morning joe weekend pick it was another fast-moving newsweek . here are conversations you might have missed. >> president biden and the vice president rallied in philadelphia, the event was the launch of the outreach to black voters. >> because black americans voted we our president and vice president of the united states, that is because of you, that is not hyperbole. that is because of you. with your vote in 2024 we will make donald trump a loser again. when someone shows you who they are believe them the first time. you have got it, kid. you have got it . i have shown you who i am and trump is show you he is. today he is pandering for your vote so he can win for himself, not for you. donald trump i have a message for you, not in our house and not on our watch. america has always been a place where we work towards a perfect unit where those are excluded in the past are included today. i still believe that. i am still optimistic but i need you. my question is a simple one . are you with me? talk to your family. >> a chant of four more years. great to have you with us. let's spread this around a little bit, jennifer, i will start with you about the initiative to bring the base home. he actually, if you read that analysis today, he is doing well in places you may not have expected, older voters, white voters, so now it is a matter of bringing the base home. >> i think what yesterday showed you, if you look at his calendar it is telling because he most valuable thing is the candidates time and how they are spending hints -- his time in showing up. doing black radio, they know they need to make up ground here. what he has going for him is his record is better. the challenge is how the trump campaign is running on this campaign of economic nostalgia, right? going back the covid and reminding people it was a time that felt better. that is true, it did feel better to most people . it is not in on the level argument, as my mother would say, but it is working to some degree so president biden is using his time and resources to reach out to communities of color, that is where they need to make up ground, to bring those voters home, show them there is a reason to vote for president biden. >> it was a big crowd yesterday. what work does the president and vice president need to do to earn back the trust? >> i think they have to continue to do in terms of showing up. the vice president has been on this economic opportunity tour and it is specifically tailored to speak directly to, not just black voters, but black men specifically and black business owners, talking about what the administration has done for black small businesses. we talk about the pandemic, black businesses were guided by the pandemic, more than 50% of them closed their doors. the opportunity to build the back, if you will, the opportunity for black businesses to build back under this administration has been phenomenal but they have to talk about that. they have to talk about the unfinished work and what they would do if elected . every time i am traveling people are like why are the numbers not resonating with folks supporting president biden and the vice president? for people who are just trying to pay their bills, people who are renters or aspiring homeowners it is extremely expensive to do those things right now. the campaign has taught about the president and vice presidents plan to attack housing, for renters also people who would like to purchase. there is a plan around credit to first-time homebuyers. that was a plan they did have in the first term that congress could not get through so that is some of the unfinished business that speaks to the heart of what people are dealing with every day and they need to hear about those plans. the student loan peace, people think president biden has not done much on student loans, that is false, there are so many people, i know people who got their student loans forgiven last week. this is something that touches so many people. i am talking about older millennial's, people who are even older than that will have student loans, that student loan forgiveness is affecting them too. they have to hear about it. >> you have been asked this question 1 million times. off of what was just said why is it that the administration and president biden is now, of porting to some people, competing with donald trump for the black vote in the black communities in this country? how can that be the case when he has a lifelong record of positive movement from the black community and his administration has the same? >> it is also how he became the nominee in 2020. i think if we talk to the campaign they will tell you, one is there is a challenge the campaign is facing that it hasn't settled into everyone that donald trump is the actual other choice in that is the alternative. there is still people who aren't paying attention. that is part of what they will argue. that is why they are eager to get on the debate stage. the other factor, you can see it in some of the coverage, things like housing costs, higher interest rates, who do they impact? they impact people who are low income, living paycheck to paycheck, they impact some of the demographic groups that president biden is struggling with. that is sent area where he has a good story to tell. it is quite similar, i was on the campaign in 2012, the argument was not ace i have solved every economic problem for you, it was i am the better fighter for you to do and the other guy. the last thing is a has started to draw the contrast, obviously president biden is showing up in places, they have to move on for credits of accomplishment and make it about the contrast of what a biden and trump president since he would be. it is really about living people home. >> morning show weekend will be right back. right back try dietary supplements from voltaren, for healthy joints. we're still going for that nice catch. we're still going for that perfect pizza. and 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re-enslaved with an even bigger problem, a worse affliction and addiction, a bigger delusion, james baldwin would say, the national suicide, as mr. lincoln prophesies. do not be seduced by easy equalization. there is nothing equal about this equation. we are at a crossroads in our political and civic lives. this is a choice that could not be clearer. >> wow. the award filming filmmaker joins us now, he is the recipient of the national constitution center's liberty medal illuminating the nation's greatest triumphs and tragedies and inspiring us to learn about the principles at the heart of the american idea. great to have you on. i want to start with the american idea. everything you said jumped out at me. you said do not be seduced, i think that is so important in the age of the cult of trump, even more important you used the word fragile. i don't think people understand just how fragile the democracy is. can you explain how easily it could be unraveled? >> i think all you need to do is go back, good morning, go back to we year in 1932 to put want to be where everything was great with ideas and politics and arts and architecture in the movies and painting, there would be no better place on the planet than berlin. the next january not so much. soap what we learned from the study of authoritarianism, from desperate's, is these democratic institutions are fragile because the covenant of democracy is a new thing . we invented it. it said we would not be a subject we will be a citizen. we are going to build institutions in which we have to, just like driving down the road, we trust people won't cross the line. we need to trust each other. there is a them. there is no them i tried to say in this. it is really not about president biden or trump, it is about this tennessee for us to other and make it an argument but not a story. we