Transcripts For CSPAN2 The Plots Against Hitler 20161127

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a fascinating story of courage and excellent study of the struggle of individuals to act morally and honorably. we are so pleased to welcome the author to harvard bookstore today. please join me in welcoming comment danny orbach. >> good evening everyone. first of all, thank you for coming. thank you for coming to hear about this new book. my talk this evening, first of all what this book is about generally. in this specific episode from the boat, maybe read a few messages. and finally, i'm going to zoom in on one particularly interesting aspect, here in the plot against hitler of revolutionary charisma. first of all, what this book is about, this book is about a secret underground organization, from 1938-1944. it was an elite organization. its members are military officers, high civil servants come in diplomats, theologians, labor leaders, mostly from conservative rights, but also the sociodemographic left. it is a very authoritarian screw, but they were all united in their nature to the regime. it was established in 1938 by an officer from the german secret service their uncle in 1938 ways to prevent the drifting of germany and europe to the second world war. when the war began, that's not the worst soonest possible by eliminating the nazi regime, taken the government and making a fair piece released book and failure to delete. so this was the story of the conspiracy, and some of them creative with the story of the very tragic failure but also a story of courage. what i'm doing in the boat, i'm telling this story because the story is very interesting. and besides telling the story i tried to find the truth to the people in the peak of their career, highly successful people to risk their lives in such a way as to conspire against a nazi regime. germany was about to lose the war as some people claim or did we do it to stop hitler's clients. there is a very deep debate in the book. as importantly, highly secret conspiracy works is a major theme in this book. in this country, and our public discourse, we are surrounded by conspirators. some conspiracies are real and they think it's interesting to take a real conspiracy. how it actually works in reality. the german resistance movement throughout the sixers effect david e. was led by one person in the chief of the army general and peter escape out the hitler in 1938 because it was the drifting of the second world war. the civilian later walked along in the conservative mayor or resigned from the force against the persecution of the. so this is the player who read the resisting. but the people who actually planned the assassination attempts with a military officers. each. in the movement unity there was a military leader. there were three military leaders, one after the other. it was between 1938 and 1944 district in three dimensions. the creative men would speak in detail and the last one, did anyone watch the tom cruise movie? a dashing figure, very romantic officer, a very educated man. the most famous figure of the resistance. they tried famously in july 1944 to smuggle a bomb in a briefcase into the headquarters. the bomb exploded that hitler didn't die. the leaders of the resistance in berlin were able to occupy chairs for a few hours with military forces and all of hitler's police in the city. there was a struggle in berlin, who was crushed around midnight. the two leaders were shot and the movement was crushed in july 1944. the episode i want to speak about today is about the second liter. a man whose last known, but when several of the most creative and interesting assassination attempts. this famous forefathers were generals, nobleman, even before germany was established, russia's very conservative. when he joined the army in the late 19 twentieths, it was supportive enough for a very short while, but the view to several massacres, especially denied that the alumni. especially the persecution of the jews. it became transfixed after the 1938 night. but then made a crucial decision not to leave the army. paula davis settled restraints in the german resistance. they told them if you want to resist the regime, stay in the army. don't go back in your uniform because things are being planned and if you like to participate, you need to be ironed. so he remained in the army. after the second world war began, he participated in the war, excels in the war. he was carried by enthusiasm for a short while after the germans had to rio for france. he famously said all of my dowser despair now after a stunning victory in the real economy feature enough for a good peace, the peace be to god. when the war in the east began in 1941, june 1941, and army group center, one of the german detentions was again horrified by criminal command. in the beginning they tried to focus and took his friends and officers and went together to the leader of the army group and try to convince them to go and force them to cancel the massacres. we are in 1941. this field marshal immediately to hit their into thin the occasion of this order will assume the guilt they would not forget for centuries. you and i as well your children and my children who just went into the store over there. the man riding his bicycle over there and the legal ball. think about what i just said. but the field marshal did not name the contact with the resistance center in berlin and