picking up and bringing showers later in the far north. for england and wales, still some rain and drizzle and low cloud around some western hills and coast but further east, not a great deal of sunshine him "want to hate all black women". what took them so long? number ten's change in tone and language came three hours after business secretary kemi badenoch said frank hester�*s comments were racist and there was a "space for forgiveness". we'll talk live to the woman who co—founded conservatives against racism and a former candidate who says most black people think he's a race traitor to be a tory. also tonight — a warning that the increasing privatisation of nhs eye care could see it go the same way as nhs dentistry, with minimal public access to treatment. they say, we're not going to do nhs cataracts, are losing money on them, people pay two go private or we have a loss of provision and that's really the end of the nhs. plus a conversation between this conservative mp and the close friend who helped him recover after he tried to take his own life. since speaking openly in the house of commons last month about what happened, elliot colburn says the reaction from the public has been overwhelming and he says, his words stopped someone else from attempting suicide. and why are there still nearly 3,000 people in prison with no idea when they are going to get out when such sentences were scrapped 12 years ago? could an amendment to the victims and prisoners bill being debated in the house of lords tonight help them get their sentences revised? at pmqs tomorrow, it's likely rishi sunak will be asked multiple questions by the labour leader along the lines of: does the pm think comments made by a conservative donor who allegedly said diane abbott made him �*want to hate all black women' and that she needed �*to be shot�* — are racist. two: will the tories hand back the £10 million given to them last year by the donor frank hester? three: why did the prime minister take a private helicopter ride from mr hester in november? ms abbott, who is currently suspended from sitting as a labour mp, said mr hester�*s alleged comments made her fear for her safety. joe is here. just describe how the government position has evolved over the last day or so. position has evolved over the last da or so. ,, , there is no question these alleged comments were wrong. frank hester apologised. he said they were rude. but the question being asked of conservatives all day was whether they were racist. was it racist to say — as it is alleged mr hester did — that looking at diane abbott makes you want to hate all black women ? first thing this morning, this was the line from ministers. what i would say is that, you know, clearly _ what i would say is that, you know, clearly it's _ what i would say is that, you know, clearly it's uncomfortable. i'm uncomfortable talking about it now because _ uncomfortable talking about it now because he was clearly wrong but, you know — because he was clearly wrong but, you know - -_ because he was clearly wrong but, you know. . .- we _ because he was clearly wrong but, you know. . .- we need - because he was clearly wrong but, you know. . .- we need to . because he was clearly wrong but, i you know. . .- we need to show you know... you... we need to show understanding _ you know... you... we need to show understanding and _ you know... you... we need to show understanding and the _ you know... you... we need to show understanding and the important - understanding and the important thing _ understanding and the important thing is _ understanding and the important thing is that he apologised and he was quite — thing is that he apologised and he was quite right. within the hour, a cabinet minister added he thought the comments were not racist. i don't think what he was saying was a race-based — i don't think what he was saying was a race—based comment, _ i don't think what he was saying was a race—based comment, he - i don't think what he was saying was . a race—based comment, he apologised and we _ a race—based comment, he apologised and we need to— a race—based comment, he apologised and we need to move _ a race—based comment, he apologised and we need to move on. _ by late morning downing street said the comments were unacceptable , but they were not able to explain why. or say whether they were racist. then just after midday a former tory cabinet minister said they were. are they racist? clearly racist and sexist. i think _ are they racist? clearly racist and sexist. i think diane _ are they racist? clearly racist and sexist. i think diane was - are they racist? clearly racist and sexist. i think diane was right - are they racist? clearly racist and sexist. i think diane was right to l sexist. i think diane was right to point _ sexist. i think diane was right to point out — sexist. i think diane was right to point out the _ sexist. i think diane was right to point out the call _ sexist. i think diane was right to point out the call to _ sexist. i think diane was right to point out the call to violence. i sexist. i think diane was right to i point out the call to violence. even in a flippant— point out the call to violence. even in a flippant way, _ point out the call to violence. even in a flippant way, it's _ point out the call to violence. even in a flippant way, it's really - in a flippant way, it's really inappmpriate _ and perhaps most significantly at 4.19 this afternoon, kemi badeoch made this intervention on twitter. "hester s 2019 comments, as reported, were racist. "i welcome his apology. "abbott and i disagree on a lot. "but the idea of linking criticism of her, to being a black woman is appalling. " she also added, "there needs to be space for forgiveness "where there is contrition." did that push number ten in to acting? because at half six tonight they released a statement saying, "the comments allegedly made by frank hester were "racist and wrong. "he has now rightly apologised for the offence caused "and where remorse is shown it should be accepted." but this was 27 hours after the guardian first broke this story. and this is not the first time no 10 has had trouble responding to controversial comments. exactly. the most recent comparison is lee _ exactly. the most recent comparison is lee anderson's comments about sadiq _ is lee anderson's comments about sadiq khan — is lee anderson's comments about sadiq khan last month. the pm condemned them, but didn t want to say they were racist. there are different dynamics at play. one is money. m mr hester has donated £10m to conservatives in the last 12 months. that s very valuable in general election year. no sign it s going to be handed back. it doesn t mean opposition parties will stop their