Transcripts For CNNW The Lead With Jake Tapper 20180822 20:0

Transcripts For CNNW The Lead With Jake Tapper 20180822 20:00:00


for the principle purpose of influencing the election. president trump today is claiming that those campaign violations are, quote, not a crime. that's not what the justice department said and same president named as individual one in the plea deal. you can believe individual one who is implicated in the crimes. the president. who does have a long and storied history of saying thing that is aren't true. or you can believe career prosecutors at the justice department, two federal judges and a jury of paul manafort's peers but you have to pick one or the other. another falsehood of the president saying that he did not learn of the hush money payments until after they'd been made. despite the fact, of course, that michael cohen recently released an audio recording of september 2016 in which donald trump can be clearly heard discussing a potential payment to playboy model karen mcdougall and president trump verified that tape tweeting at the time, what kind of a lawyer would tape
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happen in the political investigations. >> reporter: the president also claiming today that cohen's campaign finance violations are, quote, not a crime and falsely claiming that president obama's campaign had similar issues. >> if you look at president obama, he had a massive campaign violation. but he had a different attorney general. and they viewed it differently. >> reporter: obama's campaign paid a $375,000 fine from the federal election commission for reporting errors and never accusations that aides intentionally sought to conceal contributions that violated the law. cohen reaching a deal with prosecutors on charges related to the hush money payments to two women claiming to have affairs with trump. >> that's what donald trump is, he's an unindicted co-conspirator. >> reporter: the court documents have references to trump blind sided the president. sources told cnn as legal risk
now we know because of these tapes. yes, he did know about it. he said i didn't know about it until later. whatever that means. later than what? so they have zero credibility on this story as on so many. >> does it matter? >> yes. in the grand scheme of things. but will it matter to trump supporters? no, it won't. it doesn't. because they're looking at the -- they think he's been under siege the entire time and believe him first and foremost. we'll see if it matters in the midterms for those that voted for trump, because they're republicans and not part of the trump train. that remains to be seen. in terms of, you know, whether the president's lying about this, i think at this point it's baked in. >> so, kaitlan collins, our able white house correspondent tried to push sarah sanders on this issue. take a listen. >> in his interview today, the president said he found out about those payments that michael cohen made later on but
>> i heard this as a defense. i'll come back do you in a moment. jen, president trump has been paying off people, women inclouded, for years, to keep their mouths shut. might not be the most happy explanation for religious people or moral people, people who believe in the sanctity of marriage but maybe it wasn't expressly related to the presidency. >> thank you for bringing us donald trump. this might be a point they make and bizarre to be one of the talking points. what you saw michael cohen say in the courtroom yesterday was that this was -- he knowingly did it, related to the election. he was convicted of a federal crime. he is now the sitting president of the united states. and he was just implicated in a federal crime. i think there's a difference between being a sitting president and what he did as scandalous as it may have been. >> it's dicey to suggest it's
about collusion and this doesn't prove collusion and the other stuff. >> on the factual basis. but the president obviously said something today that wasn't true, didn't know about it until after the fact. >> how the white house responds. >> you mean sarah sanders. not the president. he's part of the president, to. >> president sanders handled it -- >> and donald trump have lied about this, this instance. michael cohen said he did this on his own. the president didn't know about it. now the president directed know do it. so it's not just the president wh who's told different stories on this. it's also michael cohen. when you have a credible claim and i think you have laid out, multiple other reasons why someone would pay this money, this is a very, very hard case to prove that he's broken campaign finance laws. >> do you think it makes a difference, a difference in the midterm elections, a difference in the trump presidency or is everybody just in their corners and it is going to remain as it has been? >> two different things. midterm elections you saw democrats came out today and
they really didn't want to talk about impeachment or ruffling the feathers before the midterm elections. they don't want to energize trump's voters. republicans won't move to impeachment where they want trump voters supporting them and they don't need to at this point. in the midterms, no. yesterday should be and i think could be a turning point as we look back six months from now as to when democrats may want to lay the case and after the outcome of the mueller investigation. it is true that this isn't linked to russia currently but there are a lot of links that mao michael cohen and that all of these players, paul manafort, have to russia, a lot more about that that we'll still learn. >> stick around. we have lanny davis saying there's potential things an links that michael cohen wants to talk about and knows something that mueller will want to hear. thousands of dollars on a flight for a pet rabbit?