also have a responsibility. we have been so focused, in the quarter of my screen, it is like we are waiting for the train wreck of the trial. we used to have an airplane hangar where he would arrive to say some bad things. we have not allowed, the only thing where trickle-down economics works, is in the media. president biden has the third greatest legislative accomplishments in the last hundred years and people don't know about it because we have been more interested in the argument of guilty or not guilty or this outrage or that out which we have missed our responsibility to help . the other thing i was add too is in the other ring everyone does it, we do it too, we need to reach out to trump voters, we need to listen to them. their guy is doing that, we need to remind them that so many of the things that keep them at the level they are at, paycheck to paycheck are there because of things that president biden and barack obama have done for them and not allow them to be completely seduced by the story the desperate's tell, that if we get rid of these people or this problem that things will be better. it is on all of us to speak to each other and tell stories not make arguments. >> let me try and respond to a lot of that, as it pertains to responsibility. i think there is a fine balance from covering the trial or looking at the consequences of a certain type of behavior or looking at anti-democratic behavior or looking at a crime being committed and admitted to by a former president. ignoring that is almost being a part of what, i think, fascist do, which is desensitize a population. so i think it is a fine balance that no one is perfect at striking and looking at the accomplishments of president biden because they exists, by the way, they are historic, actually, not about us, it is not how we feel about them they are historic. so that is a balance i think the media struggles with but then there is the other issue of networks, websites, that tell lies. that complete the corrode the truth. that make it looks like the presidency has ruined the economy and that is just where it begins. i guess now let's talk about responsibility of the american citizen. how do you explain that responsibility at a time like this when you need to look at history in order to understand what has happened and shape the future, but you have a firehose of lots of different things coming at you. >> that is the question. you framed it so beautifully. i don't think we entirely know the answer. we to know, that as the novelist richard potter says, all we do is argue and we need to learn to tell stories. we find ourselves in silo just by the way things are speaking to the converted, everyone is going yes, i agree. what i have tried to do is tell stories that do not have a america in front of it, to say these are stories that we share. if we reclaim a shared history that is diverse and complicated, has all the elements of a good story, then we don't get stuck, which i was trying to say, was about this coming election. it was really about our responsibility to each other not to completely always go into the binary, black or white, or straight, everything we do so the responsibility i think goes back to the ancients, it is not even american democratic founding . it is no yourself . mark twain says nothing so needs reforming as other people's habits. we are always happy to tell other people what they are doing wrong. all the work of life, in our communities, of course in the government, comes from our own self-discipline. our own willingness to choose virtue over vulgarity. that is what we have got to be talking people about and asking them, making those clear distinctions, as you said . also telling the more complicated stories about how democracy works. dictators always say, look, i have the easy solution. here is how we do it. we take 15 million people and get them out of here. or we stop the press, which is noisy over here, or we do that, all of a sudden people become susceptible . thomas jefferson said it, all experience has shown that mankind are more disposed to suffer while evils are sufferable. he is saying, the history of human beings we have been subjects. we have been superstitious peasants under some authoritarian rule. you are going to have to be a citizen and he will be individual responsibilities, the first of which is to vote. that is hugely important, but it requires being informed. the time of our revolutionary field i am working on we are reading thomas paine, the new hampshire gazette, we were getting reports from georgia. people wanted to be informed. now we just listen to what we want to hear and it reinforces how bad the other is. i think they were right, you need to start altering the narrative to have conversations, to make clear distinctions, but also remind people of this fundamental responsibility. that is why your question is so central to the survival of our republic. >> the full commencement address to brandeis is online now through his digital platform. in emmy award-winning filmmaker, ken burns, thank you so much. thank you for delivering that incredible commencement address in generating this conversation. coming up, the debate on whether the biden should have had his campaign speak outside of a courtroom where the former president is on trial. do you want to close out? should i? normally i'd hold. but... taking the gains is smart here, right? feel more confident with stock ratings from j.p. morgan analysts in the chase app. when you've got a decision to make... the answer is j.p. morgan wealth management. smile! you found it. the feeling of finding psoriasis can't filter out the real you. so go ahead, live unfiltered with the one and only sotyktu, a once-daily pill for moderate to severe plaque psoriasis, and the chance at clear or almost clear skin. it's like the feeling of finding you're so ready for your close-up. or finding you don't have to hide your skin just your background. once-daily sotyktu was proven better, getting more people clearer skin than the leading pill. don't take if you're allergic to sotyktu; 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>> they are afraid biden is going to lose, biden this, biden that. the campaign is working hard . i think that is obscured by all the whining going on in manhattan, in georgetown, in beverly hills. they need to stop and get to work . >> i think you both have really good points. we have one party that respects american democracy so that is a lot of responsibility and democrats need to say violence is bad, confrontation is bad, we need to live in a country where we respect each other and treat each other well . again, political violence is the most dangerous thing going and we all have to make sure we say it is important we keep the temperature down. i think you are totally right too, joe, i was at a dinner party in georgetown this weekend where people were freaking out. it is not like he is running against mitt romney, he is running against someone who has said he will start deportation squads and he will go after his political rivals and he is going after the mainstream media. >> so much is at stake. nothing less than american democracy is at stake. in my opinion, i am just saying, the whining at cocktail parties doesn't help. if you want to do something volunteer. if you want to do something write a check . if you want to do something go to a swing state and ask how you can help . i am just telling you, everyone that is watching, a lot of times, before alabama went onto the field i knew they were going to win. i knew they were going to win. again, forgive me for the sports comparisons, but we would be down 14-0 at half-time and nobody would be worried . we are going to wear them down. we will win at the end. everyone take a deep breath. i feel that way about biden. they have done