0 >> mccormick? >> jeffries. chu? >> jeffries. >> cicilline? >> very proudly, hakeem hakeem jeffries. >> mccarthy. clark of massachusetts? >> hakeem jeffries. >> jeffries. clarke of new york? >> the bad, brilliant brotha from brooklyn. [laughter] >> jeffries. cleaver? >> hakeem jeffries. >> jeffries. cline? >> kevin mccarthy. >> mccarthy. >> cliburn. >> jeffries. >> clyde. biggs. cohen >> [indistinct] hakeem jeffries! >> jeffries! [applause] >> cole. carthy. >> collins... mccarthy. comer... mccarthy. connelly -- jeffries. corea. jeffries. klosta. jeffries. courtney. jeffries. craig. hakeem jeffries. >> crane. biggs. crawford... mccarthy. crenshaw... mccarthy. crockett... jeffries. crow... >> jeffries. >> wuewar. jeffries. >> curtis. mccarthy. >> davis of kansas. jeffries. davidson... mccarthy. davis of illinois -- jeffries. davis of north carolina -- jeffries. dean of pennsylvania -- jef jeffries. duggett -- jeffries. >> deloro jeffries. >> jeffries. the lucio, jeffries. desonjia. mccarthy. the esposito -- kevin mcca mccarthy. mccarthy. >> finkel. >> hakeem jeffries. >> jeffries. >> delegate, jeffries. >> donald's. mccarthy. duarte -- kevin mccarthy. >> duncan, mccarthy. >> dunn of florida -- mcca mccarthy. edwards. >> mccarthy. mccarthy. emmer -- mccarthy. escobar -- jeffries. eshoo -- jeffries. -- >> don't know, now we know. jeffries. estes -- mccarthy. evans -- jeffries. -- kevin mccarthy. violent. >> mccarthy. feenstra -- mccarthy ferguson -- mccarthy finstad -- mccarthy fischbach -- mccarthy fitzgerald -- mccarthy fitzpatrick -- mccarthy. fleischmann -- kevin mccarthy. fletcher -- jeffries. flood -- mccarthy. foster -- jeffries. foxx -- kevin mccarthy. lois frankel -- jeffries. see scott franklin -- mcca mccarthy. frost -- jeffries. fry -- mccarthy. fulcher -- mccarthy. gaetz -- bigs biggs. gallagher -- mccarthy. gallego -- jeffries. garamendi -- jeffries. garbarino -- jeffries. garcia -- mccarthy. robert garcia -- jeffries [applause] garcia of illinois -- jeffries. garcia of texas -- jeffries. gimenez -- mccarthy. golden of maine -- jeffries. goldman of new york -- jeffries. gomez -- jeffries. tony gonzales -- mccarthy. vicente gonzalez -- jeffries. good of virginia -- biggs. gooden of texas -- mccarthy. >> you have been watching live the capitol hill house floor where we are now and mccarthy does not have enough votes at this point to win over the house speaker. obviously looking for the majority of those voting with 218. as you can see from the screen, jeffries is leaving right now was 75 of those boats and mccarthy 72 at this moment. and zero have voted present. and the affairs on capitol hill, john, as we know this will go on. >> john: it will. it will go on for some time. it looks like he will not get the first vote because jim jordan and andy biggs called out as well. you just heard there and that means he likely won't get to a team and a first round of voting. if he doesn't, there will be a whole lot of horse training going on to see if something there is mccarthy to do to convince skeptical republicans to throw in a with him. sandra, based on the g.o.p. conference this morning from it does not sound like that is going to happen. >> sandra: a big question why you would take to this to vote on the house floor if you don't have the votes. so now that no canada secured the ballot, this process will repeat until the speaker is, indeed, elected and notable chad chad pergram will tell as moment the last time it took multiple ballots was in 1923. let's get to chad pergram sr. congressional correspondent, chad, what are we seeing and hearing there lives on capitol hill? >> right now kevin mccarthy does not have the votes. the more members who cast ballots for someone finding other than kevin mccarthy that is worse for kevin mccarthy. right now we have five votes for andy biggs. we have three votes for the person's here jim banks of indiana, jim jordan and another person getting the vote as well. so the more votes that have a mccarthy does not get my name and someone doesn't vote present, that is bad news for him here that is why early on in the vote we know this is going to go 22nd ballot for the first time as you say and 100 years. the reason why they are going through this vote right now, it is the first order of vote in the house of representatives once they determine a quorum and everybody into the chamber for the first vote at noon they have a speaker. the first order of business and a new congress is electing a speaker. that is why the house is frozen, paralyzed until it gets a speaker you cannot vote on legislation and you can't put people on committees and you can't start investigation and the hunter biden's laptop, none of that. they can't swear the members and cured right now all of these people you see sitting on the house floor are technically representatives elect. they are not sworn in. the speaker will swear them and once i get a speaker. i'm told these positions among republicans are hardening right now. the opponents after a very intense feisty meeting this morning that it got worse for kevin mccarthy peer that is where