30 tequila shots. hawaiian shots and hotel rooms. which member of congress is accused of spending this kind of money? stick with us. ♪ a hotel can make or break a trip. and at expedia, we don't think you should be rushed into booking one. that's why we created expedia's add-on advantage. now after booking your flight, you unlock discounts on select hotels right until the day you leave. ♪ add-on advantage. discounted hotel rates when you add on to your trip. only when you book with expedia.
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media did the payment of sorts to karen mcdougall it's not come pain money so it's not a come pain violation. true? >> two. we have a federal judge as well as federal prosecutors that accepted the plea and the notion that the president can undue the -- bl whethwhether this is or not is silly. it has to do with disclosures. coming from the company, that's a violation. whether it came from him through cohen, nondisclosed. that's the problem. the campaign and election laws care about knowing where the money is going and people know how to vote and when's paying for these campaigns. that's the problem and the issue with whether it was knowing, the notion that it was handed over in order to affect the outcome of the campaign, that is we don't want this information coming out because it's going to hurt the candidate, that makes it a crime. >> michael cohen said, and pleaded to, he did this directed by president trump, coordinated
by president trump then candidate trump to affect the election. but the president's defenders have argued and again this is an odd defense but this guy's been paying off women to keep their mouths shut for a listening time, not just women, other people, too. not necessarily related to the presidential election. do they have an argument to make? >> they have to come up with something. john edwards made a similar argument having to do with my girlfriend, not campaign. but the timing and the circumstances are so different and the edwards case, it was months if not years removed and it was a current girlfriend. this was people he had affairs with allegedly ten years ago on the very doorstep of the election so the timing's very different and the actions mr. trump took to make the payments, through the attorney, through a corporation. prosecutors argue would be to disguise the nature of the transaction, all circumstantial evidence of wrongdoing or criminal intent. >> cohen said in court that
trump directed limb him to quie women. why wouldn't they have that in writing as to what he pleaded to? >> so, the statement that cohen made during the actual -- you know, i'm not sure exactly why that itself wouldn't have been in the document. perhaps seth has a thought on that. >> does it even matter? >> i mean, he said it in open court under oath and the court accepted the plea. if it weren't an actual crime and evidence supporting the allegations that he was pleading guilty to the article 3 judge wouldn't accept this. >> so a president, the justice department guidelines are a president can't be indicted. does this just take it to the political realm of impeachment? only legal ramification here potentially? >> big ramification. i think that's right. i'm of the opinion a sitting president should not be indicted. there's a process if the
president goes south. to allow an individual federal prosecutor or state prosecutor to indict the president and allow 12 jurors to decide the fate of the president could run amuck and an impeachment proceeding to take police and i think that's where this can head up. >> i have a different view on that. >> sure. there's a debate. >> there's a debatement ken starr's office as well as another concluded that you could indict a sitting president. >> you could? >> you could. yes. it's not clear in the constitution. people talk about plain reading the constitution whether to indict a sitting president is not in there. i think the structure assumes accountability for every member of our government and to the extent of which congress right now is sort of out to lunch, not actually doing their oversight role here, the notion that there would be no accountability potentially if this political process fails i think is a problem. i do think you could in theory indict a sitting president and put it under seal. the public wouldn't know.
