>> that's correct. >> he hasn't pulled out a gun. >> that's correct. >> he's not threadened you in any way verbally or physically. >> no, mam. >> so at this point you get out of the truck, correct? >> that's correct. >> and you get out with your shotgun. >> no, i got out -- my father got out and went to get in the back and my shotgun lipid and i'm not -- i wasn't going to grab it. outside the courthouse a sea of support for arbery and hundred of pastors including pastor jesse jackson forming a prayer wall. martin savidge joins us now. martin, walk us through other significant moments of what we've seen so far today. >> reporter: yeah, ana, very dramatic testimony and, of course, it was a very vigorous cris examination that was conducted by the lead prosecutor for the prosecution. time and time again she kept returning to what has been the basis of the defense here. first and foremost, the three men have said they were trying to conduct a citizen's arrest of ahmaud arbery on the day they pursued and killed him. she was able to get travis mcmichael to admit on the witness stand that they never said that. they never actually said to ahmaud arbery they were placing him under arrest or even using words to that effect. that's a very strong moment there, and then the other thing which comes to self-defense, the struggle over the shotgun which ahmaud arbery lost. he was shot three times, struck twice. there you get this depiction where initially travis mcmichael told authorities in the police report he didn't really remember. he would like to say that ahmaud arbery grabbed the shotgun but he's not sure he did. whereas when he testified on the witness stand yesterday travis mcmichael says he grabbed the shotgun. that kind of inconsistency when you're talking about self-defense doesn't go over well, so the state is able to show, well, wait a minute. first time he told that story you said he never grabbed the gun and that's something that can stick in the minds of the jurors, but one other thing i'll point out at end of the morning, there was another witness called from the neighborhood to talk about the issue of crime, and after the defense had finished the state got up and asked one question. i'm going play this for you. this is larissa olivieri. it triggered a firestorm. take a listen. >> do you believe that someone stealing is deserving of the death penalty? >> objection. >> i'll withdraw the question, judge. >> it's inappropriate. it's incendiary. it's prejudicial. it's improper. >> given all the time that we've put into this trial and i'm talking about everybody in the judicial system, before making that motion, if the court will allow me i'd like to have a lunch break to confer. maybe there's something i'm missing here. that's not the appropriate thing to ask for, if i have to do it now or lose, it i'm going to move for a mistrial. >> well, the judge considered that over the lunch break and finally came back and said the court does find the question inflammatory and irrelevant. however, ruled against the mistrial and will admonish the polluter. >> martin savidge in runs wick, gore. . thank you. jennifer, i want to play some testimony. it's first movement this the gun was pointed. >> you've moved out and into the road. >> i did. >> mr. arby goes to the passenger side of the truck? >> yes. >> your dad is still yelling at him because we can hear him say stop, god damn it stop. >> yes. >> you could easily have stepped back to your pickup truck and watched him keep going, right? >> i could have, but i still didn't know what he would or could have done right there where i couldn't see him, and to get closer to the pickup, to get closer to daddy and get close to the truck if he was going to come to the truck i was going to be right there so i think was thinking he might go after myself, my father or the truck. >> a man who has spent five minutes running away from you, you're now thinking is somehow going to want to continue to engage with you, someone with a shotgun and your father who said stop or i'll [ bleep ] your [ bleep ] head off. >> that's what it shows, yes. >> that's -- defense was defense, only if there's jer or other options. if had you can de-escalate the sayings and you can not legitimately limb dev defense. this told the jury he had other options and he chose not to and why arbery is dead. >> in the claim that he was protecting himself and his father, she prout up this about his father. listen. >> your father had 30 years of law enforcement, is that correct? >> i believe so. >> all right. so he knows how to take care of himself, doesn't he? >> he knows how. >> and he's got a handgun with him, right? >> yes. >> and he on --p i would say higher crowned. i. >> you are never once in your police said said you were about your father. >> i guess not. >> how will this resonate with the nurse. >> the prosecution is poking holes in the story. the prosecutor is challenging every single statement. in this particular case the lad had law enforcement sflmgs experiment. ahmed was running away. he was not a in the in when someone is -- that's what the polluter was hammering on in yes and that's -- >> jennifer, you thought there