Transcripts For BBCNEWS Dateline London 20240709 : compareme

and the sydney morning herald in australia. here in the studio, the bbc�*s buiness editor, simonjack. cop26, which begins in glasgow this weekend, is supposed to be the moment when the world's nations present individual beefed up pledges to mitigate climate change, agree rules to prevent double counting, and honour previously agreed plans to ensure the poorest countries, too, can adapt to survive. the summit�*s host, that perennial optimist borisjohnson, says its success or failure "is in the balance". the queen, a valuable asset in the last—minute lobbying and arm twisting that characterises summits, won't now be there. on medical advice, say courtiers. still, her majesty was caught on microphone recently, saying of cop26 : "it is very irritating when they talk, but they don t do. henry, when might we be in the realm of expectation management for the summit? . , of expectation management for the summit? ., , �* ., , of expectation management for the summit? ., , summit? certainly boris johnson has been criticised _ summit? certainly boris johnson has been criticised by _ summit? certainly boris johnson has been criticised by people _ summit? certainly boris johnson has been criticised by people of- been criticised by people of intending to under promise and overachieve. but i think he gone in the opposite direction in hopes that he might over achieve. he said it such ago in terms of what might come out of the summit. will have a bit of a barometer in the g 20 global summit that will happen before cop26. if you can't get 20 countries do play nice and come up with commitments that are binding and impressive enough for the rest of the world to follow you are knocking to get 200 countries to agree on that. the challenge are pretty daunting and some of which he doesn't have much leverage over. one of the foremost in my mind is the fact that right now the relationship between china and the us, the two biggest emitters of carbon gases and other greenhouse gases is in a pretty dire shape. if you remember six years ago, 2015 before the paris agreement was struck the two countries issuing a joint statement was actually critical for the rest of the world to come on board. and you had the visual of president 0bama standing side—by—side with chinese president. while you and i can have that at this conference. he is not attending in person he is only going to attend part two virtually. as i said washington and beijing are at a low point in their relations and neither one wants to be seen bowing or kowtowing to the other. there was some hope that maybe this could be a stand—alone issue where they would recognise the good of the planet and notches of their own national interest but i think that's can be kind of difficult. 0ne think that's can be kind of difficult. one other thing that you mentioned about rich countries stepping up to the plate and coughing up the money that they had pledged which was $100,000,000,000 a year to help the poorer nations to the red... ravages of climate change, they haven't up and do that either, it's only been about mustering it 80% and they say they probably won't get to that $100,000,000,000 mark for another few years. that's good to be discouraging for poor countries do here who already this year have seen rich countries not making good on their vaccination pledges through kovacs. . ~ , ., ., kovacs. latika, the australian prime minister said — kovacs. latika, the australian prime minister said this _ kovacs. latika, the australian prime minister said this week _ kovacs. latika, the australian prime minister said this week over - kovacs. latika, the australian prime minister said this week over the - minister said this week over the last few days that he's come up with a uniquely australian solution haven't been one of the lab guards in this international debate on climate change. tell us more. the australian way _ climate change. tell us more. the australian way as _ climate change. tell us more. the australian way as the prime minister likes to _ australian way as the prime minister likes to refer to it is deeply unambitious in the short term. we shouldri't— unambitious in the short term. we shouldn't understate just how significant it is for a prime minisier— significant it is for a prime minister of australia to stand up and say— minister of australia to stand up and say we are going to commit to net zero _ and say we are going to commit to net zero x — and say we are going to commit to net zero x 2050 which is what he said this — net zero x 2050 which is what he said this week. for him to still remain in— said this week. for him to still remain in thejob said this week. for him to still remain in the job the next day, this is extraordinary. this hasn't happened in australian politics for at least _ happened in australian politics for at least a — happened in australian politics for at least a decade. in fact we have played _ at least a decade. in fact we have played musical chairs with our prime ministers _ played musical chairs with our prime ministers and political leaders over this diabolical issue of climate change — this diabolical issue of climate change politics in australia. it is remarkable and it is a huge step forward — remarkable and it is a huge step forward for australia that the community and politics have come to some _ community and politics have come to some sort— community and politics have come to some sort of— community and politics have come to some sort of consensus here. but when _ some sort of consensus here. but when you — some sort of consensus here. but when you dig a little deeper you begin— when you dig a little deeper you begin to — when you dig a little deeper you begin to understand why. and that's because _ begin to understand why. and that's because the prime minister had said that oil. _ because the prime minister had said that oil, gas will remain in the next _ that oil, gas will remain in the next foreseeable future. in fact has _ next foreseeable future. in fact he's made a virtue of the fact that we are _ he's made a virtue of the fact that we are going to continue mining in australia, — we are going to continue mining in australia, were going to ask did not continue _ australia, were going to ask did not continue exploring in australia. you will see _ continue exploring in australia. you will see the — continue exploring in australia. you will see the prime minister of australia _ will see the prime minister of australia joined with china and india _ australia joined with china and india this — australia joined with china and india this weekend at the g 20 and trying _ india this weekend at the g 20 and trying to— india this weekend at the g 20 and trying to fight off a move to set a phase-out— trying to fight off a move to set a phase—out date for coal. it's not the best— phase—out date for coal. it's not the best company that those in australia — the best company that those in australia have been pushing for, better— australia have been pushing for, better climate change targets would've liked to have seen. how do they squared — would've liked to have seen. how do they squared that? _ would've liked to have seen. how do they squared that? the _ would've liked to have seen. how do they squared that? the problem for| they squared that? the problem for they squared that? the problem for the asia—pacific region in particular is 1.5 billion people living on coasts, you can carry on with carbon, it can carry on building your economy on that but it becomes harder and harder to find the carbon to burn to create the fossil fuels and you having to spend all that money mitigating the air they been making a case in asian political ships or is it too politically combustible? there is some optimism. _ politically combustible? there is some optimism. one _ politically combustible? there is some optimism. one of - politically combustible? there is some optimism. one of the - politically combustible? there is some optimism. one of the bigl politically combustible? there is - some optimism. one of the big shifts that task— some optimism. one of the big shifts that task did not happened in australia is really centred about technology. and you hear the are shown _ technology. and you hear the are shown prime minister said this all the time — shown prime minister said this all the time technology not taxes. what you have _ the time technology not taxes. what you have in — the time technology not taxes. what you have in australia is a business commuhity— you have in australia is a business community now picking up this mantle for itself _ community now picking up this mantle for itself. taking on what it knows is the _ for itself. taking on what it knows is the future and looking around and saying _ is the future and looking around and saying 0k. — is the future and looking around and saying ok, now we have some settled saying 0k, now we have some settled agreement— saying ok, now we have some settled agreement politically about where this regulatory environment is going to take _ this regulatory environment is going to take us — this regulatory environment is going to take us. we can start to really plan _ to take us. we can start to really plan for— to take us. we can start to really plan for the _ to take us. we can start to really plan for the future. so just this week— plan for the future. so just this week for— plan for the future. so just this week for instance, there are two reatiy— week for instance, there are two really interesting of many of shown companies — really interesting of many of shown companies here in the uk and heading to c0p26 _ companies here in the uk and heading to cop26 and going to be addressing c0p26~ _ to cop26 and going to be addressing cop26. one is a really interesting company— cop26. one is a really interesting company called sun cable. it's going to build _ company called sun cable. it's going to build an _ company called sun cable. it's going to build an enormous solar farm and through— to build an enormous solar farm and through undersea cables send that electricity via water to singapore. singapore — electricity via water to singapore. singapore has its own geography can't _ singapore has its own geography can't create solar farms like australia _ can't create solar farms like australia can. that project is being backed _ australia can. that project is being backed try— australia can. that project is being backed by an australian billionaire who is— backed by an australian billionaire who is here. he made his billions and i_ who is here. he made his billions and i in _ who is here. he made his billions and i in orbit now wants to turn his company into green hydrogen energy exporters _ company into green hydrogen energy exporters. there are a lot of people in australia — exporters. there are a lot of people in australia who are seeing the opportunities knowing they can transform the australian economy and not make _ transform the australian economy and not make australia poor along the way _ not make australia poor along the wa . ., ., , ., , not make australia poor along the wa. ., ., , , way. not that questions opportunity but also who — way. not that questions opportunity but also who pays — way. not that questions opportunity but also who pays for _ way. not that questions opportunity but also who pays for the _ way. not that questions opportunity but also who pays for the transition | but also who pays for the transition for top is a huge win for the business communities. fine for top is a huge win for the business communities. one way or another every _ business communities. one way or another every citizen _ business communities. one way or another every