the qr code on the screen now it'll take you to bbc wales news. we asked the five main parties to choose their representatives tonight, and we drew lots to decide their position on the stage tonight, leader of welsh labour and first minister, vaughan gething, for the conservatives, welsh secretary david tc davies. oliver lewis for reform uk. jane dodds, leader of the welsh liberal democrats. and the leader of plaid cymru, you nap rather, please welcome apparel. —— and what really matters to you, the voters? let's have a quick idea from our audience, and we have asked them to some of the main issues for them in a sentence. starting with this lady. would i go abroad i get asked, where in england _ would i go abroad i get asked, where in england is— would i go abroad i get asked, where in england is wales? _ would i go abroad i get asked, where in england is wales? what _ would i go abroad i get asked, where in england is wales? what will- would i go abroad i get asked, where in england is wales? what will you i in england is wales? what will you do to— in england is wales? what will you do to get— in england is wales? what will you do to get wales _ in england is wales? what will you do to get wales on _ in england is wales? what will you do to get wales on the _ in england is wales? what will you do to get wales on the world - in england is wales? what will you i do to get wales on the world stage? the gentleman— do to get wales on the world stage? the gentleman in— do to get wales on the world stage? the gentleman in the _ do to get wales on the world stage? the gentleman in the spectacles. . do to get wales on the world stage? l the gentleman in the spectacles. the relationship between westminster and the senedd. _ relationship between westminster and the senedd. and — relationship between westminster and the senedd, and the _ relationship between westminster and the senedd, and the loss— relationship between westminster and the senedd, and the loss of— relationship between westminster and the senedd, and the loss of devolved i the senedd, and the loss of devolved powers _ the senedd, and the loss of devolved powers in— the senedd, and the loss of devolved powers in wales _ the senedd, and the loss of devolved powers in wales. find _ the senedd, and the loss of devolved powers in wales— the senedd, and the loss of devolved powers in wales-— powers in wales. and in the back. what will you _ powers in wales. and in the back. what will you do _ powers in wales. and in the back. what will you do for— powers in wales. and in the back. what will you do for welsh - what will you do for welsh agriculture _ what will you do for welsh agriculture and _ what will you do for welsh agriculture and security i what will you do for welsh agriculture and security in| what will you do for welsh i agriculture and security in our rural— agriculture and security in our rural communities? _ agriculture and security in our rural communities?— agriculture and security in our rural communities? going to our first question — rural communities? going to our first question with _ rural communities? going to our first question with goes - rural communities? going to our first question with goes from - first question with goes from reardonjones. first question with goes from reardon jones._ first question with goes from reardon jones. ~ , , . , reardon jones. with rising prices and bills at _ reardon jones. with rising prices and bills at an _ reardon jones. with rising prices and bills at an all-time _ reardon jones. with rising prices and bills at an all-time high, - reardon jones. with rising prices | and bills at an all-time high, what and bills at an all—time high, what will you _ and bills at an all—time high, what will you do— and bills at an all—time high, what will you do to _ and bills at an all—time high, what will you do to help _ and bills at an all—time high, what will you do to help people - and bills at an all—time high, what will you do to help people in - and bills at an all—time high, what will you do to help people in this. will you do to help people in this cost of— will you do to help people in this cost of living _ will you do to help people in this cost of living crisis? _ will you do to help people in this cost of living crisis?— cost of living crisis? david tc davies. cost of living crisis? david tc davies- we _ cost of living crisis? david tc davies. we must _ cost of living crisis? david tc. davies. we must acknowledge cost of living crisis? david tc- davies. we must acknowledge there has been a cost _ davies. we must acknowledge there has been a cost of _ davies. we must acknowledge there has been a cost of living _ davies. we must acknowledge there has been a cost of living crisis - davies. we must acknowledge there has been a cost of living crisis as - has been a cost of living crisis as a result of a pandemic and the war in ukraine and what that did to energy prices id 400 billion the government had to spend a respect that making sure that benefits and the minimum wage went out with inflation, we spent it on further schemes that save 100,000 jobs in wales, and paid fuel bills on behalf of everyone in 22—23. has it reached everyone? there will be people that hasn't reached, we have to make it a priority to reach those who are most in need, but if you look at our record on the economy, we have brought down inflation to 2%, unemployment, 3%, joint fastest growth in the g7 along with canada so we have a good plan for the economy which will help people including those most in need. lanthem including those most in need. when inflation goes _ including those most in need. when inflation goes up — including those most in need. when inflation goes up it _ including those most in need. when inflation goes up it is _ including those most in need. when inflation goes up it is not _ including those most in need. when inflation goes up it is not your - inflation goes up it is not your fault, when it comes down to claim credit. ., ., , ., credit. inflation went up from janua credit. inflation went up from january 2022 _ credit. inflation went up from january 2022 in _ credit. inflation went up from january 2022 in all— credit. inflation went up from january 2022 in all countries. credit. inflation went up from - january 2022 in all countries across january 2022 in all countries across europe because of the money governments had spent but bringing down inflation meant taking difficult decisions over spending and borrowing, we took those decisions and inflation is now down at a very low level and that is good for the economy, good forjobs and for the economy, good forjobs and for those most in need. for the economy, good for “obs and for those most in need._ for those most in need. vaughan gethina. for those most in need. vaughan gething- the _ for those most in need. vaughan gething. the cost _ for those most in need. vaughan gething. the cost of— for those most in need. vaughan gething. the cost of living - for those most in need. vaughan gething. the cost of living is - for those most in need. vaughan | gething. the cost of living is real, i have gething. the cost of living is real, i have heard _ gething. the cost of living is real, i have heard about _ gething. the cost of living is real, i have heard about it _ gething. the cost of living is real, i have heard about it on _ gething. the cost of living is real, i have heard about it on the - i have heard about it on the doorstep _ i have heard about it on the doorstep. i have heard families reiterating the reality of their mortgage and food bills. and those are directly affected by what the conservative government has done. the liz— conservative government has done. the liz truss mini budget permanently raised mortgages across the country. people are still paying the country. people are still paying the price _ the country. people are still paying the price for that now. it is another— the price for that now. it is another reason why we need change at this election. the opportunity for this election. the opportunity for this country to enjoy economic stability— this country to enjoy economic stability and then to seriously invest— stability and then to seriously invest in— stability and then to seriously invest in our future, winning more 'obs invest in our future, winning more jobs for— invest in our future, winning more jobs for people across our country in the _ jobs for people across our country in the energy of the future, the jobs _ in the energy of the future, the jobs and — in the energy of the future, the jobs and industries of the future. that is— jobs and industries of the future. that is our— jobs and industries of the future. that is our plan. notjust clean energy— that is our plan. notjust clean energy that is good for the planet but is _ energy that is good for the planet but is good forjobs and will mean that we _ but is good forjobs and will mean that we are — but is good forjobs and will mean that we are not vulnerable to foreign — that we are not vulnerable to foreign dictators like putin for future — foreign dictators like putin for future energy supply, and those are things— future energy supply, and those are things that — future energy supply, and those are things that you will get if you vote for change — things that you will get if you vote for change on the 4th ofjuly. we are roud for change on the 4th ofjuly. - are proud that 1500 unite union workers in tata will be going on strike straight after the election, what will the post—government to myth about that? you what will the post-government to myth about that?— what will the post-government to myth about that? you will have the welsh and westminster— myth about that? you will have the l welsh and westminster governments working _ welsh and westminster governments working together. in the manifesto there _ working together. in the manifesto there is— working together. in the manifesto there is aptly a place for 2.5 trillion— there is aptly a place for 2.5 billion to _ there is aptly a place for 2.5 billion to go alongside the other trillion— billion to go alongside the other billion that has not been spent to transform — billion that has not been spent to transform the steel sector. what we need is _ transform the steel sector. what we need is a _ transform the steel sector. what we need is a uk government fighting alongside what i've already done to fi-ht alongside what i've already done to fight for— alongside what i've already done to fight for those steelworkers' job and having a united front with tata because _ and having a united front with tata because people need steel for the industries of the future. renewable energy— industries of the future. renewable energy will need more steel, not less _ energy will need more steel, not less there — energy will need more steel, not less. there was a healthy future for the steel— less. there was a healthy future for the steel sector if we can maintain it. , ., , back the steel sector if we can maintain it-_ itack to _ the steel sector if we can maintain it._ back to the - the steel sector if we can maintain i it._ back to the question it. jane dodds. back to the question about what we _ it. jane dodds. back to the question about what we will _ it. jane dodds. back to the question about what we will do _ it. jane dodds. back to the question about what we will do about - it. jane dodds. back to the question about what we will do about the - it. jane dodds. back to the question| about what we will do about the cost of living, food and fuel have gone up of living, food and fuel have gone up 25% in the last two years. i read that if you're making a spaghetti bowl now, it costs £2 more than it did two years ago. that is a struggle for many families. one of the big factors is that even wales, we have 29% of children who are poon we have 29% of children who are poor, 29% child poverty, and my challenge to the conservatives and labour if they are in power is, will you abolish the two child cap on benefits, because that is making families poorer, and that is shameful, in 2024.- families poorer, and that is shameful, in 2024. won't get in, will ou shameful, in 2024. won't get in, will you abolish _ shameful, in 2024. won't get in, will you abolish the _ shameful, in 2024. won't get in, will you abolish the cap? - shameful, in 2024. won't get in, will you abolish the cap? we - shameful, in 2024. won't get in, | will you abolish the cap? we have shameful, in 2024. won't get in, i will you abolish the cap? we have a manifesto review _ will you abolish the cap? we have a manifesto review to _ will you abolish the cap? we have a manifesto review to understand - will you abolish the cap? we have a manifesto review to understand all| manifesto review to understand all of the _ manifesto review to understand all of the policies that have been visited — of the policies that have been visited upon us because we want a fairer— visited upon us because we want a fairer deal— visited upon us because we want a fairer deal for people, to support their— fairer deal for people, to support their mental work and that means looking _ their mental work and that means looking at— their mental work and that means looking at all of these things in the round. i looking at all of these things in the round. lam looking at all of these things in the round. i am convinced we will have _ the round. i am convinced we will have a _ the round. i am convinced we will have a fairer— the round. i am convinced we will have a fairer benefit system to support — have a fairer benefit system to support families into work and help them _ support families into work and help them out _ support families into work and help them out of poverty. a clear manifesto pledge on lifting children out of— manifesto pledge on lifting children out of poverty and the last uk labour — out of poverty and the last uk labour government lifted over half a million _ labour government lifted over half a million children out of poverty, that is— million children out of poverty, that is our— million children out of poverty, that is our record, that is our ambition— that is our record, that is our ambition again.— that is our record, that is our ambition again. what would plaid c mru do ambition again. what would plaid cymru do about _ ambition again. what would plaid cymru do about the _ ambition again. what would plaid cymru do about the cost - ambition again. what would plaid cymru do about the cost of- ambition again. what would plaid cymru do about the cost of living | cymru do about the cost of living crisis? �* ., , , cymru do about the cost of living crisis? . , , ., ., crisis? always listen out for the word sorry _ crisis? always listen out for the word sorry for _ crisis? always listen out for the word sorry for the _ crisis? always listen out for the word sorry for the mess - crisis? always listen out for the word sorry for the mess that i crisis? always listen out for the i word sorry for the mess that they have made of running the economy and the trussonomics and the effect that is sad. we have had a labour leader in wales refusing to engage with the most fundamental change we need to see happening which is the lifting of the cruel two child benefit cap imposed by their conservatives and for some reason, giving the principles that labourjust to stand for, promising to be continued by labour. the cost of living crisis has hit people so hard. we have a number of proposals. help and energy bills for example, lifting the two child limit, increasing child benefit because tackling child poverty has to be one of our main priorities. poverty has to be one of our main riorities. ., , ., , ., priorities. rhun ap iorwerth, you would lift the _ priorities. rhun ap iorwerth, you would lift the cap, _ priorities. rhun ap iorwerth, you would lift the cap, that - priorities. rhun ap iorwerth, you would lift the cap, that is - priorities. rhun ap iorwerth, you would lift the cap, that is not. would lift the cap, that is not cheap. where is the money coming from? we cheap. where is the money coming from? ~ ., cheap. where is the money coming from? ., ,., , cheap. where is the money coming from? ., , . from? we have costed plans. we can talk now about _ from? we have costed plans. we can talk now about the _ from? we have costed plans. we can talk now about the fair _ from? we have costed plans. we can talk now about the fair taxation - talk now about the fair taxation system we need to build. we are honest. labourand system we need to build. we are honest. labour and the conservatives are part of what the hist —— institute for fiscal studies because a conspiracy of silence. £18 billion of cuts that they are both wedded to. we say that we need to bring money in, we would for example equate capital gains tax and income from shares with the income tax that you from shares with the income tax that w“ pay from shares with the income tax that you pay are going out to work hard. we think there are higher taxes that could be brought in.— could be brought in. higher taxes? taxes would _ could be brought in. higher taxes? taxes would go — could be brought in. higher taxes? taxes would go up? _ could be brought in. higher taxes? taxes would go up? on _ could be brought in. higher taxes? taxes would go up? on the - could be brought in. higher taxes? i taxes would go up? on the broadest shoulders. not _ taxes would go up? on the broadest shoulders. not on _ taxes would go up? on the broadest shoulders. not on people _ taxes would go up? on the broadest shoulders. not on people on - taxes would go up? on the broadest shoulders. not on people on lower l taxes would go up? on the broadest| shoulders. not on people on lower or middle income but on the economy, businesses, large corporations that can pay more, a windfall tax, that needs to be addressed and we need an honest debate about it. you needs to be addressed and we need an honest debate about it._ honest debate about it. you would not honest debate about it. you would rrot change — honest debate about it. you would rrot change the _ honest debate about it. you would not change the threshold, - honest debate about it. you would not change the threshold, you - honest debate about it. you would | not change the threshold, you want the power to be able to set the threshold in wales, you wouldn't change them like they have done in scotland, the snp?— change them like they have done in scotland, the snp? conservatives are erusin: scotland, the snp? conservatives are perusing the — scotland, the snp? conservatives are perusing the threshold _ scotland, the snp? conservatives are perusing the threshold for— scotland, the snp? conservatives are perusing the threshold for some - scotland, the snp? conservatives are perusing the threshold for some time | perusing the threshold for some time which means people in this audience have been brought in to paying tax for the first time, if trestles have to change it it needs to go up to match the increase in inflation so that you're not paying more in tax... ., ., ., ,, ., tax... you would have less tax cominu tax... you would have less tax coming in- _ tax... you would have less tax coming in. there _ tax... you would have less tax coming in. there are - tax... you would have less tax i coming in. there are corporations and those with _ coming in. there are corporations and those with the _ coming in. there are corporations and those with the broadest - and those with the broadest shoulders who can... hat and those with the broadest shoulders who can... ., ., shoulders who can... not takamine in wales. -- shoulders who can... not takamine in wales- -- rrot — shoulders who can... not takamine in wales. -- not that _ shoulders who can... not takamine in wales. -- not that many _ shoulders who can... not takamine in wales. -- not that many in _ shoulders who can... not takamine in wales. -- not that many in wales. - shoulders who can... not takamine in wales. -- not that many in wales. i. wales. —— not that many in wales. i find it hard to hold my patient here~ — find it hard to hold my patient here. these are the usual sound bites _ here. these are the usual sound bites and — here. these are the usual sound bites and whataboutery. margaret thatcher's biggest mistake was the privatisation of the natural monopolies, utilities, electricity industry. — monopolies, utilities, electricity industry, railways, water boards, they— industry, railways, water boards, they need — industry, railways, water boards, they need to be put back into public ownership. — they need to be put back into public ownership, that is what a future government has to do and reform uk has committed to that, in france where _ has committed to that, in france where edf — has committed to that, in france where edf is state owned, what did emmanuel— where edf is state owned, what did emmanuel macron do, i said i'm sorry, _ emmanuel macron do, i said i'm sorry, edf. _ emmanuel macron do, i said i'm sorry, edf, you're not tripling and doubling _ sorry, edf, you're not tripling and doubling bills and those were kept down~ _ doubling bills and those were kept down we — doubling bills and those were kept down. we need proper leadership and to take _ down. we need proper leadership and to take back ownership of the privatised industries, the privatisation of utilities has been a disaster— privatisation of utilities has been a disaster and nobody seems to accept — a disaster and nobody seems to accept that. a disaster and nobody seems to accept that-— a disaster and nobody seems to accet that. ., ., i. , ., accept that. how would you improve the cost of living _ accept that. how would you improve the cost of living crisis _ accept that. how would you improve the cost of living crisis for— accept that. how would you improve the cost of living crisis for people i the cost of living crisis for people across wales and benefits, you would cut the welfare bill by 15 billion a year. in wales would, he gets benefits now wouldn't get benefits under you? taste benefits now wouldn't get benefits under ou? ~ ., . ., under you? we will not cut welfare, we are really _ under you? we will