campaign for that to happen. secondly, significantly for some conservatives, the speed of the number— conservatives, the speed of the number ten response. some think it was sluggish. if no 10 had said this was racist 24 hours ago, perhaps wouldn t be talking about it now. potentially moving into the third day office tomorrow in by ministers questions — day office tomorrow in by ministers questions. and the general election. not just about ground war of campaigners knocking on doors. but air war — on tv, radio, social media. has the government won that war today? _ has the government won that war today? we are perhaps going to see this continuing. finally, the point about— this continuing. finally, the point about the — this continuing. finally, the point about the violence of the alleged language. it wasn'tjust racist comments that he is alleged to have used, _ comments that he is alleged to have used. but _ comments that he is alleged to have used, but also saying that diane abbott _ used, but also saying that diane abbott "should be shot. " she has reported it to the police. ive spoken we asked for an interview with mr hester. and we asked for an intrview with the government. we wait to hear back from them and the invitation remains open. the conservative _ the invitation remains open. tie: conservative party declined our request for an interview. with us in the studio is former conservative party parliamentary candidate and co—founder of the 2022 group, which aims to see the party better engage with black voters, wilfred emmanuel—jones. and siobhan aarons, co—founder of the group conservatives against racism for equality. she's also chair of the tory reform group. welcome, thank you for being with us. so, it's taken number ten more than 2a hours to describe these comments as racist. as a prominent black woman and a prominent black man in the conservative party, what do you think? 2&1 man in the conservative party, what do you think?— do you think? 24 hours for a story that is five — do you think? 24 hours for a story that is five years _ do you think? 24 hours for a story that is five years old, _ do you think? 24 hours for a story that is five years old, old - do you think? 24 hours for a story that is five years old, old news i do you think? 24 hours for a storyl that is five years old, old news and they are making it new news. that's really frustrating. i think it's really frustrating. i think it's really frustrating. i think it's really frustrating for every conservative activist from a bame background and it is frustrating for a black woman to become news because of a white man when we should be focusing on the amazing successes or people like diane abbott who broke glass ceilings for us, regardless of our politics or whether we are doing something else, but to look at women like her, british, black women and shout about their successes rather than only becoming news because of a white man. i'm over it. let's move on. ~ . white man. i'm over it. let's move on, ~ ., ., ., white man. i'm over it. let's move on. . . ., ., ., ~ , on. what we have to do in keeping persnective _ on. what we have to do in keeping persnective is _ on. what we have to do in keeping perspective is that _ on. what we have to do in keeping perspective is that this _ on. what we have to do in keeping perspective is that this story - on. what we have to do in keeping perspective is that this story is - perspective is that this story is five years— perspective is that this story is five years old. this is a successful attempt _ five years old. this is a successful attempt by — five years old. this is a successful attempt by the left to weaponise race because it has led the black feeling _ race because it has led the black feeling among many black people thinking _ feeling among many black people thinking the conservative party is not for— thinking the conservative party is not for them, so people like us who are proud _ not for them, so people like us who are proud conservatives have a harder— are proud conservatives have a harderiob _ are proud conservatives have a harderjob to do because they have weaponised this using race. they miaht weaponised this using race. they might push _ weaponised this using race. they might push back _ weaponised this using race. they might push back on _ weaponised this using race. they might push back on the - weaponised this using race. ti9: might push back on the weaponised accusation. who might push back on the weaponised accusation. ~ :, :, , , the accusation. who would push back? the left. this is accusation. who would push back? the left- this is a — accusation. who would push back? the left. this is a story _ accusation. who would push back? the left. this is a story because _ accusation. who would push back? the left. this is a story because frank- left. this is a story because frank hester said it.— hester said it. five years ago! if he set it today, _ hester said it. five years ago! if he set it today, i can _ hester said it. five years ago! if| he set it today, i can understand hester said it. five years ago! if. he set it today, i can understand as having _ he set it today, i can understand as having the — he set it today, i can understand as having the debate about the climate was different five years ago. very much -- was _ was different five years ago. very much -- was it? _ was different five years ago. very much -- was it? very _ was different five years ago. very much -- was it? very much - was different five years ago. very much -- was it? very much so. i was different five years ago. very i much -- was it? very much so. let was different five years ago. very - much -- was it? very much so. let me ask ou much -- was it? very much so. let me ask you about — much -- was it? very much so. let me ask you about how _ much -- was it? very much so. let me ask you about how number _ much -- was it? very much so. let me ask you about how number ten - much -- was it? very much so. let me ask you about how number ten have i ask you about how number ten have handled it. , , .. , handled it. number ten basically handled it. number ten basically handled it. number ten basically handled it very _ handled it. number ten basically handled it very badly _ handled it. number ten basically handled it very badly because - handled it. number ten basically i handled it very badly because they stebbed _ handled it very badly because they stepped on it but when it comes to race, _ stepped on it but when it comes to race, people are really terrified about _ race, people are really terrified about what is the correct language to use _ about what is the correct language to use is — about what is the correct language to use is it— about what is the correct