citizen in _ business communities. one way or another every citizen in the - business communities. one way or another every citizen in the world | another every citizen in the world will pay _ another every citizen in the world will pay for— another every citizen in the world will pay for this. _ another every citizen in the world will pay for this. we _ another every citizen in the world will pay for this. we had - another every citizen in the world will pay for this. we had the - another every citizen in the worldl will pay for this. we had the paper far through — will pay for this. we had the paper far through our _ will pay for this. we had the paper far through our taxes _ will pay for this. we had the paper far through our taxes or— will pay for this. we had the paper far through our taxes or through . will pay for this. we had the paper. far through our taxes or through the amount— far through our taxes or through the amount we — far through our taxes or through the amount we pay— far through our taxes or through the amount we pay for— far through our taxes or through the amount we pay for the _ far through our taxes or through the amount we pay for the products - far through our taxes or through the amount we pay for the products and j amount we pay for the products and services that — amount we pay for the products and services that we _ amount we pay for the products and services that we consume. - amount we pay for the products and services that we consume. the - amount we pay for the products and services that we consume. the cost| services that we consume. the cost of this— services that we consume. the cost of this is— services that we consume. the cost of this is going _ services that we consume. the cost of this is going to— services that we consume. the cost of this is going to be _ services that we consume. the cost of this is going to be astronomical. | of this is going to be astronomical. thats— of this is going to be astronomical. that's the — of this is going to be astronomical. that's the fossil— of this is going to be astronomical. that's the fossil fuel— of this is going to be astronomical. that's the fossil fuel stop, - of this is going to be astronomical. that's the fossil fuel stop, get - that's the fossil fuel stop, get more and more expensive to sustain where we are never going to grow there. ., ,., , , where we are never going to grow there. ., , , . ., there. there are some bits which are ruite eas there. there are some bits which are quite easy wins- _ there. there are some bits which are quite easy wins. in _ there. there are some bits which are quite easy wins. in the _ there. there are some bits which are quite easy wins. in the uk _ there. there are some bits which are quite easy wins. in the uk for- quite easy wins. in the uk for example _ quite easy wins. in the uk for example we _ quite easy wins. in the uk for example we had _ quite easy wins. in the uk for example we had a _ quite easy wins. in the uk for example we had a huge - quite easy wins. in the uk for. example we had a huge success quite easy wins. in the uk for- example we had a huge success with offshore _ example we had a huge success with offshore wind — example we had a huge success with offshore wind. it's _ example we had a huge success with offshore wind. it's a _ example we had a huge success with offshore wind. it's a big _ example we had a huge success with offshore wind. it's a big part - example we had a huge success with offshore wind. it's a big part of- offshore wind. it's a big part of our energy— offshore wind. it's a big part of our energy mix _ offshore wind. it's a big part of our energy mix now. _ offshore wind. it's a big part of our energy mix now.— offshore wind. it's a big part of our energy mix now. even the prime minister used _ our energy mix now. even the prime minister used to _ our energy mix now. even the prime minister used to joke _ our energy mix now. even the prime minister used to joke about - our energy mix now. even the prime minister used to joke about wind - minister used to joke about wind power when he was a journalist now is a big champion. g, power when he was a “ournalist now is a big champion.— is a big champion. a lot of people thou . ht it is a big champion. a lot of people thought it was — is a big champion. a lot of people thought it was impossible - is a big champion. a lot of people thought it was impossible to - is a big champion. a lot of people thought it was impossible to get i is a big champion. a lot of people i thought it was impossible to get the power— thought it was impossible to get the power its— thought it was impossible to get the power its now— thought it was impossible to get the power it's now £40. _ thought it was impossible to get the power it's now £40. we _ thought it was impossible to get the power it's now £40. we had - thought it was impossible to get the . power it's now £40. we had enormous success— power it's now £40. we had enormous success in_ power it's now £40. we had enormous success in africa _ power it's now £40. we had enormous success in africa but _ power it's now £40. we had enormous success in africa but actually _ power it's now £40. we had enormous success in africa but actually d - success in africa but actually d compromising _ success in africa but actually d compromising the _ success in africa but actually d compromising the power- success in africa but actually di compromising the power supply success in africa but actually d . compromising the power supply is success in africa but actually d - compromising the power supply is the easy bed _ compromising the power supply is the easy bed you — compromising the power supply is the easy bed. you can _ compromising the power supply is the easy bed. you can do _ compromising the power supply is the easy bed. you can do that— compromising the power supply is the easy bed. you can do that through - easy bed. you can do that through offshore _ easy bed. you can do that through offshore wind, _ easy bed. you can do that through offshore wind, renewables, - easy bed. you can do that throughl offshore wind, renewables, nuclear has a _ offshore wind, renewables, nuclear has a role, — offshore wind, renewables, nuclear has a role, we _ offshore wind, renewables, nuclear has a role, we know— offshore wind, renewables, nuclear has a role, we know that _ offshore wind, renewables, nuclear has a role, we know that the - has a role, we know that the government— has a role, we know that the government is— has a role, we know that the government is moving - has a role, we know that the . government is moving towards approving _ government is moving towards approving a _ government is moving towards approving a nuclear— government is moving towards approving a nuclear power - government is moving towardsl approving a nuclear power plant here _ approving a nuclear power plant here the — approving a nuclear power plant here. the really— approving a nuclear power plant here. the really tough - approving a nuclear power plant here. the really tough stuff - approving a nuclear power plant here. the really tough stuff is l here. the really tough stuff is making — here. the really tough stuff is making steel, _ here. the really tough stuff is making steel, cement- here. the really tough stuff is making steel, cement and - here. the really tough stuff is making steel, cement and on| here. the really tough stuff is - making steel, cement and on that you really— making steel, cement and on that you really do _ making steel, cement and on that you really do need — making steel, cement and on that you really do need new— making steel, cement and on that you really do need new technology. - making steel, cement and on that you really do need new technology. you i really do need new technology. you need something _ really do need new technology. you need something called _ really do need new technology. you need something called carbon - really do need new technology. you . need something called carbon capture for the _ need something called carbon capture for the at _ need something called carbon capture for the at the — need something called carbon capture for the at the point _ need something called carbon capture for the at the point where _ need something called carbon capture for the at the point where you're - for the at the point where you're tfuming — for the at the point where you're tfuming the _ for the at the point where you're burning the energy— for the at the point where you're burning the energy you - for the at the point where you're burning the energy you can- for the at the point where you're i burning the energy you can actually suck it _ burning the energy you can actually suck it back — burning the energy you can actually suck it back out _ burning the energy you can actually suck it back out of _ burning the energy you can actually suck it back out of the _ burning the energy you can actually suck it back out of the atmosphere | suck it back out of the atmosphere and then— suck it back out of the atmosphere and then buried _ suck it back out of the atmosphere and then buried down _ suck it back out of the atmosphere and then buried down underneathl suck it back out of the atmosphere i and then buried down underneath the ground _ and then buried down underneath the ground for— and then buried down underneath the ground for example _ and then buried down underneath the ground for example the _ and then buried down underneath the ground for example the uk's - and then buried down underneath the ground for example the uk's get - and then buried down underneath the ground for example the uk's get a i ground for example the uk's get a fantastic— ground for example the uk's get a fantastic resource _ ground for example the uk's get a fantastic resource in _ ground for example the uk's get a fantastic resource in that - ground for example the uk's get a fantastic resource in that it's - ground for example the uk's get a fantastic resource in that it's got l fantastic resource in that it's got declining — fantastic resource in that it's got declining depleted _ fantastic resource in that it's got declining depleted coast- fantastic resource in that it's got declining depleted coast two - fantastic resource in that it's got declining depleted coast two off| fantastic resource in that it's got. declining depleted coast two off the coast _ declining depleted coast two off the coast that's — declining depleted coast two off the coast. that's the _ declining depleted coast two off the coast. that's the idea. _ declining depleted coast two off the coast. that's the idea. the - coast. that's the idea. the technology— coast. that's the idea. the technology is— coast. that's the idea. the technology is in _ coast. that's the idea. the technology is in its - coast. that's the idea. thel technology is in its infancy, coast. that's the idea. the - technology is in its infancy, we are nowhere _ technology is in its infancy, we are nowhere near— technology is in its infancy, we are nowhere near that _ technology is in its infancy, we are nowhere near that yet. _ technology is in its infancy, we are nowhere near that yet. the - technology is in its infancy, we are nowhere near that yet. the primel nowhere near that yet. the prime minister— nowhere near that yet. the prime minister of— nowhere near that yet. the prime minister of the _ nowhere near that yet. the prime minister of the uk's _ nowhere near that yet. the prime minister of the uk's favourite - nowhere near that yet. the primel minister of the uk's favourite word of the _ minister of the uk's favourite word of the moment— minister of the uk's favourite word of the moment is _ minister of the uk's favourite word of the moment