We are going to win. Im more excited today than i was two weeks ago. If the election were held today, we win the election. We win the election. But where we have states that are tipping that could go either way, i have an ability to go to those states and rally. Biden has no ability. Election day is exactly two weeks away. And as nbc news correspondent mike memoli noted, trump spent yesterday insisting to his team he can still win, whereas bidens campaign is insisting to supporters they can still lose. Good morning. Welcome to morning joe. It is tuesday, october 20th. So we are two weeks away, and its exciting. And by the way, an exciting announcement on Election Night, were going to be on peacock. Of course, its nbcs morning joe at night. Morning joe at night. The streaming service. Theres some extraordinary things going on at peacock. Well be there from 6 00 in the evening until the race is called. Until whenever. Well have a cast of millions and well be focusing on getting you the results as quickly as possible. And just telling it like it is. Willie, i dont know if we have ever worked together at night. Outside of well, back then, we called it an car a, but turkey. Yeah, youre used to seeing us after the election, walltowall there. Me too. You can watch 30 rock and snl and all of the new shows but well joining the cast of thousands on Election Night. This is such a consequential moment in history that why not just stay at work and stay at it and stay on the air. Yeah. And watch it happen before our eyes. Yeah. So thats going to be a big option for Election Night. So along with joe, willie and me, we have msnbc National Affairs analyst cohost of showtimes the circus and executive editor of the recount, john heilemann. Capitol hill correspondent and host of way too early kasie hunt. She never sleeps. And National Political correspondent for nbc news and msnbc, Steve Kornacki is with us. New Battle Ground states showing a tight race between joe biden and President Trump. And in wisconsin, the latest Reuters Ipsos poll shows biden ahead by eight among likely voters and those who have already cast their votes 5143 . In pennsylvania, the same poll shows biden and President Trump statistically tied among likely voters and those who have already voted. Biden 49 , trump 45 . And in georgia, the latest Emerson College poll shows another statistical tie. Trump 48 . Biden 47 . So john heilemann, what do you see in those polls . We had a new New York Times siena poll this morning showing joe biden up nine nationally. What trends are you looking at . You know, joe, i think it sounds like a broken record here. We talked about this yesterday. What you see here is what you have seen really for months which is, you know, a race of that is demonstrated remarkable stability for months. Sounds like a boring headlines and youre starting to see the inevitability that people have expected for a long time, you and i and mika and willie have discussed for months. As you got into the final days that the race was going to tighten a little bit. I think the one of the biggest outstanding questions is whether donald trump can do in these last couple weeks what he did to his enormous benefit in 2016 which was to bring republicans home. You know, at the end of 2016, the people around trump were very focused on the questions especially right after the comey letter came out, could they get north of 90 of republicans to come and to come back to donald trump . Theres some real questions especially after the access hollywood tape, could he get that kind of loyalty out of standard issue republicans, regular republicans and he spent the last two weeks with a lot of discipline in 2016, you will recall, talking about trade, talking about manufacturing. Talking about immigration. Talking about draining the swamp and the post comey and hillary lock her up stuff. But he needs to do that again and theres lot of discussion about the fact hes currently polling in kind of the mid to high 80s with republicans. Thats a significant problem and can donald trump get republicans to come home and the problem right now his message is nothing like the disciplined economic message that he drove in 2016. Always talking about himself, his grievances and the questions related to his complaints with all of us which is not generally the way that you get regular republicans to find their way back to their party. Right. White house reporters yesterday say at least told me on the tarmac, one of the angriest theyd ever seen donald trump, enraged by articles coming out. Maggie habermans, jonathan lemire, coming out and talking about Staff Members starting to jump ship. So hes enraged now with two weeks to go. One more quick thought about and these polls we saw yesterday, john heilemann. There were some people that were panicking on the left about the fourpoint spread in pennsylvania. Its funny, we have been seeing these eight, nine, ten spread points in wisconsin and michigan. I have yet to talk to a person really deep on the inside in the trump camp or the biden camp that havent believed those are two or three point races and still believe those are two or three point races and believe florida is going to be won by 100,000 votes or less. Correct. All true. I think thats right. I think, you know, the Biden Campaign is very confident in michigan and wisconsin, but they recognize its not going to be an eight or nine point race there and truly that florida always is that florida is going to be a very, very close a race. I think the big difference if you ask both people on both sides six months ago they thought it would be very, very close and trump had the advantage. But now with the collapse of some parts of trumps strength, especially with seniors, the advantage is with biden. The neutral view would be an extremely close race, but a slight advantage to joe biden as we head to election day two weeks from today. And the closing message in the final two weeks youd think trump would be trying to expand, but yesterday he spent the day talking Anthony Fauci calling him a disaster and he went after joe biden saying he should be locked up and if bill barr his attorney general were doing his job or if he were someone else that joe biden would have been locked up. Then here he is talking about the pandemic, something he was trying to wish away for six months. Here is what he said yesterday in arizona. Pandemic. Theyre getting tired of the pandemic, arent they . Getting tired of the pandemic. You turn on cnn, thats all they cover. Covid, covid, theyre trying to talk everybody out of buying it. People arent buying it, cnn, you dumb bastards. You know, joe biden wants to lock it down. He wants to listen to fauci. And it was turned into the ad. Yes, i do want to listen to dr. Fauci and yes people are concerned about the covid pandemic thats killed 221,000 people and reshaped the lives of almost every american. You know why joe biden has decided, hey, im going to go and do debate prep for a couple of days . Because he wants to cede the entire stage to donald trump because either donald trump is providing aid and comfort to terrorists who tried to kill a michigan governor by attacking her and saying, well, i dont know. Shes claiming that. Hes saying extraordinary things there or hes attacking Anthony Fauci. And hell leave if he loses. And hes talking hes enraged about the fact that his attorney general will not arrest his political opponent. So all of these people saying oh, you know, i dont vote for democrats, you know what, im just voting for him because of the regulations. Donald trump in the last two weeks of the campaign is raging at his attorney general for not arresting his political opponent. If youre voting for donald trump, thats who youre voting for. And if youre voting for that man who two weeks from election day is calling for the arrest of his opponent, then you have absolutely no idea what america is about. Let me say it again. You have no idea what this country is about. If youre supporting a man who two weeks out is calling for the arrest of his you cant you cant explain that away. You cant explain that away to history or explain it away to your children or your grandchildren. You just cant. And you cant plead ignorance because you know better. Let me say it one more time. Donald trump the man who said that article 2 gave him power to do whatever he wanted to do, donald trump the same man who constantly undermines the judiciary and the same man who calls the media, the free press, that stalinist slur, enemies of the people. Hes now yelling at his attorney general for not arresting his opponent. Take a listen to this. Every day you wake up, wheres biden today . Sir, hes lidded out. Hes lidded out, what does that mean . That means hell stay in the basement all day. But i think today hes staying in the basement to talk to his lawyers. They caught him cold. They caught him cold. Lock him up lock him up lock him up hes lucky that we have in our country and they dont appreciate a wonderful human being and the most fair attorney general of the United States because i know people that would have had him locked up five weeks ago. Bill barr is a very nice man and a very fair man and they have no idea because somebody else would have taken that thing and all the crap and corruption. Hes been a corrupt politician for a long time, this guy. Your Campaign Strategy seems to be to call biden a criminal. Why is that . Hes a criminal. He is a criminal. He got caught. Read his laptop and youre a criminal for not reporting it. Youre criminal for not reporting it. Let me tell you something, joe biden is a criminal and has been a criminal for a long time and youre a criminal and the media for not reporting it. Good luck, everybody. Have a good time. So lets get this straight. So you have a president , mika, who calls his opponent a criminal and is calling for his arrest and now is actually i know because he called for my arrest several times. Now hes calling for jeff mason calling him a criminal because hes not calling for the arrest. I mean, this this is what is being fought in belarus. This donald trump is a strong man, a weak strong man, but hes trying to be a strong man. Anybody, how anybody can vote for him, i dont care what your ideology is. I dont care what your regulations are. I mean, two weeks out saying that his opponent should be arrested. It is beyond the pale. It is unamerican. Theres no other way to put it. And you make that great point, joe, that you dont understand what this country is about if youre going to vote for him. Especially just listening to that alone. But you also have no clue what this country is going through as he hopscotches across arizona. If you look at arizona headlines, coronavirus cases are going up in arizona. Thank you very much for your super spreaders all across the country. Two weeks out to the election, its literally selfdestructive if one cares about his campaign. But also, spreading this virus making sure it surges in wisconsin where theyre setting up extra hospital space because they literally are at 110 capacity. You have in idea what this country is going through. Yesterday marked the first day of early voting in the Battle Ground state of florida. Voters across the state were up before dawn standing for hours with lines growing into the hundreds before opening. Those in southern counties even waited in heavy, heavy rain and wind to cast their vote. Early voting continues in florida, 12 hours a day through november 1st. So Steve Kornacki, florida is just incredible. I have talked to the smartest person i have known in Florida Politics for 20 years hes always right. I talked to the smartest person that i have known in Democratic Politics in florida for the past 20 years hes always right. The republican says, i think were going to win. But its going to be under 100,000 votes. Out of 18 million cast. The democrat is saying i think were going to win this thing, but its going to within 50,000, 100,000 votes. Again, out of 18 million cast. That would be like well, well below 1 of the vote. Its just so extraordinarily close in florida. And republicans theyre leaning on the fact that they have done an extraordinary job on the ground over the past four years, registering new voters. Democrats are pointing correctly also to the fact that you win with tv ads in the state of florida and its just like b52s. Heavy, heavy bombing across the state and man, even running ads in northwest florida and counties like the counties where no democrat ever run ads. This is going to be a close one through the night these experts think. Well, its really interesting because florida unlike a lot of the other states its so easy to make the argument for either side, just based on the numbers we are getting. You mentioned for instance the new voter registrations and republicans can point to florida and they can point to other states that this is true or if you just look at the last several months leading up to the election. You see an advantage in new voter registrations among republicans. A pretty big one. So thats something for republicans certainly to crow about and then the democrats look at the same numbers and they say well some of that are folks who have been voting republican for a long time particularly in some of the Rural Counties youre talk about who had been inherited democratic registrations and they decided to reregister as republicans so thats not necessarily new votes. And democrats will tell you they think Younger Voters who are registering for first time are more likely to register, you know, basically independent. Not with either party, but to vote democratic. So the democrats say maybe those numbers arent quite as bad for us as they suggest. You hear the argument on both sides or i heard you talking a few minutes about the shift of the Senior Citizens and thats something we are seeing nationally and democrats will crow about that in a state like florida but republicans have that counter in florida and which we also say, by the way, in the 2018 midterm elections in florida and that was stronger performance with hispanic voters particularly in miamidade. Particularly in south florida. Than trump was able to get in 2016. If you look at the map from the 2018 midterms and try to figure out how desantis and scott bucked the National Tide and got statewide victories, look at Miamidade County and look at the improvement especially in areas with large cubanamerican populations relative to 2016 and the polling is suggesting that even as trump perhaps has lost some ground with Senior Citizens in florida he may have compensated with it with hispanic voters. Early in the evening, were going to be looking a lot at Miamidade County. Thats an area where in some parts of miamidade right now, donald trump is overperforming what he did four years ago by 15 Percentage Points. Overperforming 5 Percentage Points based on a lot of polling thats been going on over the past several months. Its also interesting though, there is a give and take. Hispanic voters, traditional catholic hispanic voters are breaking more for donald trump than they did four years ago, but as we have said on this show, White Catholic voters, traditional White Catholic voters are breaking more for joe biden. Obviously, right now, there are more White Catholic voters. So give that slight advantage to joe biden. Seniors are breaking a certain way. Its just there is a give and take, but ive got to say, willie, that just so we can set everybody up to be prepared for Election Night, in the state of florida, theyre going probably going to be 60, 65 of floridians who will have already voted by election day. Right. Joe