Right wing. All in starts right you will 2340. Good evening from new york. Im chris hayes. After five years of work and a long battle over declassification, the Senate Select committee on intelligence today finally released its extensive report on the c. I. A. s tension and Interrogation Program and it is damning, indeed. The heavily redacted 500 page summary on the committees findings represents this countrys First Official reckoning with the torture regime operating by the u. S. From 2001 to 2009. It shows that torture carried out by the c. I. A. Was far more brutal, far more widespread on far more shakier legal dwround than the agency had previously represented. The c. I. A. Willfully misled media out lets, lawmakersened e, National Security officials and the white house about the extent of the program and its effectiveness. The senator with chilling details about how the c. I. A. Treated it e its destiny. We learned threats to sexually abuse the mother of a detainee and to cut a detainee mothers throat. We learned that two detainees were subjected to positions including being shackled in a position for extended periods of time with broken bones in their feet. We learned that one c. I. A. Official played russian roulette and another played with a gun and a power drill. Five were subjected to rectal rehydration or feeding through the rectum with no medical necessity, including one whose lunch tray was pure rayed and rectally infused. We learned that a c. I. A. Officer who contributed to death, likely from hype therm ya, was later given a cash award, 2500 for his consistently superior work. Ed besides the astounding browalty, at one point, two detainees were subjected to sleep deprivation until the c. I. A. Confirmed that these two men had, in fact, been trying to contact the agency for weeks to inform the agency on what they believe for impending attacks. In other word, we tortured people who were trying to help us. Perhaps most disturbingly, the c. I. A. Program made the unsettling discovery about who we know very little. 26 of the 119 detainees did not meet the Legal Standard for detention and should not have etch been there in the first place. The c. I. A. Explains to congress the c. I. A. Would not have found it. The report found a majority of accurate intelligence leading to bin laden came from sources outside the krvmt i. A. Program and, the most Accurate Information was provided prior to the c. I. A. Subjecting the detainee to enhanced interrogation techniques. History will judge us by our commitment to a just society governed by law and the willingness to face an ugly truth and say never again. Vice President Joe Biden applauded the reports released today. I think its a badge of honor, every country, every country has engaged in activities somewhere along the line that it has not been proud of. Think about it. Namely another country has been prepared to stand up and say this was a mistakement we should not have done what weve done. And we will not do it again. This is a New York Times peter baker report. The officials wont take side between the cia and the senate and the way the interrogations worked. Senator john mccain mounted a stirring defense from the senate floor. I know from personal experience that the abuse of prisoners were produced more bad than good intelligence. Most of all, i know the use of torture compromises that which most distinguishes us from our enemies. Our belief that all people, even captured enemies, possess basic human rights which are protected by International Conventions the United States not only joined, but, for the most part, offered. The c. I. A. , while acknowledging short comings and mistakes is pushing back oon aspects of the report, including the idea the c. I. A. Misled about the effectiveness of the program. The current c. I. A. Director argued the program was, in fact, effective. Writing quote\, interrogations of detainees on whom enhanced interrogation techniques are infused did help twart plans and save lives. Intelligence gains the programs were critical to our understanding about alqaida and continues to inform to this day. Six former deputy directors also weighed in with an op ed in the wall street journal reading we designed at a time when welat n Relationship Building dee who did not attend behad e head dabts. Yet, it was clear they possessed information they could disrupt plots and save american lives. The c. I. A. Still has its defenders among the Political Class including, not surprisingly, the two top officials including the president. Nicole wallace who receivabled in the Bush Administration had this to say in releasing this morning. There were three people who we thought knew about attack and we did whatever we had to do. And i pray to god that until the epd of time, well do whatever we have to do. And then e the notion that this somehow makes america less great is asinine and dangerous. Florida senator marco rubio stated that his position today tweeting those who served us in the aftermath