the standoff starting just before noon central time. it happened during the morning services there paid a man we are told could be heard ranting about religion, islam directly centered on live stream of that service. listen to about 8000 people at the time for the suspect thing he did not want to hurt anyone but he did mention a sister and that he has children but local fox affiliate fox for dallas telling us the swat team is there hostage negotiators talking with the suspect as it continues on the past three and half hours now. brian in the newsroom at the very latest. >> eric and arthel we just heard about this for the first time the of that tweet from the police department. at 11:30 central time local time at which the swat team arrived on scene at the congregation that it about 70 miles northeast of fort worth texas. they evacuated we know from reporting for the dallas morning news the colleyville police has made contact there not been inside the building that we know they have made negotiations remain ongoing. but fort worth telegram is reporting this man had repeatedly mentioned his sister and islam. at times he did sound angry on the saliva stream of the services this morning in the synagogue that were live streamed online. he said a few times he did not want to hurt anybody. and he mentioned his own children that he also repeatedly said he believes that he is going to die for the latest update we have from colleyville police is that tweet that said the situation at congregation beth israel is still ongoing. they ask people to please avoid the area. we do know the rabbi of this congregation is charlie cintron walker. he's been a rabbi and colleyville since 2006 per this is a fairly new synagogue to the area. they moved into this building in 2005. this rabbi is married and has two daughters. from what we understand from k bf w, our affiliate source telling our fox affiliate in dallas-fort worth that a call came into new york city 911 with details from another rabbi located here in new york city who received a call from a rabbi in texas who is believed to be one of the people being held hostage. look we do not have confirmation this is charlie walker but we do know this rabbi is the only full-time rabbi of this congregation. this is the rabbi that is in charge of this synagogue. that is all we have as of right now, eric. we are still working our sources to try to get an update. we do not have any confirmation this person is armed. all we know is this person at times sounded angry on that live stream that began this morning for services at the synagogue and abruptly came to an end at about 2:00 p.m. witnesses listen to the live we have seen we heard a muffled sounds it's hard to be clear what's being said. clearly it's continues to be an ongoing situation there in texas, eric. eric: the hostage negotiating team still on the phone, brian thank you. arthel: are white house producer, pat moore by the way telling us the white house is closely monitoring the situation. we refer any questions to the fbi and law enforcement for the time being. so that is just in from her white house and producer pat joining us now is danny colson he's a former f vi and hoss q rescue team. you have done this countless times. would it be possible that negotiators at this point would put this hostage takers -- the suspects children, or sister on the phone with him? >> not at this point, absently not. i get that question often. do know it triggered this man, do not made him mad? it may have been a member of his family set him off, you do not know that pretty want to avoid that you want to keep the whole situation fairly vanilla and let him take control and go where it wants to go out let him vent. the fact he did not want to hurt anybody, the fact he's talking about his family. we talked about that earlier today that's really good. this is a very complex operation. they mentioned a swat team being there to there for a couple of reasons. they rescue if necessary and to keep people out. in situations like this is not unusual for somebody who thanks they has the answer to try to get inside the complex and make this thing go really badly. it's an inside outside deal the swat team as they are the key people out keep him from coming out. and ultimately at the same time allowing people that are in adjacent rooms or parts of the building to leave, get out. it's like triage want to start getting as many people out of there as you can without triggering some kind of response on his part. it's really complicated it's fairly delicate but this is what he does for a living. they're saying prayers they are successful and it sounds like it's going the right direction hopefully. arthel: hopefully for sure. we hope for the most peaceful outcome. it's coming up on almost four hours this has been going on. so at this time in negotiations, what you think is happening? does it change? >> no ma'am. time is what you want. when these things go down, adrenaline is very high. i went adrenaline is high, as he wears himself out because of this emotional outrage which is happening in his body right now he is becoming more and more fatigued. option start to approach him that basically say i am really tired. i know it sounds sophomoric and basic that's the way they work. start off with high emotion this ranting and raving behavior actually wears him out and his adrenaline that's a really good thing. i guess you more hope. >> brian reported this man is believed to have said he's going to die. what does that mean to you as a former fbi deputy associate