this before. they are on the ground, they are building from the ground up . they are disciplined . i know people think trump has some magic potion. maybe elvis 57, from 1957, this is old, tired, elvis presley. people know it . at the end of the day blocking and tackling, grinding it out they after day from may until november makes a difference. >> it does, your point about the whining of democrats, they have got to turn it into anger and defiance. we are mad and we aren't going to let the democracy slip away. the punching really needs to come from joe biden. they have to get fierce, angry, determined and vigilant . there is this defeatist thing, joe biden, trump, no, we will not let that happen. there needs to be a revolutionary attitude that we are the last stand . we are defending the country because if we don't, it is over. i say it to people all the time, do you want your grandchildren to have a vote? you had better vote for biden, it is that simple. >> i would rather be determined . in a campaign, i mean, i know there is outrage, but as far as, again, the blocking and tackling, i don't want someone so angry they are out of their mind. whatever is scaring you or make you angry, it needs to drive you to focus on work. work. work . that is how you to win the campaign, knocking on doors, planting yard signs, making phone calls, organizing, that is why all the whining on the upper east side and in georgetown, it drives me crazy. it is the month of may. you don't like how things are going, call the campaign and get to work. >> there was less whining when we had dinner at the chick-fil- a in new jersey right off route 78. no whining at the chick-fil-a . to your point, it is the goal line, don't boo, vote. go votes. go get people out. talk to your neighbor. get people engaged. molly, you get to it in your new piece, remind people it is may, there is a long way to go pick enjoy your summer. >> what is really interesting, you see them at the top of the ballot but not the bottom. you see democrats ahead or doing really well that at the top of the ticket you has see what has happened, they are trying to calculate, they are trying to find these hits in 2016 voters, the hidden trump voter and calculate them in the poll. if those people come out these numbers will look like this. but these are not high- frequency voters. these are not people who voted in 2022, 2023, these are the low-frequency voters that are a complete the different animal. that poll might be right, but what is most important, remember, we are all slightly freaked out from what happened in 2016. >> no sugar coating here, in the three states the president has to win, president, pennsylvania, and wisconsin as well as georgia. it is okay to get focus but does remain very winnable for president biden. >> look, i think the answer is you have to go fight . you have to do everything possible. i think it is a combination of things. i do think the -- i want to change anger to passion. this attitude of this wimpy attitude, so i like the attitude of robert dinero , i don't think he is the right messenger but some of that fierce list needs to be in democrats. >> next, consumer confidence arose in may for the first time in three months. we will get to more of that after a quick break. ip. ♪♪ chevy trucks' advanced camera technology lets you see over, under, through, down, and any other direction you may need. ♪♪ up to eight available cameras and fourteen views. ♪♪ so you can focus on the view that really matters. don't miss a thing. chevy's got you. chevrolet. together let's drive. hi, i'm greg. i live in bloomington, illinois. i'm not an actor. i'm just a regular person. some people say, "why should i take prevagen? 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are you better than you were four years ago? i think we asked people about the economy it has become a placeholder for an abstract how are things overall? i don't think it matters as much. the important thing is that question, how are you doing? how are your finances doing? the fact that people say the dow jones is down, unemployment is going in the other direction, it is not so good over there but it is good with me. that is what matters. >> there is such a generational divide. i think it was the new york times that said more and more, maybe you can clarify it, what is required for younger americans to buy a house are mom and dad . suggesting, again, younger americans are feeling the pinch and we hear it all the time, you hear it all the time, younger americans saying, hey, you guys don't understand what we are going through, we don't live the life that you lived 20 years ago. >> there is no question. this goes to the inflation story, the interest rate story, right now if you are a young person buying a home it is very difficult . getting a loan at a rate that makes sense is difficult . that is actually a real pain point in this economy, politically, and i think that is the one thing you are seeing play out. on the higher end of the economy folks have been able to deal with inflation and it is easy for them to say everything is okay. when you do talk about some of the pricing at the supermarkets and gas and homes, that is where people's experience on the lower end of it are challenged. >> andrew, i see behind you, the dow jones dropping again. it goes down, it goes up . it is already down 300, what is going on? 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(dog bark) it's simply fresh meat and vegetables, with all the nutrients dogs need— instead of dried pellets. just food made for the health of dogs. delivered in packs portioned for your dog. it's amazing what real food can do. >> i know who we are as americans. we are the only nation in the world that draws from old and new. home to native americans, home to people from every place on earth that came freely, some came in chains, some came when famine struck, some to leave persecution. to chase dreams that are impossible anywhere but here in america. that is america. we all come from somewhere. >> president biden back in march highlighting the united states as a nation of immigrants. the immigration story is the focus of a new play titled what became of us. joining us now, one of the stars of that play. it is great to have you with us. >> thank you so much. >> we don't give away too much because it is such an experience. how do you describe display to people? >> the play uses immigration as a backstop of two siblings over their entire life and how their relationship to their parents and their immigration status is different. as an older sister born in a young nurse brother born here, how their relationship to their parents is different and how it affects their relationship. >> you can see all the themes of this played out in our society for generations, particularly right now, it feels relevant. >> yeah, the value of understanding the definition of what an immigration is an how unique it is to the american identity is super important . that is my entry point into loving the play. sharing that definition that a lot of people don't land on. i think it is really nice to talk about how are indented he is informed by the people before us who came here to create a better life . how that is the american dream. >> the production is for everyone, but are you finding audience members whose parents -- >> absolutely, what i love about this play is that it has such an incredible way of people drawing their own story from it . everyone sees themselves in these two people . it is very interesting. but i do, i mean it is very moving, it is very funny. i think people really respond to the identification, the validation that we are talking about . this immigration kind of status that is in our identity no matter who we are. >> it is a fascinating presentation. how does that play out and what