out at just about everyone. he blames for the verdict. cnn's kristen holmes has bore on what trump just saying and doing anyone. >> i defined donald trump lashing out friday a day after a new york jury found him guilty on all 34 counts in his criminal hush money trial. >> we're gonna fight. >> i'm wired in such a way that a lot of people would gone away a long time ago, the trump air grievances with the trial and level the tax at the prosecutor and the presiding judge, juan merchan, it was a rigged trial. we wanted a venue change where we can have a fair trial we didn't get it we wanted a judge change. we wanted to judge. it wasn't conflicted and obviously he didn't do that even as the former president remains under a gag order that blocks them from speaking out about witnesses, jurors, and others closely tied to the case trump's singled out x attorney michael cohen, a key witness in the case without using his name, not allowed to use his day because of the gag order. but you know, he's just leaves back. everybody knows that took me a while to find out but he was effective. he did work, but he wasn't a fixer. he was a lawyer in a statement to cnn, cohen called trump's remarks a quote, crazy avalanche of broken brain word manure, know presidential candidates ever been under a gag order before? i'm under a gag order. nasty gag order think of it. i'm the leading candidate trump also claimed friday he wanted to testify in the trial, but suggested one of his lawyers encouraged him not to do so. but now i would have testified i wanted to testify the theory is you never testify because as soon as you test for anybody if it were george washington, don't testify because they'll get you on something that you said slightly wrong and then they sue you for perjury dressing the verdict at the white house friday, president joe biden warned that efforts by trump and his allies to undermine the justice system, or quote dangerous it's irresponsible for anyone to say this was rigged just because they don't like the verdict. >> justice and should be respected. and we should never allow anyone to tear it down trump's allies and supporters swiftly rally behind the presumptive gop nominee with the campaign announcing it had raised more than $34 million in the hours after the verdict. at one point, even crushing the fundraising platform used by trump's campaign. >> well, top republicans, including several vice presidential hopefuls, join trump and criticizing the conviction what happened in new york was a travesty of the justice system this is the weaponization of the justice system against their political opponent. >> you cannot say that this trial was anything more than politics, masquerading as justice and while those republicans wanted to make their support very public, i have learned that there were several people who are offering more private versions of support, including members of his own family. >> we had speculated a lot about ivanka and jared trump, as well as melania's never attended a day of donald trump's criminal trial all of them were present at trump tower today when donald trump delivered his remarks, i am told that while they did not attend the remarks, they were there to offer their morals for both kristen holmes reporting for us. kristen, thanks very much. now, the legal road ahead for donald trump as he plans to appeal his conviction. cnn's kara scannell cover the trump trial from start to finish. kara walker's through what's next for trump and his legal team? >> will trump's lawyers have a deadline of two weeks in which to file any motions before the judge and todd blanche had says that trump's lead attorney has said that they're going to make several motions challenging the verdict, having to do with some of the judge's rulings before the trial, including arguing that they can't get a fair trial and couldn't get one in new york. and also challenging the judge, letting in the test testimony of some witnesses, including stormy daniels then donald trump is going to be sentenced on july 11, so he will have to meet with a probation officer just like any other convicted felon who will interview him, get some materials so that the probation department can make a recommendation to judge juan merchan on what donald trump's sentence punishment should be after being convicted on 34 felony counts, that sentencing again as for july 11. now, todd blanche has also said that trump intends to appeal his conviction. they will have 30 days after the sentencing to file their notice of appeal that would start that process so the clock now taking for a couple of key deadlines for donald trump on the legal front and sandwiched between them as his first presidential debate for the presidency against joe biden running on cnn. and also just a few weeks after his sentencing, he will be at the republican convention where he is likely to get the nomination. wealth. >> kara scannell. thank you very much for that report. there's also breaking news coming into the city your way. she reminded the trump classified documents case. cnn's kaitlan poll answers working in the story for us, what can you tell us, caitlin, and we'll have that federal criminal case in florida, a gag order is back on the table prosecutors just went to judge aileen cannon again, asking her to put an order on trump limiting his ability to talk about law enforcement in that case, they say that he is potentially endangering law enforcement officers