is hydrogen. - minister of the uk's favourite word of the moment is hydrogen. if- minister of the uk's favourite word of the moment is hydrogen. if you| of the moment is hydrogen. if you set hydrogen _ of the moment is hydrogen. if you set hydrogen 100 _ of the moment is hydrogen. if you set hydrogen 100 times— of the moment is hydrogen. if you set hydrogen 100 times in- of the moment is hydrogen. if you set hydrogen 100 times in a - of the moment is hydrogen. if you set hydrogen 100 times in a row. of the moment is hydrogen. if you . set hydrogen 100 times in a row you -et set hydrogen 100 times in a row you get any— set hydrogen 100 times in a row you get anyioh— set hydrogen 100 times in a row you get anyioh that _ set hydrogen 100 times in a row you get anyioh that you _ set hydrogen 100 times in a row you get anyjob that you want _ set hydrogen 100 times in a row you get anyjob that you want in - set hydrogen 100 times in a row you get anyjob that you want in the - get anyjob that you want in the cabinet. basically— get anyjob that you want in the cabinet. basically a _ get anyjob that you want in the cabinet. basically a lot - get anyjob that you want in the cabinet. basically a lot of - get anyjob that you want in thel cabinet. basically a lot of people have _ cabinet. basically a lot of people have tweaked _ cabinet. basically a lot of people have tweaked onto _ cabinet. basically a lot of people have tweaked onto that. - cabinet. basically a lot of people have tweaked onto that. for- cabinet. basically a lot of people - have tweaked onto that. for example the nuclear— have tweaked onto that. for example the nuclear power— have tweaked onto that. for example the nuclear power people _ have tweaked onto that. for example the nuclear power people saying - have tweaked onto that. for example the nuclear power people saying anyl the nuclear power people saying any excess _ the nuclear power people saying any excess heat — the nuclear power people saying any excess heat used _ the nuclear power people saying any excess heat used to _ the nuclear power people saying any excess heat used to generate - the nuclear power people saying any excess heat used to generate extral excess heat used to generate extra hydrogen _ excess heat used to generate extra hydrogen that _ excess heat used to generate extra hydrogen that can _ excess heat used to generate extra hydrogen that can be _ excess heat used to generate extra hydrogen that can be used - excess heat used to generate extra hydrogen that can be used in- hydrogen that can be used in industry— hydrogen that can be used in industry come _ hydrogen that can be used in industry come transport - hydrogen that can be used in industry come transport and | hydrogen that can be used in- industry come transport and indeed there _ industry come transport and indeed there is— industry come transport and indeed there is a _ industry come transport and indeed there is a lot — industry come transport and indeed there is a lot to _ industry come transport and indeed there is a lot to talk— industry come transport and indeed there is a lot to talk about - industry come transport and indeed there is a lot to talk about getting i there is a lot to talk about getting renewables— there is a lot to talk about getting renewables to _ there is a lot to talk about getting renewables to make _ there is a lot to talk about getting renewables to make hydrogen - there is a lot to talk about getting renewables to make hydrogen asl there is a lot to talk about getting - renewables to make hydrogen as well. the point _ renewables to make hydrogen as well. the point is _ renewables to make hydrogen as well. the point is the — renewables to make hydrogen as well. the point is the uk _ renewables to make hydrogen as well. the point is the uk represents- renewables to make hydrogen as well. the point is the uk represents 1%- renewables to make hydrogen as well. the point is the uk represents 1% of. the point is the uk represents 1% of global— the point is the uk represents 1% of global emissions. _ the point is the uk represents 1% of global emissions. the _ the point is the uk represents 1% of global emissions. the bill— the point is the uk represents 1% of global emissions. the bill for- the point is the uk represents 1% of global emissions. the bill for doingi global emissions. the bill for doing this try— global emissions. the bill for doing this try 2050 — global emissions. the bill for doing this try 2050 is _ global emissions. the bill for doing - this by 2050 is £1,000,000,000,000. this by 2050 is £1,000,000,000,000. if you this by 2050 is £1,000,000,000,000. if you times_ this by 2050 is £1,000,000,000,000. if you times that _ this by 2050 is £1,000,000,000,000. if you times that tty— this by 2050 is £1,000,000,000,000. if you times that by 100 _ this by 2050 is £1,000,000,000,000. if you times that by 100 because - this by 2050 is £1,000,000,000,000. if you times that by 100 because are - if you times that by 100 because are absolutely— if you times that by 100 because are absolutely astronomical. _ if you times that by 100 because are absolutely astronomical. 0f - if you times that by 100 because are absolutely astronomical. of csa - absolutely astronomical. of csa climate — absolutely astronomical. of csa climate activist _ absolutely astronomical. of csa climate activist would _ absolutely astronomical. of csa climate activist would rightly - absolutely astronomical. 0f csa| climate activist would rightly say that because _ climate activist would rightly say that because of— climate activist would rightly say that because of not _ climate activist would rightly say that because of not doing - climate activist would rightly say that because of not doing this i climate activist would rightly sayl that because of not doing this are even _ that because of not doing this are even worse — that because of not doing this are even worse. but _ that because of not doing this are even worse. but nevertheless - that because of not doing this are . even worse. but nevertheless when you put— even worse. but nevertheless when you put that — even worse. but nevertheless when you put that kind _ even worse. but nevertheless when you put that kind of— even worse. but nevertheless when you put that kind of money... - even worse. but nevertheless whenj you put that kind of money... when you put that kind of money... when you put— you put that kind of money... when you put that, — you put that kind of money... when you put that, create _ you put that kind of money... when you put that, create that _ you put that kind of money... when you put that, create that industry. you put that, create that industry the something _ you put that, create that industry the something of— you put that, create that industry the something of a _ you put that, create that industry the something of a multiplier- the something of a multiplier effects. — the something of a multiplier effects. it _ the something of a multiplier effects, it creates _ the something of a multiplier effects, it creates jobs, - the something of a multiplierl effects, it createsjobs, taxes, the something of a multiplier- effects, it createsjobs, taxes, new industries— effects, it createsjobs, taxes, new industries which _ effects, it createsjobs, taxes, new industries which can _ effects, it createsjobs, taxes, new industries which can offset - effects, it createsjobs, taxes, new industries which can offset some i effects, it createsjobs, taxes, new industries which can offset some of that investment _ industries which can offset some of that investment but _ industries which can offset some of that investment but be _ industries which can offset some of that investment but be under- industries which can offset some of that investment but be under no i that investment but be under no illusion. — that investment but be under no illusion. the _ that investment but be under no illusion, the costs— that investment but be under no illusion, the costs are _ that investment but be under no| illusion, the costs are absolutely phenomenal _ illusion, the costs are absolutely phenomenal-— illusion, the costs are absolutely henomenal. , g ., �* phenomenal. henry, joe biden will travel from — phenomenal. henry, joe biden will travel from rome _ phenomenal. henry, joe biden will travel from rome to _ phenomenal. henry, joe biden will travel from rome to glasgow- phenomenal. henry, joe biden will| travel from rome to glasgow going first to the g 20 where he spends part of the weekend and then on to glasgow for cop26. but is arriving without congressional agreement on his big infrastructure bill which was supposed to be a part about climate change and tackling it. is there any sign of coherent leadership in america yet on best question? weathered city state or federal level.— federal level. certainly on the federal level. certainly on the federal level. _ federal level. certainly on the federal level. there _ federal level. certainly on the federal level. there is - federal level. certainly on the federal level. there is still- federal level. certainly on the federal level. there is still a l federal level. there is still a couple of days where which the democrats can end their squabbling and come up a credible funding plan that biden can present at 26. it's fairly remarkable package still in its slimmed—down state we are talking about a half $1,000,000,000,000 in incentives and other measures to try to encourage climate change fighting technologies and behavioural changes. if he could actually arrive in glasgow with that in hand i think that would actually increase the us is credibility on the global stage with us. then you go down to lower levels of state and city levels and unfortunately, it's the same political divide that we see on the national level appling at the micro level as well. you got liberal cities like my own, los angeles or new york starting up to this world pledge with other big cities to divest their public funds from fossil fuel companies but that you have other cities that are not doing so much. you have my state california where the governor recently just a few weeks ago unveiled a $15,000,000,000 package to fight climate change. then you had the governor of texas where to be fair, it's actually a fairly big producer of wind energy but when antonio gutierrez, the secretary—general of united nations warned texas that it needed to stop being so over reliant on oil and gas the governor actually tweeted two words which were sounds sad. it's unfortunate that were going to see the same polarisation repeated on local levels as we see already on the federal level. fin local levels as we see already on the federal level.