in a negotiation team. >> you convinced him he is not. there other options for him. that is exactly what they're doing right now you're not going to die today. what are you talking about. sometimes they will joke with him or they will cajole him, you're not going to do i've got family. that is the tact they take. it is really interesting what works. we did when many, many years ago when i was a commander guy took a 747 he wanted $10 million and an airplane to someplace. we finally negotiated amount for a package of cigarettes. i know that sounds like i'm joking, but i am not pretty just do not know what's going to work. if he's a smoker and is a cigarette then use that part of us get and sit down give him a chair. these guys know this and all the things i'm telling are in their repertoire. they probably not better than me. >> your experience for sure. they are as well. you mentioned while they are talking to this guy, they are trying to also the synagogue there we don't how many people are in there but whoever is not in the suspects and mediate control if you will, they are trying to clear the rest of the building there also clearing the area as well telling people to stay away from the area. why are they doing that? >> they do not want interference. they don't want people, like i said earlier, the purpose of our perimeters to keep people in but also to keep people out from going in there. that's really important. they do not want someone coming up there with the sign or something or some loudspeaker or something to set this guy off. this is pretty delicate right now. i know this law enforcement community. they are very good at what they do. they take themselves seriously. they take the job very seriously. and they train all of the time. it may not go chances are there's a good chance too. arthel: data before let you go for now i want you to ask you, she told me earlier it's possible the hostage taker is listening, possibly, who also might be listening is his family. what you say to them? i would imagine everybody has a cell phone i'm not sure if they're texting with this gentleman or not. what do you say to his family that might be watching and listening to us? >> i think what they need to know it's important to give -- it's important for his life. the motto is to save lives. if that means we valued the life of the hostages and we value the life of the hostage taker. all life is valuable, god made all of us. if they are working right now is much to save him as the hostages. they have to understand he have to understand. also this is not the end of the line for him. this is not the last day. he can say his piece and he can go home he's not going to home is going to go someplace. he does not have to die today. there's time to think about this and today is not the former fbi deputy assistant director and experienced hostage negotiator, danny colson thank you so much for joining a standby i'm sure we'll come back to again at some point in this hour eric. before i went to tell the viewers were following news of a man's taken inside colleyville texas just of north of war fort worth. we do not know how many people are being held or if that man is armed including the rabbi who was holding services at the time when this occurred starting at 11:30 or so central time. reports that he was not ranting about religion is on but also using obscenities at one point but then of course it said he does not want to hurt anyone and referenced his sister and his children. ted welner's former -- ted coming up or sooner four hours. and his danny said that theoretically could be a good sign for the ideas to keep him talking, keep him engaged, try to lower and reduce the emotions set this man off. especially if it is a religious component. danny i was listening to danny colson he is right on target here. you have got experienced hostage negotiating teams on the scene there. you have a swat team on the scene. but what you do not have at this time is an active shooter. if there was an active shooter, quite naturally they would have to go in. we have seen go in before. what they are now doing is talking to this man. as long as they are able to talk to him and he is able to respond to them, they will stay and stand down. but i can tell you these various swat teams are strategically in place, there is no doubt about it very quick some reports the demands a sister may be incarcerated in federal custody, obviously would that be a motivating factor? could something set him off this morning? we just do not know what or why that is being reported not just the rabbi but three other people inside with him at the time at the time. it's being reported the suspects sister may be incarcerated in the federal medical center how do those layers of come laxity how do you unwrap those layers of complexity if he wants to try to get his sister freed or something? >> i think what they are going to do primarily is to keep him talking by now they may and i can only say may have found out what the motive but it could very well be incarcerated or could be someone else. but as long as they can keep him talking, the hostage negotiators feel they are in control of what is going on. it is when he stops talking, that is when it is dangerous. but at no time do i will evil they permit him to talk to his sister are clearly his sister would perhaps it definitely be released under these circumstances. but the talking, the back and forth, rant. let him go on and on about what he believes he is therefore. that is going to be very instrumental in bringing this