of france? as the country prepares to elect a new president bears record levels of apathy and delusion among french voters, a spate of terror attacks has sown in security and has sparked debate. my guest todayis and has sparked debate. my guest today is a writer and public intellectual in the grand french tradition. is france living through an age of decline? pascal, welcome to hardtalk. thank you. we are talking with a french presidential elections very close, does france feel right for the sort of political shock that we've seen in recent times both in the uk over the brexit vote and in the united states with the victory of donald trump in the presidential election? i hope not, with all my heart i hope we won't face the same electoral results that you had with brexit and that the americans had with trump. so we're doing everything to avoid the passage to the far right with marine le pen. but at the present time we have two opposite candidates, marcha nt, time we have two opposite candidates, marchant, a communist and a great admirer of putin, and marine le pen, the head of a former fascist party and a great admirer of putin so it seems putin is pulling the strings in france as he did in the strings in france as he did in the us. my question wasn't so much about the individual candidates or their ideologies but more about the mood about the public, if you were to generalise massively in the uk and the united states, we saw peoples who were angry, they were fea rful peoples who were angry, they were fearful and more than anything else they wanted to send a message, a very powerful message to elite is they believed had betrayed them and left them behind. is that something france has too? yes, it's exactly the same thing in france. people are puzzled, their indecisive and they might bend over the saviour, whether extreme might bend over the saviour, whether extre m e left might bend over the saviour, whether extreme left or extreme right, who could carry out their anger. of course what happened in france, like many other european countries, is the working class went from the communist party to the fry right because the working class felt abandoned by the elites, the leftist elites, and the scenario might reproduce itself in paris in ten daysin reproduce itself in paris in ten days in may. i want to come back to the race and the personalities in it and their ideas later, but i do now wa nt to and their ideas later, but i do now want to put to use something that i find quite shocking and that is in your recent writing about the state of france today, you said that for you one of the two biggest dangers and challenges facing the french republic today is political islam. islamism. are you serious about that? yes, i'm very serious. we have the greatest muslim community in europe, five to 6 million, and the greatestjewish europe, five to 6 million, and the greatest jewish community, so there's strong risks of clashes. we know the muslim brotherhood on one hand, the salafists on the other hand, the salafists on the other hand, try slowly and then constantly to reislamise the muslim population of france and turn it against the republic. it has been said openly by many mouths, many clerics of muslim confessions. i think it is a risk because france is a privileged target. if france swings over and the reislamisation of french muslim citizens it would be a victory for all the fundamentalists. the point is you began by saying we have five to6 is you began by saying we have five to 6 million muslims in france, you then proceeded to talk about a very small minority who take on board the ideas of the political islamists, the salafists, and a very tiny minority of that minority who actually consider or engage in violence. to conflate that with the fa ct violence. to conflate that with the fact you've got five or 6 million muslims in your country is to do something both misleading and possibly very dangerous. no, it's not the fact they are engaged in violence, as you say, it's a minority. there was a poll made last summer minority. there was a poll made last summer about the state of the muslim population in france, they said that 50% of the french muslims consider themselves like ordinary citizens, they practise religion but in private. amongst a very young generation, 28% higher than 30% consider that the sharia should pervade over the republic law and they would like to come back to the early times of the profit. when president francois hollande in the wa ke president francois hollande in the wake of, i can't remember which, but one of the terror attacks in the last couple of years, which have killed over 200 people, they've been terrible, but after one he used the language of a walk. of course he declared a state of emergency, which bill continues in your country, but he talked of a war. the same concept george w bush used in the aftermath of 9/11. -- george w bush used in the aftermath of 9/11. —— deal. do you consider this a war? it is a war because if you go to paris you will see soldiers and policemen everywhere. it isa soldiers and policemen everywhere. it is a kind of low—key war. it's not a war with trenches and tanks. as we know attacks can come out everywhere at any moment of the day. we see this week, last week, in london three weeks ago what can happen, any kind of person can take a car 01’ happen, any kind of person can take a carortakea happen, any kind of person can take a car or take a knife and try to kill as many people as possible. but i'm not afraid. i don't think the issueis i'm not afraid. i don't think the issue is terror. the terrorists won't win, they have no way to transform the population. i think the strategy of the fundamentalists is much more clever. they want to win through predication and persuasion. let me ask you a very blunt question, do you think france has a muslim problem? yes, like