texture does it bring to it? >> it is wonderful, atlantic theater is a wonderful company doing something that has never been done and that is to have two casts that are doing a play that is very universal. we are opening the play very soon, next week, subsequently tony will be doing the play overlapping with us so you could see both of us -- both casts on the same date if you wanted to. but it will highlight the individuality of the immigration experience side by side and also shows you what the similarities are. >> don't go anywhere, we have a second hour of morning joe weekend coming up right after the break . our biggest challenge? uncertainty. hidden fees, surcharges... who knows what to expect! turn shipping to your advantage. keep it simple...with clear, upfront pricing. with usps ground advantage®. ♪♪ everybody wants super straight, super white teeth. they want that hollywood white smile. new sensodyne clinical white provides 2 shades whiter teeth and 24/7 sensitivity protection. i think it's a great product. it's going to help a lot of patients. are you still struggling with your bra? it's time for you to try knix. makers of the world's comfiest wireless bras. for revolutionary support without underwires, and sizes up to a g-cup, find your new favorite bra today at knix.com ( ♪ ♪ ) start your day with nature made. the #1 pharmacist recommended vitamin and supplement brand. 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(fisher investments) at fisher investments, we're clearly different. some people just know that the best rate for you is a rate based on you, with allstate. because there are people out there who aren't you. a lot of them. and you don't drive like... whoa. i don't want my child being raised by a robot! other drivers are not you. yes, thank you so much to all 50 of my subscribers. nope, definitely not you. save with drivewise and get a rate based on you. you're in good hands with allstate. good sunday morning and will go back to a second hour of morning joe weekend. let's get to some of the big stories we have covered over the last week. >> how involved was donald trump in his own defense? >> what do you think? >> very involved. he is a smart guy. he knows what he is doing. he jokingly said to us that he wanted to be the litigator. he wanted to be the one arguing because he is a smart guy and he knows what he is doing. we made every decision together. there were things he was frustrated with. >> were you satisfied with jury selection? and was the former president involved in that in any way? >> very much involved. right there with the whole team talking about potential jurors. was i satisfied? we put a motion and because we said we could not get a fair jury in manhattan and i'm not being disparaging to the jurors. they were great. they showed up on time every day. they were committed. they paid attention. we are in a situation where we had a very limited number of people we could strike. most of the folks had a very strong opinion of president trump and it wasn't positive. >> they paid attention. okay. >> they talked about how donald trump was still involved and so engaged and wishes he could have been the litigator. but yet, he was afraid to take the stand. he wouldn't even get up and talk in his own defense. i don't know how much you really wanted to talk and they are after all. >> i think that is right. and we will talk to our legal experts. there is nothing particularly unusual about jury selection. they had the chance to strike jurors just like we do all the time. donald trump didn't want to take the stand. and you do get the sense that donald trump, and all those republicans that showed up in court for him including the speaker of the house of representatives, to tear down the process in preparation for what happened yesterday which is to say that they knew the evidence was strong and overwhelming and perhaps did not expect to go 34, for 34 on these counts but they knew there was a likelihood that he would be convicted of something here. therefore, they had to attack the judge and they had to attack the witnesses and the jury in some cases and attack the process to say that it was rotten and therefore he couldn't get a fair trial. we outlined the reasons that is not true. we talked about this, whether or not you believe this should have been brought, this case should have been brought at all, it was. evidence was produced. it was given to the jury. witnesses came and gave testimony and a jury of donald trump with different views agreed unanimously and by the way, relatively quickly, if you look at how long this trial was, but he was guilty of all 34 counts. >> that is the thing. it is an important point you brought up. you could make arguments that this case should not have been brought. the wall street journal editorial page, whoever came up with this line, the editorial this morning, should get a bonus. they talked about everything being shoved inside and fried. and i said it time and again. i'm not so sure any conviction, given what is underlying the case, will be given the pill. >> a long time of court stuff. >> it marco rubio or ted cruz or somebody wanted to go after the d.a. in the case and talk about how they disagree, that it didn't make sense, that is one thing. but to attack the jurors, to salvage the judge, that is -- i think most people would consider that to be un-american and you saw him. i'm so glad president trump's attorney showed respect to the jurors and said, they did a great job. they did everything that was asked of them. they showed up early. they were always there on time. they listened and paid attention. back costume and would have cost and republican senator nothing and would have maybe warranted a little bit of respect from people listening to the message. but instead, they go straight to, we are communist cuba. and it is a joke. >> that was senator rubio who said that yesterday and one of donald trump's adult children said this verdict officially makes us a third world country. another descriptive term. when the legal system works against you and a jury convicts you after hearing the evidence, suddenly we are third world country. with donald trump, either way now, the first former u.s. president in american history to be convicted of a crime late yesterday afternoon. a jury of 12 new yorkers found trump guilty on all 34 felony counts against him in the hush money criminal trial. that came after the jury deliberated for roughly nine and a half hours over a couple of days. sentencing is set for july 11th, just four days before the republican national convention begins in milwaukee. the maximum sentence for falsification of business records is four years in prison. but incarceration is not a mandatory sentence. the judge will ultimately decide the punishment. let's add to the panel, former u.s. attorney and in these msnbc legal analyst joyce vance. our msnbc legal analyst and president of the national constitution center. good morning to you all. let me begin with you, joyce. and your reaction on 34 felony counts against the president. >> it is something. i have talked to a lot of juries after they have reached a verdict. i live in one of those jurisdictions where the judge gives you permission to do that several days after a verdict is returned. what i have heard over 25 years is jurors that wanted to express to us how much they honor their oath and they had tried so hard to set aside any bias or preconception and they deliberated based only on the evidence and reached their verdict based on the evidence. whatever that verdict was. and that is what this jury did here. they listened to the evidence. they reached a verdict based on the evidence. we saw signs of them working through it. donald trump is in the process of trying to spend the verdict down. where americans need to reject