were a lot of holes to identification. was there any moment for you that maybe well let? >> i this -- i mean, the best cris examiners don't let witness get away with anything and even during the last clip that was played when he was talking about his father and the prosecutor was saying he has 30 years of law enforcement experience and has a gun, right, and mcmichael said, well, he's old. she could have said, oh, wait a minute. i'm sorry. because of his age you were concerned he wouldn't be able to defend himself with his weapon than would have forced him to say well, no. there were chances that she would have taken to really hammer home that what he was saying was not believable, but generally i thought she did a good job with a lot of material to have to get through. >> as you point out. his dad had a weapon, too. they were both armed an. >> i'm wondering was putting mcmichael on the stand the right call by the defense? >> you typically need testimony from the defendant to say i'm feetful for my life. it really fell flat because they captain hammering home ahmed was unarmed. ahmad was running away and ahmad was scared and then y'all were three men in two trucks who ran him down and murdered him and it's what this case really hinges on. >> again, there are three defendants. we've only heard from one of them and the man who filmed the encounter, william brian, in another vehicle, another truck, his attorney says that at this point mr. brian has no plan to testify in this case, but jennifer, has a precedent now been set? should the other two defendant take the stand because what message would it send to the jurors if they don't? >> the jury always wants to hear from the defendant, but very few defendants actually testify it, and the judge will admonish them strongly telling them a they can't take any inference in he does. apparently mr. bryan will not of it back his lawyer's track is going say they were -- he have the information but don't lump him him with the other two. we'll see what mcmichael senior decide to do. >> i do want to play some sound from the attorney general beck mincrump who basically boils it down to in. >> now if the -- if that was a flack who chased a young player and killed him, his ruling was murder and the ruling supports that. >> eric, do you agree with that? >> when you look at how this case took place it took them a compile especially when you look at the fact this man was charged, in the south. i'm in birmingham, alabama. we're in the south where we have this history of violence. it is very disturbing as an african-american man and thinking if i go out jogging also, someone try to chase me down? and that's a reality that we have to think about and what we have to really be mindful of, but if wrels weren't -- we know that law enforcement essentially -- it wasn't until months later that video of -- was leaked to the public that the makes were made. thanks for your perspective on what you think and heard. let's head to wisconsin where another high-profile case where jurors in the kyle rittenhouse trial are now in day three of deliberation and shimon perez is outside the courthouse in kenosha. i understand the judge just banned any reporter from msnbc or any person from entering the courthouse. what snapped. >> there wasans didn't last night with someone who was employed by msnbc, he says the kenosha police who issued a statement in a tweet saying that they person they believe was trying to photograph jurors. the judge says that this person was following the jury van and so police became suspicious and they pulled him over. they issued citations but there you see the police issuing a statement saying this a person who is alleging to be affiliated with a national media outlet was briefly taken into custody and issued several citations, and that they believe that this person was trying to photograph jurors. now, nbc has issued a statement -- let me pull that up here now. they confirm that a free lanser received a traffic citation and they say that the traffic took place tanweer the jury deliberations. they never intended to photograph them and that they intend to fully cooperate. the judge came out and didn't announce that they were going to do this. just took the bench and started telling us in the greed what was going on because we were asking questions and that's when he relayed the information. just to like give you an idea of what goes on here. there is intense security around the jurors. they are taken out a back way and they are in this van and they are taken to an off-site location and taken to an off-site location and the van is covered so you captain see inside. there's a lot of security and us a understand a lot of people get very nervous any time anyone gets near the jurors. >> there's been a lot of twists and turns so far in this trial. thank you. we have some breaking news just n.cnn has learned that iranian cyber actors targeted the 2020 u.s. elections and the treasury department has now slapped sanctions on both individuals as well as one company. cnn's kylie atwood joins us live to break it all down, kylie. well, this is some breaking news from the treasury department on six