— local levels as we see already on the federal level. on this question on whether _ the federal level. on this question on whether pension _ the federal level. on this question on whether pension funds - the federal level. on this question on whether pension funds should l on whether pension funds should divest— on whether pension funds should divest from — on whether pension funds should divest from oil— on whether pension funds should divest from oil and _ on whether pension funds should divest from oil and gas _ on whether pension funds should divest from oil and gas and - on whether pension funds should divest from oil and gas and other carbon— divest from oil and gas and other carbon intensive _ divest from oil and gas and other carbon intensive stuff, _ divest from oil and gas and other carbon intensive stuff, there - divest from oil and gas and other carbon intensive stuff, there will| carbon intensive stuff, there will be carbon intensive stuff, there will he a _ carbon intensive stuff, there will he a big — carbon intensive stuff, there will he a big debate _ carbon intensive stuff, there will be a big debate at— carbon intensive stuff, there will be a big debate at cop26. - carbon intensive stuff, there will. be a big debate at cop26. there's a bil be a big debate at cop26. there's a big argument. — be a big debate at cop26. there's a big argument. is— be a big debate at cop26. there's a big argument, is it _ be a big debate at cop26. there's a big argument, is it better— be a big debate at cop26. there's a big argument, is it better to - be a big debate at cop26. there's a big argument, is it better to say- big argument, is it better to say were _ big argument, is it better to say were going _ big argument, is it better to say were going to— big argument, is it better to say were going to sell— big argument, is it better to say were going to sell our— big argument, is it better to say were going to sell our shares. were going to sell our shares in exxon, _ were going to sell our shares in exxon. shell, _ were going to sell our shares in exxon, shell, bp— were going to sell our shares in exxon, shell, bp or— were going to sell our shares in exxon, shell, bp or do - were going to sell our shares in exxon, shell, bp or do you - were going to sell our shares in exxon, shell, bp or do you tryl were going to sell our shares in. exxon, shell, bp or do you try to engage _ exxon, shell, bp or do you try to engage with _ exxon, shell, bp or do you try to engage with those _ exxon, shell, bp or do you try to engage with those businesses i exxon, shell, bp or do you try to . engage with those businesses goes back a _ engage with those businesses goes back a lot _ engage with those businesses goes back a lot of— engage with those businesses goes back a lot of the _ engage with those businesses goes back a lot of the oil— engage with those businesses goes back a lot of the oil majors - engage with those businesses goes back a lot of the oil majors will- back a lot of the oil majors will tell you. — back a lot of the oil majors will tell you. if— back a lot of the oil majors will tell you. if you _ back a lot of the oil majors will tell you, if you divest - back a lot of the oil majors will tell you, if you divest yourselfl tell you, if you divest yourself that _ tell you, if you divest yourself that doesn't _ tell you, if you divest yourself that doesn't mean _ tell you, if you divest yourself that doesn't mean the - tell you, if you divest yourself that doesn't mean the stuff. tell you, if you divest yourselfj that doesn't mean the stuff as it could _ that doesn't mean the stuff as it could happen, _ that doesn't mean the stuff as it could happen, ill— that doesn't mean the stuff as it could happen, illjust_ that doesn't mean the stuff as it could happen, illjust don't - that doesn't mean the stuff as iti could happen, illjust don't those assets will— could happen, illjust don't those assets will be _ could happen, illjust don't those assets will be hoop _ could happen, illjust don't those assets will be hoop it _ could happen, illjust don't those assets will be hoop it up - could happen, illjust don't those assets will be hoop it up i- could happen, illjust don't those assets will be hoop it up i less i assets will be hoop it up i less transparent— assets will be hoop it up i less transparent with _ assets will be hoop it up i less transparent with less - assets will be hoop it up i less - transparent with less commitment to try to _ transparent with less commitment to try to do _ transparent with less commitment to try to do this — transparent with less commitment to try to do this with _ transparent with less commitment to try to do this with the _ transparent with less commitment to try to do this with the question - transparent with less commitment to try to do this with the question of- try to do this with the question of being _ try to do this with the question of being to — try to do this with the question of being to divest _ try to do this with the question of being to divest or— try to do this with the question of being to divest or engage - try to do this with the question of being to divest or engage will- try to do this with the question of being to divest or engage will bel try to do this with the question ofl being to divest or engage will be a really— being to divest or engage will be a really key— being to divest or engage will be a really key one _ being to divest or engage will be a really key one with _ being to divest or engage will be a really key one with the _ being to divest or engage will be a really key one with the masters i being to divest or engage will be a really key one with the masters of| really key one with the masters of the financial— really key one with the masters of the financial universe _ really key one with the masters of the financial universe and - really key one with the masters of| the financial universe and they will have a _ the financial universe and they will have a big — the financial universe and they will have a big say— the financial universe and they will have a big say in _ the financial universe and they will have a big say in how— the financial universe and they will have a big say in how this - the financial universe and they will have a big say in how this goes. i the uk's finance minister, the chancellor of the exchequer, was managing expectations, too, this week. his budget and spending plans for the next three years included the largest increase in taxes in almost 30 years. not that you'd have known it. his budget, declared rishi sunak, was helping to create "a new age of optimism" — which includes the highest tax burden since the 1950s. now that's chutzpzah. iam i am slightly tongue—in—cheek but there are kind of serious questions about it. is it possible to squared rishi sunak st bradaric with the reality of the measures is introducing? i reality of the measures is introducing?— reality of the measures is introducin: ? ~ , ., ., ., introducing? i think you have to take this budget _ introducing? i think you have to take this budget with _ introducing? i think you have to take this budget with the - introducing? i think you have to take this budget with the lasso. introducing? i think you have to - take this budget with the lasso. we seen some — take this budget with the lasso. we seen some of— take this budget with the lasso. we seen some of the _ take this budget with the lasso. we seen some of the biggest— take this budget with the lasso. we seen some of the biggest tax - seen some of the biggest tax rises we've _ seen some of the biggest tax rises we've seen— seen some of the biggest tax rises we've seen in— seen some of the biggest tax rises we've seen in a— seen some of the biggest tax rises we've seen in a generation. - we've seen in a generation. added 40, we've seen in a generation. added 40. 50 _ we've seen in a generation. added 40. 50 billion _ we've seen in a generation. added 40, 50 billion as— we've seen in a generation. added 40, 50 billion as you _ we've seen in a generation. added 40, 50 billion as you say - we've seen in a generation. added 40, 50 billion as you say the - 40, 50 billion as you say the highest _ 40,50 billion as you say the highest tax _ 40,50 billion as you say the highest tax burden _ 40,50 billion as you say the highest tax burden since - 40,50 billion as you say the highest tax burden since the| 40,50 billion as you say the - highest tax burden since the 1950s. what happen— highest tax burden since the 1950s. what happen was _ highest tax burden since the 1950s. what happen was back _ highest tax burden since the 1950s. what happen was back in _ highest tax burden since the 1950s. what happen was back in march - highest tax burden since the 1950s. what happen was back in march he| what happen was back in march he said we've — what happen was back in march he said we've had _ what happen was back in march he said we've had a _ what happen was back in march he said we've had a one _ what happen was back in march he said we've had a one and _ what happen was back in march he said we've had a one and 300 - what happen was back in march he said we've had a one and 300 year| said we've had a one and 300 year event. _ said we've had a one and 300 year event. i_ said we've had a one and 300 year event. i paid— said we've had a one and 300 year event. i paid the— said we've had a one and 300 year event, i paid the wages— said we've had a one and 300 year event, i paid the wages of- event, i paid the wages of 11,000,000 _ event, i paid the wages of 11,000,000 workers - event, i paid the wages of 11,000,000 workers at i event, i paid the wages of. 11,000,000 workers at some event, i paid the wages of- 11,000,000 workers at some pace, payback— 11,000,000 workers at some pace, payback was— 11,000,000 workers at some pace, payback was inevitable. _ 11,000,000 workers at some pace, payback was inevitable. and - 11,000,000 workers at some pace, payback was inevitable. and peoplej payback was inevitable. and people kind of— payback was inevitable. and people kind of sucked _ payback was inevitable. and people kind of sucked it _ payback was inevitable. and people kind of sucked it up _ payback was inevitable. and people kind of sucked it up and _ payback was inevitable. and people kind of sucked it up and said - payback was inevitable. and people kind of sucked it up and said ok, i kind of sucked it up and said ok, that's— kind of sucked it up and said ok, that's fine. — kind of sucked it up and said ok, that's fine, we _ kind of sucked it up and said ok, that's fine, we realises _ kind of sucked it up and said ok, that's fine, we realises bill- kind of sucked it up and said ok, that's fine, we realises bill to- kind of sucked it up and said 0k,| that's fine, we realises bill to pay for this — that's fine, we realises bill to pay forthis~ but— that's fine, we realises bill to pay for this. but new— that's fine, we realises bill to pay for this. but new economic - that's fine, we realises bill to pay. for this. but new economic numbers came _ for this. but new economic numbers came out— for this. but new economic numbers came out and — for this. but new economic numbers came out and said _ for this. but new economic numbers came out and said actually, - for this. but new economic numbers came out and said actually, it's- for this. but new economic numbers came out and said actually, it's noti came out and said actually, it's not quite as— came out and said actually, it's not quite as catastrophic _ came out and said actually, it's not quite as catastrophic as _ came out and said actually, it's not quite as catastrophic as we - quite as catastrophic as we thought. in quite as catastrophic as we thought. in fact _ quite as catastrophic as we thought. in fact we've — quite as catastrophic as we thought. in fact we've got _ quite as catastrophic as we thought. in fact we've got plenty— quite as catastrophic as we thought. in fact we've got plenty more - quite as catastrophic as we thought. | in fact we've got plenty more money than we _ in fact we've got plenty more money than we thought _ in fact we've got plenty more money than we thought we _ in fact we've got plenty more money than we thought we would _ in fact we've got plenty more money than we thought we would have. - in fact we've got plenty more moneyj than we thought we would have. the question— than we thought we would have. the question is— than we thought we would have. the question is whether— than we thought we would have. the question is whether seeking - than we thought we would have. the question is whether seeking to - than we thought we would have. the question is whether seeking to get . question is whether seeking to get that back— question is whether seeking to get that