several sources tell me this could take a few days. >> john: chad, what are the possible outcomes then? if mccarthy can't get to 218 in the first or second vote? it could potentially start to bring in other candidates. the hard-line opponents of kevin mccarthy. you are saying there is a mystery candidate out there that we might bring in. people are thinking, who could that potentially be? we should point out the rules state they don't have to be sitting member of congress or even a member of congress elect to become the speaker. there has been some talk that somebody might try to nominate former president trump for speaker. >> we heard that talk a year and a half ago but i tell you if kevin mccarthy doesn't have the vote for the speaker, donald trump doesn't have the vote for speaker. jordan and the two names during the hallway is tom cole republican of oklahoma and patrick mchenry in line to be the chair of the financial services committee is the republican from north carolina. but again, you have to go through a lot of votes and break a lot of furniture and glassware in the u.s. capital before you get to that. maybe steve scalise can get to the magic number. again, it doesn't have to be to a team. we elected three speakers newt gingrich, john boehner and also nancy pelosi. but fewer than 218 votes but if everybody votes for somebody by name, 434 total number of house right now based on that quorum call it is in fact 218. you might have people get sick and have travel plans and a republican elect on that side of the aisle. one had a baby a couple of days ago so you don't know who will be here. you try to get 434 people in the same room at the same time. but again, it is going to be hard to have somebody get more votes than kevin mccarthy peer that is where if this drags on for several days, that is where people start to say there is a coalition candidate out there that some democrats and some republicans could support. but that is still unclear appear that is a long way away from this pier that is why i don't see this much chaos on capitol hill in a long time. a lot of times, you can go up to senior members and say, "what will happen?" and they will give you one scenario or another scenario but no one knows how this will go because we have not seen this in 100 years. i will give you two nightmare scenarios, it took two weeks in 1849 to elect a speaker of the house. and it took two months in 1856. the house was paralyzed that entire time. >> sandra: chad, "the new york times" in their right up this morning made the prediction of this could prompt chaos, not seen at the house floor and a sentry. noting what you just said there that every speaker since 1923 has been able to quench the devil after one vote. so now this process continues. the success of votes whether another nominate able to secure the supporters to prevail. so set this up for us. what are the coming days and weeks look like for this? >> we are kind of into uncharted territory. kevin mccarthy seems pretty steel in his resolve he will continue to ask for votes here. the rule is and this to cheryl johnson the clerk of the house the old clerk one of the house that presides over the house until they get a speaker. you will see her up there a lot the next few days because kevin mccarthy and his allies will continue to say, "we want to wear these guys down. holmes a syndrome day after nigt and they agree with her captors." that could backfire and people get more in their resolve and oppose kevin mccarthy. some people have said to me the past 24 hours or so, this demonstrates kevin mccarthy is not ready to be speaker because if he was ready to be speaker he would have this nailed down a long time ago. keep in mind in the fall of 2015, kevin mccarthy was the majority leader. john boehner decided to resign as speaker. without for several days kevin mccarthy was the odds-on favorite and this would be complete. he did not have the vote and it comes down to the math. the high watermark was about 219, which is one over what you need. i was told his number was actually lower in the hundreds. what we might be sitting on the house for is a fight that did not occur in 2015 that was delayed for seven years. perhaps kevin mccarthy is just never going to be the speaker of the house. >> john: you know, chad you talked about a couple of nightmare scenarios in the amount of time it might take to get this done. but is there a potential nightmare scenario for the republicans here? people voting for the president and instead of voting for a candidate and potential attrition that the democrats actually get to the magic number and the republicans don't? >> you come in that case you would have to have people who are away and you would have to say people vote present in the democrats come in at 212. this will be the math at some point year. so, if that number 212 is more than half of what the whole house of representatives is in the democrats all stick together and you don't have attrition there there is a coalition that forms from democrats, republicans and this goes on for several days. you could certainly see