not cut welfare, we are really the _ under you? we will not cut welfare, we are really the new _ under you? we will not cut welfare, we are really the new labour - under you? we will not cut welfare, we are really the new labour party. | we are really the new labour party. the labour— we are really the new labour party. the labour party was founded to represent — the labour party was founded to represent the interest... listen to me, _ represent the interest... listen to me. listen— represent the interest... listen to me, listen carefully. the labour party— me, listen carefully. the labour party was— me, listen carefully. the labour party was founded to represent the interests _ party was founded to represent the interests of working people from the trade union movement, they are not a party— trade union movement, they are not a party of— trade union movement, they are not a party of labour any more about the party— party of labour any more about the party of— party of labour any more about the party of welfare. what we wish to do is to ensure — party of welfare. what we wish to do is to ensure that people who want to work, _ is to ensure that people who want to work. you _ is to ensure that people who want to work, you are in the benefits trap because _ work, you are in the benefits trap because they get such jet generous payments— because they get such jet generous payments on universal credit that those _ payments on universal credit that those people return to work. a property— those people return to work. a property labour party were people of the dignity that comes from work, why should we encourage a culture of benefit _ why should we encourage a culture of benefit dependency? mrs thatcher's second _ benefit dependency? mrs thatcher's second massive mistake continued by new labour— second massive mistake continued by new labour was this culture of shifting — new labour was this culture of shifting people onto incapacity benefit, — shifting people onto incapacity benefit, people need to work. to be clear, benefit, people need to work. to be clear. reform _ benefit, people need to work. to be clear, reform uk— benefit, people need to work. to be clear, reform uk would _ benefit, people need to work. to be clear, reform uk would not - benefit, people need to work. to be clear, reform uk would not cut - benefit, people need to work. trr ye: clear, reform uk would not cut the welfare bill. brute clear, reform uk would not cut the welfare bill-— welfare bill. we want to get people back into work _ welfare bill. we want to get people back into work and _ welfare bill. we want to get people back into work and paying - welfare bill. we want to get people back into work and paying taxes. i welfare bill. we want to get people i back into work and paying taxes. you with to 12 back into work and paying taxes. gm. with top 12 billion off the welfare bill. disabled people, with they suffer? ., ., , , ., , suffer? there are many people claimin: suffer? there are many people claiming welfare _ suffer? there are many people claiming welfare at _ suffer? there are many people claiming welfare at the - suffer? there are many people | claiming welfare at the moment suffer? there are many people - claiming welfare at the moment who are on sickness benefit who could work. they are not milking the system, there may be a small number like that but the vast majority simply do not realise that companies these days can make allowances for people, we want to support companies to do that, and we believe a lot of people with certain types of mental health problems could work from home potentially, in an office or different environment if the relevant changes have been made. what we cannot see is the benefits bill going up from 69 billion also where it is at the moment, towards 90, that is going to be unaffordable and we are being honest about it. but going back to what vaughan was saying about children, many children could be helped if labour in wales would bring in the 330 hours of childcare which we brought in, in england. we gave them the money to do that. they have had £1 20 for every pound that are spent in england, per head. what has happened to that money, why is the 30 hours not been given in wales, why can the welsh government find £120 million for extra politicians, but not money to support parents who want to go out to work when they have our children? applause very briefly. —— when they have children. i5 very briefly. -- when they have children. , . . very briefly. -- when they have children. , ., ., ., ., children. is a matter of fact what is not correct. _ children. is a matter of fact what is not correct. we _ children. is a matter of fact what is not correct. we did _ children. is a matter of fact what is not correct. we did not - children. is a matter of fact what is not correct. we did not have i is not correct. we did not have money— is not correct. we did not have money to— is not correct. we did not have money to deliver 30 hours of childcare, _ money to deliver 30 hours of childcare, it has not been delivered in england. — childcare, it has not been delivered in england, look at what the childcare sector are saying, they don't _ childcare sector are saying, they don't have the resources to deliver it. don't have the resources to deliver it we are — don't have the resources to deliver it. we are ruling out flying start childcare to more to roads, our ambition is— childcare to more to roads, our ambition is to do even more of that across the — ambition is to do even more of that across the country. i'm proud of the record _ across the country. i'm proud of the record we have prouder still of what we will _ record we have prouder still of what we will be able to do, when two labour governments are working together for wales and britain. lots of hands up. the — together for wales and britain. lots of hands up, the gentleman in the front row. i5 of hands up, the gentleman in the front row. , ., , ., ., front row. is a question for david. the liz truss _ front row. is a question for david. the liz truss budget _ front row. is a question for david. the liz truss budget was - front row. is a question for david. i the liz truss budget was disastrous. what _ the liz truss budget was disastrous. what are _ the liz truss budget was disastrous. what are your — the liz truss budget was disastrous. what are your thoughts _ the liz truss budget was disastrous. what are your thoughts on _ the liz truss budget was disastrous. what are your thoughts on that? - the liz truss budget was disastrous. | what are your thoughts on that? you say that _ what are your thoughts on that? you say that we _ what are your thoughts on that? you say that we can — what are your thoughts on that? you say that we can trust _ what are your thoughts on that? you say that we can trust you _ what are your thoughts on that? you say that we can trust you on - what are your thoughts on that? you say that we can trust you on the - say that we can trust you on the economy, — say that we can trust you on the economy, we _ say that we can trust you on the economy, we clearly— say that we can trust you on the economy, we clearly cannot - say that we can trust you on the i economy, we clearly cannot after that budget, _ economy, we clearly cannot after that budget, and _ economy, we clearly cannot after that budget, and oliver, - economy, we clearly cannot after that budget, and oliver, who- economy, we clearly cannot after that budget, and oliver, who say| economy, we clearly cannot after. that budget, and oliver, who say we can trust— that budget, and oliver, who say we can trust you — that budget, and oliver, who say we can trust you but _ that budget, and oliver, who say we can trust you but that _ that budget, and oliver, who say we can trust you but that manifesto - can trust you but that manifesto that came — can trust you but that manifesto that came out _ can trust you but that manifesto that came out recently - can trust you but that manifesto that came out recently was - can trust you but that manifesto i that came out recently was widely reported — that came out recently was widely reported to — that came out recently was widely reported to be _ that came out recently was widely reported to be even _ that came out recently was widely reported to be even worse - that came out recently was widely. reported to be even worse calculated than liz _ reported to be even worse calculated than liz truss's _ reported to be even worse calculated than liz truss's. how _ reported to be even worse calculated than liz truss's. how can _ reported to be even worse calculated than liz truss's. how can we - reported to be even worse calculated than liz truss's. how can we trust. than liz truss's. how can we trust you on— than liz truss's. how can we trust you on the — than liz truss's. how can we trust you on the economy? _ than liz truss's. how can we trust you on the economy? in- than liz truss's. how can we trust you on the economy?— than liz truss's. how can we trust you on the economy? in this country we invest huge _ you on the economy? in this country we invest huge resources _ you on the economy? in this country we invest huge resources on - you on the economy? in this country we invest huge resources on trying i we invest huge resources on trying to make sure we forecast every immediate pound on a budget into— five years. another covid crisis could happen, anotherfinancial could happen, another financial crisis, could happen, anotherfinancial crisis, all of these could happen, and what matters is that the british people a bit competent, well—educated and competent politicians who know their history, know how the constitution operates, we don't seem to have that now, and some of you may wish to laugh, but reform uk are getting good people back into government. and that is nigel farage. he is the only person to win two national polls of the different party brands. just wait, 0k? different party brands. just wait, ok? �* , different party brands. just wait, ok? , ., ., ok? and david davies if you want to that point--- — labour have given at this narrative that liz— labour have given at this narrative that liz truss caused everything. but look — that liz truss caused everything. but look at what was happening across _ but look at what was happening across the eu at the same time. what about the mortgages _ across the eu at the same time. transit about the mortgages that across the eu at the same time. wisgt about the mortgages that liz truss meant more people paid more money on their mortgages and they are still paying it right to this very day. the mortgage rates went up because bank of— the mortgage rates went up because bank of england rates went up to bring _ bank of england rates went up to bring down inflation. it happened across— bring down inflation. it happened across the — bring down inflation. it happened across the whole of europe. i promise _ across the whole of europe. i promise you, check what inflation levels _ promise you, check what inflation levels were in europe. a decimal point _ levels were in europe. a decimal point or— levels were in europe. a decimal point or so— levels were in europe. a decimal point or so higher, not much higher. i point or so higher, not much higher. i am _ point or so higher, not much higher. i am going _ point or so higher, not much higher. i am going to — point or so higher, not much higher. i am going to take two points here very briefly. i i am going to take two points here very briefly-— very briefly. i come from a single-parent _ very briefly. i come from a single-parent household l very briefly. i come from a i single-parent household with very briefly. i come from a - single-parent household with a single—parent household with a disabled — single—parent household with a disabled mother— single—parent household with a disabled mother and _ single—parent household with a disabled mother and people . single—parent household with a i disabled mother and people love single—parent household with a - disabled mother and people love to point the _ disabled mother and people love to point the blame _ disabled mother and people love to point the blame at _ disabled mother and people love to point the blame at immigrants- disabled mother and people love to point the blame at immigrants or. point the blame at immigrants or people _ point the blame at immigrants or people out— point the blame at immigrants or people out of— point the blame at immigrants or people out of work— point the blame at immigrants or people out of work through - point the blame at immigrants or people out of work through no i point the blame at immigrants or. people out of work through no fault of their— people out of work through no fault of their own — people out of work through no fault of their own. when _ people out of work through no fault of their own. when are _ people out of work through no fault of their own. when are you - people out of work through no fault of their own. when are you going i people out of work through no fault| of their own. when are you going to start pointing — of their own. when are you going to start pointing the _ of their own. when are you going to start pointing the blame _ of their own. when are you going to start pointing the blame and - start pointing the blame and actually— start pointing the blame and actually starting _ start pointing the blame and actually starting to - start pointing the blame and actually starting to fix - start pointing the blame and actually starting to fix the i start pointing the blame and i actually starting to fix the bad system — actually starting to fix the bad system for _ actually starting to fix the bad system for the _ actually starting to fix the bad system for the better? - actually starting to fix the bad system for the better? we i actually starting to fix the bad system for the better? we will take that oint system for the better? we will take that point and _ system for the better? we will take that point and the _ system for the better? we will take that point and the gentleman i system for the better? we will take that point and the gentleman overi that point and the gentleman over there, please. you that point and the gentleman over there. please-— that point and the gentleman over there, lease. ., ., .,~ ., there, please. you all make your own oints on there, please. you all make your own points on the — there, please. you all make your own points on the cost _ there, please. you all make your own points on the cost of— there, please. you all make your own points on the cost of living _ there, please. you all make your own points on the cost of living crisis, i points on the cost of living crisis, but why— points on the cost of living crisis, but why not — points on the cost of living crisis, but why not make _ points on the cost of living crisis, but why not make a _ points on the cost of living crisis, but why not make a good - points on the cost of living crisis, | but why not make a good starting point, _ but why not make a good starting point, get — but why not make a good starting point. get your— but why not make a good starting point, get your claws _ but why not make a good starting point, get your claws out - but why not make a good starting point, get your claws out of- but why not make a good starting i point, get your claws out of working people's _ point, get your claws out of working people's pocket _ point, get your claws out of working people's pocket so _ point, get your claws out of working people's pocket so they— point, get your claws out of working people's pocket so they have - people's pocket so they have disposable _ people's pocket so they have disposable income _ people's pocket so they have disposable income to - people's pocket so they have disposable income to help i people's pocket so they have - disposable income to help generate their local— disposable income to help generate their local economies— disposable income to help generate their local economies and _ disposable income to help generate their local economies and they i disposable income to help generate their local economies and they canl their local economies and they can feed their— their local economies and they can feed their own _ their local economies and they can feed their own kids— their local economies and they can feed their own kids without - their local economies and they can feed their own kids without the i feed their own kids without the child _ feed their own kids without the child benefit— feed their own kids without the child benefit system _ feed their own kids without the child benefit system if- feed their own kids without the child benefit system if they i feed their own kids without the | child benefit system if they had more _ child benefit system if they had more of — child benefit system if they had more of their— child benefit system if they had more of their own _ child benefit system if they had more of their own money i child benefit system if they had more of their own money in i child benefit system if they had i more of their own money in their child benefit system if they had - more of their own money in their own pockets _ more of their own money in their own pockets water— more of their own money in their own pockets. water you _ more of their own money in their own pockets. water you going _ more of their own money in their own pockets. water you going to - more of their own money in their own pockets. water you going to do - more of their own money in their own pockets. water you going to do abouti pockets. water you going to do about that? _ pockets. water you going to do about that? t, pockets. water you going to do about that? a, , pockets. water you going to do about that? t, , l, pockets. water you going to do about that? t, , t, l, pockets. water you going to do about that? t, , t, t, t, _ that? that is what we are doing by increasing the _ that? that is what we are doing by increasing the personal _ that? that is what we are doing by increasing the personal allowance. jane does, please. we have to hold the conservatives to account and it is a shame — the conservatives to account and it is a shame that you are not saying sorry— is a shame that you are not saying sorry to _ is a shame that you are not saying sorry to those people affected by your significant traction of our economy _ your significant traction of our economy. what would you do? you are not taking _ economy. what would you do? you are not taking responsibility for those poor children. it is shameful that we live _ poor children. it is shameful that we live in— poor children. it is shameful that we live in wales with 30% of our children who are living in poverty right _ children who are living in poverty right now — children who are living in poverty right now. and it has gone up. to be honest. _ right now. and it has gone up. to be honest, welsh labour are not doing enough _ honest, welsh labour are not doing enough either. this honest, welsh labour are not doing enough either-— enough either. this is the blame came, enough either. this is the blame game. jane _ enough either. this is the blame game, jane dodds, _ enough either. this is the blame game, jane dodds, what- enough either. this is the blame game, jane dodds, what with i enough either. this is the blame | game, jane dodds, what with the game, jane dodds, what with the liberal democrats do, you would be spending 27 billion more by 2029, where is it coming from? that spending 27 billion more by 2029, where is it coming from?- where is it coming from? that is cominu where is it coming from? that is coming from _ where is it coming from? that is coming from taxing _ where is it coming from? that is coming from taxing the - where is it coming from? that is coming from taxing the rich - where is it coming from? that is coming from taxing the rich and| coming from taxing the rich and taxing _ coming from taxing the rich and taxing the — coming from taxing the rich and taxing the polluters as well. the taxing the polluters as well. the tax on _ taxing the polluters as well. the tax on the — taxing the polluters as well. the tax on the super—rich, that is what we are _ tax on the super—rich, that is what we are going — tax on the super—rich, that is what we are going to do. £760 million will be _ we are going to do. £760 million will be coming into well for our health— will be coming into well for our health service, for agriculture and for our— health service, for agriculture and for our social care. the gentleman at the back — for our social care. the gentleman at the back makes _ for our social care. the gentleman at the back makes a _ for our social care. the gentleman at the back makes a very - for our social care. the gentleman i at the back makes a very good point. economic prosperity and helping people out of their own problems has got to be a significant part of building the future. that got to be a significant part of building the future.