reporting, that the former president and a small group of allies were deadly serious about overthrowing the results of a free and fair election. and we know that most of their schemes were both at once dangerous and absurd. there is still one remaining question which is how close were they to succeeding? and this is been the subject of quite some debate. contrary to some folks out there, and i've read a lot along these lines, who argue that the whole thing was preposterous. doomed to fail from the beginning. there was also, it's the intimidation tactics against global officials, donald trump and his allies settled on a brazen anti-democratic strategy that the rest of unjust in one person. and here's the thing. it could've worked. what they wanted, but they settled on was for vice president mike pence to essentially throw out the electors in case states over entirely fabricated bogus claims of fraud and irregularity. but how done that, it cannot be overstated how dangerous and unprecedented that would've been. and anyone who says that they know for sure what would've happened next is wrong. it almost certainly would've precipitated if -- because there would not be no real blueprint at that point. there is no precedent, it never happened. now, maybe the senate would've come together across party lines to try to rectify the situation but that is not guaranteed. especially with the senate. it might have probably and would've ended up in the supreme court. the court would've history a different of the ruling as they didn't push before. but there's no telling which candidate these six three court would've supported. it is also entirely possible that the court would've said, look, this is not judicial. it is fundamentally a political question and we are seeing out of it. in which case we'd be back to square one. all of which is a long way of saying, it would be a catastrophic mess with no clear path for a reason or answers. ultimately, mike pence did not throw out the electors. and this nightmare scenario did not play out. but the pressure campaign on pence to play along with this scheme was enormous. it started with donald trump in self who would tell everybody. this is from january 4th rally in georgia. >> i hope that mike pence comes through for us. i have to tell you. [applause] >> i hope that our great vice president comes through for us. he's a great guy. of course, if he doesn't come through, i won't like him quite as much. now mike is a great guy. >> it would be terrible if something happened to. it the day after those comments, january 5th, pence reportedly told trump that he did not have the power to block the certification of the election. undeterred, trump just pretended pence was on the side anyway. that same night, that same night after trump reportedly said that i am not doing this, trump orders the white house to release a statement. reading in part, quote, the vice president and i are in total agreement that the vice president has the power to act. think about the pressure that puts on mike pence that just told him, i can't do it. pence also fig pressure from trump's allies in the coup attend like rudy giuliani and of course coup architectures john eastman. and from the president chief of staff, mark meadows. who would forward coup plans to pence's office. as well as from unlikely sources like the presidents economic adviser, peter navarro, who we know now was directed by trump at least according to navarro. even came up with a cute little name for the coupon. the greenpeace weep. on the day of the insurrection, trump called out pence multiple times in his speech at the ellipse saying, if he does not act, quote, it would be a sad day for the country. and then after pence doesn't do it, after he doesn't do it, mob entering the capitol, goes on to tweet that the courage to do what we should protect the country in the constitution. it is hard to pin down if the crowd was chanting, hang mike pence at exactly the same moment at that tweet. but they're pretty contemporary. all of this to say nothing of course of the liberal angry mob of insurrectionists who stormed the capital to hang mike pence. hoping to use the threat of violent and death against the vice president. now, with hindsight we know that contributes to cooperate. but in the moments leading up to january six, one year ago at this moment on the evening of january 5th, it was a real question. whether or not he would throughout the results of a democratic election to help along a. and it was a question for a number of reasons, first, because it is worth remembering who mike pence. is this is a man who understood his assignment from the day he was at the ticket to be the most sick sick offense. it was itself a difficult challenge. to always be the last yes men in the room. in fact, pence image in the public was widely seen as nothing more than trump's trophy. so there was a reason a lot of concern he was simply refused to declined a direct order from his boss like that. secondly, as we mentioned there was no telling what would happen next. presumably, pence wanted to stay vice president. there was an opportunity that might very well have allowed into. we now know from reporting that pence wanted to get to -- our at least he was going around looking for a us. as bob woodward and robert costa report in peril, pence axed dan quayle for advice. and according to the reporting in the book, pence poked and prodded quayle for a way in which he could go along with the