most countries in europe. you would use that phrase? i actually picked it up from your book. of course. i think this problem is also, as i said in the book, a symptom. i'm not the only one to say that. are you aware for so many people watching this programme, to talk of a muslim problem is incitement, it represents the sort of inflammatory language that far from the sort of inflammatory language that farfrom in the sort of inflammatory language that far from in gender the sort of inflammatory language that farfrom in gender in the sort of inflammatory language that far from in gender in a thoughtful debate about islamism and security and french identity, actually picked communities against each other and lumps the vast majority of muslims who live ordinary french lives just like you do with those tiny few who have bought into an ideology of violence. it's not the case, i'm not the only one to say there is a muslim problem. most muslim french intellectuals say the same and the problem with islam is islamism, it's integrity, that's why they say to ask us, sometimes in vain, to be aware of what is going on. you know we are very close to algeria and in algeria there was a terrible civil war in1992 algeria there was a terrible civil war in 1992 which caused 200,000 dead people and this could happen again after the death... so yes, there is a danger. would you say you're might most intellectuals agree with you, many don't. a man who has written and studied extensively on islamist extremism in france, he says at root the problem here is a sort of cultist ideology amongst young people, my holistic ideology, which then defines an expression through islam but islamism isn't the root of their psychosis. do you understand what he's saying? yes, but i totally disagree with him. are not the only one, there's one specialist with islam, he speaks... —— i'm not the only one. so does olivier, he has studied 100 case studies in france of young men who were radicalised and took on violent acts. he has studied their lives and their beliefs and this is his conclusion. but the one i'm talking about is a specialist in central asia, afghanistan, pakistan, iran, he's not very familiar with the arabic world, he doesn't speak the language. giles is more aware of the real situation and the risk and what happens in the last few years in europe and france, what is happening every day now in st petersburg, in stockholm, last night in germany, it proves that the optimism, the deliberate optimism of 0livier u nfortu nately deliberate optimism of 0livier unfortunately does not fit and match reality. when you talk of a muslim problem you make those millions of muslims who live in france perfectly peaceably very uncomfortable. but you also seem to question the very notion that in france today there is a worrying strain of islamaphobia. that is there are many people in your country who are now deeply prejudiced against muslims and adopt discriminatory practices against muslims too. do you deny that is a problem? yes, i totally deny it and i'm going to tell you why. i think france offers to the muslim population a unique chance in europe. the chance to be... to adopt certain religious indifference. the chance to believe and not to believe. that's exactly what france offers to muslims and that is why the fundamentalists have such a violent reaction because they're very afraid to see off those people from the slim origin coming from algeria, morocco, tunisia or sub—saharan africa, algeria, morocco, tunisia or sub—sa ha ran africa, little algeria, morocco, tunisia or sub—saharan africa, little by little abandoning their ritual, ramadan, their religious practices and become ordinary believers like we have ordinary believers like we have ordinary christians orjews who go to the mass sometimes, who do religious feats, but don't care about religion. mr brukner, you are, i called giraldo grand public intellectual, you write in paris, you have a comfortable life. how can you have a comfortable life. how can you tell me islamaphobia doesn't exist? put yourself for one minute in the position of a poor second generation north african immigrant living in a poor town who has no chance of a job and we know from the official statistics it is much harder to get a job if you have an arabic name than a true difficult —— traditional french name. put yourself in those shoes. don't call it islam afobe, called it races, this is a real word. what i don't like with the word islamaphobia, it blends two different meanings, the believers, a crime in every country, and the criticism of a religion and criticising religion is a human fundamental right and so those people are not being harassed or discriminated against because they are muslim but because they come from margareta, africa, asia stoppila sunzu make religion is the key from all these problems. forgive me but you are the man who talks about the muslim problem, so perhaps you are at the root of this issue yourself. let me quote you perhaps a significant boys around the world, thatis significant boys around the world, that is the un secretary general who just the other week said one of the things that fuels terrorism is the expression in some parts of the world of islamophobic feelings and islamophobic policies and islamophobic policies and islamophobic hate speech. he has no doubt that there is such a thing as islam afobe. i use this quote and it puts everything upside down. why has islamaphobia started at the first step? because there were all those terror attacks during the last 20 yea rs. terror attacks during the last 20 years. the terrorists have generated hatred of their own religion. they have generated islamaphobia, the hatred of islam, which, by the way, in france is not so strong because the statistic of the last two years made by the human rights commission show that the amount of intime islam a cts