back or— question is whether seeking to get that back or spend _ question is whether seeking to get that back or spend it _ question is whether seeking to get that back or spend it anyway? - question is whether seeking to get that back or spend it anyway? he i that back or spend it anyway? he banked _ that back or spend it anyway? he banked a — that back or spend it anyway? he banked a little _ that back or spend it anyway? he banked a little bit _ that back or spend it anyway? he banked a little bit and _ that back or spend it anyway? he banked a little bit and spent - that back or spend it anyway? he banked a little bit and spent a . that back or spend it anyway? he l banked a little bit and spent a lot. mainly— banked a little bit and spent a lot. mainly on — banked a little bit and spent a lot. mainly on health. _ banked a little bit and spent a lot. mainly on health. so _ banked a little bit and spent a lot. mainly on health. so the - banked a little bit and spent a lot. mainly on health. so the size - banked a little bit and spent a lot. mainly on health. so the size of. banked a little bit and spent a lot. i mainly on health. so the size of the state is _ mainly on health. so the size of the state is at _ mainly on health. so the size of the state is at levels _ mainly on health. so the size of the state is at levels that _ mainly on health. so the size of the state is at levels that we _ mainly on health. so the size of the state is at levels that we haven't i state is at levels that we haven't since _ state is at levels that we haven't since his— state is at levels that we haven't since his 1970s. _ state is at levels that we haven't since his 1970s. some _ state is at levels that we haven't since his 1970s. some say- state is at levels that we haven't since his 1970s. some say this. state is at levels that we haven't since his 1970s. some say this is 'ust since his 1970s. some say this is just accepting _ since his 1970s. some say this is just accepting the _ since his 1970s. some say this is just accepting the reality, - since his 1970s. some say this is just accepting the reality, we - since his 1970s. some say this is. just accepting the reality, we have an ageing — just accepting the reality, we have an ageing population, _ just accepting the reality, we have an ageing population, and - just accepting the reality, we have an ageing population, and health. an ageing population, and health cost really— an ageing population, and health cost really high. _ an ageing population, and health cost really high. right— an ageing population, and health cost really high. right at - an ageing population, and health cost really high. right at the - an ageing population, and health cost really high. right at the endj cost really high. right at the end of his— cost really high. right at the end of his budget _ cost really high. right at the end of his budget he _ cost really high. right at the end of his budget he kind _ cost really high. right at the end of his budget he kind of- cost really high. right at the end of his budget he kind of gave - cost really high. right at the end| of his budget he kind of gave this weird _ of his budget he kind of gave this weird moment— of his budget he kind of gave this weird moment where _ of his budget he kind of gave this weird moment where he - of his budget he kind of gave this weird moment where he said - of his budget he kind of gave this. weird moment where he said i didn't want to— weird moment where he said i didn't want to do— weird moment where he said i didn't want to do this. _ weird moment where he said i didn't want to do this, this _ weird moment where he said i didn't want to do this, this is _ weird moment where he said i didn't want to do this, this is not— weird moment where he said i didn't want to do this, this is not who - weird moment where he said i didn't want to do this, this is not who i - want to do this, this is not who i am _ want to do this, this is not who i am i_ want to do this, this is not who i am iwant— want to do this, this is not who i am i want to _ want to do this, this is not who i am. i want to be _ want to do this, this is not who i am. i want to be a _ want to do this, this is not who i am. i want to be a tax _ want to do this, this is not who i am. i want to be a tax cutting, l am. i want to be a tax cutting, traditionally— am. i want to be a tax cutting, traditionally physical chairs - am. i want to be a tax cutting, traditionally physical chairs off| traditionally physical chairs off said in— traditionally physical chairs off said in an _ traditionally physical chairs off said in an interview— traditionally physical chairs off said in an interview with - traditionally physical chairs off said in an interview with the l traditionally physical chairs off. said in an interview with the bbc that he _ said in an interview with the bbc that he hopes _ said in an interview with the bbc that he hopes you _ said in an interview with the bbc that he hopes you cut _ said in an interview with the bbc that he hopes you cut those - said in an interview with the bbc. that he hopes you cut those taxes towards _ that he hopes you cut those taxes towards the — that he hopes you cut those taxes towards the end _ that he hopes you cut those taxes towards the end of— that he hopes you cut those taxes towards the end of this _ that he hopes you cut those taxes. towards the end of this parliament. but certainly — towards the end of this parliament. but certainly the _ towards the end of this parliament. but certainly the conservative - towards the end of this parliament. j but certainly the conservative party is any _ but certainly the conservative party is any really — but certainly the conservative party is any really good _ but certainly the conservative party is any really good at _ but certainly the conservative party is any really good at rather - is any really good at rather particular— is any really good at rather particular position - is any really good at rather particular position for - is any really good at rather particular position for the i is any really good at rather| particular position for the it certainly— particular position for the it certainly put _ particular position for the it certainly put the _ particular position for the it certainly put the labour - particular position for the it . certainly put the labour party particular position for the it - certainly put the labour party in a bit about— certainly put the labour party in a bit about six _ certainly put the labour party in a bit about six. where _ certainly put the labour party in a bit about six. where do _ certainly put the labour party in a bit about six. where do they- certainly put the labour party in a bit about six. where do they go . bit about six. where do they go when they got— bit about six. where do they go when they got the — bit about six. where do they go when they got the state _ bit about six. where do they go when they got the state decides _ bit about six. where do they go when they got the state decides where - they got the state decides where they spent— they got the state decides where they spent so _ they got the state decides where they spent so much _ they got the state decides where they spent so much money? - they got the state decides where they spent so much money? it. they got the state decides where l they spent so much money? it like to cut taxes— they spent so much money? it like to cut taxes but— they spent so much money? it like to cut taxes but it — they spent so much money? it like to cut taxes but it doesn't _ they spent so much money? it like to cut taxes but it doesn't look - they spent so much money? it like to cut taxes but it doesn't look like - cut taxes but it doesn't look like he'll be — cut taxes but it doesn't look like he'll be able _ cut taxes but it doesn't look like he'll be able to _ cut taxes but it doesn't look like he'll be able to do _ cut taxes but it doesn't look like he'll be able to do that - cut taxes but it doesn't look like he'll be able to do that soon. i cut taxes but it doesn't look like he'll be able to do that soon. ai cut taxes but it doesn't look like . he'll be able to do that soon. a lot of people — he'll be able to do that soon. a lot of people thinking _ he'll be able to do that soon. a lot of people thinking that _ he'll be able to do that soon. a lot of people thinking that this - he'll be able to do that soon. a lot of people thinking that this new i of people thinking that this new timetable — of people thinking that this new timetable means— of people thinking that this new timetable means an _ of people thinking that this new timetable means an election . of people thinking that this newi timetable means an election will of people thinking that this new - timetable means an election will be a bit later~ — timetable means an election will be a bit later~ a— timetable means an election will be a bit later. a lot _ timetable means an election will be a bit later. a lot of _ timetable means an election will be a bit later. a lot of people - a bit later. a lot of people thinking _ a bit later. a lot of people thinking they— a bit later. a lot of people thinking they were - a bit later. a lot of people| thinking they were gearing a bit later. a lot of people - thinking they were gearing up for a bil thinking they were gearing up for a big tax— thinking they were gearing up for a big tax cut — thinking they were gearing up for a big tax cut in — thinking they were gearing up for a big tax cut in 2023 _ thinking they were gearing up for a big tax cut in 2023 out _ thinking they were gearing up for a big tax cut in 2023 out of - thinking they were gearing up for a big tax cut in 2023 out of election, | big tax cut in 2023 out of election, maybe _ big tax cut in 2023 out of election, maybe it _ big tax cut in 2023 out of election, maybe it could _ big tax cut in 2023 out of election, maybe it could be _ big tax cut in 2023 out of election, maybe it could be a _ big tax cut in 2023 out of election, maybe it could be a bit _ big tax cut in 2023 out of election, maybe it could be a bit further- maybe it could be a bit further away than that _ maybe it could be a bit further away than that ia— maybe it could be a bit further away than that. , , , ., . than that. is it possible to look at this and say _ than that. is it possible to look at this and say this _ than that. is it possible to look at this and say this is _ than that. is it possible to look at this and say this is a _ than that. is it possible to look at this and say this is a government| this and say this is a government which has got the balance right between the haves and have—nots but the generations. indeed simon was talking about big increase in spending on health. at the same time he was announcing the good news that schools are now going to get as much money per pupil that they got ten years ago. the balance is questionable, isn't it? yes on international— questionable, isn't it? yes on international age _ questionable, isn't it? yes on international age due - questionable, isn't it? yes on international age due to - questionable, isn't it? yes on| international age due to niaid questionable, isn't it? yes on - international age due to niaid which i international age due to niaid which ithought— international age due to niaid which i thought was overlooked in the whole _ i thought was overlooked in the whole debate. ? eight. that was one of the _ whole debate. ? eight. that was one of the things that rishi sunak had in the _ of the things that rishi sunak had in the name of the pandemic saying the finances are terrible we can't possibly— the finances are terrible we can't possibly afford to help the poor as we committed to. both