into a peaceful conclusion. that is what they are working towards, eric. eric: would you see potentially at some point covering hostage negotiating in the past. after a while you need a break. it's very simple they want a cup of coffee. you try to wear them down, you just wait them out because as long as he does not do anything rash we don't know if he has a weapon. as long as there is no rash movements in this sense, would it be fair to say time and generally can be on the side of the angels when it comes to the situations? >> devault covered various hostage situations one thing if the authority has it is time to a proper conclusion take action meaning they can continue to talk to this person if they can let him events, let him talk about what he wants to talk about. at some stage or another few wants cigarettes, if he wants coffee, if he wants those kinds of things they will try to give them to him because what they are trying to do is to make sure nobody's harm and will be stay tuned nobody, even the hostage taker, they are trying to make sure he is not harmed also. they are trying to bring this to a conclusion without anybody being harmed. but time at this stage is on their side. we know that because at this stage she is not harmed anybody. quickset is a good thing at this time he's a brother of a convicted terrorist was being held at the air force base near fort worth. that the sister has ties to al qaeda and it has been reported had been convicted of attempted murder and assault on a soldier and is serving 86 years in prison. how does that complicate things when you're dealing with this potential? abc report of the information they suspect is talking for all inside the synagogue is the brother or his claiming to be the brother of a convicted terrorist. it could be it could not be we don't have any of that confirm jet. >> right. it could be one way or the other. they are also doing a quote unquote psychological profile of this individual meaning the fbi. and if he has brothers, sisters incarcerated, or he himself is been involved in some kind of activity the main thing is to continue to keep him talking. let him rant, it is my understanding he's talked about his sister. it is my understanding he allegedly talked about islam what he wants to do in reality of talking to the authorities they are going to buy that they're going to take that. they have time on their side. the longer he talks in a danny colson made a reference to it a little earlier, he will get tired her and tired her because as we know, this incident is now about four hours in the happenings. so i anticipate they are going to wait him out. but while they are waiting, eric they are also taking strategic action to make sure if they cannot bring this to a peaceful solution, that they want to try to end of this without any of the hostages themselves being hurt. that is also paramount. and as i said, there's a lot going on we do not know about behind the scene. we may be talking to the brother, the sister, allegedly incarcerated to try to find out more about the hostage taker. that is also important. if there are family members out there the fbi is cognizant of their going to want to talk to those individuals also for trying to find out more is much as they possibly can about the hostage taking himself. there are a lot going on as we speak in regards to this. >> there is the report he claims to be the brother of a terrorist with the alleged ties to al qaeda. that complicates things. we'll see if they patch the sister in what happens in terms of the next step a ted williams thank you very much. again the situation in colleyville texas. the synagogue hostage taking ongoing for four hours at this very moment. as long as i continues this is a hopeful sign as your reporting will have much more in the very latest on this as we continue our coverage right here on fox news for strength and energy. woo hoo! ensure, complete balanced nutrition with 27 vitamins and minerals. and ensure complete with 30 grams of protein. ♪ ♪ with 30 grams of protein. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ with chase security features, guidance and convenience, banking feels good. chase. make more of what's yours. your shipping manager left to “find themself.” leaving you lost. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates matching your job description. visit indeed.com/hire and there you have it. woah. matching your job description. wireless on the most reliable network nationwide. wow. big deal. we get unlimited for just 30 bucks. sweet, but mine has 5g included. relax people. my wireless is crushing it. that's because you all have xfinity mobile with your internet. it's wireless so good, it keeps one-upping itself. take the savings challenge at xfinitymobile.com/mysavings or visit an xfinity store to learn how our switch squad makes it easy to switch and save hundreds. eric: breaking news in colleyville, texas that is where man is right holding worshipers and a rabbi hostage at the synagogue. right near dallas at 30 miles north of fort worth. the standoff started just before noon central time this morning. during services. it is being live streams about 8000 people were watching the live stream they could hear men ranting about religion and islam during that live stream. the man's a voice saying he did not want to hurt anyone but he did mention a sister and live stream and his children and new reporting says that man claims to be the brother of a convicted terrorist whose now being held at near dallas. the woman the alleged sister