kept us out of war. and that was true. he had kept us out of the war. at that point. and that was a popular enough sentence in the united states up until that time. that wilson got reelected as president. thanks to those bragging rights, along those lines. by keeping us out of the great war. he was reelected in 1916. but world war i was nevertheless dragging on, and expanding. it started in 1914, dragged on into 1915, into the 1916, into the 1917, it involved dozens of countries, it really was reshaping the world, with all the alliances that various countries had all over the world. ultimately the german started sinking our ships in the atlantic, even though we technically weren't part of the war. yet other countries in our hemisphere started getting dragged into it. by the spring of 1917, not even six months after wilson had been reelected on that slogan, he kept us out of war, not even six months after that the u.s. congress in fact voted to declare war. and we don't. but the political wrangling over the decision in our country was really something back in 1917. and it turns out that political wrangling back then, in 1917, over the decision to turn america around and abandon our previous isolation and get ourselves involved in world war i. all the political wrangling around that hard decision in 1917, left us a little parting gift that we're still wondering today. a little parting gift in fact that is still totally screwing us up today. because one of the many objections that people had, when entering world war i, was cost. there was gonna be expensive, we did not have the means to pay for it at the time. and then some find it expenditure of something we need to build here at home in the u.s., and during that giant mega war in europe, that was already years old, it just seemed like it would be a bottomless expenditure that we would never be able to control. and there is logic to. that war does have a way of doing that. but while the u.s. was turning itself around and getting ready to enter the war anyway while arguably were being dragged into that war, part of the way they tried to win over people who had objected us joining the war on cost grounds, people who are worried about the expenses, part of them >> was to create a new thing in u.s. law. a new limit in the law on what our country could spend. we could spend up to eczema, but for any reason if the government wanted to spend any more than that the -- would have to regroup, write a piece of legislation, and passing a limit on what we could spend. that process was created in 1917 to placate the isolation who didn't want to untoward one. that is the very specific history on how we got, what we called the death ceiling, we got them in 1917 in the same way that we declared war in germany. -- took two tries but we didn't get over the debt ceiling gimmick that we used to placate people who objected the first one of those wars. we kept that for some reason. for more than 100 years now we have kept that. and it doesn't function at all, really at all. it does not function as a barrier to our government spending money. obviously. it doesn't even stop us from spending endlessly and rapaciously on years long epic. or it doesn't constrain u.s. government spending in any meaningful way at all. it just gives congress this embarrassing awkward procedural thing that they have to do every so often because if they don't, the most important catcher in the world, the economy will default on instead. will boeing ourselves into a fiery -- other than the fact that nobody thought the turn. off this stupid thing that we turned on in 1917, because we needed to placate people who felt bad that would change their minds about entering that war. and over the 100 conscious that we have been saddled with this thing, it has loomed smaller or larger depending on the decade, depending on circumstances. but it's roughly 1916, congress had to vote to raise the stupid that ceiling, dozens of times. nearly 100 times. under presidents of both parties. and again it's a work that you have to do forward no benefit. you get nothing positive for doing. but if you don't do it, fiery financial disaster on and indeed international skill. it's like, if you had a backyard at your house or your apartment and you decided you were going to keep a piranha filled lagoon right next to the scenes. yes, theoretically having appear on the field lagoon there might make your kids more careful on the swing set. it might make them develop really good balance so that they don't fall in and get eaten by the promises. theoretically okay. maybe there's some benefit to it. but honestly it's all downside. right? why would you do that. anything can happen. they might fall in. why would you set a trap like that in iraq? why would you set a track like that in american law. thanks to this trap if congress fails at anytime or for any reason to do this dumb procedural thing that they don't want to do, and for which they get no credit or no benefit, if for any reason, that anytime the congress fails to do that, the country gets it. default on our. that downgrade over credit. potentially trillions of dollars in extra expenses for our country for no reason. why would you put a piranha filled trump like this nylon? i mean i do know why they did it in 1917, when woodrow wilson was change his mind about warm germany. i don't know why we've kept it ever since. and we have kept it, there it is. this time four years ago, in 2017, donald trump was in his first year as president of the united states. as crazy as that still seems. in 2016 