of 9 11 deserve our thanks that now places american lives in danger. Republican senator richard burr who is set to take over chairman ship of that committee. Saw the torture report as purely political saying the only motive here could be to embarrass george w. Bush. Your reaction to the action. Do you feel as if we made progrez in reckoning with this period or are we back where we were ten years ago. I think the latter, chris. I dont think even though this might bring a modicum of accountability to some of the people at the top, some of the people you named, i dont think anything would really be done. Whatever punitive effects there is to it, will be whitewashed, will not be accomplished. I was connecting alqaida in baghdad and was frantic to get it stuck back in you have an opinion where former officials, former heads of the c. I. A. , should the American People believe the c. I. A. When this is onesided. E, dont listen to this. This is another disservice to the agency, chris. There are a lot of good people at the agency. There are just as many people i would submit if you could do a survey, there would be more people who are aeng to see the agencies name and these people who have done these sorts of things cleared out. Anxious to see some sort of accountability. Anxious to get their hands cleaned to get the agencys hands cleaned and to get onto business with the c. Imt a. The way things should do. This is not an agency that is out there, you know, cowering in the dark wondering as mcglocglin and others have said. If it has a future. This is a group of people who would like to do their duty to their country and to their mission. They like to get this stuff off of their hands. Stlfs one thing that i have to ask you about. This is in the summary that we got today. An internal c. I. A. Email noted the white house is extremely concerned secretary powell would blow his stack if he were to be briefed on what was going on. Youre working for secretary powell at that time. Your reaction to ha . Im sure thats probably the case. I got to see him. I worked for him over 12 years. And i got to see him blow his stack worse than hed ever blown it before. At the c. I. A. With george tenant and john mcgloughin. He took me into a room and told me to cut about 25 of the presentation he was e he was going to give out. Told me to take it out because he was worthless. He was even worried that it wasnt accurate. Within a few minutes, george tenant showed up with the spellbinding news that the operative had revealed under sbir gags he said. No revealing that he was being tortured at the time. Within a week to ten days, this is the kind of thing that was happening when i was out at the c. I. A. For five days and nights when even now trying to tell the American People that they were confident and telling the truth. So i just want to clarify. You didnt know that the secretary of the program, it looks like tommy rice didnt know about the program. There were a lot of people at the highest levels of government in the executive branch who did not read into the fact that we were torturing people. I think thats true. Ill go out on a limb who said the only person who was completely read in. But the one who had e has read in the need for the law to cover their rear ends and the need to continue the program because it was effective was Richard Bruce cheney. He was the man in the 145 doe shadows orchestrating all of this. The story the c. I. A. Sold the bhiet house and the American People and the effectiveness for the Interrogation Program, thats ahead. At kaiser permanente, everything you need is under one roof. Another way care and coverage together makes life easier. Okay, a little easier. Become a member of kaiser permanente. Because together, we thrive. One detailed report from president bush 2006. According to the c. I. A. Records, the president expressed discomfort. Clothed in a diaper and forced to go to the bathroom on himself. Four years later, this is the president in the ole e oval office. These alternative methods you talked about in terms of extracting information from these suspected terrorists. Were you made personally aware of all of the techniques that were used, for example, dpamand you approve all of those techniques . I told our people get nfgsz without torture and was assured by our Justice Department that we were not torturing. Its been reported that with khalid sheik muhammad, that he was water boarded. Im not going to talk about techniques we use on people. Im not going to talk about that. Im not going to ask you specifically to say about it. If were used, are you at all concerned that even if you get results, theres a blurring the lines fween ourselves and the people that are trying to protect ourselves against . Matt, im just telling you, what this government has done is to take steps necessary to protect you and your family. You asked me about your family. And you rep zebtresent a lot ofr people. And the best information we can get is from people we take