0 the nsa spying extends to some of the closest allies abroad. the national security agency end ad program that spied on as many as 35 world leaders after the white house order an internal review over the summer. several programs have already been shut down and others are expected to be closed at a later date. the report states president obama spent nearly five years in office in the dark, unaware of the nsa's practices overseas. officials say the targets of these programs are not typically decided by the president, but by the agency. yesterday congressman peter king defended the nsa's program saying they should be viewed as a positive thing for everyone involved. >> i think the president should stop apologizing, stop being defensive. the reality is the nsa has saved access to. in terms of spying on the world leaders, the 35 world leaders which is the latest thing that's riled the europeans and people all over the world, it's hard to imagine, if you captured something of interest from angela merkel's cell phone that reference to that wouldn't end up in the president's daily brief. may not say obtained through surveillance of her cell phone but the intelligence would be there otherwise why would you have it? snowden revelations, just keep rolling at the world and at the obama administration. i'm surprised there's not more push back because it's triggered a response by major nations, france, germany, even britain that's been our partner said it will work with the europeans for new rules. we'll come out of this with new rules that the nsa has to live with. somewhat more limited collection of these signals. the question we'll have to sort out does that put the country at any greater risk of attacks. does it take away any weapons that were important in defending the united states and our allies for that matter as we go to greater protection of civil liberties. >> does anybody around this table believe the nsa would tap the phone of one of america's most important allies, the cell phone of a world leader like angela merkel. does anybody believe the president would be kept in the dark? >> i believe there's such -- >> it's one thing if you tap the phones -- >> i don't think the president was tapping merkel's phone. >> you don't think that the president knew -- >> he may have gotten the data. i don't believe that. >> which is worse? >> that's terrible. >> if the president doesn't know this is happening. >> doesn't know about the irs. doesn't know about the website that's going to collapse. >> the question is what kind of damage at this point, i would love to hear everyone's point of view on this, does this do to the relationship. no matter what we do to try to fix it at this point the damage is done. >> let me ask another question. what would we think if we found out angela merkel was tapping barack obama's phone or these other world leaders. holy cow. this is outrageous. >> that's why it's such a big story in europe. you don't see it here. it's a lead story in the "journal." it's a huge story in europe. what is the long term impact of this, angela merkel has come out publicly and said we got some work to do to repair the damage from this. does this affect our relationship with germany and beyond? >> it certainly is a political issue between the u.s. and german governments. the larger thing people should be aware of is in reaction to these allegations european companies are saying to european business customers you can't trust your data with the united states. go to this cloud service provider, don't go to amazon. identify seen an estimate that $25 to $35 billion worth of business in the cloud computing area alone could be lost because of this. countries will enact their own data laws. internet that we think is unbroken and open around the world i fear it will be segmented as countries have their own rules and own protections. >> about six years ago when the president was running, you know if he gets in there our reputation around the world will be so much better. everybody hates george w. bush. this is all we need for a brand new world. little did we know while he was giving that speech in berlin his people were bugging every office. think about the damage this has done and this is one more of those bush/cheney programs that this administration has taken to ridiculous lengths. >> the real world implications is massive. the damage has been done that's not just political but mic economically. the idea that the president doesn't know about these things over and over again -- i imagine people think it's a better explanation than saying he did know. that's hard for me to see how it's a positive. if that is true that's alarming. given that they are arguing this wholesale review we have not heard a revamp of this from the president. he made his speech, he made his press conference. he needs to go back and explain exactly what's happening. these revelations keep coming and more will continue. >> one more story before we go to break. over the weekend the affordable care act main website went into a bit of an overhaul. >> that's good. i should have gone on it yesterday. instead of watching football, if they had an overhaul -- >> buy one get one free. >> willie, sign right up. >> okay, boys. >> it shut down yesterday. >> it highlights the way you can enroll including the use of a navigator for consumers to purchase health coverage. the website couldn't make to it monday without experiencing another major issue. hhs officials say the system was down late sunday because of an outage due to one of its data centers. >> so, donny, you've done a lot of successful launches. so help me out here. this goes one of two ways. this either causes serious problems and has a