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i don't disagree with what's being said, but i think there are other remedies. you talk about student debt. student debt reform should be a major priority. when you look at what's charged for a student loan, 10% in a 2% world -- when i was in college, i paid 7% when interest rates were 20%. there should be debt renegotiation for sure. they should be able to refinance. there should be some principal forgiveness. we should work on that -- >> hold on a second. i'm not going to let you get off student debt because i kind of do this for a living, too. when i went to college, you know -- and i'm not going to say when i graduated, but i graduated in the '90s -- >> i graduated in the '80s. >> it was $22,000 a year. our children, our youngest is in college now. it's $64,000 a year. >> wow. it's more than that. >> you know, we're blessed to be able to help our child go to college. >> yes. >> but if you're talking about student debt, it's not about renegotiating the interest rate people are paying. why in the world is a college education three times what i paid for it? what about the idea of making

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