off the battlefield so we can act on it. So we can stop plots before they happen. And whatever we have done is legal. Thats why im saying it. Its in the law. We had lawyers look at it and say mr. President , this is lawful. Thats all i can tell you. Im not going to tell you specificationly whats done. I dont want the enemy to adjust. Were at war. This is people that want to come and kill your families. And the best way to protect you is to get information. And im confident the American People understand why weve done that. You see, weve acted on information theyve given us to prevent attacks. And these are real. This isnt make believe. More on the story and the krchlt c. I. A. And the Bush Administration were seal e selling in the media next. 6 azure, and office 365, the team can gain Real Time Insights and instantly share information around the globe. When every millisecond counts, staying competitive begins with the cloud. This is the microsoft cloud. Ah, h it. Push it. P. Push it real good ow oooh baby baby. Baby baby. If youre saltnpepa, you tell people to push it. Push it real good. Its what you do. Ah. Push it. If you want to save fifteen percent or more on car insurance, you switch to geico. Its what you do. Ah. Push it. Im pushing. Im pushing it real good one of the striking things about the newly released report is the lepgtsds the agency went to about the effectiveness on the torture program. The investigation paints the picture the agency and misinformation to willfully mislead the people. Regarding the operation and effectiveness of the c e c. I. A. s effectiveness and Interrogation Program. About the effectiveness of c. I. A. Interrogation being provided by the c. A. To policymaker at the time. The policymakers are the one getting inAccurate Information. C. I. A. Director Michael Hayden said hed never be selected to the committee. So when Diane Finestein says you lied, is she lying . Ill go so far as to say shes incorrect. I mean, lying, lying is intentionally, intentionally misleading someone. All right. Let me make another distinction. Telling people something they dont want to hear is not the same thing as telling people something that is untrue. The investigation includes an entire 37 page section dedicated solely to inconsistencies in a single 2007 appearance commit e committee. For example, the senator asked hayden and e and did any c. Imt a. Personnel express allegations about interrogations being used. Im not aware of any. These guys are more experienced. No. The report knows that statement is incon grutkocongru c. I. A. Records. They express reservations over zubayda. Several on the team profoundly affected. Some to the point of tears and choking up. An email points away from the detention site if the decision is made to continue with enhanced interrogation techniques. Hes also aware of making 40 other statements. Former reporter for the washington post, we did a lot of reporter on the war on terror. Its so striking. What emerges from this and in some ways that push back after the fact that the uil or cia saves looifrs. Everything they did, saved lives, all the information they got was very valuable. It led them to other terrorists and it led them to e Osama Bin Laden in the end. They havent put forward any evidence to show that. Its been a lot for many, many years. Theyve been successful. The idea that theyve now come out again on this huge push, this huge Publicity Campaign to beat back an actual record showing inconsistencies and discrepancies. We should be clear. It provides the Raw Materials for this report. The one argument folks in the c. I. A. Are making that seems to me persuasive is we are being hung out to dry here. We are ordered by the president of the United States to stay e do this. We did it. Sure, we werent equipped to. It was wanted by the American People who were thirsty for vengeance and terrified. It was signed off and briefed to legislative leaders. And now you guys all want to put this on us. Its the battle c. I. A. What do you think of that argument. The c. I. A. Is a Government Agency and theres oversight of that Government Agency. Theres a lot of things they need to do. For this report, 2009, when the committee decided to do this, they decided to do this because there was evidence the c. Imt a. Destroyed materials on the interrogations. Its not evidence. Its not even we know that. They destroyed evidence of these interrogations. And, in fact, they had lied to congress about it. Congress didnt even know the tapes existed when they found out theyd been destroyed. Thats why the committee we believe the went ahead with this investigation. A few years later down the road, what they agreed to, from a part san perspective of what republicans and democrats agreed to, they were just going to investigate the c. I. A. Its focused on the c. I. A. And its actions. It gives us one narrow perspective just on the c. Imt a. Opportunity e dunt it make it an important perspective . Are there other perspectives. Does e