there s psychological analysis, but there are hard facts that i think we should start with before we go anywhere else here. the fact is the special counsel gave a subpoena to sam nunberg to testify before a grand jury. this is even after nunberg talked to investigators. so why? why would the special counsel want to put him before the grand jury? it s not at all peculiar that after you speak to a federal investigator, they want to memorialize that not just in their spiral notebooks but also in front of the grand jury. the grand jury has far more authority to have that testimony used at trial. you can compel the witness to be consistent, if not truthful at a trial if it comes in the future. you can impeach that person with their testimony if it s somehow inconsistent. it also has the advantage of having a first-hand account told by a witness in front of the grand jury when their role is to assess credibility, to decide if
they should indict. also no lawyer in the room for a grand jury. if you have a witness you think you can get to, it might be better to do it in that setting than a one-on-one interview. i m trying to look at beyond the soap opera here and at the facts. it s hard. it is hard. there are key nuggets here. we know what nunberg says he has been asked already. he said investigators when they did have him were asking about the president s businesses. listen to this. the way they asked about his business dealings, the way they asked if you had heard anything, even during while i was fired, it made me suspect that they suspect something about them. now gloria, he may not have very well done anything. you know why? trump may have very well done something during the election
we ve seen that in other cases. so we really don t know how close nunberg is. i think he said in one of the interviews yesterday that he s spoken to the president within the last couple months. we need to keep in mind some of the things he said, we need to take with a grain of salt, maybe some of the information about the meeting with trump tower. he had been far removed mr. the dpan at that point. that said, this is someone who knows the president well. you had one of the great lines, choose your own nun-venture. i like that. if you listen to what nunberg is saying, clearing the smoke aside, he s saying the special counsel was asking about the president s business dealings. here is a guy saying inside this testimony the president had crossed that red line. and that i think is the value of hearing from sam nunberg. as jackie said, he s talked about many things that he certainly doesn t have firsthand knowledge of or would be very unlikely to have firsthand knowledge of. when he say
great to have you with us. thanks very much. new developments from today s episode as the nunberg turns, or is it days of our nunberg. sam nunberg who was subpoenaed by the special counsel to go before the grand jury and wavered dramatically and publicly about whether he would comply on tv now seems like he would cooperate. for now it seems that sam nunberg will testify. when you get behind the psychology and the soap opera elements, there are hard facts. nunberg revealed that the special counsel wants all his communications with the president and nine of the president s closest confidants. he alleged the president may well have colluded with russia during the campaign. the president has not responded but is due to hold a news conference this afternoon with the visiting prime minister of sweden. let s bring you up to speed with sam nunberg. jessica schneider in washington. not only did he waffle over
the president knew about that trump tower meeting. what s also important to put into perspective is sam nunberg was a short-lived campaign adviser, fired in august 2015 for racially charged facebook posts. that was two months after donald trump announced his candidacy, nearly a year before the trump tower meeting in june of 2016. really sam nunberg putting forth a lot of claims in several interviews over the past day, really not providing any evidence to back up those claims. when it does come to the subpoena, a demand that nunberg produce documents, also appearing before a grand jury on friday. it s unclear if nunberg will comply or not. hanging over nunberg s head would be a contempt of court charge if, in fact, he didn t comply. of course, waffling on whether he will or won t. john. jessica schneider in washington. joining me former federal prosecutor laura coates. there is a lot of drama here. this is a soap opera.