that. they need to ignore that and use the same common sense. the jurors are the ones that listen to every bit of the evidence. that is something we did not have the opportunity to do. most of us had to read about it on the record or hear reports on the news. the jurors heard every piece of the evidence and made a decision for all of us. i think it is important that we not let donald trump, who has done so much damage to our institutions, shake our faith in the jury system. the jury system did its job. it listened to the evidence. it returned a verdict. we should accept the verdict. >> neil, i'm curious. sentencing is set for july 11th and chuck was talking the last hour about the elocution part of that. and that is where the defendant has a chance to express remorse or say something. if the defendant expresses remorse, could that impact the sentence that the judge decides ? >> that is the most counterfactual hypothetical i think i have ever gotten. there is no chance you will express remorse. he himself has just been going out and attacking the judge and the jury and all of that. if he expressed remorse, that would be relevant along with his conduct during the trial. remember that the prosecutor said here that this is a really serious offense. this is something that may have put donald trump directly in the oval office. it is going to be very hard i think to get away without jail time. and i want to pick up on something you asked joyce. i think joyce is absolutely right. the jury verdict here tells us a lot. just add to it two things. one is that it is not just the jury verdict in terms of a majority vote or something. in our country, it has to be unanimous. all 12 jurors have to agree and they have to a great on the most difficult standard in the law, the highest burden for the prosecutors and beyond a reasonable doubt. the jury did all of that. they listened to the evidence and so concluded. and now you have all of trump's allies including trump's own lawyer in the clip you played saying that this jury was unfair to donald trump. they didn't like him and the like. there are two problems with that. one is that it is just wrong. there was juror number two, literally the only media the juror consumes is truth social. that juror was one of 12 jurors that voted to convict donald trump. the other is that they are trying to set up an argument about a challenge to venue on appeal, that this was an unfair jurisdiction to try donald trump. every high-profile defendant tries this and it feels. i dealt with it myself when i was a special prosecutor in the george floyd conversation. look at minneapolis. i cannot get a fair trial. i'm demonized. the judge rejected it and the court of appeals rejected it. everywhere in the country, there is pretrial publicity. and that is true for trump just as much. so the standard for change of venue won't be that. i think he has no decent appeal on these grounds. >> we will have continued analysis of the trump guilty verdict straight ahead. s, thet fresh appr oach to dog food. everyday, more dog people are deciding it's time to quit the kibble and feed their dogs fresh food from the farmer's dog. made by vets and delivered right to your door precisely portioned for your dog's needs. it's an idea whose time has come. ♪♪ frustrated by skin tags? dr. scholl's has the breakthrough you've been waiting for. now there's an easier-to-use at home skin tag remover, clinically proven to remove skin tags safely in as little as one treatment. so, what are you thinking? 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[jeff laughs maniacally] (inner monologue) seriously, i'm on the green and all i can think about is all the green i'm spending on 3 kids in college. with empower, i get all of my financial questions answered. so i don't have to worry. empower. what's next. norman, bad news... i never graduated from med school. what? -but the good news is... xfinity mobile just got even better! now, you can automatically connect to wifi speeds up to a gig on the go. plus, buy one unlimited line and get one free for a year. i gotta get this deal... i know... faster wifi and savings? ...i don't want to miss that. that's amazing doc. mobile savings are calling. visit xfinitymobile.com to learn more. doc? list get your reaction to what is simply a significant moment in american history. we don't know what impact if any it will have on this year's election. this was a day we will always read about in the history books. getting a sense of the system working. and beyond that, what you feel the appropriate sentence would be. >> the most remarkable aspect of president trump's reaction to the verdict is that he attacked the entire system, that it was rigged. he attacked the judge as crooked. he attacked the jury and he attacked the prosecution. this represents a historic change in american constitutional law. the founders thought only virtuous leaders would save the republic and we would also need the auxiliary protections to the legions to the rule of law. and lincoln before the civil war said that once we abandon our attachment to the rule of law, we will succumb to the mob. and it is a sign of a third world country. it is a sign of communist dictatorships that you attack the rule of law as rigged when you lose. that is what happened in brazil when the president loses office. he goes to jail. he runs again. his successor says the system was rigged and people storm the capital because they won't accept the election. the urgently important thing at this crucial moment in american history, even if you think the prosecution was unfair or that the verdict should be overturned on appeal, is to accept the results of the rule of law. in this polarized time, wants citizens abandon a commitment to accept the verdict they disagree with, then we really will lose the foundations of the constitutional republic. as for the appropriate sentence, that is a question for new york state law. it is true that if president trump were to be reelected, then he is unlikely to serve jail time and even the supreme court might say that he has to be able to have his responsibilities and do his duties and therefore jail time isn't appropriate. the judge's should apply whatever sentence new york law requires and not treat trump differently than any other defendant. in order to reaffirm this really important point, it is important that republicans accepted this and not go the way of attacking the system is rigged. because once we do that, we really have the founders nightmare. >> joyce, you mentioned you have talked to a lot of jurors after verdicts. i'm curious as to your reading here. i have heard some people say they were surprised that the jury came back as quickly as it did. it didn't strike me as particularly fast. but i wonder how the speed of the verdict struck do you. and if the fact that they were unanimous on all counts means that when they entered the jury room, there was a kind of general sense of agreement there? how do you think -- what do you think the dynamic was there? >> i tend to agree with you that while this was quicker than some of us expected, i thought it would go into this afternoon or maybe even monday morning. it was a reasonable amount of time for the jury to review the evidence. you will recall that there was 20 minutes after we knew they delivered a verdict that they had to go sign off on each of the verdict forms, a separate form for each of the 34 counts that donald trump was convicted on. some juries will walk into the room and they will take a straw poll. if everyone is pretty much an agreement, they will move on from there relatively quickly. it is possible that that is what happened here. we know from the jury's questions, that they wanted to review both the evidence and the law and that really gives this appearance that worked diligently