case. former u.s. attorney michael moore will break down the charges and what could happen when the jury comes in with a verdict. arthel. arthel: eric, thank you. first, i think we have a reporter on one of our other big stories that's happening that is going to tell me, producer, which reporter are we going to now? okay. all right. we're going to go to david spunt. he is at the white house. david. >> reporter: hi, arthel. tomorrow is a big day for president biden as he signs his bipartisan infrastructure package into law. it's something that the white house has been touting for several times but the white house is acutely aware of the supply chain crisis that continues to manifest itself, that's been going on for several weeks and it looks like it's not going to be ending any time soon. gas prices, arthel, continue to climb. store shelves in many cases bare and those cargo ships continue to sit off the coast of california, waiting to pull port. weeks after we first reported on the story there's still a backlog and don't forget the trucker shortage. >> economists across the board also agree that the president's economic agenda, the bipartisan infrastructure bill that he will sign on monday and the build back better bill that we are working to move forward will not add to inflationary pressure and will ease inflationary pressure over the long term. >> reporter: the president says the answer to some of these issues, namely inflation, is his build back better social spending bill. still has not passed yet. he wants to sign it into law as soon as possible. we are learning, arthel, there is yet another delay. congressional correspondent chad pergram reporting that chuck shy schumer is delaying the senate vote because it's not come up in the house and there's no score from the congressional budget office to illustrate the exact cost. this comes as president biden, a new approval poll shows 41% of the people understand and appreciate his overall presidency. coronavirus pandemic, 47% say he's doing a good job. the economy, 39% say he's doing a good job. the president will hit the road to tout that bipartisan infrastructure package. he'll be headed to new hampshire and michigan. also, this is notable, as if this upcoming week is not busy enough, president biden will have a virtual summit with chinese president xi jinping, that's going to be the first time the two have met in several months. they have a relationship going back many years when joe biden was vice president. but they will be meeting virtually. many topics to discuss. arthel: it's my understanding that president biden will be meeting with the president of mexico, if you didn't already say that. wow. okay. busy week ahead and you'll be busy as well, david spunt at the white house. thank you so much. well, the justice department vowing to fight back after a federal appeals court extended the temporary ruling that has halted president biden's vaccine mandate. the rule, if put back in effect, would require companies with more than 100 employees to have their staff either be fully vaccinated or take weekly testing. this is supposed to start by january 4th. let's go to alexandria huff, she is following all of this for us, she is live in washington of. what more can you tell us. >> reporter: the fifth circuit court of appeals called the president's mandate staggeringly overboard. late friday they upheld the decision to halt the administration's covid-19 vaccine mandate for companies that employ over 100 people. the sweeping mandates were announced in september and met with immediate pushback. more than half of u.s. states are now suing to block the requirement. here's texas attorney general ken paxton of speaking with chris wallace on fox news sunday. >> the federal government has no authority to do this. right now, we have osha guidelines, not been authorized by congress. they interest no authority to do this. >> reporter: the three underpanel based in new orleans sided with opponents on the basis of withholding constitutional civil liberties. they noted the economic impact in the one size fits all nature of the mandates. the biden administration warned the court's decision could lead to hundreds of unnecessary deaths. >> it would be a setback for public health. what we know very clearly is that when people get vaccinated and the more people who get vaccinated, the quicker we're able to bring this pandemic to an end. the more lives we can ultimately save. >> reporter: and again, the justice department says they're willing to fight this case all the way to the supreme court. arthel. arthel: okay, alexandria huff. thank you. eric: arthel, it's an echo of the new york city jogger case that happened during the high crime era in new york city. now police have arrested a suspect in the latest assault and rape of a jogger in central park. the 25-year-old homeless man has a troubling criminal record we're told. he was arrested in florida last year for a similar attack. it is just the most recent brazen act of violence if