language to use. is it about somebody saying something — to use. is it about somebody saying something racist, does that imply they are _ something racist, does that imply they are racist? this is one of the problems— they are racist? this is one of the problems in— they are racist? this is one of the problems in this country, people are reatiy— problems in this country, people are really terrified about the right language to use. | really terrified about the right language to use. really terrified about the right lanauuae to use. , . ., language to use. i understand that. let me read — language to use. i understand that. let me read you — language to use. i understand that. let me read you the _ language to use. i understand that. let me read you the full _ language to use. i understand that. let me read you the full quote. - language to use. i understand that. | let me read you the full quote. this is what frank hester is alleged to have said about diane abbott. "it's trying not to be racist but you see diane abbott on tv and you want to hate all black women because she's there. i don't hate all black women at all but i she should be shot and poor it's not difficult to describe that as racist. —— she should be shot." it that as racist. -- she should be shot." , that as racist. -- she should be shot.�* , , :, shot." it is when you accuse someone of sa in: shot." it is when you accuse someone of saying something _ shot." it is when you accuse someone of saying something racist _ shot." it is when you accuse someone of saying something racist and - of saying something racist and therefore that person is racist. i've therefore that person is racist. i've been— therefore that person is racist. i've been in front of people who have _ i've been in front of people who have been— i've been in front of people who have been out canvassing for me and they have _ have been out canvassing for me and they have used the word, they've used _ they have used the word, they've used expressions like n““*r in the woodbiie — used expressions like n““*r in the woodpile. we have to get to a point where _ woodpile. we have to get to a point where when as some one used incorrect — where when as some one used incorrect language and when is someone — incorrect language and when is someone racist and i think they are two different things. this is why we are dancing — two different things. this is why we are dancing around the edges here. don't _ are dancing around the edges here. don't hate — are dancing around the edges here. don't hate me but i'm going to apologise on your behalf for using the n—word. why do you think it is seemingly difficult for number ten for number ten to say that this was racist? i for number ten to say that this was racist? :, �* ~ :, : for number ten to say that this was racist? :, �* ~' :, : ~' racist? i don't know. and i think that's the _ racist? i don't know. and i think that's the hardest _ racist? i don't know. and i think that's the hardest thing. - racist? i don't know. and i think that's the hardest thing. thankl racist? i don't know. and i think i that's the hardest thing. thank you for inviting me here tonight to be able to talk about these things but i can't answer for able to talk about these things but i can't answerfor number ten. number ten need to answer for i can't answerfor number ten. number ten need to answerfor number ten. i only represent myself and my community and do so in a positive way. i'm tired about talking about these things and these people. that's the only time i have the opportunity to talk about successful, ordinary, being successful, ordinary, being successful, being ordinary black women. i don't want to talk about that. i actually want to be able to celebrate. this is the month of international women's day. we have just had mothering sunday. we piggyback on the us having their black history month last month for example. why is it that i'm here talking about hester number ten when we have so many british black women who we be celebrating?— who we be celebrating? that's a good oint and who we be celebrating? that's a good point and i'm — who we be celebrating? that's a good point and i'm glad _ who we be celebrating? that's a good point and i'm glad you _ who we be celebrating? that's a good point and i'm glad you accepted - who we be celebrating? that's a good point and i'm glad you accepted our i point and i'm glad you accepted our invitation. labour mpjess phillips invitation. labour mp jess phillips has invitation. labour mpjess phillips has this theory about why it wasn't described as racist by number ten. she said it is because they are worried about offending racists. do you think there's any truth about that? , you think there's any truth about that? y , ., �* you think there's any truth about that? , ,., �* , that? sorry, i shouldn't kiss my teeth on national— that? sorry, i shouldn't kiss my teeth on national television, . that? sorry, i shouldn't kiss my teeth on nationaltelevision, i. teeth on national television, i guess i'm just showing off my culture! i don't know, there's so much speculation. we use so much valuable air time on the profiles that we have to talk about things we don't know. we hold people accountable and focus where we need to be. :, , :, accountable and focus where we need to be. ., , ., , , accountable and focus where we need tobe. . ,. , , ., to be. that statement implies that the --eole to be. that statement implies that the people on _ to be. that statement implies that the people on the _ to be. that statement implies that the people on the right _ to be. that statement implies that the people on the right are - to be. that statement implies that the people on the right are racist, | the people on the right are racist, because _ the people on the right are racist, because that's what it's saying, there's— because that's what it's saying, there's a — because that's what it's saying, there's a section of the conservative party that are racist. is conservative party that are racist. is that _ conservative party that are racist. is that not — conservative party that are racist. is that not the case? in conservative party that are racist. is that not the case?— is that not the case? in any party ou are is that not the case? in any party you are going _ is that not the case? in any party you are going to _ is that not the case? in any party you are going to have _ is that not the case? in any party you are going to have extremes. | is that not the case? in any party| you are going to have extremes. i can see _ you are going to have extremes. i can see why— you are going to have extremes. i can see why some people get really excited _ can see why some people get really excited when they are accused about being _ excited when they are accused about being accused of racist because they have a _ being accused of racist because they have a particular view. you being accused of racist because they have a particular view.