regimes fall, as our questioner has asked? of course, and then we should humbly say that building democracy and rule of law is not that easy. it takes time. culture, education, tradition, whatever. we have seen that in those post soviet or post yugoslav states, to take another part of europe it is not easy, is not straightforward, it requires time, patience, but it is worth it. because the alternative is far worse. the alternative is to descend into chaos and dictatorship. building democracy, messy, difficult, back and forth ukraine is not a perfect place, by the way, but it is on its way. and i think that lesson needs to be learned by everybody. quite, thanks for that carl. tamuz, ijust want to come back to you, do you want to comment on what you heard our panel say about this? i want to be an optimist. you want to be an optimist, we like that here. let me just get a couple
when this will happen, somebody else will come. there will be an opportunity that we should not lose to engage with russia, to try to anchor russia in europe. because we missed our chance in 1989, we missed our chance in 1999, we should not allow this opportunity. the breakdown of the soviet union. carl, what happens when these regimes fall, as our questioner has asked? of course, and then we should humbly say that building democracy and rule of law is not that easy. it takes time. culture, education, tradition, whatever. we have seen that in those post soviet or post yugoslav states, to take another part of europe it is not easy, is not straightforward, it requires time, patience, but it is worth it. because the alternative is far worse. the alternative is to descend into chaos and dictatorship. building democracy, messy, difficult, back and forth ukraine is not a perfect place, by the way, but it is on its way. and i think that lesson needs to be
tradition, whatever. we have seen that in those post soviet or post yugoslav states, to take another part of europe it is not easy, is not straightforward, it requires time, patience, but it is worth it. because the alternative is far worse. the alternative is to descend into chaos and dictatorship. building democracy, messy, difficult, back and forth ukraine is not a perfect place, by the way, but it is on its way. and i think that lesson needs to be learned by everybody. quite, thanks for that carl. tamuz, ijust want to come back to you, do you want to comment on what you heard our panel say about this? i want to be an optimist. you want to be an optimist, we like that here. let me just get a couple of comments from our audience here on what they have heard our panel say today. anybody want to make a comment? russia became a successor state of the soviet union, they took over their seat
there will be an opportunity that we should not lose to engage with russia, to try to anchor russia in europe. because we missed our chance in 1989, we missed our chance in 1999, we should not allow this opportunity. the breakdown of the soviet union. carl, what happens when these regimes fall, as our questioner has asked? of course, and then we should humbly say that building democracy and rule of law is not that easy. it takes time. culture, education, tradition, whatever. we have seen that in those post soviet or post yugoslav states, to take another part of europe it is not easy, is not straightforward, it requires time, patience, but it is worth it. because the alternative is far worse. the alternative is to descend into chaos and dictatorship. building democracy, messy, difficult, back and forth ukraine is not a perfect place, by the way, but it is on its way. and i think that lesson needs to be learned by everybody.
regimes fall, as our questioner has asked? of course, and then we should humbly say that building democracy and rule of law is not that easy. it takes time. culture, education, tradition, whatever. we have seen that in those post soviet or post yugoslav states, to take another part of europe it is not easy, is not straightforward, it requires time, patience, but it is worth it. because the alternative is far worse. the alternative is to descend into chaos and dictatorship. building democracy, messy, difficult, back and forth ukraine is not a perfect place, by the way, but it is on its way. and i think that lesson needs to be learned by everybody. quite, thanks for that carl. tamuz, ijust want to come back to you, do you want to comment on what you heard our panel say about this? i want to be an optimist. you want to be an optimist, we like that here. let me just get a couple of comments from our audience here on what they have heard our panel say today.