today on "inside politics," more problems, more money. donald trump's donors foot an enormous legal bill and the trump co-conspirator accused of trying to destroy evidence for the boss sees the inside of a federal court. the polls. all of them. all for donald trump. republican voters fall in line behind the frontrunner as ron desantis' reasons for running appear to fall flat. and the president corrects how he counts. joe biden acknowledges his seventh grandchild for the first time and now he hopes it returns to being a private matter. i'm dana bash. let's go behind the headlines and "inside politics." up first, saving america or saving his skin. today we see on paper how much money from donors donald trump spent on legal bills. sources put that number north of $40 million for his own defense and the defense of those who are sticking with him. this morning, cnn cameras captured the glimpse of one of those individuals carlos de oliveira, the man federal prosecutors say schemed with mr. trump and walt nauta to shield evidence from federal investigators. the mar-a-lago property manager made his first appearance inside a federal court and we're going to start there in south florida where randi kaye is posted. what did we see this morning, randi? >> reporter: well, dana, this was our first look at carlos de oliveira as he entered into the courthouse here just behind me. he was wearing a navy blue suit and a tie. he went inside with his lawyer john irving who was here from washington, d.c. when he stood it at the lectern to address the judge, he said good morning, and then the judge proceeded to lay out the charges that he is facing. he said he understood the charges, he understood that he had a right to remain silent and speak to a lawyer. then they went on to talk about a bond. the judge went on to set a $100,000 what they call a personal signature bond so he doesn't have to pay it, but he doesn't have to stay behind bars right now. he was asked, dana, about a passport. he says he does have a u.s. passport, but it's expired. still, the judge told him that he had to turn that over within 48 hours. he was told he can't leave south florida without permission. the area of south florida. and then he was also given a witness list of the list of government witnesses, and he was informed that he cannot speak to those witnesses that are on that that have been identified as witnesses for the government. i can tell you he did not enter a plea. that will take place on august 10th. there is going to be an actual arraignment on august 10th in fort pierce, florida. he did not have a florida barred attorney, so he couldn't enter a plea. he needs somebody who could practice law in the state of florida to do that. that will happen on august 10. all eyes are watching this, because as we know, his case is pushed back, his arraignment is pushed back, which could impact donald trump's case when it comes to the mar-a-lago documents and we, of course, want to see whether or not he would go to trial before election day, certainly something a lot of people are watching. dana? >> thank you so much. not having an attorney present, delaying things, that sounds familiar at this point in terms of tactics. >> yeah. >> thanks. also today a nine-page dressing down from a judge to donald trump's legal team, an atlanta judge told mr. trump he will not intervene in any way right now admonishing trump's lawyers for asking that he play a, quote, guessing game. cnn's sara murray is in atlanta. explain more what this ruling was and what it means? >> reporter: well, it really is a smack down from fulton county judge. the trump team wanted fani willis disqualified from overseeing the case and wanted the evidence the special grand jury collected. they wanted it thrown out and not going to do that.ear he's here's a portiwhat he wrote. being the subject or target of a highlycized criminal investigation lik unwelcomed and unpleasant experience no court has ever held that that status alone provides a basis for the courts to interfere with or halt the investigation. now part of the trump team push is trying to get mcburnry in tossed off, the judge who ruled today, another judge set a hearing on august 10th on that matter so we'll see if that hearing goes forward or if this is just the final word we get before we head into potential indictments. >> that is, of course, the obvious question. any tea leaves you're able to read down there in georgia about when and if that could happen? >> well, we're officially in the window for when she could potentially announce indictments, security precautions are being taken. i still think we're more like a week or two away, rather than a day or two away. but our affiliate here in georgia caught up with fani willis over the weekend at a back-to-school event and she was very clear even though people may not like the decisions she's come to at the end of this investigation, she's ready to go. take a listen. >> some people may not be happy with the decisions that i am making and sometimes when people are unhappy they act in a way that could create harm. the work is accomplished. we've been working for 2 1/2 years and we're ready to go. >> reporter: and again, willis still not tipping her hand on whether she plans to charge former president donald trump or his allies or all of them together, but we should get an answer in the coming weeks. >> okay. thank you so much, sara murray, for the reporting. here with me, cnn's evan perez, cnn's