after he finishes office then those cases could go forward on the theory that we would have to go to the statue of limitations. the issues really boil down to is it going to interfere with his ability to execute the law under article ii? if it's quiet, if the public isn't aware, i don't think it interferes. >> a final question, both of you, which is, president trump's defenders and president trump himself have suggested that because manafort was only found guilty of eight of the 18 charges, the other 10 were resulted in a hung jury or mistrial on the 10 and president trump wrote 10 not decided in the paul manafort case. witch hunt. i don't know what that has to do with that there. as a former prosecutor, are you lap pi with that result? >> as a defense lawyer, that's not a good day for me and my client. defending an individual client an they got con convicted on
bank fraud, tax evasion, with sentencing guidelines that could be from 10 to 20 years. so mr. trump's statement is a wishful thinking. not reality. it was a bad day for mr. manafort clearly and for the trump organization as a whole. >> what do you think? >> yeah. politically, too, where i think the white house now stumbling. running out of ways of spinning this in a way that's not absolutely damaging and i think we're seeing the house is going to fall. the house of cards eventually. not sure how it comes down but this is not sustainable in a popsicle stand let alone the white house and the executive branch of government in the united states. >> thanks so much for being here. appreciate it. if michael cohen answers lawmakers' questions, again, will that spell new trouble for president trump? the vice chairman of the senate intelligence committee responds to that next. to look at me now, you don't see psoriasis. you see clear skin. you see me. but if you saw me before cosentyx... ♪
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special counsel robert mueller with the russia investigation. >> my observation is that the topics relating to hacking and the crime of hacking laid out in the indictments of the 12 russians that there are subjects that michael cohen could address. >> reporter: davis also offering cohen to testify to any congressional committee regarding the 2016 trump tower meeting with russians without immunity. one reason? cohen's long-time support of the president -- >> the next president of the united states of america. >> reporter: -- as wavered. >> it's been a evolution to his loyalty of president trump. he has regrets about. >> reporter: the regrets played out in tuesday's plea agreement where it's clear just after trump announced the candidacy in 2015, cohen was already working on a plan to quash any bad press about trump. quote, the defendant and one or more members of the campaign
offered to help deal with negative stories about individual one's relationships with women. individual one is trump. two of those women karen mcdougall and stormy daniels who cohen admitted to paying off in 2016 just weeks before the election. cohen told a judge he did the 2016 hush money payments for the principle purpose of influencing the election and stunned the courtroom by admitting he took part in fact payments in coordination with and at the direction of a candidate for federal office, a major contradiction to when the president told reporters he had no knowledge of any payments. >> did you know about the $130,000 payment to stormy daniels? >> no. no. >> reporter: davis says cohen's courtroom moment was a turning point. >> he's stepped up to the line and he can now speak again and he feels liberated. >> reporter: and trump's team saying cohen's admissions are on him and him alone and that the
president didn't do anything wrong here and hasn't committed a crime. jake? >> thank you. joining me now is democratic senator mark warner of west virginia, vice chairman of the senate intelligence committee. thank you so much for joining us. as you know, michael cohen's lawyer lanny davis claims that michael cohen has evidence that the president knew about the hacking of the dnc e-mails before that even happened and also says that the president might -- michael cohen might know more about possible collusion with the russians. do you have any evidence? do you know of any evidence that might back any of that up? >> jake, i'm not going to comment of what mr. cohen testified to our committee as the chairman and i said yesterday. we've reconnected with mr. cohen. we had to clear up some of the earlier testimony and we hope that his plea deal would not preclude him from coming back before our committee. so i'm anxious to hear if he's got information about the
collusion or knowledge of the russian hacking before the leakage of that information and we have questions for him about his involvement in the proposed moscow trump tower. there are open questions on that issue, as well. so, if mr. davis is going to make him available to mr. mueller, i hope he's available to our committee, as well. >> how can you rely on what michael cohen says? i mean, hasn't he contradicted publicly or his lawyers have contradicted publicly things he said behind doors closed to your committee under snoet. >> clearly you will have to take some of mr. cohen's comments in context just as you have to take mr. trump's comments in context. i still remember that video of mr. trump saying i believe on air force one he had no knowledge of any payments to the adult porn star and clearly there's evidence not only knowledge but may have instructed now. so obviously, any of mr. cohen's comments taken in that context