hakeem jeffries getting the vote. that is unlikely to happen. but this is where you talk to some of the more moderate republicans, they say if not kevin mccarthy, it is not going to be in a sitting republican. this is where you bring up former president trump or maybe another person who we have not heard from, colin powell used to get votes for speaker as a protest. jeff sessions when he was a senator from alabama, rand paul the senator from kentucky, david walker the comptroller of the currency. a couple of names bounced over the past few weeks is now former members as of about an hour ago, lee zeldin a republican of new york. fred upton republican of michigan, they are now former members, they are moderates. you might see a scenario where democrats say, "look we need to get on with the business of governing. we've been through x number of votes with mccarthy. it will never have been that may be a coalition candidate and they bring in a moderate person and that's never happened to have nonmember speaker of the house." there is one more safety valve for kevin mccarthy. in both of those speaker races, in 1849 and 1850, the house voted and voted and voted 133 ballots in 1856. what they finally said his look, it is obvious we can't get outright majority of the entire body to vote for the speaker appearance what they did is put forth a resolution, which was adopted by a simple majority. so democrats majority say on for the next ballot if we do not get a speaker, what we will do is lower the bar of a person with the most votes, just the person who has the most votes, which is why kevin mccarthy and what he certainly has right now, that person will be the winner peer that is how they elected speaker called in 1849 and nathaniel banks of 1856. but that was way down the road. you can see that happen in this case because it might not be a situation where the math ever works under the circumstances for kevin mccarthy. >> sandra: okay, chad program joining us live as we continue to watch the house floor on capitol hill. thank you very much, chad and we will see you shortly. ronna mcdaniel joining us now. good to have you here and thank you very much. your reaction to know new majority emerging anza health speaker vote for kevin mccarthy. >> i look at the contrast with the democrats who clearly are going to elect hakeem jeffries. the number one thing i always hear on the road, why are democrats always seem to stick together and republicans don't? the american people one has to take the reins in the house. we retired nancy pelosi. it was done in large part because of kevin mccarthy and his work. i think in a delay is a delay in the business and the work done for the american people. i will see policy differences dividing and kevin wants to tackle the border, get rid of the 87,000 irs agents. so i think has the votes continue, he will continue to bring members this way, i hope. he is the one who retired nancy pelosi purity was the minority leader and he switched it so we can have a republican speaker. you see broad support at the vast majority of member support candidates. >> john: ronna mcdaniel received 12 people have voted and if i can bring up the graphic on the screen, as of this morning we had 14 republicans who were firmly oppd to kevin mccarthy as speaker or certainly leading in that direction. we bring that graphic up so we can get a look at the 14 who were either skeptical of or outright opposed to kevin mccarthy asked speaker. congressman dan crenshaw was on "fox & friends" this morning and doing what they are doing plays in the democrats hands. listen to how he put it. >> i didn't know any better it's like the democrats paid these people off. let's pay them off and make it look like the republicans can't govern and don't deserve any gavels whatsoever. that is what it makes it look like. and their demands are foolish. their demands are inside baseball procedural issues. >> john: speak to that, if you were to come as before with the count 127 for mccarthy, 12 voting for jim jordan and andy biggs and other folks. the opponents of mccarthy really can't articulate what it is that they want here. and in doing this, what are they doing to the republican party? >> i am in michigan right now and i was talking to somebody who said this makes the party look bad. we elected republicans to take over the house and why can't you guys unified qwest market is division for division's sake and i'm not saying policy separation. mccarthy is certainly not a murderer moderate. he raised the money and recruited the candidates elected not just in 2022 but also in 2020. so i will say this, we have a big task ahead of us in 2024 to take back the white house, the senate map gets infinitely better and we have to get the house. everyday we are delaying the agenda and the american people elected republicans to govern with is a day that we are not getting the work done for the american people. and it is five, ten, the vast majority of the member support cap and appear there are ten who don't. i hope they come around because we have to unify. we have to unify. this is the biggest