biden is going to do extraordinarily well or he should do extraordinarily well, gillum for instance, was up 7 Percentage Points in to election day and the republicans caught up. So were going to be in a situation where joe biden if hes fortunate will be up 7, 8, 9 Percentage Points with 60 of the votes already counted and it will be tabulated and we will hear that early in the evening. Then the question is, those 35 , the day of voters, republicans are expecting a huge advantage and they will be spending the rest of the night trying to catch up with bidens margin if he does in fact have the comfortable margin that he needs to keep this race close. Some things never change over the years. Well be watching florida florida again. There will be a big load of mailin votes and other voting or the opposite where youll get the day of voting and some of that mailin voting isnt counted until later. We have to balance that on Election Night. As you look across the map, Steve Kornacki, at wisconsin and michigan and then you move over east to pennsylvania. Thin margins in all three states in 2016. We have heard whispers and private conversations that the Trump Campaign although they havent written them off expects perhaps to lose all three of those. What would that mean . What does he have if those three come off the map for the Trump Campaign what does he have to do to make up for that . Hes done unless he starts to pick up states that hillary won in 2016. He had 306 electoral votes in 2016. If you subtract pennsylvania hes down to 286. If you subtract michigan, down to 270. And if you subtract wisconsin, down to 260. Hes under 270, he loses. So trump has to find a way either to hang on to at least one of those states and i think, you know, theres some reason to think his chances might be a little better in pennsylvania right now, but theres it is certainly debatable. He has find a way to hang on to one of the states thats his most realistic course right here or hes got to start picking off as we say Clinton States. Where could he look in terms of Clinton States . New hampshire is a target but its only four electoral votes. The margin in the state in 2016 was just 3,000 votes for Hillary Clinton. If he can pick it it off, he can pick up four. Give trump new hampshire, now hes at 264. Hes still short. They talk about nevada maybe, the polling is not too encouraging for trump out of nevada. Minnesota, if hes unable to hold on to pennsylvania, michigan and wisconsin, but he flips minnesota, which he lost by a point and a half in 2016 thats hard to see. It looks like trump has to find way too hang on to one of the three midwest states and then probably run the cant also lose florida on top of that. Cant be losing arizona or nebraska. Run the table everywhere else. Add to this, kasie hunt, this was an Interesting Development yesterday. A rule big the Supreme Court will allow mailin ballots to be counted if received within three days of election day in the Battle Ground state of pennsylvania. The move is a loss for republicans who pushed to require that only ballots received by election day be counted. Four justices dissented from the order with chief Justice John Roberts siding with the courts three liberals the high court down to eight members following the death last month of Justice Ruth Bader ginsburg issued no opinions explaining its reasons. Kasie, how does this impact potential for republicans in the state of pennsylvania . And what else are you looking at . Well, theres a lot here, mika. I mean, to take just the pennsylvania question for a second, pennsylvanias one of those states where we expect, you know, most of the we expect democrats to have an advantage on the mailin vote if you just look at the way that people are handling the pandemic. Its much more likely to show up on election day, so this gives another three days of counting. It also potentially i mean f it all comes down to pennsylvania which my sources on both sides of the aisle agree florida is going to be a big one on Election Night and potentially for the weeks after. But pennsylvania potentially the critical Battle Ground for this. So this decision potentially incredibly significant could also stretch out the election for several days or weeks beyond actual election day. The other piece of this thats so interesting is john roberts here. After this decision came down, several Top Republicans were criticizing john roberts who has become sort of this boogie man for them even though he was of course appointed by former president george w. Bush. He sided with liberals in this decision and its a split court currently, but it raises the possibility Amy Coney Barrett is supposed to be voted out of Committee Later on this week and republicans are racing to put her on the bench before election day. President trump has been pretty transparent about why he wants that to happen because that could potentially swing the balance when, you know, further decisions like this may end up reaching the Supreme Court if in fact the Electoral College state of play is not clear coming out of Election Night. How revealing that republicans and socalled conservatives are attacking john roberts for allowing all votes to be counted in the age of covid. If that is your position, you are actually no conservative. Youre trying to get people to go out and vote and, you know, youre trying to stop as many people as you can from having their votes counted in pennsylvania. And youre exposed. So good luck with that in the future. John roberts isnt going along with your game. So john heilemann, a new poll out, Washington Post abc news poll in the state of North Carolina, another barn burner. This one statistically tied. Biden up by 1 percentage point. This is a strange set. Theres some states that you just everybody gets wrong. I dont know how this is going to turn out. But i will tell you that, you know, i saw this story yesterday that said trump people are getting discouraged and about to write off North Carolina thats wildly overstated. That race is still close. But its interesting talking to the biden people over the past two weeks, you could go hows wisconsin . How is michigan . How is pennsylvania . Oh, you know, theyre very, very cautious. You go through all of the states where they should be comfortable. Theyre really cautious. What about North Carolina . Were doing pretty well there. Were doing a lot better there than we expected. Judging by the reaction of the two campaigns, biden is overperforming at least based on trump and bidens campaigns viewpoint. Really overperforming right now in North Carolina, despite the fact that that state looks like a tie. Yeah. I agree with that, joe, i would say over the over in the pandemic period, you know, as you break up those the six Battle Ground states we spent some time talking about. The wisconsin and pennsylvania and florida, the florida and North Carolina of the six have always been the two that the Trump Campaign felt like they were the strongest position in and the Biden Campaign felt they were in the weakest position again. Again, its all margin of stuff at this point. North carolina has been margin of error with biden ahead and most of the private polling for that period, but you are right. There is a body language thing happening and i agree with you in both sides. In the last two or three weeks where inside the campaigns, even though the numbers havent changed that much, theres been a sense that somehow that the Biden Campaign was maybe in a slightly stronger position. And some weird way, the fact that Cal Cunningham who had all kinds of problems in his personal life in the senate race and continues to hold a larger lead than biden does in the public polling somehow that that hes overcome those problems or at least so far seems to not be taking on water because of some problems in his personal life. Its not been a great month for cunningham and yet his lead in North Carolina continues to hold up. I think in some weird way, im not saying theres a cause and effect thing, but the fact that cunningham has maintained that strength has buoyed the democrats in the race. Thats a ridiculous thing to say on some levels but i feel like its part of the psychology there thats making some democrats and those around joe biden feel like they might be in a stronger position in North Carolina than they thought they were and that they expected to be. Okay. You mentioned North Carolina. At this point, Steve Kornacki, what is North Carolina looking like to you . Yeah, you know, you put the new poll up on the screen and thats par for the course here. I think the thing to keep in mind in North Carolina as we talk about florida and i think the story of Election Night itself in terms of getting the best read sort of on a state, you know, may well come out of florida just in term of the their ability to get all or most of their vote reported out on Election Night. So i think florida is going to give us a really good look at where things might be going. But the other one to keep in mind on that front or another one to keep in mind is North Carolina. Again, the world is sort of full of surprises these days so we can get to Election Night and find out the count is complicated by a factor were not talking about right now, but i think North Carolina has the potential they wont get all of them reported out. They cant maybe cant get quite as far in florida because the ballots can come in for a few days after, but we may get in a timely fashion a great deal of the vote from North Carolina in the hours, those 8 00, 9 00, hours and florida can give us a sense of whats coming i think North Carolina can as well. Wow, Steve Kornacki, thank you very much. Still ahead on morning joe the latest ad from the Lincoln Project comes with a new republican endorsement for joe biden. Well reveal that next. As we go to break, a note that joes new book, saving freedom truman, the cold war, and the fight for western civilization is coming out on november 24th. You can preorder now. Morning joe is back in just a moment. 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Joe bidens plans will help working families immediately by making the super rich finally pay their fair share. For joe, its never been about ego. Its always been about the work he can do for working families. Its what hes always done. Joe biden brings everyone to the table and gets it done. Im joe biden, and i approve this message. Beautiful. But when i started cobra kai, the lack of control over my business made me a little intense. But now i practice a different philosophy. Quickbooks helps me get paid, manage cash flow, and run payroll. And now im back on top. With koala kai. Hey more mercy. Save over 30 hours a month with intuit quickbooks. The easy way to a happier business. Expectand action. 16 people died did he catch our bad guy . Were know as the charmed ones. You got one day to show me what you got. I want to fight. You need us harry. What a goal bockey ball, hockey ball, you name it ball. Im gonna be ready. Just say show me peacock into your xfinity voice remote or download the app today. Imagine that night, tensions high. A nation torn apart. A plot here in Baltimore City to assassinate a newly elected president on his way to inauguration. And to plunge the country into chaos. Abraham lincoln disembarked at this train station and made his way unscathed and on the greatness. In the days ahead, we may face a crisis of similar proportion, an outlaw president defying the will of the people. For four years, many have said there will come a moment. Well, this is the moment. Because this ballot is like none over cast. Im a life long republican and im still a republican, but this ballot is how we restore the soul of the nation. Electing a good man, joe biden and Kamala Harris and ensuring an orderly transfer of power or plunge our country into chaos. America or america trump. I choose america. The Lincoln Project is responsible for the content of this advertising. Wow. That was former rnc chair Michael Steele endorsing joe biden for president and the Senior Adviser to the Lincoln Project joins us now. Michael steele, great to have you on the show. But on this day with that endorsement, tell us a little bit about your decision. It doesnt seem like it was a very tough one. Well, you know, actually, mika, thank you very much for having me on this morning and thanks for showing the ad, both you and joe for doing that actually, it was a tough decision because, you know, at the core, there are a lot of fundamental things. You know, you have heard joe talk about, you know, that small c conservatism that has grounded both of us, for example, in our political life and how we have tried to lead when we have been given that opportunity to lead. So it was a very hard decision. You dont wake up and go, okay, ill just do this. But what struck me was something that occurred and actually it was kind of a moment of paying it forward. When i ran for the u. S. Senate in 2006, four or five democrats here in my county, prince georges county, maryland, stood up. They were, you know, currently elected government officials, you know, county council democrats, stood up and endorsed my for the United States senate. And i remembered speaking with one of them who was fundamentally opposed to me on the life issue. Shes very, very strong pro choice activist. But what brought her around to finally saying yes was it wasnt about leadership. It was excuse me, it wasnt about politics but about leadership. It was about leadership. She placed that trust in me. She took the Political Risk in the moment because she saw something bigger than her particular interest in an issue. She saw something more important for the county and for the state of maryland and so as i reflected on that, i remembered what dr. King said that, you know, youll come to the moments where, you know, life begins to end if you dont step into those things that matter. If you dont take hold of those things that matter. If you dont, you know, trust those things that matter. And this matters. My country matters to me. And so for that reason i said, look, im looking at these two men. I have known them both. I have a chance to spend time working with trump in the past, but this isnt leadership. This is a failed moment and the country needs to do better than this because the country can do better than this. For all of my policy differences with joe biden i told him, look, i look forward to beating you up on some of things you want to put out there, but i want to have that fight over the health care and the environment and thing like that. I dont want to have a fight over being an american. The president of the United States standing in front of fellow americans talking about arresting and throwing in prison his political opponents. The president of the United States telling the American People that, you know, the sickness that theyre going through, the deaths that they have experienced, you know, it is what it is. Thats not who we are. So for me, this election you guys know i have been on the air and i have said this time and time again, this election is about us as americans. This election is about us. The person we put in that office in the oval Office Behind the resolute desk is an extension of us. They reflect the good, the bad, the ups and downs of us. And at the end of the day, we come to rely on them to do the right thing and so, you know, that moved me to this moment. Joe biden is the guy right now for me. Along with a lot of other republicans who are saying the same thing. That can make the make this moment matter. Make america matter more than it has so far. As you say, President