he had been elected president, republicans in that same election also secured the votes in the house. and that trifecta of republican control, set all kind of things in motion. some of which were definitely not recovered from. yet but one problem they did not have, the first year of the donald trump was president. they didn't have a problem around raising the stupid that ceiling. this time, four years ago, democrats are out of power in the white house, they are in the minority of both houses of congress. but nevertheless september 2017, democrats agreed. they voted to pass the spending bill that kept the government from shutting down. and in that bill they agreed to raise the debt ceiling. september 2017 past of the senate and the house by by overwhelming margins. not a single democrat voted no in the senate. not a single democrat voted no in the house. even though there was a republican controlled congress, democrats voted unanimously, to not throw the country into the provide real front a bit. to not hit that ceiling on purpose. yes the other party is in charge but let's not self inflicted totally pointless crisis and huge and there are so sorry expenditure, have a credit rating downgraded, throwing ourselves out a big part of the world into another financial grasp for no reason. democrat said let's not do. that doesn't matter that the republicans are in charge. nobody wants that for our country. we will vote unanimously, so that that does not happen. that was four years ago. september 27. now it is september 2021. and it's the mirror image of the tubes partisan control. now we have democratic presidential biden, who is in this first u.s. president. in the 2020 elections last year, democrats occurred near majority in both the house and the senate. and just like september 2018, it is time to do that thing. that we have been doing since world war i. once again, it is time to think that them vote to keep the government funded. but also raise the debt ceiling. in order to placate the ghost of the oscar longer an empire. it is ridiculous that we still do that? but if we don't do it real problems, default prices huge expenses self inflicted wounds. it is time to do that again and this time it's democrats in control. republicans say they want to. they will not vote to keep the lights on, they will vote to vote to shut. that and they will not vote to rate that that soon. in fact they said they will filibuster the which means democrats can even raise the debt ceiling with the majority vote. and one democrats can raise the debt ceiling unless they get ten republican senators to side with them, and republican senate leader said no republican's ever gonna do that. >> when trump and the republicans were in charge four years ago democrats did this unanimously for the country. now that biden and the democrats are in charge, republican stand unanimously against it. so apparently we're going to take a deliberate leap into the product. unless something changes. tonight the house just in the last half hour, has voted for legislation to keep the lights on. to avoid a government shutdown. and for our country to stay out of the previous probable, thousands voted to raise the debt ceiling, nancy pelosi knows how to drive the bus here, so there was not that much expense as to whether the house will get this. done with that being said as zero republicans voted with the democrats to do this. it was a peer party line vote has now passed the house just within the last few minutes. and so this means -- in the seven republican said they will do it. they say listen, if the democrats are in control than the u.s. should default on our debt, crash out that reading, and something something we hate you. we're not gonna allow you to do it. doesn't matter the democrats voted to do that unanimously when republicans were in control. democrats were in control the republicans would say no, screw it. and as i mentioned, passing the debt ceiling legislation doesn't actually get you anything. it does not do anything for the country except avoid a self inflicted disaster. but the site is going to have to get through this murder suicide plan from the republicans. democrats are simultaneously also right now, trying to definitely passages solution that has a big upside as for the concern. they are trying to pass legislation, that most of president biden's agenda for his first term. something they will soft to deal with that republicans. and something the democrats would have to agree to pull together on in order to get it done. so we have to deal with stopping the government shutdown. we have to deal with this debt ceiling thing, nobody knows how they're gonna do that. but there's also this positive legislative agenda that the democrats are trying to get done. and it is in fact biden's registration agenda, it is live now, it's either gonna happen now or to. in a handful of conservative democrats in the house, a couple of contrarian democrat in the senate have been getting all the attention from the press for weeks, from a. in terms of their threats to block president biden. to block every democratic priority themselves if they don't get what they personally want as conservative democrats. the look to the other side too. this is the scene today, look at the shot. this is the scene today. when the leader of the aggressive caucus, washington congresswoman pramila jayapal came out of a speaking with nancy pelosi. you have to take it from me that she is there, you can see are there, because she is mauled with all the reporters trying to see what went on in that. meaning that attention from congressional press court is a healthy development for the coverage here. because pramila jayapal doesn't represent a tiny group of democrats, that are trying to get their names in the paper or opposing with the democratic president is trying to do, pramila jayapal represents a number that it's closer to half the democrats in congress, there's too many democrats in the house. 