event in his mind that he was going to need to defend himself from. so he at least had to plan long enough to realize he was going to be shot at. which means he didn t expected to die right away. he wanted to live for a while. he had a vision of that killing journey. usually these visions are complicated and they ve been thinking about them for quite a while. that s the hypothesis they ll start with. the minimal indicators just from the very beginning tend to back that up. the authorities looking at those associated with this shooter. one would expect to find clues at a location that he lived at. talk to me about the specific clues authorities are looking for. well, they re going to look for evidence of his writings. very common the mental processes that somebody does this, they will have written this out,
political motivation here. well, hostage negotiators use cognitive empathy or sociopath empathy. having nothing to do with their personal point of view, but able to see it through their eyes. that is going to get the conversation started. for them to be surprised the hostage negotiator can understand. it catches people off guard. it s their job to get a dialogue going and get them out of there without being on a killing journey he was on. are you surprised it went on for 16 hours? usually, an alone gunman siege like this, once they get past 12 hours, it s difficult for an individual to keep going. there s too much stress, they get tired. i was surprised it did last 16 hours and more than likely, it wasn t going to see the sunrise. he wouldn t have been able to
mentioned this before. empathy. looking at their position and not making judgment on it at all. become predictable once you get into the situation and you know where they are coming from. you look at how they communicate. as we discussed, whether or not they are on a killing journey. we were talking in the last hour with jonathan, school shootings, columbine, wait before you go in, find out where everybody is. now the thought is, go in as quickly as you can. these things actually, school shootings, they end quickly. i m wondering, in a situation like this, as a negotiator, are there ticmes when you say negotiation is not going to work here? this person is determined to die and we need to work quickly? you can t negotiate a gunfight or riot. you have to understand what you are walking into at the moment. the earmarks of the situation.
that s terrifying, i imagine. there s two things. there s a difference between willing to die and wanting to die. tough separate that out. they may be willing to die, but may be able to convince them dying another day is a better idea. if there s a predetermined killing journey, if the hostage taker has a specific orchestrated event in mind, he may have started on that at 2:00 in the morning when he separated the hostages. the hostage takers invision, then it s your job, as a negotiator, combined with the s.w.a.t. team to intervene. that s an incredible term, the killing journey. that s what you think of as a negotiator. right. what have they invisioned in advance? i can promise you he surveilled the location a number of times. writings of what was going to happen and what he was thinking
no demands for boat or a car. he doesn t see living past this. if he wants to talk to the prime minister that s the ultimate place he wants to go to if he s orchestrating a killing journey. that may be the last thing he wanted to do before he killed the hostages inside. you begin to assess that kind of a possibility and don t let him do that. how high up the ladder do they pass that? probably went all the way up to the prime minister. chris boss, thank you. thanks for having me on. president barack obama was briefed about the hostage siege in sidney today and in matter of moments we ll see the president expected to address 25,000 u.s. troops. we ll bring it to you live from new jersey. stay here.