involved in the investigation and the prosecution of this case, and threatened the integrity of these proceedings. the prosecutors are writing this to judge cannon, working off of comments, trump has been making in the past couple of weeks saying that fbi agents who searched his resort in florida in august of 2022, they were ready to use deadly force. but that is actually pretty misleading. he that was a standard procedure that was in place for the fbi search of that property? nothing out of the normal it was even used in the search of joe biden's own home in dallas well aware. so the prosecutors, they want this gag order on donald trump trump, his team says it's a violation of his rights. they're going to be arguing against it before judge cannon. but wolf, this is going to be a major thing for this judge to look at in the coming days, something we're going to be talking about quite a bit next week. and another a reminder that donald trump, the criminal defendant now convicted in new york, has these other cases and legal proceedings to still face on a daily basis, including the classified documents case in florida, three other cases indeed, katelyn polantz. thank you very much. let's break all of this down with our legal and political experts. parlatore, let me start with you. you're former trump attorney. you predicted that trump sentence will be less than a year and served at the notorious manhattan shubi to run question for you? i want to get your reaction. first of all, to the special counsel, jack smith's latest request for a gag order in the classified documents case. what do you think? >> i think prosecutors have generally been overusing gag orders with donald trump? i mean, a gag order is something that's really very rarely used. and only for very limited purpose, they're presumptively unconstitutional because it's a prospective restriction of free speech rights it has to be done to protect the integrity of the proceedings. and to simply ask for a gag order because you don't like that. he said something that turned out to be false. i think that they would have to tie that to some kind of a specific threat. and even if you look at what he's saying, he's saying all the biden administration wanted them to assassinate me i don't think anybody's taken conviction in new york will add weight to this request for a gag order. >> no. just because you have been convicted in new york, doesn't say that your first amendment rights or any less, anywhere else and so i think and quite frankly, the fact that he's been convicted in new york should be the grounds to lift the gag order in new york because there's no longer any trial to protect. there's no longer any jury pool to protect for their deliberations are no longer any witnesses to prevent the intimidation of and so gag orders, they usually expire as soon as the jury is sworn in. here was kept a little bit later to protect the witnesses. but certainly by the time there's a verdict, there's no need to keep the gag order in place under the laws of the state of new york will see how the judge aileen cannon response to the special counsel jack smith's request for a gag order against trump. this is significant development, potentially norm, you're the one who predicted that trump sentence will be less than a year sure. and could be served at the notorious rikers island jail in new york city. how do you think judge merchan will weigh security concerns if he sentences a former president of the united states wealth i think he'll take those concerns very seriously since i did the initial analysis assess of the likely sentence that trump would face, it's likely it's not certain that he'll get a sentence of jail time i've had the opportunity to observe judge merchan in court every day throughout this trial. >> and i don't think in my more than three decades practicing law, i've ever seen seeing a better judge inaction. tim has tried a case. i have four, judging or sean. >> he's like the he's an outstanding he's an outstanding judge for that reason. >> he will consider all of the factors in determining whether or not to sentence donald trump to jail the secure, and he talked about this one day in court when trump had committed his tenth violation of the gag order, ten findings of contempt. he said, if you do it again, i'm going to have to put you in jail and that will be very hard including for those security concerns. but will there are factors that at the other way the seriousness of this crime, this jury found election interference, conspiracy, and other factors. tough choice for judge merchan, very tough and de we'll see what he decides that's coming up. brad, you've seen a lot of republicans now rallying to trump's defense supporting him, saying all sorts of things in effect echoey with trump has been saying, do you think this is a winning strategy for the gop? >> well, i think first off, alvin bragg has done something to know republican could do, which is unify republicans refocused on like each other very much today's yes, the district are you in new york? i think there's a real opportunity for donald trump here politically. if he's willing to take it, if he's discipline poland enough to take it. number one, turnout two big factor in any presidential election, both these candidates are unfavorable. this is unified as base. secondly, the group that really matters is people in the middle who are unfavorable to both of them. nothing is now knew about donald