Trump, the closing message two weeks out hes calling for his opponent to be locked up, to be put into prison. He did it four years ago with Hillary Clinton. Just because he does it a lot doesnt mean we should lose our capacity to be shocked and outraged but there are people who say, oh, thats just him being him, you have to ignore some of that stuff. So what would you say to a republican who is sitting here saying i voted republican my entire life. I just dont know, i dont love trump. We know these people. I dont love the rhetoric. I dont love the tweets but i cant find my way to voting for a democrat, i have been a republican my whole life. What do you say to those people . Well, look, its a hard river to cross. Its tough for sure, particularly if you have been in that environment that thats what you have done. But you stop and ask yourself, well, what is it that matters . How do you explain to your children, yeah, we have a great 401 k , but, you know, just ignore all of the behavior. We dont raise our kids that way. We do make the choices. We make the very hard choices in our families. I said to a friend of mine who was, you know, giving me some grief about it. I said, well, look, you have a kid who has straight as and youre very proud of that. They bring home the grades every day. I said, but when the neighbors knock on your door and complain about the behavior of your child, you discount that . When the teachers come to the can you come in for the parent teachers meetings, hes got straight as but hes a bully on the playground. No, you take into account the concern because the quality and character of your child matters and we have always we have always looked at our president s that way. Thats why we hold them up to our children as examples, you know . Not we dont say to our kid, you know, they gave us a great tax cut. You too one day can give us a great tax cut. No, we talk to them about the quality of the person they are. Thats how that matters. These things still matter. We have to get out of this space that with this idea that the only thing thats important is whether or not i get mine. America is not about that. We have always been about that shared experience. And the president has been at the touch that particular sphere. So its hard, i know its hard for a lot of republicans, but it says something, willie, that so many republicans have come out and said something. They have said something, so many republicans have taken a stance. You cant throw that away, so there must be something more to it than, you know, a mark ross acoe or colin powell or Jennifer Horne or other republicans saying, i cant do this. This is not who we are. It matters, folks, who we are as a nation. Not just to the world. But most especially to ourselves and each other. John heilemann . Hey, michael hey, boss. I want to stay on the point how are you doing, man . I want to stay on the point youre making and a point you made in the answer to the first question too, which is this notion of a lot of republicans like you. Im curious, this question to me is quite central to how this election plays out in the last couple of weeks. Donald trump i said in 2016, part of the way he won was getting republican regulars to come home. Even though he alienated a lot of with the access hollywood and he was very disciplined and had a lot of republicans who had been nervous about him, decided to come back to the party and roll the dice with trump. Obviously, we have four years of information now about trump and we have seen the defections from the party. Its been problematic for the party in the midterm elections and other elections we have seen over the last four years. Because of i know you look at a lot of data and i know at lincoln and other places youre down in the weeds where you should be right now. Do you have a sense of whether where trump is going to end up with republicans . Is he doing to be still in the 90s where he needs to be or are we now as we sit here today, is there some prospect that trump on election day when all of the votes are tallied that trump is in the high or mid 80s because it seems to me thats the number thats where you end up, its one of many potential back breaking things for trump that you cant win the presidency if youre donald trump if youre anywhere below 90 with republicans. That is you know, john, an important point. At the end of the day, i think youre starting you have seen that bleeding, if you will. And its not complicated. Its not complicated. You know, a lot of these families have been hit hard by covid19. They have been hit hard by the flat lining of the economy. And they have also been hit and touched by the civil rights moment of this time, where all of these things have now come together and you realize that its not just about the label of being a republican. And its about the kind of leader who moves you through these moments. So when you say come back home to the Republican Party and come back home to donald trump, come back home to what . Come back home to a mishandling of covid19, come back home to, you know, putting children in cages. Come back home to shole countries. What are you coming back home to . What are you resting your laurels on . What are you patting him on the back for . Youve got a great 401 k but thats been hit and if youre lucky enough to have it recover, okay, now youre spending your money to pay for your health care because you have covid19 or paying for the funeral expenses of a Family Member who died from covid19. There are these reminders of what this leadership has wrought every day. What are you coming back home to . I mean, a Supreme Court nomination look, youve got republicans now ticked off at the chief justice because hes doing jurisprudence, hes not doing politics. So what are you coming back home to . You certainly arent coming home to what made me a republican in the first place. Exactly. We have talked about this for years now, trying to balance the budget, at least trying to have a small government. Of course there are a lot of things that the federal government had to do, but you do your best. You try not to have pork barrel projects, not try to reward military contractor just because they give you contributions. You try not to have the bloated a budget as donald trump has had. Hes failed every step of the way. Hes failed as far as being a conservative. Hes being a small c conservative or large c conservative. What are you coming home . Youre coming home to the strong man who wants his opponent arrested two weeks out . Yeah, i dont think edmond burke, william f. Buckley, russell kirk, ronald reagan, would call that conservative. You know why . Because its not. And Michael Steele, stay with us for this conversation because you mentioned the coronavirus which is surging to levels we havent seen since july. With cases rising in at least 41 of 50 states, and more and more hospitals once again under siege. Nbc news correspondent Gabe Gutierrez has the latest from milwaukee, wisconsin, a growing hot spot. Reporter the parking lot of a Major League Ballpark transformed into wisconsins newest drivethrough testing site. The cars started to line up more than an hour before this testing site opened. On friday, wisconsin saw a Record Number of new covid cases. More than 3,800. What are your symptoms . I have had a pesky cough since saturday. Fatigue. Reporter we spoke with teacher Stacy Isakson from a distance. We want to get back to work and have life as normal as possible. And specifically as an educator, we want our kids to be in the classroom learning and not be subject to long delays and gaps in the learning. Reporter hospitalizations in wisconsin have tripled over the last month. About 85 of the states beds are full. You know, this aint no joke. Just look at the number. Reporter covid hospitalizations are at the peak in at least 16 states including north dakota and new mexico where they have spiked more than 100 in two weeks. Health care workers have noticed a dramatic difference. They are significantly more sick than at the beginning of the pandemic. Reporter in kansas, brian elias is still sick and dropped 20 pounds. Somewhere down the line, i may have let my guard down because i got comfortable. You know, you wake up one day, like, oh, my god, i cant taste. Reporter and damage from covid can be long term. Carmen was diagnosed in july and spent 45 days in the icu. Blisters from the ventilator are healing. Its like gasping for air. Reporter but doctors now say the virus severely damaged her lungs and the 52yearold needs a double lung transplant. Its challenging, however, im fighting hard every day. Reporter that fight continues with no end in sight. Gabe gutierrez, nbc news, milwaukee. Lets bring in physician and fellow at the brookings institution, dr. Patel. Shes a former Obama White House Health Director and an msnbc medical contributor. Some think this is being overblown. Give us the reality. Are there some states surging back again to the proportions that we have seen in the past and where do states like wisconsin stand setting up Field Hospitals . Yes, hi, and good morning, everyone. It is absolutely the state of affairs today that Hospital Capacity is surging. Places like wisconsin, mika, which had the Army Hospital built months ago and didnt need to use it and is a reflection and a fact that this is a rolling wave of cases across the country. And candidly, mika, i saw a case of someone who actually did not have covid but could get into the hospital because the emergency room was so full with suspected cases of covid and the capacity in the icu was completely full. So this is affecting all americans with access to health care and then as the kind of statements you have heard were still seeing cases months later concerning cardiac symptoms and just other effects from covid where were struggling to understand do they need to go back to the hospital just for management of the effects of covid long term. Dr. Patel, willie, good to see you this morning. I wanted ill keep you out of the politics as we always do, but President Trump again was talking dr. Anthony fauci. He said people are sick of this pandemic. He says, you know, time for dr. Fauci to kind of lay low for a little bit. What is the impact of that downward pressure from the white house . As you look at polling of people who say its not as bad as i thought it was, maybe its not as bad as the scientists are saying it is. Maybe i wont get that vaccine because i dont trust the doctors and science anymore. From your point of view, from a Public Health perspective what does that all mean . Willie, its a great question because its affect all of us downstream. We are seeing people who are saying, you know, this really isnt as bad this is the media hyping this up, and i dont want to get a vaccine, what do you think . And at least theyre having the conversation so that we can try to course correct it but the damage its doing is widespread. And by the way, its coming in all forms. You are seeing people who really feel indignant about wearing a mask. They feel like the science is not supportive of and i have never seen a questioning of basic facts. It has nothing to do with politics but people are as we go into the holiday season, theyre saying, you know, its no problem. We can get together with our families. Nobody i know is sick and if they are, theyre young. Theyre healthy. Theyll get over it. So youre seeing what what i have seen the president s words result in is a different virus pandemic. Its a virus of misinformation and a virus against science and i didnt think i would ever see that in my lifetime. Dr. Patel, thank you so much for being on this morning. Still ahead, there are some changes in store for this weeks president ial debate. After the first faceoff between joe biden and trump featured frequent interruptions. Well tell you whats in store. Well be joined by president obamas former Campaign Manager, jim mussina and Claire Mccaskill will join the conversation. Morning joe will be right back. Conversation morning joe will be right back limu emu and doug. And if we win, we get to tell you how Liberty Mutual customizes Car Insurance so you only pay for what you need. Isnt that what you just did . Service stand back, im gonna show ya how doug and limu roll, ya you know you got to live it if you wanna wi. [ music stops ] time out only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Still a father. But now a friend. Still an electric car. Just more electrifying. Still a night out. But everything fits in. Still hard work. Just a little easier. Still a legend. Just more legendary. Chevrolet. Making lifes journey, just better. With priceline, you can get up to 60 off amazing hotels. And when you get a big deal. You feel like a big deal. Priceline. Every trip is a big deal. What we have is incredible. We have the f35 fighter jet the best in the world, tankers, new tankers, new freighters. 2. 5 trillion all made in the usa. We are the envy of russia and china. Nobody has the equipment. Even the hydrasonic missiles that obama messed up on. They go seven times faster than a normal missile. We have the best hydrosonic in the world. We think he meant hyper sonic. Perhaps, willie, maybe he was talking about the hydrosonic because this technology let me tell you something, my friends. Chinese, really, i dont think they have hydrosonic toothbrushes like we do. Sure, they can try to steal the patent from hydrosonic, but only one hydrosonic toothbrush. And when you feel it in your hands, the quality, it shows on your teeth. Not cheap as we showed there. But it get into the hard to reach places if you have plaque and tartar built up. So hes right to tout our technology in the era of hydrosonic toothbrushes. Usa, baby. Thats what you call american exceptionalism. Oh, yeah. We are exceptional. Welcome back to morning joe. It is tuesday, october 20th. Former rnc chair Michael Steele is still with us. And joining the conversation, we have msnbc contributor mike barnicle. He uses the hydrosonic. Former u. S. Senator and now msnbc political analyst, Claire Mccaskill. Ceo of the messina group, jim messina. He ran obamas 2012 reelection campaign. The more you talked about that, i dont feel safe. He doesnt like its taken you this long . No. Taken you this long . Doesnt know anything. Jim messina, help us out, man. We go through the polls. You know, its interesting, the upper midwest polls that have shown joe biden with a bigger lead. You talked to the biden camp. And they dont think the leads are that big. I people, youve got eight points in wisconsin. I dont know a Single Person on the Biden Campaign or the Trump Campaign that thinks thats going to be an eightpoint race. They think it might be four, five. You go over to pennsylvania, a lot of people on the left panicking yesterday afternoon when the pennsylvania Reuters Ipsos race came out. And then joe biden is up by one point in North Carolina. A virtual tie obviously. Yet, you talk to both campaigns, again from what were hearing behind the scenes both camps are feeling like thats leaning joe bidens way. Help us through this. You have been through it before. What numbers are you looking at that are guiding you two weeks out from this election . Well, a couple. The first number is 32 Million People have already voted. That number at this time four years ago is only 5 Million People. So its not just polls anymore, joe. We actually see real numbers every morning. Both campaigns are running it through the voter files to look and see whos voting and right now you see democrats voting at a much bigger level than republicans. Now, republicans are going to say, look, theyre just