to get this done. so from my perspective, if in fact you were simply to take it off the table, you re going to have a lot of people. and from a straight political standpoint a lot of those people are going to be the president s supporters, the president s base. yeah. that s what s going to happen. i live this every day. so i can t have a theoretical conversation about this because i live this every day. mr. binion. every american lives this every day. and what their personal experience with obamacare has been is that the cost of their health insurance premiums have gone up. you cannot speak for every american when you say that. that s a blanket statement about the people that you know and you talk to. i just have somebody sitting here at the table who s in the health care business. don t speak for all americans about what s happened. there are there s data that shows what s happened to costs. that it s gone up. insurance always goes up. insurance premiums go up. hello.
because what we re doing i love talking with ali velshi about this. i wish he was here but he s having a life. and what he i think pointed out this week which was so important and i think so fundamental to this debate we re having politically is that when we talk about health care we tend to lump everything in together. there really are two health care markets. there s the nongroup the three, the non-group market. people who buy their own insurance, small business people, people who really a lot of times i ve met don t like obamacare because for them some of their costs have gone up. in some regions, we have a map shows in a few regions i think 38 counties there s only one insurer. so in some cases non-group people have suffered. that needs to be fixed. that s about 10 million people. then you ve got the bulk of americans who get their insurance the way i do, through your employer. yeah. and they only benefitted from obamacare through important things like free mammograms, serv
you the last word. have you ever known a year in american history in your adult life when insurance premiums on an annual basis have gone down? no. i mean, look, there are winners and the cbo says this bill will make them go down. maybe next year. no. for people that buy high deductible plans, the small tiny slice of the public who you only see. you don t see anyone else. the rest of the people are invisible to you because you re thinking about that wealthy affluent business owner who doesn t want to buy insurance for their employees. and yeah, maybe they hate obamacare. but what about everyone else? i m sorry. i was trying to give jonathan cohn the last word. go ahead, jonathan. i was going to say there are winners and losers in all of these policies. there are certainly people under obamacare paying more, there are a lot of people paying less. and the key is what you said if you go to the senate bill, look what happens, the true premiums eventually come down but that is bec
market into chaos, right? i don t think so. i think the markets would respond the way we expect a free market to respond. we know that free markets bring competition between firms when they re competing for your business, they re going to offer a better product at a lower price. part of the reasons premiums have gone up so high is because of obamacare. i expect premiums to get a lot cheaper if obamacare were to be repealed. i think what we re seeing from the president with that tweet, with his statement that if repeal and replace doesn t happen, he s still committed to keeping his campaign promise. president trump is absolutely committed to keeping that promise and all of his campaign promises. but no, i don t think that we should expect the insurance markets to collapse. really? if republicans do what they say they re going to do. if there was a robust market to insure the people who were added to the insurance rolls under the medicaid expansion, these are basically the workin
but that s true. hold on. you re basically saying if people can buy more junk insurance, insurance that really doesn t cover much, insurance that has low premiums but insurance that covers the things they want. that are basic things. and most people like the services that they re getting under obamacare, the free mammograms, et cetera i think most people want to pick the services they get, not have the federal government would they also pick to be uninsured? because you keep on saying that people would voluntarily disenroll from insurance. and there s no would you voluntarily disenroll from insurance? i didn t say that. the cbo said it. no, the cbo said they would lose insurance. said very specifically they would lose insurance. they said a few million would voluntarily leave lose their insurance. and the only people who would voluntarily dis-enroll and the only people who actually again get lower premiums are people who don t want to pay the penalty under