trump. this the verdict and bring out any new facts that anyone didn't know. so if you're already unfavorable to him, you knew these things. but does give him a rallying cry and he's going to have to be able to project that forward and say, this is really the democrats tried to deny the voters a choice, make it more about the voters and not about himself. he makes it about himself it's gonna be a problem what do you make of the way the president united states, kate responded to trump's guilty verdict, where he said you just broadly the response. >> look, i think what he's has to do here is thread a needle that he's doing, which is he has to not politicized. it's not, not contribute to this idea of the framework that the trump campaign payne wants to paint around this, which is at its politicize. it's all biden's doing. so he's got to be i think he has to be restrained as he has been throughout this process. but this i would i would disagree with brad and i actually think this presents an opportunity for biden. i think for these for these swing voters who are not gonna be able to stomach the idea of voting for a convicted felon for biden to drive effectively that this is somebody who has broken the law, has been found guilty by a jury of his peers, and use that to paint a bigger picture about donald trump. and the fact that only cares about himself, that he's willing to lie and cheat and steal to get what he wants, that he cares about him. he doesn't care about you. i think biden can use that as he's making in this broader message. and i think you saw him walk that line today of not overly politicizing, but being very clear that what donald trump has done makes him unfit to be president the united states again, let me get back to tim. tim, you say, you think trump needs to stay silent at least until july 11, sentencing, but you think he can your hurt. i'm just going after michael cohen didn't mentioned michael cohen by name but described him and called him a sleazebags one thing i don't understand is why todd blanche hasn't gotten to the judge to ask to vacate the gag order at this point. >> so the idea of him risking violating the gag order is something that can be easily dealt with. whether he needs to stay silent. obviously, he's a candidate for president. so the likelihood of him saying silent outside the courtroom is one thing my concern more is him staying silent inside the courtroom because when he goes back on july 11, the judge is going to say, before i sentence, you do have anything to say? >> and i would hope i would recommend him to say i rely upon the words of my attorney here because they're going to have to thread a very slim needle here where he still maintaining his innocence and what i do in these types of situations as i say, you're honore my client has his appellate writes he's going to be pursuing during his appeal and as such, he's maintaining his innocence and i asked you to not take that not hold that against them and sentencing. >> and let's talk instead about these other factors and steer the judge to all of the other considerations that normal is just talking about. >> and if he talks every time the defendant says anything other than i rely upon what my lawyer said and i'm so very sorry the sentence goes up. we could say he could show some remorse. he has shown no remorse at all. >> i don't think that's going to happen in this case, especially with the pellet with the appeal that they intend to file. so the only thing he can do is increase the sentence must speak right, guys. >> thank you very, very much. just ahead. michael cohen's former attorney, lanny davis, standing by live. you'll join me right here in the situation room, will get his reaction the donald trump's historic conviction and very angry rant against his onetime fixer in one of the most active 22 seasons. >> you can't control a tornado. >> what kinds of interventions can we design? hi, go inside the store. >> the premier 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misprint.com and university of maryland global campus getting a bachelor's degree doesn't have to mean starting from scratch. >> here, you can earn up to 90 undergraduate credits for relevant experience. what will your next success speaks i'm caitlin polantz at the federal courthouse in washington, and this is cnn close captioning bronte. >> you bye. in vet help call 1807, 1020 do you have an invention idea, but don't know what to do next, cohen van help today, they can help you get started with your idea called now 800 100020 this is cnn breaking news there's breaking news coming in to cnn right now, the mother of former first lady, michelle obama, marion robinson has died at the age of 86. i want to bring in cnn's kevin lip tack. kevin, tell us more. >> yeah. and i think most americans, we'll know mrs. robinson as the mother of michelle obama and the grandmother of sasha and malia obama, and a fixture really at the white house during the obama administration we are learning that she has passed away at the age of 86 from a lengthy statement, really quite a beautiful statement. i will say from her family members, including her daughter, michelle obama, her son, craig grommets and barak obama, the former president. i'll just read you a little bit of what they wrote. they said marion luis shields robinson our mother mother-in-law, and grandmother, had a way of summing up the truths about life and a word or two, maybe a quick phrase