— got to be a significant part of building the future. that is very thatcherite. _ building the future. that is very thatcherite. i _ building the future. that is very thatcherite. i am _ building the future. that is very thatcherite. i am a _ building the future. that is very l thatcherite. i am a pro-business leader in a pro-business - thatcherite. i am a pro-business l leader in a pro-business party that leader in a pro—business party that wants to build prosperity in the welsh economy. that is why we are talking about the need to build an economy around making use of our natural resources, which is why i in my first major speech after becoming leader asked the welsh government to look far more long—term about how to build the economy. when it comes to tata steel we need bold decisions by both uk and the welsh government. if tata steel can't sort it out, nationalise steel. look after the workers, the thousands of workers who are on steel, and build a strategic future for steel in the uk. this is why we need to be talking about economic prosperity and looking after the weakest in society at the same time. vaughan gethin: , society at the same time. vaughan gething. mark— society at the same time. vaughan gething, mark drakeford _ society at the same time. vaughan gething, mark drakeford said - society at the same time. vaughan gething, mark drakeford said his l gething, mark drakeford said his advice to keir starmer would be to be bold if he were to win this election. is it bold to stick to current taxes and just spend a little bit more? is that really going to attack the cost of living crisis? ., , ., , ., going to attack the cost of living crisis? ., , ., ., crisis? the manifesto is a bold one for the future. _ crisis? the manifesto is a bold one for the future. we _ crisis? the manifesto is a bold one for the future. we have _ crisis? the manifesto is a bold one for the future. we have to - crisis? the manifesto is a bold one for the future. we have to fix - crisis? the manifesto is a bold one for the future. we have to fix the l for the future. we have to fix the problems— for the future. we have to fix the problems that exist in the country. we have _ problems that exist in the country. we have got to have economic stability— we have got to have economic stability and we have to grow the economy — stability and we have to grow the economy. that is a big chunk of what our manifesto offers. we have to be straight _ our manifesto offers. we have to be straight with people about the costs of doing _ straight with people about the costs of doing that as well and we are going _ of doing that as well and we are going to — of doing that as well and we are going to inherit, if we win, an absolute _ going to inherit, if we win, an absolute shower of public finances. to rebuild — absolute shower of public finances. to rebuild those we cannot do that in a couple — to rebuild those we cannot do that in a couple of months. we would take the public— in a couple of months. we would take the public for. if we pretended we couid~ _ the public for. if we pretended we couid~ we — the public for. if we pretended we could. we have a real off about what we could _ could. we have a real off about what we could do — could. we have a real off about what we could do and what it would mean for wales _ we could do and what it would mean for wales. the sprint for clean power— for wales. the sprint for clean power means hundreds of thousands of 'obs power means hundreds of thousands of jobs across— power means hundreds of thousands of jobs across the uk and in wales they have to _ jobs across the uk and in wales they have to be _ jobs across the uk and in wales they have to be here where we have the natural _ have to be here where we have the natural resources. we have to be here where we have the natural resources.— have to be here where we have the natural resources. we are not going to net that natural resources. we are not going to get that investment _ natural resources. we are not going to get that investment if _ natural resources. we are not going to get that investment if you - natural resources. we are not going to get that investment if you push l to get that investment if you push ahead _ to get that investment if you push ahead with — to get that investment if you push ahead with policies _ to get that investment if you push ahead with policies such _ to get that investment if you push ahead with policies such as - to get that investment if you push i ahead with policies such as blocking euros _ ahead with policies such as blocking euros from — ahead with policies such as blocking euros from being _ ahead with policies such as blocking euros from being built, _ ahead with policies such as blocking euros from being built, 20 - ahead with policies such as blocking euros from being built, 20 miles. ahead with policies such as blocking euros from being built, 20 miles anj euros from being built, 20 miles an hour zones— euros from being built, 20 miles an hour zones all— euros from being built, 20 miles an hour zones all over— euros from being built, 20 miles an hour zones all over the _ euros from being built, 20 miles an hour zones all over the place. - euros from being built, 20 miles an hour zones all over the place. it - euros from being built, 20 miles an hour zones all over the place. it is. hour zones all over the place. it is a completely— hour zones all over the place. it is a completely negative _ hour zones all over the place. it is a completely negative message i hour zones all over the place. it isj a completely negative message to investors — a completely negative message to investors. . ~ ., , ., investors. talking about sending out neaative investors. talking about sending out negative messages... _ investors. talking about sending out negative messages... there - investors. talking about sending out negative messages... there is - investors. talking about sending out negative messages... there is a - negative messages... there is a strong feeling among the electorate, david tc davies, and all of you. we, the voters, are dealing with the cost of living crisis. i have got to ask you about the betting allegations recently, david. rishi sunak said this morning and last night that he was very, very angry. four people close to him are facing allegations of betting on the election. you must be furious. i am election. you must be furious. i am furious, election. you must be furious. i am furious. we — election. you must be furious. i am furious, we are _ election. you must be furious. i am furious, we are all— election. you must be furious. i am furious, we are all very _ furious, we are all very disappointed _ furious, we are all very disappointed by- furious, we are all very disappointed by it. - furious, we are all very disappointed by it. i. furious, we are all very| disappointed by it. i am furious, we are all very- disappointed by it. iam not endorsing _ disappointed by it. iam not endorsing it, _ disappointed by it. iam not endorsing it, there - disappointed by it. iam not endorsing it, there is- disappointed by it. iam not endorsing it, there is a - disappointed by it. iam not endorsing it, there is a fulll endorsing it, there is a full investigation _ endorsing it, there is a full investigation going - endorsing it, there is a full investigation going on - endorsing it, there is a full investigation going on into| endorsing it, there is a full. investigation going on into all endorsing it, there is a full- investigation going on into all of those _ investigation going on into all of those people _ investigation going on into all of those people you _ investigation going on into all of those people you mention. - investigation going on into all of those people you mention. let i investigation going on into all of . those people you mention. let me investigation going on into all of - those people you mention. let me say something _ those people you mention. let me say something. before _ those people you mention. let me say something. before you _ those people you mention. let me say something. before you asked - those people you mention. let me say something. before you asked me, - those people you mention. let me say something. before you asked me, i. something. before you asked me, i have not— something. before you asked me, i have not made _ something. before you asked me, i have not made any— something. before you asked me, i have not made any bets _ something. before you asked me, i| have not made any bets whatsoever and haven't— have not made any bets whatsoever and haven't done _ have not made any bets whatsoever and haven't done for— have not made any bets whatsoever and haven't done for years - have not made any bets whatsoever and haven't done for years as - have not made any bets whatsoever and haven't done for years as it - and haven't done for years as it happens — and haven't done for years as it happens on _ and haven't done for years as it happens on anything. _ and haven't done for years as it happens on anything. for- and haven't done for years as it happens on anything. for fairness, an bod happens on anything. for fairness, anybody here _ happens on anything. for fairness, anybody here placed _ happens on anything. for fairness, anybody here placed a _ happens on anything. for fairness, anybody here placed a bet - happens on anything. for fairness, anybody here placed a bet on - happens on anything. for fairness, anybody here placed a bet on the l anybody here placed a bet on the election? . . w' anybody here placed a bet on the election? , . a ., ., election? just checking. not a auamblin election? just checking. not a gambling man. _ election? just checking. not a gambling man. let— election? just checking. not a gambling man. let me - election? just checking. not a gambling man. let me say . election? just checking. not a - gambling man. let me say something, when i _ gambling man. let me say something, when i took— gambling man. let me say something, when i took over— gambling man. let me say something, when i took over the _ gambling man. let me say something, when i took over the wales _ gambling man. let me say something, when i took over the wales 0ffice - gambling man. let me say something, when i took over the wales office i- when i took over the wales office i realised _ when i took over the wales office i realised there _ when i took over the wales office i realised there was _ when i took over the wales office i realised there was a _ when i took over the wales office i realised there was a lot _ when i took over the wales office i realised there was a lot of- realised there was a lot of unhappiness _ realised there was a lot of unhappiness about- realised there was a lot ofi unhappiness about general realised there was a lot of— unhappiness about general standards and i unhappiness about general standards and i did _ unhappiness about general standards and i did two— unhappiness about general standards and i did two things _ unhappiness about general standards and i did two things which _ unhappiness about general standards and i did two things which were - and i did two things which were unusuai~ — and i did two things which were unusuai~ the _ and i did two things which were unusual. the first _ and i did two things which were unusual. the first thing - and i did two things which were unusual. the first thing was - and i did two things which were unusual. the first thing was i. and i did two things which were. unusual. the first thing was i dig the ministerial— unusual. the first thing was i dig the ministerial car. _ unusual. the first thing was i dig the ministerial car. that - unusual. the first thing was i dig the ministerial car. that is - the ministerial car. that is something _ the ministerial car. that is something you _ the ministerial car. that is something you might- the ministerial car. that isj something you might want the ministerial car. that is i something you might want to the ministerial car. that is - something you might want to take note of— something you might want to take note of because _ something you might want to take note of because you _ something you might want to take note of because you are _ something you might want to take note of because you are spending | note of because you are spending mitiions— note of because you are spending millions of— note of because you are spending millions of pounds _ note of because you are spending millions of pounds being - note of because you are spending. millions of pounds being chauffeured around _ millions of pounds being chauffeured around the _ millions of pounds being chauffeured around the place, _ millions of pounds being chauffeured around the place, you _ millions of pounds being chauffeured around the place, you and _ millions of pounds being chauffeured around the place, you and your- around the place, you and your colleagues _ around the place, you and your colleagues. no— around the place, you and your colleagues. no chauffeur- around the place, you and your colleagues. no chauffeur for. around the place, you and your. colleagues. no chauffeur for me, around the place, you and your- colleagues. no chauffeur for me, no n1inisteriai— colleagues. no chauffeur for me, no ministerial car~ _ colleagues. no chauffeur for me, no ministerial car. the _ colleagues. no chauffeur for me, no ministerial car. the second - colleagues. no chauffeur for me, no ministerial car. the second thing - colleagues. no chauffeur for me, no ministerial car. the second thing i. ministerial car. the second thing i did, it _ ministerial car. the second thing i did, it was — ministerial car. the second thing i did, it was to— ministerial car. the second thing i did, it was to stop _ ministerial car. the second thing i did, it was to stop any _ ministerial car. the second thing i did, it was to stop any alcohol- did, it was to stop any alcohol being — did, it was to stop any alcohol being drugged _ did, it was to stop any alcohol being drugged or— did, it was to stop any alcohol being drugged or served - did, it was to stop any alcohol being drugged or served in. did, it was to stop any alcohol| being drugged or served in the did, it was to stop any alcohol- being drugged or served in the wales office _ being drugged or served in the wales office at— being drugged or served in the wales office at any— being drugged or served in the wales office at any time _ being drugged or served in the wales office at any time for— being drugged or served in the wales office at any time for any— being drugged or served in the wales office at any time for any reason - office at any time for any reason whatsoever~ _ office at any time for any reason whatsoever. that _ 0ffice at any time for any reason whatsoever. that is— office at any time for any reason whatsoever. that is also - office at any time for any reason i whatsoever. that is also something you might _ whatsoever. that is also something you might want— whatsoever. that is also something you might want to— whatsoever. that is also something you might want to take _ whatsoever. that is also something you might want to take note - whatsoever. that is also something you might want to take note of. - you might want to take note of. ok~~~ _ you might want to take note of. ck. .. ~ you might want to take note of. ck... ~ , ., you might want to take note of. 0k...~ , 0k. .. will you support the suspension _ 0k. .. will you support the suspension of _ 0k. .. will you support the suspension of those - 0k. .. will you support the suspension of those two i 0k. .. will you support the - suspension of those two candidates. it is suspension of those two candidates. it is not _ suspension of those two candidates. it is not virat— suspension of those two candidates. it is not viral to _ suspension of those two candidates. it is not viral to suspend _ suspension of those two candidates. it is not viral to suspend people. - it is not viral to suspend people. there _ it is not viral to suspend people. there a — it is not viral to suspend people. there a full— it is not viral to suspend people. there a full investigation going on and anyone — there a full investigation going on and anyone who _ there a full investigation going on and anyone who broke _ there a full investigation going on and anyone who broke the - there a full investigation going on and anyone who broke the rules . there a full investigation going on l and anyone who broke the rules will face the _ and anyone who broke the rules will face the full — and anyone who broke the rules will face the full force _ and anyone who broke the rules will face the full force of— and anyone who broke the rules will face the full force of the _ and anyone who broke the rules will face the full force of the law. - face the full force of the law. going — face the full force of the law. going into _ face the full force of the law. going into an— face the full force of the law. going into an election - face the full force of the law. going into an election with l face the full force of the law. i going into an election with this, are you embarrassed? this going into an election with this, are you embarrassed?— going into an election with this, are you embarrassed? this is the sort of question _ are you embarrassed? this is the sort of question i _ are you embarrassed? this is the sort of question i want, - are you embarrassed? this is the sort of question i want, you - are you embarrassed? this is the sort of question i want, you have| sort of question i want, you have -ot sort of question i want, you have got every— sort of question i want, you have got every right _ sort of question i want, you have got every right to _ sort of question i want, you have got every right to ask— sort of question i want, you have got every right to ask it, - sort of question i want, you have got every right to ask it, i - sort of question i want, you have got every right to ask it, i can. sort of question i want, you have| got every right to ask it, i can set ”p got every right to ask it, i can set up my— got every right to ask it, i can set up my own — got every right to ask it, i can set up my own standards _ got every right to ask it, i can set up my own standards and - got every right to ask it, i can set up my own standards and i- got every right to ask it, i can set up my own standards and i wouldj up my own standards and i would e> from any party in politics. that includes the labour party- from any party in politics. that includes the labour party and i includes the labour party and yourself _ includes the labour party and ourself. ~ . includes the labour party and ourself. ~ , ., ., ., yourself. ok. we must go to our second question, _ yourself. ok. we must go to our second question, although - yourself. ok. we must go to our second question, although we i yourself. ok. we must go to our. second question, although we will yourself. ok. we must go to our - second question, although we will go on to other topics. a quick reminder you canjoin in the debate on on to other topics. a quick reminder you can join in the debate on social media and you can follow what is being said here on our live page where experts will be giving analysis and reaction and fact checking. grab your phone or tablet and scan the qr code on the screen which will take you to the bbc wales website. oursecond which will take you to the bbc wales website. our second question which comes from jean cannon. iltrui’ith website. our second question which comes from jean cannon.— website. our second question which comes from jean cannon. with the nhs in terminal decline _ comes from jean cannon. with the nhs in terminal decline and _ comes from jean cannon. with the nhs in terminal decline and 2096 _ comes from jean cannon. with the nhs in terminal decline and 20% of- comes from jean cannon. with the nhs in terminal decline and 20% of the - in terminal decline and 20% of the population— in terminal decline and 20% of the population on _ in terminal decline and 20% of the population on waiting _ in terminal decline and 20% of the population on waiting lists, - in terminal decline and 20% of the population on waiting lists, how i in terminal decline and 20% of the| population on waiting lists, how do you plan— population on waiting lists, how do you plan to — population on waiting lists, how do you plan to fight _ population on waiting lists, how do you plan to fight for _ population on waiting lists, how do you plan to fight for the _ population on waiting lists, how do you plan to fight for the survival. you plan to fight for the survival of our— you plan to fight for the survival of our nhs? _ you plan to fight for the survival of our nhs?_ you plan to fight for the survival of our nhs? there we are, a big toic, of our nhs? there we are, a big topic. one _ of our nhs? there we are, a big topic. one of — of our nhs? there we are, a big topic, one of the _ of our nhs? there we are, a big topic, one of the biggest - of our nhs? there we are, a big topic, one of the biggest topics | topic, one of the biggest topics when we asked questions. obviously, it is devolved. the managing of the nhs is done by the welsh government here in wales, but of course the funding is ultimately set and the money available comes from the westminster government, which is being elected to right now. vaughan gethina. being elected to right now. vaughan gething- thank— being elected to right now. vaughan gething. thank you _ being elected to right now. vaughan gething. thank you for _ being elected to right now. vaughan gething. thank you for the - being elected to right now. vaughan | gething. thank you for the question, jean. i recognise there are too many people who are waiting too long to get the treatment they need. i know what receiving treatment on the nhs looks like and feels like. i am here because the nhs looked after me when i had a serious kidney disease when i had a serious kidney disease when i was 19. what i want to be able to set is what we have already done. we are investing £1 billion in wales already to tackle the pandemic backlog. we are also investing more in what we are going to do to train the next generation staff. we have bursaries to support staff in their training, we are opening a new medical school in bangor this autumn. all of those things are about getting the people we need and money is a part of it as well as modernisation. the next uk labour government will mean we will get more money to invest in our health service. ~ ., ,' v service. will it, though? it is 1.196 more on george _ service. will it, though? it is 1.196 more on george osborne - service. will it, though? it is 1.196 more on george osborne during i service. will it, though? it is 1.196 i more on george osborne during the austerity years was given 1.4%, so you are actually going to be giving less to the health budget in wales than during the austerity years. that is not true. in than during the austerity years. that is not true.