to fulfill their obligations. maybe we will learn more about this verdict. the judge has suggested that these jurors remain anonymous. i think that is certainly in their own self interest. there is part of me that hopes we won't learn more about the process but whatever ultimately we are able to discern, what we do know is that they believed unanimously, as neil pointed out, that the government put on proof of guilt beyond a reasonable doubt and they went back and they reviewed the legal standards very carefully before they made the decision. i would join neil in saying, there will be an appeal. trump will raise arguments and probably get an appeal bond to remain out while the appeal is pending. it looks like the government tried a very clean case here, a case that will be affirmed on appeal. >> president biden was in delaware yesterday when the verdict came down. he was there to mark the ninth anniversary of the death of his son, beau biden. the official white house counsel office said, "we respect the rule of law and have no additional,." meanwhile, president biden said on x, "there was only one way to keep donald trump out of the oval office, at the ballot box." donate to our campaign today. and the biden campaign itself said "in new york today, we saw that no one is above the law. donald trump has always mistakingly believed that he would not face consequences for breaking the law for his own personal gain. today's verdict does not change the fact that the american people face a simple reality. there is still only one way to keep donald trump out of the oval office. at the ballot box. convicted felon or not, trump will be the republican nominee for president." that is a statement from the biden/harris campaign. a democratic strategist familiar with the biden campaign thinking tells nbc news, "the campaign is looking at the bigger picture and a guilty verdict would not be a central message." the same strategist added, "biden will focus on what matters to voters, democracy, personal freedom and prioritizing the middle class over wealthy corporations." it was interesting. even in the few hours since the verdict, to watch the president himself and the campaign walk this fine line of reminding voters that donald trump now has been convicted of felonies but also exactly what donald trump himself said when he came out after the verdict, that the most important day is not yesterday but november 5th on election day. >> response from president biden and his team, they had telegraphed. the president maintained a vow of silence throughout these proceedings and didn't want to be perceived as interfering with any of trump's legal matters and he will still stay quiet on the other three outstanding cases. we will hear from him in the days ahead about this case as mentioned earlier. is expected remarks to be respecting the legal system and the rule of law. likely in an informal setting taking questions. that could happen today. he is at the white house for an event this afternoon. perhaps it is early next week before he goes overseas for a national trip to mark the anniversary of d-day. i think the most important thing is that the campaign statement is here where they say, "this is just part of the argument we will make against donald trump." it shows he is choosing himself over the american people. it shows he is unfit for office. and the campaign to her x account will probably poke fun at trump. they talked about using the phrase "convicted felon donald trump" in the weeks ahead. but most and portly, they know he can still win. they can read the polls. they know how close this is. they also don't know what kind of impact this conviction will have on the race. they tend to think, not much of one. therefore, they don't want democrats to be complacent. the messages that the legal system will not save you. the only thing that will save you from donald trump's if you beat him at the ballot box. expect the message to be heard over and over again, guys. there is this thought. i don't think it will be a major game changer. maybe it does just enough for the margins. it is about 50, 60, 70,000 votes total over three states. pennsylvania, michigan and wisconsin. that that is enough. if those people are turned off by conviction, they go to joe biden. >> neil, back to the court proceedings. a lot needs to happen as we lead up to the sentencing on july 11th and then what happens after that with any appeal which appears probably will happen. there have been rumblings by trump followers and even analysts on different networks criticizing the jury and criticizing openly and vehemently the judge. i'm wondering what you are thinking about concerns for their security. what about the gag order? does that stay in place? finally, what is the possibility of jail time or is it just impossible to guess what the sentence will be? >> trump has been and his acolytes have been attacking the judge and jury relentlessly. i don't expect the attacks to seize all the sudden. i don't think that is the style. that is one very unfortunate thing about this former president donald trump. he puts himself above the institution as jeffrey rosen was talking about and he is perfectly willing to call out the mob basically and have them attack all these people and threaten their safety. i do expect enhanced security for all the participants. i think the first thing trump will do legally is file his statement for why he shouldn't deserve any jail time and the like. as i said, i don't think that will be successful. i think the lack of remorse and the gravity of the crimes in conjunction with this behavior like you are asking me about come altogether, will push the judge to not just a felony conviction but a felony conviction that does lead to imprisonment or at least home incarceration. i think then what trump is going to do is picking up on what joyce mentioned briefly, this appeal. he will file a piece of paper with the court saying, look, i have credible arguments for my appeal. so don't jail me or home can find me while my appeal is pending. i do expect that to be successful. there is a lower standard for that. i file those motions myself. i don't think we are talking about a circumstance in which trump is jailed but under confinement in the run-up to the november election. >> more coverage of the guilty verdict in donald trump's criminal trial after a quick break. trump' come on. i already got a pneumonia vaccine, but i'm asking about the added protection of prevnar 20®. if you're 19 or older with certain chronic conditions like asthma, diabetes, copd, or heart disease, or are 65 or older, you are at increased risk 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yesterday, 34 counts and 34 verdicts of guilty? >> my initial reaction was, thank god for the jury system. when we went over to the senate having impeached donald trump for citing an insurrection against a union, there was a 232-197 vote in the house. we were over in the senate for a week presenting the case. i think the evidence was absolutely overwhelming and the defense, as in the new york case was pretty nonexistent. it didn't have a coherent counter narrative to tell. and yet, we were only able to get 57 out of 100 votes. 