iranians individuals for attempting to influence the to 20 elections and what's interesting treasury gets into some details over what the iraqis were trying to do from october to november of 2020. i want to read to you some of the details here. they were seeking to get u.s. voter information from state election websites so essentially you're trying to get into those websites to get voter information. they were also sending threatening email, and those were trying to intimidate voters obviously who were going out voting, and then there were -- they were also crafting and disseminating information about election and election security. they were also trying to get into u.s. media companies, though there's a loin in here that said that the fbi was able to research this and make sure that it was ultimately an everett that was throw. there were details about what the biden administration wants to do and he made it clear that those who meddle in the elections will pay a price by rolling out the new sanctions today. >> kylie atwood for news washington. thank you. no remorse and a quick return to the toxic behavior that got him punished by congress. republican congressman paul gosar continuing to defend and even re-tweeting a video depicting the killing of democratic woman acortes and new details about a new weapon in china's arsenal, a hypersonic missile that can travel all the way around the globe. and dr. anthony fauche i issuing a new warning for fully vaccinated americans as cases rise. why he says all adults should get their above thor. i'll shoot you an estimate as soon as i get back to the office. hey, i can help you do that right now. high thryv! thryv? 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>> well, i think it's pretty clear that if you ask most of those house republicans they felt that gosar deserved to be sanctioned. many did not want to remove him from the committee that. said, gosar has become an embarrassment and distraction. his behavior is incendiary and reckless, and he deserved this. there used to be a time, ana, when a member of congress who was sanctioned, reprimanded or censured in this case they would experience reputational damage and it would be career-ending in many cases. you know, he's wearing this as a badge of honor. taylor greene i believe was also sanctioned from the house and removed by committees uncertain big deal. that's what i think has changed. the standards of conduct have not been maintained or enforced, and the standards bar is now very low. i was chairman of the house ethics committee and used to have to deal with situations like this. this was not presents or fun. i was involved with the rangel ken sure ten years ago, the last time there was a ken sure and believe me. this is a hard thing to do. i'm almost at a loss for words to describe how this seems so bizarre and surreal that a member could just be so cavalier about the whole thing. >> well, i'm glad you feel that way because as an outside observer it certainly seems crazy. i mean, there used to be a time, you said twhrks this kind of punishment would make a difference, right? but gosar seemed empowered, emboldened versus remorseful. what does his re-tweeting the video tell you? >> well, it tells me that he's simply unapologetic. i don't think he ever really apologized. i think he expressed some regret in a closed door meeting but he's unapologetic, and what's sad about today's politics is people like, you know, paul gosar and marjorie taylor greene are able to monetize their notarize. you know, ordinarily if you had been sanctioned like this, you would lose a lot of friends, and people would be less inclined to suspect and your campaign and probably would be the end of your career, but nowadays they are able to go out there and raise a lot of small dollar contributions and they will make money off of this, but i think it's incumbent upon house leaders, in this case house republican leaders, to deal with problems within their own conference. i witnessed john boehner and paul ryan deal with members who became distractionors embarrassments forcing them to resign. nancy pelosi did the same thing with anthony weiner and eric massa and others. i remember these experiences. they dealt with their problems internally to avoid a public spectacle like we witnessed yesterday. >> some democrats have said this ken sure is not strong enough condemnation. that it should be expulsion. what do you think? >> well, expulsion -- i believe there's been a total of five expulsions in the history of the u.s. house of representatives, three during the civil war for treason at the other two because of feloniesed. ozzie myers during abscam and james traficant, both convicted of felonies and refused to resign. i would be very hesitant to go down the expulsion route just based on the precedence. ordinarily what should happen, the republican leadership should sit down with people like gosar and greene and try to force resignations. again, i've seen it happen. i probably counted about 14 or so resignations during my time of members because of misconduct and yet they resigned for those reasons. >> instead, this is how house gop leader kevin mccarthy