sides are parliament in legislation tied to gross _ parliament in legislation tied to gross national income. that's not going _ gross national income. that's not going up— gross national income. that's not going up any time soon yet suddenly they have _ going up any time soon yet suddenly they have found this money for all they have found this money for all the other— they have found this money for all the other things like the overhaul of booze — the other things like the overhaul of booze taxes. they can make it cheaper — of booze taxes. they can make it cheaper to — of booze taxes. they can make it cheaper to fly domestically in the uk but _ cheaper to fly domestically in the uk but they can't find the money to restore that original promise which is actually— restore that original promise which is actually tied to gross national income — is actually tied to gross national income anyway. it's not actually a lump _ income anyway. it's not actually a lump sum — income anyway. it's not actually a lump sum that they have to tweak back _ lump sum that they have to tweak back 0t— lump sum that they have to tweak back. of gross national income, that's right — back. 0f gross national income, that's right it— back. of gross national income, that's right. it naturally tapers down — that's right. it naturally tapers down as— that's right. it naturally tapers down as the economy expands or contracts — down as the economy expands or contracts. rishi sunak saying this is the _ contracts. rishi sunak saying this is the end — contracts. rishi sunak saying this is the end of his budget reminds me of this— is the end of his budget reminds me of this great line that labour prime minister— of this great line that labour prime minister in — of this great line that labour prime minister in 2007 when he was on track— minister in 2007 when he was on track to— minister in 2007 when he was on track to win _ minister in 2007 when he was on track to win his landslide victory over— track to win his landslide victory over conservative prime minister, he came _ over conservative prime minister, he came unsaid, — over conservative prime minister, he came unsaid, people call me a fiscal conservative well a very enterprising journalist went back and took— enterprising journalist went back and look at history and no one had ever caited — and look at history and no one had ever called him a fiscal conservative. i think rishi sunak may— conservative. i think rishi sunak may be — conservative. i think rishi sunak may be wanting a little so the maxeti — may be wanting a little so the maxell describing mojo for himself. to quote _ maxell describing mojo for himself. to quote shakespeare you think the lady does protest too much. does the labour balance to be admired or doubted? i labour balance to be admired or doubted? . . , ~ labour balance to be admired or doubted? . . , ,, , doubted? i certainly think the big ruestion is doubted? i certainly think the big question is we — doubted? i certainly think the big question is we would _ doubted? i certainly think the big question is we would any - doubted? i certainly think the big question is we would any party i doubted? i certainly think the big l question is we would any party that in power notjust the conservatives. to go back to simon's point comparing to what happen a year ago, let's also think about what's happened over ten years. that is that the conservatives in power not just on the borisjohnson but back when david cameron was prime minister instituted fairly crippling austerity cuts that we hadn't seen also since world war ii. we keep talking about the huge generational shifts. the fact that health is going to be back to their 2010 level, excuse me, education back to the 2010 level, health is been 0k and so is the home office put the 2010 level, health is been ok and so is the home office put up a plenty of other departments are not going to necessarily find that they are back in flush as they were even are back in flush as they were even a little bit over a decade ago. of course we still have that inflation. they are pegging it between four to 5% next year that's going to cut into people spending power and that includes the government each percentage point or even half that inflation goes up is going to make all this a little bit tougher on sunak and johnson as the year goes by. i sunak and johnson as the year goes b . ~' sunak and johnson as the year goes by. i think that's a really important point. - by. i think that's a really| important point. inflation by. i think that's a really - important point. inflation was the thin that important point. inflation was the thing that stopped _ important point. inflation was the thing that stopped his _ important point. inflation was the thing that stopped his budget. . important point. inflation was the thing that stopped his budget. it| thing that stopped his budget. it stocks— thing that stopped his budget. it stocks the — thing that stopped his budget. it stocks the economy. _ thing that stopped his budget. it stocks the economy. in - thing that stopped his budget. it stocks the economy. in the - thing that stopped his budget. it stocks the economy. in the uk l thing that stopped his budget. it| stocks the economy. in the uk is around _ stocks the economy. in the uk is around the — stocks the economy. in the uk is around the world. _ stocks the economy. in the uk is around the world. even - stocks the economy. in the uk is around the world. even though . stocks the economy. in the uk isl around the world. even though all stocks the economy. in the uk is - around the world. even though all of this spending. — around the world. even though all of this spending. hey— around the world. even though all of this spending, hey big _ around the world. even though all of this spending, hey big spender, - this spending, hey big spender, spending — this spending, hey big spender, spending spree _ this spending, hey big spender, spending spree were _ this spending, hey big spender, spending spree were headlinesi this spending, hey big spender, i spending spree were headlines in this spending, hey big spender, - spending spree were headlines in the uk. spending spree were headlines in the uk a _ spending spree were headlines in the uk a tot— spending spree were headlines in the uk a tot of— spending spree were headlines in the uk. a lot of people _ spending spree were headlines in the uk. a lot of people will— spending spree were headlines in the uk. a lot of people will not _ spending spree were headlines in the uk. a lot of people will not feel- uk. a lot of people will not feel that things _ uk. a lot of people will not feel that things are _ uk. a lot of people will not feel that things are actually- uk. a lot of people will not feel that things are actually getting i that things are actually getting better — that things are actually getting better they— that things are actually getting better. they will— that things are actually getting better. they will feel- that things are actually getting better. they will feel the - that things are actually getting i better. they will feel the benefit of that— better. they will feel the benefit of that because _ better. they will feel the benefit of that because with _ better. they will feel the benefit of that because with inflation - better. they will feel the benefit| of that because with inflation and indeed _ of that because with inflation and indeed a — of that because with inflation and indeed a rising _ of that because with inflation and indeed a rising employee - indeed a rising employee contributions, _ indeed a rising employee contributions, tax- indeed a rising employee - contributions, tax contributions you're — contributions, tax contributions you're going _ contributions, tax contributions you're going to— contributions, tax contributions you're going to see _ contributions, tax contributions you're going to see wage - contributions, tax contributions . you're going to see wage increases of you're going to see wage increases oqust_ you're going to see wage increases oqust 5%— you're going to see wage increases oqust 5% to — you're going to see wage increases ofjust 5% to stand _ you're going to see wage increases ofjust 5% to stand still— you're going to see wage increases ofjust 5% to stand still and that i ofjust 5% to stand still and that inflationary— ofjust 5% to stand still and that inflationary environment. - ofjust 5% to stand still and that inflationary environment. will . ofjust 5% to stand still and that l inflationary environment. will you fail the _ inflationary environment. will you fail the benefit, _ inflationary environment. will you fail the benefit, fill— inflationary environment. will you fail the benefit, fill the _ inflationary environment. will you fail the benefit, fill the glow- fail the benefit, fill the glow that, — fail the benefit, fill the glow that. probably— fail the benefit, fill the glow that, probably not. - fail the benefit, fill the glow that, probably not.- fail the benefit, fill the glow that, probably not. maybe not that new a . e of that, probably not. maybe not that new age of optimism _ that, probably not. maybe not that new age of optimism just - that, probably not. maybe not that new age of optimism just yet. - the chancellor was able to delete one line of expenditure this week. 20 years of funding a military presence in afghanistan has ended. a different sort of funding may already be needed — aid to avert famine. afghanistan is bankrupt and the taliban is floundering. challenged in the house of commons to help, borisjohnson said the uk "couldn't write a completely blank cheque" for a country that risks becoming again a haven for growing opium and cultivating terrorism. latika, regionalforeign latika, regional foreign ministers were latika, regionalforeign ministers were meeting on friday and ended by issuing a statement calling for international assistance. australia is one country that had a military present and has done things for example, take afghan refugees who wanted to flee the taliban. is there a sense in the region that realistically people are going to have to get involved again one—way or the other? it have to get involved again one-way or the other?— or the other? it was interesting to see this week _ or the other? it was interesting to see this week that _ or the other? it was interesting to see this week that the _ or the other? it was interesting to see this week that the australian l see this week that the australian government committed in another $100,000,000 to foreign aid or humanitarian assistance to afghanistan. it's very well for me to criticise — afghanistan. it's very well for me to criticise the british but australia's foreign aid contribution are absolutely paltry. i think is not 21— are absolutely paltry. i think is not ~21%— are absolutely paltry. i think is not .21% of gni. were not a big donor, — not .21% of gni. were not a big donor, were _ not .21% of gni. were not a big donor, were not a big giver and were not very— donor, were not a big giver and were not very generous when it comes to foreign aid — not very generous when it comes to foreign aid. this is a bit of a substantial donation from australia that the _ substantial donation from australia that the government sent this week. clearly— that the government sent this week. clearly that is the only lever that australia — clearly that is the only lever that australia sees much of the west having _ australia sees much of the west having over the taliban. now over all australia has spent over two decades— all australia has spent over two decades $1.5 billion in trying to develop — decades $1.5 billion in trying to develop afghanistan. and the question that the australian government has for its voters is, was it— government has for its voters is, was it worth it? look what's happening at the end of those two decades, — happening at the end of those two decades, we have handed afghanistan back wrapped with a bow on top to the taliban. back wrapped with a bow on top to the taliban-— back wrapped with a bow on top to the taliban. henry, what about the im act on the taliban. henry, what about the impact on visit _ the taliban. henry, what about the impact on visit washington? - the taliban. henry, what about the impact on visit washington? we'vej impact on visit washington? we've only just impact on visit washington? we've onlyjust had the debate about the withdrawal from afghanistan. onlyjust had the debate about the withdrawalfrom afghanistan. i onlyjust had the debate about the withdrawal from afghanistan. i think there was a senator this week calling for a committee inquiry to set up to answer exactly this question and being radical of president bidens policy. how much concern in washington it is there about how you engage with taliban and how you ensure this doesn't turn into notjust a humanitarian crisis but also further deterioration and yet again the breeding ground for international terrorism? i yet again the breeding ground for international terrorism ?