that made everyone around her stop and think her wisdom came off as almost innate as something she was born with. but in reality, it was hard earned, fashioned by her deep understanding that the world's roughest edges it could always be sandi down with a little grace and certainly that is a lesson in a message she will have imparted on her daughter, her son-in-law, and her granddaughters as she moved with them from chicago to the white house back in 2008, this enormous transition that she was on hand to make a little bit easier for members of her family and the statement and previous statements from mrs. obama and president obama have described her as really something of a grounding force in the white house, both for her own children and her grandchildren. and it was interesting, they say in this statement, it took a healthy nudge, as they said, to get her to move to the white house at all. but in the end, they really describe her as recognizing the importance that that would have in raising grounded children. it's a very difficult place, i think to grow up and she ease that in some way they say that rather than have not been with oscar winners are nobel laureate. she preferred spending her time upstairs here's what the tv tray in the room outside her bedroom with big windows that looked out over the washington monument. and this is so interesting. they say the only guessed that she ever asked to meet while she was living in the white house, was the pope. now, she was born in 1937 in chicago. she grew up on the south the side of chicago and the statements are delves into her biography. it's so interesting, they say that her father, because of the color of his skin, wasn't a allowed to join a union. and you can really see in the ark of her life starting in these days, where her own father wasn't allowed to have a job i'm going all the way to living in the white house with the first african-american president, her son-in-law truly an american story of no other type. >> she wasn't spotted all that frequently around the white house when i was covering it, she wasn't at a ton of events or in the rose garden are in the driveway when reporters are around, but certainly she was spending so much time with her granddaughters who we're going to school, learning to drive having some of the most formative years of their life in this building that can be such a crucible of tension and i think what you've heard their father, the present president, and their mother, the former first lady, say, is that marion robinson was able to sort of keep things real in a way she was seen sometimes around town, you know, sometimes you would see her at the kennedy center sort of having a night out on the town, but certainly not a major presence in the so bombers presidency, but certainly in their personal lives and in the personal life of that white house, she was absolutely essential. >> i remember the video of her and the young daughters coming to visit the bush daughters during that transition period, she was on hand to sort of look at what the bedrooms might look like, look at what they're new lives might look like. this enormous change for them to come into the white house from chicago. she was a key part of easing that transition and a key touchstone for her daughter in this new glare of attention yeah. >> i'm michelle obama, just tweeted this and let me read it for our viewers. my mom, marion robinson was my rock, always there for whatever i needed she was the same steady backstop for our entire family. and we are heartbroken to share. she passed away today. very sad. indeed. and our deepest condolences to the family. i want to bring in on the phone right now, the former obama sr adviser and cnn senior political commentator david axelrod, along with our senior political analyst, bmi leica henderson, david, what's your reaction to the passing of michelle obama's mother, marion robinson, a woman i assume you knew well just profound sadness. will she was just a great lady. i mean much of what was said reflects what i experienced over the course of my relationship with the obamas, starting before he was a national bank but the move to washington, as was said, was not something he was a south sayyed or through and through her husband worked for 37 years at a wall water filtration plant, worked through multiple sclerosis, had and yet never missed a day of work work and she was the rock of that family as michelle said michelle and her brother craig, both excelled in life and we're very much the product of their mom's tutelage. she was she taught them how to be resilient how to be responsible and. grace top them, grace. but in the white house it was so interesting. he or she ji would as we're said, she did not take to the whole celebrity. lifestyle. she kind of tion and she would often slip out of the white house on her own and visit with friends outside the white house she really wasn't looking for attention and she was and she as soon as the administration was over, she had it right back to the south side of your caga i will tell you my last her with her was when pizzas to the former white house photographer came to the institute of politics that i am associated with the university of chicago. and he did a he, he was talking book of photos from the from the white house and she was right there in the front row and when it was over, the students just gravitated to her and she held forest. she was not a person of many