved when you get off the ride. yes! oh, my god, a metaphora minute, you have to queue for ages for it to start, and it costs a lot of money! someone in cabinet said to me a couple of weeks ago said, we're all living on planet boris, but planet boris doesn't have any rules, right? but there's always a danger in political stories that people just get completely carried away with the narrative. and let's remember, and in fact i think we've sat in the studio and said this literally before, when borisjohnson actually quit as foreign secretary, and i think we were sort of saying anyone whoever says he's a busted flush and it's all over is talking... it was you and i stood in the sunshine outside his place. yeah, they're talking nonsense, you know, this is a man who's made a successful career and ended up in number ten based on a love of flouting convention. and it would be so easy for people to sort ofjust get completely carried away with this inside the tory party and think that somehow the moment is gone. but, you know, two weeks ago when we had the owen paterson affair, we were saying, "0h, could this be a tipping point?" "could it be a turning point?" who's got any idea? does it now feel as if this is quite a criticaljunction? yeah, i've got to tell you two little anecdotes from speaking to cabinet ministers on zoom. so grant shapps, so i was putting to both grant shapps and to the defence secretary, ben wallace, about all all the big names. such as proof, but congratulations to them, that's an exciting moment in any one cosmic life, butjust a reminder that this is not a normal job so you can'tjudge it by any normal staff. and yes, this is yet another reminder this week, isn't it, for the umpteenth time, that borisjohnson is not a normal prime minister, and british politics in the 2020s would yet again be likely to be turned down by any publisher looking for a political drama forjust simply being too far fetched. do you reckon it's time to open the studio door and bring in our newscast guest for this week? i think we should. robert buckland, former cabinet minister, formerjustice secretary. so, adam, we've got that thing, haven't we, that awkward social moment when the three of us are back in here, but we can't really have a fourth, cos that's a bit much in these covid times. i'm going to listen to robert buckland, but not see him, cos i'm going to go and sit in your cupboard. give him my love! oh, well, thank you, enjoy the the boutique of news. i promise i'll go in the cupboard next week, i've not had a turn in there yet. that's true, but we've had you in your spare room at home. that's true, or in a cab or walking around or wherever else. back of taxis, all of that. well, thank you very much for taking my seat in the studio, and welcome robert buckland, hello! hello, good to see you and thank you for being so kind! _ we've done our own reshuffle, hopefully that doesn't bring back too many bad memories for you! 0h! thank you! moving on! you are a trained lawyer, you were thejustice secretary for quite a long time, so a lot of your career has been about fairness, proportionality, what is just. do you think the plan the restrictions, and covid certificates in particular, kind of tick all the boxes of fairness and proportionality? i think that we are getting into the right place. - i think that experience has taught us throughout this pandemic that| i being wise after the event isn't. really good enough when it comes to what we need to be doing to control the proliferation l of this disease. and i think we've also| learned about the way in which we bring the public with us on these measures. _ this is quite a different challenge. from previous ones where we have done well with delta, - we have got the boosters being rolled out, and the public can be perhaps forgiven for thinking, i god, not again, really? is this going to be i lockdown territory? are we really going to have another christmas like - the one we had before? i get all that sentiment. but at the same time, | the british public now, two years into this, . have learned as well, and they are not stupid, _ and already you are seeing decisions they are making about their own lives, you are seeing, _ even around london, - you are seeing fewer people. you are seeing people scaling back perhaps on their activities, - and therefore i think— they will accept these measures, or the bulk of these measures, as proportionate, particularly. facemasks, ithink, having certainty and continuity. and consistency is helpful. i think stay at home advice and guidance, again, - something people understand. covid passes, a bit of a more vexed question, i would say. _ | but i would say there needs to be| more of a mission to explain here, and if there is new material or information that perhaps i and others haven't. seen, well, bring it on. let's face it, though, robert, a lot of this is made deeply, deeply difficult for the government by the fiasco that has been going on in and around downing street, whether that is over the parties or over borisjohnson and his seeming inability, according to the electoral commission report, to get a grip on his own personal finances. you know borisjohnson well. how much do you think that the shambles that's developed in the last few weeks is damaging his brand as a leader, and your party's brand in the view of the public? you need public goodwill at the moment to cope with the pandemic. how much damage is being done? we do, and, look, ithink the tone he struck in- prime minister's questions yesterday was actually the right one. _ two weeks for an apology? i think he made it very clear that he got public concern. and public anger about this sort. of perception