— have a particular view. you stood to be a tory mp. _ have a particular view. you stood to be a tory mp. in — have a particular view. you stood to be a tory mp, in 2010, _ have a particular view. you stood to be a tory mp, in 2010, wasn't - have a particular view. you stood to be a tory mp, in 2010, wasn't it? i be a tory mp, in 2010, wasn't it? that's right. 1&1 be a tory mp, in 2010, wasn't it? that's right-— that's right. 14 years ago. diane abbott says _ that's right. 14 years ago. diane abbott says she _ that's right. 14 years ago. diane abbott says she fears _ that's right. 14 years ago. diane abbott says she fears for - that's right. 14 years ago. diane abbott says she fears for her - that's right. 14 years ago. diane i abbott says she fears for her safety with these comments, because there was a comment about how she should be shot. i wonder if you think things have got worse when it comes to this political environment or has progress been made, when you look at the diversity of the cabinet? i really admire diane abbott. i think she should be really celebrated. she's— she should be really celebrated. she's a — she should be really celebrated. she's a very courageous woman. we disagree — she's a very courageous woman. we disagree on _ she's a very courageous woman. we disagree on the politics but she is a phenomenal woman, that's the first thin- a phenomenal woman, that's the first thing we _ a phenomenal woman, that's the first thing we have to point out. the climate — thing we have to point out. the climate hasn't changed. in a sense we are _ climate hasn't changed. in a sense we are still— climate hasn't changed. in a sense we are still having this debate about— we are still having this debate about colour, where does it fit in, what _ about colour, where does it fit in, what is _ about colour, where does it fit in, what is the — about colour, where does it fit in, what is the right language? i find people _ what is the right language? i find people tiptoe around the right language. i've been accused of being racist~ _ language. i've been accused of being racist. people are so nervous about the right— racist. people are so nervous about the right language and until we can have a _ the right language and until we can have a free, open debate without peopie _ have a free, open debate without people feeling they are going to be accused _ people feeling they are going to be accused of being racist because they are giving _ accused of being racist because they are giving a — accused of being racist because they are giving a view we are always going _ are giving a view we are always going to — are giving a view we are always going to be doing this dance and it isn't going — going to be doing this dance and it isn't going to be good for our democracy. isn't going to be good for our democracy-— isn't going to be good for our democracy. isn't going to be good for our democra . �* , �* ., :, democracy. but it isn't hard to find the riaht democracy. but it isn't hard to find the right language, _ democracy. but it isn't hard to find the right language, you _ democracy. but it isn't hard to find the right language, you just - democracy. but it isn't hard to find| the right language, you just google it. i the right language, you 'ust google it. ~' the right language, you 'ust google it. ~ ., �* , the right language, you 'ust google it. ~ . it. i think that's incorrect. there are still some _ it. i think that's incorrect. there are still some parts _ it. i think that's incorrect. there are still some parts of _ it. i think that's incorrect. there are still some parts of this - it. i think that's incorrect. there i are still some parts of this country where _ are still some parts of this country where they— are still some parts of this country where they would refer to me as coloured. — where they would refer to me as coloured, not because they are being racist~ _ coloured, not because they are being racist~ it— coloured, not because they are being racist~ it is— coloured, not because they are being racist. it is because that is what they— racist. it is because that is what they think— racist. it is because that is what they think is the correct language. sure _ they think is the correct language. sure. :, they think is the correct language. sure. ., :, ,~ ., , ., sure. that only changes when more black people _ sure. that only changes when more black people get — sure. that only changes when more black people get into _ sure. that only changes when more black people get into rural - sure. that only changes when more black people get into rural britain, | black people get into rural britain, when _ black people get into rural britain, when there is more experience, then those _ when there is more experience, then those people cannot be accused of being _ those people cannot be accused of being racist because they are not using _ being racist because they are not using the — being racist because they are not using the right language. what should happen _ using the right language. what should happen to _ using the right language. what should happen to this - using the right language. twist should happen to this £10 million that pankhurst originated to the conservatives? the that pankhurst originated to the conservatives?— conservatives? the reality is it -robabl conservatives? the reality is it probably has — conservatives? the reality is it probably has been _ conservatives? the reality is it probably has been spent - conservatives? the reality is it i probably has been spent already conservatives? the reality is it - probably has been spent already but if it has not i would hope that gchq would use the money to invest in grassroots. there are so many activists in the conservative party, bame groups and forms and so many are under supported. it would be a perfect opportunity to actually approve that engagement and use it to help dispel some of the myths and ideas about us as conservative activists. because light will fit i have experienced racist comments to my face on the doorstep when i am just reminding people that there is an election. so i think there are good things that could be done for the conservative party with that money. the conservative party with that mone . :, ~' the conservative party with that mone . :, ~ ,:, the conservative party with that mone. :, ~ , the conservative party with that mone. :, , . ., money. thank you both very much for cominu money. thank you both very much for coming on- — a leading expert has told newsnight