this is what you talked to mike hayden. mike hayden is the cia director who took the extraordinary step of authorizing a huge commitment of resources by the cia on the hunch of these interrogators that khalid shaikh mohammed was not telling truth and al kuwaiti was more important than the current information led them to believe. the senate report debunks that theory with live cia traffic at the time. ghoul was said that he was singing like a tweety bird and gave up the connection to al kuwaiti as did all four of the sources. they did not there is a lot of information that indicates that abu zabada helped lead to the capture of sheikh mohammed which led to the capture there are a lot of people who were interrogated that seemed to lead to the capture of other people.
eit and after al sheeb was broken using enhanced interrogation, the two gave enough information to track khalid shaikh mohammed to his hideout in pakistan. the problem, karl, that s wrong not according to three cia directors who were there at time. the information that was provided bit cia at the time, that s why we went underneath what the directors were saying and saw what the actual traffic was from these black sites at the time. that s why we actually interviewed talked to the investigators you didn t interview they were in front of the committee all the time. all the time. but they were none of them were interviewed for this report. that s what they say. finally, because this gets directly to that question, the third question we to want discuss. did the cia mislead the white house and congress. the senate report says, yes. again, vice president cheney. the notion the committee is trying to peddle that the agency
rest of the program. if you look at the information we had on the courier that took us to osama bin laden, we had four sources and all four sources had the information they knew to attract this guy before they were exposed to enhanced interrogation techniques. karl? it s not true. al kuwaiti, the courier, was identified as a low level operative. it was only after enhanced interrogation techniques were used on al balachi, he s the first guy to say he s osama bin laden s courier. that happened only after enhanced interrogation. khalid shaikh mohammed is saying, no, he left al qaeda in 2002. then after eit confirms khalid shaikh mohammed is lying and that al kuwaiti is actually the courier delivering messages to and from osama bin laden.
if another 9/11 happens f we re faced with another imminent threat do we go back to enhanced interrogation, you re worried about a follow-on attack by ksm, that air remarks will we be more strained or tim snid. one thing the white house is hoping by putting this report out is it becomes a fair wall if you were to something like 9/11 happened again. we have this public accounting. people know what happened. perhaps know what information did or did not come out of these techniques. that being said, i just don t think any of us can realistically say this will never happen again if something as horrific as 9/11 ever happened. we saw in the aftermath of that attack, the nation reacted in ways that i think a lot of us wouldn t have expected and people were comfortable with that for a long time. i don t know if it s at all clear, yes, the committee issued the report but it hasn t settled the issue as to, one, whether these tactics were necessary or not and whether they were effective.
some of the tactics that were written about in the senate intelligence report were brutal. as i said before, constituted torture in my mind. the senate report details waterboarding that was, quote, a series of near drownings, sleep deprivation for up to rectal feeding, that wasn t necessary. isn t that torture by any no. there are nine references on 14 pages to rectal feeding. in four of those five, it is discussed as being a result of a hunger strike by the detainee. they there s no reference in this report to ksm, but khalid shaikh mohammed. the mastermind on 9/11. and there s attempt to ask his interrogators at the time