presidents plan. quayle was unequivocal. quote, mike you have no flexibility on this. none. zero. forget it. put it away. pence also reached out to legal scholar, michael leduc, who is a big deal in the conservative world. and he similarly told mike pence that the was unconstitutional. add to pence's own chief of staff who came to the same conclusion that one man, the obvious conclusion, could not unilaterally overturn an election disenfranchising 80 plus million voters. and to be clear here, and i think it's probably already clear, quayle, michael luttig, i think they already have pretty clear politics. they've all named a lot of terrible policies. actively made the country worse place. pence especially deserves enduring infamy for politely overseeing one of the most destructive presidencies in my lifetime and making it on and apologizing for it and vouching for it. but in this one instance, i think that these men, pence among them, deserve credit for doing the right thing. there was enormous pressure to cast this country and the constitutional crisis and they refused. i thought back to the book, the things they carry. and in his book, bryan writes about peer pressure and shame in the context of war in the battlefield. he writes, quote, men killed and died because they were embarrassed not to. it was what had brought them to the war in the first place, nothing positive, no dreams of glory or on, or just to avoid the blush of dishonor. and that phrase has stuck with me over the decades since i first read it. the blush of dishonor. because that mentality can translate over to many others of life experiences. a desire to not disappoint your peers. neither your team. to not appear cowardly or unwilling to fight. that can motivate people to do things that the otherwise would not. it is worth considering what you yourself would do in pence's situation. when the eyes of the entire country are watching and waiting for you to make a decision that you know deep down is wrong. i mean, historically unprecedented wrong. could render the country into. and it includes the man that you served for the past four years. the man who episode be the most powerful figure on the face of the earth. known for his demand of complete loyalty. and refused traders. essentially hold your political future in his hands. and that is not even including with the decision would be for your family, what type of danger could put them in. indeed trump came out swinging against pence immediately. and pence's approval rating among republicans dropped significantly. following the events of the sick. ending and never recovered. again, there is so much to criticize mike pence for. we have done it on the show. but one year later, i think he deserves credit for having, in this moment, the courage to do the right thing. we also know now, pence even refused to flee the capitol as the rioters were calling for his execution. as a former chief of staff tells it, he did not want to be seen as handing a victory to the hanging -- angry mob. >> a couple different times they asked to evacuate the capitol. but the vice president -- >> he did not want to go? >> yes, he said he wasn't leaving. and the reason why was because he did not want to adversaries across the globe see all of them flee the capital. i was also proud to be with the vice president because he did all this leadership under enormous pressure. and i think he, again, had to fight efforts to evacuate. i don't want a visual for the world to see. >> so, yes pence did the right thing. the most important takeaway here is that the entire venture indian rested on one guy making the right call. that is how close we care. this idea that the coup attempt did not come that close and the plan was obviously doomed to failure is preposterous. it's just flat wrong. pence justice was easily agreed to play along and no one knows what happens next. rick austin is at used in irvine. he's the professor and the author of the upcoming book chief speech. and he is an expert on election law and who has been thinking and writing about these issues for a long time and he joins me now. professor rick hasen, first, as someone who is far more steeped in the law here, i wonder if you feel the same way. if pence buckles to trump and declares that certain slates of electors are ruled out of order or that he says from the view of the chair that he's competing slate electors. that the roadmap past that point is unclear. is that your feeling to? >> chris, i have to say. just listening to your opening my heart is racing because it's reminding me what's things were like a year ago. i think you're absolutely right. we don't know. it is uncharted territory. i think one of the mistakes that i made and that others made was assuming that more people would follow the rule of law. of course mike pence wouldn't say that he had unilateral authority to throughout electoral college votes. or to delay the certification of elections. but we learned one we saw all of those republican members of congress who voted to subpoena objections to the vote counts in arizona of pennsylvania is that the law doesn't matter if people are lawless. and it really does take people of integrity in order to keep us from plunging into a constitutional and political crisis. >> right. because you're if you're out past the frontiers of the law, but you are doing it extensively into the color of, law this is what i think is so dangerous and a sort of misunderstood at this moment. yes, it