cannibalizing their own vote but thats not necessarily true. If you look at numbers and actually see whos voting you see a coalition of voters who really need the women africanamerican women who are the base of the Democratic Party voting in historic numbers. Democrats having a 450,000 early vote lead in your home state of florida. But going to your question about the polls, for me, it always goes back to the midwest. If youre in both campaigns you have to win the blue wall. Trump won by 77,744 votes in three states combined. Wisconsin, michigan and pennsylvania. And, you know, you and i can agree this thing is going to tighten. You know, i promise you pennsylvania is going to be a three or a four point state. Probably two point states its over and if you see these numbers that you have to win, if joe biden wins pennsylvania theres a 94 chance hes the president of the United States. And the fact that Neither Campaign is really talking about michigan right now because michigan feels over. So youre starting to see real problems for trump in states he just has to win. We can go to other states that are fun to win. North carolina, arizona, talk about georgia. But the midwest and florida is where its got to happen for both campaigns. Yeah. And willie, you look, again, at the early votes. I have talked to some supervisors of elections across florida who have told me that theyre seeing a lot of voters who havent come out to vote since 2008. And theyre in the demographic bloc that jim was talking about. So again, this is a race thats going to be too close to call for quite some time. But the one thing that the biden people though theyre extraordinarily cautious will say is that the one thing that joe bidens achieving that Hillary Clinton is not, that in the fact in many of the polls hes over 50 , 51 . While hillary and trump were at 44 , 45 , 46 . So biden has crossed the 50 threshold with in a lot of states. Thats providing at least a bit of comfort to the biden team. Yeah, his lead objectively is larger than Hillary Clintons was in the public polling from four years ago and has been more durable over six months. Been about the same race, so Claire Mccaskill as somebody who has fought hard fights in elections, you know not to get too high when it looks good and not too low when it looks bad. How are you looking at this race . Where do you think the race is . If you look at the polling and try to find whats different and whats the same as 2016 theres a lot of guideposts. What is the same, there is some separation in the polling in pennsylvania and michigan and wisconsin but there was in 2016 also. Hillary clinton went on to lose those states. The number that i have zeroed in on is in fact joe bidens favorability. It is ten points higher than Hillary Clintons was and thats important for the hold the nose voters. By the time the campaign is over, theyre kind of sick of everybody. Those voters are really important in close states. Those votes have a higher opinion, a higher favorability and everything that trump has thrown at him is not working and hes an honest and a nice guy. And trumps closing strategy is turning the page on the pandemic and also talking dr. Anthony fauci. Pandemic. Theyre getting tired of the pandemic, arent they . Getting tired of the pandemic. You turn on cnn thats all they cover. Covid, covid, pandemic. You know why . Theyre trying to talk everybody out of voting. People arent buying it, cnn, you dumb bastards. Theyre not buying it. Thats all they talk about. You know, biden wants to lock it down. He wants to listen to dr. Fauci. People are tired of hearing fauci and all of these idiots, these people, these people that have gotten it wrong. Fauci is a nice guy. Hes been here for 500 years. Every time he goes on television, theres always a bomb. But a bigger bomb if you fire him. But fauci is a disaster. Its like in the godfather, nothing personal, strictly business, you know . I just want to do my job and take care of the people of this country. Thats all i want to do. I mean, mike barnicle, take it from here. I dont even know how to characterize this. Im not sure what the strategy is politically, but its downright sick to attack the man whos putting out advice for the country as a doctor, as a scientist, as a person with decades of experience in dealing with pandemics. Whos trying to save lives, who is putting out simple, critical, Vital Information to the American People that can help keep them their families safe from dying and the president is doing this. You know, its kind of a unique Closing Argument for a president ial candidate, mika. Wed have to admit that. Going after Anthony Fauci, claiming on the stump campaigning yesterday that people are tired of the pandemic, there are 220,000 americans who are dead today. Dead. And its not because people are tired of the pandemic. People are tired of the incompetence that the pandemic has been met with and the incompetence stems from Donald Trumps handling of the virus. So thats what i think thats whats on peoples minds, that children arent going to school the way theyre supposed to be going to school so were going to lose a whole generation of kids. Theyre going to be missing the formative years of an education. Third, fourth, fifth, seventh grade, freshmen, sophomore in high school theyre not in class. Incompetence is also given when you figure out the amount of personal Protection Equipment that is still kind of scarce in some places. As the wave continues to grow right now. Its growing right now in massachusetts where i am this morning. Its growing in 30 other states around the country, so people are not tired of the pandemic. Theyre tired of the incompetence this is met with and the president of the United States, his name is donald j. Trump and his name is on the ballot and jim messina was talking about the big blue wall in the midwest and thats clearly important. But something is going on when the president of the United States, hes now looking at numbers the same numbers that the biden camp is seeing in ohio where working class white males are seemingly some of them, increasingly so, are veering towards joe biden. Working class white males in ohio. Guess what . A lot of them arent working at at all because of donald j. Trump. Even more shocking than what we heard about Anthony Fauci who has fulltime protection from federal agents because of threats to his life and his family, is because donald trump two weeks from election day wants to see his political opponent, former Vice President joe biden, locked up. Put in prison, calling him a criminal yesterday. Every day you wake up. Wheres biden today . Sir, hes lidded out. Hes lidded out, what does that mean . That means hes going to stay in the basement all day but i think today hes staying in the basement to talk to his lawyers. They caught him cold. They caught him cold. Lock him up lock him up lock him up hes lucky that we have in our country and they dont appreciate a wonderful human being and the most fair attorney general of the United States because i know people that would have had him locked up five weeks ago. Bill barr is a very nice man and a very fair man and they have no idea because somebody else would have taken that thing and all of the crap and corruption. Hes been a corrupt politician for a long time this guy. As i said to Michael Steele just because the president has been saying things like this for five years now, he started with lock her up with Hillary Clinton and now moving to joe biden we shouldnt lose our capacity to be shocked. That hes using an article that was cooked up by Rudy Giuliani and placed into the newspaper where many of the reporters protested the fact that it was in the paper and it was passed on by fox news because it was so sketchy, he is using that as a reason that his opponent, joe biden, should be put in prison. Yeah. Two weeks to go in a campaign, the candidate typically sits down with his trusted advisers and says what do i need to do . I know i have to lift people up and whats the bloc of voters that im struggling and i need to reach out . Well, with this guy its women. And him having first of all, having the super spreader rallies, thats exhibit a for a lot of women and how reckless and frankly the rank disregard for human safety. Secondly, he attacks trusted doctors and then goes after the candidates child and then on top of that, lock them up. Women are going what are you talking about, you idiot . You know, this is crazy. This is america. We dont do this. So hes actually going out of his way to lose even more of the voters that he needs to pull back into his coalition that have abandoned him because of his behavior. Yeah. And the president seemed to mock Nbcs Kelly Odonnell yesterday when she asked him to authorize the release of information on whether he took a covid test before the last debate. Take a listen. Will you authorize your doctors to tell when you tested negative last is that so important to you . Its so important to you, why is it so important to you . Because we want to know long its been. Why . We want to know if you followed the rules. Look at the dedication. Yeah, my doctors have already given it. You know my doctors have given more information than has been given on any human being in the history of the world. You know, Michael Steele, its i guess its not surprising that he would behave that way. The president said he would be tested before the debate on thursday, though he claims hes covid free and immune. But the question still remains did he go to that first debate knowing he was positive with covid . Nobody knows the answer to that just another way this white house doesnt care about transparency but even more so doesnt seem to care about the health and wellness of others. Well, thats the central part of this. You know, i looked at it and said, well, what have you got to hide . Your doctors have not provided information and in many cases the information they have provided is not necessarily been correct or honest. Fully honest information. The fact that he did not understand well, he did understand what Kelly Odonnell was asking him because he knows its a trigger point and if he answers that honestly theres a problem and it goes to what claire was talking about for a lot of moms and grandmothers out there, you know, who care for the ill, who have taken care of their children, who dont want them exposed here you have this guy not being honest. So that plays into the overall narrative around health, about how he how hes handled this virus. Something that hes not been able to get away from and wont be able to get away from it because its stuck in the craw of so Many Americans right now. The management of covid19. And thats what this election is going to turn on. Its not going to turn on a tax policy or a Supreme Court appointment. Its going to turn on my health and the safety of my family and my community and all of the ancillary impacts of that. Trump knows that. So hes not going to be honest and forthright about that. And the distraction is, hey, lets lock him up, throw people in jail. Lets have a conversation about something other than the fact that i have mismanaged the major pandemic that has hit this country in over a century. Jim messina, so Donald Trumps Closing Arguments are, one, throw my political opponent in jail. My political opponent should be in jail, and two, ignore a pandemic that is now sweeping across america. Thats killed twice as many people than died in combat in world war i. And about four times as many people who died in combat in vietnam over 20 years. And the u. S. Soldiers. I dont know. Those dont seem to be 9010 issues for the president. In fact, he continues to seem to drill down to his 35 to 40 . Does this not at the end of the day show up in the final Election Results . Does this not all of this nonsense that hes been spewing for a year now, does that not drive republican suburban voters into the arms of the Democratic Party . Oh, joe, absolutely. Thats what youre seeing. And what were what word didnt you say when you talked about how hes ending the campaign you didnt say the word economy. You didnt say the economic [ indiscernible ]. You look at this look at the for the first time in a while donald trump is now trailing of on the economy. If i was his Campaign Manager and thank god im not, but if i was id say to him, look, we have two weeks here. Dont say any word that doesnt start with the economy. Dont talk about this other stuff. Dont talk about covid. Dont talk about, you know, these crazy conspiracy theories. But instead, he goes on and talks Anthony Fauci who has a 20point advantage in Approval Rating over him and claire has it exactly right. How he is going to come back . He has to look at the women voters and start to seem normal. He is trailing women voters by 23 points. Thats not a gender gap, joe. Thats a gender canyon. And the only way hell do it is the way he did it four years ago, the last week of the campaign. He seemed less crazy and more nicer and he talked about the economy over and over again. But instead, he steers right into joe bidens sweet spot of the coronavirus when he goes after Anthony Fauci and he has no semblance of any message to swing voters about what hell do for the next four years. Jim messina and Michael Steele, thank you for being on this morning. Two weeks to go. Still ahead on morning joe and michael, what a wonderful commercial. Yeah. Thank you. So moving. Yeah. Thanks, i appreciate it. Thank you both. Washington posts Eugene Robinson has his pointed new piece, entitled trump isnt trying to slow the virus spread. Plus in 2016 Hillary Clinton lost the state of michigan by about 10,000 votes. Could the same thing happen to joe biden next month . Detroit native ron fournier joins us with his take on that. Joins us with his take on that im kalvin, and theres more to me than hiv. Im a peer educator,. A fitness buff,. And a champion for my own health. I talked with my doctor. And switched to. Fewer medicines with. Dovato. Prescription dovato is for some adults who are starting hiv1 treatment or replacing their current hiv1 regimen. With. Just 2 medicines. In 1 pill, dovato is as effective as a 3drug regimen to help you reach and stay undetectable. Research shows people who take hiv treatment as prescribed. And get to and stay undetectable. Can no longer transmit hiv through sex. Dont take dovato if youre allergic to any of its ingredients. Or if you take dofetilide. Hepatitis b can become harder to treat while taking dovato. Do not stop dovato without talking to your doctor,. As your hepatitis b may worsen or become lifethreatening. Serious or lifethreatening side effects can occur, including allergic reactions,. Lactic acid build up, and liver problems. If you have a rash and other symptoms of an allergic reaction,. Stop taking dovato and get medical help right away. Tell your doctor if you have kidney or liver problems, including hepatitis b or c,. Or if you are, may be, or plan to be pregnant. Your doctor may prescribe a different medicine. Than dovato if you plan to be pregnant or if pregnancy is confirmed during the first trimester. Dovato may harm your unborn baby. Use effective Birth Control while taking dovato. Most common side effects are headache, nausea, diarrhea, trouble sleeping,. Tiredness, and anxiety. So much goes into who i am. Hiv medicine is one part of it. Ask your doctor about dovatoi did. Trump took a good economy and drove it back into the ditch through his failure to get covid under control, his failure to deliver real relief to working people. Does he not understand and see the tens of millions of people whove had to file for unemployment