that he is naming has alleged ties to al qaeda. we don't know if he is the brother. fox news not confirming authorities are not confirming the information whether or not this man is who he says he is. rapidly developing story. >> good afternoon the fbi dell spokeswoman talking to the associated press saying there are currently no reported injuries authorities are, they are not certain they were not certain how many people are in side the synagogue right now that's obviously at the center of the standoff. we note negotiation are ongoing spokeswoman saying it's an evolving situation. there's a lot of law enforcement personnel on the scene. reporting out there is that while we have the state troopers out there the swat team from the police department as well as the fbi by the texas department of public safety is also on scene. it began at about 11:00 a.m. when the live stream today was on this morning with about 8000 viewers. it was cut short right before 2:00 p.m. local time. apparently, reportedly there is a fixed camera shot of the pulpit of the synagogue and viewers could hear the faint voice of a man in the background the fort worth telegram reporting that man was reportedly repeatedly mentioning his sisters and islam. he said a few times he did not want anyone hurt. he hasn't mentioned he has a children. he also said repeatedly he believes he's going to die. right now we know the u.s. ambassador to israel tom has tweeted saying i am closely monitoring reports of the hostage situation at congregation beth israel and texas for the community has gathered for services praying for intermediate. we do not know how when people are held hostage inside we do know there's one main rabbi for the congregation in colleyville, texas this is about 70 miles northeast of texas his name is rabbi charlie walker. he's a full-time rabbi there since 2006. the center got on trent synagogue is been in the community since 1999. the new building built. kds wr affiliate is reporting a call came in to a rabbi in new york city from a rabbi in texas who is believed to be one of the people being held hostage. we do not know if it is in fact rabbi walker but he is listed as the main and only rabbi of that synagogue. at this moment we know the white house is also monitoring the situation, our produce for producers saying the white house official telling fox they are monitoring the situation there referring all of the questions to the fbi and law enforcement. we are attempting, eric, to get up-to-date information. obviously so are many other media outlets at this time. so information is trickling in. the good news is at the hour there are no reported injuries. we note negotiations are still ongoing. obviously the fbi seems to be leading this hand-in-hand with the colleyville police department. as soon as we get more information we will let you know. eric: sometimes they can piece together reports the latest we been report he claims to be the brother of a convicted terrorist who is being held on life terms in the nearby air force base. also claims he has bombs located several different locations buried fox news is not confirmed that. but it certainly appears to be more complex situation than just someone trying to blow off some steam. with angry rants hopefully it will end very peacefully, brian thank you. >> eric and brian thank you joining us now on the phone as lieutenant steven rogers. he is a retired police detective bureau commander for the new jersey police department. he is also the military officer former member of the fbi joint terrorism task force. steve, good to have you and your expertise this afternoon. according to reports we do not have a lot of information but according to reports this hostage taker claims he was at the air force base near fort worth. allegedly it's the hostage takers is sister who is convicted of assault and attempted murder. of u.s. soldier in 2010 she was sentenced to 86 years in prison. the hostage taker sister has alleged ties to al qaeda, the hostage takers this profile if it's true about the mindset and does this change the hostage negotiators approach? >> it will. i can tell you this information is very, very critical. on death and destruction there's absolutely nothing that's going to change his mind. my gases, as long as the police have contact with him, as long as he is talking there is always a hope the police will be able to de-escalate this to a point where he may give himself up. now it saying that, and the reason this information is critical now the police have a very important lead as to who this person is, who he has been in contact with and if they are able to get that information they will be able to begin the big task of checking over his computer, cell phone will be call electronic footprint as to where, when, how he's been talking to people, very critical. their approach now is to calm him down. make sure the hostages are not going to be harmed. and as i said there is some indications this guy although he says he wants to die he may not want to die. i am basing that on the fact the police must be doing a tremendous job in keeping this guy talking to them. >> he says according to reports he believes he is going to die. he also said he does not want anyone hurt. we have also been reporting that he has a children. so he has family in addition to a sister who is being incarcerated. we just heard reports again, we have not confirmed these reports here fox news. but reports that perhaps he has placed some bombs and other locations. again we cannot confirm that. just you and