the city as the brand-new mayor-elect eric adams pledges to crack down on violent crime. mollie line now with more. mollie. >> reporter: hello, eric. you laid it out there very well, this ongoing wave of violence in new york city, it's caught the attention of the entire nation and the incoming mayor is vowing to address this ongoing violence. this past thursday a jogger in central park was raped. this happened just shortly after 7:00 a.m. in the morning. police released surveillance images of a man dressed in black fleeing the scene, identified as paully vilez, a 25-year-old homeless man, he was arrested yesterday, charged with rape, robbery and strangulation. the new york post reporting he is wanted in florida for a similar attack, accused of dragging a woman off the sidewalk, charged with kidnapping and sexual battery. the alleged predator never appeared back in court after making a plea deal. now he's held without bail. mayor-he elect eric adams vowed to name a new police commissioner. the reported short list is filled with women, from players from seattle and newark. he promised to bring back plain clothessed police officers aiming to combat gun violence, despite pushback from hawk newsom who criticized the plan, warning of fire and bloodshed. he was pressed on his words. >> do you condemn riots and burning down buildings after a police use of force incident you don't like? >> no, i can -- what i'll say is i understand when a police officer unjustify aabley killed someone, why people lash out. i understand that completely. >> i didn't ask -- why can't you answer the question? >> i'm not going to condemn. >> you can't answer the question. >> nor am i going to condone it. >> reporter: he later walked out on the interview, accusing him of trying to bait him. eric. eric: thanks so much. and a day in court tomorrow for steve bannon, the one-time white house advisor and close trump aide is expected to turn himself in and appear before a judge in washington. he was indicted on two counts of contempt of congress. he is refusing to testify before the house committee investigating the january 6th attack on our democracy and turn in documents that could shed light about the planning and any role the former president and his top advisors may have had in the efforts to challenge and overturn the presidential election and the ultimate violent criminal riot that put our nation's capitol under a destructive siege. if convicted, bannon could face from 30 days to one year in jail. other subpoenaed witnesses like former national security advisor mike flynn say they will cooperate but like bannon form earn white house chief of staff mark meadows continues to defy that panel. arthel: americans are feeling the pain in their wallets, skyrocketing inflation, soaring bass prices, it's -- gas prices, it's putting a strain on families you ahead of the holidays. president biden saying the build back better plan will help the inflation situation but is more spending what the u.s. needs right now? when critics say it's what helped us get here in the first place. we'll talk about it. ♪♪ helping them discover their dreams is one of the best parts of being a parent. one of the most important is giving them ways to fulfill them. for over 150 years, generations have trusted the strength and stability of pacific life. because life insurance can help protect and provide for the financial futures of the ones we love. talk to a financial professional about pacific life. 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have violent criminal histories. arthel. arthel: all right, eric. back to our other top story, inflation in the u.s. is at a 30 year high and the biden administration is acknowledging americans are feeling the pain. prices of things like groceries and gas are skyrocketing just ahead of the holiday season. this morning, treasury secretary janet yellen saying the future of the economy will depend on how we get through the pandemic. >> the pandemic has been calling the shots for the economy and for inflation and if we want to get inflation down, i think continuing to make progress against the pandemic is the most important thing we can do. arthel: joining us now is executive vice president of the national taxpayers union, brandon arnold. so brandon, do you agree with secretary yellen? what percentage of this inflation is caused by the pandemic? >> well, i think what this administration needs to do, first of all, i'm glad that they're finally recognizing that inflation is a problem because just a month ago the white house chief of staff was telling us it's only affecting high income individuals, not recognizing that working class and everyday americans are getting walloped by inflation. now they're trying to pass a piece of legislation that would make the problem significantly worse rather than better. so he yes, the pandemic is a huge factor here, secretary yellen is right in that. what the administration needs to do is stop making things worse. put together a plan that actually