— that is not true. in wales this ear... that is not true. in wales this year- -- that _ that is not true. in wales this year... that is _ that is not true. in wales this year... that is true. - that is not true. in wales this year... that is true. we - that is not true. in wales this year... that is true. we had l that is not true. in wales this year... that is true. we had a buduet year... that is true. we had a budget that — year... that is true. we had a budget that put _ year... that is true. we had a budget that put 496 _ year... that is true. we had a budget that put 496 in - year... that is true. we had a budget that put 496 in an - year... that is true. we had a - budget that put 496 in an increase in budget that put 4% in an increase in our nhs even in difficult times. our budget in real terms is 7 million less than three years ago. actually, having a proper crackdown on non—dons will give us more money to put in and that is a down payment on what we need in the future. rates have gone up by 17% in the last few years and there is much more to go and it takes resources and people. in england 275 people are waiting more than two years. that number in a far smaller country is 21,000 after five years of labour. and you have been health minister. it is after five years of labour. and you have been health minister.- have been health minister. it is a real challenge _ have been health minister. it is a real challenge and _ have been health minister. it is a real challenge and a _ have been health minister. it is a real challenge and a real- have been health minister. it is aj real challenge and a real problem and that means, as i have said there are people waiting too long in real discomfort and that is why we have invested £1 billion in addressing the backlog. that is why we have reduced weights by 70% and it is why the investment we will get, if we have a future uk labour government, will help us to go further and faster which is what we need to do. in montgomeryshire we don't have a proper— in montgomeryshire we don't have a proper hospital. i had an elector in wrexham — proper hospital. i had an elector in wrexham telephoned me last week, two children. _ wrexham telephoned me last week, two children, she has to take them to manchester to be cared for. she even has to— manchester to be cared for. she even has to go— manchester to be cared for. she even has to go to _ manchester to be cared for. she even has to go to the specialist in great ormond _ has to go to the specialist in great ormond street in london to be treated — 0rmond street in london to be treated i— ormond street in london to be treated. i shared this message with my fellow— treated. i shared this message with my fellow candidates and i learned there _ my fellow candidates and i learned there is— my fellow candidates and i learned there is no— my fellow candidates and i learned there is no specialist children's hospitai— there is no specialist children's hospital in south wales either. i looked — hospital in south wales either. i looked up — hospital in south wales either. i looked up the data on this and in engiand — looked up the data on this and in england the number of specialist children's hospitals, so you don't have _ children's hospitals, so you don't have to _ children's hospitals, so you don't have to go — children's hospitals, so you don't have to go to worcester, i looked up the data _ have to go to worcester, i looked up the data on the number of hospital beds in _ the data on the number of hospital beds in wales and in 1999 welsh labour— beds in wales and in 1999 welsh labour has reduced by a third. from 15,000 _ labour has reduced by a third. from 15,000 to— labour has reduced by a third. from 15,000 to 10,000.— labour has reduced by a third. from 15,000 to 10,000. let's look at your ro osals 15,000 to 10,000. let's look at your proposals and _ 15,000 to 10,000. let's look at your proposals and reform _ 15,000 to 10,000. let's look at your proposals and reform uk. _ 15,000 to 10,000. let's look at your proposals and reform uk. you - 15,000 to 10,000. let's look at yourj proposals and reform uk. you would eliminate waiting less entirely in two years, something which has never been done in the history of the nhs. it sounds amazing, how will you do it? ~ , ., , ~ ., it sounds amazing, how will you do it? , ., , it sounds amazing, how will you do it? why does britain accept this culture of waiting _ it? why does britain accept this culture of waiting lists? - it? why does britain accept this culture of waiting lists? why i it? why does britain accept this culture of waiting lists? why do politicians accept the culture of waiting — politicians accept the culture of waiting list? not the case in france or germany — waiting list? not the case in france or germany. i go back to the point about— or germany. i go back to the point about the — or germany. i go back to the point about the quality of our politicians. if our elected people don't _ politicians. if our elected people don't have a vision, they will keep having _ don't have a vision, they will keep having low— don't have a vision, they will keep having low public services. it is shameful- _ having low public services. it is shameful. share _ having low public services. it 3 shameful. share with us how you will eliminate waiting list. £311" shameful. share with us how you will eliminate waiting list.— eliminate waiting list. our first ro osal eliminate waiting list. our first proposal is _ eliminate waiting list. our first proposal is to _ eliminate waiting list. our first proposal is to reduce - eliminate waiting list. our first proposal is to reduce the - proposal is to reduce the restriction on the number of new medics _ restriction on the number of new medics and — restriction on the number of new medics and nurses to be trained. the treasury— medics and nurses to be trained. the treasury has — medics and nurses to be trained. the treasury has been capping the number of people _ treasury has been capping the number of people being trained here. instead — of people being trained here. instead of training our own people we poach— instead of training our own people we poach them from countries like sierra _ we poach them from countries like sierra leone and that is unacceptable. we are going to introduce _ unacceptable. we are going to introduce vouchers, free at the point _ introduce vouchers, free at the point of— introduce vouchers, free at the point of use, so we can use more of the private — point of use, so we can use more of the private sector to reduce the waiting — the private sector to reduce the waiting list. the private sector to reduce the waiting list-— waiting list. the snobbery is something _ waiting list. the snobbery is something else _ waiting list. the snobbery is something else from - waiting list. the snobbery is something else from the i waiting list. the snobbery isj something else from the uk waiting list. the snobbery is - something else from the uk reform party _ something else from the uk reform party led _ something else from the uk reform party. led by— something else from the uk reform party. led by a _ something else from the uk reform party. led by a former— something else from the uk reform party. led by a former banker. - something else from the uk reform party. led by a former banker. [- party. led by a former banker. i went party. led by a former banker. went to a comprehensive party. led by a former banker." went to a comprehensive school, party. led by a former banker.“ went to a comprehensive school, i party. led by a former banker._ went to a comprehensive school, i am entirely— went to a comprehensive school, i am entirely stay— went to a comprehensive school, i am entirely stay educated. how dare you! entirely stay educated. how dare ou! ., , , , ., you! comprehensive, look it up. i am talkin: you! comprehensive, look it up. i am talking about — you! comprehensive, look it up. i am talking about nigel _ you! comprehensive, look it up. i am talking about nigel farage. _ you! comprehensive, look it up. i am talking about nigel farage. i - you! comprehensive, look it up. i am talking about nigel farage. i am - you! comprehensive, look it up. i am talking about nigel farage. i am thel talking about nigel farage. i am the leader in wales. _ talking about nigel farage. i am the leader in wales. in _ talking about nigel farage. i am the leader in wales. in wales _ talking about nigel farage. i am the leader in wales. in wales i - talking about nigel farage. i am the leader in wales. in wales i am - leader in wales. in wales i am leading — leader in wales. in wales i am leading and i don't think it is appropriate to condone people because — appropriate to condone people because of their background. what you make — because of their background. what you make it personal? mrs thatcher said when— you make it personal? mrs thatcher said when they make it personal, they have — said when they make it personal, they have lost the debate and that applies— they have lost the debate and that applies to you. you they have lost the debate and that applies to you-— they have lost the debate and that applies to you. you have made your oint. i applies to you. you have made your point- lwill— applies to you. you have made your point. i will let _ applies to you. you have made your point. i will let the _ applies to you. you have made your point. i will let the audience - point. i will let the audience decide for— point. i will let the audience decide for themselves. - point. i will let the audience decide for themselves. i - point. i will let the audience decide for themselves. i am j point. i will let the audience - decide for themselves. i am sure the will. decide for themselves. i am sure they will. looking _ decide for themselves. i am sure they will. looking at _ decide for themselves. i am sure they will. looking at the - decide for themselves. i am sure they will. looking at the state i decide for themselves. i am sure they will. looking at the state of| they will. looking at the state of they will. looking at the state of the nhs we _ they will. looking at the state of the nhs we have _ they will. looking at the state of the nhs we have had _ they will. looking at the state of the nhs we have had a - they will. looking at the state of the nhs we have had a double i they will. looking at the state of - the nhs we have had a double whammy. yes, the nhs we have had a double whammy. yes. we _ the nhs we have had a double whammy. yes. we have _ the nhs we have had a double whammy. yes. we have had — the nhs we have had a double whammy. yes, we have had years _ the nhs we have had a double whammy. yes, we have had years of— the nhs we have had a double whammy. yes, we have had years of austerity- yes, we have had years of austerity from _ yes, we have had years of austerity from the _ yes, we have had years of austerity from the conservatives, _ yes, we have had years of austerity from the conservatives, but - yes, we have had years of austerity from the conservatives, but we i yes, we have had years of austerityl from the conservatives, but we have had the _ from the conservatives, but we have had the mismanagement— from the conservatives, but we have had the mismanagement of- from the conservatives, but we have had the mismanagement of the i from the conservatives, but we have had the mismanagement of the nhs| from the conservatives, but we have i had the mismanagement of the nhs by labour— had the mismanagement of the nhs by labour for— had the mismanagement of the nhs by labour for 25_ had the mismanagement of the nhs by labour for 25 years. _ had the mismanagement of the nhs by labour for 25 years. an _ had the mismanagement of the nhs by labour for 25 years. an election - had the mismanagement of the nhs by labour for 25 years. an election is i labour for 25 years. an election is full of— labour for 25 years. an election is full of weird — labour for 25 years. an election is full of weird and _ labour for 25 years. an election is full of weird and wonderful- labour for 25 years. an election is| full of weird and wonderful sights, but to— full of weird and wonderful sights, but to me — full of weird and wonderful sights, but to me one _ full of weird and wonderful sights, but to me one of— full of weird and wonderful sights, but to me one of the _ full of weird and wonderful sights, but to me one of the most- full of weird and wonderful sights, but to me one of the most bizarre| but to me one of the most bizarre size of— but to me one of the most bizarre size of the — but to me one of the most bizarre size of the past— but to me one of the most bizarre size of the past few _ but to me one of the most bizarre size of the past few weeks - but to me one of the most bizarre size of the past few weeks was i size of the past few weeks was wales' — size of the past few weeks was wales' health _ size of the past few weeks was wales' health minister- size of the past few weeks was wales' health minister holding j size of the past few weeks was i wales' health minister holding up a placard _ wales' health minister holding up a placard saying — wales' health minister holding up a placard saying let's _ wales' health minister holding up a placard saying let's modernise i wales' health minister holding up a placard saying let's modernise the. placard saying let's modernise the nhs _ placard saying let's modernise the nhs that — placard saying let's modernise the nhs. that doesn't _ placard saying let's modernise the nhs. that doesn't make _ placard saying let's modernise the nhs. that doesn't make sense i placard saying let's modernise the nhs. that doesn't make sense to| placard saying let's modernise the i nhs. that doesn't make sense to me. it is nhs. that doesn't make sense to me. it is not _ nhs. that doesn't make sense to me. it is not honest— nhs. that doesn't make sense to me. it is not honest with _ nhs. that doesn't make sense to me. it is not honest with the _ nhs. that doesn't make sense to me. it is not honest with the people - nhs. that doesn't make sense to me. it is not honest with the people of- it is not honest with the people of wales— it is not honest with the people of wales because _ it is not honest with the people of wales because they— it is not honest with the people of wales because they have - it is not honest with the people of wales because they have had i it is not honest with the people of wales because they have had the | wales because they have had the opportunity _ wales because they have had the opportunity. when— wales because they have had the opportunity. when i— wales because they have had the opportunity. when i talk- wales because they have had the opportunity. when i talk about i opportunity. when i talk about ophthalmologists, _ opportunity. when i talk about ophthalmologists, they- opportunity. when i talk about ophthalmologists, they have i opportunity. when i talk about i ophthalmologists, they have not opportunity. when i talk about - ophthalmologists, they have not got a plan, _ ophthalmologists, they have not got a plan, the _ ophthalmologists, they have not got a plan, the welsh _ ophthalmologists, they have not got a plan, the welsh government- ophthalmologists, they have not got a plan, the welsh government will. a plan, the welsh government will not implemented. _ a plan, the welsh government will not implemented. orthopaedic- not implemented. orthopaedic surgeons— not implemented. orthopaedic surgeons have _ not implemented. orthopaedic surgeons have not _ not implemented. orthopaedic surgeons have not got - not implemented. orthopaedic surgeons have not got a - not implemented. orthopaedic surgeons have not got a plan, i not implemented. orthopaedic. surgeons have not got a plan, the worst— surgeons have not got a plan, the worst government _ surgeons have not got a plan, the worst government needs - surgeons have not got a plan, the worst government needs to - surgeons have not got a plan, the worst government needs to get i surgeons have not got a plan, the i worst government needs to get behind this workforce — worst government needs to get behind this workforce and _ worst government needs to get behind this workforce and it _ worst government needs to get behind this workforce and it needs _ worst government needs to get behind this workforce and it needs to - this workforce and it needs to reward — this workforce and it needs to reward its— this workforce and it needs to reward its workforce - this workforce and it needs to reward its workforce and i this workforce and it needs to reward its workforce and it i this workforce and it needs to i reward its workforce and it needs this workforce and it needs to - reward its workforce and it needs to show _ reward its workforce and it needs to show that _ reward its workforce and it needs to show that it — reward its workforce and it needs to show that it is — reward its workforce and it needs to show that it is supporting _ reward its workforce and it needs to show that it is supporting its - show that it is supporting its workforce _ show that it is supporting its workforce and _ show that it is supporting its workforce and that - show that it is supporting its workforce and that is - show that it is supporting its workforce and that is why. show that it is supporting its| workforce and that is why we show that it is supporting its i workforce and that is why we are talking _ workforce and that is why we are talking about _ workforce and that is why we are talking about bringing _ workforce and that is why we are talking about bringing more i workforce and that is why we are talking about bringing more gps| workforce and that is why we are i talking about bringing more gps into the nhs _ talking about bringing more gps into the nhs because _ talking about bringing more gps into the nhs because without _ talking about bringing more gps into the nhs because without the - the nhs because without the workforce, _ the nhs because without the workforce, the _ the nhs because without the workforce, the nhs- the nhs because without the workforce, the nhs is- the nhs because without the i workforce, the nhs is nothing, the nhs because without the - workforce, the nhs is nothing, and the labour— workforce, the nhs is nothing, and the labour government— workforce, the nhs is nothing, and the labour government has- workforce, the nhs is nothing, and the labour government has let i workforce, the nhs is nothing, and. the labour government has let them down _ the labour government has let them down for— the labour government has let them down for 25— the labour government has let them down for 25 years. _ the labour government has let them down for 25 years. it _ the labour government has let them down for 25 years. it is _ the labour government has let them down for 25 years. it is time - the labour government has let them down for 25 years. it is time for- down for 25 years. it is time for change — down for 25 years. it is time for chance. , ., down for 25 years. it is time for chance. g . , down for 25 years. it is time for chance. , . , . down for 25 years. it is time for chance. g . , . ., down for 25 years. it is time for chane. , . ., ., . ~ change. jane dodds, a lot of talk about austerity. _ change. jane dodds, a lot of talk about austerity. you _ change. jane dodds, a lot of talk about austerity. you were - change. jane dodds, a lot of talk about austerity. you were in - about austerity. you were in coalition for five years. you must take responsibility for the legacy of those austere years. i put take responsibility for the legacy of those austere years.— take responsibility for the legacy of those austere years. i put it on record that _ of those austere years. i put it on record that i _ of those austere years. i put it on record that i was _ of those austere years. i put it on record that i was ashamed - of those austere years. i put it on record that i was ashamed of - of those austere years. i put it on record that i was ashamed of the | record that i was ashamed of the effect of authority from those coalition years. that is on record, i said that three years ago in a similar debate, and i am deeply ashamed of that without a doubt. but i want to come back tojean's question which is about the nhs. it feels like it is broken here in wales, it feels like along with social care that we don't have a system that cares for our most vulnerable and we in the welsh liberal democrats want to certainly focusing on social care and fix social care. that will mean that the front door and the back door of our hospitals and for our gps will actually be helped. because if we can help to pay our carers more, those unpaid carers to get a higher carer allowance, then we can actually make sure that people can stay in their own homes indignity. 