volunteered to be this. to take the assassination of hitler and the mission and from late 1941 to a small group of kids or editors, especially intelligence officer, and the idea was rather simple, but it was complicated to kill hitler as soon as he visited because in russia, the security of hitler is a new environment. it's a difficult environment. hitler may fear the russians, but certainly not his own officers. the first was to put a bomb in hitler's car, but the car was guarded, day and night. the second idea was to shoot hitler through his shooting squad. but they wanted them to cooperate the resistance in the field marshal vetoed the plan. and they decided they were the only way to kill hitler is there a bomb. did anyone hear during the coalitions? i never did. people say it's very good. it's a french later, german officers at the time took plastic explosives into a square package that could fit into a package. then viewing hitler's visit, can you do me a small favor? i have a friend in hitler's headquarters. would you be so kind to fetch it and bring it to headquarters and an officer will in the same plane as hitler. and i am quoting. i waited until hitler dismissed the officers of the army group center. i read the order to go ahead with the help of the key i press down hard trickery and the bomb and handed and boarded the plane shortly after this year. a few minutes later he hitler's same investor in the other members of his party escorted by a number of planes started back to these russia. we returned to our quarters from where they gave them the second cold war, indicating the flash was underway. after waiting hours, we received the shattering view that hitler's planned landed without incident and that hitler himself had saved headquarters. we cannot imagine what had gone wrong. i gave them the cold lawyers for the failure of this nation. afterwards, shaken by the blow, concerned about what our next move should be. the failure of our attempt was bad enough that the discovery of what the bomb would mean to us and our fellow conspirators, friends and family was infinitely worse. this would not be good news. so they went to hitler's headquarters and took a train, came to his officer, that was a mistake. he went 10, locked his cab and and discovered the condition of the explosive was unchanged, carefully dismantling the bomb. the reason for this failure immediately became clear. everything but one small part was good. the chemical had eaten through the wider. the firing had been released forward, but they were not ignited. probably because the british bomb, by the way and was very cold inside the place. it was a chemical reaction. it slows it down. the assassination attempt, which i like to call an afternoon in the museum. hitler was about to give a speech in a museum in berlin or the armory. in the museum there was an exhibition of culture, soviet military banners. hitler wanted to see the exhibition. the guy should be someone familiar with the soviet military and who is better than intelligence officer at the easter rent. he put a bomb on himself and his plan was to ignite the bomb secretly and then explore about guiding the exhibition. i spent march 20th at the armory to examine the possibility for an assassination attempt. laborers everywhere in the yard at the museum where the ceremony was to take place in the exhibition himself, the speaker's stand had been set up and the stage for the shamanic orchestra. they are guarding the place day and night. and then, you listen to the speech that was very to concentrate in minnesota to take her into the museum, but hitler instead of listening, just ran to the outside. they started to ignite into 20 minutes for the bomb to explore. so the window of opportunity for the assassination because at least 10 minutes, even if the temperature was normal, hitler's life was saved by a last-minute change, a sophisticated security system cannot listened to the ceremony in russia with a stopwatch in his hand. when he hears the announcer declared that he had left the armory, the plan would not have been completed. but he didn't give up a lot with this college who was his successor the suicide bombers. recruiters that the resistance tried to find officers to make preliminary conversation and then try to volunteer to the resistance. people who seem -- were recruited suicide bombers. one of them was an officer. he was an apolitical german officer and appeared and expressed to change ukraine. he testified, reading from the book. the governor asked us to help the operation, which hitler's father explained as an anti-jewish measure to refuse is all we could do. after a few days, 2,003,000 people are made to stand in long lines to be killed one by one of the following day to begin a manhunt after the few who managed to hide. a one man kneeled in front of me and ask for advice, but there is nothing they could do for her. they shared weakness for the first time committed by the government for which he was duty bound. the sense of in face of such evil gendered a religious like change of heart and a vision, a higher calling. unlike other conspirators come he didn't volunteer to aid the event, but also to be the cutting edge. the only thing he felt he could do was to assassinate hitler. in 1943, the age of the resistance arranged a meeting and asked the young man whether he was ready to kill hitler. the assassination attempt was as creative as the previous one. it