message coming out of the midterm. if you look at the split tickets, the states where republicans refuse to vote other republicans, in large part, that is why we didn't get the winds we wanted in this election because of republican and republican infighting's tearing into the speaker and this is something disheartening and not people bringing to the party but a vision of positivity and attentive getting things done for the american people if we will continue to get elected in these next elections. we need to elect a speaker. >> sandra: before the freedom caucus in recent days have indicated over the last few days but after this first vote, which is going to conclude shortly, that they would nominate a new candidate that they would hope republicans could support. could you add any color to that on what we should do? >> you know, i don't know who that would be, sandra. the reality kevin has a huge group of republican congress people who support him who are not going to move. they will not vote for any other candidate. when he is at, what, 200 votes for him and maybe ten, 12 that are differing? the majority will stick with gavin. i don't think they are budging. this could go into multiple votes. why are they with kevin? he was the one traveling the country purity was the one raising millions of millions of dollars. he is the one that secured republican majority in the house. i think a lot of us did that together. he is the one who did the work. i think a lot of these members are very, very loyal to him on top of the fact he will be a bold leader as speaker. he will do the things that republican voters want to republican leadership to do. >> john: you know, ronna, i mentioned all of these opponents and kevin mccarthy can't articulate what they want. we had on fox, "fox & friends" this morning chrissy said we can't keep doing things the way we have been doing them and without pointing to specific details they have some details. one of the things is they want the threshold to vacate the chair that is to bring to a vote to change the speaker to a threshold of one member of congress, mccarthy offered five down from 50% of the caucus. when you take a look at demands like that, do they seem reasonable to you? or is this as democrats, don't crenshaw put it a self of grand eyes met? >> i agree with dampier this is not something the american people care about right now. we are dealing with our kids having deficits after the pandemic. we have a border crisis. we have recession and massive layoffs happening across the country. we still have an energy issue with gas prices being high. the people in the country right now are looking at this and saying, what is going on? why can't this party get it together and unify so we can hold biden accountable? remember, republicans, we have so much more common than what is dividing us right now. if we can't come together and take on the biden administration, the people who elected us or being let down. that is what they are seeing right now because of these holdouts refusing to elect a speaker of the house for the first time in 100 years. i think we need to come together and unify, we need to unify and our opposition to the democrats. right now, this is not helping our party. >> sandra: ronna, going back to the last question who can merchant the last few days the freedom caucus indicating that they would nominate a new candidate. are you right now rejecting the idea that anyone other than mccarthy can move republicans in this new congress? >> i just don't see movement from the mccarthy camp. i don't see many members who are going to abandon kevin like these five holdouts or the five saying we won't vote for kevin, there is a lot more people saying it's only got to be kevin. i don't see any movement right now. obviously this will go into multiple votes. but everybody needs to remember, the american people just retired nancy pelosi and elected republicans to lead the house of representatives. and every day we are delaying, we are letting down those voters. this is what we need to be focused on the voters and the people who just retired nancy pelosi and put republicans in charge. >> john: so ronna, the fact the vote is going the way it is would seem to be an indication that this is not about for somebody else. this is a vote against mccarthy. and that if mccarthy were to continue to stay in the race, he will never make it to speaker. you know, chad pergram was talking about going back to examples of 1849 and 1856 to describe where we are in 2023. is there a potential consistent ohmic consensus candidate out there steve scalise, lee zeldin, somebody out there like that who can get the votes necessary to become speaker? >> i've been getting a history lesson of watching your show and i didn't know about 1856 that vote that lower the threshold. i think we are in for a long run. i don't see many of these members -- because i've been with them and i campaigned with kevin. you look like one cisco money or leslie hunt and kevin recruited and got over the finish line. look at california, ken calvert, mike garcia, these are pickups that