improves the situation rather than exacerbates it. arthel: they would say their plan would improve it, but let me move on. how much, though -- because this brings me to my next thought. how much is political stagnation contributing to the current inflation? >> well, it's a big problem. if this administration was willing, for instance, to take on labor unions, to move to port automation, to try to expand hours. they've done that a little bit but i think those kinds of changes to our logistical hangups would go a long way to alleviate some inflationary problems that getting the products to consumers, to businesses, faster than it's currently happening. there are things like reducing tariffs. that would tick off labor unions and make them upset with the administration but getting tariffs actually would go a long way to helping our manufacturing sector and to helping consumers right on the eve of course of the holiday season when people are really going to feel the pinch when they can't get products that they want to give as gifts when those gifts are extraordinarily expensive, toys, consumer electronics and so forth. arthel: well, the president has worked with the ports like the port of los angeles, the port of long beach, to -- for them to start operating at 24/7 to sort of ease that pain. so we'll see, hopefully that will help. meanwhile, according to the labor -- the bureau of labor, you've got gas prices that are up 50%. i want to ask you, would tapping into oil reserves or maybe temporarily banning oil exports would that help ease the pain or is that notion too simple for a complex undertaking. >> yeah, we have the highest gas prices in seven years so taping into the strategic reserves certainly makes sense right now but a lot of these problems of course could have been solved in the first place if we hadn't shut down the keystone pipeline, one of the very first orders of business for this administration, if we hadn't limited exploration and extraction of oil from alaska and this bill, this is one of the reasons why i think this bill us misguided, the build back better plan further restricts energy exploration. arthel: when you talk about exploring or exporting more energy through pipelines, i mean, does that include fracking and from what i remember, fracking is a bad word. >> yeah, they made fracking a bad word. arthel: who made that a bad word? >> i think the left did. i think when we saw the energy boon there was concern we were pursuing less clean forms of electricity and everyone wants to generate power, particularly the left, from solar, from wind, from the clean sources. i think it makes sense to transition to them but you have to transition in a manner that recognizes some of the limitations that the market is facing now. just flipping a switch and going to solar all of a sudden doesn't recognize the fact that there are people very dependent on traditional fossil fuels and other types of electricity generation. arthel: okay. this one may -- you may arrest may not like the next question -- may or may not like the next question, what about a flat tax rate. everyone would proportionally pay taxes and there would be more government to cover voter approved expenses. is that one possible solution? >> i'm not in favor of increasing tax revenues right now. i think we can do pro growth tax reform in a fashion that lowers rates and simplifies the code. that's something we advocated for years. and we got a long way toward that in 2017 with the tax cuts and jobs act. i don't think moving to a flat taxis realistic right now but what we need the to do is preserve some of the gains that we made. of course, this administration is trying to undo them. arthel: a well, let me ask you this. because i know you're the vice president of the national taxpayers union, so i realize who i'm speaking to on this one, brandon. you've got some folks who would say, hey, listen, the former president, he gave all of these tax benefits to the rich and that took millions if not trillions of dollars off the table and out of government coffers so they could pay for the expenses that now we're up against the wall trying to cover. you say what to that in. >> well, i think what we need to toys put things into perspective. the tax cuts and jobs act reduced revenue by $1.7 trillion. the plan passed by this administration on a partisan basis back in march increased spending, increased the deficit by $2 trillion. so already larger than what the tax cuts and jobs a act did over a 10-year period. now they want to double down on that. the bipartisan infrastructure plan, that increases the deficit by more than $250 billion. this additional piece of legislation, the build back better plan, you could be talking about 2 trillion, 2 and-a-half trillion dollars. arthel: over the course of 10 years. i get it. let me ask you one final. i have to go. but i want to ask you, what is -- politics aside for me, brandon. what is the most immediate solution that you think you could offer to get this relief for