was in the tanks that rolled through the streets and the opposition was locked away. what it was was the thinnest possible predicate of some lawful action undertaken by a -- with people with widely lawful aspirations. they were trying to go ahead and do though there was no guide that if you get far enough it would be told. >> that's right. and this is why also worried about 2024. we depended on brian kemp, dan quayle, mike pence, brad raffensperger. these are the republicans who saved our democracy. and those people, for the most, part are not going to be complacent in 2024. and if you have people who are not willing to abide by the rule of law, what is that going to look like? what if kevin mccarthy is speaker of the house? and bogus competing electors committed? really, how much can lock be determined if you're willing to just use the veneer of law to accomplish political ends? it's a kind of bloodless coup. >> i want to read michael luttig, a very revered figure in concern for the legal figures. he left a job for the private sector. he said this to abc news, had the supreme court refused to decide these issues, which might have been likely, the country and our democracy would've spiraled into a chaos and which neither would have recovered literally jeopardizing our national security. legitimacy of our democracy would've been forever drawn in doubt and lost it could've never been distort. now that you've got the situation in which the fence has been tested for its weaknesses, again, on the sort of technical matters, what you do to reinforce them is -- you just have the idea state legislators just getting in saying. they say that arizona is going to send its electors for donald trump without its voters. there is so much room, more room than they even got to the last time around. >> right. what i think we're talking about now is making both legal changes and political changes. certainly, you need to fix the electoral count act. the law that governs the mechanics of how we have congress counts, certify those electoral college votes. but if law is not going to be folded to term, we need political action. we need a coalition of people, democrats, republicans, independents, who believe in the rule of law. who take it at the very basic bottom principle that the winner of the election should be the person who got the most votes. and we have to form a coalition around that and work to strengthen civil society. if there are attempts to try and steer election in the future, we are going to get that. because law alone is not going to say this. >> i think that the other lesson, which is adjacent to that, and maybe this isn't overly psychological explanation for the facts that we have, is that these peer affect matters and the people that you talk to matter. when you go and consult them, their integrity and their acculturated sense of the rule of law and that being very important. which is that dan claire and michael luttig are saying, are you out of your mind? can you do this? >> yes. and there were many trump appointed federal judges who said the same thing. -- but when you replace brad raffensperger with jody heist, then? what are we going to accept the results of an election when the person running the election is someone who embraces the big lie that the election was stolen? and then what is this going to do to legitimacy of trump actually wins the election if he runs again? >> this is the last question. it is a really under considered one too. because it's a two-way door. this legitimacy genie is out of the bottle. very hard to stuff back in. and i worry about it in both directions actually. that's a very good point and worth meditating on. rick hasen, thank you very much. >> thanks. >> on the eve of the anniversary of one of the worst attacks on the democracy, capitol police officers who faced down the violent mob are again demanding full accountability. harry dunn, and clean o'donnell have been vocal and public in those. fights only the whole truth made public. next, our interview with officer harry dunn, about life one year later. and what still needs to be done. don't go anywhere. n't go anywhere. n. 24-hour hydration. no parabens, dyes, or fragrances. gold bond. champion your skin. do you struggle to fall asleep and stay asleep? qunol sleep formula combines 5 key nutrients that can help you fall asleep faster, stay asleep longer, and wake up refreshed. the brand i trust is qunol. i'm jonathan lawson here to tell you about life insurance through the colonial penn program. if you're age 50 to 85, and looking to buy life insurance on a fixed budget, remember the three ps. what are the three ps? the three ps of life insurance on a fixed budget are price, price, and price. a price you can afford, a price that can't increase, and a price that fits your budget. i'm 54, what's my price? you can get coverage for $9.95 a month. i'm 65 and take medications. what's my price? also $9.95 a month. i just turned 80, what's my price? $9.95 a month for you too. if you're age 50 to 85, call now about the #1 most popular whole life insurance plan available through the colonial penn program. it has an affordable rate starting at $9.95 a month. no medical exam, no health questions. your acceptance is guaranteed. and this plan has a guaranteed lifetime rate lock so your rate can never go up for any reason. so call now for free information and you'll also get this free beneficiary planner. and it's yours free just for calling. so call now for free