we got out of kevin mccarthy's leadership. i don't think any of them will budge. no there is a focus on these holdouts against kevin but the met, vast majority are strongly supporting kevin. >> john: but it is the holdouts preventing him from becoming speaker, not the people supporting him. if they don't change, he's toast. >> i'm hopeful that they will change. i'm hopeful they will listen to the american people who said, "we want a republican speaker. please give us that. find a way to repair your differences and division you have and solve it and let's unite and remember what we are here to do, which is take on the biden administration." >> sandra: who is going to do that, ronna? who will unite the party? why is your party at this point today? >> you know, i think the vast majority of the party is united. you see these few holdouts. so i think kevin is going to continue to have discussions and work with these members. i think you will see other members like jim jordan and others talk to these other members and say, "let's come together because right now we need the american public to know we can govern." as you have multiple votes, you will see more and more people come over. i'm hopeful that happens. i think that is what should happen. i know that is what the voters want, they want us to start governing. >> john: ronna let me finish up by putting out, this is not a new problem in the republican party when they have control of congress. they are years passed and not-too-distant past where bills were brought to the floor by john boehner and failed. and nancy pelosi role, never bring a bill to the floor unless you know you've got the votes to pass it. so this is something that didn't just happen. this has been going on for years where at the same time the democrats, as you pointed out, operating in lockstep with each other not just in the house, but the house together with the senate. pelosi and schumer always on the same page. until republicans start to function like that, can you ever expect to effectively govern? >> no. i think we have to start working together. i look at states like arizona right now. arizona, the top and the whole state was a republican. she got 1.375000 million votes and the other republicans running in that state who didn't vote for them, republicans. if we are so hateful towards each other and other republicans won't vote for us, we are doing exactly what the democrats want, right? the scorched earth i will take on every other republican instead of focusing on who voters one is to focus on which are the democrats. the democrats are leaving the border open. they are the ones that kept our kids out of school. they have allowed time to run rampant in the streets. that is the democrat party. as long as we are fighting each other, we are not keeping our eye on the price. we have to get the speaker ship settled and go forward if we will be successful in 2024 as a united party. right now, this exemplifies exactly what the democrats want to see from our party. >> sandra: ronna mcdaniel joining us during live breaking news we are covering on capitol hill at this hour. ronna, thank you for joining us. >> thank you for having me. >> sandra: fox news contributor reporter for axios, live on capitol hill. >> this is not a good start with the bid for kevin mccarthy for speakership. we have seen as the count is still still going on 18 republicans voting against kevin mccarthy so far. that is on the high end of the expectations for the republican conference. then to my eye my was surprised the view the republican lawmakers who voted against mccarthy. one of them eli crane arizona republican who helped mccarthy to get elected. and spent $1 million to boost his campaign in a very close race. he voted for andy biggs for this first round of balloting. so i expect some republicans to not be on the mccarthy bandwagon, but it looks like closer to 20 republicans. that makes it really hard for even on the second ballot, the third ballot as the day goes on. it will be hard for mccarthy. in order for mccarthy to get 218 votes. >> john: josh, let me propose this to you. we knew early on that mccarthy wasn't going to make it in the first ballot. how many of these votes for jordan and banks and andy biggs that are being registered now are basically first-round protest votes that could change in the second round? what i'm getting to here is a lot of these members are voicing displeasure knowing mccarthy won't get to 218 in the first ballot? but when push goes to show if they will vote for him and hard opponents they get down to the point where he gets enough to be speaker? >> yes. and out of the to undoubtedly they want to send a message to leadership. but the problem is by sending this message and by potentially having representative jeffries leading the first round of balloting for the speakership, it is making kevin mccarthy look weak. this is not accomplishing the mission of sending the message and getting the message across the leadership with kevin mccarthy and the conference. because it will make it tougher, i think, to get 218 votes in the scope