the american taxpayers and not just taxpayers, consumers right now, they can't get stuff they need on their table for thanksgiving. they're already going through it. this is the last thing people need to deal with. >> yeah. i mean, i think this administration needs to be honest with people. it took the highest inflation rate since 19 -- arthel: i'm asking you, brandon. please give me a direct answer. what is your idea? please. >> there is no magic wand. reducing tariffs. you can't snap your fingers and make inflation go away. inflation is here to stay for a little bit. we need to scale back spending. we need to abide by budget austerity rather than spending the administration is trying to pursue. there is no silver bullet because inflation is caused by a lot of factors. it's a complicated problem that requires complicated, serious solutions. arthel: appreciate that. brandon arnold, thank you very much. eric. eric: the jury in the trial of 18-year-old kyle rittenhouse, well, it gets the case tomorrow. will they convict him of the killings or agree with him that he shot those protesters dead in self-defense? the charges, the evidence, and what the jury could decide, straight ahead here on "fox news live." >> tech: when you get a chip in your windshield... trust safelite. this couple was headed to the farmers market... when they got a chip. they drove to safelite for a same-day repair. and with their insurance, it was no 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who has said he will let them consider some lesser charges. what does that mean and what can we expect? alexis mcadams is live outside the courthouse in kenosha. alexis. >> reporter: arthel, that's right, deliberations begin tomorrow in kenosha, wisconsin. the judge in the area is going to have to make up his mind on if he allows the jury to deliberate on lesser charges. the decision will be made today before everything begins again tomorrow in that courthouse behind me. so wisconsin law does allow the prosecution and defense to ask that jurors be told they can consider lesser charges before they start deliberating. the judge will then allow jurors to consider some of the lesser charges and he made the decision just the other day. but he also denied one of those requests which is important to note. legal experts tell fox news the tradeoff could help get a conviction and it would also ensure that rittenhouse would not receive a life sentence. closing arguments begin tomorrow and that's when names will be drawn to decide which 12 jurors will deliberate and will eight will be dismissed. last summer more than 100 businesses were badly damaged or destroyed during the unrest that followed the police shooting of jacob blake. business owners say a they're pen tally preparing for -- mentally preparing for possible unrest following the trial. >> i think we'll be a little more prepared this time. before it came out of nowhere, things went left real quick. i pray it doesn't happen again. i don't see it happening. i don't see it happening. they're taig the measurements to -- taking the mesherments to get on top of it before. >> reporter: wisconsin's governor said the state continues to be in close contact with partners on a local level, saying the kenosha community hays been strong, resilient, has come together through incredibly difficult times and that healing is ongoing. i urge folks who are otherwise not from the area to please respect the community by reconsidering any plans to travel here. we did talk to the kenosha county sheriff dem. -- department. they say they're prepared but are not expecting anything. deliberations begin tomorrow here in wisconsin. arthel: alexis, thank you. eric. eric: innocent victim or armed vigilante. a former u.s. attorney with jois with more. six counts, among them intentional homicide. how do you think the jury will sort it out. >> it will be interesting. there's nothing particularly unusual about having lesser offenses that are charged to the jury. and it does give some leeway, some compromise if they feel the state hasn't met their burden of proof on certain elements. my guess is there will be some compromise at least on a couple counts. i think likely on the count where the gentleman had the pistol drawn, that may be an excuse for the jury to give that one away and a find that rittenhouse was involved in self-defense. i think when you start talking about whether or not he was hit with a skateboard and that type of thing by one of the victims, that becomes a little bit more unbelievable given that he had no injuries. and his idea that -- or statement at least that he was trying to shoot people because they grabbed his gun when he had it pointed at them so he had to point to defend himself or stop the threat. he had a scripted examination. that's tougher to believe too. i don't think it's going to be lost on this jury that there weren't a lot of real -- what appears to be at least tears coming out of a performance on the stand. eric: that skateboard claim dealt with anthony