your experience of something like this is true, even if it is not true, if he is telling the police this, the negotiators this, what you make of all of that? >> well hopefully as you say it's not true. if it's true certainly the police are going to do with him he can to find out where these brahms are. but i've got to tell you, what i find important really important is that for the police to get in touch with the family members he spoke about. obviously is concerned about his children, his concern about his family perhaps may want the steps the police will take is have them speak to him and try to get him to calm down. he is feeding that information out, in my view, to extend this thing and keep going. again these are indicators he doesn't want to harm anybody. he's trying to get a message out and that the end of the day will find out the message is. i am believing, based on what i'm hearing as you are he does not want to die. he does not to hurt anybody but he wants to send a clear message regarding the situation he is in as he sees it. >> danny was on at this earlier, ted williams on earlier, we are all sing the same thing as we approach the fourth hour of this hostage situation there. he's talking to police, he is not wanting to hurt anybody. with guns a blazing got a come situation on our hands. you have a man is taken the rabbi and three other people hostage there. in colleyville. again we are four hours in, what could they do they are not doing right now? i think they are doing an amazing job. with your expertise wondering if you think they may be turning a corner and switching up there negotiation process. >> well, as you've said they are doing a tremendous job in keeping this thing at a minimum. the next step as i said earlier, i believe the police might do is get a hole of the family members, his children, his wife, whoever is close to them and start speaking to him. that would be a tremendous help to the police. and my experiences maybe they'll go down that road. we will see if this thing ends hopefully within the next few hours with no and injured. remember he said over and over again i don't see my kids hurt, i do not want to hurt anybody. one who may convince him to follow through by not hurting anyone are his family members, the ones that he loves. arthel: we do not know, perhaps, steve he has a cell phone with him perhaps he has heard from his family members, we do not know that. i think you agree with danny colson, ted williams, negotiators who want this hostage taker to know his life does matter. they do want him to come out of the situation alive. of course they want the hostages to come out alive and they want to sing to end peacefully. do you agree? >> one 100%. i like the way you framed that. his life doesn't matter to his children, his wife, his family. we do not know what made them motivated to do this. that something that police will be very aggressively looking at. once they find out the motive what is behind this is going to be a tremendous help to them. i like the way you framed it he needs to know his life matters, the life of the hostages matter but the future of his children and family may be something he needs to hear and maybe bring this to a very satisfactory conclusion for all concerned. arthel: steven rogers as always thank you very much for your expertise. we want to let you know are going to keep following this breaking news out of colleyville, texas. bringing the very latest as we get it paid were also following a number of other big stories 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maybe we lost the signal. we will continue it was steve rogers, get back to you about that. he does have a brother who reports he lives in houston was has not been confirmed fox news is not confirmed all of this. it certainly adds more in depth to this hostagetaking if indeed he is the brother of the convicted terrorists whose nickname at one point was lady al qaeda who authorities said suspected had ties to al qaeda pretty goes into a synagogue ranting and raving about is long his sister theoretically is doing this to try to get his sister sprung from federal prison after she was convicted of trying to kill u.s. soldier, terry is back with this. this added complication maybe he is the brother of this convicted al qaeda terrorists, this woman who is being held for 86 years she received an 86 year terrorism sentence, your thoughts and how do authorities deal with that with a guy who's got perhaps four hostages inside the synagogue? rexall eric, as you said it really does complicate this. this is not like an example of a random loan, or similar type who decided to come up with an idea and had a sister in prison this is much more complicated than that. these are people who think nothing of taking human life. hostage situations in the end hostage killing and suicide are common with them is going to take all of the patients and all of the skill all of the training the police and law enforcement authorities have at the scene to keep it under control and hope they can reach this person and get through. it is another example i'm not trying to sound political. about the dangers posed and a lot of us who were in the fbi especially those who work terrorism said wait a minute, you are getting way ahead of yourself or at international terrorism is not dead and gone. this is a great example of what we face. because we are going into a period of time in history that is somewhat unique. we are going to have both domestic and international terrorism knocking at our door and causing us all kinds of problems. the best advice i could give is for politicians to stay out of it. they do nothing but complicate things just like they did with anthrax. we have to be very careful in this people out there really have their hands full. this is not an easy situation to deal with. >> if you don't count the assassination of robert f kennedy. november 519 and given the speech on the second floor of the hilton on 49th street. shoots him, runs four years turns out guess what folks he was not. part of the mosque over in jersey city. that ledge of the bombing plot of the landmarks 95 bombing of the world trade center. 