kristen holmes and former prosecutor elliott williams. evan, am i being too cynical in my expression of skepticism that it de oliveira went down there without a florida-based attorney, maybe it wasn't an accident, because it automatically delays things? >> it is very hard to find lawyers in florida. very difficult. we saw -- we saw walt nauta, you know, eat up essentially a month. >> exactly. >> in between the indictment and the time he was finally brought for arraignment. today the judge pushed back when de oliveira's attorney asked for a hearing some it time at the end of august, and he said no, let's work on august 10th. so every day of delay counts. every bit of it will add up. the former president's overall goal has made it very clear is to have this happen until -- wait until after the election to actually go to trial. we'll see whether the judge, judge cannon, is going to be tolerant of this, but we know what the strategy is. >> and inside the substance of this is, of course, what we learned late last week about the superseding indictment alleging that the former president had this individual, wanted this individual to delete security footage. that showed that he allegedly had documents that he wasn't supposed to have. over the weekend, yesterday, the former president did one of those all capsts, mar-a-lago security tapes were not deleted. i never told anybody to delete them. decode that in legal speak. >> well, you're wrong in legal speak because he's saying that -- he seems to be saying that because the act of deletion wasn't completed there's no crime. the charges say inducing another person to obstruct footage and delete footage is a crime and conspiring with others to obstruct justice in the form of deleting video footage is a crime. you don't have to have deleted the footage. if i say delete that footage so law enforcement can't have access to it and take steps towards doing it, that's a crime even if the footage doesn't get deleted. >> what if he says it in a subtle way the people who know him know what he's staying. >> it's harder to prove but provable in court. they appear to have a witness, trump employee number four, as listed in the indictment, who seems to be ready to testify, we understood fully what the president was asking us to do. >> you had some reporting over the weekend about how the former president is paying r not only his legal fees but more importtlthe legal feesf those like the aide who went into the courthouse in florida today talking about the legal defense fund that he is creating. it's striking separate from the legal defense fund, how much money, political donors, have given to his political campaign and how much of that he has used to help keep himself and the people around him out of jail. >> yeah. actually that number has gone up in terms of the structure that they had for fundraising. at the beginning of the campaign, they were donating, you know, of the dollar, 1% went to the save america pac, which is what foots these legal bills and 99% of the dollar went to the campaign. quietly they changed the fundraising structure, so 10% went to save america pac and 90% went to the campaign. they'll that's a big number there. i will say when i talk to the political advisors, they say the donors know what they're getting into. they know donald trump, and he has legal issues and this money could be going toward that. >> it's not illegal. >> it's not illegal and they don't think it's going to dry up because all of a sudden they're going to be outraged learning these are going towards legal bills. $40 million is an enormous amount of money, and again, this isn't just for his bills but these associates, various investigations, essentially swept up in this, and talk about this mar-a-lago case and mentioned this, both of his co-defendants have lawyers who have been paid enormous amounts of money from the state of america pac. that is what they are footing the bill with his. >> prosecutors noticed on page 31 of the indictment, they mention this signal encrypted text chain where people are wondering where whether carlos de oliveira is loyal and the prosecutors describe the former president gets on the phone with de oliveira and says i'm going to pay for your lawyer. prosecutors are paying attention. they did not charge it in that document, in the new indictment, but you can tell, that it is something that's on their mind, it's probably something that they can bring up at trial and the question is, is it something that they want to charge, perhaps in the new indictment? >> it's mind-bending, the sort of layers to this. by that i mean, we're talking about the former president using political donations for the defense fund. we were talking among our team this morning about the fact if you layer that on top of the notion that the special counsel, part of what they're looking at is whether or not the i guess post-candidate donald trump was trying to get donors to give, to push an election lie, knowing that it was a lie? >> right. that second part is if he is misrepresenting how he is using people's money, that itself can be a crime in the form of mail or wire fraud. if you say i am going to use this money to pay for a campaign bus and pay for lawyers, then, of course -- and once you click send on the e-mail it becomes wire fraud. to kristen's point it's not illegal because people kind of know what they're getting into, but there is a fine line. >> because we can't say this enough, we say this