huber whos was one of the deceased who was shot, that he got hit in the neck with a skateboard. joseph rosenbaum, he testified that he threatened him and tried to grab his gun. let's listen to some of rittenhouse on the stand. >> i didn't do anything wrong. i defended myself. if i would have let mr. rosenbaum take my firearm from me he would have used it and killed me with it and probably killed more people if i would have let him get my gun. eric: does that make the jury then maybe clear him on self-defense? >> it's a hard for me to imagine that. i mean, he basically said, look, if i stopped mr. rosenbaum -- or if he had stopped him, he might have killed other people. well, rittenhouse was the one killing people that day. it's not lost on me either that in a case down in south georgia, at the same time, the defendants are arguing that somebody who tried to grab a gun to keep from getting shot deserved to get shot under the theory of self-defense. it's a ridiculous argument to make. maybe all that they have and sometimes if you're a defense attorney you sort of dance with what brung you and that is here they've got a guy who shouldn't have had an ar-15 walking through a crowded area he shouldn't have been in shooting people and coming up with reasons and, again, a very well scripted response to questions by the prosecutor. eric: do you think -- i mean, did he do himself a favor by testifying. it's unusual in a high profile case of to put the defendant on the stand. >> it's always a tough kale whether or not to put your -- call whether or not to put your client on the stand. i think there was some element to see a young kid, basically an 18-year-old kid on the stand who was saying i was scared. i think the problem is is that he really -- his responses, at least to me, sounded much, much too scripted. and i've said that a couple times because his answers were trying to fit the law as opposed to tell his own story about what he was feeling and i thought that his emotional outburst seemed to be fake. you know, i would have -- it's hard to have a big emotional outburst and tell back into telling the law. it would have looked for genuine if i were a jury to see him break down, lay his head on the witness rail there, weep for a while and basically ask for forgiveness for what happened and explain how much he hated it as opposed to well, i was trying to stop this threat against me. by the way, the guy was hitting me with a skateboard. i know i don't have a mark on my body. at some point it defies credulity. eric: the third person talked about pointing his gun at rest in-house's head. here's what he said. >> i thought the defendant was an active t shooter. >> with your arms up in the head, he never fired, right? >> correct. >> it wasn't until you pointed your gun at him, advanced on him, with your gun -- now your hands down, pointed at him, that he fired, right? >> correct. eric: doesn't that type of testimony favor rittenhouse? >> you know, it starts to favor rittenhouse but it must drive the second amendment advocates crazy. the theory is you have a right to a gun to protect yourself. here you have an individual that was there as a paramedic apparently who sees a guy with an ar15, he's shooting people and takes his gun and points it at him. somehow because he pointed the gun at the shooter, it justifies at least in the rittenhouse theory, justifies him being shot. so again, some of this just going to be whether or not the jury thinks that he had a right to be there, he was legitimately there, whether or not he should have had the weapon, whether or not he was actually provoked, whether or not he's telling the truth on the stand about the threats that he felt or whether or not he is just a good parrot and repeating things that he was told by his defense attorneys. so there's a risk to putting him up and we'll see which way it goes. eric: finally, what do you think is going to happen when the jury comes in. >> >> i think it's likely to be a guilty verdict at least on some of the counts. i think the charge with the gentleman where rittenhouse says he was hit with a skateboard, i think that's likely a conviction. i think that the first charge for the gentleman that was chasing him in the parking lot according to the testimony, i'm not sure the prosecutors know exactly what happened in that case, that will probably be a compromised verdict. wouldn't surprise me to see the jury acquit him on the charge where the gentleman had the weapon even though i think he had a right to defend himself against rittenhouse to stop a tragic and unbelievable situation. i think if they look for a compromise, sometimes juries split verdict, they're not told by the way what the sentences are so they're told what the law is and they're to apply the facts to the law. they don't know that some of them carry a life sentence, some carry up to 60 years. the jury is not supposed to concern itself with the punishment, just whether or not the state's proven guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. eric: the jury gets the case tomorrow. always good to see you. thank you. >> great to be with you. eric: of course. arthel. arthel: eric, we're going to go down south now where a steady stream of migrants crossing into la jolla the texas last night as border patrol tries to keep up with the massive and constant surge of illegal immigrants. bill melugin is live at the border with the latest. bill. >> reporter: good afternoon to you. once again it was a very active night out here i la jolla with masses of migrants crossing over. this was right where we are standing last night here in la lajolla, a group of migrants crossed illegally here, this was mostly those family units coming across. masses of families. once again, we saw this all summer long. there was a little bit of a lull. now it's starting up again. most of the families have different color wristbands on when they crossed which means they were pushed across by the cartels a at a certain location, at a certain time. as part of this group, there was one unaccompanied minor, boy, 5-year-old boy from guatemala who made the journey completely alone. it's remarkable when you think about it but it is not uncommon. border agents told us this little boy's parents are here in the united states but this sort of thing happens all the time. just in fiscal year 2021, there were 147,000 unaccompanied minors who made this journey alone, crossing here into the united states. that's up five times what it was in 2020. it's not just at night. take a look at this video we shot at the same spot early this morning. more migrants crossing over once again, family units with these family units we see it all year long, they are not the runners, not trying to get away. the they look for border patrol. they give themselves up in hopes that the biden administration's policies will allow them to be released into the united states with a future court date and again, it's not just here in the rio grande valley where this is heating up. it's he'll where in texas. -- elsewhere in texas. take a look at the photos of the del-rio sector. this is the eagle pass section where 225 were caught in one day. the eagle pass station, one of the border patrol stations in del-rio sector has been averaging more than 500 apprehensions every day so far this month. eagles pass is the new hot spot in the del-rio sector and back out here live, i mentioned this yesterday, we see all these family units coming across. what we don't see are the runners all the time. some of them get through. just on friday alone, in a 24 hour period a dhs source tells us in the rio grande valley sector there were more than 226 known got-aways who made it through the border and were never apa preparedded by -- apprehended by border agents. back to you. arthel: bill melugin, thank you. eric: nearly 200 countries including ours, some of the world's worst polluters reached a climate deal at the summit in glasgow. next, the compromises they made and what the agreement really means and will it work. every business is on a journey. and along the ride, you'll find many challenges. ♪ your dell technologies advisor can help you find the right tech solutions. so you can stop at nothing for your customers. ♪♪ fresh flavors... classic dishes... ♪♪ and a new seat at the table. ♪♪ ♪ an[laughing and giggling]le. 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(vo) reflect on the past, celebrate the future. season's greetings from audi. paul loves food. but his diabetes made food a mystery. everything felt like a "no". but then paul went from no to know. with freestyle libre 2, now he knows how food affects his glucose. and he knows when to make different choices. take the mystery out of your glucose levels, and lower your a1c. now you know. try it for free. visit freestylelibre.us to be a thriver with metastatic breast cancer means asking for what we want, and need... and we need more time. so, we want kisqali. living longer is possible and proven with kisqali when taken with a nonsteroidal aromatase inhibitor in premenopausal women with hr+, her2- metastatic breast cancer. kisqali is a pill that's significantly more effective at delaying disease progression versus a nonsteroidal aromatase inhibitor alone. kisqali can cause lung problems or an abnormal heartbeat, which can lead to death. it can cause serious skin reactions, liver problems, and low white blood cell counts that may result in severe infections. tell your doctor right away if you have new or worsening symptoms, including breathing problems, cough, chest pain, a change in your heartbeat, dizziness, yellowing of the skin or eyes, dark urine, tiredness, loss of appetite, abdomen pain, bleeding, bruising, fever, chills, or other symptoms of an infection, a severe or worsening rash, are or plan to become pregnant, or breastfeeding. avoid grapefruit during treatment. kisqali is not approved for use with tamoxifen. ask your doctor about living longer with kisqali. eric: it's sunday, that means services in churches