do we really need to know what Congress Needed to authorize and what they really knew . Absolutely. But codo we need to know what t c. I. A. Itch lech implemented . Absolutely. Im going to talk to a former c. I. A. Officer who wrote a book on it. You interrogate him. Hes this top alqaida member. He can help us find alqaida. He will do whatever it takes whatever it is to make him talk. Do you understand . And i said we dont do that. And the response was, and this was the first chapter of the book. Well, we do now. First subted to the torture program captured march, 2002. The cia initially and wrongly believed to be an important alqaida official. Zubaydah spent 266 hours in a coffinsized confinement box and told the only way he would leave the facility is in the coffinshaped box. Typically kept naked, sleep deprived and subted to waterer boarding. Despite his hysterical pleas for mercy, zubaydah became so compliant, he would put himself in to position to be water boarded when his interrogator raised his eyebrow and snapped his fingers twice. He used to represent zubaydah and this seems like a broken human being. Is that the man you represented . Is there anyone there left to charge or run through a legal process. I have to be somewhat cautious around client sensitivities. But i can say heel e he and other torture survivors who work with suffer the prediblgtble consequences which is to shatter people, to break them. Rectal hydration which is a form of adepreggressive sexual assault. This term ive encountered before in my life. It sounds like forest feeding down the tube. Its simply a means of degrading somehow. Clearly. That is the point of this Interrogation Program. Its so many of these brutal, stay e sadistic, torture techniques. People watching this saying these people are associated with people who murdered three e 3,000 americans. And whether it was wrong or not, im going not going to sit here and feel a whole lot of sympathy for your clients. I dont necessarily ask them to have sympathy for our clients. I expect them to have sympathy for a democracy and torture is the an tithesis of what democracies do. Thats why torture has been banned universally for dozens of years. And, yet, its surprisingly popular have the torturers in some senses won the last 13 years . I hope not. This is a longwaiting process. But they will come. These two men are still in getmo, correct . Yes. How long will they be there . Well, zuba yurksydah is a de d detainee person in that cat goir who the goeft thinks is too dangerous to release. Well, theyve tried, but they tortured him. Yes, in some sense. So, in some dark place, he 345i have to leave in a blax box. We also have someone who is on the other side of this who worked in the Interrogation Program, wrote a book about it. Glen carl joins me now. Glen, can we start with the black sites that are part, a huge part of this. These are spread across the world, some in afghanistan, some in poland. Can you walk me through what is a black site . Is it in a basement . Whats it like . Sure, ill tell you. But i wouldnt say im only the other side of this. Im on the same side, i believe, as gentlemen, and you who are just speaking. A black site is a secret facility that black is a term of art in the c. I. A. Which means clandestine. Unknown, unannounced secret. So a black site is a secret site so that no one would know where they were. And you were asked you were given a detainee and told earlier in the days in this program that he was an alqaida person and you need to get what you could out of him and you were told that you could use torture. Well, the word torture is never used. People are careful. I could never bring myself to use i was stunned from the first seconds. We heard president bush quote\ed on your segment a few minutes ago, the government decided what one can do and said this is not torture. But if you define something as you want it, then you can call it what you will. And thats what happens. So no one ever used officially and formal, professional conversations that i heard the word torture. But they did use enhanced interrogation techniques. Oh e. Oh, yeah, sure. And there was no question, to me, and i think to many of my colleagues what this was. Sure. You resisted. You said im not going to do this. What was your what were colleagues saying. Im so fascinated reading this report. You cant pull down the front line operators and ajents who are working in this . E. What are people saying to each other . Are you getting drinks late at night. I think you will always have a range of views in any institutions. All of the above, what youve described. In general, the culture is we have given the assignment of a quasi military culture. Its not a debating soe ining s where you say what about this, what about that. Discussion to debate arguments on how to Say Something or whether it should be done once its prepared. Then theres little discussion. If you challenge Something Like that, youre viewed as insubordinainsu insubordinate. I