words. the words were often laden with wisdom, but she, she was very, very talkative and the kids were just transfixed and she said sort of as an aside, this is great. they never let me talk much when we were out there in washington. so she it was just so much fun to see. she was like the pied piper with these with these young people. the last thing i would say is she was indispensable to the obamas, who's big concern about running for president, about being elected president, was the impact it would have on their two young daughters when they had to be on the road and so on. and the fact that mrs. robinson was there to provide consistent sustain nurturing, guidance oversight made everything possible and those young women now are in part who they are, and they're both sensational young women cuts of love items of their grandmother who spent so much time with it as four yeah this lesson a lot truly a wonderful, wonderful woman near malika year with us as well. i want you in our viewers to listen to how michelle obama described her mother during her portrait unveiling back in 2018. listen to this of course, i'm thinking about my mommy marion robinson, who is sitting in the front row supporting us, like she has always done always putting herself last on her list so that she could give me and craig and our children everything that makes today possible. nia, mrs. robinson, of course, lived in the white house during the obama presidency. what will you remember most about her during that time? >> the thing about ms robinson was that she wasn't a real figure in washington and that was on purpose. that was who she was. she was a south siders. she was a midwest center she didn't believe in putting on airs and her real presence was felt obviously the lives of her grandchildren and her daughter and son-in-law, and that was the purpose for her coming down here right. in washington and coming from this outside of chicago to make sure that those girls had a connection to chicago. and two so the midwestern values to humility oftentimes you hear michelle obama important lessons about motherhood, or that she learned from her mother. i would always think that i would love for michelle obama to write a book about sort of width and witticisms that she learned from her mother about parents okay. young girls, particularly young girls who were in the spotlight. she talks about this idea that she wanted to, her girls to know that they will special to home, to their families, into their friends, but they won't special just because they were the daughter daughters of a president. so i think it's a little sort of down home african american family values that resonated with so many americans that mrs. robinson obviously brought to washington block to the white house and blocked it over girls lives. and in this, i'm sure it's heartbreaking for mrs. obama, for her daughters who are now women and who owe a lot of their learning in the way in which they've navigated of the world, not only to their mother, but certainly to their grandmother as well it's a real loss on foot for that family really to the nations and what she she represented and what she was able to do for the first family in those years that they were in a life house? >> yeah. so said, i want to read part of the obama statement that was released over those eight years, she made great friends with the ushers and butler's, the folks who make the white house a home. she'd often sneak outside the gates to buy greeting cards at cvs and sometimes another customer might actually recognize you, sir. you look like michel's mother. they'd say she's smiling reply, oh, i get that. a lot our hearts go out to the family, our deepest, deepest condolences. may she rest in peace and may her memory be a blessing? we'll be right back the russians were trying to spy on us we were spying on them early friday this is the secret was secrets and spies, a nuclear game from here sunday at ten on cnn today. and america's beverage companies are models might still 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the lawyers representing mr. trump with the words, liar. so for now my only comment is that i was honored to represent michael cohen. he told the truth. he was vindicated, and the man that just called him that name is the same man that a federal judge called a rapist after a trial and the e. jean carroll case, another new york supreme court judge, bantam committing financial fraud and find him quadrant and $50 million. and then a jury just found unanimously beyond a reasonable doubt that he committed 34 felonies. and today, he says, everybody is rigged against him and he calls michael cohen a liar because michael cohen stood up untold truth to power does michael cohen feel a sense of relief that trump was found guilty? >> so i haven't talked to him. i can only say that from my experience with him, from the very beginning when i called him and asked if i could represent him he's always stood tall and faced. the facts of the injury that this man today who blames everybody, everything is rigged when jury's rule against him, when judges rule against him, when he loses elections everything is rig, but michael cohen took the pain went to prison for the very same crime that federal prosecutors said mr. cohen was directed to do by mr. trump trump is going to be sentenced, as you know, july 11 what sort of sentence do you think judge merchan will give him? so on this one, i have a