lingering effect which terrible launches have that impact on certain products, or it's the sort of thing next january we're looking back and going huh? what? how does this go? >> once again let's separate the success of a concept of this new law versus the technological execution. i think the average american can distinguish between the two. we're asking for a sea change the way americans behave. a year from now of course there were a lot of kinks. they will fix it. i think it will take a year. >> how do you know that? >> i think they will -- >> listen to bill clinton. you love bill clinton. >> this is massive. the trap door, the boobie trap for the republicans if they spend the next six to nine months if they focus on execution than the brand of their party -- >> this next sound bite is a stretch. i tried it on friday. it rang hollow. when the former president does it it works, but you can tell he has to like really try to talk around it. he doesn't have that thing. president bill clinton defended the program and its roll out while campaigning in virginia for terry mcauliffe. >> look at america today. we got to implement this health care law. the computer deal will get fixed up. don't worry about that. everybody forgot when president george w. bush a republican put that medicare part d drug program in it was more unpopular than the health care law and they had terrible problems with the computers. but our side we're not so ideological so instead of bashing them our people tried to help most people understand the law and help get it work and getting it fixed. difference between being an ideologue and -- >> president bush, his song all conservatives given away prescription drugs to senior citizens was not unpopular concept. >> he does a good job kind of. >> you know what the president should do -- >> that challenger thing. >> the president should get in front. i think this is a nine to 12 month process. >> he did. look i actually agree with them but i think the medicare part d argument and the whole, that's just grasping. this is a bad roll out. it can be fixed. a website can be fixed. the effects of shutting down the government and doing what the anti-obama care group in congress did far more dangerous and long lasting in terms of its implication, that's the bottom line. thanks for wasting that money. >> maggie, we got some problems here with roll out. right? a little bit of problems. but bigger problem "l.a. times" had a story yesterday that actually there are a lot of californians that are finding have been dropped from their insurance and then they are going out and trying to get new health insurance and they are finding out it's costing them a lot more. for some middle class people, a lot of middle class people. they get dropped unsceremonousl. the website will get fixed. the question is now you have into bill clinton's thing people don't focus on that, we're looking at these technical glitches will get done. there is this question of how many people get signed up by march and that's when this deadline is. there's some democrats calling for a delay. >> joe manchin is calling for a year and jean shaheen up in new hampshire not a right-winger talking about a delay. >> it tells you this is going to be an ongoing issue for people looking at elections next year. they are concerned about it. they are concerned about the success of this program depends on how many people, young people who are not in ill health enrolls. to the extent this website are masking other issues like sticker shock, to some extent the administration should be happy that people are focusing on the website. >> isn't that the story, we don't know the markets may adjust six months from now. but that really is a bigger challenge than a website launch, right? >> i think people feel they are out of pocket for this new reform that was promoted to them they will be unhappy and angry. whether the benefits that ordinary folks feel in terms of having protection, being able to change jobs without worrying so much, whether those out weigh sticker shock problems we'll have to say. you worry sometimes that the country wasn't ready politically or technologically for the breadth of what the administration tried to do. >> coming up on "morning joe," former vice president dick cheney will be here on the set plus politico strategist david axelrod, senator tom coburn and dr. nancy snyderman. up next the top stories in the politico playbook. but first bill karins. >> halloween forecast looks iffy for millions of people across this country. we have a big storm moving across the nation bringing a lot of heavy rain with it. it's cold in montana. that's where the storm is located in the intermountain west providing snow in montana, even areas of northern nevada, higher elevations near billings, montana and out there in the plain. rapid city and black hills will be getting some snow. we turn from a snowstorm to a big rain storm in the middle of the country. not so much today. we're okay today. east of the rockies you're all right. chance of some showers in chicago and atlanta. no significant airport delays. as we get towards the halloween forecast one of those areas we're targeting up through the great lakes. a big rain maker for chicago, detroit, cleveland, indianapolis, all the way down through nashville, louisiana and east texas. we're talking about a lot of big cities and unfortunately looks like a lot of west trick or treaters on thursday. i'll pinpoint that forecast as halloween approaches. washington, d.c., you're looking for a nice warm up this week. your rain doesn't arrive until friday. you're watching "morning joe". ready to run your lines? 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