so far. so i understand there are republicans who might have voted for mccarthy if it just meant, you know that he was going to win on a second ballot. i'm not sure 19 or so if you end up voting for mccarthy again. i think the depth that we are learning is quite deep. it will be hard to put humpty dumpty back together, at least in the near future. >> sandra: mccarthy went into this pretty much knowing the outcome we are seeing right now to some degree would be the case. now, we know this process will repeat until he speaker is elected. do you expect there will be for conversations behind closed doors saying that tally we are right now and perhaps the name put forward? >> i heard you talk to ronna mcdaniel about the possibility of consensus alternative, somebody like steve scalise. i think that is a very distinct possibility, but there are a lot involved before we get to that point. steve scalise is not a candidate but loyal mccarthy supporter. there is more good will for steve's police and a little bit more trust even amongst mccarthy retractors. steve scalise though, it would make a lot of sense if kevin mccarthy can't get the votes for someone to emerge as a viable member. but we are not at that point and there's a lot to come. but i will say, again, mccarthy number and short of even what he was expecting a lot of his allies were expecting going into the first ballot. >> john: so, if this is an indication of the hard-liners are firm enough they will force some sort of consensus building process around a third candidate and mccarthy doesn't get the speakership, that is going to look bad enough, but josh, he started moving into the speaker's office. if he doesn't make it, he has to move out. >> i mean, mccarthy has had dreams of being speaker. he's been at the one-yard line of becoming speaker. and it is so close, yet, those ten or so votes away from getting that goal, that accomplishment. again, i think -- look to either wait and if you are a mccarthy supporter, i wonder if even all the concessions mccarthy has had to make an orderly to become speaker at some point, hey, if you don't have the vote we basically don't want you to win at all cost. and it will be -- it might not be good for the party and i might not be good for health leadership. that would be the moment where there could be some changing strategies to change forces. but we are not at that point yet. i think mccarthy out of goodwill, the vast majority of republican vote for him. but 20 defectors is a large number. and if enough come all you need her for cope republicans to say they will not vote for kevin mccarthy under any circumstances. there is only 4 of 20 to dig in and it will be a long night. if they force to come up with plan b. >> john: you notice he has 1 foot in the end zone, but the bulk is still not broken. wow! >> very close, so close right now, very, very far away. >> sandra: josh, thank you for joining us. we have some more news coming to us from the capital right now by the way, chad pergram is putting out a vote noting obviously disclosed through second ballot for the first time since 1923, noting as you can see on the screen, more g.o.p.-yours voting against mccarthy than expected. and i'm also going to get another update year, chad pergram joining us right now and jump in and tell us what we need to know at this point. >> sandra, what is significant is we saw the mic that we might these five, six, seven, eight votes but 19 votes right now for someone else by name. that is a little bit higher than we anticipated. and then also underscores the depth of the problem kevin mccarthy faces today or perhaps in the coming days. he has never been able to move that made her over the past couple of months. there were more than 30 members of the republican conference who voted against him in november. that vote doesn't count. this is the nomination and the house republican conference. he was never able to significantly close the gap since after the election. this is why having neural majority in the house of representatives is such a poem for kevin mccarthy. 40, 50 seat majority, which is what we thought he might have where at least some republicans predicted that he would be a much better shape. one thing i want to direct your attention to, leadership relationships are not partisan politics but what we call on capitol hill decided at the political level. that is why it is very hard sometimes to determine who is going to get into leadership. for years, there were several people lined up behind house speaker nancy pelosi including steny hoyer, that then majority leader, who we thought might move in to succeed at some point. we thought chris van hollen might do that. we thought that someone like emmanuel would do that but it never happened and pulls he was the leader of the party. we thought kevin mccarthy was a stomach supposed to succeed john boehner in 2015 but that didn't happen. paul ryan who said he didn't want the job two weeks later became speaker of the house. so this is when i'm talking about when you start racing all these political particles together and supercollider