show that the amount of intime islam acts have considerably decreased by 60% -- acts have considerably decreased by 60% —— anti— islam. acts have considerably decreased by 60% -- anti- islam. there is the glass half full opinion but the glass half full opinion but the glass half full opinion but the glass half empty is that there are still every year scores, getting onto the hundreds of attacks, specific attacks, on muslims because their muslim in france. i'm sorry, first you have to understand, first we had two horrible terrorist attacks, on charlie hebdo, and in nice. if the people reacted after charlie hebdo, the french behaved in a very civilised way. there were no pogroms, no mosques burned, no one has been killed. who has been killed in the last year injuly? a catholic priest because he was catholic by radical islamistss. we should not put everything upside down. i think the french have taken a very decent and civilised way, if you compare them with the americans after 9/11. why are you, so, it seems, lacking in self—confidence when you think about france today? you seem to think there's a real problem because you claim voices like yours are being censored, gagged, because it's become politically incorrect to say what you say about muslims and islamaphobia. but in fact you have a fantastic platform. you are on french tv all the time. everyone reads your articles and listens to you on the radio. in france today, there is a debate, and you are a pa rt there is a debate, and you are a part of it, so why do you argue that you are being censored? i'm not saying i am censored because i'm not muslim. for me, it's easy to speak, but those censored are muslim intellectuals, women, ladies coming from the maghreb, and an algerian intellectual who is now the object ofa intellectual who is now the object of a fatwa in his own country. sensal. even young writers like sonia mabrouk are called islamaphobic. she put raise a young muslim woman who refuses to wear the islamic scarf. sure, i dare say people threaten her, but people also threaten those who go onto a beach wearing a so—called burkini. you've called that a racist uniform, and some have concluded from your words about racist uniforms that you want to make muslims invisible in france today. two answers. first i didn't say it was a racist uniform, i said it was a provocative uniform. i'm not against the burkini. as they said, it was not a problem. the only question i'm asking to myself — in two months, the beaches will be open with the beginning of summer. with winning in burkini. will they admit besides them women in burkinis, topless, or naked? as you know, in france we admit nudist portions of beaches. will they tolerate this women in burkinis are so if the women in burkinis are tolera nt to so if the women in burkinis are tolerant to the women that are naked, we are living in the best of all worlds. another question. women have to wear the burkini. why don't men wear burkini? why is it a 1-way road? why do men not have to wear burkinis and islamic scarves? what's the reason for that? let me tell you something. the first time i got into a conversation about burkinis and beachwear in france, it was with marine le pen, and it strikes me that, although you come from a different political tradition from marine le pen, right now, with your focus on the muslim problem, with what you say is this illusion of islamaphobia, your focus on what people wear — you are on the same platform in france today as marine le pen. you know, in the 30s, when people said that the soviet union was not a paradise, there were concentration camps, people said, don't say that, because you are speaking the language of the imperialist. and so your argument does not go with me. does it make you in any uneasy? not at all. that you in any uneasy? not at all. that you and marine le pen sound remarkably similar. me and marine le pen, and a list of progressive french islamic intellectuals, and many others, refused to be directed by islamic fundamentalists. it's not because marine le pen — she's not lying if she says it's raining. so this kind of rapprochement is normal. it is a game. but it doesn't dissuade me to think like i think, because i've been saying that for 30 yea rs. because i've been saying that for 30 years. let's raise our eyes to a wider horizons than islam and muslims and that aspect of french culture and identity. let's think of france in the biggest perspective. there was a bestselling book by another philosopher not so very long ago called decadence — the life and death of the judaeo—christian tradition. it started a tradition of writing about france, called declisme, that idea that france is ona declisme, that idea that france is on a downward trajectory. do you feel that? it on a downward trajectory. do you feelthat? it might on a downward trajectory. do you feel that? it might be a self—fulfilling prophecy. if you say you are in decline, you might really be in decline. but, no, ithink you are in decline, you might really be in decline. but, no, i think of course we have many symptoms of decline, and french people are fearing everything — europe, immigration, radical islam... and you are part of that fear creation, are you not? no, i'm not coming because i say we have to face that problem. and we have ways to absorb five — 6 million or more muslims, and turn them into ordinary french civilians. let's be proud of our traditions. that's what i say in my book. i'm not against islam, i'm against fanaticism, which we've seen with catholics and protestants. how does france get its mojo back. with a real leader. you voted for sarkozy in 07, you voted for hollande, and you renounce both of them. most of the votes in france are negative votes, but after all england voted also for brexit. we will see in the future if it was a mistake or a benefit. but i think france needs to