all the time, but people might get sick of it, we're going to say it, trump legal, trump political, completely and totally intertwined and that was evident again listening to the former president on the campaign trail over the weekend in erie, pennsylvania. >> beating biden by a lot and they want to try to demean and hurt us, all of us. you know, they're not indicting me. they're indicting you. i just happen to be standing in their way. that's all it is. >> it's not about me, it's all all of you. that is probably one of his most potent arguments as you go around with him, isn't it? >> it is. it works. when we look at the different various cases and investigations and compare that to what's going on in the house with hunter biden and those investigations, we see clear differences. when donald trump standis up an faces the crowd and outlines these things as fundamentally unfair and one person is getting a plea deal, and i'm not getting a plea deal, people in the audience believe what he is saying. they are looking at this at face value, not looking at the nuance and what these investigations mean. people are angry. there's always been a little bit of resentment when it comes to republicans and the feeling of the deep state or elitists are out to get them, but it's been intensified with donald trump, as we saw in 2016, and more intensified as these investigations have continued. >> okay. thank you so much, everybody, for your reporting and insight. up next, new data to support the current republican reality. it is donald trump and then everyone else way behind. stay with us. implants makes every day... a "let's dig in" day... mm. ...a "chow down" day... a "take e a big bite" day... a "perfectly delicious" day... - mm. 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keep more of what you make. start saving today at godaddy.com i'm saving with liberty mutual, mom. they customize your car insurance so you only pay for what you need. you could save $700 dollars just by switching. ooooh, let me put a reminder on my phone. on the top of the pile! oh. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ moments ago, ron desantis, out on the trail, tried to introduce a new policy plan that he hopes voters will use to take a second look at him. >> we cannot be satisfied with simply managing this decline a little bit better than the democrats. the elites in this country have failed time and again. they've imposed policies that have proven shortsighted and counter productive. >> that is part of desantis' move to roll out a new economic plan today. oes it as he finds himself looking way up at donald trump new national poll numbers show more than half of likely republican primary voters say the former president is r first choice. that is 37 points, 37 points, ahead of ron desantiho is, again,ing to regain mo as he falls further hind trump and closer to the rest of the republican pack. the florida governor is at 17%, the next five highest polling candidates trail in the single digits. joining me now is cnn's manu raju, laura barone lopez and kristen holmes is still at the table. i mean, those numbers are absolutely striking. >> they are. when you look at what donald trump is facing in terms of these legal issues that continue to mount, this is what is keeping them going and keeping them in the fight and also really giving them the momentum to continue to say that this is election interference and that this is going to affect the 2024 election. he is the frontrunner, and he remains the frontrunner. that is why they feel like they have the kind of wind under their sails, even though, obviously, this is draining them financially. they do not want to be spending their time on this. when you see those numbers they feel they have the backing of a majority of the republican party right now so that they can say this is going to impact the election. >> it just underscores that no one has figured out how to take on donald trump. ron desantis for so much of the campaign has tried to run to donald trump's right. this really is not much room from donald trump's right. a lot of voters supported him because they liked his policies, but the argument that has not been really made effectively by the opponents is the electability argument. that is what really concerns so many republican voters that donald trump could get nominated and use a general election, cost him the house and senate. they're not making that argument effectively. hardly any discussion about all the ammunition in the indictments to go after trump. they're siding with trump's argument he is being unfairly targeted here. you're seeing an uncertainty among the republican field about how to go after him. >> i'm glad you brought up the electability questn. that is one of the many data points inside this poll, the cross tabs as they like to say in the biz, that kind of i surprising because if you look at get things done, % fo trump, desantis 22%, able to beat joe biden, electability, 58% of rublicans say he can beat joe biden when the next person behind m way behind him, 30 points behind him, is ron desantis. also by the way, just to kp thatp there, for fun, why not, 54% and desantis only 16% think he's fun. it's the electability is the key question for a lot of republicans and the people in this poll think they will beat him. >> republican voters think trump would be great in a rematch against president biden, despite the fact that ron desantis is really trying to -- and other