information. harry dunn is a 14 year veteran for the u.s. capital. you grew up in the d.c. suburbs and county maryland. he joined the capitol police force after graduating with a masters degree from james university. and on january six, 2021, he was posted at the east front the capital building. on the steps leading, as rioters speaking obstructing the building, he aided the officers on the other side. he was defending in the air where officers were recovering from irritants. in fact, he helped carry rosen boyland, one of the rioters who lost conscious during the riot. in the first hearing held by the first committee investigating january six, dunn was one of four officers to testify. his testimony was a credible and powerful. >> one woman in a pink shirt yelled, you hear that guys? these -- voted for joe biden. in the crowd, perhaps around 20 people joined in screaming boo. no one had ever, ever, called me a. while wearing a uniform of a police officer. i used the analogy of what i wanted as a hitmen. when the hitmen is hired any killed but, i have my goes to joe. not only does the hitmen go to jail but the person who hired him does. it was an attack carried out on january six. and a hit man sent them. i want you to get to the bottom of that. >> this, week harry dunn and his colleague were removing an opinion piece from the washington post titled, the government we defended last january six has a duty to hold all perpetrators accountable. the writer says, it happened a year ago but it feels like yesterday. because for the two of us, together with many other officers defending the capitol on january six, from a violent mob of insurrectionists, the wounds from that horrific day persist. both of us continue to trans post-traumatic stress. even more painful, though, is a shocking effort by the former president and including members of congress who we protected from violent setting to whitewash what happened. we urge the justice department not only to bring appropriate prosecution for those who defied subpoenas, but also to fully about the gate whether additional people including the former government officials should be held criminally liable for the attack on the capitol. joining me now is u.s. capitol police officer harry dunn. officer, it's great to have you. thank you for joining me. i know that you are speaking to me tonight in your personal capacity. not in any spokesperson capacity. so let me just ask first in your personal capacity, how you are doing. how your day today life in your job and genuinely are going. >> thanks for having me on, i appreciate the opportunity to tell my story about what happened. how am i doing. like i said, the calendar says a year ago. everyone keeps referring to january six tomorrow as the anniversary of what happened. there hasn't really been an end to january six. so tomorrow seems like just another day. i don't believe that you can have to healings regarding any kind of incident until there is full accountability about what happened. and there hasn't been accountability fully yet. there have been a couple of sentences that have happened, on accountability and the way i see it. you cannot field until there's accountability. we're still suffering, i'm still suffering. but i am doing a lot better than i was in january 7th. >> do you feel -- i guess she said never ended. but do you feel the presence of it in the holding. does it loom there in that structure where this happened? >> i mean if you're asking if i'm having flashbacks or violent memories, no, not really. but you are constantly reminded about what you went through that day. i, mean you walk through that building and you are reminded of the situation. even just watching the news, when you see a news clip or news subpoena or new text message release, you cannot really stay january six. fortunately i'm not trying to. whatever i can do to see that accountability is served and has been hand because i believe that would bring it about truly. >> what is accountability mean for you? >> understanding the full picture of what would happen. it is easy to interpret them talking about specifically just the former president. anybody who has contributed to the downfall of that they, the planners, not just the people who carried out the attack on us. but the people planted. the people who had everything to do with making it. on encouraging it, covering it up, anybody who had anything to do with the failure of that day, that dark day, they need to be held accountable. i don't necessarily feel like it's my job to talk about sentences and all of that stuff but we are painting a public picture about would have been. i will just lay all the facts out and then will go from there. there is so much that that we do not know. let's just think about the things that we know now, think about what we did know last january six. think about what we know about january seven 2023. there's just so much stuff that needs to come out. and that's why i'm pushing for all the facts to come. oh wherever they lead. >> in terms of that, one of the things that i found from my position from reporting it, and not being you having gone through it, there seems to have been at least after the crowd was cleared and in the wall that night, and in the days after, a consistent. a pretty broad consensus. that this was horrific. it was unprecedented. it was an american. that it must never be allowed to happen again. and we watched over the past year because of political actors, undoing