is responding to this. he actually said this today about both gosar and marjorie taylor greene. if republicans win the house in next year's mid terms. listen. >> they will have committees. the committee assignment they have now, they may have other committee assignments, may have better committee assignments. gosar, those are the ones he wants. taylor greene, she was just a freshman. i know she requested others. she has a right to serve of on committees. >> rewarding these type of republicans who do these types of things? do you see republicans ever being held accountable and policing their own? >> well, they must. they must police their own. in fact, i said at the time that marjorie taylor greene was nominated back in the summer of 2020, i mean, she was espousing that the time qanon conspiracy theories and making indsendry and racially insensitive comments and at the time i said she should not be welcome into the gop conference and shot assigned commits and told we'll work with the georgia gop to defeat her in the 2022 primary and enjoy your time in congress. that's how you deal with people like this. you do not bring them into the main street. you marginalize them and put them on the fric. what's even worse, ana, is they spent on tuesday morning, they spent 90 minutes in the house conference, gop conference, excoriating john katko, an honorable congressman from new york, for voting for an infrastructure bill. they weren't talking about paul gosar. they were talking about john katko, and, you know, here's a normal mainstream guy in a very swing district and, you know, trying to harm him while excusing, you know, people who are embarrassments and who engaged in conduct that brings discredit upon the house. i mean, the whole world is upside down it feels like. >> and what happened to serve vinagre the american people? it seems like everybody who is going down that route is there to serve of themselves right now. charlie didn't, appreciate the conversation, former congressman charlie didn't, good to see you. >> thank you, ana, great to be with you. it can travel around the world largely undetected the, and according to the number two military general in the united states, it's pretty accurate, too. the stunning new details about china's hypersonic missile next. you're a one-man stitchwork master. but your staffing plan needs to go up a size. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates matching your job description. visit indeed.com/hire people everywhere living with type 2 diabetes are waking up to what's possible... ...with rybelsus®. 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(♪ ♪) you may pay as little as $10 per prescription. ask your healthcare provider about rybelsus® today. small businesses like yours make gift-giving possible. now, comcast business has an exclusive gift for you. introducing the gift of savings sale. for a limited time, ask how to get a great deal for your business. and get up to a $500 prepaid card with select bundles when you switch to the network that can deliver gig speeds to the most businesses. or get started with internet and voice for $64.99 per month with a 2-year price guarantee. give your business the gift of savings today. comcast business. powering possibilities. breaking news out of oklahoma. oklahoma governor has just granted clemency to julius jones hours before his scheduled execution. cnn's ed lavandera has the breaking details for us. ed, what can you tell us. >> reporter: well, we were about three and a half hours away from the scheduled execution of julius jones. he was the man convicted of murdering a gentleman by the name of paul howl pack in 1999. this is a case that has garnered a great deal of attention across the country. millions of people signing a petition urging the governor of oklahoma to spare julius jones' life and has garnered the attention of kim kardashian, baker mayfield, the quarterback of the cleveland browns and other celebrities across the country. the oklahoma pardon parole board has issued several weeks ago recommendations saying that julius jones be granted clemency. that his sentence be reduces to life imprison with the possibility of parole but just a short while ago the governor of oklahoma made the decision of granting julius jones and saying his life but with the caveat that he'll have to spend the life in prison without the possibility of parole. we've not heard official reaction from julius jones' family, his mother and family members have been pleading for weeks for the governor to spare his life. the mother has also been asking that her son get a new trial. a great number of questions surrounding various issues that happened during that trial including issues of whether there was racial bias in the jury and investigators, also some question over dna evidence including the murder weapon and a bandana that was used and all of this happening as the family of paul howell has maintain that had they believe that there's overwhelming evidence that julius jones was the man responsible for the murder of paul howell back in 1999, that there's overwhelming evidence and this whole experience has retraumatized the family throughout