republicans that are running against the former president, are trying to say that he can't possibly beat biden with all of these legal issues and this legal peril looming over him, but one thing i think that was also striking in the poll, dana, was the fact that when voters were asked -- republican voters were asked, do you want a candidate who will go after corporations who practice, quote, woke ideology or do you want a candidate that will not exert government control over corporations, republican voters sided with the latter. they didn't want that at all. shows why desantis' entire message to this point has not been resonating or helping him. >> which is traditionally the way republicans operate, and it has been one of the sort of dividing lines within this field, right? you have the desantis, mostly desantis, saying i'm going to use government to further republican cultural ideals and then you have others saying, no, no, no, fewer others, but that's not what republicans do, we keep government out of your lives, even if it's for things that w don't like. i want to up another leading desantis by 31%.rump trump %, desantis 31%.e race. that's interesting because of the mitt romney chris sununu argument. everybody needs to clear the field, get out, and let this be a one-on-one matchup. if it were it to be ron desantis right now, it is early, but right now, he doesn't come close. >> that was a pretty striking number in the poll. that has been the argument all along, this should be a one on one race. we shouldn't lose sight of the key fact. we have a long time, five months until the iowa caucuses. debates will happen. advertising on tv will pick up. we'll see what ultimately comes out of the potential january 6th indictment, the mar-a-lago new evidence seems to be coming out in the mar-a-lago case will that hurt him politically, we'll see. a lot of time left to shake up this field but "the new york times" poll notes no one with a lead that large has lost it. >> we have to take a break. i want to read this one quote from a voter who was part of "the new york times" poll. david green, from new hampshire, trump might say mean things and make all men cry because allhe men are wearing your wife's underpants and you can'te a man anymore. you have to be a littlsissy and cry about everything, but at the end of the day you want results. donald trump is my guy and proved it on a national level. that spoke to so many things you hear on the campaign trail. >> this is exactly what we heard in 2016 and this is now exactly what we are still hearing. they want somebody who is going to be a fighter, who they believe is going to take on this establishment as we talked at s. they want somebody they think is going to go up and name call and all these candidates not wanting to do that and saying that donald trump is the only one who can. >> coming up, president biden acknowledges for the first time that he has not six, but seven grandchildren. what prompted the public admission? details next. muscle, bone, and heheart health. yaaay! woo hoo! ensure with 25 vitamins and mininerals and ensure complete with 30 grams of protein. ♪ i need it cool at night. you trying to ice me out of the bed? baby, only on game nights. you know 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"people" magazine, voters are more likely to pick up than maybe politico. also notable, the venue for the president's first on camera acknowledgement of grandchild seven was a podcast interview with life coach jay sheddy. >> i have seven grandkids, four of them, five of them are old enough to talk on the phone. every day i text them or call them. i think being there is important and makes such a difference, knowing that someone is going to be there to listen, just to hold you, just to hug you. >> the panel is back here. i just want to read a little bit more of the statement that the president and first lady gave to "people" magazine on friday. our n hunter and navy's mother lunden are working together to foster a relationship in the best interest of their daughter as possible going forward. this is not a political issue. it is a family matter. couple things here. number one, this is a very small child. it is -- who should remain -- everything should remain private about her when it comes to images and so forth. what we are seeing here is maybe something that was expected once this became a thing, "the new york times" did a story after hunter biden acknowledged this child was his, settled a custody battle and maureen dowd wra very pointed and i think even poignant article, op-ed, saying it's seven grandkids, mr. president. that sent ripples, maybe even waves, through the political world. >> yeah. and look, it cut at his image of a family man, someone who has endured tragedies in his family and personal life and become where he is today as the president of the united states, central to his character and that cut against it. the white house had to realize that they had to address this issue, and the way they did that, eventually, the president was going to be asked about it. he has not been to this point said this and rather than saying it as he's walking to, you know, being asked by reporters as he's walking to an event sitting down and having to talk about it. if he didn't address it now it was going to come up later in the campaign season, potentially at a debate, he had to acknowledge it now as something that ultimately he was pressured to do. >> there's a lot of, you