that consensus. and i wonder what it's like for you to watch that consensus being undone over the course of the years. from what it was a year ago to now. >> the truth is on my side. i can't describe or think about would have been that they. the actual rioters recorded it and posted it themselves they were proud of what they did, so there's no way that anybody can say anything otherwise. everybody who says it's whitewashing is just flat out lying. it is what it is. the truth is on my side. as far as the people that are whitewashing it, it just gets me frustrated even to think about it. that is why it's very important for all the facts to come out, so accountability justice can be served. >> i want to play for you, fact finding that the select committee has won. the select committee is another. they have overseen the prosecution of 700 plus individuals who are actually in that capital. and today the attorney general, merrick garland gave a speech about that. and i just want to play you a little bit of what he said and get your reaction to it. here's what he had to say. >> those who assaulted officers or damage to the capital face greater charges. those who conspired with others to obstruct the vote count also face greater charges. those who did not undertake such conduct have been charged with lesser offenses. particularly if the accepted their responsibility early, and cooperated with the investigation. >> what's your reaction to that? >> i mean, it's encouraging. in the society that we live in everybody wants instant justice, right? and from what happened yesterday it needs to be resolved today. unfortunately that's not how investigations go. i am not any part of the justice department, i'm a police officer. and i'm just going to do my job. and i'm glad that the justice department is doing theirs. like i said, i just urge them to do their job while i continue to do mine. >> all right, officer harry dunn. i really appreciate you making time tonight. be well. thank you very much. >> thank you for having me, have a good day. >> you too. next, he was a reporter in the gallery as the violent mob tried to stop the peaceful transfer of power. tonight, he's got a gripping new report about how shocking little has changed when year later. and while the real tragedy of that day is still not over. matt fuller of the daily beast joins me next. joins me next. why choose proven quality sleep from sleep number? because my sleep number 360 smart bed is temperature balancing so i stay cool. and senses my movement and effortlessly adjusts to help keep me comfortable. learned a lesson in anyway. the sleep number 360 smart bed is on sale now. only from sleep number. they are very much committed to this course of action, even more so today. >> i'm part of the reason for that, to show the favorability ratings. this is really the key to it. the favor -- donald trump compared to compare to pence, over the last year,. you know, they sided with him. he drove a wedge, and ended up with a bigger chunk, on his side. his favorability is extremely high, and mcconnell is underwater, with republicans. pence is much lower than his. which brings us to kevin mccarthy, who knows this, and nbc news just said he won't be -- just a commemoration that was planned. i have to interpret that is a tacit explicit symbol to trump. like, i'm down with you, dude. >> yeah, absolutely. kevin mccarthy, he made his one small stand on the night of january 6th. ever since then he's bent over backwards and service to trump. he's made that his cause. he's tied his entire political being to donald trump, at this point. he understands that he can't piss off trump. he's going to play this as closely to donald trump as possible. part of that is not -- i don't want to say -- recognizing the threat that was. recognizing the threat and the trauma that it did to capitol hill. >> all right, matt fuller, as always, thanks. >> appreciate it. >> earlier today, attorney general merrick garland gave an update on the investigation on january 6th. seeming to address critics -- when he said about those charges, yet to come, after this. on the eve of the anniversary january 6th, the worst attack on american democracy arguably since the civil war. the top law enforcement officer of the united states delivered the speech marking this moment. attorney general, merrick garland noted the progress made over the past year by nearly 150 prosecutors around the country in bringing justice to the perpetrators of the insurrection. he said that the department of justice has issued over 5000 subpoenas and search warrants. seized 2000 devices, unexamined footage over 15 to the rights of data. the investigation which he called the most largest and complex in history, hustle resorted into 755 defendants over 325 of whom have been charged with felonies. the attorney general promised that the work would continue until all of those responsible are held accountable. >> the actions we can thus far make will not be our last. the justice department remains committed to holding all january six perpetrators at any level accountable under law whether they were president that day or were otherwise criminally responsible for the assault on our democracy. we will follow the facts wherever they lead. >> also interestingly, back the political gamble before january six, watergate. he reflected on how the lessons from that investigation informed their work today in a political environment filled with partisanship. >> over 40 years