that free nhs treatment for cataracts could disappear given the growth of private provision since the pandemic — and create a crisis of care, like dentistry. while private sector involvement has led to additional eye operations being carried out in england, there are fears from nhs consultants of the negative long—term consequences for eye treatment on the nhs. here's kate lamble. every year, hundreds of thousands of people in the uk get a cataract operation to treat blurry vision, replacing the lens in their eye with an artificial version. but recently there's been a huge change in who delivers that work. before the pandemic, under a quarter of cataract operations in england funded by the nhs were carried out by the private sector. today, it's more than half. this boom in private provision has allowed almost 200,000 additional operations a year. actually what we've seen in ophthalmology over the last couple of years is a really interesting success story. it's now the only specialty where the average waiting time is less than it was pre—pandemic and that's partly contributed to by the fact that the independent sector has been doing growing levels of activity over that period of time. not everyone views the situation so positively. a new survey of nhs leads shared exclusively with newsnight by the royal of ophthalmologists shows around 80% of nhs clinical leads in england think independent sector providers are having an impact on services in their nhs department. of those, more than two thirds think the impact has been negative. only 5% thought it was positive. i'm very concerned. we are doing some very straightforward, mild cataracts and everybody's delighted except the consultants that are doing that and the money that's been paid for that and the nurses that are assisting with that are not in the nhs and that money has to come from somewhere, the staff has to come from somewhere, so it's exacerbating other waits, and the other waits are much more important. we know that people on waiting lists to be seen in outpatient clinics are much more at risk of going blind than new patients with minimal cataracts. we've prioritised whatever makes a profit, not whatever needs to be done the most. the independent health care provider network says they don't recognise that argument. in the royal college's survey, the two most commonly referenced problems were training and funding. nhs england says all providers are required to help provide training but with fewer simple cataract operations in the nhs, some argue there have been reduced opportunities to train the next generation of surgeons, and funding for the work lost can no longer be used to offset more complex operations. so, when the cataract operation on the nhs makes a profit, it doesn't go to people who own the companies or shareholders but what that goes to is offsetting the loss made by, for example, a maternity unit or an a&e department or whatever bits of the nhs is costing more to run. it's a loss of money and expertise to the independent sector that's not prioritised appropriately as it would be within the nhs. now, we can look more closely at how much money has been given to the private sector as part of this shift. independent companies are paid according to the operations they carry out, with different patient complexities translating into different codes, like these. more complex, represented by the codes at the top here have meant a higherfee. newsnight has been given f0| data from 35 integrated care boards across england by the centre for health and the public interest. it shows that over six years there was a huge growth in operations coded as the most complex, those with the biggest financial reward. and while the number of complex operations in the nhs has remained relatively stable, it's private providers that have driven the increase, registering more complex operations both in real terms and as a proportion of their work. the nhs has previously been clear this increase can't be explained by patients becoming more complex over time. for some, this raises questions over whether so—called up—coding, recording artificially complex codes, could be taking place. there are a couple of red flags in the data that you gave me. the first one is that the complexity is increasing over time and we don't have any good reasons for that to be the case. the second one is that the complexity increases seems to be predominantly in the private sector, and that is also something that needs to be looked at. it's counterintuitive to me because the nhs traditionally takes the more difficult cases. without individual patient records we can't be certain. it could simply be that private providers are just more diligent in accurately recording patient comorbidities, things like diabetes, carefully following the nhs framework to entitle them to register more complex codes. however, the chpi suggests that had private providers made the same proportion of their income from the most complex cataract codes as the nhs then that would have saved taxpayers £29 million injust two years. i think that somebody needs to do an audit to check that the complexity is being applied correctly. it is possible that it is but there's also a possibility that things are being saturated. you know, it seems strange, if you're a believer in free market economics and competition, that we are paying more for what may well be the same thing butjust coded perhaps more accurately. how do you see the future of ophthalmology? it's very uncertain. we've seen what's happened in dentistry. i work in great yarmouth, you know, we are in a dental desert. there's very minimal access to nhs care. and i could see that happen in ophthalmology. when the money reduces, the private companies are saying, we're not making enough profit, the nhs has more or less collapsed because everybody's moved for higher wages into the independent sector. and they say, right, well, we're not going to do nhs cataracts, we are losing money on them and they stop. there's no provision at all. people have to pay to go privately or they end up, you know, with loss of vision. representatives from the private sector suggest this comparison to dentistry is misleading. actually what's going on in ophthalmology is that more patients are getting access to nhs—funded ophthalmology care. that's fundamentally a good thing and generally speaking the public is entirely relaxed about who provides their nhs—funded care, providing its high—quality and free at the point of use. so we would push back robustly on the assertion that what is happening in ophthalmology, which we think is a major success story, is in any way analogous to what we're seeing in nhs dentistry at the moment. nhs england told us no