know, conversation around this in particular. everyone continues to say this is a private matter and you have people who are defending joe biden saying you have people on the right saying that this is something that we should be talking about, has a lot to do with hunter, a target of the right, so that has something at play here too. but as we talked about i think the day that that article came out on the show, you know, it was going to become an issue. it was, but it was going to get bigger especially as he maintained his silence. he cannot be the patriarch, the family man, running on that, in 2024, and not -- >> one of the things joe biden has done successfully based on tragedy, the tragedy of losing his wife and his daughter and then of course losing his adult son beau, being a relatable person. my family is like yours, it's very complicated. this is a very complicated family matter and people in and around the president say, that families deal with stuff that is complicated all the time. the difference is that his image is america's grandfather. >> he's leaned into it. during the 2020 campaign cycle something voters i interacted with during the primary as they were picking him over other democrats, was the fact that they felt that he was more rea lateble, the fact that they thought he could better win a general election and that goes to that image as you said of him being the compassionate candidate and president. >> speaking of hunter biden as we speak, a former business associate of hunter biden is testifying under oath to the house oversight committee. will he provide that smoking gun house republicans are determined to uncover? we'll get more on that coming up. ♪ (don't cha byby callaway/ray plays) ♪ ( ♪ ♪ ) don't cha wishour phone was fun like this? 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[whip sound] take the first step to see if your small business qualifies. meet the team all using chase to keep up with their finances. smart bankers. convenient tools. boom. one bank with the power of both. chase. make more of what's yours. . - [announcer] do you have an invention idea but don't know what to do next? call invent help today. they can help you get started with your idea. call now 800-710-0020. republicans say he's got a smoking gun and he's an eyewitness to biden corruption, but it's really unclear how much evidence devon archer can offer. the former hunter biden business partner is testifying behind closed doors as we speak before the house oversight committee and want to get to zach cohen. zach, what are you learning so far about what is actually happening behind closed doors, the most important question is obviously will this individual, archer, bring the goods that republicans insist that he has? >> reporter: dana, republicans really couldn't have set the bar higher leading up into this interview, an, you know, devon archer has been sitting in this building behind me with lawmakers for about two and a half hours now, and it's not clear as you said if he's delivering the goods that republicans want, but, you know, democrats going in were very skeptical. dan goldman, congressman, a member of this committee, i caught up with him, and he said look, of all the documents that archer has turned over and everything he's already told them, there is no evidence linking the president himself to any of his son's foreign business dealings. a high bar set by republicans, again, and the thing with closed door interviews, i'm sure we'll get different sides of the story from republicans and democrats when they come out. >> that is a guaranteed fact. no question. very different recounting of what happened inside. zach, thank you so much for that. the packnel is back here. this is all about whether or not republicans can find any evi evidence, which they have yet to put forward, of their repeated accusation that the president, joe biden, had knowledge of or a connection to hunter biden's business dealings in ukraine and china. but the allegation is pay for play, right? let's see, zach talked about republicans setting the bar very high on what this individual, devon archer, hunter biden's former business partner, will say in his closed-door testimony, let's play some of what republicans have said before. >> this is a person who was in business with hunter biden and biden family members, the bff of the president's son. he has a lot of information, i believe, that we'll be able to fact check and corroborate with other witnesses and whistleblowers. >> my guess is this guy, devon archer, is going to testify he saw vp biden talking about business dealings with hunter. it's serious when you have credible allegations of foreign bribery of the sitting president of the united states. >> we are going to bring people in now for depositions and interviews who were a part of some of these transactions and say what exactly triggered this million dollar transaction? >> manu, you run around and talk to these republican congress people all day, every day. has any of them once provided evidence of what they are claiming? >> well, not anything other than circumstantial evidence. james comer who you just showed, chairman of the committee, i asked him in that same gaggle, do you have direct evidence linking the president to hunter biden's business dealings and essentially corroborating what they're saying is a bribery scandal that occurred when joe biden was vice president dealing with a foreign national, and he said no, they