57-43 which is a pretty commanding majority. we needed two thirds. and i just feel like the jury system is an essential democratic practice and institution because it is a microcosm of the people and what you get is common sense. people who are willing to take in all the facts on all of the sides. people who are willing to participate in this justice system that includes the presumption of innocence and includes the right of the defendant either to testify or not testify as donald trump chose to do and we are willing to apply the law to the facts. to me, it was a beautiful thing to watch. obviously the process is not completely played out. the convicted defendant has the right to appeal and we should respect to the appeals process like we are respecting the trial process. i think it was a great victory for the justice system within liberal democracy. >> the cross-section of donald trump's peers listening to evidence of testimony decided, yes, he did it. all of it. congressman, i know you are not surprised, like we are not surprised from the response on your congressional colleagues on the republican side. i'm curious of your reaction to how extreme it has been with a prominent united states senator saying it that we are a banana republic. senator marco rubio said this reminds him of the stories that his family would tell him about cuba where there is no rule of law, the extremism we are hearing. even the speaker of the house this morning on television saying that the supreme court needs to step in and reverse this miscarriage of justice. what is your response to all of that? >> donald trump has been like a psychological and cognitive stress test for the republican party. so many of them have failed. not all of them. not liz cheney. not mitt romney. there are a lot of them who are of said, no. they don't want to go down the road of becoming members of a cult of authoritarian personality. but at this point, many of them are perfectly willing to surrender critical thinking skills and everything they know about the legal system and everything they know about political science and simply give themselves over to the cult of trump. imagine if trump woke up and decided, all right. the game is over. i'm going to admit all these crimes and all of these offenses against the constitution. what would they do at that point? would they still be yelling, no. let's stick with trump. let's keep going down the road to authoritarianism. but it shows that they are looking like members of a religious cult who are sleeping on the basement floor someplace just listening to the tapes of a cold leader. >> you are watching morning joe weekend. we will be right back! and intel. clearing the way, [rumble] [whoosh] so you arrive exactly where you belong. centrum! it's scientifically formulated to help you take charge of your health. centrum gives every body a healthy foundation. supporting your - oops - energy, immunity and metabolism. and yours too! you did it! plus try centrum silver, now clinically proven to support memory in older adults. a lot of new dry eye patients in my office tell me about their frequent dry eyes, which may point to dry eye disease. millions of americans were estimated to have it. they've tried artificial tears again and again, but the relief is temporary. xiidra can provide lasting relief. xiidra treats the signs and symptoms of dry eye disease. don't use if you're allergic to xiidra. common side effects include eye irritation, discomfort or blurred vision when applied to the eye, and unusual taste sensation. doctor: why wait? ask your eye doctor about a 90-day prescription for xiidra today. every day, more dog people, and more vets are deciding it's time for a fresh approach to pet food. they're quitting the kibble. and kicking the cans. and feeding their dogs dog food that's actually well, food. developed with vets. made from real meat and veggies. portioned for your dog. and delivered right to your door. it's smarter, healthier pet food. get 50% off your first box at thefarmersdog.com/realfood we have the connection of the university of kentucky. you love the university of kentucky and i do. both of my parents went there. i read in the new york times yesterday that misses alito went to the university of kentucky. i was quite struck. if you have been reading the news conference, you would have thought she was like jenny thomas. like this woman will hang a flag upside down. she must have been politically -- no. she was a librarian. stays away from politics as much as possible. arranged a cookbook after ruth bader ginsburg's husband died. act of love. and sort of helped people on the court and helped her bj. i'm just wondering for this university of kentucky graduate, what are your thoughts on all of this? i must say, and maybe it is just the old-line conservative in me but hanging a flag upside down, i would never do it in a million years. i don't care. if somebody attacks me -- again, and i'm not saying this targeting misses alito but it is so shocking to me that -- let's just say our tribe, our former tribe, behaves this way now. and if this had happened in the 60s or the 70s or the 80s or the 90s or the 2000s, if anybody had hung a flag upside down, they would officially be outside the conservative tribe. now you have this mild-mannered homemaker, grew into being a homemaker and housewife after a career as a librarian hanging flags upside down in the most fraught political times in american history. >> it doesn't make since. >> i don't understand it. i don't understand how we, and by we, i'm talking about conservative. how did we get here? >> the first thing you have to say about it is when a flag is being flown upside down at an associate justice or supreme court house, that is bad. there is no way to look at that. >> look at that. >> to me, it's like burning a flag. it is horrible. you don't do it. >> that should not have been period. and justice alito said he asked her to take it down and she refused to take it down. we don't know the dynamics of the marriage. we don't know how that works. but we can say two adult women, martha alito and jenny thomas, that they have, at the most benign possible explanation for their conduct, is they put their supreme court justice husbands in this terrible mind where their wives political activism is leading to situations where ordinary average people would look at the upside down flag being flown outside of a supreme court justice his house the same time that i saw upside on flags being flown outside houses on trump trucks at the same time and just say, trust us. there is nothing to see here. it is all her. that is a terrible position to put the public in. the public wants to be in a position where it doesn't have to overcome things like flying a flag where at that very moment was an insurrectionary symbol outside of your house and saying, you have to trust me. i had nothing to do with this. that was my spouse. that is a lot to ask of the public frankly. this is something where adults need to start acting like adults. they need to start acting like adults and stop acting like neighborhood disputes or justification for outrageous behavior and don't put the public in the position of, we have to decide. is justice alito with his wife on this? or is this some sort of breach in the marriage? it is a terrible position to put the public in. it never should have come to that. >> new york times columnist david french, thank you very much. next, cnbc on the reported alliance between elon musk and donald trump. you are watching morning joe weekend. we will be right back! so, what are you thinking? i'm thinking... 