was a new designer winter uniforms at the time. what better with medals of bravery, and the person who organized the fashion show was an asian just the resistance. beneath the winter uniforms, they put it again. it took a few months to prepare another one and was recalled to the front, were front, would get front, would get an remain nature lies to the end of the war. they did it for family connection. they took a young boy, a lieutenant the son of an aristocrat, one of the founders of the german resistance and testifies that his january 1944. i want to leave the agent of the resistance, telling me to report for duty with my regimen. he got straight to the point by telling me, everything is in place, we need the volunteers to assassinate hitler. are you willing to do it? he explained to me they would blow up without their in berlin and proceeded and greeted me and as usual warmhearted manner and offered me a dream. we discussed the plan until they said okay, give me 24 hours to think about it. i went on to brief my father. i thought it was one of the founders of the german resistance. now we face the decision whether to sacrifice his son to. they don't officer rather than reading from the book, to seek his father's advice, a veteran of the conspiracy once put his life on the line is so resistant to aging, but would he agree to sacrifice? the father and son had been linked to the conversation. according to the testimony, he paused for a moment and then advised me to go for it. he failed to respond to such a challenge, you would never be happy again. very weird argument in my opinion. if you blow yourself up you will never be happy again as well, but people thought differently at the time. clyde was ready to do it, but the last serious attempt in july 1944 was planned by an officer who was a very good sharpshooter and he planned to kill hitler. he was an assistant at the field partial. he usually carried by field marshal, talking and yet again officers are allowed to carry guns and volunteered for the suicide attempt to shootout their and knew he would be shot by one guard. they were looking for a conversation and told him, you know, you can finish with misery in one moment. later it was so convincing that you just couldn't say no. and he volunteered. he was about to enter the room with the field marshal. the officer grabbed him by the hand and told him today no entry for young officers. the irony of this story as most of the leaders of the resistance after the note that was discovered, all of the suicide bombers stayed alive. after the war. that was one of true ironies. now in the last part of the talk, i want to speak about not only why did we do it, to make a long story short, there's a picture motive to save germany from destruction. i want to speak about a different aspect. revolutionary leadership, how people are influenced by the leader have a very charismatic leader to sacrifice the life and new creations, which i'll testify to immense charisma a woman herself was the secretary who wrote the secret order for the coup d'état and testify after the war an incredible gift for connecting and winning you over. yet how shall i put it? they exercised a very strong immediate influence of the surrounding that the chart and their beauty to convince. you trusted him. if you look at the picture, you will see a middle-aged german uniform and. you wouldn't see any charisma. this is just yet another sign of how difficult it is to transfer the power of charisma across space and time. charisma is the process of dialogue. a person would give their charismatic audience, chairman officers and russia would be ridiculous. bless charisma? what's it all about? there is this element that we cannot break and start the way people look, the way they taught, their voice, their expression. have you seen the picture of him? she tried to convey to the interviewer something that is very clear, but was not clear to anyone who had not been there. the other aspect was known as a commander who deeply cared about their daily lives of the very hierarchy german army was made a very beloved commander i see the final key point and they solve the problem for your audience. usually it's some thing was some kind of contradiction. do you fear the answer, charismatic figure something you don't care about. you will not listen. you cannot find the right words. four officers in the eastern front belonged to the german resistance movement. citing your government in wartime. how can one still be patriotic germany. how can one uphold military values will be in a resistance fighter and trained to secure your head if they? these people care a lot about the army in this military advice. when you seize letters coming you see that one day he sent to his son over the ceremony a letter praising the prussian military values at tbs and beauty. just the next day as a conspirator. one of active revolutionary means. everything we've learned from our forefathers that the russian german soldier is stabilized, in the mobility. silly alyssa said, what are military skills matter windows skills are in this office in in two main ways, three main ways. first by example and his example was very controversial. unlike some other conspirators was to fight hit their insight soviet army. he did his duty because he felt duty bound and he gave to all of this man an example to be an officer. it is like walking to demanding jobs. that was one thing. the second