and what other substantiating information? remember, we and much more than we, the mueller team has literally thousands and thousands of other individual's testimony and the ability to then corroborate or deny what cohen might say. it might be a missing piece. >> senator, michael cohen implicated president trump in federal court yesterday telling a judge that the payments he made to karen mcdougall and stormy daniels in coordination and at the direction of a candidate for federal office. do you think that president trump committed a crime? if so, what will or can you do about it? >> well, again, i think that's for court of law to figure out or another process to figure out but it does seem from at least what i have seen in the public press of the timing of these payments and the fact then
candidate trump was under a great deal of scrutiny of the "hollywood access" tape and seems like the time line and logic follows but as i said earlier, with both mr. cohen and mr. trump, neither one of these have been exactly people that are always on the straight and narrow in terms of the truth. >> take a listen to your fellow senator republican orrin hatch of utah this morning. he was asked about what these charges say about the type of people the president surround himself with. take a listen. >> naturally, makes you very concerned but, you know, the president shouldn't be held responsible for the actions of people he trusted. >> the president should not be held responsible for the actions of people he trusted. your response? >> i have a great deal of respect for senator hatch but i can't think in my lifetime and i remember richard nixon when there's been this many people that have been indicted or
guilty pleas, where you have the president's campaign manager, the president's lawyer, we have got the president's first national security adviser pleading guilty, we have potentially family members and others still under investigation. we have got mueller with over 30 other indictments now. other presidential appointees like his foreign policy adviser pleading guilty who clearly acknowledges the russians reached out to him with compromising information. i think you are judged by the company you keep. >> let's ask you a question, senator. based on what you know and you know more than the rest of us, did america have free and fair elections in 2016? >> you know, jake, i'm not here to relitigate 2016. >> you have a -- you have a knowledgeable take on what happened. we are talking about stormy daniels, karen mcdougall, russian collusion, all of this is about 2016. it is simple. you know more than the rest of us. did we have free and fair elections? >> jake, our committee's going
to finish this process. we've already finished on election security and also confirmed that the russians intervened to help trump and hurt clinton. we have elections in 65 odd days and as we have seen in the last 24 hours, as well, from microsoft, facebook and twitter, our foreign adversaries are still using the internet to try to interfere in our political debate and in our election cycle. >> senator warner, vice chairman of the intelligence committee, thank you so much. >> thank you. a congressman on a nice european vacation? not a big deal. spending hundreds of thousands of dollars at target, tequila shots from campaign funds, that lands you in legal trouble. we'll explain why and who. there that 1 in 30 boomers has, yet most don't even know it. a virus that's been almost forgotten. it's hepatitis c. hep c can hide in the body for years without symptoms. left untreated it can lead to liver damage, even liver cancer. the only way to know if you have hep c is to ask
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another early trump supporter on capitol hill accused of living a corrupt lifestyle. this time, congressman duncan hunter of california. according to charging documents he and his wife essentially broke but they were living large off of campaign money taking trips around the world, buying gichts for friends and a plane ticket for a rabbit. the indictment alleges that hunter a marine corps veteran bought clothes for himself and tried to purchase it off as golf balls for wounded warriors. congressman hunter is dismissing the claims as a political hit job. >> what i am is a representative to you and a campaign finance stuff i was not watching it close enough. i have fixed it now. i have fixed it now. it is all straightened out. >> reporter: for nearly two years, congressman hunter maintained that any misuse of campaign funds was accidental. >> when i start explaining it,
it sounds like excuses. the buck stops here. >> reporter: 60-count federal indictment against hunter and wife margaret paints a portrait of campaign of 30 shots of tequila and a steak, hawaiian shorts at a golf pro shop to falsely describe the purchase later as golf balls for wounded warriors and roughly $300 worth of goods at target including a white duck, two punky brewster items and a ring pop. >> i run as you could call me the right conservative wing of the republican party. >> reporter: in an effort to justify a family trip to italy, hunter allegedly tried to set up a tour of the naval base there. but when officials said they couldn't make the date work, hunter told his staff, tell the navy to go "f" themselves. when campaign staffers and the treasurer tried to raise concerns, hunter allegedly said