across the country, this as reports of attacks against catholic churches in our country are on the rise. from arson to vandalism and other property crimes, one group is saying it's part of a rise in anti-catholic bias. lauren green explains. >> reporter: cat lick officials say while -- catholic officials say while vandalism is a crime, they see it as a spiritual issue. in brooklyn, a large crucifix is tackled at a roman catholic church, the face of jesus lay in the dirt, a suspect captured a week later. the struggle to understand why lingers. >> i thought of the line from scripture, father forgive them, for they know not what they do. the parish was deeply hurt. it was really an offense to the church. it was an offense to the catholic faith. and no matter how sick this person might be, it really was offensive. >> reporter: since may of 2020, the united states conference of catholic bishops tracked 111 incidents of vandalism against catholic churches in 29 states and the number continues to rise. incidents include this arson fire that heavily damaged the 250-year-old church in california. there's been statues beheaded, limbs cut and graffiti. >> we're trying to get a handle on it. and achieve a better understanding of what's going on so that we might be able to achieve some sort of feeling here. >> reporter: the fbi's stats show there are 10 times more hate crimes against jews than catholics and nearly twice as many against muslims but the numbers show a decrease between 2019 and 2020 while religious based hate crimes against catholics during the same period. >> i've never seen anything like it with the evidence we've been able to see. >> reporter: the catholic league blames liberal political forces. >> the west is angry at america and western civilization, that means you have to be angry at the catholic church. it's one of the pinnacles of western civilization. >> reporter: faith groups are lobbying lawmakers, asking them to make houses of worship eligible for government grants to help pay for increased security. eric: that really is a shame. lauren green, thank you. arthel. arthel: eric and lauren, well, approval of pfizer's booster shots for those 18 and older could come sooner than expected. dr. march makary -- marty makary gives us his thoughts. he's up next. type 2 diabetes knocking you out of your zone? 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ask your health care provider today about once-weekly ozempic®. oh, oh, oh, ozempic®! you may pay as little as $25 for a 3-month prescription. >> the fda is considering broadening the eligibility after a request from pfizer to do so but what they're going to do is take a close look at the data. they want to make especially sure that the booster shots are safe and effective for the population that is not currently eligible. once they determine that, they will make a recommendation there. arthel: surgeon general on the fanses the food and drug administration will approve pfizer's booster shots for adults 18 and older. the fda previously held back on approving it for everyone, saying they was not enough evidence on fading immunity for the booster shots. the department of justice says it will defend the president's vaccine mandate for large businesses after a federal appeals court upheld the stay in one of several lawsuits against the mandate by a total of 27 states. here to weigh in on all of this is dr. marty makary, a fox news contributor, professor of health, policy and management. first, dr. makary, in terms of the fda perhaps making a decision about this booster without consulting advisors first, is this a normal or unusual to you? >> well, it's very unusual and i hope it's not true. cnn is reporting from an inside source that it may very well be likely but it would represent really suppressing scientific discussion around an important topic, one where the experts clearly had significant concernses because it really fueled a vigorous discussion in the prior fda expert meeting around boosters and at the cdc expert meeting around boosters, both conversations basically concluded that it should be in a limited population because they haven't seen enough data in a broader population. those concerns need to be listened to. unfortunately, the fda has a precedent of not convening experts when they don't want to. they did that with the vaccine for kids 12-15. arthel: so many people are nervous about the covid vaccine, whether or not they should get it, whether or not their children should have it. i mean, what's the real information that people need to focus on right now, if you're older, if you're not older, you want to be -- you want to protect yourself, you have a child. give me some straight answers, dr. makary. >> i think the bottom line is the boosters are ideal for people over 65 or over 50 with significant risk factors. otherwise, we don't have a lot of clear data that shows the benefit of the booster outweighs the potential risk. when you get into the younger population under 30, the risk of myocarditis