the entire process, but the breaking news this afternoon is that jewelus jones' life has been spared. >> okay. ed lavin $, with this breaking news. thank you. now to the nation's second most senior military general issue warning. china could now launch a surprise attack on the u.s. the vice chairman of the chiefs of staff revealed new information about a hypersonic missile test that china did last summer. the missile traveled all around the world at five times the speed of sound. after that it dropped a glide vehicle that made it back to china. when asked if it hit its intended target he said close enough. this raises a whole host of concerns since these type of missiles are hard to detect. i want to bring in retired admiral william mccraven, the former commander of u.s. special operations command who oversaw the raid that killed osama bin laden and he's also out with a new book that we will get to in just a moment. first i've got to get your reaction to this news. how concerned are you about china's weapons technology right now? >> thanks, ana. great to be with you. i think we need to be concerned about chip's advancement in the hypersonic technology. now, i'm not concerned that china is going to use these weapons against us, you know, countries develop weapons and hopefully certainly something like the hyperresponsiblic weapon. they never end up use, but that doesn't mean we don't need to be focused on it. that doesn't mean we don't need to develop hypersonic technology as well. we're a couple years behind the chinese when it comes to developing this kind of weapons sis them. >> >> is the u.s. able to counter this? >> right now that's the possible. >> when john hyten talked about a first-strike capability, the reason this is so concerning is had a hypersonic missile can come in very quickly, and right now we don't have the defensive systems that could potentially, you know, shoot down a hypersonic missile so that then does become a first-strike cape ann. once again i'm not concerned that the chinese will use it as a first strike but the potential is out there. >> let me pivot to afghanistan because as you mentioned you helped to lead the raid that took out osama bin laden. right now the u.s. is in the process of vetting thousands of a gan evacuees following the u.s. withdrawal from that country. we have some new reporting today that the u.s. is considering sending some evacuees who don't pass the vetting process back to afghanistan. do you agree with that, and do you think that those who fail the vetting test pose a real threat to the u.s.? >> yeah. i mean, this is obviously a difficult and complicated problem, but the fact of the matter is, you know, when we loaded up 1930,000 afghans that we pulled out of kabul before august 31st we knew that there would be some that wouldn't meet the state department's vetting process, and my expectation is they were made aware of that, and, you know, hopefully we'll be able to get them back safely to afghanistan but, you know, if not, maybe to a third country that would be willing to take them, or they can, of course, apply for as lull. we don't want to put them back in harm's way, that's for certain, but frankly we also need to ensure that we go through the state department's vetting process to ensure that the right people are coming into the united states. >> you have had such an incredible career and it's so great to have you on as a guest to help us navigate national security issues but i is also to ask you about your latest project, this children's book, "make your bed" with skipper the seal. i got my hands on it and had a chance to read it. it's a book about bravery, about hard work and about teamwork, about learning from mistakes and overcoming obstacles, just so many messages, so many lessons in this book, but why a children's book? >> well, you know, when i was a young parent i had three kids. i really enjoyed reading to my children, and there's, of course, you have a connection when you read with your kids and you have an opportunity to teach them the values that you just talked about, but now i also have a 5-week-old grandson and now i'm going have an opportunity and i have already read the book to my grandson. he was the first reading, but, you know, it's just great to be able to connect with kids when you're a young parent or a friend or a member of the family and connect through reading. >> and, again, the messages here resonate with children, especially, but adults, too. these are life lessons that you touch on in your book. thanks for sharing it with us. thank you for being a guest on may show today. admiral william mcgrafn, the book is "make your bed with skipper the seal." good to see you. >> thank you, ana. well, the clock is ticking now on the fda's decision about boosters for all adults, especially with doctors warning about a rise in covid-19 hospitalizations among the vaccinated. just how protected are you without a booster? 