this year, so far . The people who lost wages while the cost of groceries has gone up dramatically. Donald trump has been almost singularly focused on the stock market, the dow, the nasdaq not you, not your families. My plan will help create at least five million new, goodpaying jobs and create them right here in the United States of america. Lets use this opportunity to take bold investments in american industry and innovation. So the future is made in america. Ill be laser focused on working families. Im joe biden, and i approve this message. And former columnist, ron fournier. In detroit. Why cant he still write, i dont get it. Former . So wait, we can talk about important things here for a second. Right. So lets get to the important things first. Claire mccaskill, so oh, boy. As john kennedy all free people are citizens of tampa and of course tampa put away the astros and the yankees. Pretty extraordinary. Can they do the same to the dodgers . I dont know. I mean, this is going to be a good series. When was the last time barnicle may know this, we had the two teams with the best records in their leagues going head to head in the world series. You know, kershaw is unbelievable. Hes on the mound tonight. I think it will be a great series. You know, i have been focused on tampa for a different reason and that is that is where the super bowl is next year and im hoping our chiefs are back again. Yeah. Willie, you know, you and i have good reason to resent the rays, theyre in our division. We have a bunch of kids, they get off the train with nothing but a suitcase and a bag of dreams. Yeah. Yeah. The rays are spending all that money. We cant the red sox and yankees cant keep up with these guys. Like theyre like you know, its a scene out of the natural. Theyre the guys there up with the monocle and all of the just doesnt seem fair. Yet, here they are, playing the dodgers. And they play in the beautiful cathedral in tampa st. Pete. This is going to be a good series. These are by record the two best teams in baseball. Mike barnicle, kershaw gets the ball tonight. He and mookie betts the former red sox right fielder and now with the dodgers sorry, its a fact. I dont want to open that wound but its true. Yes. Their combined salary, its in the ballpark of the Tampa Bay Rays entire team payroll. So the rays have done something extraordinary, perhaps made a new model for baseball and you find yourself in the world series. Yeah. Well, its not for the first time for tampa bay to do this. I mean, they have done it consistently for about ten years and they have changed baseball in a sense because more and more teams are looking at exploding payrolls that they arent cant afford. Longterm contracts they try to get out of after four or five years and the rays are just the opposite. They have a group of Young Players and some playing for the major League Minimum and in the world series. Theyre in the world series a few years ago, so it will be a good series, i think agree with claire and with you, its tragic to see mookie betts in a dodgers uniform. He looks great in a dodgers uniform, but i will live with that for a long time. I would think on the whole, the series will go to the dodgers for one reason above all others. The dodgers can really hit. The rays offensively sometimes are challenged. But well see. Short series, world series, best of seven games. Well find out. Ron fournier, your tigers did about as well as my red sox this year. But youve got you look at the rays and you see how they played. What an inspiration. Its a team that can take out the yankees a team that im beholden to. I think it will be a very good series. And Gene Robinson, last year, washington did carried it all. What are you thinking this year . Who do you like . Well, you know, we are still the reigning world series champion, although obviously not for long as we didnt do that great this year. I you know, i think the rays i just dont know. They have got really good relief pitching thats deep. They got rested pitching. Im kind of thinking the rays could take this. I know the dodgers are favored almost 21 but i think the plucky rays and willie is right about that, that great cathedral in tampa bay, the trop. The trop. Okay. Hallowed hall. The memories the memories that willie and i have, our fathers taking us to the trop. This has gone on way too long. You guys used to go to the cigar concession, right . Right. You had a couple of cigars and then, you know in the seventh inning. They called it the seventh inning smoke. Seventh inning smoke and willies father was good friends with jackie gleason. They spent winters in miami beach. And so, yeah, it was a wonderful time at the trop. Lets talk to ron fournier about something almost as serious, and thats the president ial election. In my home state of florida, the experts the smartest of the smart people say we cant tell you whos going to win. This one is going to be extraordinarily close. They have been looking at data for a year now. And they think its going to be within 100,000 votes which most races in florida it seems end up. Look at 2018, if you look at of course 2000. What about michigan . You have been sounding warnings for some time when they show donald trump behind 10 or 11 points, you say trump can win in michigan. Do you still feel that way two weeks out . I do. Ive got to say though, joe, i feel better than i did in 2016 when i was warning you and others that trump would win the state. Debbie dingell and i were the only ones who could see that coming. This cycle is different. This cycle, joe biden is not taking the state for granted like Hillary Clinton did. This cycle, joe biden is spending the political Season Running down [ indiscernible ]. This cycle joe biden is not [ indiscernible ]. Hes running against the president. [ indiscernible ]. The deaths of a quarter of a million americans and hes running in a state of a governor who is very popular and trumps mismanagement is on the plat. Now Gene Robinson, jumping to your opinion piece that trump is not trying to stop the covid as we see it surging in places like wisconsin and michigan struggling too. A lot of states having resurgence of this virus. Why wouldnt he want people to get better and stop dying . I mean, i have to agree with you, it appears hes doing nothing to stop the virus spread and in fact it seems like hes making matters worse. He is. And i mean, just think about that for a second. It is extraordinary, the president of the United States as we enter the sort of third peak of Covid Infection that potentially could be worse than the first two since its nationwide and the weather is getting colder and its really a time to emphasize the messages that dr. Fauci and the other medical professionals have been trying to send us because this could get really, really bad. And the president of the United States is working against that. Hes actively working against the efforts to slow the spread of the virus by saying everybody is tired of it. Nobody wants to hear about it anymore, covid, covid, covid, yada yada yada. Its the combination of his impatience. He has the Attention Span of a fruit fly. I think thats basically true, but also his narcissism. And his narcissism not only being interested only in his own electoral prospect. I think he has a warped view of his best path to reelection which would have been to do a good job, but now he thinks its look over there. Dont Pay Attention to the virus. Also, his narcissism because he himself did have covid19 and then he had all of the experimental advanced treatments that no one else could get. Then he recovered. Then he said, you know, i recovered. Everybody else can just recover, no big deal. I think its just tragic. Its tragic. Almost a quarter of a million americans have died and more will die because of donald trump. Yeah. The numbers are not getting any better. Our thanks to ron fournier for being on this morning. Coming up, the president was in arizona yesterday. Super spreader event, trying to make up ground i guess as polls show him trailing joe biden in the Battle Ground state. Our next guest explains why arizona is the perfect microcosm of the state in terms of the National Race and the latino vote. Were back in a moment were back in a moment the Supreme Court has decided to hear two cases pertaining to the Trump Administrations handling of immigration in the United States. The first is a challenge to the Trump Administrations use of pentagon money to build the southern border wall. The other will focus on the administrations policy on a asylum applicants. The governments use of 2. 5 billion in pentagon funding was inproperly diverted by the administration to build more than 100 miles of border wall. The court ruled only congress can approve of the transfer of funds and the court will hear a Lower Court Ruling on returning Asylum Seekers to mexico while awaiting court hearings. The policy filed a surge of immigrants at the border from southern and south america. The Supreme Court is expected to hear the case next year with a decision by spring. Joining us now vice news host and msnbc contributor, the author of the new book finding latinx in search of the voices redefining latino identity. And great to have you on the show. Thank you. Explain to us which different subsets of latino culture could impact the election and how. So the whole purpose of the book was kind of my Lesson Learned from the 2016 campaign where i was the Deputy Director of hispanic press for Hillary Clinton and i remember waking up, november 8th, thinking that the headline that morning was going to be that latinos were the ones that voted out donald trump. So i took this whole trip across the country trying to look at all of those Battle Ground state through a different lens. How have i as the daughter of immigrants changed from my parents so i went from california, i talked to the children of farm workers. In arizona theres a huge indigenous community. I talked to Puerto Ricans, i talked to venezuelans. In the south, i talked to other huge communities of mayans. In the midwest i found latinos, because wed barely think of latinos in the midwest so the whole book is an exercise of Lessons Learned from 2016 and trying to rediscover a community that i thought i knew. You know, its fascinating that i think both parties for some time have looked at latinos as just one group. A Homogeneous Group and thats a terrible mistake. You cant even do that in the state of florida. If you look, for instance, in miamidade right now, the biden team is underperforming in miamidade because people that are coming up from venezuela, people that are here from cuba, first, Second Generation cubanamericans, they have a completely different look at the situation exactly. Than Puerto Ricans in central florida. Theres so many different subsets. Explain how both parties, republicans and democrats alike, have missed this central fact and how the future of american politics is really going to turn on them starting to get a better understanding of the nations Fastest Growing group of americans. Right. To me, i think the biggest lesson is that both parties for years have understood the story of someone like my mother and my father. Everyone understands the immigrant narrative and this idea that we came to this country in search of opportunities and the American Dream and what we lost track of is how people like myself, the millennials what we did with the rights that our parents fought for. How we have been able to how i can live freely as a latino and as a person and what does that mean in florida and other Battle Ground states. So i think theres this fear of messing up, of asking questions. Like how have young latinos changed, what do you want in the agenda and what does the american agenda ask mean for you . So theres a fundamental missing question of who is latinos right now. My experience as a cubanamerican in miami is very different than any grandparents who grew up around the idea of socialism and communism so i think theres basic questions that we have lost track of the evolution of who latinos who are right now. Its people who look like me, theres over 250,000 latinos that identify as muslim. Theres over is million latinos that are in indigenous. If you look at the millennial generation we are more than likely to identify as queer, right, so theres all these different hybrids and we have been sort of walking into our identities in a very free way and people dont really know what that looks like. Claire mccaskill . Yes, im curious, i think joe hit on something and i think thats too often the Political Parties see latinos as a monolith. There was a taking for granted that anybody who is latino in america is going to be for the democrats because donald trump has been so awful about his language and his policies around people who are like your family wanting to come to america for all of the right reasons. So what is the issues that are eating into the democratic success of getting these voters over . It is the threat of socialism or is it tax policy or cultural issues . Can you point to why you think donald trump is doing better with these voters than we anticipated that he would . Right. So arizona is a perfect example, right. Obviously the president is there. He knows hes not going to win the National Latino vote but he knows he has to win enough. What you see in a place like arizona theres a sudden fascination by young latino men that see something in trump and we scratch our heads, we dont understand what thats about. I just got back from arizona last week, some immigrants, some latinos, do want to forget theyre immigrants. Right . Theres a fascination and an assimilation and the closest they can solution to the solution theyre not the other, theyre just like trump some people will buy that and it goes back into the notion of were not a monolith. We can be conservative and in trump they see that proximity to power. I think thats an important element to understand of why some are driven to him. Right, why are they so aching for this assimilation and i think it goes back to, you know, we have been lacking that. We have been lacking the longing for a long time and it goes in to what is giving that to us, who is saying the right words. Obviously, trump creates an ill illustration, but he has not given us a concrete agenda that makes us belong in the country but at the core is belonging. The new book is finding latinx, in search of the voices redefining latino identity. Thank you very much for being on the show. Still ahead, were digging in to the new Battle Ground polling that shows the tightening president ial race in a few key states. Plus, the Debate Commission announces changes ahead of thursdays second president ial faceoff. Youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. I wanted more from my copd medicine, thats why ive got the power of 1,2,3 medicines with trelegy. The only fdaapproved, oncedaily 3 in 1 copd treatment. Trelegy the power of 1 2 3 trelegy 1 2 3 trelegy with trelegy and the power of 1, 2, 3, im breathing better. Trelegy works 3 ways to open airways, keep them open, and reduce inflammation for 24 hours of better breathing. Trelegy wont replace a rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. Tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high Blood Pressure before taking it. Do not take trelegy more than prescribed. Trelegy may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. Call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vision changes, or eye pain occur. Think your copd medicine is doing enough . Maybe you should think again. Ask your doctor about oncedaily trelegy. We know