they were trying to create a paper trail. >> i'll be out there campaigning for him, standing in for him. >> reporter: now charged with violations, wire fraud and filing false campaign reports, the hunters claim the charges are politically motivated. pointing to the fact that prosecutors on the case attended a clinton campaign event. >> if they can cloud his name before the election, they take his seat, a republican seat, they put it in the democrat column. that's the reason they have done the late hit. >> reporter: multiple sources familiar with the case tell cnn the ultimate charging decision was made by u.s. attorney adam braverman, a career prosecutor appointed by attorney general sessions. founding member of the trump caucus in the house in the 2016 campaign -- >> duncan hunter, mr. president. >> reporter: he marks the second early trump backer along with republican congressman chris collins facing criminal charges heading into november's election. congressman hunter's democratic
opponent has already seized on these charges. in a new ad saying this just shows he was all in it for himself and he said he did nothing wrong and the doj is an arm of the democrats. making a first appearance tomorrow in court in san diego. >> thank you so much. let's talk about this. department of justice is an arm of the democrats? a department of justice of sessions and trump? >> they're so devious. even a republican administration they get their people in there. here's the good news part of this. it is the system working part of the story. this is the second member of congress who endorsed donald trump at a time when that kind of legitimacy was badly needed and he is facing the law dispassionately applied so that's the good news. the bad news you mentioned before. all of the really tawdry examples of incredible selfishness on his part and
indifference to the appearances. >> you used to work at the dccc and i remember in 2006 you all had a culture of corruption thing, after the jack abrahamoff scandal and we hear the dccc doing the same thing now. >> right. we back lack. last time democrats won back the house. something effective not just in washington or not really in washington but districts around the country and we would pick a crony of the week and an above the fold headline in the scranton paper. i remember one. this is something that people can identify with because corruption and people living by a different set of rules is manager that even if you're worried of food on the table matters. that's why democrats are trying to get focus on the issue this year. >> chris collins is not running for re-election. there's some weird way they get him out of running for the seat in new york. but duncan hunter who represents
a rather republican seat, he's not stepping down it doesn't look like. looks like he goes forward. paul ryan removed him from his committee and enjoying the benefits of being a member of congress and just charges. he's not convicted of anything. >> yeah. look -- this is not a good story. it's -- if he did anything near what approaches in that indictment, i -- i'm speechless. >> you were off camera. >> i just -- you know, you just can't believe that a person in congress today could think they could do this and get away with it. just the stupidity of doing things like this is overwhelming. having said all that, the timing of this stinks. and i say that, i know people are going to go back and check and it's true. when james comey did the hillary clinton thing before the -- i scream. i say he should not be doing
this. it's wrong. to have these two indictments, eight weeks, nine weeks, ten weeks, whatever it is, before the election, that stinks. the idea you can't wait until after the election and then have this thing come out to do it when people are stuck on the ballot, that is -- that is the justice department being political and it's wrong. >> the counter argument might be they're bringing the charges when they have the -- >> no. you don't -- you don't inject yourself. it is an allegation. he has no chance to respond other than to say it's wrong. no trier of fact. nothing to defend himself in the face of these allegations. not the right thing to do. >> when you read through the indictment, there is quite a bit. e-mails between the congressman and treasurer. they cite this evidence and it really is quite damning. >> it is an accusation. >> but it's not like he said/she said situation right now. >> it is the timing stinks. >> so one of the most shocking
charges is them -- the hunters, duncan and his wife, going to -- he needed a pair of shorts, going to a golf store to buy the shorts so that they could disguise the purchase as golf balls that they were going to say they bought for veterans. that is a shocking allegation. also -- >> cynical as you can get. >> he's a veteran. one would think he would no better. >> here's the worrisome thing. there's always been corruption and both sides of the aisle and we have this tendency since we have become so polarized for republicans to now be upping the ante every bad act so you find people like matt schlapp saying, you know, whatever they found about trump perhaps having participated in a crime, it's not treason. therefore, nothing to see here. each one of these becomes one more straw on the camel's back.