95 of the 220 of them are members of her caucus. which pramila jayapal leads. i know the progressives do not want to purposely jump into the pool of the product and smashed the country up to the debt ceiling in, hurt the country for no reason. that's what the republicans are doing. the progressives have the opposite, they today are voting to keep the government open and to extend the debt ceiling so we don't hit those crises. but they are also working on this positive agenda very positively. we are flexing their muscles, counting their members for whom there are many, taking a stand today and tonight. but they want to go big. they want the president bill to pass it entirety, it's three and a half trillion dollar bill that encompasses much of his agenda for his whole first term. they would not -- for the small bipartisan bill, what some republicans want, and what conservative democrats say they are prioritizing. the priorities are insisting. nobody's gonna get anything unless the infrastructure bill, the big one moves as well. pramila jayapal in response to questions from the reporters, she said today that they are not bluffing. >> in your view on the base of conversation with the speaker, are these packages still occupied they've been unoccupied. >> no there she is very clear >> progressive were bluffing about thanking the partisan? >> trials. as some people say you're bluffing to my strategy here. try us. pramila jayapal leads the progressive caucus in the house of representatives. democrats are getting crunched. now they are trying not to hit the debt ceiling. thanks republicans. trying to avoid a government shutdown. thanks republicans. they're trying also to pass the legislation that contains the book of president biden's agenda. it is pramila jayapal progressive caucus that has the numbers. here using a progressively to try to get this done. one of the prospects. joining us now is congresswoman pramila jayapal she's chair and kind enough to join us tonight even though it is her birthday. happy birthday congresswoman, it's nice to see you. >> thank you rachel, can't think of a better way to spend my birthday than with you. >> i can think of tons of better ways to spend your birthday, then being on cable tv with or without me. so it makes me all the more grateful that you are here. especially because you are in the middle of some high stakes negotiations. and having high stakes meetings. and really in the middle of crunch time right now. tell me if i characterize some of the moments in the right way. tell me in your own words where you think this process is right now, and how close the democrats are to a decision. >> yes and rachel i would just characterize it perfectly, i just wanna take us back minute to when president biden got elected. and even before that during the campaign, when he campaigned. and it was on childcare. universal child care. pete leave. making sure we were had housing. making sure we address climate change. expanding health care. addressing immigration. these are all things that he -- and when he became president, this is the agenda he put forward. and it was called the build back better agenda. we progressives, three and a half months ago, said let's just pass the whole thing together, jobs infrastructure, and all of these other pieces that i have mentioned which are the largest part of the president agenda. it became clear that some moderate democrats, conservative democrats, whatever you want to call, it wanted to have a bike hardest an infrastructure bill. then we said we are not willing to leave out women from coming back to the world for us from childcare. we are not going to leave our health. care so we would agree to that by court isn't bill if, and only if, we also passed the reconciliation bill offers. that was our position, we voted our members on, it have -- a few months ago today we will vote for both hills we will vote for the bipartisan infrastructure bill, which is much smaller, and frankly rachel has a lot of things that our members don't like. but if we can get the reconciliation bill that has the majority of the president's agenda, then the majority of what we are not on, then we will vote for both bills that is been our position two months ago, it remains our position today. now in the senate passed the bipartisan bill, senator sanders, senator warren, and many other progressive senators only voted for that by cartersville because they were given the commitment. by the senators in the democratic party, and the president, that we wouldn't move these two things together. the reconciliation bill, the build back better act doesn't calm, and the bike artisan bill. so becoming to the house, and all of a sudden the tables get turned on us, and we're not finding that people are saying, just pass the infrastructure bill, and will get the childcare later. look at the paid leave later. we will reach we are committed to delivering the entirety of the presidents agenda to the president's desk. and that is where we had to do, the speaker said it beautifully. the children have the leverage and we are not going to get that up. this is the leverage for transformational, that