ago, the wake of the watergate scandal, the justice department concluded that the best way to ensure that the department at independence, integrity and a fair application of our laws, and therefore the best ways to ensure that the health of our democracy is to have a set of norms to govern our work. the central norm is that in our criminal investigations, there cannot be different rules depending on one political party or affiliation. there cannot be different rules for friends and foes. and there cannot be different rules for the powerful and the powerless. >> attorney general concluded with a warning about the other ways their democracy has been under attack. all the time, not just on the six. we often refer to this as a slow motion insurrection and the encouraging and devoted rights to american democracy. >> the protection of the voting rights act have been drastically weakened. there has been a dramatic increase in legislative enactments that make it harder for millions of eligible voters to vote and to elect representatives of their own choosing. the department of justice will continue to do all it can to protect voting rights with the enforcement powers that we have. it is essential that congress act to give the department the powers that we need to ensure that every eligible voter can cast a vote that count. >> so on this eve of the somber and of or surrey of january six, what is next in the justice department investigation and what new evidence is come to light, that is next. light, that is next. i'm jonathan lawson here to tell you about life insurance through the colonial penn program. if you're age 50 to 85, and looking to buy life insurance on a fixed budget, remember the three ps. what are the three ps? the three ps of life insurance on a fixed budget are price, price, and price. a price you can afford, a price that can't increase, and a price that fits your budget. i'm 54, what's my price? you can get coverage for $9.95 a month. i'm 65 and take medications. what's my price? also $9.95 a month. i just turned 80, what's my price? $9.95 a month for you too. if you're age 50 to 85, call now about the #1 most popular whole life insurance plan available through the colonial penn program. it has an affordable rate starting at $9.95 a month. no medical exam, no health questions. your acceptance is guaranteed. and this plan has a guaranteed lifetime rate lock so your rate can never go up for any reason. so call now for free information and you'll also get this free beneficiary planner. and it's yours free just for calling. so call now for free information. this is elodia. she's a recording artist. 1 of 10 million people that comcast has connected to affordable internet in the last 10 years. and this is emmanuel, a future recording artist, and one of the millions of students we're connecting throughout the next 10. through projectup, comcast is committing $1 billion so millions more students, past... and present, can continue to get the tools they need to build a future of unlimited possibilities. playback! ♪ woo ♪ the feel great hit of the holidays is still in theaters. ♪ yeah. yeah. yeah. yeah. ♪ yeah. and on friday, you watch at home too. time to show the world what we're made of. activating "piggy power." today in an address marking the anniversary of the attack on the capitol, attorney general merrick garland attempted to answer some of his critics who are upset over the lack of charges for the organizers of the attempted coup. he pointed out that there have been hundreds of charges filed against a low level flood shoulders. those who stormed the capitol. the house select committee investigating the attack is now floating the idea of televised hearings in primetime against prominent figures that they have called to testify. zoe tillman is a reporter for buzzfeed news. yeah glenn kirschner, has spent time in the u.s. attorney's office as a prosecutor. and let me go to you, someone who has spent so much time in the office in overseeing these cases, glenn, your reaction to the speech today. >> i think merrick garland speech was a little bit more forward-leaning than i had expected. i was hoping that we weren't just going to hear more about how the department of justice would follow the facts and follow the law wherever it leads. that is nothing more than seeing the prosecutors with agreed and followed by agreeing. now what he said was that the department of justice is determined to hold all january six perpetrators accountable. his words at any level. and then he had it, whether they were at the capitol or not or otherwise were criminally responsible. that is frankly what i had been waiting to hear because that conjures up notion of, you know, lawyers like jeffrey clark who are offering arguably seditious letters to state election officials giving them a blueprint to undermine joe biden's win. and lawyers like john eastman issuing and drafting memos. basically had a coup for fun and profit. it also conjures up that the people who were part of the workaround are only enjoying the cushy environment of the hotel while they were plotting democracies demise. and of course people in the oval office. so i was really pleased to hear attorney general garland reinforce that they are going to be focusing on and holding accountable people at any level whether president at the capitol or not. so much just more than donald trump's foot soldiers of the insurrection, but the powerful. not just the pilots. >> i agree. that is exactly