was told a number of times i was discussing religious issues which are quiet relevant as we are the infidel to the jihadist. I was discussing theology and i was told, listen, we rbt e arent engaging in ecology. Thats sort of shaping the culture of discussion or lack there of. Theres so mume reports that this sbt e isnt working. And theyre just goating the message. Keep pressing. Oh,well, i was involved in an infill nit number of surreal moments. One spechx one. This actually happened. This sounds unbelievable. Its like a skit, but its not funny in the least. I was told to ask a certain question. So i did. And the answer was essentially, by the fellow, i dont know. My assessment was that he was being truthful. He said he doesnt know. My assessment was that hes being truthful. The response from headquarters was the fact that he has not answered the question proves that he is withholding information and or lying. Therefore, we must press him hard, which is completely insane. And i thought i was dealing with an idiot. I found out that was actually formal instructions guided from the white house. Thank you, sir. 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Wow nice and get 150 credit when you switch to verizon. I want to show you part of a journal entry that reads as follows. Who said that and what it has to do with the Darren Willson grand jury ahead. I make a lot of purchases for my business. And i get a lot in return with ink plus from chase. Like 50,000 bonus points when i spent 5,000 in the first 3 months after i opened my account. And i earn 5 times the rewards on internet, phone services and at Office Supply stores. With ink plus i can choose how to redeem my points. Travel, gift cards, even cash back. And my rewards points wont expire. So you can make owning a business even more rewarding. Ink from chase. So you can. The use and abuse of testimony if the Darren Wilson grand jury. Witness number 40 says that Michael Brown charged Darren Wilson like a Football Player. Witness number 40, whose account was picked apart and seemingly discredited by them . Why was witness number 40 allowed to testify during the grand jury. Next. 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One wnitness described it as charging at officer wilson like a Football Player with his head down. Dont charge him with a foo ballplayer with your head down. One of the thou sapsands of s is of a particular witness of mike brown when he charmgs like a Football Player towards officer wilson. Its a detailed acount thats described in a piece of evidence called witness 40 journal entry. The cop just stood there and dang if that kid didnt start running at the officer like a Football Player, head down. Its showing you how abnormal, how strange, this whole process was. There that same journal entry, heres how she described found herself on august 9th, saturday, 8 00 a. M. Im going to take my random drive. Need to understand the black race better so i stop calling blacks n word and start calling them people. Rjt. We blacked out part of the n word in that graphic we just showed you but it was clearly written. Witness 40 woke up on august 9th and decided that on that, of all morning, reason e randomly will dri drive to a black neighborhood. She tells a story that basically backs up the idea of aufrgs wilson and use of force. On october 22nd the f. B. I. Conducted an 1 38 interview in which the questioners performed t turned out to be a methodical kperpt of her account. M question others suggest to her she seems to use internet acounts. They cited to her problems with her own questions. It leaves you thinking it is possible this woman wasnt everyone there that day. And heres the kicker. That whole hour thirty eight minute imvest gags was played for the jury. That is how witness 40 journal entry also mades its way into evidence. It looks a lot like someone asserting zero Quality Control and leaving the grand jury drowning under a sea of conflicting information. It happens to take into account that bolsters officer Darren Wilson. Witness number 40. The big kid turned around, had his arms out with an attitude. Thes just stood there. Dama dang, in if that kid didnt start running at the cop like a Football Player with his head down. Youve read this. Youve read the testimony. Do you even think, as a lawyer, what do you think of this testimony . Well, the weirdest thing was the first thing in the journal entry. I dont know about you, but just the facts, forget the dissection. It didnt sound like any journal entry id ever seen or heard of. Theyre refleblgted. Its no, oh, i felt this way or no, i felt that way. No commentary at all. It was like i saw x. Then its, like, crazy. And you silt there and you read this, this just does not even have the vaguest sense of truth. This is how we get to the whole process. At one level, yea e yes. He gave them the evidence. He had this one to testify. He played interrogation that seem to completely knock her story aside. Why not just save everyone