one was available for an interview but it recently consulted on amending prices for cataract operations to reduce the difference between high and low complexity procedures. they add prices are constantly reviewed to ensure they're at a fair price for taxpayers. a conservative mp who last month stood up in the house of commons and revealed that he had attempted to take his own life in 2021 tells us tonight that reaction from the pubic has been overwhelming. elliot colburn is 31 years old and was elected as an mp at the 2019 election. two years later he says he felt under such pressure, he thought there was only one way out. i want to take this chance to say thank you to everyone who saved me. and sorry to my family and loved ones who i put through such an awful ordeal. in that moment i felt alone and scared and like there was no way out and that the world would be better off without me in head. better off without me in it. but i don't recognise that man any more. cheering. i know that nothing is ever really worth that. help really is out there. i'm pretty awesome. hear, hear. there was one close friend in particular who worked for mr colburn in his surrey constituency who helped the mp get through this period. her name is catherine gray. and they are both here to talk to you this evening. thank you for being here. can i ask you first what was going on in your life at that time? it is you first what was going on in your life at that time?— life at that time? it is hard to put a sinale life at that time? it is hard to put a single moment _ life at that time? it is hard to put a single moment in _ life at that time? it is hard to put a single moment in 2021- life at that time? it is hard to put a single moment in 2021 where i | a single moment in 2021where i thought that was it. it was a build up thought that was it. it was a build up of the year. there have been a number of things going on at home and in my personal life and relationships with other people starting to struggle and be difficult. but of course the job is always part of that as well, it is a high—pressurejob put a lot always part of that as well, it is a high—pressure job put a lot going always part of that as well, it is a high—pressurejob put a lot going on in that year in particular there was quite a few death threats and very difficult thing is that have come through during that time. i think that did not help certainly with my state of mind and as the year went on those negative thoughts in my head where just getting progressively worse and getting more extreme and saying awful things to myself. but the worst part was that i was isolating myself away from other people. and that culminated in one night in december.— one night in december. there were five death threats _ one night in december. there were five death threats i _ one night in december. there were five death threats i think— one night in december. there were five death threats i think that - one night in december. there were five death threats i think that you i five death threats i think that you had that year. something like that. you have given me permission to read one of them out, it is homophobic and the language is vile just to warn you. but let me read it, tory some, you and yourflag boyfriend should watch your backs, enjoy your time, you smug... you haven't got many left. and that had a profound effect because it was about you and your partner, notjust you. i effect because it was about you and your partner, notjust you.- your partner, not 'ust you. i think that has become _ your partner, notjust you. i think that has become one _ your partner, notjust you. i think that has become one of _ your partner, notjust you. i think that has become one of the - your partner, notjust you. i think that has become one of the worst things about the job, we expect it now as mps and we get a lot of threats. not to say it is right at all but when it is encroaching on other members of your family and loved ones and friends and that was the first time i'd ever received a threat of that nature and because it was hand delivered to my constituency office it felt, ijust felt very vulnerable in that moment when i received that one in particular. it was not the main thing to be honest that was going to my mind closer to the time but it did feed into that negative thought cycle of everything is going wrong, you cannot do anything right and no one wants to see you or spend time with you. and death threats like that and the ones that included my loved ones and family certainly did not help the situation at all. catherine, what is it like to hear your friend talk in these terms about that time? it your friend talk in these terms about that time?— your friend talk in these terms about that time? it is difficult to hear from elliott _ about that time? it is difficult to hear from elliott exactly - about that time? it is difficult to hear from elliott exactly how - about that time? it is difficult to hear from elliott exactly how he | hear from elliott exactly how he felt that — hear from elliott exactly how he felt that the time. i could see him going _ felt that the time. i could see him going through a difficult time. being — going through a difficult time. being an _ going through a difficult time. being an mp from the perspective i had can— being an mp from the perspective i had can go— being an mp from the perspective i had can go from lovely happy things through— had can go from lovely happy things through to _ had can go from lovely happy things through to death threats coming through— through to death threats coming through the door but elliott is such a warm _ through the door but elliott is such a warm and — through the door but elliott is such a warm and lovely person and you could _ a warm and lovely person and you could see — a warm and lovely person and you could see him being affected by things— could see him being affected by things like that and i could see him withjoy_ things like that and i could see him withjoy and i suppose over that time _ withjoy and i suppose over that time he — withjoy and i suppose over that time. he did not bounce back as quickly— time. he did not bounce back as quickly as— time. he did not bounce back as quickly as he might have done before — quickly as he might have done before it _ quickly as he might have done before. it is difficult because we are all— before. it is difficult because we are all human beings and to see other— are all human beings and to see other people use white so callously and not _ other people use white so callously and not really appreciating the human— and not really appreciating the human impact that had on him and the people _ human impact that had on him and the people around him, it is a difficult thing _ people around him, it is a difficult thing to— people around him, it is a difficult thing to face. gn people around him, it is a difficult thing to face-— people around him, it is a difficult thin to face. :, thing to face. on the day he told me earlier it was — thing to face. on the day he told me earlier it was not _ thing to face. on the day he told me earlier it was not something - thing to face. on the day he told me earlier it was not something that. earlier it was not something that you had planned? tia. earlier it was not something that you had planned?