1993 which then of course led to 9/11. and now here we are on a saturday in the year 2022, sitting on a guy who claims he's the brother. i woman sent us 286 years in the federal prison nearby for trying to kill a u.s. soldier. >> exactly. and she is not the only relative or connection to international terrorism that is now sleeping in american prison. everything you just said is a great context of people to have and understand. i will add to that, ago the shooting outside the gate the ci a in langley, virginia. all of these things are part of history. there also as current today for motivation, the vengeance and revenge is part of what drives this kind of criminology and terrorism. that is why it's so complicated and hard to handle and to think it has been happening or to think over the last year we have been hearing so much about forget all of that. this is the threat to america. it will always be with us for. >> it is a domestic threat to the countryside on january 6 with the deadly attack on the u.s. capitol which is striking at the very heart of our democracy itself. we had that. but you are right in the sense we have not heard of, although it's been there about radical islamic terrorism and the foreign terrorism. they have been here, it continues and as it continues hen attacks on synagogues. the greatest number of religious attacks in our country, 54% or so of religious -based attacks our anti-semitism. and now you have this purported brother of the convicted terrorists in the synagogue demanding her release. terry, how do authorities deal with that demand? too they put her on the phone? do they not put her on the phone? what do they say? we'll discuss that more you've got to come out first. >> of course that is a great question. all of these hostage situations are different depends on the personality of the individual. in this case is not just the personality of the individual to whole ideology the backdrop we have been discussing. so, they have to sort through all of that. you and i as we are talking about this have no idea how much progress they made to talk to this person it's one thing to have negotiations ongoing or being able to talk it's another thing what's being said and how much you are able to talk, is this person just getting on the phone and saying this is what i want goodbye unless you have news for me you're releasing my sister and going to have her in ten minutes then we have nothing to talk about. we are at a disadvantage. knowing and let say he's talking at least a little bit, he is going to stick with the idea we have these hostages. not going to release them until i get progress in knowing my sister somewhere i can see her for example. they're going to have to sort through this. people like say you change the policy near the bottom but we didn't. that was a much different situation than this. eric: explained that for people who don't understand the unabomber. >> okay of course the key to that is he'd written a manifesto he said look, a terror organization publishes the manifesto then we will stop committing terrorist acts. but we will reserve the right which we will make sure we bomb buildings. of course that is ridiculous. but the point is, our look at that in our view and the reason we encourage the justice department and the times and the post in the published manifesto as it would help us identify the bomber. if something written by a person who probably mouth these words many times over the years but secondly we sought more of a kidnapping for ransom situation. you make this step and hopefully will bring the person out in the open. and we will get them. that is exactly what happens. this is not that kind of situation this person is in the open this person has hostages. so we have the violence already committed. we are just a heartbeat away from an even bigger tragedy. there is not much you can do because if you start giving in and letting them have their way, you can see what's happening in cities. we've kind of looked the other way and made excuses for people to commit crimes. so, i am afraid another manifestation of what were going to see more of. i don't think anybody who's been involved in this kind of work and has been involved in working cases on the street is probably going to be surprise we are not now turning this corner. i just want to add one more thing, terrorism is always a back and forth. it is always changing. it's always coming back in a different form. and sometimes meeting again we have both domestic and international terrorism operating at the same time. we are going into, in my opinion, one of those requests we just had the indictments for conspiracy against the oath keepers. now we have another indication a case that seems to be tinged with international terrorism if the reports are true this man claims to be the brother of a convicted located connected terrorist is the suspect holiness people hostage. this has been going on almost