that you do as i say, not as i do, which clearly i think. he understands very well and has the capacity of undermining the messaging and - confidence in the system. let's not dance around this, it's a problem, course it is. i let's cut to the quick on all of this, because the overlapping thing around all of this, whether it be the stuff about the flat or the stuff about the parties a year ago, is the allegation that gets levelled at boris johnson, by labour and others, it was asked directly in the lobby briefing for westminster reporters at lunchtime today, which is that — has the prime minister lied? that's a huge word and yet it's one now that is being frequently thrown around by the government's opponents. and that's dangerous, isn't it? look, this prime minister is not unique in having had _ allegations thrown at them. all right, this particular set of circumstances, l you know, everybody loves — something about wallpaper i and westminster. i remember derry irvine's wallpaper when he was i lord chancellor a few before me... did you ever buy any flash wallpaper? no, i don't. i much prefer a plain- emulsion, so much easier! magnolia? have you ever tried| hanging wallpaper? it's a nightmare! no... cutting around the curtain rails! nightmare! nightmare, and i gather- that the wallpaper in number ten started peeling off or something, i heard that story. _ but we won't go there! you just did! but look, people accuse politicians, usually from another party, - of being economical with the truth, lying, this is nothing new. - let's just strip away all of that and come back to, i think, - a fundamental point here, which is, you know, - government is really hard. it is exhausting. tell me about it! i spent years doing it. not at the prime ministerial level, which is another dimension again. | and i think it is really important in those jobs that you work - as smartly as you can. you use all the resources that you have at your disposal, - lyou trust in some of the systems| of government, and that you have that sort of capacity to govern. so, what does he need to do now then to get back on the straight and narrow? borisjohnson is the greatest campaigner of ourage, - he's a fantastic campaigning - politician, but we have got so much content as a government that we need to do. - let's actuallyjust get - on with the job of governing. that might sound a bit boring, it might sound a bit mundane, a bit dull, but you know what? i think that's what we need. i have spoken to many, many mps and ministers this week. they are talking, privately and amongst themselves, about whether boris johnson is still the right person to be in number ten. you know that unless you've been going around with your fingers in your ears all week or only talking about wallpaper! do you worry, as somebody who knows him well and as somebody who i'm sure wishes him well, you know, you didn't leave government because you fell out. no, exactly. do you worry that this could turn out to be a very dangerous moment, some kind of turning point? and, actually, a lot of your colleagues have been saying privately, it looks like he is past the peak of his powers. look, you are right, i do wish him well. i i know he can do this. but at the moment i think, - if i was him looking in the mirror, i'd be saying, surely i can do this better. _ and that sort of capacity for self—improvement. and intelligent, just - a recalibration of the way things are done, i think, . would be a sensible move. he can do this, he can do it, but, you know, first of all, _ there has to be an acknowledgement that it can be done better. _ i promise we will talk about some of the things you are working on now, which are really interesting, but do you think he could do with a different team in number ten to help him do that? well, you know, we can talk- about moving scroggins and boggins and having new titles l and where they sit, it's all nonsense, frankly. it's about him. ultimately, yes, it is, - but it is also about making sure that we attract the sort of calibre and team who are not frightenedj to say truth to power - and who work as equals. i'm a great believer— of the doris kearns goodwin school of history, that wonderful book, |team of rivals, where this hick| country lawyer from illinois becomes . president, everybody thinks he's l a bit ofa... not up to it, he deliberately- fills his cabinet with strong people who all, by the way, _ think they can do the job better than him, and he ends up being one of the greatest presidents _ of all time because he was confident enough to have. strong people around him. ithat, i think, is a great model. for how you'd run a government. too many yes—men and women around him at the moment? well, i think people have to summon i up the blood and not be frightenedl to say what they think. do it in a professional way, of course, but that's - what collective decision—making is all about _ once you have reached the collective cabinet decision, that is fine, - you stick by it or you get out. but before that point, | there should be plenty of opportunity for cabinet ministers or others to have that vigorous - debate, probably in committee, - that's probably the best place to do it, and then for cabinet to sign off on those decisions - or to have further discussion if there isn't agreement. - robert, i wanted to ask you about your daughter, who was diagnosed with autism, i think, when she was ten. it's quite striking, isn't it, that fewer girls, fewer women, are diagnosed, than boys and men, and ijust wonder what your reflections on your own personal experience are, about that and what needs to change around that? ok, she was a bit younger than that, - but i still find it