times are hard and were here for you. Find support at trelegy. Com. A lastminute formatting change was announced for this thursdays final president ial debate. Didnt you talk about on peacock . We are going to be on peacock Election Night. Yes. Can i turn you off . Exactly. I can turn your volume down and say, joe, shush. No, we want to figure out why things are going. The commission on president ial debates announced yesterday each candidate will have their microphones cutoff while their opponent issues answers to each debate topic. They said both microphones will be op during open discussion segments of the debate. This is so not hard. I dont know why it took so long mike barnicle. Mike barnicle. You know, even if they mute the mics, i bet we will still be able to hear donald yapping, you know, as joe speaks. And certainly when the mics are open, it will be no holds daniel bard i dont know that anything is going to happen in the debate thats going to alter whats going on in the country. I doubt it. But its just the initial debate, the damage that he did himself is eternal. Yeah, and so, Claire Mccaskill, trumps people say he will be calmer, more reserved. He is not. He is incapable of being that way. The white house reporters say he was angrier yesterday than they have ever seen him. The microphone is going to be cut off. How many times he is going to be calling joe biden a criminal . How many times will he say he should go to jail . How men times is he going to keep doing the things that cause him so much damage to the first debate . Well, he is not going to be able to be what his Campaign Needs him to be. The sad thing is he will continue he thinks hunter biden is the same word as her emails. He thinks that somehow attacking the president s the Vice President s son is the only thing he needs to do to get him across the finish line. I mean, it got him impeached trying to get dirt on biden, and this idea that he could do this and this is somehow going to move the needle, its not going to work, but he is going to do it. He is going to try to dirty up Vice President joe biden. Frankly, at this point i think joe biden is teflonesque when it comes to those attacks because they have been out there so long and havent made a bit of difference in the numbers. We have heard trump people say from the campaign he has to move the needle at this final debate. Unclear what that means. Is he suddenly, after four years, going to look appealing to senior voters who turned on him because he turned on the pandemic . Appealing to the suburban women he has bj him ridging and performing through one performance . He is who he is. I think he is who he is. I dont think he changes his spots during this last debate. Look, typical donald trump behavior that we have seen over time is he will double down. Hell double down on everything that hes doing. He will double down on, you know, we are talking too much about the pandemic and i have done a great job on it anyhow and lets move on. Even as cases rise, lets move on. He will double down on joe biden is a criminal and, you know, say the name hunter biden a million times. Hell double down on just the series, the litany of lies that he tells about his record, the economic record, about his social justice and Racial Justice record, about everything, and he will hope to bring some republicans home on the fringes, i guess. But i dont see this being promising. It will be interesting to see what the ratings are for this debate and how many people watch it. All right. Well, before we go to break, admiral mccrave non the wall street journal pout out a piec. When we remain indifferent to our role in the world, retreat from our obligation to our citizens and allies and fail to choose the right leader, then we will pay the highest price for our neglect and shortsightedness. I voted for joe biden. Still ahead with coronavirus cases up and his poll numbers down, the president lashes out at dr. Anthony fauci and calls joe biden a criminal who should be locked up. Morning joe is coming right back. Joe biden a criminal who should. Joe biden a criminal who should and because its a ninja foodi, it can do things no other oven can, like flip away. The ninja foodi air fry oven, the oven that crisps and flips away. To save you up to 60 . These are all great. And when you get a big deal. You feel like a big deal. Priceline. Every trip is a big deal. Every time you touch a surface, bacteria is left behind. Now, consider how many times your family touches the surfaces in your home in 24 hours. Try microban 24. Spray on hard surfaces to kill 99. 9 of viruses and bacteria initially. Once dry, it forms a bacteria shield that keeps killing bacteria for 24 hours, even after multiple touches. Try microban 24. Available in multipurpose, sanitizing, and bathroom sprays. This has been medifacts for microban 24. I think you mean the new alexa. Its a buick. Its an alexa. Check it out. Alexa, turn on the outdoor lights. Ok. Thats cool, but im pretty sure its a buick. Clearly an alexa. Alexa, get directions to the 818 grill. Getting directions. Its a buick. The firstever encore gx, available with alexa builtin. Nice buick. Its an alexa. Now get nearly 3,300 purchase cash on the 2020 encore gx. Ask alexa, tell me about buick suvs were going to win. I wouldnt have told you that maybe two or three weeks ago. We are going to win. We have never been in a stronger position than we are today. We are going to win. I am more excited today than i was two weeks ago. If an election were held today, we win the election. We win the election. But where we have states that are sort of tipping and go go either way, i have an ability to go to those states and rally. Biden has no ability. Election day is exactly two weeks away, and as nbc news correspondent mike memoli noted trump insisting to his team he can still win, whereas bidens campaign is insisting to supporters they could still lose. Good morning and welcome to morning joe. It is tuesday october 20th. We are two weeks away. An exciting announcement on Election Night. We are going to be on peacock. Of course, its nbcs brandnew streaming service. Morning joe at night. Jeff shell is doing some extraordinary things over at peacock. We are going to be there from 6 00 in the evening until the race until whenever. Is called. As always, we are going to have a cast of millions. And we are going to be focusing on getting you the results as quickly as possible and just telling it like it is. Willie, i dont know if we have ever worked together at night outside of, well, back then we called it ankora, but outside of turkey. Those dice games were fun. No, this is a big deal. We will be there on Election Night. You are used to seeing us the morning after the election. We will be there walltowall. Peacocks got a lot to offer. You are getting to watch 30 rock and snl and all the stuff from snl and the new shows. We will be joining that cast of thousands on Election Night. This is such a con sequential al moment in history. Why not stay at work and stay at it and stay on the air and watch it happen before our eyes. So thats going to be a big option for Election Night. So along with joe, willie and me, we have msnbc National Affairs analyst cohost of showtimes the circus, john heilemann. Capitol hill correspondent and host of way too early kasie hunt, she never sleeps. And National Political correspondent for nbc news Steve Kornacki. A lot to cover. New battleground state polling this morning showing increasingly tight race between joe biden and President Trump. In wisconsin the latest reuters poll shows biden ahead by eight among likely voters. Those who have already cast their votes, 51 to 43 . In pennsylvania, the same poll shows biden and President Trump statistically tied among likely voters and those who have already voted biden 49 , trump 45 . And in georgia, the latest Emerson College poll shows another statistical tie. Trump 48, biden 47 . So, john heilemann, what do you see in those polls . We also had a New York Times siena poll coming out this morning showing joe biden up nine nationally. What trends are you looking at . You know, joe, i think it sounds like a broken record here. We talked about this yesterday. I think what you really see here is what you have seen for months, which is a race that has demonstrated remarkable stability for months. A boring headline, right . You are starting to see, the inevitable thing that i think people in our business have expected for a long time, that you and i and mika and willie and i have discussed for months, as you got into the final days that the race was going to tighten a little bit. I think the most important things, the most outstanding questions is whether donald trump can do in these last couple of weeks, what he did to his enorthernous benefit in 2016, which was to bring republicans home. At the end of 2016 the people around trump were very focused on the question, especially right after the comey letter came out, could they get north of 90 of republicans to come and to come back to donald trump. There will be questions about that, especially after the access hollywood tape, could he get that loyalty out of the republican standard issue republicans, regular republicans, would they come back. He spent the last two weeks with a lot of discipline in 2016, you will recall, talking about trade, talking about manufacturing, talking about immigration, talking about draining the swamp, in addition to the postcomey, you know, lock her up crooked hillary stuff. There was an economic thrust to his message. Needs to that again now. There is discussion that he is polling in the midtohigh 80s with republicans among his many problems, thats a significant one. Can donald trump get republicans to come home . And the problem right now is that his message right now is nothing like the disciplined economic message that he drove in 2016. All he is talking about is himself, his grievances and the questions related to his complaints with all of us, which is not generally the way that you get regular republicans to find their way back to their party. Right. And white house reporters yesterday say at least told me on the tarmac that he was one of the angriest they had ever seen donald trump. Enraged by articles coming out. Maggie habermans. Jon lamirs coming out talking about Staff Members starting to jump ship. So hes enraged now with two weeks to go. One more quick thought about these polls we saw yesterday, john. There was some people that were panicking on the left about the fourpoint spread in pennsylvania. Its funny. We have been seeing eight, nine, ten point spreads in wisconsin and michigan. I have yet to talk to a person really deep on the inside in the trump camp on the biden camp that havent believed those are two or threepoint races and still believe those are two or threepoint races and believe florida is going to be won by 100,000 votes or less. Correct. All true. I think thats right. I think the Biden Campaign is very confident in michigan and wisconsin, but they recognize its not going to be an eight or ninepoint race. And i think both sides have said that florida is going to be a very, very close race. I think the difference is, if you ask people on both sides six months ago, they both would have thought its going to be very, very close but trump has the advantage. I think now with some of the collapse of trumps strength, especially with seniors, that now the advantage is to biden. I dont know the Trump Campaign would acknowledge that, but i think the neutral view with be extremely close race, but a slight advantage to joe biden heading to election day two weeks from now. To johns point, you would think the president would be trying to expand a little bit. He is drilling down that the base. Yesterday he spent the day attacking dr. Anthony fauci saying he is a disaster, calling scientists idiots. He went after joe biden again at a rally saying he should be lucked up and if bill barr, the attorney general were doing his job, if he were someone else, joe biden would have been locked up. And then talking about the pandemic, something he tried to wish away for seven months, something he told bob woodward he is trying to downplay. Here he was talking about it yesterday in pros cot, arizona. The pandemic. They are getting tired of the pandemic, arent they . Getting tired of the pandemic. You turn on cnn, thats all they cover. Covid, covid, pandemic, covid, covid, covid. You know why . They are trying to talk everybody out of voting. People arent buying it, cnn, you dumb bastards. Thats all they talk about. You know biden wants to lock it down, he wants to listen to dr. Fauci. And, of course, joe, the Biden Campaign is turning that into a campaign. Yes, i want to hissen to dr. Fauci and people are concerned about the coronavirus thats killed 221,000 people and reshaped the lives of almost every american. And you know why joe biden has decided hey, im going to go and do debate prep for a couple of days . Because he literally wants to cede the entire stage to donald trump. Either donald trump is providing aid and comfort to terrorists who tried to kill a michigan governor by attacking her and saying, well, i dont know, maybe, she is claiming that, and hes saying some extraordinary things there, or hes attacking Anthony Fauci or saying he is going to leave. Also, for people that say, you know, i think im voting for donald trump because of my regulations or it wont be as bad as they are under joe biden, he is talking, he is enraged about the fact that his attorney general will not arrest his political opponent. So, all of these people saying, you know what . I dont vote for democrats. You know what . Im voting for him because of regulations. Donald trump in the last two weeks of the campaign is raging at his attorney general for not arresting his political opponent. If you are voting for donald trump, thats who you are voting for. And if youre voting for that man who two weeks from election day is calling for the arrest of his opponent and well show you that moment straight ahead. President trump says joe biden would be in jail if attorney general william barr wasnt so nice. You are watching morning joe. Well be right back. Are watchin. Well be right back. We use 11. Eleven. 