>> also, it is not exactly draining the swamp. >> right. >> when you have all of these things happening. people who are already cynical of washington, d.c., this isn't going to help. >> that's very true and, you know, to paul ryan's credit, he no longer has committee positions and they could vote to expel him. i don't think they're there yet and hoping he goes away and only so much to do to get rid of this person at this point and started that process. it is not that -- everyone's throwing up the hands saying deep state. right now. the hypocrisy. think of the donors, people who gave $100, $50 here. they're not paying for the congressman to, you know, work for them. they're paying for his vacation. >> collecting campaign contributions of people that didn't have the money anyway, i mean, this was treasure to me. this was like more than my own money and to see someone do
things like this is disgusting. and very upsetting to me. so but to get to jen's point, i happen to be on the ballot in 2006 when the dnc and we had mark foley, kirk welldon and the fbi raid a week before the election. it can have -- trust me, a cumulative affect and jen is right. nothing that cuts across party line like swarmy corruption. if this continues. i'm not saying this is not bad enough, this is going to be ugly election for republicans. next, new information in court about the suspect in the murder of a college student. why he didn't raise any red flags with his employer. stay with us. i'm beating this. my main focus was to find a team of doctors. it's not just picking a surgeon, it's picking the care team and feeling secure in where you are. visit cancercenter.com/breast
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now that you know the truth... are you in good hands? a judge just set bail at $5 million for the man accused of killing 20-year-old mollie tibetts, a talking point in the immigration debate. cristhian rivera confessed to the abduction. president trump cited the case for illegal immigration laws. diane, rivera worked at a dairy farm owned in part for a prominent iowa republican. how's he able to get through this screening process? >> reporter: so, jake, just in the couple of minutes here we have more clarification on this, the owner of that dairy farm coming out saying basically he gave a different name. this is not the man that we
thought it was. it is not the name on the paper work and they didn't use the dhs e-verify system but an older social security verification system. now, still a lot of unanswered questions here. that isn't stopping the plittization of the death and something people in iowa wish they didn't focus on. the disappearance of mollie tibetts now a case of murder. 24-year-old cristhian rivera charged in the 20-year-old university of iowa student's death this afternoon. >> you have been charged with murder in the first-degree. >> reporter: investigators say rivera led them to a corn field tuesday where they found a body believed to be mollie tibetts. >> he tells us that some point in time he blacks out and then he comes to, near an intersection which we believe he
then placed mollie. >> reporter: investigators say cristhian rivera worked farm. this afternoon, the farm said believed it was doing due diligence and using the wrong system. >> what we learned in the last 24 hours is that our employee was not who he said he was. and just within the last four hours we have come to learn that the social security administration employment verification service is not the same as e-verify. >> reporter: within hours of the arrest, politicians began using tibetts' death as a rallying point for the right, iowa's republican senators released a joint statement blaming criminals that broke the immigration laws adding, quote, we cannot allow these tragedies to continue. the president wading further in at a rally in west virginia. blaming democrats for weak border security. >> and you saw what happened to
that incredible, beautiful, young woman. the immigration laws are such a disgrace. we're getting them changed. but we have to get more republicans. >> reporter: in a statement, the tibetts family thanked the nation for the love and support while asking for privacy as they grieve. friends say they hope the politics now surrounding her death won't overshadow her life. >> do you fear that the whole illegal immigrant part of this conversation now will take over? >> we all came from immigrants. >> this isn't about being political? >> no, no, this is about mollie being a smart, beautiful -- >> very intelligent. >> intelligent young woman. >> reporter: people here in iowa are going to be remembering her tonight. she should have been starting the sophomore year of college at the university of iowa. they're going to hold a vigil, jake, in about two hours there on campus so fellow students and

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