the time . He obviously did not exercise any judgment what so ever. Thats the answer. Its one thing to use judgment without mentioning all the things that undermine her and throw it up on the news. Its another thing to just sort of go oh, here you go. You decide. The point is, judgments about credibility, the kinds of judgements, prosecutors are making all of the time. You dont just say hey, this person came into our office. They had a scrap of paper. We any they might be crazy. But were going to show it to you. One of the reasons i think that ferguson took off the way it did is precisely because it was emblematic of a much bigger problem. Black men being shot by cops all over the place. And thats often justifiable circumstances. At the same time, its completely bizarre. And thats the road we trod to get here. It seems to be an essentially invebt e vented account. It sounds to me you could say i was there, all right, come on in. To be witness 41. Woere committed to giving you all the evidence. Former public defender david feiga, thank you for being here. Over the past few weeks, it makes me wonder if we really are a nation of laws. My thoughts, next. Music, and 6 hf video playing. singing and five golden rings ha, i see what you did. singing four calling birds. Three french hens. the guys starts to fizzle out two. Turtle. Doves. I really went for it there ya you did. You really, really did now get 3 gigs of data on one line for 65 a month. Switch to at t, buy a new smartphone and get 150 credit per line. They take us to worlds full of heroes and titans. For respawn, building the best Interactive Entertainment begins with the cloud. This is titanfall, the first multiplayer game built and run on microsoft azure. Empowering gamers around the world to interact in ways they never thought possible. This cloud turns data into excitement. This is the microsoft cloud. Here we go, here we go, here we go. Fifty omaha set hut losing feeling in my toes nothing beats that new car smell chicken parm you taste so good nationwide is on your side mmm mmm mmm mm mmm mm mmmmmm first and foremost, we are a nation built on law. We are a nation of laws and we must enforce our laws. We are also a nation of laws. America is a nation of laws, which means i, as the president , am obligated to enforce the law. Were a nation of law, a nation of civil right. When praising our country, president s love to invoke that we are a nation of law. John adams appears in the constitution that he helped right. It refers to a government of laws and not of men. I mean, for example, e just a minute, the current military regime, just oversaw the reversal of former dictators conviction for the murder of 00 dleds of protesters and in proceedings that are all legal in some narrow, technical sense, but were widely viewed has an out right chant. And itss safe to say no americans are russianing to call e jipt a model for the rule of law. Apply them equally. A nation of laws is one where the law acts as a great equalizer by restraining those in power. And ensuring that etch the most marginalized societies can get a fair shake in court. Sure, the u. S. Is flawed and places where justice is miscarried, but fundamentally, the u. S. Really is a nation of laws. I have to say tgs git is gettin harder and harder to hold onto that faith. And then, last week, we all watched as a Police Officer who put a man in a choke hold, diemt, no charges what so ever. We dont even know if hes going to be fired. Today, we have 600 pages documenting the torture carried out and authorized by a wide viert of officials, up to and including the president and the vice pet. Documenting activities that are, on their face, out laws torture specifically mentioning acts committed outside the u. S. By a u. S. National. No one will face prosecution for those crimes. Michael vick didnt do to dogs what many of them faced. It ask not depend on whether people committing the crime is depending on whos doipg it. Can ye choke a man to death . It depends on whos doing it. Can you anally rape someone with a tube and threaten to rape his mother all without legal consequence . Well, you see, it depends obama who on whos doing it. One of the authors for this entire, sick chapter currently serves as a federal judge reasonedering interpretations on the law. Does that sound like a nation of laws . Or does it sound more like the cynical maturization. If you want to defend torture, by all means, go ahead. But, please, im begging you, spare me any sermons about the law ever, ever again. That is all in for this evening. Good evening, chris. Thank you, my friend. And thanks to you at home for joining us at this hour. Ten weeks before barack obama was elected president of the United States, 2000 e8, 10 weeks before that, this man died. His name was urie nosenko. I apologize this is an old and really great picture of him. There arent many great pictures of him. Thats because he lived a deliberately mysterious life. He had been a spy, a kgb agent. But when