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>> yeah. there is some vulnerability, aba abe -- ana, followed by some bad news followed more some more bad news. we're starting to see the beginning of the winter wave. we've had a 14% increase in cases over the last week. we're about to go yet again over 100,000 new cases a day, and it's starting up in the northern midwest, minnesota, wisconsin, michigan, so that's very concerning that the winter wave is now upon us and now starting. that's the first piece of bad news. second, there is now strongest for waning immunity so, more so for the pfizer vaccine than the moderna vaccine and we're seeing, for instance in, colorado, about 20% of the hospitalized cases are among those vaccinated with waning immunity, so you're saying, well, what's the good news in the good newsy think we're going to move very quickly now towards universal boosters for those over the age of 18, the third immunizations, and as we've been speaking about all year, ana, this was always a three-dose vaccine, and so this was all predict and predictable so it's going to be very important for everybody to get boosted. the good news is that will really rev up your virus antibodies 30 to 40-field and increase your viral protection and keep you out of the hospital, and it will likely prevent you from getting infected as the study coming out of israel therefore prevent you from getting long covid. >> we've got to get on it. we're waiting for the green light if the data is clear. it sounds like the green light should come very soon. there is other good news for people who are fully vaccinated, who haven't even gotten the beister yet but it's still much, much better news for those people than those who aren't vaccinated at all according to dr. fauci and other data. let's listen. >> let's take texas and look at a comparison of up vaccinated people with vaccinated people. unvaccinated people were 13 times more likely to become infected than fully vaccinated, and unvaccinated people were 20 times more likely to die than fully vaccinated people. >> doctor, he's talking about your state. the data could not be more career on this, and yet there are still tens of millions of americans who aren't vaccinated at all. >> i've been talking about tone -- dr. fauci with texas where i work and live, and it's really tragic, ana. the numbers are extraordinary. since june 1, 2021, 20,000 unvaccinated texans have needlessly lost their lives to covid despite the widespread availability of vaccines. there's almost no words to describe it. it's a form of self-immolation. none of those lives had to be left. people who were defiant of vaccines, and of those 20,000, you know, well over 85%, 86% were unvaccinated, and the thing that i'm worried about. this is all coming from aggression -- i don't even call it misinformation or disinformation. i call it anti-science aggression coming from the far right and we're about to see it again, because i believe with this new wave coming up in the northern midwest we're going see the same thing. we've still got 40% of those populations unvaccinated and those are the ones that will get hospitalized and lose their lives. doing everything that i can to prevent it, but it's really dug in, and it's a very difficult situation. >> disney cruiseline just announced come january all passengers 5 and up must be vaccinated. how big of a deal is that? >> well, it's essential. i can't imagine going on a cruise right now especially as we're about to hit that winter wave now without everybody being fully vaccinated, and we're going have to make it clear, that unfortunately, the goal posts have moved and being fully vaccinated means two voices of mrna and two of the j&j and the good news it won't be one and done and two and done. i be three and done. i do not think we're going to need boosters on a regular basis after that. looking at some of the data, i think we're going to have some longer-lasting protection after that third dose, just like we do with a lot of pediatric vaccines where you give a series of quick immunizations and then we wait six months to a year and then boost and then we don't have to vaccinate again for five years or ten years. >> dr. peter hotez, i always appreciate your time and expertise. thank you for all you do. >> thank you. back to our other breaking news today. prosecutors cross-examining the man who chased, shot, and killed ahmaud arbery and getting a critical admission in the process. here. new aspercreme arthritis. full prescription-strength? 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(vo) visible. unlimited data, powered by verizon. switch and get up to $200. one of the most important things you can do is to make sure you call 811 before you dig. calling 811 to get your lines marked: it's free, it's easy, we come out and mark your lines, we provide you the information so you will dig safely. is there life on another planet? humanity is closer than ever before to getting that answer. the new cnn film "the hunt ifor planet b" follows the team of female-led scientists who are leading the quest to find another earth. the film provides an inside look at this groundbreaking mission. here's a preview. ♪ >> the webb telescope is a hundred times more powerful than hubble. telescopes getting bigger because the bigger the telescope, the better the resolution. we wouldn't have built the telescope this big