_ international terrorism? i think it's something _ international terrorism? i think it's something that _ international terrorism? i think it's something that might - international terrorism? i think it's something that might be i international terrorism? i think i it's something that might be even more fearful to americans then the taliban in charge in afghanistan is a failed state in afghanistan. it becomes a geopolitical nightmare the region and the rest of the world will have to suffer well. i think the us has recognised thatjust like australia having announced more aid yesterday, the us said that it was going to pledge another 140 for million dollars and that will raise its overall amount this year to 600,000,000 plus. of course a lot of that was pledged before the taliban to go over in august was up the fear is that money will not be directed in the right way and they don't want to fund the taliban. there still get a final it through ngos and other groups to try to make sure that the taliban itself is not benefiting from this. we are talking about a humanitarian disaster in the making for a country whose budget in the past was 75% foreign aid. you really do need these donors to step up. and then the fact that the taliban itself isn't equipped to be able to distribute any of this aid if it had its own hands. put people or more were evacuated from afghanistan after the fall of kabul. many of those people are professional, well—trained engineers, economists, many of them women whom the taliban is not allowing to work and they've lost a real serious human resource right there. this is really staring them in the face right now is the winter comes on. it’s them in the face right now is the winter comes on.— them in the face right now is the winter comes on. it's a huge task business play _ winter comes on. it's a huge task business play a — winter comes on. it's a huge task business play a big _ winter comes on. it's a huge task business play a big part - winter comes on. it's a huge task business play a big part in - winter comes on. it's a huge task business play a big part in the i business play a big part in the development of afghanistan, contractors say we built this off and the world bank will pass the money because it won't allow any money because it won't allow any money to go back into afghanistan. meanwhile ngos play a big role in distributing. it’s meanwhile ngos play a big role in distributinu. �* , . meanwhile ngos play a big role in distributing-— distributing. it's a messy picture. you've got _ distributing. it's a messy picture. you've got the — distributing. it's a messy picture. you've got the world _ distributing. it's a messy picture. you've got the world food - distributing. it's a messy picture. i you've got the world food programme say you've got the world food programme sav we've _ you've got the world food programme sav we've got — you've got the world food programme sav we've got the _ you've got the world food programme say we've got the biggest _ say we've got the biggest humanitarian _ say we've got the biggest humanitarian crisis - say we've got the biggest humanitarian crisis in i say we've got the biggest humanitarian crisis in the j say we've got the biggest - humanitarian crisis in the world devetoping _ humanitarian crisis in the world developing there. _ humanitarian crisis in the world developing there. there - humanitarian crisis in the world developing there. there is i humanitarian crisis in the world developing there. there is a i humanitarian crisis in the world i developing there. there is a stage of one _ developing there. there is a stage of one to — developing there. there is a stage of one to five _ developing there. there is a stage of one to five emergency - developing there. there is a stage of one to five emergency food i of one to five emergency food situation~ _ of one to five emergency food situation. we've _ of one to five emergency food situation. we've got - of one to five emergency food situation. we've got 47% i of one to five emergency food situation. we've got 47% of i of one to five emergency food i situation. we've got 47% of the of one to five emergency food - situation. we've got 47% of the comp tree either— situation. we've got 47% of the comp tree either three _ situation. we've got 47% of the comp tree either three or— situation. we've got 47% of the comp tree either three or four— situation. we've got 47% of the comp tree either three or four other- tree either three or four other critical— tree either three or four other critical or— tree either three or four other critical or emergency. - tree either three or four other critical or emergency. and i tree either three or four other| critical or emergency. and will go into the _ critical or emergency. and will go into the winter— critical or emergency. and will go into the winter months. - critical or emergency. and will go into the winter months. i - critical or emergency. and will go into the winter months. i think. critical or emergency. and will go i into the winter months. i think one of the _ into the winter months. i think one of the other— into the winter months. i think one of the other things _ into the winter months. i think one of the other things the _ of the other things the international— of the other things the i international community of the other things the - international community has to figure — international community has to figure out— international community has to figure out is— international community has to figure out is our— international community has to figure out is our recognise i international community has to figure out is our recognise and| international community has to i figure out is our recognise and deal with the _ figure out is our recognise and deal with the taliban? _ figure out is our recognise and deal with the taliban? yes _ figure out is our recognise and deal with the taliban? yes or— figure out is our recognise and deal with the taliban? yes or no? - figure out is our recognise and deal with the taliban? yes or no? there j with the taliban? yes or no? there still $9,000,000,000 _ with the taliban? yes or no? there still $9,000,000,000 of- with the taliban? yes or no? there still $9,000,000,000 of assets l still $9,000,000,000 of assets frozen _ still $9,000,000,000 of assets frozen outside _ still $9,000,000,000 of assets frozen outside afghanistan. i still $9,000,000,000 of assets frozen outside afghanistan. [- still $9,000,000,000 of assets frozen outside afghanistan. i think the aft han frozen outside afghanistan. i think the afghan foreign _ frozen outside afghanistan. i think the afghan foreign minister i frozen outside afghanistan. i think the afghan foreign minister has i frozen outside afghanistan.— the afghan foreign minister has been lobbying in the or saying let us have that money at least. the cuestion have that money at least. the question is. — have that money at least. the question is, are _ have that money at least. the question is, are we _ have that money at least. the question is, are we going to deal with the — question is, are we going to deal with the television, _ question is, are we going to deal with the television, yes - question is, are we going to deal with the television, yes or- question is, are we going to deal with the television, yes or no? i question is, are we going to deali with the television, yes or no? to be older— with the television, yes or no? to be older nose _ with the television, yes or no? to be older nose and _ with the television, yes or no? to be older nose and deal— with the television, yes or no? to be older nose and deal with - with the television, yes or no? to be older nose and deal with them j with the television, yes or no? to i be older nose and deal with them and freed his— be older nose and deal with them and freed his money— be older nose and deal with them and freed his money on _ be older nose and deal with them and freed his money on the _ be older nose and deal with them and freed his money on the basis - be older nose and deal with them and freed his money on the basis that i be older nose and deal with them and freed his money on the basis that if i freed his money on the basis that if we don't _ freed his money on the basis that if we don't were — freed his money on the basis that if we don't were going _ freed his money on the basis that if we don't were going to— freed his money on the basis that if we don't were going to see - freed his money on the basis that if we don't were going to see the i we don't were going to see the economy— we don't were going to see the economy which— we don't were going to see the economy which is _ we don't were going to see the economy which is already i we don't were going to see the i economy which is already collapsed, there's— economy which is already collapsed, there's absolutely _ economy which is already collapsed, there's absolutely no _ economy which is already collapsed, there's absolutely no way— economy which is already collapsed, there's absolutely no way of- economy which is already collapsed, there's absolutely no way of getting | there's absolutely no way of getting it back, _ there's absolutely no way of getting it back, i_ there's absolutely no way of getting it back, ithink— there's absolutely no way of getting it back, i think a — there's absolutely no way of getting it back, i think a lot _ there's absolutely no way of getting it back, i think a lot of— there's absolutely no way of getting it back, i think a lot of people - it back, i think a lot of people around — it back, i think a lot of people around the _ it back, i think a lot of people around the world _ it back, i think a lot of people around the world feels - it back, i think a lot of people| around the world feels slightly embarrassed, _ around the world feels slightly embarrassed, ashamed - around the world feels slightly embarrassed, ashamed even i around the world feels slightly i embarrassed, ashamed even about around the world feels slightly - embarrassed, ashamed even about the way embarrassed, ashamed even about the wav that— embarrassed, ashamed even about the way that afghanistan _ embarrassed, ashamed even about the way that afghanistan was _ embarrassed, ashamed even about the way that afghanistan was left - embarrassed, ashamed even about the way that afghanistan was left there. i way that afghanistan was left there. the very _ way that afghanistan