— earlier it was not something that ou had lanned? :, ., :, you had planned? no, i had not woken u . you had planned? no, i had not woken u- that da you had planned? no, i had not woken up that day knowing _ you had planned? no, i had not woken up that day knowing that _ you had planned? no, i had not woken up that day knowing that i _ you had planned? no, i had not woken up that day knowing that i was - you had planned? no, i had not woken up that day knowing that i was going i up that day knowing that i was going to do it. it was not something i had been planning over a period of time. i got up and did my first engagement of the day and really struggled, to be honest. ifelt i did not want to be honest. ifelt i did not want to be there, it was really difficult to find the energy to go and do it. i then left work quite early that day and shut myself away in my room for hours, absolutely ours. i had gone back to my childhood home where my mum and brother still lived. and just shut myself in my old childhood room for hours that day. and later that night i eventually had snapped, something in my mind just went in and what, there's no point. nothing is ever going to go right. so you might as well if up and take yourself out of the equation. and i took my note pad out of my bag and wrote a goodbye note and did something very stupid. which thankfully did not work. but it was not something that i necessarily had planned to do. but something about that day in the build—up of everything that had been going on all of that year led to something snapping on that day. when you got the call saying what had happened, what was your reaction? i had happened, what was your reaction? :, :. had happened, what was your reaction? :, ., :, :, �* , reaction? i got a call from elliot's brother to — reaction? i got a call from elliot's brother to say — reaction? i got a call from elliot's brother to say what _ reaction? i got a call from elliot's brother to say what had - reaction? i got a call from elliot's| brother to say what had happened reaction? i got a call from elliot's - brother to say what had happened and that elliott _ brother to say what had happened and that elliott had asked that he phoned — that elliott had asked that he phoned me so that i could step in and take — phoned me so that i could step in and take the pressure is away from elliot _ and take the pressure is away from elliot i— and take the pressure is away from elliot i felt — and take the pressure is away from elliot. i felt so devastated and disappointed that elliot felt that that was the only option he had in front— that was the only option he had in front of— that was the only option he had in front of him. you know, it's hard to think— front of him. you know, it's hard to think that _ front of him. you know, it's hard to think that somebody who has so much life and _ think that somebody who has so much life and potential and has such a bright _ life and potential and has such a bright future would have felt in that moment that it was their only option _ that moment that it was their only option it — that moment that it was their only option. it was disappointment that he hadn't — option. it was disappointment that he hadn't felt that he could reach out to _ he hadn't felt that he could reach out to people in that moment. i suppose. — out to people in that moment. i suppose, despairat out to people in that moment. i suppose, despair at the lack of acknowledgement from elliot that better _ acknowledgement from elliot that better things would come, that he could _ better things would come, that he could be _ better things would come, that he could be sitting here today and able to reflect _ could be sitting here today and able to reflect on that. it was an awful call to— to reflect on that. it was an awful call to receive. my mind went to, what _ call to receive. my mind went to, what can— call to receive. my mind went to, what can i— call to receive. my mind went to, what can i actually do to make a difference? i wish that he'd known at difference? iwish that he'd known at that— difference? i wish that he'd known at that time that there are so many people _ at that time that there are so many people out— at that time that there are so many people out there who love him and want to— people out there who love him and want to support him. i'm pleased that what— want to support him. i'm pleased that what he tried failed because it would _ that what he tried failed because it would have been the most awful thing _ would have been the most awful thin. :, :. would have been the most awful thin. :, ., :, i. would have been the most awful thin. :, ., :, ~ :, thing. elliot what would you like to sa to thing. elliot what would you like to say to catherine? _ thing. elliot what would you like to say to catherine? catherine - thing. elliot what would you like to say to catherine? catherine was i thing. elliot what would you like to i say to catherine? catherine wasjust say to catherine? catherine was 'ust incredible during fl say to catherine? catherine was 'ust incredible during that i say to catherine? catherine was 'ust incredible during that time. * say to catherine? catherine was 'ust incredible during that time. i h say to catherine? catherine wasjust incredible during that time. i don't i incredible during that time. i don't think i would have got through it without amazing people like catherine. i never really had the chance to say thank you properly. i suppose this is me having the chance to do that. i really am grateful for everything you did. it was so much easier to compartmentalise parts of my life in the aftermath, when i was discharged from hospital and i tried to look at what had brought me to that point, just the way that catherine wouldn't just that point, just the way that catherine wouldn'tjust help by taking on a lot of the burden at the time. just coming and checking on me and sending me things to make me laugh and making sure i was all right. i really don't think i would have recovered as well as i did it for that. ~ :, :, , have recovered as well as i did it for that. ~ . ., , :, have recovered as well as i did it