yet. we d have a lot of atf agents surrounding them in plain clothes. once they checked the bag and they didn t notify the carrier, we d grab the bag and get the guns and arrest the traffickers. that s how we used to stop a lot of gun trafficking because we don t have a gun traffic law so we had to deal with it that way. okay. let s move to the security checkpoint that every single passenger has to go through. i mean, it s not like a gun wouldn t easily be detected in the x-ray machines, right? so, what kind of thing are you envisioning? well, you know, guns come in many sizes, first of all. and metal detectors have sensitivities. you could have a derringer, for example, a.22 caliber derringer that is as big, really, as your thumb. and that can be in the baggage and could be undetected. so, they try their very best to find everything, but
thank you so much from kenosha. joining me is joyce vance, nbc legal analyst. all right, joyce, let s get to you there as we ve heard from the judge. he s gotten a lot of criticism for his idiosyncrasies in court. how do you view his comments to the jury that we played? it s pretty typical for judges to make comments to a jury after a verdict comes in, thanking them for their jury service and reminding them that it doesn t matter what their verdict is, what matters is their commitment to listening to the evidence and doing their best and diligently trying to fulfill their duties. so, this wasn t that unusual. the problem is that it was the final stage of what had been a number of, if not outright efforts to put his thumb on the scale, then blunders by this judge, who didn t seem in any way committed to creating an environment where everyone who was watching the trial would believe it was fair. on many cases, he appeared to have a strong defense
carrier. you must notify the carrier. that s federal law. so, that s interesting. yeah. you can transport are you supposed to be asked if you have anything i don t recall i think it s mostly because i take carryon luggage but i do travel a lot. when you re checking luggage, are you always asked if you have any firearms? is that something a gate agent has to ask you when you re checking your luggage? well, the onus is really on the person carrying the firearm. but often, the ticket agent does ask, do you have any hazardous materials, chemicals, firearms? they often ask. but they re not required to ask. you re required to notify them, because you re the one transporting the firearm. if you put it in the checked baggage, this is how we used to bust gun traffickers all the time. we follow them to an airport, they had a briefcase full of guns, you know, a dozen handguns in the briefcase, flying from one city to another to traffic the guns. we follow them in the airport. we had
and whenever we went anywhere and we were always flying all over the country for missions, we were always armed and of course you wouldn t know we were armed, and the only people who would know would be the pilots. and we would usually surreptitiously meet the pilot, and the flight crew would know who we are. they d look at us, we d talk to them beforehand quitely so we all know the flight crew knew that was a federal agent in seat 3b. we were glad to have the armed pilots in the cockpit and because that was tremendous security. they re not going to shoot through there and get in that cabin, and if there s federal agents in the back, and a lot of times there are, not air marshals always, but federal agents who are flying for, you know, various normal law enforcement missions, and often police officers too. from city, state, and county agencies that must travel so a lot of times there are officers and agents on board. agents and officers are not flashing their guns. they re not, you k
we carry a large number of those. secret service, fbi, a lot of different law enforcement officers and then frequently, they re armed usually, they re armed, and so the state of carriage of their weapon would be in accordance with their particular organization s policies, but usually, they re fully ready to go. okay. john, i m going to ask you to stay with me. very quickly, jim, i have one more question to you, and the likelihood that this is a terrorism-related incident or something just somebody, potentially if it s a passenger, who unintentionally left a gun. you know, i mean, it doesn t sound like it s terrorism. how often does this kind of thing happen in your experience as a terrorism analyst, that it s just some, you know, knucklehead who forgets to take