thing is more values and the people are the leaders of germany. so if you're a german teacher, you have to oppose the corner of the country, even if they can't does the work. even if the country will be occupied. it is the utmost national interests. the surrendering regardless of who's in power and the assassination of later even if it does not succeed. it is now not a practical therapy, but to prove to history that the german resistance has stayed besides this, nothing has any weight. the third issue, which i find the most interesting, and conversations of subordinate officers and curators took the concept of an enemy that every soldier knows it's clear that a returning officer at the front, defined their as the enemy is actually the enemy of the front. every soldier boy needs to fight the enemy. it took the soldier values in terms of hit her as the biggest danger to the nation. no matter how you look at it and talk about it, the doing of a single man, he must perish. after they failed in july, 1944, is about to take his own life, to make a suicide. he said i don't want to get the added pleasure pleasure of taking my own life. i think this dilemma is summarized in his last speech before he opened grenade on himself. [inaudible] but i am convinced now as much as i've heard that have done the right thing. i believe hitler is the enemy not only a germany, but in deed of the tire world. in a few hours time, i shall stand before investing in a neglected to do. and the officer of the eastern front to take responsibility for some war crimes. i think he said ikea with a clear conscience stand but all i've done. just as god has promised that he would have the 10 men that he found in the city. i also have reason not for my sake he would not destroy germany. no one among us can complain about is that for whoever joined our ranks, and the greek mythology, immense moral war is established only at the point where he's prepared to give his life. thank you very much. [applause] any questions? yeah, please. [inaudible] >> more strategically, what is the fracturing point that it hurts so much from the ideology that they will actually try to kill you? >> i think what hitler did was relatively sound. he brags the general. they left so many people participating that they don't have any reason to overthrow it. he gave a lot of present. the people who resisted in there were a small minority and when it took place in july 1944, the army question and so i think hitler did much better than other dictators who angered so many people. don't anger to many people. >> by member has taken a personal oath of allegiance to hitler. >> the conspirators from the top, the leader to the bottom were very disturbed and famously said that gave a sworn allegiance to hit their, but they felt duty bound. what they said and is expected with the leader of the resistance, that hitler broke its own oath to the constitution that nobody's being duty bound to keep them off in a library. the conspirators actually said explicitly in the speech they plan to the nation. >> you said they wanted to stop the eastern front. [inaudible] >> definitely anonymous statements, which are plenty, but in july 1944, gave orders to the district military commanders. it is actually the main document of the group, immediately after arresting the government's minister was to occupy the concentration and the guard and release the prisoners. >> how did they find each other? >> there is a strong religious element. almost all conspirators were deeply religious man and women. even socialists which participated in conspiracy became more and more religious. very interesting. communism is a kind of religion. in order to resist the modern states in 20th 20th century history, units and in higher and they think it's a very good choice. how did they find each other? who's usually by family connections. this is how the resistance network of the world. usually when you're doing something very dangerous, you prefer to be recruited by a person you really trust. in the boat by the way, the rule of revolutionary beautician. normal friendly connection transformed into conspiratorial connection in certain conditions. that is how it usually works. in later stages they are also recruiters, but this officer in ukraine is deeply anti-train six. the reason there are so many in the conspiracy was not because they were more than other classes. it is because the founder and the people tended to be from your class. anymore questions? [inaudible] >> there is a weed to those made. it was very important. wednesday's people were negotiating with the western allies as much as we could get the detailed government. and device independence to shame proposed train six germany. these people were very much involved in the military planning as well. [inaudible] >> is a very good question. everyone very wise a subject to disarm me to the political scientist trying to re-sharp in the army in a way that would prevent the future. the only problem is involved, for example, you don't want to promote people -- [inaudible] you don't want information to flow too much inside the army because you want to know everything that slows the command-and-control structure. it is very conventional war. i think era to one and aided syria right at the moment and it's going to be a tragedy in the disaster. >> how did you get started in the research? >> i started in high

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