conflict. did reaction. i think he deserves to go to jail based upon 34 felonies. his lack of remorse, and what he's been doing continues to do to intimidate witnesses and commit contempt of court, violating a court order. but i'm not in favor of incarcerating an ex-president. he can be penalized. he can be kept at home, but i'm not in favor of going beyond that. we have an election ahead and voters. i do agree that the end of donald trump's career should be from the ballot box and i don't believe you should be incarcerated. you think there's a chance that the verdict could be overturned on appeal? >> well, there is certainly a chance and that is the rule of law. it's ironic sentence here at the very same man that ignores the rule of law that scorns the rule of law, scorns the results of elections, and has consistent criticism of juries because of where they're from as opposed to the facts that were overwhelming in convicting him of 34 felonies, that now it's mr. trump complaining so i would say that mr. trump only knows how to win when juries or judges will against him. it's rigged and republican politicians who have no facts and just rhetoric and denouncing are justice system should be ashamed of themselves. >> you were representing michael cohen for a long time did you ever think that the situation would come to what? just become what it is right now i did not because i never imagined that mr. trump, with all of his abuses of people of due process of the rule of law. >> but every be held to account much less convicted of 34 felonies when i started, the honore working with michael cohen, it was a hope that he would at least be held accountable, but never did i imagine that 34 felony, a unanimous vote beyond a reasonable doubt, ignoring the shouting of liar, and lighter and lighter, including people on television about michael cohen went today. he has been vindicated. i never imagined that would happen rarely, davis, thanks for coming in. >> thank you i'm coming up a closer look at how donald trump will be forced to pay for the crimes he has committed with a judge weighing everything from picking up trash to put him behind bars we're going to talk about that in more with the former fbi director james comey. >> he's here lives standby. we'll be right we hear nothing. the space shuttle accidents usually not one thing. it's a series of events is that part of the wing coming apart? >> space shuttle columbia? the final flight. now streaming on max what makes ewc so special? we do a really great job at trying all of our associates to be the best of the best one 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happiness discount c to 50% over real stone this is cnn the world's news network. tonight, donald trump is staring down a july 11 sentencing date when he expects to learn as punishment for the conviction on 34 criminal charges. ryan todd is taking a closer look at the judges sentencing options. brian, there are clearly many factors for judge juan merchan to consider. there are wolf donald trump's age and his status as a first-time offender are among the factors that judge more merchan will be weighing tonight. we have new information on the many possible forms of punishment the judge could impose from here tonight, donald trump's legal team has just a few weeks to come up with their best argument for why he shouldn't go to jail july 11 is his sentencing date before then, the former president is likely to have to go through pre-sentencing interviews with probation officers where he'd have to give personal information when judge juan merchan does let's level the sentence. he has a few options. the most serious one prison time, the crimes for which trump's been convicted, falsifying business records could carry sentences of up to four years each. but realistically, it's unlikely that someone convicted of this type of felony in new york with no prior criminal history would see much, if any prison time. >> trump's advanced age experts say would also be a factor in not sending him to prison. plus, the security challenge of putting a former or current president behind bars, his secret service detail would have to be armed. they would have to be with him they would have to be able to control the process of where his food comes from, how it's delivered. >> another sentencing option, probation analysts say, well, that might be a more realistic choice. it would come with a host of inconveniences and indignities for the former president having to be drug tested, having to check in with a probation officer, there could be random visits by bayesian officers to your home, not with a search warrant, but they can come knock on the door. you need to let them in home confinement also might be part of a probation sentence for trump, or maybe a restriction on out-of-state travel if he were going to fly off to another state wisconsin, arizona, he would have to get explicit permission from the probation agency. trump could simply be fined for his convictions or he could do community service where he has to pick up trash on the subways experts say a conditional discharge could be a sentencing option is a condition of your discharger, your release, and you have to abide by those conditions. >> the court will say, don't get arrested, going and don't get in trouble for the next year. during the pendency of your sands or for a stated period of time. and that's it. you're not checking in? no-one's following up with