people would wake up and feel differently about themselves, i will know that the government delivered for that. and half of our caucus, over half of her caucus, has said that they will not just vote owned the bye card is an infrastructure bill. we have to vote on the reconciliation bill first. and even though some people don't like, it will vote for the boycott isn't bill because we understand we are all part of the democratic team, this is the democrats agenda, and we are willing to vote for both risk. anyone that is blocking, the reconciliation bill that this, time is voting against the president's agenda. so look, it is a tough drive now, we are trying to get the reconciliation bill done, we need the senate to actually work with us to say okay, we are pre-conferencing anything, meaning we have to -- an ability like we're gonna pass something intended to. senate know that takes too much time. we're going to pass one bill that all of us agree on. and once you pass that bill, we will vote also for the bipartisan bill, we will see both of them on the president's desk first thing. >> how much distance is there between you and speaker pelosi on this? we have seen all the irresistible template held lines today from the beltway press, democrats in disarray. they all write themselves. internal strife among democrats. when you had this meeting today with speaker pelosi came out and spoke with reporters of the same things you just talked about. in the broader if you think about this, but are you and speaker pelosi pulling in the same direction. or is the distance that -- the speaker has been terrific in really pushing for the entirety of the presidents agenda, and she also understands that if we have over half of the rest of cough is that we have over the bucket isn't, bill she's a master, she's not gonna bring a bill before that she knows who's gonna. phil so she's been trying to communicate that with people, in the senate, in the house, and to say, they are already to vote for the by counties and bill. we just have to pass the reconciliation bradford. so there hasn't been distance, she's been a great champion of making sure that we get back to work and create jobs. that everyone can cry dissipated. all of these, things and of course we fight climate change which is of course crucial in this moment. the biden cartersville doesn't have any of that reach. so if we were to just vote on the bike artisan bill, we would leave behind all of these other priorities. 60 70% of the priorities. we know what, and so it's she's been a very strong champion of pushing all of these, things and again what i said that we simply don't have the votes. and she gets, congresswoman pramila jayapal chair of the caucus. it's a large number. which means has a lot of weight to laura. we're seeing that process at work right now. as this process works its way through calm chris. congressman thank you for joining us i hope that the rest of your knife, involves no more cable news and lots of birthday cake. >> much more ahead with tonight's stay with us s stay with us what makes new salonpas arthritis gel so 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nope. -it crushes it. pshh, mine's so fast, no one can catch me. big whoop! mine gives me a 4k streaming box. -for free! that's because you all have the same internet. xfinity xfi. so powerful, it keeps one-upping itself. president biden addressed the can your internet do that? un general assembly today as first address to the un as president. he covered a lot of ground in his speech. one part of his address to the general assembly today really caught my attention, because of something that's going on in today's news. >> we're hardening our critical infrastructure against cyberattacks. disrupting ransom networks. and working to establish clear rules of the road. for all nations. as it relates to cyberspace. we'll reserve the right to respond decisively. the cyberattacks to threaten our people, our allies, our interests. >> hardening are critical infrastructure against cyberattacks. you might remember that phrase, critical infrastructure, used in this context from a few months ago. the spring, when a criminal hacking groups in russia shut down the largest fuel pipeline on the east coast. with a big ransomware attack. remember the colonial ransomware attack? knocked him down from the better part of the week. -- attacking critical infrastructure like field pipelines, and water ship lies, and hospitals things we really can't live without. that's supposed to be americas bright line when it comes to cyberattacks. that's what president biden meant when he said we reserve the right to respond decisively when that line is crossed. well, now we have just learned about a new ransomware attack by apparently a russia-based criminal group. on the very critical infrastructure that is our food supply. the company that's been hit this time is an iowa-based farming cooperative called new cooperative. among other things they say the provide feed for 11 million for animals in this country. their computer systems were hit on monday, yesterday. now they are operating with pen and paper. some of the farm co-op negotiations with the cyber criminals are trying to wrench and then. have been posted online, to the degree on which the co-op are going out of the way to explain to the hackers that they are crossing this bright line, the amount that hackers don't seem to care. and they're willing to explain that they don't care. it is very cinematic. it's a sort of thing you would expect to see in a movie. not real life. but