0k, david tc davies. i would like to thank ou ok, david tc davies. i would like to thank you for— 0k, david tc davies. i would like to thank you for the _ 0k, david tc davies. i would like to thank you for the question. - 0k, david tc davies. i would like to thank you for the question. for - thank you for the question. for every— thank you for the question. for every £1— thank you for the question. for every £1 spent in the nhs in england pair head. _ every £1 spent in the nhs in england pair head, when pounds 20 a spend well so _ pair head, when pounds 20 a spend well so funding is not an excuse that 20,000 people have been waiting more than _ that 20,000 people have been waiting more than two years. when a call and ambulance _ more than two years. when a call and ambulance were my father—in—law, at 11 oflock— ambulance were my father—in—law, at 11 o'clock in _ ambulance were my father—in—law, at 11 o'clock in the morning it arrived at five _ 11 o'clock in the morning it arrived at five o'clock the following day. we knew — at five o'clock the following day. we knew what happened in betsi cadwaladr that the welsh labour government don't accept there was a problem. _ government don't accept there was a problem, when the independent commissioner said £100 million were not being _ commissioner said £100 million were not being spent, they were called in and fired _ not being spent, they were called in and fired by the health minister who refused _ and fired by the health minister who refused to— and fired by the health minister who refused to release the report they had drawn — refused to release the report they had drawn up and we know the welsh lahour— had drawn up and we know the welsh labour government refused point—blank to have a covid inquiry on the _ point—blank to have a covid inquiry on the rise — point—blank to have a covid inquiry on the rise of the independent one taking _ on the rise of the independent one taking place in the united kingdom, they didn't want anyone looking at brady— they didn't want anyone looking at brady had — they didn't want anyone looking at brady had been managing the nhs through— brady had been managing the nhs through covid and quite frankly, vaughan, — through covid and quite frankly, vaughan, even if you had arranged for an— vaughan, even if you had arranged for an independent inquiry in wales i don't _ for an independent inquiry in wales i don't know what the nation would have gained because you seem to have deleted _ have gained because you seem to have deleted all— have gained because you seem to have deleted all of the important whatsapp messages that could given them some useful information. applause vaughan gething? applause vau . han gethin: ? . applause vau~ahangethin? . ,, . vaughan gething? that is shameful and dishonest. _ vaughan gething? that is shameful and dishonest. we _ vaughan gething? that is shameful and dishonest. we have _ vaughan gething? that is shameful and dishonest. we have provided i and dishonest. we have provided thousands of documents to the public inquiry. i have given evidence, hundreds of pages of evidence. i have been questioned at the inquiry. if you look at what we did during covid, making extraordinarily difficult choices, in a once in a century event to try to keep the country safe, i have been and will continue to be honest with every piece of information i have vowed to answer every question and in the pandemic, when you look at what we did in wales, we had a test and tray system that was more effective and cost less than the one in england. we did not have a vip lane, we did not have mates who got rich with fat contracts in wales. those are my choices, that is what they did here in wales, that is the record. i have no problem with being properly scrutinised by the public inquiry and everything they have i am very comfortable with.— and everything they have i am very comfortable with. screenshots of the whatsa - comfortable with. screenshots of the whatsapp messages _ comfortable with. screenshots of the whatsapp messages will _ comfortable with. screenshots of the whatsapp messages will you - comfortable with. screenshots of the whatsapp messages will you advise l whatsapp messages will you advise ministers _ whatsapp messages will you advise ministers to delete things so that they could not be foi'd, is that correct? — they could not be foi'd, is that correct? i— they could not be foi'd, is that correct? ., ., . ,, correct? i reminded them not to make unkind comments _ correct? i reminded them not to make unkind comments about _ correct? i reminded them not to make unkind comments about others - correct? i reminded them not to make unkind comments about others in - correct? i reminded them not to make unkind comments about others in the | unkind comments about others in the group. it unkind comments about others in the urou -. , unkind comments about others in the i rou . _ , ., , ., unkind comments about others in the rrou. unkind comments about others in the ”to“. ., unkind comments about others in the iroui, ., group. it is a point about how you treat each — group. it is a point about how you treat each other. _ group. it is a point about how you treat each other. sometimes - group. it is a point about how you - treat each other. sometimes you have to take a step — treat each other. sometimes you have to take a step back _ treat each other. sometimes you have to take a step back and _ treat each other. sometimes you have to take a step back and think- treat each other. sometimes you have to take a step back and think about. to take a step back and think about how other things can be seen. vaughan gething did say in that stream — vaughan gething did say in that stream of— vaughan gething did say in that stream of messages that he was deleting — stream of messages that he was deleting because he wanted to avoid information being foi'd, to be obtained — information being foi'd, to be obtained through a freedom of information request. this reflects poorly— information request. this reflects poorly on — information request. this reflects poorly on hisjudgment. remember we are in— poorly on hisjudgment. remember we are in the _ poorly on hisjudgment. remember we are in the midst of a scandal of the kind we _ are in the midst of a scandal of the kind we have never had in welsh politics. — kind we have never had in welsh politics, this £200,000 that he accepted — politics, this £200,000 that he accepted to his campaign, and one of the worst— accepted to his campaign, and one of the worst thing is a secret up with his hands— the worst thing is a secret up with his hands up and said i made a mistake — his hands up and said i made a mistake but again, as with the whatsapp messages, he digs his heels in and _ whatsapp messages, he digs his heels in and we _ whatsapp messages, he digs his heels in and we deserve better in wales. applause — applause your chance, vaughan gething, to show some contrition to say sorry, or to take some element of playing, and do you regret at all taking that donation given the trouble it has caused you? —— make some element of blame. {lari caused you? -- make some element of blame. u, , blame. of course i regret the difficulty i — blame. of course i regret the difficulty i have _ blame. of course i regret the difficulty i have caused - blame. of course i regret the difficulty i have caused you i blame. of course i regret the difficulty i have caused you a| blame. of course i regret the - difficulty i have caused you a range of people, ifollowed difficulty i have caused you a range of people, i followed the rules difficulty i have caused you a range of people, ifollowed the rules but i recognise there was concern so i have instigated a review within my party, i have asked these and is committed to do a whole senedd review so that everybody understands the rules. and when you then look at what you are actually doing, i am very clear about our commitment to... , ., very clear about our commitment to... ,, , . very clear about our commitment to... , . . �* to... do you wish that you hadn't taken it? knowing _ to... do you wish that you hadn't taken it? knowing everything - to... do you wish that you hadn't| taken it? knowing everything that to... do you wish that you hadn't i taken it? knowing everything that i know now i — taken it? knowing everything that i know now i would _ taken it? knowing everything that i know now i would not _ taken it? knowing everything that i know now i would not have - taken it? knowing everything that i know now i would not have wanted| taken it? knowing everything that i . know now i would not have wanted the difficulty that has been presented. i don't believe that. very good idea — i don't believe that. very good idea. �* , . . idea. i'm very clear about the way i have conducted _ idea. i'm very clear about the way i have conducted myself— idea. i'm very clear about the way i have conducted myself throughout| idea. i'm very clear about the way i i have conducted myself throughout my time... i have never, ever made a decision as a minister in more than 11 years for my own personal gain or for other people. that has never happened. he for other people. that has never happened-— for other people. that has never ha ened. happened. he said he regretted the wa this happened. he said he regretted the way this was _ happened. he said he regretted the way this was reported _ happened. he said he regretted the way this was reported and - happened. he said he regretted the way this was reported and covered, | way this was reported and covered, it was— way this was reported and covered, it was our— way this was reported and covered, it was our fourth to hold him to account, — it was our fourth to hold him to account, and that is not acceptable. if account, and that is not acceptable. if you _ account, and that is not acceptable. if you took — account, and that is not acceptable. if you look at what i have done repeatedly, i have been honest about what happened, about the fact that i took the money, ifollowed what happened, about the fact that i took the money, i followed all the rules... ., took the money, i followed all the rules... . . , . , took the money, i followed all the rules... . . , , rules... there are so many hands up. i followed rules... there are so many hands up. i followed all — rules... there are so many hands up. i followed all of _ rules... there are so many hands up. i followed all of the _ rules... there are so many hands up. i followed all of the rules. _ rules. .. there are so many hands up. i followed all of the rules. look- i followed all of the rules. look chamonix _ i followed all of the rules. look chamonix hands _ i followed all of the rules. look chamonix hands are _ i followed all of the rules. look chamonix hands are up. -- - i followed all of the rules. look| chamonix hands are up. -- look i followed all of the rules. look- chamonix hands are up. -- look how many hands- — chamonix hands are up. -- look how many hands- l _ chamonix hands are up. -- look how many hands. i have _ chamonix hands are up. -- look how many hands. i have followed - chamonix hands are up. -- look how many hands. i have followed the - many hands. i have followed the rules and review _ many hands. i have followed the rules and review the _ many hands. i have followed the rules and review the position - many hands. i have followed the | rules and review the position that we are in, that is what i am doing, sometimes you have to front up to get a summer better and to do the job that they want you for the country, the reason why i am in public life in the first place. the gentleman _ public life in the first place. the gentleman there. and then the lady there, thank you. you gentleman there. and then the lady there, thank you.— there, thank you. you are, we hear from welsh — there, thank you. you are, we hear from welsh labour _ there, thank you. you are, we hear from welsh labour about _ there, thank you. you are, we hear from welsh labour about how - there, thank you. you are, we hear from welsh labour about how they| from welsh labour about how they will fight _ from welsh labour about how they will fight for — from welsh labour about how they will fight for more _ from welsh labour about how they will fight for more funding - from welsh labour about how they will fight for more funding from . will fight for more funding from welsh — will fight for more funding from welsh -- — will fight for more funding from welsh —— westminster- will fight for more funding from welsh —— westminster then - will fight for more funding from welsh —— westminster then i l will fight for more funding from . welsh —— westminster then i hear from _ welsh —— westminster then i hear from the — welsh —— westminster then i hear from the shadow— welsh —— westminster then i hear from the shadow welsh _ welsh —— westminster then i hear from the shadow welsh secretary| welsh —— westminster then i hear- from the shadow welsh secretary who will he _ from the shadow welsh secretary who will he the _ from the shadow welsh secretary who will be the welsh _ from the shadow welsh secretary who will be the welsh voice _ from the shadow welsh secretary who will be the welsh voice in _ from the shadow welsh secretary who will be the welsh voice in the - will be the welsh voice in the cabinet — will be the welsh voice in the cabinet about— will be the welsh voice in the cabinet about how _ will be the welsh voice in the cabinet about how h52 - will be the welsh voice in the | cabinet about how h52 simply will be the welsh voice in the - cabinet about how h52 simply doesn't exist any— cabinet about how h52 simply doesn't exist any more. — cabinet about how h52 simply doesn't exist any more, therefore _ cabinet about how h52 simply doesn't exist any more, therefore we - cabinet about how h52 simply doesn't exist any more, therefore we cannot i exist any more, therefore we cannot iet exist any more, therefore we cannot get any— exist any more, therefore we cannot get any consequential— exist any more, therefore we cannot get any consequential from - exist any more, therefore we cannot get any consequential from it - exist any more, therefore we cannot get any consequential from it so - exist any more, therefore we cannot| get any consequential from it so how would _ get any consequential from it so how would the _ get any consequential from it so how would the welsh _ get any consequential from it so how would the welsh labour _ get any consequential from it so how would the welsh labour government| would the welsh labour government pressure _ would the welsh labour government pressure the — would the welsh labour government pressure the british _ would the welsh labour government pressure the british government - would the welsh labour government| pressure the british government into getting _ pressure the british government into getting more — pressure the british government into getting more money— pressure the british government into getting more money for— pressure the british government into getting more money for us, - pressure the british government into getting more money for us, here - pressure the british government into getting more money for us, here in i getting more money for us, here in wales? _ wales? i applause and over here? . . , and over here? labour have been in ower for and over here? labour have been in power for 25 — and over here? labour have been in power for 25 year— and over here? labour have been in power for 25 year supported - and over here? labour have been in power for 25 year supported that. and over here? labour have been in power for 25 year supported that by| power for 25 year supported that by cymru. _ power for 25 year supported that by cymru. as— power for 25 year supported that by cymru. as well _ power for 25 year supported that by cymru, as well. you _ power for 25 year supported that by cymru, as well. you have _ power for 25 year supported that by cymru, as well. you have had - power for 25 year supported that by cymru, as well. you have had your| cymru, as well. you have had your chance _ cymru, as well. you have had your chance to — cymru, as well. you have had your chance to help _ cymru, as well. you have had your chance to help out _ cymru, as well. you have had your chance to help out on _ cymru, as well. you have had your chance to help out on the - cymru, as well. you have had your chance to help out on the nhs - cymru, as well. you have had your. chance to help out on the nhs when you were _ chance to help out on the nhs when you were in — chance to help out on the nhs when you were in coalition. _ chance to help out on the nhs when you were in coalition. you _ chance to help out on the nhs when you were in coalition. you are - you were in coalition. you are tflaming — you were in coalition. you are tflaming them _ you were in coalition. you are blaming them. you _ you were in coalition. you are blaming them. you hold - you were in coalition. you are| blaming them. you hold some you were in coalition. you are - blaming them. you hold some blame for what _ blaming them. you hold some blame for what is _ blaming them. you hold some blame for what is happening _ blaming them. you hold some blame for what is happening in _ blaming them. you hold some blame for what is happening in wales. - blaming them. you hold some blame for what is happening in wales. thisi for what is happening in wales. this is a general— for what is happening in wales. this is a general election _ for what is happening in wales. this is a general election debate. - for what is happening in wales. this is a general election debate. it - for what is happening in wales. this is a general election debate. it is i is a general election debate. it is getting _ is a general election debate. it is getting a — is a general election debate. it is getting a little _ is a general election debate. it is getting a little too _ is a general election debate. it is getting a little too much - is a general election debate. it is getting a little too much for- is a general election debate. it isi getting a little too much for that. the lady — getting a little too much for that. the lady there _ getting a little too much for that. the lady there.— the lady there. over half of the voters say _ the lady there. over half of the voters say that _ the lady there. over half of the voters say that their _ the lady there. over half of the voters say that their voting - voters say that their voting decision— voters say that their voting decision will— voters say that their voting decision will be _ voters say that their voting decision will be influenced| voters say that their voting i decision will be influenced by voters say that their voting - decision will be influenced by the priority— decision will be influenced by the priority of— decision will be influenced by the priority of healthy— decision will be influenced by the priority of healthy rivers - decision will be influenced by the priority of healthy rivers and - priority of healthy rivers and coastal _ priority of healthy rivers and coastal waters. _ priority of healthy rivers and coastal waters. what - priority of healthy rivers and - coastal waters. what long—term commitment _ coastal waters. what long—term commitment are _ coastal waters. what long—term commitment are you _ coastal waters. what long—term commitment are you willing - coastal waters. what long—term commitment are you willing to. coastal waters. what long—term - commitment are you willing to make to improve _ commitment are you willing to make to improve rivers _ commitment are you willing to make to improve rivers and _ commitment are you willing to make to improve rivers and coastal- to improve rivers and coastal waters. — to improve rivers and coastal waters. and _ to improve rivers and coastal waters, and how— to improve rivers and coastal waters, and how will- to improve rivers and coastal waters, and how will the - to improve rivers and coastal. waters, and how will the public to improve rivers and coastal- waters, and how will the public know that they— waters, and how will the public know that they are — waters, and how will the public know that they are not _ waters, and how will the public know that they are not being _ waters, and how will the public know that they are not being fobbed - waters, and how will the public know that they are not being fobbed off. that they are not being fobbed off lry that they are not being fobbed off by gestures — that they are not being fobbed off by gestures and _ that they are not being fobbed off by gestures and sticking - that they are not being fobbed off by gestures and sticking plastersl by gestures and sticking plasters once again? _ by gestures and sticking plasters once again?— by gestures and sticking plasters once aain? , . once again? very good point, and finall , once again? very good point, and finally. the _ once again? very good point, and finally, the gentleman _ once again? very good point, and finally, the gentleman in - once again? very good point, and finally, the gentleman in the - finally, the gentleman in the pattern shirt. i finally, the gentleman in the pattern shirt.