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(husband) we just want to have enough money for retirement. (wife) and travel to visit our grandchildren. why (fisher investments) i understand. that's why at fisher investments we start by getting to know each other. so i can learn about your family, lifestyle, goals and needs, allowing us to tailor your portfolio. (wife) what about commission-based products? (fisher investments) we don't sell those. we're a fiduciary, obligated to act in your best interest. (husband) so how do your management fees work? (fisher investments) we have a transparent fee, structured so we do better when you do better. at fisher investments, we're clearly different. elon musk might become an advisor for former president trump if the presumptive nominee is elected in november. the wall street journal's reporting, "the role has not been fully hammered out and may not happen." the two men discussed ways to give elon musk formal input into influencing policies related to border security and the economy. trump and musk speak several times a month according to the paper along with a billionaire investor who told trump of an influence campaign in the lead circles under way in which elon musk and his political allies host gatherings of powerful business leaders across the country to try to convince them not to support president biden's reelection campaign. let's bring in the coanchor of cnbc and a columnist for the new york times. good morning. if we didn't know it already, it does appear that elon musk was firmly in the camp during the campaign for starters. >> sort of. this is a bit of a stealth endorsement if you will. it makes for strange bedfellows. the truth is that elon musk has for a long time publicly been critical of president trump. just within the last year, telling tucker carlson, wouldn't it be nice to have a normal person be the president? and maybe you could take that as a comment about president biden. i think it was registered the other way. i think it is early days to see what is happening here. he has been outspoken and that he will not vote for president biden work in fact, i did that interview with elon musk last november where he effectively said the reason he didn't want to vote for president biden in large part was because of his frustration and if you remember, we talked about this many times on the broadcast, president biden iced him out early on in favor of automakers that were using unions. tesla does not use a union and that created this early friction and the sense from elon musk that he believed that president biden and what he described as the democrats going too far left and what he thinks of as this work to mind virus concept and that has led him to not want to vote for president biden. having said that, we don't know where the story really lies. there are a couple of people trying to position this as an opportunity for trump to get on board with elon musk. by the way, musk woodmont want trump very much to be on twitter. trump does not want to go on twitter because he has his own truth social platform. there are a lot of strange things going on here. the other piece is that he owns tesla. a company all about climate change and trying to solve climate change. the truth is that president trump has been on the other side of that issue. we will see where all of this goes. president trump if you can remember, did use these sort of informal advisors that lived inside the business world during his presidency. so whether he ends up calling on musk or not, i think remains uncertain. it is worth noting that elon musk was, like many other executives, part of some of these committees that were called to help advise the president in the first term and he ended up stepping off of one of those committees after he decided he couldn't abide by some of the things that former trump was doing when he was president. >> musk is also in the satellite business. in the times the other day, it was saying he is not only in the satellite business but he goes out of his way to impede anyone else from getting into the satellite business. i'm wondering, can you get a sense from the many people you talked to, corporate titans and wall street individuals, is there any sense of potential danger in elon musk that they fear? >> he has an enormous amount which the fear is that elon musk may be has too much influence, especially when it comes to the fact that he does control the race to space at the moment. and i think that is why folks are trying to be supportive to folks like jeff bezos and those trying to get space. right now there is a reliance on elon musk and this is true not just in the u.s. but of our allies when it comes to defending our allies and others in other parts of the world. that is a real concern and maybe you would argue that one of the reasons elon musk is trying to get close to former president trump is that it would help his business. having said that, it has not heard his business to be as vocal against president biden oddly enough. in large part, because right now he has a monopoly on that business. >> morning joe weekend will be right back! no, my denture's uncomfortable! dracula, let's fight back against discomfort. with new poligrip power max hold & comfort. it has superior hold plus keeps us comfy all day with it's pressure absording layer. time for a bite! if your mouth could talk it would ask for... poligrip. higher shipping rates may be “the cost of doing business...” but at what cost? 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>> we tried to make a classic western like the ones i remember growing up watching but there are some significant differences. the two main characters, vicki's character vivian and mine, olson, are not born in the usa characters. they don't have english as their first language. that is something different. the lead character is vivian. most westerns don't have a woman leading the way. and he does go away. even though he is not from this country. he has been here for 10 years and he sort of adopted as his country and he decides to join the union forces and fight in the civil war leaving her to fend for herself. and it is really a story about her. we stay with her, which we never do. usually go with the guy off to war. i wanted to explore what happens to women, girls with their partners, fathers or sons go off to fight. >> that is what is so ordinary about the film. he does go off to war. and this is a story about vivian. what do you describe about how she goes through this when her husband goes off to war? >> i think she goes through what many women go through now. it is very universal female experience to be the one who stays behind and holds everything together. holds the family together. holds the village together. i think their whole continents nowadays being held together by women the differences that we don't see them or we don't talk about them. and in this movie, you stay with her. what i find personally the most interesting about the film is that we don't stay with her because she is particularly, especially strong. she is not a hero. she is just a woman. but we stay with her. and that is what is so beautiful and respectful i think about the film. >> they were probably a lot of women like that back then but it's just that the people writing stories at that time, amen, didn't want to tell the stories about strong, independent and feisty women. >> the two elements you are talking about right now now, are truly fascinating and relatively unknown elements. one, the union army was an army of immigrants. a large number of immigrants fought the war for a country they were not born into and the women who were left behind, and you are left behind and a frontier filled with loneliness and danger. unheard of in later days. but very common in those days. >> yes. like i said, i think there are a lot of women like that. and the inspiration for vicki's character was my mom. she was like vivian and like vicki. strong-willed and had her own ideas about things and i thought, let's put this story of vivian in that time come on the western frontier in the 1860s. a place that is kind of lawless and handled by powerful and unscrupulous men not opposed to using violence to achieve their goals. things like that don't seem to change much. but that gave her more of a challenge i think. >> that is all for today and this weekend. we are back here tomorrow morning at 6:00 eastern for another week of morning joe. until then, we hope you enjoy the rest of your sunday! good morning. it sunday, june 2. i'm alicia menendez. with symone sanders

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