look we have the screenshots. this is the copp. we are critical infrastructure we are to tighten with the food supply chain in the u.s.. there is going to be a very very public destruction in the grain, pork and chicken. supply this is pretty much out of our hands, we can't graduate the regulators in the u.s. government meant. does the impact of this attack will likely be much worse than the colonial pipeline. attack i'm just telling you this is you're not surprised does it does not seem like you understand who we are, what will accompany place in the food supply chain. >> that's a co-op speaking to the hackers, after all of that the hackers reply. >> no one will give you decryptor's for free, look for money. >> meaning we don't consider you to be on the other side of that bright light. what if the u.s. were to respond decisively here, since despite line has been very overtly crossed. what would that actually mean? i mean i'm not the world's tech is person, if there is the piece of technology that can be fixed by restarting. it started out of luck. but luckily for us yesterday a very distinguished computer scientists named dimitri, he is the cofounder of the cyber security crowd strike. he published a new york times explaining what it might mean for america to really go on offense in these matters. he laid out a proposal for america targeting ransom where criminals and these hacking groups essentially in the same way the attacked isis online. including disrupting their financial structures, but also revealing personal details about the perpetrators, taking down their servers. introducing bugs into their cold so that even when they think they're operating on their own terms, they're actually operating on ours. it's an aggressive proposal, from dimitri we contacted a former homeland security cyber chief, about mr. dimitri alperovitch about how the u.s. should be handling these issues. now he told us that what dimitri alperovitch is recommending, is basically that the u.s. should quote >> release the hounds. against these criminal groups. i can tell you as far we know he meant that in a good way, humid as a compliment. joining us now is dimitri alperovitch he is chairman of the cybersecurity chain. he is the cofounder of the cybersecurity crowd strike. thank you for joining us tonight, i appreciate you for taking the time. >> thank you for having me. >> am i right to suggest that you think america has the skills to be more aggressive, to act offensively towards these criminal groups in a way that would be much more destructive to them. but we have until now reserve that sort of skills for international terrorist groups. and not applied for as aggressively as possible. >> well there is no question that we have the skills, we had stir of cyber command over a decade ago. we have 1000 of personal working for them, and engaging into cyberattack other nations to difficulty what we gave them billions of dollars to do. unfortunately we currently use that capability to primarily go after nation states, go after terrorist groups, we have not used it to go after criminal groups, like these ransom operators. and i think it's past time that we do. that we have this with president putin as we recalled years ago, at that it's pretty clear now that president putin has been lifted a finger to try and stop these groups, most of them which are operated from russia, so it is not time, long past time, to take matters into our own and. and to get the group shut down. to make their lives very difficult. >> i feel like a lot of this who are sort of outside the cybersecurity world, run up pretty quickly against the idea of blow back. that when we talk about defensive capabilities, hardening yourself as a target, and then you talk about offense capability, going after the perpetrators of these kind of crimes in attacks, one of the things that we hear from your sector is that the potential blow back, the potential consequences of very aggressive offensive actions is something that may be hard for us to conceptualize. maybe it's something hard for us to get our heads around. how do you think about that? if we did do, if the u.s. government to do the kind of things are proposing, treating these groups effectively as we treated international terrorist groups. what is the risk in how they could retaliate? well with the blow back? be >> well there's concern about blowback, is something that's been raised over 30 years now. anytime that the u.s. is considered in engaging in offense, the response has always been on all we can do that, we have all of these vulnerabilities. it's gonna come back and haunt. this and of course our adversaries have not restrained in this way. russia, china, iran, north korea they flood with cyberattacks, nonstop over the last 20 years without any considerable back. an empirically when we look at the evidence over the last 20 years, cyber has not lead to neck glacial in so far. so when it comes to these groups that overstrain i'm, cells doesn't believe, that when they're looking and going after these vote cooperative's. when they're going after colonial pipelines, and other infrastructure, we're basically telling them that they get to decide what is critical, and one is not critical. and then make the decision on whether they'll give you a ransom case for four. that's unacceptable for us to give so much part to these fundamentals. in terms of the in biden administration. approach to this. and the types of diplomatic approaches that you've described, including that -minute way president putin and president biden where they