— pattern shirt. i would like to return to — pattern shirt. i would like to return to the _ pattern shirt. i would like to return to the debate - pattern shirt. i would like to return to the debate on - pattern shirt. i would like to return to the debate on the | pattern shirt. i would like to - return to the debate on the nhs, where _ return to the debate on the nhs, where we — return to the debate on the nhs, where we are _ return to the debate on the nhs, where we are always _ return to the debate on the nhs, where we are always looking - return to the debate on the nhs, where we are always looking at i where we are always looking at waiting — where we are always looking at waiting lists, _ where we are always looking at waiting lists, looking _ where we are always looking at waiting lists, looking at- where we are always looking at waiting lists, looking at the - waiting lists, looking at the current _ waiting lists, looking at the current situation— waiting lists, looking at the current situation in - waiting lists, looking at the current situation in the - waiting lists, looking at the . current situation in the health service, — current situation in the health service, i_ current situation in the health service, i think— current situation in the health service, i think we _ current situation in the health service, i think we should - current situation in the health service, i think we should payi service, i think we should pay tribute — service, i think we should pay tribute to— service, i think we should pay tribute to nhs— service, i think we should pay tribute to nhs staff _ service, i think we should pay tribute to nhs staff but - service, i think we should pay tribute to nhs staff but the i service, i think we should pay. tribute to nhs staff but the real reason — tribute to nhs staff but the real reason is, — tribute to nhs staff but the real reason is, you _ tribute to nhs staff but the real reason is, you have _ tribute to nhs staff but the real reason is, you have to- tribute to nhs staff but the real reason is, you have to be - tribute to nhs staff but the real. reason is, you have to be retaining your— reason is, you have to be retaining your staff— reason is, you have to be retaining your staff and _ reason is, you have to be retaining your staff and valuing _ reason is, you have to be retaining your staff and valuing staff, - reason is, you have to be retaining your staff and valuing staff, and i your staff and valuing staff, and not leaving _ your staff and valuing staff, and not leaving them _ your staff and valuing staff, and not leaving them to _ your staff and valuing staff, and not leaving them to go - your staff and valuing staff, and not leaving them to go to - your staff and valuing staff, and not leaving them to go to other| not leaving them to go to other countries — not leaving them to go to other countries i_ not leaving them to go to other countries. i also _ not leaving them to go to other countries. i also think - not leaving them to go to other countries. i also think mental. countries. i also think mental health— countries. i also think mental health services— countries. i also think mental health services are _ countries. i also think mental health services are dire - countries. i also think mental health services are dire in- countries. i also think mental- health services are dire in wales. child _ health services are dire in wales. child mental— health services are dire in wales. child mental health _ health services are dire in wales. child mental health services, - child mental health services, absolutely _ child mental health services, absolutely poor, _ child mental health services, absolutely poor, we - child mental health services, absolutely poor, we don't- child mental health services, - absolutely poor, we don't mention mental— absolutely poor, we don't mention mental health _ absolutely poor, we don't mention mental health services _ absolutely poor, we don't mention mental health services enough - mental health services enough because — mental health services enough because there _ mental health services enough because there is _ mental health services enough because there is a _ mental health services enough because there is a huge - mental health services enough because there is a huge void i mental health services enough - because there is a huge void there. lots of— because there is a huge void there. lots of points, _ because there is a huge void there. lots of points, let's _ because there is a huge void there. lots of points, let's go _ because there is a huge void there. lots of points, let's go back - lots of points, let's go back to health. �* ,., lots of points, let's go back to health. �* , , _ health. i'm so disturbed by the histo of health. i'm so disturbed by the history of the _ health. i'm so disturbed by the history of the health _ health. i'm so disturbed by the history of the health service, i health. i'm so disturbed by the i history of the health service, the tories _ history of the health service, the tories in — history of the health service, the tories in the nhs effectively shut all of— tories in the nhs effectively shut all of the — tories in the nhs effectively shut all of the mental hospitals, every county— all of the mental hospitals, every county had a legal requirement to have a _ county had a legal requirement to have a mental health hospital, many of them _ have a mental health hospital, many of them were not perfect but we closed _ of them were not perfect but we closed down most of the mental health— closed down most of the mental health institutions, why, who made that decision? mental health is now one of— that decision? mental health is now one of the _ that decision? mental health is now one of the biggest challenges the country— one of the biggest challenges the country has. again i go back to the infrastructure point, we don't have enough _ infrastructure point, we don't have enough hospital beds, hospitals, mental— enough hospital beds, hospitals, mental hospitals, the blame is all and his— mental hospitals, the blame is all and his people before you today. on and his people before you today. (olin the and his people before you today. the health and his people before you today. on the health service the reality is that i would ask people to do a straightforward comparison between the way the nhs treats people in england with diagnostic centres and flexibility to be treated at other hospitals in the region if you cannot be treated at your own and not just take what you're given. there is a huge amount the welsh nhs could be doing to drive down waiting lists accept the point the gentleman made that mental health is also very important and needs to be treated with parity to physical health concerns. on the issues of the rivers, it is important and i hope angela realises that it is the welsh labour government you are responsible for things like cso sewage outflows and one of the biggest reasons for rivers failing in wales is metal leaching out of mines, something the government has been aware of and has done little to resolve. ., . , . resolve. you have been in a cooperation _ resolve. you have been in a cooperation agreement. - resolve. you have been in aj cooperation agreement. we resolve. you have been in a - cooperation agreement. we did not aree cooperation agreement. we did not a i ree with cooperation agreement. we did not agree with labour _ cooperation agreement. we did not agree with labour on _ cooperation agreement. we did not agree with labour on the _ cooperation agreement. we did not agree with labour on the nhs, - cooperation agreement. we did not| agree with labour on the nhs, there was no _ agree with labour on the nhs, there was no common ground between us on the nhs _ was no common ground between us on the nhs. picking up on the h52 point~ _ the nhs. picking up on the h52 point if— the nhs. picking up on the h52 point. if anyone hasn't heard that interview— point. if anyone hasn't heard that interview withjo point. if anyone hasn't heard that interview with jo stevens, —— jill stevens. — interview with jo stevens, —— jill stevens, she said that h52 no longer exist _ stevens, she said that h52 no longer exist it _ stevens, she said that h52 no longer exist. it does. they are spending up to £70 _ exist. it does. they are spending up to £70 billion on it, wales is subsidising it and we are owed £4 billion— subsidising it and we are owed £4 billion we — subsidising it and we are owed £4 billion we could be spending on improving infrastructure in wales but not _ improving infrastructure in wales but notjust on h52, that interview told you _ but notjust on h52, that interview told you everything you need to know about _ told you everything you need to know about the _ told you everything you need to know about the relationship between an incoming — about the relationship between an incoming labour government and wales, _ incoming labour government and wales, a — incoming labour government and wales, a point that you made at the start of— wales, a point that you made at the start of the — wales, a point that you made at the start of the programme on devolution and that— start of the programme on devolution and that relationship. what we heard was the _ and that relationship. what we heard was the secretary of state saying she wouldn't fight for h52, that she would _ she wouldn't fight for h52, that she would not _ she wouldn't fight for h52, that she would not listen to the labour party in wales— would not listen to the labour party in wales on— would not listen to the labour party in wales on the devolution of crime and justice — in wales on the devolution of crime and justice. a former lord chief justice — and justice. a former lord chief justice of— and justice. a former lord chief justice of england and wales agrees with labour members in wales, plaid cymru _ with labour members in wales, plaid cymru has _ with labour members in wales, plaid cymru has been pushing this for years. _ cymru has been pushing this for years. we — cymru has been pushing this for years, we need to crack on and devolve — years, we need to crack on and devolve policing and justice. and jill stephen said that this isjust tinkering. jill stephen said that this is 'ust tinkerini. ~ ., �* . tinkering. won't get in, if you want to take that — tinkering. won't get in, if you want to take that point _ tinkering. won't get in, if you want to take that point on _ tinkering. won't get in, if you want to take that point on the _ to take that point on the relationship between the two ends. one of the key factors in the election. when we havejust one of the key factors in the election. when we have just met governors that work together for wales and britain and government that will take devolution forward. in the manifesto we are standing on, we are clear about the devolution of employment support, of restoration of... we are, i have asked for and got a pledge that in the manifesto, restoring structural funds to wales, more than that, devolution of justice and probation services. and the fiscal framework, a justice and probation services. and the fiscalframework, a greater say for wales on wales, strengthening the sewell committee... let’s for wales on wales, strengthening the sewell committee... let's leave it there. i need _ the sewell committee... let's leave it there. i need to _ the sewell committee... let's leave it there. i need to get _ the sewell committee... let's leave it there. i need to get to _ the sewell committee... let's leave it there. i need to get to jane - it there. i need to get to jane dodds. oliver lewis, thank you very much. it dodds. oliver lewis, thank you very much. . dodds. oliver lewis, thank you very much. , ., . much. it is not that dignified, these people _ much. it is not that dignified, these people scrapping - much. it is not that dignified, - these people scrapping together, because — these people scrapping together, because i want to talk about rivers and seas, — because i want to talk about rivers and seas, the lifeblood of our country — and seas, the lifeblood of our country here in wales, and we need to be _ country here in wales, and we need to be working together, with the farming — to be working together, with the farming sector and strengthening nrw to monitor— farming sector and strengthening nrw to monitor and police there is rivers — to monitor and police there is rivers because sewage is being put in theirs _ rivers because sewage is being put in theirs rivers, and we need to prosecute — in theirs rivers, and we need to prosecute the polluters. applause it is absolutely appalling. applause it is absolutel aiiallini. ., applause it is absolutel aiiiallin. ., it is absolutely appalling. that the conservatives _ it is absolutely appalling. that the conservatives did _ it is absolutely appalling. that the conservatives did not _ it is absolutely appalling. that the conservatives did not support - it is absolutely appalling. that the conservatives did not support a i it is absolutely appalling. that the l conservatives did not support a law which _ conservatives did not support a law which would prosecute polluters. that is— which would prosecute polluters. that is what we need to do. that is why we _ that is what we need to do. that is why we need to have... that is what we need to do. that is why we need to have. . ._ why we need to have... thank you very much. _ why we need to have... thank you very much. we _ why we need to have... thank you very much, we need _ why we need to have... thank you very much, we need to _ why we need to have... thank you very much, we need to leave - why we need to have... thank you very much, we need to leave it. very much, we need to leave it there. thank you very much, going to our third question, and it is asked by aly roderick. has our third question, and it is asked by aly roderick.— our third question, and it is asked by aly roderick. has the discussion around the election _ by aly roderick. has the discussion around the election being - by aly roderick. has the discussion around the election being too - around the election being too negative, _ around the election being too negative, around _ around the election being too i negative, around immigration? i manage — negative, around immigration? i manage a — negative, around immigration? i manage a laboratory— negative, around immigration? i manage a laboratory with - negative, around immigration? ij manage a laboratory with people negative, around immigration? i- manage a laboratory with people from all over— manage a laboratory with people from all over the _ manage a laboratory with people from all over the world. _ manage a laboratory with people from all over the world.— all over the world. 22,000 people comini to all over the world. 22,000 people coming to wales _ all over the world. 22,000 people coming to wales in _ all over the world. 22,000 people coming to wales in 2022, - all over the world. 22,000 people coming to wales in 2022, how- all over the world. 22,000 people l coming to wales in 2022, how many think that is too many immigrants? hands up? anybody want more? i think that is too many immigrants? hands up? anybody want more? i don't know whether — hands up? anybody want more? i don't know whether the _ hands up? anybody want more? i don't know whether the gentleman _ hands up? anybody want more? i don't know whether the gentleman is - know whether the gentleman is referring to legal migration. i don't think that is an issue. does an bod don't think that is an issue. does anybody want — don't think that is an issue. does anybody want more _ don't think that is an issue. does anybody want more immigration, rhun ap iorwerth? into anybody want more immigration, rhun ai iorwerth? ., , . ., , ap iorwerth? into some sectors, health and — ap iorwerth? into some sectors, health and care _ ap iorwerth? into some sectors, health and care for _ ap iorwerth? into some sectors, health and care for example, - ap iorwerth? into some sectors, i health and care for example, some parts _ health and care for example, some parts of— health and care for example, some parts of the — health and care for example, some parts of the economy. you use the word _ parts of the economy. you use the word negative, thinki parts of the economy. you use the word negative, think i that is a kind _ word negative, think i that is a kind word _ word negative, think i that is a kind word to use, and i don't like the turn — kind word to use, and i don't like the turn of— kind word to use, and i don't like the turn of the debate on immigration. we know that one party in particular— immigration. we know that one party in particular wants to exploit people's— in particular wants to exploit people's fears and anxieties. sadly, we're _ people's fears and anxieties. sadly, we're conservatives and labour, more and more. _ we're conservatives and labour, more and more, willing to talk back kind of language. if we are to address our needs— of language. if we are to address our needs as a society, in certain sectors, — our needs as a society, in certain sectors, we — our needs as a society, in certain sectors, we need to take that heat out of _ sectors, we need to take that heat out of it. _ sectors, we need to take that heat out of it. of— sectors, we need to take that heat out of it, of course we need to control— out of it, of course we need to control borders, every country does that _ control borders, every country does that, we _ control borders, every country does that, we need to invest in proper processing — that, we need to invest in proper processing so that we deal with who is able _ processing so that we deal with who is able to— processing so that we deal with who is able to come in and who might need _ is able to come in and who might need to— is able to come in and who might need to be — is able to come in and who might need to be sent home if they don't meet a _ need to be sent home if they don't meet a particular threshold, but we are talking — meet a particular threshold, but we are talking about people. people who are talking about people. people who are moving, many of them because of war, are moving, many of them because of war. because — are moving, many of them because of war, because of issues that have meant _ war, because of issues that have meant that— war, because of issues that have meant that they have had to move from _ meant that they have had to move from their— meant that they have had to move from their country against their will _ from their country against their will let's— from their country against their will. let's remember the humanity and all— will. let's remember the humanity and all this — will. let's remember the humanity and all this. and that is again to counter— and all this. and that is again to counter the negativity that we hear far too _ counter the negativity that we hear far too much. applause jane dodds. thank you for the question, this is really— thank you for the question, this is really important. _ thank you for the question, this is really important. i— thank you for the question, this is really important. i have _ thank you for the question, this is really important. i have worked i thank you for the question, this is. really important. i have worked with immigrants— really important. i have worked with immigrants for— really important. i have worked with immigrants fora— really important. i have worked with immigrants fora number— really important. i have worked with immigrants fora number of- really important. i have worked with immigrants for a number of years i really important. i have worked with immigrants for a number of years inj immigrants for a number of years in this country— immigrants for a number of years in this country and _ immigrants for a number of years in this country and abroad. _ immigrants for a number of years in this country and abroad. they - immigrants for a number of years in this country and abroad. they are i this country and abroad. they are people _ this country and abroad. they are people like — this country and abroad. they are people like us, _ this country and abroad. they are people like us, they— this country and abroad. they are people like us, they are - this country and abroad. they are i people like us, they are desperately trying _ people like us, they are desperately trying to— people like us, they are desperately trying to get — people like us, they are desperately trying to get away— people like us, they are desperately trying to get away from _ people like us, they are desperately trying to get away from war - people like us, they are desperately trying to get away from war torn - trying to get away from war torn situations — trying to get away from war torn situations. we _ trying to get away from war torn situations. we need _ trying to get away from war torn situations. we need safe - trying to get away from war torn situations. we need safe and . trying to get away from war torn i situations. we need safe and legal roots. _ situations. we need safe and legal roots. that — situations. we need safe and legal roots. that is — situations. we need safe and legal roots, that is the _ situations. we need safe and legal roots, that is the first _ situations. we need safe and legal roots, that is the first thing. - situations. we need safe and legal roots, that is the first thing. we . roots, that is the first thing. we need _ roots, that is the first thing. we need a — roots, that is the first thing. we need a faster— roots, that is the first thing. we need a faster asylum _ roots, that is the first thing. we need a faster asylum process. i roots, that is the first thing. we - need a faster asylum process. people are sitting _ need a faster asylum process. people are sitting in— need a faster asylum process. people are sitting in the _ need a faster asylum process. people are sitting in the asylum _ need a faster asylum process. people are sitting in the asylum process - are sitting in the asylum process without— are sitting in the asylum process without any— are sitting in the asylum process without any hope _ are sitting in the asylum process without any hope for— are sitting in the asylum process without any hope for months, i are sitting in the asylum process without any hope for months, ifi are sitting in the asylum process i without any hope for months, if not years _ without any hope for months, if not years. why— without any hope for months, if not years. why don't _ without any hope for months, if not years. why don't we _ without any hope for months, if not years. why don't we give _ without any hope for months, if not years. why don't we give them - without any hope for months, if not years. why don't we give them thei years. why don't we give them the ability— years. why don't we give them the ability to— years. why don't we give them the ability to work? _ years. why don't we give them the ability to work? here _ years. why don't we give them the ability to work? here in _ years. why don't we give them the ability to work? here in wales - years. why don't we give them the. ability to work? here in wales there is not _ ability to work? here in wales there is not a _ ability to work? here in wales there is not a community— ability to work? here in wales there is not a community that _ ability to work? here in wales there is not a community that does - ability to work? here in wales there is not a community that does not i is not a community that does not have _ is not a community that does not have a _ is not a community that does not have a poster— is not a community that does not have a poster up— is not a community that does not have a poster up saying - is not a community that does not have a poster up saying we - is not a community that does not have a poster up saying we need | have a poster up saying we need staff _ have a poster up saying we need staff we — have a poster up saying we need staff. we need _ have a poster up saying we need staff. we need to _ have a poster up saying we need staff. we need to make - have a poster up saying we need staff. we need to make sure - have a poster up saying we need | staff. we need to make sure that have a poster up saying we need - staff. we need to make sure that we allow _ staff. we need to make sure that we allow people — staff. we need to make sure that we allow people to _ staff. we need to make sure that we allow people to work. _ staff. we need to make sure that we allow people to work. we _ staff. we need to make sure that we allow people to work. we need - staff. we need to make sure that we allow people to work. we need to i allow people to work. we need to stop the _ allow people to work. we need to stop the language, _ allow people to work. we need to stop the language, i— allow people to work. we need to stop the language, i agree - allow people to work. we need to stop the language, i agree with i allow people to work. we need to . stop the language, i agree with rhun on this, _ stop the language, i agree with rhun on this, around — stop the language, i agree with rhun on this, around the _ stop the language, i agree with rhun on this, around the demonisation - stop the language, i agree with rhun on this, around the demonisation of| on this, around the demonisation of asylum _ on this, around the demonisation of asylum seekers _ on this, around the demonisation of asylum seekers. wales _ on this, around the demonisation of asylum seekers. wales is _ on this, around the demonisation of asylum seekers. wales is a - on this, around the demonisation of asylum seekers. wales is a nation i on this, around the demonisation of| asylum seekers. wales is a nation of santry— asylum seekers. wales is a nation of santry and _ asylum seekers. wales is a nation of santry and i— asylum seekers. wales is a nation of santry and i wanted _ asylum seekers. wales is a nation of santry and i wanted to _ asylum seekers. wales is a nation of santry and i wanted to be _ asylum seekers. wales is a nation of santry and i wanted to be open, - santry and i wanted to be open, welcoming — santry and i wanted to be open, welcoming and _ santry and i wanted to be open, welcoming and positive - santry and i wanted to be open, welcoming and positive and - santry and i wanted to be open, i welcoming and positive and caring for anyone — welcoming and positive and caring for anyone who _ welcoming and positive and caring for anyone who wants _ welcoming and positive and caring for anyone who wants to - welcoming and positive and caring for anyone who wants to come - welcoming and positive and caring i for anyone who wants to come here welcoming and positive and caring - for anyone who wants to come here to live with _ for anyone who wants to come here to live with us _ for anyone who wants to come here to live with us— live with us. let's go to the gentleman _ live with us. let's go to the gentleman there. - live with us. let's go to the gentleman there. why - live with us. let's go to the gentleman there. why are l live with us. let's go to the i gentleman there. why are the live with us. let's go to the _ gentleman there. why are the people of wales so poorly _ gentleman there. why are the people of wales so poorly served _ gentleman there. why are the people of wales so poorly served by - gentleman there. why are the people of wales so poorly served by the - of wales so poorly served by the railways — of wales so poorly served by the railways and would it be fair to say that cardiff— railways and would it be fair to say that cardiff is the worst connected capital— that cardiff is the worst connected capital city in europe? the that cardiff is the worst connected capital city in europe?