unless we needed to and you need it to look at the dimmest, most early galaxies in the universe. >> the james webb telescope is not just a machine built by engineers and scientists to look after the universe. it's taking humanity on a journey. we're going to enter completely new part of observational space, what we have never trod before. and every time we've done this as a species, we've discovered new things. >> joining us now is dr. john mather, the senior project scientist for the james webb space telescope mission at nasa. thank you for being with us. this is fascinating. this telescope will show us the earliest light in the universe. it might be able to find other habitable planets. it's truly astonishing. tell us more about what it will be able to do. >> the webb telescope was designed to look at everything we already know about in the sky from those nearby planets, solar system, and places where we know there's a planet around a nearby star. out through the nurseries where stars and planets are being born today, all the way out as far as we can see back in time and far out in space to the very first objects that grew after the big bang, whatever they were, probably stars, possibly also galaxies with black holes growing up. it's a story we're trying to work out, and we have great hopes of finding some surprises. >> wow. what about the technology behind this telescope? how is it able to do and see all of these incredible things? >> the telescope is much bigger than any we've ever put into space before. and it does that by folding up so it can go up in the rocket and then unfold after launch. it is cooled off to a low temperature so we can pick up the infrared light from those cooler objects out there that the hubble can't see and it's totally gigantic, so we've got a little paper model. your viewers can make their own. if you google james webb space telescope paper model, you put it together yourself, but the basic thing is there's a gold-coated mirror, which is 21 feet across, and that's the thing that collects all the light from those distant objects, focusing it on to some camera chips that are bigger than anything we had before also, so that's the technology behind it. it's amazing. >> it really is. when can we expect to start receiving information from it? >> we will plan to launch it around december 18th, and it takes six months to -- of daily work, planned hour-by-hour, to get it all set up, focused after launch, all the instruments checked out and knowing how to run the exposure calculators, all those things so that june of next year is when we should start flooding you with scientific information. >> what is your greatest hope for this mission, and what is your biggest fear? >> oh, my greatest hope is there's something out there that nobody ever imagined before, ever. and so, i'm guessing where that could be. maybe there's something about the very early universe with the dark matter and the dark energy and the mysteries of that, because we've never been able to see them. closer up, i think we could get some surprises about planets, because there are plenty of them very close by but none of the ones we've seen so far are much like home. so, we'd like to know, are they like home? could they have an atmosphere even around little red stars that we know about already? so, that's what i'm hoping for. the things i worry about, of course, will it unfold properly in space? this is new. we've never unfolded a thing this big in space before, for astronomy, and so, well, it's new. it could be trouble. so we are very careful and cautious about it. >> yeah. fingers crossed. we don't know what we don't know when it comes to this sort of thing. it is an incredibly expensive mission, we do know that. nearly $10 billion in all. so, what is your response to critics who say that money should be spent solving problems here on earth? >> i think what we can prove is that if you spend money, you can solve problems. we have a definite problem to solve, and we solved it. i think given problems closer to home, we just need to agree what they are and decide to solve them, and we can solve them. that's what kennedy thought when he said we would go to the moon and we'd do the other things too. so, i think he was right. we proved we can. so, let's do. >> all right. dr. mather, thank you so much for joining us. we look forward to the film. it is "the hunt for planet b." it premiers saturday at 9:00 p.m. eastern only on cnn. that does it for us today. thanks for joining us. see you tomorrow at 1:00. see you tomorrow at 1:00. the news continues right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com ♪ hello, it is good to be with you. i'm victor blackwell. >> and i'm alisyn camerota. welcome to "newsroom." for the second day in a row, jurors heard directly from the man who shot and killed ahmaud arbery. prosecutors pressed travis mcmichael over inconsistencies in his account about what happened during last year's deadly encounter in brunswick, georgia. mcmichael claims he acted in self-defense. >> and the defense attorney who has tried and failed several times to ban black p

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