you. there's no probation is no oversight. all options experts say reflective of the striking uniqueness of this situation. >> this is completely uncharted territory for the court system, for the secret service, for the department of corrections in new york city. >> in many cases, i believe legal analysts say acceptance of responsibility is often a key factor when a judge considers a sentence and the fact that donald trump has shown no remorse for the actions he has been convicted of and has repeatedly publicly attack the judge and witnesses in this trial could bring him a stiffer sentence. wolf, see what happens on july 11, bryan todd, thanks very much for more on this. we're joined now by the former fbi director james comey. he's written a very excellent brand new book entitled westport, a crime novel. thanks very much. a director comey for joining us, really a terrific book. i've gone through it it's a crime novel. and you know, your stuff let's talk a little bit about what get to a little bit where the book later, let's first of all talk about this monumental verdict, 34 counts guilty, guilty, guilty. could go on and what's your reaction? >> it's a great demonstration striation at the rule of law is alive in america you may not lose supporters if he shot someone on fifth avenue or sack the capital, but you will be held accountable. >> and this is what it looks like. you heard the various options that the judge has as far as prison time non-prison time, what do you think? >> it seems unlikely, but i've never seen a defendant begging for a jail sentence more than one who's taken a flame thrower to the judge and the jury, it's still seems unlikely to me, but donald trump is asking for it. i will important is it that he's not showing any remorse at all? well, very important to a sentencing judge in any defense lawyer would tell you that you tell your clients to be on their best behavior and tell the court, i've learned whatever lessons there are to learn. so please let me go about the rest of my life. >> i'm curious to think what so many of these republicans in the house and the senate and elsewhere are really going out and supporting trump and arguing this was totally italy unfair. what do you make of that? >> they just reflecting the view of his base of followers and having done fraud cases, i get it. it's very hard for people to escape a fraud because it requires them to admit something about themselves. if you didn't leave donald trump after january 6, convictions are not going to change the way you think about them. you can't get away. >> how worried are you and your the former fbi director about security, especially for the people in the courtroom. the judge and others, as well as the jurors for that matter. >> i'm worried about threats and individual acts of violence by disturb people who might be motivated by some of the hate and anger finger in maga world to act out on that. and so it's important to protect jurors, to protect participants so that these threats are never able to be carried out because the fbi get involved in adding security for these individuals who i assume there are worried right now are doing what's going on. >> well, the fbi's role in connection with this would be the supply information in elegance about threats that it picks up through its work. >> so if the fbi were to pick up that there was a threat against a juror, for example, who voted to convict trump. what would you do or weed feed it immediately to the new york city police department and to the other partners in the joint terrorism task force in new york, would the juror himself or herself be notified? >> it would depend upon the nature nature of the threat. but if it was something that seemed imminent and substantive shore, there'll be a visit, there'll be a security assessment and an offer of assistance to the juror you know, it's interesting, the special counsel, jack smith is again seeking a gag order in the classified documents case down in florida, saying the trump's quote, and i'm quoting now deceptive inflammatory claims expose the law enforcement professionals who are involved in this case to unjustified an unacceptable risks. >> those risks have the potential to undermine the integrity of the proceedings, as well as jeopardize the safety of lawn for law enforcement do you think another gag order would be appropriate down there? >> it might be narrowly tailored to address the risk that's raised by a former president, and his followers lying about the fbi, basically saying the fbi wanted to assassinate president trump, former president trump, which is nuts. but people respond to nadine is, tell us a little bit about westport a crime novel. this is, this is fiction. >> yeah, it's fiction. try to make it as real as possible to take people inside of cases in situations i've known, but it's a who done it. it's a murder. is set in the world of financial management than a hedge fund that hope folks will find it pretty fun summer read, yeah, it's really you need a distraction today. i got it. you learn a lot readings as well because you know your stuff that extra, thanks for joining us, thanks for writing westport, a crime novel. i really appreciate it. thanks for having me here very much. >> i'm coming up. donald trump's conviction, throwing another wrench into the 2024 race. we're going to talk with veteran strategist james carville on how democrats should run against the criminal cnn saturday morning