my read in that speech that it is exactly about where i thought, except for those few moments. which is obviously a very closely watched speech in terms of what's the put input out. and i wanted to get your reaction, zoe, because you are among a small group of reporters who really have been on this speed at the ground level. in terms of out the department of justice has gone about these cases of the people that have been arrested. what is your take away from this? >> you know, i agree with glenn that they need to send a stronger message than we've seen from the department with the potential reach of the investigation. i do think that this meantime it was meant for expectations. he tried to walk through the steps of a normal investigation and the message seemed to be that if you want norms restored to the justice department, you need to sit tight and we. and that it's start small and it builds up from there. and you know, so far we haven't seen any indication that we're going after some of the boldface names or the bigger fish that glenn kirschner was talking about. so we haven't seen any public investigatory steps. steps that they're looking at pursuing charges against those type of people. so we know it's on the calendar in the cases. we know that we can expect to see a lot more plea deals in the small misdemeanor level cases. it will be more of the same for sometime. but the big question is really looking ahead and selling plea deals who created more serious crimes like assaulting the police, obstruction, conspiracy. we have trials on the calendar for the first time in 2022. so there are some major steps coming up in the prosecution efforts. i think that midway to some of the much bigger potential steps that the attorney general alluded to that aren't quite there yet. >> yes, the quote was that we build investigations without laying a foundation. we resolve more straightforward cases first because the provide the evidentiary foundation for more complex cases. glenn, let me ask you about the other criticism that has come in. and this has come from actually a number of federal judges. is the severity of punishment being requested by the government in some of these cases? this was a political article of the 70 plus people who have been sentence and seen prison time for among those defendants. there is stints in prison are someone. brief immediate prison sentence today to 45 days. i think the department of justice, as garland, said in that clip that i played for harry dunn is making a distinction. which is making a justified. one which is thinking and making people who trespassed -- and those who plan resulted people. but i wonder what you think of the sort of effort so far at the ground level. >> these are my friends and my former colleagues at the u.s. attorney's office with the district of columbia where i work for decades. i know the people who are working this case. i know how much time energy and effort they are pouring into. and i think that merrick garland did the best that he could do in explaining why there are so many seemingly life sentences. because these don't feel like protesting cases. but the fact of the matter is that in my experience, no matter what prosecutorial decision you make, somebody is always going to criticize it as being too harsh, too light not exactly like that. the reality is this when you have 750 defendants that streams this is stuff. it's going to department of justice, it's changed the ports. and so the prosecutors have to look at every case in isolation not as part of some big angry mob. and say what does this person deserved. does this person deserve to go to prison? does this person deserved probation? these are really difficult calls to make. but when merrick garland said that you should inspect to see lower sentences early on, this sentences will ratchet up as we tackle the more serious cases and is quote was this is purposeful. they are building from the ground up which is the way that we make these cases. >> and is always point, we will see that trial, will be looking into. that so we, will have you back on to talk about as we get closer. zoe tillman and glenn kirschner, thank you both. >> that is all in on tonight. now time for the rachel maddow show. >> thanks to at-home for joining us this hour, senator chuck schumer, the leader of the senate democrat majority and the leader of the state senate is going to be here as our guests live in just a moment. very much looking forward to speaking with him. it has been once again, as usual, now he's the man of the center of the question of what can or cannot be done in washington. but the biden administration can or cannot get past. we'll be speaking with senator schumer, live in just a moment. today of course is january 5th, a year ago today in the great state of georgia, georgia voters elected to new u.s. senators, democrat jon ossoff and democrat raphael warnock. they were runoff elections for both of georgia's u.s. senate seat one year ago today. at the democrats won both of those races. now, georgia electing to democrats to their two u.s. senate seats. that is how we got senate majority leader chuck schumer. that is what flipped control of the u.s. senator from republican control to democratic control. that is what made it possible for the biden administration in its first year to an act all the legislation that they have passed in the past year. including covid relief, the big

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