four and half hours. at least that can be encouraging the talking is continuing, thank you, arthel. >> thank you eric we are now going to bring back ted williams of former d.c. homicide detective and fox news contributor. so again were looking for and a half hours of negotiating with this guy. we have found out the sister of the hostage taker, she is affiliated with al qaeda. she is currently incarcerated cars will therefore face near fort worth. he she is sentenced to 86 years for the crime. she is that pakistani neuroscience i believe we just heard from lucas tomlinson's reporting. and her brother, they have another brother in houston looking at a highly intelligent family. how does this change anything from your perspective? it changes it we now know who we may very well be dealing with. that is, when i say that, it appears as though, if this is in fact the brother of the woman who is now known as lady al qaeda, he wants her release. the authorities under no scenario or circumstance that i know of is going to release this woman. so, what they have to do is continue to talk to him. to see if there is something else other than the release of this a woman he is willing to give up. but i can tell you the swat team and if they have to they will move in. but i think can settle peacefully that is what they are technically trying to do right now. under no circumstances will negotiate the release of a hostage who has killed an american citizen. >> if that is a nonstarter, then what else might work? i think we talked about this earlier i'm not sure if it is you are danny colson. i asked if there's a possibility the negotiators would let this guy talk to his relatives. at the time we didn't know what we know now. which is not a terrible amount. we do know now is about the sister lady al qaeda who is incarcerated. we know they also of a brother in houston who is an architect. perhaps may be the brother in houston >> perhaps the brother in houston, they may very well permit him to speak to the hostage taker. steve rogers spoke about it earlier that maybe he could speak to his sister that's in prison, and that would perhaps lead to a peaceful solution. i'm not so sure about that because she's already are radicalized to the degree where she very well may say something to him that would set him off instead of being beneficial and helpful to the fbi. so the fbi has to take that into consideration. but some -- what they're doing is they're dealing with a psychological profile, arthel. so when i say that, they know that he loves his family because he's spoken about his family. they know that he loves his children, because he's spoken about his children. so there is that possibility while they may not let him speak to the sister, that they may let him speak to one of the family members who he loves to see about bringing this to a peaceful solution. arthel: that's right. the brother in houston, who's an architect according to the report. and, again, his children, as you said. they have already, you know, they don't have access to one family member who is incarcerated right now, lady al-qaeda. so then you also have this guy who can, you know, as we've been talking, this guy can walk away from this situation. he may not go home today, but he can walk out of this situation alive. and maybe they -- and that's what negotiators are hoping for, to leapt this guy know that that's what we want. we want you to walk away alive just like your family does. again, now weaver looking at four and a half hours, ted, of negotiating. what's happening, do you think, there with these conversations between negotiators and the hostage taker? >> well, i think these are very experienced negotiators, and they know what they're doing. they know what thresholds they've reached with this guy at this stage. there may very well be members of the kong redivision because -- congregation because it is my understanding there are 3-4 hostages there, that they may also be able to talk to guy and establish some kind of a rapport with him. so what is going on is they're trying to wear him down, should we say. they're trying to find out if there's some, something alternative to releasing his sister from prison that he's willing to take at this immediate time. you've said it very well, it may be that if he's very close to his brother, the one that's in houston, that they will try to put that person on the phone with this hostage taker. they, they're trying to find out if there's some alternative solution other than the release of the sister. finish. arthel: yeah. ted williams, thank you, as always, for your expert analysis and coverage, and we'll be talking to you, i'm sure, throughout the evening here on fox news. eric, over to you now. you have something, an interesting observation. we're talking about this brother in houston who we're told is an architect. you said maybe he's in dallas. we don't know where he is. eric: yeah. that brother in houston, we don't know. it's not confirmed, but that could be the man who's inside the synagogue. as far as we know -- we do not know. we will know when the details come out as this hostage situation in texas is continuing. ♪ ♪ >> hello, everyone. i'm jackie deangelis along with joey jones, lara trump and leo terrell, and welcome come to "the big saturday show." a rabbi and three others are being held hostage at a synagogue in colleyvilleing, texas. the suspect reportedly claims that he's the brother of a woman who is a convicted terrorist. bryan llenas is here with what we know so far. >> reporter: good evening.