have a pattern of behavior. they chased down the pattern of behavior to define that evidence and they're going to have a number of interviews, this being one of them, to try to corroborate some of these claims. the question is can they -- will that corroborate any of these claims and the credibility of this witness too, dealing with kahn vickion on an unrelated fraud case, and i'm sure democrats will make a point of that coming out of this, but that's what they're trying to do, lay the predicate for an impeachment inquiry in the fall are, but will they have the evidence is the question. >> impeachment inquiry, but also the notion of a two-tiered justice system, the buzzword we're hearing over and over again, and you have the former president really trying to stir the pot on this issue. let's listen to what he said on saturday calling out his republican brethren on the hill. >> the biggest complaint that i get is that the republicans find out this information and then they do nothing about it. any republican that doesn't act on democrat fraud should be immediately primaried and get out. out. >> fraud. alleged fraud to which there is no evidence that they have provided yet. >> yeah. actually, right after the news on thursday of that superseding indictment, trump did an interview, ramping up the pressure on the republicans saying i hope the republican party does something about this. he knows there are people in the republican party, and speaker mccarthy is one of them, he can put the screws to and this pressure on and that's where you're seeing this go, is this ramping up of the pressure on these republicans, republicans who support him or republicans who still need his support, as they move forward. >> i think some bigger context, you played the clip from congresswoman nancy mayes earlier. she was saying that they were under pressure publicly to impeach the president and essentially they've gone on a hunting expedition to figure out whatever they could get that would validate a potential impeachment vote and so far, everything has been unproven or unsubstantiated and not corroborated. their motivation, because they are hopeful that it could hurt the president in his re-election campaign. >> so fascinating. thank you all for that really important context in reporting. the white house has not so new and not so secret weapon she's been deployed as the one person who can give rapid response. she's a one-person rapid response team and raging war against republican rhetoric. new reporting on this, next. so they cacan stop the spread of wildfires. now's the time to see whatat america's lalargest 5g network can do for your business. >> woman: why did we choose safelite? 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florida, a big fan of kamala harris, she said even with being a fan of hris, it was like a whole new kamala. >> let me put up that quote. it felt like a new kamala, as you just mentioned, had arrived into the sphere of the white house. it's not like someone i felt i had seen before. this is certainly some that the compare is being clear about, she's going to be the leading voice, as they described it to me on these issues, abortion, guns, cultural issues, social justice issues, like we saw her take on african american curriculum, and she's going to continue to do that. it also allows the president not to just get into the fray, but focus on the economy, which is what he wants to focus on. he and really try to battle that public perception, and make that entire -- democrats i talked to are frustrate that had somehow the president's poll numbers are still not good on the economy despite the markers they see as popular. >> she's filling a void here, too. biden has not been doing much campaigning, if at all, since the launch of the campaign. it's all focused on trump's legal problems. they need to find a way to break through all of that. there's also a question of what is the biden reelection message. what are these going to do for the next four years. they want to make this a choice election, and they're trying to use harris to do that. >> and having the first female vice president out there talking about women's issues, and also the first person of color in that job talking about what we saw in florida, kind of raising the stakes there. all kind of fits nicely into what should be her portfolio, in addition to all the other sort of meat-and-potato kim table issues. >> i agree, and what manu was saying, about filling this void, biden hasn't been out there, hasn't been hitting the republicans as hard. i think this fits nicely into that. however, i do have questions about her being the best messenger when she's a very polarizing figure. she spend a lots of time on the ground talking to voters, part of the argument that republicans are going to make is joe biden is old. do you really want kamala harris to be the president? that's because she herself has been so polarizing. even if she's filling this void, i wonder how effective it is, especially when you look at make independent voters, not just people who are supporting harris, who thinking she's great. >> i think she's proven popular with parts of the base that the democrats want to light up. you're seeing that in some of the fund-raising response. she's been hugely popular with donors in the last few months. >> great reporting, isaac. find more of it on cnn.com. and thank you for joining "inside politics." 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