restore the authority of the state, because there is no authority. there is no pilot of the plane. when you walk in the cities of france, you don't feel the authority of the state. we need some new... someone young, new, and capable of giving a project to this country which is doubting deeply of itself. young and new. that, i guess, points you in the direction of emmanuel macron. well, he is the only one who is available today, and he is not so bad. and of course he blends a kind of republican tradition and the anglo—saxon tradition also. free enterprise, free—market, and i think france has too many nostalgias over communism all state directed economy. ijust wonder communism all state directed economy. i just wonder whether in pa rt economy. i just wonder whether in part it's a loss of self—confidence in france being a major part it's a loss of self—confidence in franc partlyj a major part it's a loss of self—confidence in franc partly in major part it's a loss of self—confidence in franc partly in ideas. i talked at player? partly in ideas. i talked at the beginning about the grand tradition of the french public intellectual. maybe you are part of this lack of self—confidence today in france. i'd be sorry ifi this lack of self—confidence today in france. i'd be sorry if i were, because most of my books — i tried to give back confidence to my fellow citizens. i suppose the question is, do you feel the world still listens to france? in fact yes and no. i think france has lost a privileged position after 1989 when it was a kind of third party between the united states and the ussr, and then france hoped that europe would follow the french model. in fact it didn't work because the french model now is out warned, it's finished. we have to change it. even with very good intentions. so we need renewal, andi good intentions. so we need renewal, and i hope the young generation will do something to wake this old country, which is plagued by all kinds of evil is — lack of self—confidence and self—hatred, which is, in my opinion, the worst feeling. awakening the gaelic giant. that's what we must look to. but for now, we have two end this interview. it's finished? too bad. pascal bruckner, thank you for sharing your thoughts. hello there. the weather may provide something of a shock to the system early this tuesday morning because temperatures have been dropping away. a cold and frosty start to the day, but after that chilly start, there are plenty of sunny spells on the way. high pressure firmly in charge of our weather at the moment, giving us largely dry conditions, and behind this weather front, the cloud has been clearing. and underneath those clear skies, temperatures have been dropping. many areas, particularly out in the countryside, starting the day below freezing. but, as i mentioned, after that chilly start, we will see plenty of spells of sunshine. a little bit breezy down towards the south—east, so that will make it feel particularly chilly, and as we go on through the day, cloud will gradually increase from the west, so the sunshine will turn increasingly hazy. in fact, by the end of the afternoon, i think the skies will be largely grey across northern ireland and the western side of scotland, maybe even the odd splash of rain into the western isles. but for shetland, for 0rkney, for eastern and southern scotland, we should hold onto some hazy sunshine, just seven degrees in aberdeen, eight or nine in edinburgh and glasgow. and with some high cloud spreading across northern england down into wales, again the sunshine here will turn a little bit hazy through the afternoon. 11 degrees there in aberystwyth. fairly light winds across wales. light winds too across the south—west. maybe 13 with a bit of shelter there in plymouth. some patchy cloud across the midlands. east anglia and the south—east should keep plenty of sunshine but pretty cool, now, as we go on through the night into wednesday morning, england and wales where we keep clear skies will turn very cold again, a widespread frost. not as cold for northern ireland and scotland because here we'll have more cloud and some outbreaks of patchy rain courtesy of this very weak weather front just sinking its way into the picture. but behind that front we start to bring in more of a westerly wind, so won't be as chilly across scotland and northern ireland on wednesday. some extra cloud also sinking into northern england, but through the midlands, south wales, down into southern england, here the best of the sunshine, 1a degrees the top temperature there in london. temperatures in the south particularly could rise further on thursday and friday. there'll be some further spells of sunshine. generally a fair amount of cloud around by this stage. so, to sum up this week, we'll see very little rain, it will be mostly dry. the days will be turning warmer, although some of the nights will continue to be frosty. but then by the end of the week and into the weekend, well, it looks like cold air will return from the north, so those temperatures will drop. quite a chilly feel, i suspect, by the coming weekend. welcome to bbc news, broadcasting to viewers in north america and around the globe. my name's mike embley. our top stories. a warning from pyongyang. north korea tells the bbc it's ready for war if america launches an attack. translation: if the us is reckless enough to use military means it would mean, from that very day, an all—out war. donald trump telephones turkey's president erdogan to congratulate him on his victory in sunday's referendum, despite criticism of the poll from international observers. facebook orders a review after video of a man being shot dead was posted on—line. police are still hunting the killer. and as the french presidential election enters its final stages, we take a closer look at the far—left candidate who may yet cause a surprise.