addressed this matter directly, the biden administration has been very focused on giving groups like this, a place operate from. giving them safe haven, in the same way that pakistan was allowing the tub to regroup and reopen across borders and so the afghanistan war, and against the taliban was never going to be one because they always had safe haven in pakistan across the border. the biden administration was essentially extreme to explain the problem with similar with russia, giving these place a group to brief. not so much a blind eye as an occurrence ing-wen cannot from the russian government. is there any way to change the russians government attitude? or their incentive scorched around these groups? or should we see that as a lost cause? >> absolutely that we. can you are absolutely right, the russian government there's no evidence that they're involved in these attack. however, we know that these criminal groups are operating within their borders, and they are well known to russian law enforcement. so putin wanted to do something, if they wanted to shut them down, if you want to rush to individuals, we could just send a message, knock it off your crossing the. like he has the capability to do so. it cost him very little politically, because these are not all the golf, these are not people who are part of his entourage, he doesn't know that personally, these are individuals that are very easy to roundup and send a very clear message to. so the question is, does he have the will to do so? and right now so far we have not really pressured him's significantly, we don't rush major sentence that would really impact the russian economy, unless he gets those groups to stop, we have not done, that we sorted as dicey, and so frequently hasn't worked. >> dimitri cofounder of the cybersecurity from crowdstrike, thank you very much for talking to us about this tonight. especially for the sort of general audience or someone like me who is not tech minded on this. does your clarity on this is really appreciated thank you. >> thank you. >> all right much morehead stay with us. >> with us. with us. >> or it could be the day there's a cyberthreat. get ready for it all with an advanced network and managed services from comcast business. and get cybersecurity solutions that let you see everything on your network. plus an expert team looking ahead 24/7 to help prevent threats. every day in business is a big day. we'll keep you ready for what's next. comcast business powering possibilities. do you struggle to fall asleep and stay asleep? qunol sleep formula combines 5 key nutrients that can help you fall asleep faster, stay asleep longer, and wake up refreshed. the brand i trust is qunol. when our daughter and her kids moved in with us... our bargain detergent couldn't keep up. turns out it's mostly water. so, we switched back to tide. one wash, stains are gone. [daughter] slurping don't pay for water. pay for clean. it's got to be tide. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ just two pills for all day pain relief. aleve it, and see what's possible. my great grandmother started a legacy of education in my family. she ran for state office. had no problems breaking the norms. she had a dream and decided to pursue it. find the strong women in your family with ancestry. ♪ i see trees of green ♪ ♪ red roses too ♪ ♪ i see them bloom for me and you ♪ (music) ♪ so i think to myself ♪ ♪ oh what a wonderful world ♪ the doctor broke the law. and we know he did. because he told us all in public. in the pages of the washington post. so quote and so after hearing stories like that from his patients four days in a row. he said he made a choice. in the morning of september six that was run in by long time seen in tokyo physician allen braided. and doctor brayden started his ob/gyn residency before roe v. wade guaranteed the right to obtain abortion in all 50 states. now today dr. biden says he feels like he's back in 1972 all over again now that texas has banned all abortions in the state, and a system that does not allow for citizens to any woman or anyone who helps women to get an abortion. that's the way of enforcing to have private citizens to. and that last part, the vigilante part of this new law in texas, that's part of the reason doctor bright says, he knowingly and openly violated the texas abortion ban a few days ago. he didn't have to wait to try to stress test the legality of it in court. he writes quote and of course tested it will be, and after that public admission doctor bright has been sued by a private vigilante, he was exercising his knew the extent was right under the new texas state law to bring the doctor to court. amanda suing doctor breed's not from texas. he is a convicted felon, he said he's a disbarred lawyer, he is currently serving at his criminal sentence on house arrest, he has no obvious connection to the abortion issue at all, in fact he doesn't even say that he's necessarily antiabortion. but it is hard to concern, he seems -- this will not be the first challenge of the constitutionality of texas's new abortion ban. will it work? joining us now to help us understand is our hand joyce vance, the u.s. attorney jerusalem thank you so much for being with us today. >> thank you for having rachel. >> so we've talked about in recent weeks how texas device this law, to work in the specific way, to shield it from federal court scrutiny, but it's been mostly speculation, until now as to whether or not that enforcement mechanism would do more than just shield a lot from federal scrutiny. whether the