quite difficult - to talk about the moment i heard, | because part of me was relieved, | frankly, that the system was recognising there i iwas a condition and, therefore, | statutory services, statementing and all that was going to follow. but there was also part of me that was really, i | really upset, because suddenly, | you know, the life path changes. and that is something i think a lot of people who've been _ through the same experience really i find very difficult to talk about. . just composing myself for a moment, moving the debate more widely, - i my strong feeling ever since that| time was that there were too many families going through this. everything was always a fight. i think now where we are is that |actually diagnosis has improved and we're getting a lot more of it, but then the next question - of "what happens now?" is not being answered, - particularly for young adults. they go through the system i and very often we have some brilliant special schools, like the ones in swindon that we have, which are fantastic, but they get to 19, 20, _ 21, or25, and there's nothing — nothing. i and suddenly you've got young people sitting at home doing nothing. - the employment rate for autism is two out of ten adults. - for the general population, it's eight out of ten. - for disability, generally, it's five out of ten. - this means there are hundreds- of thousands of people who are not fulfilling their potential, and it seems to me that unless we scale up research- into what type of support and care works, and that sort of drive to open up potential, - then we are just going to notjust fail people, it's going to cost - us us all as a society - a huge amount of resource. you know, autism isn't a disease, it's not — i it shouldn't be seen as a problem. in many cases, it's a gift. ithe human brain, in its different| permutations, is an extraordinary thing, and people with autism have so much to offer. _ ijust think, again, _ that sense of wonder and potential out there is such an important part of what i'm trying to do. _ and, robert, what are your hopes now for your own daughter? what i've been encouraged by is the support that - she's had in school, - and the things that she does and the things she's able to do with trained support. - it'sjust wonderful- to be able to have that. but in adulthood, you know, i'ld like to think that she's . going to be able to live - independently with support and, you know, maybe even have a job of some sort or some activity- that is meaningful for her, - and that we don't sit injudgment on the quality of her life in a way| that i think actually does damage to the whole issue of autism. and disability more generally. i think we can do that, . but we are going to need, through the autism strategy, - and through the accommodation, the housing issue that is being addressed in the social care i white paper, we really need to focus on that. l because in the big social care debate, we naturally talk- about elderly people, - but we never properly talk about the adult with disability issue and the fact that many. families will have 20, 30, 40, 50 years of care responsibilityj for an adult with disability. and i was the only one in cabinet who talked i about this back in september. and we've just got to keep on banging the drum. - and that's why i didn't vote - with the government on the health bill recently because if we don't cover the question of adults - with disabilities, we are really not answering the issue. _ robert, thank you so much. this is why i love doing newscast, because we get to stir the pot with you as a politician and then our little family gets to hear more about your family in a kind of really sweet way. so thank you very much. thank you and you got a lot out of me there! | thank you so much. thank you. thank you, lovely to see | you and to speak to you. thanks for tuning in to this episode of newscast. we will be back with another one very soon. bye. bye, everyone. bye. it's been quite a chilly day and we've got a cold night on the way, a widespread frost expected in the early hours of saturday morning, particularly across eastern and central areas of the uk. many towns and cities will fall to around freezing or below. but out towards the west, not quite so cold — in fact by this stage on saturday, the weather will be turning milder as an advancing warm front brings cloud and also some outbreaks of rain. of course, when i say warm front, relatively warm for this time of year, because it won't be all that warm at all. in fact, cloudy with outbreaks of rain lasting all afternoon — yes, it's12 celsius out towards the west, but not particularly appealing. 6—8 celsius for the east of the country, still fairly nippy on saturday, anywhere from aberdeen down to norwich. it'll turn milder as we head toward sunday and into next week, temperatures in some parts of the country could be around 13—14 celsius. confirmation from official new data that the omicron variant of coronavirus is growing much faster in england than delta. omicron could be the dominant variant in the uk by next week. a senior cabinet minister says the situation is seriously worrying. we face a deeply concerning situation. we know that we have the highest number of covid infections across the united kingdom recorded today since 9th january. we know that the omicron variant is doubling every two to three days in england and possibly even faster in scotland. its first minister nicola sturgeon warns of a "tsunami" of omicron cases and cautions against christmas parties. today's analysis shows two doses of a covid vaccine provide much lower levels of protection against omicron, but a third booster increases it significantly.