starting tomorrow at eight on cnn every weekday morning, cnn's five things has what you need to get going with your day and here are five reasons the supreme it on maps it's the five essential stories of the morning in five minutes or less you can stream it anywhere, any anytime we'll get you up to speed and on with your day. cnn's five things with kate bolduan, streaming weekdays exclusively on many were you stationed working or living at campbell as yoon between 1953 and 1987, if you or a loved one have suffered from a severe illness, you may be eligible for a settlement offer ranging from 100,000 $550,000 without a court filing morgan 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35 million in small donations let's discuss this in more of the political implications of the trump guilty verdicts with veteran democratic strategist james carville. >> james, thanks so much for joining us. this is clearly a very historic verdict. >> a former president united states, being found guilty of 34 felonies what do you think the political impact of this verdict will be well, i think is to be determined, but i think democrats should point out it did put up no defense. trump, would fail to defend himself. he goes out and both are stupid mouth outside of the courtroom. he had a chance to take the stand. he could have said anything in they wanted to he could defend himself. they put it put that abbott and costello clown and that was the fig leaf of a defense that they put up. so i think we should be very very pointed out. you did not defend yourself the second thing democrats should do, the jury, the jury, the jury, the jury in this country reign supreme. i hit his bow v8 and lawyer and thanks for somebody. i'm seeing that i think they know more than juries. you don't they sat there, they listened to the evidence. they weighed the evidence, and they came back with a unanimous verdict. so i don't think we need to say much more than that. we believe in the jury system four counts. as as you know, james or president biden has been consistently behind and some of the polling in recent weeks to donald trump we expect that will now change. and if it doesn't, what does that say about president biden well, you know, the poet has been pretty static for the last year and i think he should just do talk about how the jury system works. >> i think democrats like many point out that he's a, he's a coward. he had ever we chance to defend himself. and the other thing is i cds up sean hannity and laura ingraham, these people talking about a manhattan jury, i got news for your manhattan juries are pretty good. the crime rate manhattan is way lower than it is in florida. i don't know what these people are running away from but the crime rate manhattan yaks specifically is very low and juries they are, willing to convict people if they're guilty. but what they're not going to do is they're going to config guilty people. that's as simple as that. you don't defend yourself. they're gonna find you guilty. >> as you know, president biden very, very briefly today addressed the trump verdict. do you think he and his campaign should talk more about this i do not i think you should talk about things that are going to do. >> i wish they would talk more about ways in the minimum wage i wish had talked more about how to get and people tools to deal with test. but i this story will keep it on this business. for apa in solar by your story does not need more oxygen, it's a raging fire out you don't need a symbol of kerosene on a raging forest spartans northern california, i can tell you that there's plenty, plenty enough. >> i want to get your reaction, james, to how republican lawmakers have reacted to this verdict. watch and listen to this under joe biden, the weaponization of the justice system has become front and center in this selection cannot say that this trial was anything more than politics, masquerading as justice. >> i did not think it was a fair trial at all. >> its entire thing is absurd. this is a purely political exercise, not a legal one, and everybody knows that they know intuitively that it's wrong what do you make of that james well, i mean speaker johnson from louisiana. he went to the same law school. i did. apparently he doesn't believe in juries. i do i know when i was in roster with ella shoe, they taught a separate juries for foundational trial session and that we should always believe in trust in the wisdom of them. and that's what happened and none of them have an answer for that. and i would ask speaker johnson, why didn't trump defend himself if this was all a rigueur deal and he was being stopped from being talking, he had every right to take that stand and tell him his side the story. he chickened out. he was scared. he said that he would he did an upper the don't think he's going to bake present biden. i'm hoping to does can be on cnn june 27th. i think he's not weasel out of that too. >> we will see. do you have any concern, james, that this verdict potentially could backfire on democrats and unite trump's skeptical republicans around the former president i'm concerned about everything. >> i'm professional everything worries me, but i mean this sincerely that jury did its job. they've gotten us to claim that lead prosecutor it out to give him presidential medal of freedom. but i i think it's pretty static. it pretty fixed out to it. but. at the end of the day, i do think it'll have an opaque effect on