is unknown. maybe it's toledoses for older and -- three doses for older and high risk and maybe one for young children. two fda officials at the highest level left in disgust over political interference from the fda. under the last administration that would have been a two month story. this does threaten the public trust in the public health officials's message. arthel: what you're talking about in terms of vaccinations, you're talking about the booster shot right now. you're still on board -- >> that's right. arthel: and approve us getting our first two shots of pfizer and moderna to fight against covid? >> that's right. now, in young folks, in kids who are healthy, maybe one dose, maybe the recommendation of pediatricians, some are recommending that because, remember, you're talking of a low baseline starting risk. anyone who has not had covid already should get vaccinated. no one should be dying of covid right now. between vaccinations and the therapeutics out there, not the controversial ones but ones with randomized control trials, nobody should be dying of covid with rather exceptions. >> you said anyone who hasn't had covid should get vaccinated. >> that's right. arthel: what about those that had covid, should they be vaccinated. >> we're having a discussion about immunity after prior infections. natural immunity is real. it's durable. we're coming on two years. we don't see reinfections after prior covid infection result in severe illness or death. we don't see it. it's rare, when it occurs it's an exception. natural immunity does appear to be protective. the cdc and fda and the current administration is in denial that natural immunity is legitimate. it's in part to have a simple, streamlined message to tell everyone to get vaccinated. it's in part because they don't want people to get the infection instead of vaccination and i agree with that but we can encourage vaccination and be honest at the same time. arthel: that's a gamble if you got covid, you don't know how your body will react, if you're going to live or die, frankly. quickly, doesn't natural immunity wane as well, i'm up against the clock, doesn't that wane as well, natural immunity. >> 19 months in, it's going strong. we'll have to see what the long-term data shows. so far it appears to be strong enough to show there's no scientific basis for requiring vaccinations in that group. arthel: if you haven't had covid, do you recommend us getting vaccinated? >> yes. arthel: okay. thank you. dr. marty makary, thank you very much. we appreciate your answers. all right. we'll talk to you again soon. thank you. >> arthel, the covid infections, they're rising in the northern states and mountain west. colder winters here, people are inside, so please take it seriously. we're back at 4:00. >> are you ready to start a great career? >> safelite is now hiring. >> you will love your job. >> there's room to grow... >> ...and lots of opportunities. >> so, what are you waiting for? >> apply now... >> ...and make a difference. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪ >> man, i love that song! ok everyone, our mission is to provide complete, balanced nutrition for strength and energy. whoo hoo! ensure, with 27 vitamins and minerals, now introducing ensure complete! with 30 grams of protein. hello, for the last few years, i've been a little obsessed with chasing the big idaho potato truck. but it's not like that's my only interest. i also love cooking with heart-healthy, idaho potatoes. always look for the grown in idaho seal. the worst genocide in human history also destroyed the lives of thousands of jewish survivors still suffering today. god calls on people who believe in him to act on his word. "comfort ye, comfort my people." especially during this holiday season of hanukkah. when i come here and i sit with lilia i realize what she needs right now is food. these elderly jews are weak and they're sick. they're living on $2 a day this now, is how god's children are living. take this time to send a survival food box to these forgotten jews. the international fellowship of christians and jews urgently need your gift of $25 now to help provide one survival food box with all of the essentials they critically need for their diet for one month. your special holiday gift will provide everything they need to celebrate the miracle of hanukkah. this is the first time in over 70 years that she has anything to do with faith. the communists came and wiped it out. and now we're coming to her and saying, "it's okay to have faith." it's okay to light the hanukkah candles. for just $25, you can help supply the essential foods they desperately need for one month. i just want to encourage all of you to join with yael eckstein and the wonderful work of the international fellowship of christians and jews. god tells us to take care of them, to feed the hungry. and i pray holocaust survivors will be given the basic needs that they so desperately pray for to survive. 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