was left there. the very vulnerable _ way that afghanistan was left there. the very vulnerable to _ way that afghanistan was left there. the very vulnerable to economic- way that afghanistan was left there. | the very vulnerable to economic and famine _ the very vulnerable to economic and famine shocks — the very vulnerable to economic and famine shocks that _ the very vulnerable to economic and famine shocks that we _ the very vulnerable to economic and famine shocks that we are _ the very vulnerable to economic and famine shocks that we are seeing. i famine shocks that we are seeing. there _ famine shocks that we are seeing. there did — famine shocks that we are seeing. there did not _ famine shocks that we are seeing. there did not aid _ famine shocks that we are seeing. there did not aid is _ famine shocks that we are seeing. there did not aid is getting - famine shocks that we are seeing. there did not aid is getting in and| there did not aid is getting in and the taliban— there did not aid is getting in and the taliban are _ there did not aid is getting in and the taliban are not _ there did not aid is getting in and the taliban are not preventing i there did not aid is getting in and the taliban are not preventing it. the taliban are not preventing it getting — the taliban are not preventing it getting in— the taliban are not preventing it getting in because _ the taliban are not preventing it getting in because they- the taliban are not preventing it getting in because they do - the taliban are not preventing it getting in because they do not. the taliban are not preventing it- getting in because they do not want a failed _ getting in because they do not want a failed stand — getting in because they do not want a failed stand the _ getting in because they do not want a failed stand the next _ getting in because they do not want a failed stand the next date - getting in because they do not want a failed stand the next date on i a failed stand the next date on hand — a failed stand the next date on hand they— a failed stand the next date on hand. they don't _ a failed stand the next date on hand. they don't want - a failed stand the next date on hand. they don't want the i a failed stand the next date on i hand. they don't want the minute they take — hand. they don't want the minute they take over— hand. they don't want the minute they take over the _ hand. they don't want the minute they take over the country- they take over the country cottapses~ _ they take over the country collapses. as _ they take over the country collapses. as on - they take over the country collapses. as on their- they take over the country| collapses. as on their best interests _ collapses. as on their best interests either. _ collapses. as on their best interests either. just - collapses. as on their best interests either. just how. collapses. as on their best i interests either. just how those channeis — interests either. just how those channels will— interests either. just how those channels will work— interests either. just how those channels will work and - interests either. just how those channels will work and to - interests either. just how those channels will work and to what i channels will work and to what extent — channels will work and to what extent vou _ channels will work and to what extent you begin _ channels will work and to what extent you begin to _ channels will work and to what extent you begin to recognisei channels will work and to what i extent you begin to recognise the taliban— extent you begin to recognise the taliban as — extent you begin to recognise the taliban as a — extent you begin to recognise the taliban as a legitimate _ extent you begin to recognise the taliban as a legitimate dump i extent you begin to recognise the taliban as a legitimate dump like | taliban as a legitimate dump like that government _ taliban as a legitimate dump like that government is _ taliban as a legitimate dump like that government is a _ taliban as a legitimate dump like that government is a really - taliban as a legitimate dump like that government is a really big i that government is a really big question _ that government is a really big question but— that government is a really big question. but i _ that government is a really big question. but i don't _ that government is a really big question. but i don't think- that government is a really big i question. but i don't think there is any international— question. but i don't think there is any international consensus - question. but i don't think there is any international consensus right i any international consensus right now _ any international consensus right now white — any international consensus right now white we _ any international consensus right now. while we wait _ any international consensus right now. while we wait for _ any international consensus right now. while we wait for that - now. while we wait for that consensus _ now. while we wait for that consensus i'm _ now. while we wait for that consensus i'm afraid - now. while we wait for that consensus i'm afraid the i now. while we wait for that - consensus i'm afraid the situation deteriorating _ consensus i'm afraid the situation deteriorating. there _ consensus i'm afraid the situation deteriorating. there was - consensus i'm afraid the situation deteriorating. there was an - deteriorating. there was an interesting _ deteriorating. there was an interesting report— deteriorating. there was an interesting report every- deteriorating. there was an| interesting report every two evervone _ interesting report every two everyone to _ interesting report every two everyone to watch. - interesting report every ton everyone to watch. tragically interesting report every two - everyone to watch. tragically some people _ everyone to watch. tragically some people are — everyone to watch. tragically some peopte are being _ everyone to watch. tragically some people are being forced _ everyone to watch. tragically some people are being forced to - everyone to watch. tragically some people are being forced to sell i people are being forced to sell their— people are being forced to sell their children _ people are being forced to sell their children in— people are being forced to sell their children in order- people are being forced to sell their children in order to - people are being forced to sell their children in order to get i their children in order to get enough _ their children in order to get enough food _ their children in order to get enough food. it's _ their children in order to get enough food. it's very - their children in order to get enough food. it's very hard i their children in order to get i enough food. it's very hard watch but i _ enough food. it's very hard watch but i think— enough food. it's very hard watch but i think if— enough food. it's very hard watch but i think if you _ enough food. it's very hard watch but i think if you want _ enough food. it's very hard watch but i think if you want a - enough food. it's very hard watch but i think if you want a portrait l but i think if you want a portrait of what's — but i think if you want a portrait of what's going _ but i think if you want a portrait of what's going on _ but i think if you want a portrait of what's going on there - but i think if you want a portrait of what's going on there i - but i think if you want a portrait| of what's going on there i would -ive of what's going on there i would give that— of what's going on there i would give that a — of what's going on there i would give that a look. _ of what's going on there i would give that a look.— give that a look. very important one. give that a look. very important one- that _ give that a look. very important one. that can _ give that a look. very important one. that can be _ give that a look. very important one. that can be found - give that a look. very important one. that can be found on i give that a look. very important l one. that can be found on various bbc resources online or on the bbc iplayer. latika burke henry, thank you also watching. don't forget to challenges facing the taliban. one is the opium trade which is been a problem in the times even of the western occupation. heroin was still getting from the opium fields of afghanistan to the streets of the west. that was a good financial resource of the taliban want to use it and of course the threat of terrorist activities from the islamic state. that's it for dateline london for this week — goodbye. good evening. there is yet more rain in the forecast for this weekend. not great news for those in many parts of the uk that could really do with a chance to dry out. but the one thing we can say is that the various bouts of rain should move through fairly quickly, so there will be some drier, clearer, even sunnier gaps in between. this is how things turned out today. heavy rain that drifted across parts of wales, northwest england and made for a really soggy afternoon across scotland. we saw some showers following on, and then this line of showery rain pushing in from the west. and that is going to work its way eastwards as we move through friday night into the first part of saturday morning. things, though, by the end of the night should be drying out again across northern ireland, and for the eastern side of scotland, down the eastern side of england where we hold on to clear skies, one or two places will turn a little bit chilly. but tomorrow morning will start cloudy and wet for many, thanks to this frontal system which will be pushing its way eastwards. but at least it is moving eastwards. so it offers the promise of something drier and brighter following on from the west. you can see our band of rain as it slides eastwards across scotland, moving out of wales fairly quickly, sliding eastwards across england. northern ireland will start the day with sunshine, holding on to that through the day, albeit with one or two showers. and those sunnier skies with a scattering of showers will spread further east as the day wears on. top temperatures between 11—15 celsius. if anything, a little cooler and fresher than it has been during today. another slice of clear skies for saturday night, so, again, it will turn a little chilly in places, but there is another weather system working in from the west. don't forget, though, through the early hours of sunday, the clocks go back an hour. you will get an extra hour in bed, but while the clocks change, the weather story doesn't, really. it stays unsettled. low pressure dominating for sunday, in fact, potentially quite a deep low, so not only rain in the forecast, we're likely to see some quite strong winds as well. again, the band of rain should move through quite quickly. heavy showers following on behind with some sunshine, some very strong winds, which could touch gale force around some western coasts. top temperatures for sunday afternoon, again, quite a cool, fresh feel between 10—14 celsius. and we stick with some cool, perhaps even chilly weather as we head into next week. we will see showers for a time, but it should turn drier for midweek onwards. this is bbc news, i'm shaun ley. the headlines at 8pm — the queen has been advised to rest from public duties for two weeks following worries about her health. penelope jackson stabbed her husband david three times with a kitchen knife, admitting the attack when police made their arrest. i admit it all. the government warns it may retaliate if france blocks british fishing boats in the row over post—brexit fishing rights. the pope meets president biden and calls for radical decisions at next week's climate change summit in a special message filmed for the bbc.

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