law would actually work to punish abortion providers and people who help women in the state. how do you think this is gonna play? >> so this is a very interesting situation. and i think the statue which is designed to outsmart the justice system may be too cute by half. because in creating this private vigilante mechanism. it's sort of becomes chaos. and so we have here, by his own admission disgrace, and disbarred former lawyer, who is filing this lawsuit and it opens a huge can of worms, but the biggest kind of warms it opens for the state of texas is the possibility that now that the law is actually in effect, there will be a challenge to law lawyers called this an as applied constitutional challenge. and this may give opponents of the bill of much more certain path towards having a court blocked the law and join the law during the tendency of the litigation. >> so the vigilante element of the law, it's no longer hypothetical. it exists, it is a concrete process that is quite as a bubble, approvable, and therefore testable in court. is that it? >> i think that's right and this is vigilante-ism. perhaps maybe has a higher caliber then the legislature could've imagined. this is just rank vigilantism, someone from out of state of texas, with no connection whatsoever to the doctor or to the patient in this case. and the complaint that he files is really interesting, because texas all authorizes a minimum 10,000-dollar bounty in the situation. but the plaintiff here oscar silly says that he'd like $100,000 for his lawsuit. but he'll settle for 10,000. >> i will say going through his complaint today was an exercise in tripping without taking drugs. there is a lot of work elements to it. but if this is going to be the candle -- that gets a tent open >> be careful what you ask for. >> yes exactly, you're going to environmentalism round the world to sue as a basis, in the means by which are going to enforce this law? welcome to the world of vendors. and they litigation. just well i have you here, i really hope that you do not mind that i do, this and you are totally welcome to shut me down, and not engage with me on this at all. but since our last commercial break, since we had you in the chair, a little piece of nose has broken at the daily beast. concerning the former president and his niece mary trump. and i would like, -- i am reading this i do not know anything about this besides what's in the daily beast -- i'm going to redo the reporting, and i'd like to get your response to. it but shut me down if this is an inappropriate thing for me to ask you. the headline here as you see, president trump has filed a lawsuit donald, trump sues new york times and his niece overtaxed or. here is the entirety of the reporting at this point. >> former president donald trump has filed a lawsuit over the, timepieces reporters and his niece claiming they hatch didn't idiot plot to obtain his private records for stories about his texas jury, the lawsuit was filed today in that just cutting new york and they got the papers to convince mary trump, to smuggle records out of his attorney office, and turn them over to the times despite her having signed the confidentiality agreement, it's in an amount to be determined, trouble believe to be no less than $100 million. each of those words capitalize. 100 million dollars from both mary trump and the times. mary trump giving a comment to the daily beast about, this unquote, i think he is a effing loser. and he is going to throw anything against the wall in desperation. the walls are closing in his, he's a closing anything against the wall, as is always the case with don, all he will try and change the subject. that is the total of what has been reporting about this before. i just want to ask for your initial take on whether this is a real thing or a joke. >> filicoides that, as a legal theory. based on what you said it's a tough theory to argue them or trump couldn't do what she did in this case. it doesn't sound very much like someone is desperate to try and turn the tables -- and civilly before president has like this sucks like another chapter in that same book. joyce vance able to turn on less than a dime to two different stories that you're learning right now on tv. joyce thank you very much for being with us tonight. invaluable, thank you my friend. >> thanks rachel. >> all right we'll be right back, stay with us back, stay with us was approved to treat and prevent migraines. don't take if allergic to nurtec. the most common side effects were nausea, stomach pain, and indigestion. ask your doctor about nurtec today. with relapsing forms of ms... there's a lot to deal with. not just unpredictable relapses. all these other things too. it can all add up. kesimpta is a once-monthly at-home injection... that may help you put these rms challenges in their place. kesimpta was proven superior at reducing the rate of relapses, active lesions, and slowing disability progression vs aubagio. don't take kesimpta if you have hepatitis b, and tell your doctor if you have had it, as it could come back. kesimpta can cause serious side effects, including infections. while no cases of pml were reported in rms clinical trials, it could happen. tell your doctor if you had or plan to have vaccines, or if you are or plan to become pregnant. kesimpta may cause a decrease in some types of antibodies. the most common side effects are upper respiratory tract infection, headache, and injection reactions. ready for an at-home treatment with dramatic results? 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