— capital city in europe? the lady there and the _ capital city in europe? the lady there and the man _ capital city in europe? the lady there and the man in _ capital city in europe? the lady there and the man in front. - capital city in europe? the lady there and the man in front. i i capital city in europe? the lady. there and the man in front. i am a survivor of — there and the man in front. i am a survivor of domestic _ there and the man in front. i am a survivor of domestic abuse, - there and the man in front. i am a survivor of domestic abuse, in - survivor of domestic abuse, in particular— survivor of domestic abuse, in particular of— survivor of domestic abuse, in particular of family— survivor of domestic abuse, in particular of family court - survivor of domestic abuse, in particular of family court and i survivor of domestic abuse, in - particular of family court and post separation — particular of family court and post separation abuse _ particular of family court and post separation abuse and _ particular of family court and post separation abuse and it _ particular of family court and post separation abuse and it is- particular of family court and post separation abuse and it is an - separation abuse and it is an important _ separation abuse and it is an important topic— separation abuse and it is an important topic and - separation abuse and it is an important topic and i- separation abuse and it is an important topic and i speak. separation abuse and it is an i important topic and i speak on behalf— important topic and i speak on behalf of— important topic and i speak on behalf of so _ important topic and i speak on behalf of so many _ important topic and i speak on behalf of so many women - important topic and i speak on behalf of so many women i - important topic and i speak on. behalf of so many women i deal important topic and i speak on - behalf of so many women i deal with throughout— behalf of so many women i deal with throughout the — behalf of so many women i deal with throughout the country. _ behalf of so many women i deal with throughout the country. with - behalf of so many women i deal with throughout the country. with the - throughout the country. with the family— throughout the country. with the family courts _ throughout the country. with the family courts in _ throughout the country. with the family courts in particular. - throughout the country. with the family courts in particular. do . throughout the country. with thei family courts in particular. do any of the _ family courts in particular. do any of the candidates _ family courts in particular. do any of the candidates have _ family courts in particular. do any of the candidates have any- family courts in particular. do any of the candidates have any plansl family courts in particular. do any. of the candidates have any plans to prioritise _ of the candidates have any plans to prioritise addressing _ of the candidates have any plans to prioritise addressing violence - prioritise addressing violence against — prioritise addressing violence against women _ prioritise addressing violence against women in _ prioritise addressing violence against women in wales, - prioritise addressing violence - against women in wales, specifically by educating — against women in wales, specifically by educating the _ against women in wales, specifically by educating the multi _ against women in wales, specifically by educating the multi agency - by educating the multi agency professionals _ by educating the multi agency professionals such— by educating the multi agency professionals such as - by educating the multi agency professionals such as the - by educating the multi agency i professionals such as the courts, social— professionals such as the courts, social services _ professionals such as the courts, social services and _ professionals such as the courts, social services and the _ professionals such as the courts, social services and the police - professionals such as the courts, social services and the police by| social services and the police by responding _ social services and the police by responding to _ social services and the police by responding to coercive - social services and the police by responding to coercive control i social services and the police by. responding to coercive control and post separation _ responding to coercive control and post separation abuse, _ responding to coercive control and post separation abuse, given - responding to coercive control and post separation abuse, given the i post separation abuse, given the devastating — post separation abuse, given the devastating impact— post separation abuse, given the devastating impact on _ post separation abuse, given the devastating impact on victims . post separation abuse, given the l devastating impact on victims and their families _ devastating impact on victims and theirfamilies in— devastating impact on victims and their families in family— devastating impact on victims and their families in family court - their families in family court procedures— their families in family court procedures as _ their families in family court procedures as well- their families in family court procedures as well as - their families in family court i procedures as well as financial their families in family court - procedures as well as financial and emotional? — procedures as well as financial and emotional? women— procedures as well as financial and emotional? women are _ procedures as well as financial and emotional? women are taking - procedures as well as financial and l emotional? women are taking their lives _ emotional? women are taking their lives, and _ emotional? women are taking their lives, and men— emotional? women are taking their lives, and men as— emotional? women are taking their lives, and men as well— emotional? women are taking their lives, and men as well and - emotional? women are taking their lives, and men as well and they - emotional? women are taking their lives, and men as well and they arej lives, and men as well and they are contemplating _ lives, and men as well and they are contemplating it _ lives, and men as well and they are contemplating it and _ lives, and men as well and they are contemplating it and it _ lives, and men as well and they are contemplating it and it is— lives, and men as well and they are| contemplating it and it is happening and they— contemplating it and it is happening and they are — contemplating it and it is happening and they are ignoring _ contemplating it and it is happening and they are ignoring all— contemplating it and it is happening and they are ignoring all the - contemplating it and it is happening and they are ignoring all the laws i and they are ignoring all the laws that have — and they are ignoring all the laws that have come _ and they are ignoring all the laws that have come in. _ and they are ignoring all the laws that have come in. it— and they are ignoring all the laws that have come in. it is— and they are ignoring all the laws that have come in. it is all- and they are ignoring all the laws that have come in. it is all being| that have come in. it is all being ignored — that have come in. it is all being iinored. ., ~' that have come in. it is all being iinored. . ,, , . . ignored. thank you very much. that is a very important _ ignored. thank you very much. that is a very important issue. _ ignored. thank you very much. that is a very important issue. as - ignored. thank you very much. that is a very important issue. as rhun l is a very important issue. as rhun mentioned. _ is a very important issue. as rhun mentioned, many people - is a very important issue. as rhun mentioned, many people come i is a very important issue. as rhun i mentioned, many people come over here because of war and a lot of it is sponsored by us here in wales and britain _ is sponsored by us here in wales and britain. britain and wales have an entranced — britain. britain and wales have an entranced history of complicity in israel— entranced history of complicity in israel plus— entranced history of complicity in israel plus my genocide and war crimes — israel plus my genocide and war crimes. and so over 57,000 people have _ crimes. and so over 57,000 people have died _ crimes. and so over 57,000 people have died in— crimes. and so over 57,000 people have died in palestine, innocent civilians — have died in palestine, innocent civilians and 55,000 are children. what _ civilians and 55,000 are children. what will— civilians and 55,000 are children. what will be do to remove british and was — what will be do to remove british and was complicity because you voted against _ and was complicity because you voted against a _ and was complicity because you voted against a ceasefire in the senned and the _ against a ceasefire in the senned and the conservatives are not being helpful— and the conservatives are not being helpful and we keep calling for a ceasefire — helpful and we keep calling for a ceasefire and we don't do anything about— ceasefire and we don't do anything about the — ceasefire and we don't do anything about the genocide in israel. thank ou ve about the genocide in israel. thank you very much- _ about the genocide in israel. thank you very much. the _ about the genocide in israel. thank you very much. the lady _ about the genocide in israel. thank you very much. the lady there i about the genocide in israel. thank you very much. the lady there withj you very much. the lady there with the blonde hair. 50 i you very much. the lady there with the blonde hair.— the blonde hair. so i think linked to the cost _ the blonde hair. so i think linked to the cost of— the blonde hair. so i think linked to the cost of living _ the blonde hair. so i think linked to the cost of living crisis - the blonde hair. so i think linked to the cost of living crisis and i the blonde hair. so i think linked| to the cost of living crisis and the immigration _ to the cost of living crisis and the immigration issue _ to the cost of living crisis and the immigration issue is— to the cost of living crisis and the immigration issue is the - to the cost of living crisis and the immigration issue is the fact i to the cost of living crisis and the immigration issue is the fact thatj immigration issue is the fact that there _ immigration issue is the fact that there are — immigration issue is the fact that there are not _ immigration issue is the fact that there are not enough _ immigration issue is the fact that there are not enough houses i immigration issue is the fact that there are not enough houses in i immigration issue is the fact that i there are not enough houses in the uk. there are not enough houses in the uk i_ there are not enough houses in the uk i am _ there are not enough houses in the uk iam a— there are not enough houses in the uk. i am a mortgage _ there are not enough houses in the uk. i am a mortgage advisor- there are not enough houses in the uk. i am a mortgage advisor and i there are not enough houses in the i uk. i am a mortgage advisor and i'm quite _ uk. i am a mortgage advisor and i'm quite shocked — uk. i am a mortgage advisor and i'm quite shocked by— uk. i am a mortgage advisor and i'm quite shocked by the _ uk. i am a mortgage advisor and i'm quite shocked by the fact _ uk. i am a mortgage advisor and i'm quite shocked by the fact there - uk. i am a mortgage advisor and i'm quite shocked by the fact there has i quite shocked by the fact there has not been _ quite shocked by the fact there has not been much _ quite shocked by the fact there has not been much of— quite shocked by the fact there has not been much of a _ quite shocked by the fact there has not been much of a discussion- quite shocked by the fact there has not been much of a discussion soi quite shocked by the fact there has. not been much of a discussion so far of mortgage — not been much of a discussion so far of mortgage rates _ not been much of a discussion so far of mortgage rates. there _ not been much of a discussion so far of mortgage rates. there has - not been much of a discussion so far of mortgage rates. there has not i of mortgage rates. there has not been _ of mortgage rates. there has not been any— of mortgage rates. there has not been any discussion _ of mortgage rates. there has not been any discussion of— of mortgage rates. there has not been any discussion of the - of mortgage rates. there has not been any discussion of the fact i been any discussion of the fact there _ been any discussion of the fact there are — been any discussion of the fact there are not _ been any discussion of the fact there are not enough - been any discussion of the fact there are not enough houses. i been any discussion of the factj there are not enough houses. i been any discussion of the fact - there are not enough houses. i speak to people _ there are not enough houses. i speak to people everyday— there are not enough houses. i speak to people everyday who _ there are not enough houses. i speak to people everyday who are _ to people everyday who are struggling _ to people everyday who are struggling to _ to people everyday who are struggling to get _ to people everyday who are struggling to get on - to people everyday who are struggling to get on the i to people everyday who are - struggling to get on the property ladder_ struggling to get on the property ladder because _ struggling to get on the property ladder because they— struggling to get on the property ladder because they can't - struggling to get on the property ladder because they can't get - struggling to get on the property ladder because they can't get a i ladder because they can't get a deposit — ladder because they can't get a deposit i— ladder because they can't get a deposit. i want— ladder because they can't get a deposit. i want to _ ladder because they can't get a deposit. i want to understand i ladder because they can't get a - deposit. i want to understand what is the _ deposit. i want to understand what is the long-term _ deposit. i want to understand what is the long—term plan _ deposit. i want to understand what is the long—term plan to _ deposit. i want to understand what is the long—term plan to tackle - deposit. i want to understand what is the long—term plan to tackle thei is the long—term plan to tackle the housing _ is the long—term plan to tackle the housing crisis— is the long—term plan to tackle the housing crisis in— is the long—term plan to tackle the housing crisis in wales? _ is the long—term plan to tackle the housing crisis in wales? how- is the long—term plan to tackle the housing crisis in wales? how will. housing crisis in wales? how will you those — housing crisis in wales? how will you those challenges? _ housing crisis in wales? how will you those challenges? the - housing crisis in wales? how will you those challenges? the gentleman in the checked — you those challenges? the gentleman in the checked shirt. _ you those challenges? the gentleman in the checked shirt. i _ you those challenges? the gentleman in the checked shirt. i have _ in the checked shirt. i have listened — in the checked shirt. i have listened to _ in the checked shirt. i have listened to everything - in the checked shirt. i have listened to everything very | listened to everything very carefully this evening. but none of you are _ carefully this evening. but none of you are being honest. we are {2.7 trillion _ you are being honest. we are {2.7 trillion in _ you are being honest. we are {2.7 trillion in debt as a nation. we are spending — trillion in debt as a nation. we are spending £89 billion on interest atone _ spending £89 billion on interest alone. this year, the conservatives have _ alone. this year, the conservatives have borrowed £51 billion. where is all this— have borrowed £51 billion. where is all this money going to come from? you can_ all this money going to come from? you can either raise taxes which would _ you can either raise taxes which would be — you can either raise taxes which would be a _ you can either raise taxes which would be a 70 year high, or you are going _ would be a 70 year high, or you are going to _ would be a 70 year high, or you are going to cut— would be a 70 year high, or you are going to cut services stop that is the state — going to cut services stop that is the state of the economy. also, in wales— the state of the economy. also, in wales the — the state of the economy. also, in wales the senned has been in charge of devolution for 25 years. it has not of devolution for 25 years. it has got worse- _ of devolution for 25 years. it has got worse- 0k. _ of devolution for 25 years. it has got worse. 0k, thank _ of devolution for 25 years. it has got worse. 0k, thank you - of devolution for 25 years. it has got worse. 0k, thank you very l of devolution for 25 years. it has - got worse. 