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And telehealth so you can see a primary care doctor remotely, from the comfort and safety of home. Because while your reverse dunk days may be behind you, your coaching days are just beginning. Aetna Medicare Advantage plans. Medicare annual enrollment ends december 7th. Call today to learn more and well send you a 10 visa reward card with no obligation to enroll. He is lucky that we have in our country, and they dont appreciate, a wonderful human being and the most fair attorney general of the United States because i know people that would have him locked up five weeks ago. Bill barr is a very nice man and a very fair man, and they have no idea because somebody else would have taken that thing and all the crap and corruption, he has been a corrupt politician for a long time, this guy. He is a criminal. He is a criminal. He got caught. Read his laptop. You know who is a criminal . Youre a criminal for not reporting it. You are a criminal for not reporting it. Let me tell you something. Joe biden is a criminal and hes been a criminal for a long time, and youre a criminal and the media for not reporting it. Good luck, everybody. Have a good time. So, lets get this straight. So you have a president , mika, who calls his opponent a criminal and is calling for his arrest, and now is actually, i know because he called for my arrest several times, now hes calling for jeff masons arrest, calling him a criminal because hes not calling for the arrest. I mean, this is what is being fought in belarus. Donald trump is a strong man, a very weak strong man, but he is trying to be a strong man, and again how anybody could vote for him, i dont care what your ideology is, i dont care what your regulations are. I mean, two weeks out saying that his opponent should be arrested. It is beyond the pale. It is unamerican. There is no other way to put it. And you make that great point, joe, that you dont understand what this country is about if you are going to vote for him, especially just listening to that alone. But you also have no clue what that country is going through as he hopscotches across arizona. If you look at arizona headlines, coronavirus cases are going up in arizona. Thank you very much for your superspreader across the country. Two weeks out to the election, its selfdestructive if one cares about his campaign, but also spreading this virus, making sure it surges in wisconsin where they are setting up extra hospital space because they literally are at 110 capacity. You have no idea what this country is going through. Yesterday marked the first day of early voting in the battleground state of florida. Voters across the state were up before dawn standing for hours with lines growing into the hundreds before opening. Those in southern counties even waited in heavy, heavy rain and wind to cast their vote. Early voting continues in florida 12 hours a day through november 1st. So, Steve Kornacki, floridas just incredible. I talked to the smartest person i have known in Florida Politics on the republican side for 20 years. He is always right. I talked to the smartest person i have known in Democratic Politics in florida for the past 20 years, hes always right. The republican says, i think were going to win, but its going to be under 100,000 votes out of 18 million cast. The democrat is saying i think were going to win this thing, but its going to be within 50,000, 100,000 votes, again out of 18 million cast. That would be well, well below 1 of the vote. Its just so extraordinarily close in florida, and republicans, they are leaning on the fact that they have done an extraordinary job on the ground over the past four years registering new voters. Democrats are pointing correctly also to the fact that you win with tv ads in the state of florida, and its just like b52s. They are just heavy, heavy bombing across the state. Man, even running ads in northwest florida in counties like Okaloosa County where no democrat ever runs. This is going to be a close one through the night, these experts think. Well, its interesting because florida unlike a lot of other states is so easy to make the argument for either side just based on the numbers we are getting. You mentioned, for instance, the new voter registrations and republicans can point to florida and point to several other states where this is true if you look at the last four years or just look at the last several months leading up to the election. You see an advantage in new voter registrations among republicans. A pretty big one. Thats something for republicans to crow about. The democrats look at the same numbers and they say, well, some of that are folks who have been voting republican for a long time, particularly in some of these Rural Counties you are talking about, who had been sort of inherited democratic registrations they finally decided in the trump era to reregister as republicans. There has been a trump effort for that. Thats not new votes necessarily. Also democrats will tell you they think Younger Voters in particular who are registering for the first time are more likely to register. Basically, independent, not with either party, but to vote democratic. So the democrats say maybe those numbers arent quite as bad for us as they suggest. You hear the argument on both sides. I heard you talking a few minutes ago about the shift you see among Senior Citizens in the polling in florida which mirrors something we have been seeing nationally, and democrats will crow about that in a state like florida certainly. But republicans have that counter in florida which weve seen in the polling this year and we which also saw, by the way, in the 2018 midterm elections in florida, and that was stronger performance with hispanic voters particularly in miamidade, particularly south florida. Then trump was able to get in 2016. If you look at the map from the 2018 midterms and try to figure out how desantis and scott buck got statewide victories in florida. Look at Miamidade County, the improvement especially in areas with large cubanamerican populations relative to 2016. The polling is suggesting even as trump as lost ground with Senior Citizens in florida, he may have found a way to compensate with hispanic voters. Coming up, the Supreme Court gives pennsylvania more time to count the votes. What it means for all of those ballots caught up in potential delays at the post office. Morning joe is coming right back. Coming right back its still warm. Thanks, alice says hi. For some of us, our daily journey is a short one. Save 50 when you pay per mile with allstate. Pay less, when you drive less. Youve never been in better hands. Allstate. Click or call for a quote today. So youre a small bor a big one. You were thriving, but then. Oh. Ah. Okay. Plan, pivot. How do you bounce back . You dont, you bounce forward, with serious and reliable internet. Powered by the largest gig Speed Network in america. But is it secure . Sure its secure. And even if the power goes down, your connection doesnt. So how do i do this . You dont do this. We do this, together. Bounce forward, with comcast business. This was apInteresting Development yesterday. A ruling by the Supreme Court will allow mailin ballots to be counted if received within three days of election day in the battleground state of pennsylvania. The move is a loss for republicans who pushed to require that only ballots received by election day be counted. Four justices dissented from the order with chief Justice John Roberts siding with the courts three liberals. The high court down to eight members following the death last month of Justice Ruth Bader ginsburg issued no opinions explaining its reasons. How does this impact potential for republicans in the state of pennsylvania and what else are you looking at . Well, there is a lot here, mika. I mean, to take just the pennsylvania question for a second, pennsylvania is one of those states where we expect most of we expect democrats to have an advantage on the mailin vote if you look at the way people are handling the pandemic, democrats much more likely to vote by mail. Republicans more likely to show up on election day. So this gives another three days of counting. It also potentially, i mean, if it all comes down to pennsylvania, which my sources on both sides of the aisle agree florida is going to be a big one on Election Night and potentially for the weeks after, but pennsylvania potentially the critical battleground for this. So this decision potentially incredibly significant, could also stretch out the election for several days or weeks beyond actual election day. The other piece of this thats so interesting is john roberts here. I mean, after this decision came down, several Top Republicans were criticizing john roberts, who has become sort of this boogeyman for him, even though he was appointed by former president george w. Bush. He sided with liberals. Its a split court currently, but it raises the possibly Amy Coney Barrett supposed to be voted out of Committee Later this week, republicans racing to put her on the bench before election day. President trump has been pretty transparent why he wants that to happen, because that could potentially swing the balance when further decisions like this may end up reaching the Supreme Court if, in fact, the Electoral College state of play is not clear coming out of Election Night. Coming up, well talk to the democrat in a hardfought race for u. S. Congress in virginia. Dr. Cameron webb. How his background in medicine is shaping his policy prescriptions amid the pandemic. Morning joe is back in a moment. Tired of overpaying for your prescriptions . Try optum perks. Its a new way to save up to 80 . And everyone can do it. Its from optum, a Health Care Company thats trusted by millions of people. You dont have to sign up for anything. Just go to optumperks. Com. And get a coupon to use at your pharmacy. Thats it. I opted in. I opted in. You can, too. Opt in and save big today. Whosgovernor gavin newsom. The governor says prop 15 is, fair, phasedin, and long overdue reform, that will exempt Small Businesses and Residential Property owners. Join governor newsom. Vote yes on 15. Whos supKamala Harris. 5 . Harris says, a Corporate Tax loophole has allowed billions to be drained from our Public Schools and local communities. No more. Im proud to support prop 15. Vote yes. Schools and communities first is responsible for the content of this ad. The only difference is wed be much bigger. But thats what it is. Its the American Dream versus a socialist hell hole. Donald trump on with his fox friends just moments ago. Welcome back. I. C. E. Raids which had been paused due to the pandemic have been resumed by the Trump Administration with hundreds of undocumented immigrants taken into custody in the last few weeks nationwide, and top officials saying more are to come. But President Trump wont be keeping his Campaign Promise to deport millions. Joining us now msnbc correspondent Jacob Soboroff and author of the New York Times bestseller separated inside an american tragedy. Jacob. Mika, i will never forget when President Trump said to you and joe he was going to deport millions of people. The truth of the matter is, he will not even come close to deporting the amount of undocumented immigrants than president obama d did because of a lack of cooperation local law enforcement, including places like right here in los angeles. Lo take a look at this. The week before Donald Trumps inauguration i did a series on his major Campaign Promises and visited tijuana, mexico. How long had you lived in the United States . 29 years. Reporter how long have you been in mexico . Three weeks. Reporter so what did you do . You got caught. What did you do . I got deported four months ago. It was a misdemeanor, drinking in public. Reporter the people i met in tijuana had been deported by president obama who back then held the record for the most deportations by a president. More than 3 1 2 years later it looks as if he still with when you compare president obamas first term to President Trumps. Immigration activists say one reason President Trump hasnt been able to deport more people than president obama is some localities are ending the practice of handing over undocumented inmates to i. C. E. After they serve their time, including Los Angeles County jail, the worlds largest. Thats where i met sheriff Alex Villanueva who in august made permanent a ban on transfers of inmates to i. C. E. Those two are going to be released. They get fingerprinted. Reporter under the new rules here with i. C. E. Out of the jail system even if they are undocumented they are good to go . They are good to go. Reporter why did you make this decision . We have the nations concentraticon sen, the largest in l. A. County. I cant have tows people afraid to call the police. I need them report being a victim of a crime, a witness to a crime. Reporter during obamas first toerm l. A. County got the most requests to transfer inmates. Those requests dropped in the second term and despite a brief uptick under trump his numbers are a fraction of obamas. And with i. C. E. Entirely out of l. A. County jails that number may drop further. There used to be a big tv screen here had the name of every inmate, the charge and everything. So i. C. E. Was here in uniform. Reporter pick them out, fish in a barrel. Like fishing in a barrel. When i got here december of 2018, this was my first stop on the job. I saw the i. C. E. Agents here and i said thats it, they need to leave. Reporter twice since our tour of the jail i. C. E. Staged highprofile raids across the country, including in los angeles, arresting over 100. But President Trump is still a long way away from his goal of deporting millions. And from inside i. C. E. s former office in l. A. County jail you understand why. Its sad that we participate in that for so long. Reporter when you look at obama being criticized for being the deporter in chief, this had to contribute to the numbers . Yes, this was part of it, definitely. The sheriff is very embattled politically in los angeles for his handling of policing issues in this city and in this county, but he is winning praise from immigration activists for this policy. The end of handing over undocumented immigrants to i. C. E. , and that, in a nutshell, is why President Trump wont be able to surpass president obama when it comes to his pledge to deport millions of people. Jacob, as we saw in that piece right there, the long stretch of your reporting on this issue going back to the beginning of this administration, your book is entitled separated, another issues voters may consider at the polling books. Is that family separation policy. It was white hot for a long time. To what extent does that policy continue today . Oh, its still going on right now. As a matter of fact, today we expect an update in federal court about the number of families who are still separated from one another going on three years for some, back to that el paso pilot program. That could be hundreds of parents and children. The children we know today will have permanent psychological damage because of that policy that was uniquely presented, put on and executed by the Trump Administration. Jacob soboroff, staying on the story for us for years now. Thanks so much. Mika. Joining us now, cofounder of black lives matter and the black lives matter global network, alicia garza. The author of a book the purpose of power how we come together when we fall apart. Alicia, explain the many ways this topic of coming together when we fall apart might be now a better time than ever really given what is happening in the black community during this time and this election. Absolutely. And good morning, mika. Thanks for having me on. So, think for our book what were really talking about here is how it is that we get more power to more people so that the conditions in our communities get better. And in this book i really thought i was going to be talking about black lives matter and how it came to be. But what actually came to me when i started writing was that there is so much lessons that we have learned over the last 20 years for me of organizing, seven years of this movement, that i think are helpful to people who are looking at whats going on in our country right now and saying, how did we get here and how do we turn around . And so this book really is about how we offer what i call hospice care to that which is dying away, which i think, you know, is literally all of the things that this administration is offering us in this moment, and also how to offer prenatal care to the things that we want to birth, to the country that we actually want to live in, and thats why im really excited that the purpose of power is out today. And explain what motivated you to write this book. I am reading about even your upbringing and how you were inspired it towards advocacy. But why this book now . We are in the midst of a moment that going to be historic. Frankly, 10, 20 years from now we will be studying this moment