forthat. ~ . :, , for that. what has the reaction been like since you _ for that. what has the reaction been like since you spoke _ for that. what has the reaction been like since you spoke about _ for that. what has the reaction been like since you spoke about it? - like since you spoke about it? 0verwhelming. i've been so honoured and blessed to hear people's own stories as well. you never really know as an mp how people are going to react when you share a personal story because you don't know how it's going to land. people might think we are being self—indulgent, talking about ourselves rather than the people we represent and that wasn't what i was intending at all. it was trying to share something to see what we can do to improve things. i had an amazing phone call. i wasn't in the office, a member of my team picked up the phone and there was a gentleman on the line who said that he had been planning to take his own life that day that he'd seen it, it popped up on a news article, he'd seen the prime minister's question that i ask and he picked up his phone to his gp and started hisjourney to he picked up his phone to his gp and started his journey to try and get better. i was blown away by that. i didn't know what to expect. but how humbling it's been to hear people's stories and to try and do do something to improve mental health facilities in this country has been amazing, so i'm pleased that i did it in the end. amazing, so i'm pleased that i did it in the end-— it in the end. thank you both very much, it in the end. thank you both very much. really _ it in the end. thank you both very much, really appreciate _ it in the end. thank you both very much, really appreciate you - it in the end. thank you both very i much, really appreciate you talking to us. let me give you those actionline contact details, where you can find a list of organisations that can help is available at bbc.co.uk/actionline, or you can call for free on 0800 066 066. haiti's prime minister has agreed to resign, following weeks of mounting pressure and increasing violence in the impoverished caribbean country. ariel henry is currently stranded in puerto rico, after being prevented by armed gangs from returning home. it comes after regional leaders met injamaica to discuss a political transition in haiti. the country's powerful gangs now control around eighty percent of the capital — with violence blighting ordinary people's lives. 0ur international correspondent joe inwood has been investigating a crisis with deep historical roots. haiti is now a failed state. violent gangs control most of the capital. police and the military are outnumbered and outgunned. bodies lie on the streets with ordinary people, the ones who suffer. translation: we haven't been able to sleep since last night. _ we're running away. me with my belongings on my head, not knowing where to go. access to services of education, of health, water are limited. ability to actually move through the city are limited because of roadblocks and gang controls. so right now, i would say it's one of the most dire times i've seen in haiti. so how did haiti, just off the coast of florida, end up as a failed state? some point to the devastating earthquake of 2010 as the start of the country's recent troubles. it killed around 300,000 and destroyed much of the country's housing and infrastructure. that was followed up by a cholera outbreak, laterfound to have been started by un peacekeepers. there was a series of devastating storms, especially hurricane matthew in 2016, which made the humanitarian situation worse. there were anti—corruption protests in 2018 against presidentjovenel moise. in 2021, he was assassinated. the killers were believed to be colombian mercenaries. ariel henry took over as prime minister weeks later, promising elections that he never delivered. but to really understand why haiti has failed, we need to understand its history. when haitians overthrew the french, they were forced to pay vast reparations to the people who had enslaved them. it hobbled the haitian economy, made it very difficult for haiti to grow, because over 60% of the haitian national economy was being used to service the debt. that also had an effect on the ability of haiti to reinvest in more diversified agricultural enterprises, as well as to develop institutions, economic institutions that could be sustainable. then, in the 20th century, haiti was once more occupied, this time by the us. the stage was set for the rise of the gangs. the united states' occupation of haiti created a new political culture in haiti, one in which a new level of weight was being placed on the importance of the haitian military in supporting state power. when the military was abolished by aristide in the 1990s, it created a breach. and in that breach was the space in which gangs are being used by political aspirants, as well as members of the ruling class in haiti, to preserve and secure their personal and political power. back to the present. and the product of that legacy isjimmy "barbecue" cherizier. he's been responsible for much of the violence and has led the calls for the government to quit. translation: if the international. community continues down this path, it will plunge haiti into chaos, if it chooses a small group of politicians and negotiates with them on paper to decide who can be president and what kind of government we're going to have. earlier today, the prime minister released this video, announcing that he would stand down. but what will come next? kenya has offered to send a thousand police officers, although it's unclear when or if that might happen. the us has offered more than 300 million in financial support. there seems to be a consensus that haiti needs outside help. there is a restore in peace when the un is there, but as soon as they leave, there is a new gap and a vacuum in power. so haitian politicians are basically defenseless if they don't have the un and basically the whole haitian economy is on the ground at the moment. so there is no other way than violence and gaining from the informal economy. today, a small group of protesters gathered on the streets of port—au—prince. they were wary of help from abroad. this is a country that has so often been let down, by history, by its own corrupt leaders, and by an international community who claimed to offer help. a prison sentence with no known end. they are still being served in jails in england and wales and they are known as ipps — imprisonment for public protection. they were scrapped in 2012 by the coalition government — yet there are still nearly 3,000 people in prison with no idea when they are going to get out. many have served longer than the minimum tariff they were given.