0k, thank you very much. we could listen to you all night. tote we could listen to you all night. we don't need a government that is rubbish — don't need a government that is rubbish. ,., . . ~ don't need a government that is rubbish. . . ~ . rubbish. ok, so we are talking about immigration- — rubbish. ok, so we are talking about immigration. thank— rubbish. ok, so we are talking about immigration. thank you _ rubbish. ok, so we are talking about immigration. thank you for - rubbish. ok, so we are talking about immigration. thank you for all - rubbish. ok, so we are talking about immigration. thank you for all your i immigration. thank you for all your points. they are all extremely important. i wish we had ours to discuss all of them in depth but i don't think we could do justice to all of them, i am sorry about that. let me go back to immigration and go to oliver. . ~ let me go back to immigration and go to oliver. . ,, , ., , . g . to oliver. thank you very much. jane used words — to oliver. thank you very much. jane used words like _ to oliver. thank you very much. jane used words like demonisation - to oliver. thank you very much. jane used words like demonisation and i used words like demonisation and scapegoating immigrants. we do not wish to scapegoat or demonise any market. we don't blame any margaret for exploiting the failures of the british state. our scorn is reserved for the failures of the uk government to control our borders properly and it is a domestic failure of our institutions. the crisis is so serious i don't think the political class has caught up with it. you mentionjustice and i was speaking to a lady on a bus last night which was constantly full of disasters on the line because of the failures of our railways and the lady was waiting six years for the cps to prosecute a case, not in the family court, to bring a case to trial. she said she could be dead before it reaches a judgment. she can't claim insurance until the six years is up. every british institution when you open it you realise there is a pandora's box there and it is appalling and we need to improve all of our institutions and that is what reform stands for. to institutions and that is what reform stands for. ., . . institutions and that is what reform stands for. ., . , ~ . �* , stands for. to answer alan's point we will always _ stands for. to answer alan's point we will always need _ stands for. to answer alan's point we will always need and _ stands for. to answer alan's point we will always need and welcome| we will always need and welcome illegal— we will always need and welcome illegal migration into this country for people with specialist skills, such— for people with specialist skills, such as — for people with specialist skills, such as the one you refer to. but we cannot— such as the one you refer to. but we cannot have — such as the one you refer to. but we cannot have 50,000 or so people, maihty_ cannot have 50,000 or so people, mainly young men, and i have been to several— mainly young men, and i have been to several cams. — mainly young men, and i have been to several cams, including the one in calais, _ several cams, including the one in calais, they— several cams, including the one in calais, they are mainly young men and they— calais, they are mainly young men and they are coming because they want _ and they are coming because they want to— and they are coming because they want to have a better way of life. that is _ want to have a better way of life. that is perfectly understandable. will you the rwanda plan? let that is perfectly understandable. will you the rwanda plan? let me get down to the question. _ will you the rwanda plan? let me get down to the question. you _ will you the rwanda plan? let me get down to the question. you don't - will you the rwanda plan? let me get down to the question. you don't have | down to the question. you don't have a plan _ down to the question. you don't have a plan for— down to the question. you don't have a plan for immigration. we know what tattours— a plan for immigration. we know what tabour's pian— a plan for immigration. we know what labour's plan is, it is to get people _ labour's plan is, it is to get people more benefits, whether it is universal— people more benefits, whether it is universal basic income and then try and get _ universal basic income and then try and get legal aid. there is is what you are _ and get legal aid. there is is what you are doing in wales. we want to -ive you are doing in wales. we want to give everyone the opportunity to work _ give everyone the opportunity to work and — give everyone the opportunity to work and that is what 50,000 young men would _ work and that is what 50,000 young men would like to have. david work and that is what 50,000 young men would like to have.— men would like to have. david tc davies, men would like to have. david tc davies. on _ men would like to have. david tc davies, on the _ men would like to have. david tc davies, on the rwanda _ men would like to have. david tc davies, on the rwanda plan, - men would like to have. david tc davies, on the rwanda plan, if. men would like to have. david tci davies, on the rwanda plan, if you were to implement it and win the election, do you personally want to leave the european court of human rights. if a leave the european court of human richts. . ., _, leave the european court of human richts. . ., , , rights. if a foreign court stops us from doing _ rights. if a foreign court stops us from doing something _ rights. if a foreign court stops us from doing something which - rights. if a foreign court stops us from doing something which we | rights. if a foreign court stops us| from doing something which we as rights. if a foreign court stops us i from doing something which we as a democratically elected, sovereign parliament has voted to do, of course — parliament has voted to do, of course i— parliament has voted to do, of course i would. we have every right to entit— course i would. we have every right to enrit -- — course i would. we have every right to emit —— implement the immigration policy— to emit —— implement the immigration policy that— to emit —— implement the immigration policy that people in this country have _ policy that people in this country have voted for.— policy that people in this country have voted for. vaughan gething, immigration- _ have voted for. vaughan gething, immigration. we _ have voted for. vaughan gething, immigration. we need _ have voted for. vaughan gething, immigration. we need to - have voted for. vaughan gething, immigration. we need to go - have voted for. vaughan gething, immigration. we need to go back| have voted for. vaughan gething, i immigration. we need to go back to the question. _ immigration. we need to go back to the question, where _ immigration. we need to go back to the question, where are _ immigration. we need to go back to the question, where are we - immigration. we need to go back to the question, where are we with - the question, where are we with migration? it has been covered in a way that is more divisive than it needs to be. if you look at rwanda it is an opportunity to be divisive and it will solve all of our problems, it will not. we have a real problem, we have a backlog in our asylum system and that is why we will employ 1000 more staff. we have to understand who should be here and who should not. we will stop the rwanda scheme and invest that money in border security to deal with the criminal gangs who are exploiting people getting them in unsafe, small votes across the channel. all of those things need to happen. i am proud of the generosity we have showed to a number of people around the world and we have obligations as well. think what we have done across wales and beyond for people in ukraine. think about those people in afghanistan who worked alongside our forces. we have obligations to them as well as having a balance immigration system.- as well as having a balance immigration system. as well as having a balance immirrations stem. , . . , immigration system. does wales need more immigrants? _ immigration system. does wales need more immigrants? do _ immigration system. does wales need more immigrants? do we _ immigration system. does wales need more immigrants? do we need - immigration system. does wales need more immigrants? do we need more? | immigration system. does wales need . more immigrants? do we need more? we hear the system is broken, do we need more immigrants? what hear the system is broken, do we need more immigrants?— hear the system is broken, do we need more immigrants? what we need in the care sector _ need more immigrants? what we need in the care sector is _ need more immigrants? what we need in the care sector is we _ need more immigrants? what we need in the care sector is we need _ need more immigrants? what we need in the care sector is we need to - need more immigrants? what we need in the care sector is we need to pay - in the care sector is we need to pay people properly, so a national care service with fair play in england and wales and it would make a massive difference. we will need people from around the world and our economy. go to any nhs operating theatre and you will see an international success story. go to higher education and you see that as well. it is the balance that we need, having different relations around the world, are not treating people as if they were the problem. i am the son of an immigrant because my father left wales and worked in zambia. i am my father left wales and worked in zambia. lam here my father left wales and worked in zambia. i am here because of that journey. i recognise this needs to be managed sensitively and honestly about what our country needs and the basic decency we should all be proud of. , . , basic decency we should all be proud of. , , , g ., basic decency we should all be proud of. i, , , of. very briefly, jane dodds. it is really clear _ of. very briefly, jane dodds. it is really clear to _ of. very briefly, jane dodds. it is really clear to me _ of. very briefly, jane dodds. it is really clear to me that _ of. very briefly, jane dodds. it is really clear to me that we - of. very briefly, jane dodds. it is really clear to me that we need l of. very briefly, jane dodds. it is| really clear to me that we need to take the _ really clear to me that we need to take the heat out of this debate and we can— take the heat out of this debate and we can honestly look at what our communities need here in wales. i am really— communities need here in wales. i am really sorry. _ communities need here in wales. i am really sorry, but reform uk are not helping _ really sorry, but reform uk are not helping this debate at all and i will not — helping this debate at all and i will not give nigel farage one more second _ will not give nigel farage one more second than we need to because he is divisive _ second than we need to because he is divisive and _ second than we need to because he is divisive and poisonous. ok, | second than we need to because he is divisive and poisonous.— divisive and poisonous. ok, i am very sorry. _ divisive and poisonous. ok, i am very sorry. our— divisive and poisonous. ok, i am very sorry, our time _ divisive and poisonous. ok, i am very sorry, our time is _ divisive and poisonous. ok, i am very sorry, our time is nearly - divisive and poisonous. ok, i am| very sorry, our time is nearly up. to close tonight i am going to ask you to sum up on a point which comes up you to sum up on a point which comes up all the time in this campaign. what would you do to restore faith in politicians? you each have 30 seconds. we have drawn lots and we are starting tonight with vaughan gething. it are starting tonight with vaughan gethina. , gething. it might disappoint some --eole, gething. it might disappoint some peeple. but _ gething. it might disappoint some peeple. but what _ gething. it might disappoint some people, but what labour _ gething. it might disappoint some people, but what labour wants - gething. it might disappoint some people, but what labour wants is i people, but what labour wants is less division in our politics. less division, but more ambition. people should not go to bed angry at night about the lies they have been told. they should not wake up in the morning worried about their shopping bill. people have the right to expect us to be calm and cooperative and to be straight about the tough road ahead. that is what keir starmer and i offered to you as we seek your support to change wales for the better. jane seek your support to change wales for the better.— seek your support to change wales for the better. jane dodds. tonight ou have for the better. jane dodds. tonight you have heard _ for the better. jane dodds. tonight you have heard from _ for the better. jane dodds. tonight you have heard from two _ for the better. jane dodds. tonight you have heard from two political. you have heard from two political parties _ you have heard from two political parties who have been in power for far too— parties who have been in power for far too long, political parties who have _ far too long, political parties who have lost — far too long, political parties who have lost our trust. they have taken well for _ have lost our trust. they have taken well for granted. labour have mismanaged wales. the conservatives have neglected wales. you can change that. have neglected wales. you can change that if— have neglected wales. you can change that if you _ have neglected wales. you can change that. if you want that child, you can vote — that. if you want that child, you can vote for the welsh liberal democrats onjuly the can vote for the welsh liberal democrats on july the 4th. can vote for the welsh liberal democrats on july the 4th. thank you for listening- — democrats on july the 4th. thank you for listening. rhun _ democrats on july the 4th. thank you for listening. rhun ap _ democrats on july the 4th. thank you for listening. rhun ap iorwerth. - for listening. rhun ap iorwerth. most peeple — for listening. rhun ap iorwerth. most people agree _ for listening. rhun ap iorwerth. most people agree that - for listening. rhun ap iorwerth. most people agree that in - for listening. rhun ap iorwerth. most people agree that in this i most people agree that in this election— most people agree that in this election the _ most people agree that in this election the conservatives - most people agree that in this election the conservatives arej most people agree that in this- election the conservatives are gone but there _ election the conservatives are gone but there is— election the conservatives are gone but there is no— election the conservatives are gone but there is no real— election the conservatives are gone but there is no real excitement- but there is no real excitement about — but there is no real excitement about what _ but there is no real excitement about what labour— but there is no real excitement about what labour are - but there is no real excitement about what labour are offering| about what labour are offering instead~ — about what labour are offering instead. there _ about what labour are offering instead. there is— about what labour are offering instead. there is a _ about what labour are offeringi instead. there is a fundamental issue _ instead. there is a fundamental issue of— instead. there is a fundamental issue of trust _ instead. there is a fundamental issue of trust here _ instead. there is a fundamental issue of trust here to _ instead. there is a fundamental issue of trust here to me. - instead. there is a fundamental issue of trust here to me. you i instead. there is a fundamental- issue of trust here to me. you need to be _ issue of trust here to me. you need to be able _ issue of trust here to me. you need to be able to — issue of trust here to me. you need to be able to trust _ issue of trust here to me. you need to be able to trust that _ issue of trust here to me. you need to be able to trust that our- to be able to trust that our interests _ to be able to trust that our interests in _ to be able to trust that our interests in wales - to be able to trust that our interests in wales are - to be able to trust that ouri interests in wales are being to be able to trust that our- interests in wales are being served. keir starnrer— interests in wales are being served. keir starmer will— interests in wales are being served. keir starmer will become _ interests in wales are being served. keir starmer will become prime - keir starmer will become prime minister— keir starmer will become prime minister regardless _ keir starmer will become prime minister regardless of - keir starmer will become prime minister regardless of how- keir starmer will become prime i minister regardless of how wales votes~ _ minister regardless of how wales votes~ we — minister regardless of how wales votes~ we can _ minister regardless of how wales votes. we can send _ minister regardless of how wales votes. we can send him - minister regardless of how wales votes. we can send him a - minister regardless of how wales i votes. we can send him a message. one, _ votes. we can send him a message. one. he _ votes. we can send him a message. one. he should _ votes. we can send him a message. one, he should not _ votes. we can send him a message. one, he should not take _ votes. we can send him a message. one, he should not take well- votes. we can send him a message. one, he should not take well for- one, he should not take well for granted — one, he should not take well for granted and. _ one, he should not take well for granted and, two, _ one, he should not take well for granted and, two, we _ one, he should not take well for granted and, two, we are - one, he should not take well for- granted and, two, we are determined to hold _ granted and, two, we are determined to hold hinr _ granted and, two, we are determined to hold hint to— granted and, two, we are determined to hold him to account. _ granted and, two, we are determined to hold him to account. plaid - granted and, two, we are determined to hold him to account. plaid cymru l to hold him to account. plaid cymru would _ to hold him to account. plaid cymru would do _ to hold him to account. plaid cymru would do that— to hold him to account. plaid cymru would do that with _ to hold him to account. plaid cymru would do that with our _ to hold him to account. plaid cymru would do that with our clear- to hold him to account. plaid cymru would do that with our clear and - would do that with our clear and positive — would do that with our clear and positive vision— would do that with our clear and positive vision for— would do that with our clear and positive vision for our— would do that with our clear and positive vision for our country. i positive vision for our country. vote _ positive vision for our country. vote plaid _ positive vision for our country. vote plaid cymru _ positive vision for our country. vote plaid cymru on— positive vision for our country. vote plaid cymru onjuly- positive vision for our country. vote plaid cymru onjuly the l positive vision for our country. i vote plaid cymru onjuly the 4th. david _ vote plaid cymru onjuly the 4th. david tc— vote plaid cymru onjuly the 4th. david tc davies. _ vote plaid cymru onjuly the 4th. david tc davies. we _ vote plaid cymru onjuly the 4th. david tc davies. we should - vote plaid cymru onjuly the 4th.| david tc davies. we should never vote plaid cymru onjuly the 4th. . david tc davies. we should never be afraid to discuss difficult issues and it is important why we should talk about illegal immigration and have a policy to deal with that. i was the first person to raise concerns about trans— ideology in parliament in 2017 and i believe passionately that women have the right to same—sex spaces and people who are physically male should not be competing in sports with women or sharing spaces with them. i dilso sharing spaces with them. i also believe- -- _ sharing spaces with them. i also believe... your _ sharing spaces with them. i also believe... your time _ sharing spaces with them. i also believe... your time is - sharing spaces with them. i also believe... your time is up, - sharing spaces with them. i also| believe... your time is up, thank you very much. oliver lewis. irate you very much. oliver lewis. we fou~ht you very much. oliver lewis. we fought so _ you very much. oliver lewis. we fought so bravely for the right for wonren _ fought so bravely for the right for wonren to— fought so bravely for the right for women to vote in our country and courage — women to vote in our country and courage. courage everywhere. reform respects— courage. courage everywhere. reform respects your intelligence and expects — respects your intelligence and expects you to use your vote wisely. this 4th _ expects you to use your vote wisely. this 4th of _ expects you to use your vote wisely. this 4th ofjuly, our independence day front — this 4th ofjuly, our independence day from the incompetence of the old parties. _ day from the incompetence of the old parties, vote reform uk.— parties, vote reform uk. thank you very much- — parties, vote reform uk. thank you very much- that _ parties, vote reform uk. thank you very much. that is _ parties, vote reform uk. thank you very much. that is it. _ parties, vote reform uk. thank you very much. that is it. thank- parties, vote reform uk. thank you very much. that is it. thank you - parties, vote reform uk. thank you very much. that is it. thank you to l very much. that is it. thank you to our panel tonight and our live audience here. you have been brilliant. and thank you for watching and listening at home. more reaction to tonight was much debate continues now on bbc radio wales and there is a live analysis and fact checking still going on on the bbc world news live page. there is also, as usual, a full list of all the candidates standing in this election on the bbc news website. so, with less than two weeks to now until polling day onjuly less than two weeks to now until polling day on july the less than two weeks to now until polling day onjuly the 4th, the decision is now up to you. have a great weekend, thank you for watching. good night. hello, i'm rajini vaidyanathan. you're watching the context on bbc news. translation: you can't imagine the temperature — translation: you can't imagine the temperature in _ translation: you can't imagine the temperature in our— translation: you can't imagine the temperature in our tent. _ there's been no drought here, there's— there's been no drought here, there's not been any phenomenon that accounts _ there's not been any phenomenon that accounts for _ there's not been any phenomenon that accounts for what we are seeing. it is simply— accounts for what we are seeing. it is simply the war. translation: we need a tremendous effort to reestablish _ translation: we need a tremendous effort to reestablish water _ translation: we need a tremendous effort to reestablish water and - effort to reestablish water and sewer — effort to reestablish water and sewer networks. _ effort to reestablish water and sewer networks. we've - effort to reestablish water and sewer networks. we've lost i effort to reestablish water and i sewer networks. we've lost 200 effort to reestablish water and - sewer networks. we've lost 200 km of pipe which _ sewer networks. we've lost 200 km of pipe which have — sewer networks. we've lost 200 km of pipe which have been— sewer networks. we've lost 200 km of pipe which have been completely - pipe which have been completely destroyed — pipe which have been completely destroyed along _ pipe which have been completely destroyed along with _ pipe which have been completely destroyed along with the - pipe which have been completely destroyed along with the wells . pipe which have been completely i destroyed along with the wells and water— destroyed along with the wells and water tanks — with millions of palestinians living without clean water, proper food, and functioning health care — we have a special report from inside gaza, on the harrowing conditions millions are facing. also tonight — concerns in south korea, as satellite images show that the north is building a wall in several places near the border. and as nigel farage sits down for a half hour interview with the bbc — we'll have the latest, as polls suggest his party, reform uk, are closing in on the conservative party. all that to come shortly — but first, the latest uk election headlines.