and asking ourselves the same questions that were asking now. How did we get here and how did folks turn it around . And for me this book is really about helping us understand how it is that we create change. You know, there is so much about what happens online. There is so much about protests out in the streets. But i think there is very little about the offline work that happens to be able to change the rules, change policies, and change culture so that we can change the things in our lives that we can no longer accept, like wage gaps that disproportionately impact women, like Police Violence thats disproportionately impacting black communities and latinx communities and indigenous communities. So, for me, this book is really something i want everybody to put in their back pocket as were figuring out how it is that we not only take advantage of this moment of unprecedented crisis and opportunity, but also how we build the future that we deserve. And im offering lessons from 20 years of organizing experience, but also things that im unlearning and things that i still have yet to learn, and its a unique inside perspective from someone like me who has spent most of my life trying to change the rules and change practices so that we can live better together. Gene, jump in. Alicia, congratulations on the book. I have one question, which is how do you address the cultural divide, the sort of tribal divide that we have in the country now . The people who just instinctively and reflectively reject even the words black lives matter and go into a crouch, you know, blue lives matter, all lives matter, but rejecting the very idea and not showing openness, frankly, to to letting sort of thoughts, new thoughts in and letting new ideas in . Absolutely. Well, i think there is a few things that we have to be mindful of. I talk about this a lot in the book, the power of stories to shape our perceptions and our actions. You know, make America Great again is a very powerful story. It brings all kinds of perceptions about how people want this country to be. It says explicitly and implicitly that there was a time that was better than this, that we are trying to get back to. Unfortunately, for women, for people of color, for black people, that was not a good time in our lives. But what those stories do as it galvanizes people to take action. Black lives matter has also done the same thing, and i think when were talking about how we build the kinds of movements that can have power and impact, we do have to Pay Attention to the stories that we are telling. Who is telling those stories and for what purpose. And we also have to start telling stories that include all of us. In my book i talk a lot about what it means to include the waking amongst the whoa. I talk about what it means to speak to the things that everyday people care about, that actually are the majoritarian values of that nation. So much of this moment really will be about us not finding our tribe and finding the people who agree with us, but it will be about expanding, right, and growing, as my friends says to me all the time, organizing is about addition and multiplication and not division and subtraction, and thats one of the things that we talk about in the book, as well. Alicia, willie geist. Congratulations on the book. I dont know if a lot of people realize, but the term black lives matter is credited to you starting from a Facebook Post back in july of 2013 after the death of trayvon martin. Im curious on a human level if you can believe what has happened with the simple phrase that put in a Facebook Post, that once seen by radicalists, some people put into the Corporate Mission statements of Major Companies across the country. What is that like for you . Its incredibly surreal. You know, patrice and opal and i talk about this all the time, that we are honored and humbled to be the smallest piece of such an incredible, important, and global moment. And i want to take the opportunity to just say that there are thousands of organizers and activists who are working tirelessly every single day to build and lift and advance this movement. And so really the credit belongs in all of those places. I also think a lot about what we have to do here moving forward, and what i know is that there are so many people out there, like i said, who want to figure out where do we go from here. And are the divisions in this country able to be bridged . And in my book i talk a lot about how we do that. I talk about the fact that its important for us, right, to get a better sense of where weve been in order to understand where were going. I talked about placing myself in a context, right. I talked a lot about my mother and how she really reflects and represents the challenges that black women face every day, but also the hopes and dreams and where those hopes and dreams can take this nation. So, to me, we still have a lot of work to do, and im really ready to start to invest in that prenatal care that we need to build the country that we deserve. The new book is the purpose of power how we come together when we fall apart. Alicia garza, thank you very, very much. And up next, the president s answer when asked this morning what his plan is for the country to live with the coronavirus and still stay safe from it. Keep it right here on morning joe. [announcer] meet the ninja foodi air fry oven. Make familysized meals fast. And because its a ninja foodi, it can do things no other oven can, like flip away. The ninja foodi air fry oven, the oven that crisps and flips away. Such as high Blood Pressure,ve pdiabetes, and asthma. 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The moment you sponsor a job on indeed you get a shortlist of quality candidates from a resume data base so you can start hiring right away. Claim your seventyfivedollar credit when you post your first job at indeed. Com promo what is the plan to live with it while steadily staying safe from it . Well, we are living with it and we are having the vaccines coming out very soon. With or without the vaccines, we are rounding the turn. We have incredible. I tell you what. I had regeneron. I wasnt exactly feeling the greatest, and i had regeneron. I felt like superman a day later. I got better very fast. Very, very fast. What theyve done under this administration in terms of the fda and getting things things that would have taken two or three years, i got done in two weeks. And the fda has been great. Theyve all been great. Now the vaccines are coming out. Thats going to help it. But were doing much better than europe. I mean, europe is getting hit pretty hard. Were doing much better and we will never shut down. We shut down. We understood the disease. Were protecting our elderly, unlike what they did in new york where they did such a bad job, cuomo. Were protecting our elderly. Were taking care of those because they are susceptible, especially if they have heart or diabetes or problems, but we understand the disease. No, there will be no shutdowns. I think the all or none phenomenal was the thing that did us in where individuals were so understandably concerned about being shut down that when things began to open, they skipped over the benchmarks and the gateways and the different phased and in some areas, essentially there fly as it were. And we didnt have the situation where we could gradually reemerge into a society that is careful and then, as ive said very often, sanjay, and its true, there was a perception that Public Health measures is the obstacle to opening the economy as opposed to being a safe, gradual gateway and roadway to opening the economy. So we wound up getting the surges. And when you get a surge, sanjay, you have such a level of Community Spread that it makes containment and control very, very difficult. Hes a nice guy. The only thing i say is, he is a little bit sometimes not a team player. But he is a democrat. And i think that hes just fine. Are you and dr. Fauci at odds . You said you were not no, i like him. Ii i think hes a terrific guy. Just to factcheck the president there on his fox friends show that dr. Fauci is unregistered. Hes not a democrat. Joining us now, democratic candidate for congress in virginias 5th district, dr. Cameron webb. Dr. Webb, as a doctor, who spends his weekdays treating patients at the university of Virginia Medical Center and your weekends campaigning, you might have a thing or two to say about the president s response to the coronavirus that might counter his claim that we are rounding the corner. Well, thanks for having me, first of all. I would say the data is telling us, i wouldnt call it rounding the corner. Dr. Fauci is describing a lot of the reality of these experiences. We have to lean into the Public Health facts. Thats something you cant argue. Were still seeing an uptick in cases in so many states. Our sevenday Positivity Rate is higher than it was a few days back. Were seeing 57,000 new cases across the United States every day. I wouldnt call it rounding the corner. Im working in the coronavirus unit tonight. We are hunkering down, preparing for this cold and flu season and the impact its going to have on covid. Pretty decisively won a fourway democratic primary in june in virginia. What are you hearing from voters and is coronavirus top of mind for them as you head out on the campaign trail . Yeah, i am hearing from voters that coronavirus is top of mind but im hearing it in two different ways. Both hearing that the Health Concerns are top of mind to folks and theyre really worried about whats happening in our community, whats happening in terms of Health Outcomes and im also hearing the folks really concerned about the economic impact. And thats playing out in education, k12 education space. Thats also playing out in certainly our health space and folks having access to care that they need but Small Businesses are hurt. So everybody is talking about covid and how its impacting their lives. Its certainly top of mind. I think being able to speak to that with expertise has been valuable for us in this campaign. Dr. Webb, its willie geist. You are a highly regarded young doctor at the uva medical center. So what made you want to leap from medicine into politics . Its the part of the same passion and passion about serving people. And im passionate about building consensus. Before joining the faculty at the university of vrgesirginia, was working in the white house. I worked in the Obama White House on the Health Care Team and as my brothers tekeeper initiative and also worked in the trump white house. So between those two experiences just realizing we have a lot of levers in our federal government we can pull to improve lives for individuals and just continuing that thread that led me down this path. Where would you february you were were in the house of representatives right now. A lot of people in your district and districts across the country are hurting badly. Small businesses are desperately waiting for relief from the government. How are you looking at the economic crisis that comes with the Public Health crisis . Its critical we get more stimulus dollars to our communities. Ive been doing a Small Business tour for the last couple of weeks. Were seeing businesses are running out of those dollars from the c. A. R. E. S. Act. Individuals need resources. Families, Small Businesses. Our communities. Hospitals need resources in so many instances, particularly rural hospitals. Were recognizing states and localities need additional assistance. Im hoping that a deal is imminent between speaker and secretary mnuchin, but however we can get this done, we have to deliver it for the people. Dr. Webb, Gene Robinson with the Washington Post has a question. Gene . Yeah, cameron, just one question. How is early voting going in your district . What are you seeing . Who is voting . Yeah, early voting is going really well. In fact, on the ground, were seeing some of the numbers across our Congressional District are higher than we anticipated. In the 5th Congressional District, its larger than the state of new jersey. Its an enormous Congressional District that includes charlottesville, virginia, all the way down to the North Carolina border. Were seeing the early turnout is high. A lot of enthusiasm. So folks are really interested in this election and the impact it can have on their lives. And what sort of reception do you get in the more rural parts of your district . You know, in charlottesville would seem to be, you know, friendly to a candidate like you. But what about the what about the more rural parts toward that North Carolina border which, very conservative and voting republican for a long time. You know, keep in mind, im spom spotsylvania, pennsylvania. A very rural area. So we came back to Central Virginia because its for family. Were able to connect with folks in all the counties across this district. Were talking about the issues that really matter to voters most. Were talking about those everyday Kitchen Table issues like education, like jobs, like health care, and how its affecting their bottom line. How its affecting their wallets. And wipeople care about that. Go to our website. They are checking it out and seeing what were saying about the issues and thats whats leaning people in our direction. All right. Dr. Cameron webb, thank you so much for being on with us. We really appreciate it. Now to this. A wisconsin judge yesterday reimposed a previous order limiting the capacity of people that can gather at indoor venues to 25 capacity. The order, which was initially imposed by the states Governor Tony Evers comes amid a surge in coronavirus cases in the state. As it deals with one of the worst surges of the virus infections in the country. Over 1,000 people there are hospitalized as of this week hitting new records amid infections and deaths. The state also opened a Field Hospital on state fairgrounds last week to help overwhelmed hospitals treat patients with less severe covid symptoms. A lawsuit brought on by the Tavern League of wisconsin, now called trade commission, argued the State Government had overstepped its authority and caused 5,000 bars, restaurants and taverns, the league represents, to shut down. A judge temporarily blocked the capacity order last week, but has reinstated it today, yesterday. So we are, as of today, that is back on. Willie, we end the show this morning with some good news. Our elise jordan had a baby girl. That just snuck up on it, didnt it . She did. She had a little girl a couple of days ago and just made the news public this morning. She and mike brought home this beautiful baby girl. She writes, we are so very blessed. Ive hit the jackpot in life and love and am just so grateful. Congratulations to elise and mike. What a sweet little girl. Yes, and she tells me her name is mary clyde, named after her great aunt. That does it for us. Stephanie ruhle picks up the coverage right now. Hi there. Im stephanie ruhle. It is tuesday, october 20th. Lets get smarter. With just two weeks, two weeks to go before the big election day, joe biden is off the trail and President Trump is off his script. Instead of hammering home an economic message, he spent time complaining about the media and new rules for thursdays debate. Late yesterday we learned the candidates mics will be muted at certain times to keep the move civil, a move President Trump called unfair. He said hes still going to show up, but hes not happy about it. Well, i think the whole thing is crazy. This commission, i had problems with them four years ago where they stifled out my mic during my conversation with crooked hillary. Its so set up. Its incredible that weve been