it is hard to figure out who will be in the leadership politics. this is where kevin mccarthy has the most votes or he will among the republican conference here but might not become speaker. this is where you talk about steve scalise where an outside process this is thesis of politics and i've seen this happen over and over and over again leadership elections. remember, it was not that long supposed to be john painter successor and he lost his primary. this seems to happen over and over again. and never quite know who's going to be in the leadership until it is a done deal. the other thing that is significant here, nancy pelosi the outgoing speaker of the house a speaker of the house now, that she always knew exactly how many votes were there. kevin mccarthy was never known whether the web for majority leader for being a good vote counter. nancy pelosi could vote the votes down to the end and i think when you look at the school board right now 19 republican members voted against him and people thought this was going to go to a second ballot anyway, but without that number would be a lot lower, is kevin mccarthy has not been able to whip his conference to support him here that is a major disconnect and that shows this chasm that starts at the beginning of the 118th congress and we get to passing bills. how are they going to keep the government open and say september or the end of september when the government next needs funding? how will they vote to get something out of committee? vote to impeach alejandra may work us which is something they suggested, the dhs secretary. how do they deal with the debt ceiling? they can't pass all these other big bills or resolutions or high-minded ideas that they have. this is a rough start, the roughest start for any majority in recent house. >> john: the opponents of kevin mccarthy are handing tough. andy biggs said it is clear our party deserves a new leader. mccarthy should stand down and allow us to select somebody else in the next ballot. the 19 others are there on the screen. the others voted for, ten votes for andy biggs, six for jim jordan, one for jim banks. one for lee zeldin and one for congressman byron donalds of florida. it is interesting that we talk about steve scalise, chad as consensus candidate if mccarthy can't make it. he hasn't received any other votes at this point. you know, the name lee zeldin potentially somebody how republicans can rally. but i mean come up where we are in this process as you pointed out, chad, this will go on for a long time. >> john may think that is the issue here. when they talk about steve scalise here, he has not put his name out there. he has tried publicly to be a good soldier dealing with kevin mccarthy supporting him. there was a point in time not that long ago there was a little bit of a rivalry there. steve scalise got a lot of political energy after he came out to pretty good health after the baseball practice shooting in june 2017 here or there were some people who thought steve scalise might have missed his moment politically at that stage because he was extremely popular at that point. but right now, it is hard to see how kevin mccarthy ever brings this together. again, i come back to this i don't think he's move the meter in the past few days the situation appears to have gotten worse. this is where we might get some unexpected things happening. the republicans keep saying, oh, we couldn't have a democratic speaker of the house. you see that happen with oppositions and legislatures, state legislature. it happened in arkansas a few years ago the majority did not have the votes nailed down and a coalition from someplace else. this happens in our limit all the time. european element. that is something we don't have in house of representatives and the nature for the second ballot for the first time in 100 years. >> sandra: i want to recap what we are seeing on the house floor right now. noting the tally he provided us, when you see the others on the screen below mccarthy and jeffries, you have andy biggs, jordan, lee zeldin, byron donalds noting that the vote on the first ballot is open until the last vote is cast. there were ten for andy biggs, six for jordan, one for banks, one for lee zeldin and one as byron from chip roy. and we were just talking to ronna mcdaniel a moment ago who suggested there was a small amount that would show up against mccarthy here, but that number is clearly bigger than she and many were anticipating heading into this vote today, chad. >> that is why it will be interesting to see how kevin mccarthy after the first vote if you take two or three votes start to get the same result later tonight, tomorrow or show up on friday morning and it is the same thing. again, you are not living the envelope to some degree. does kevin mccarthy drop out? he knew he did not have the votes in the fall of 2015 after john boehner stepped aside. and just before the conference was supposed to nominate him, he and his chief of staff and others, there was meeting and john boehner said, "i don't have the votes and i will drop out." it was a big shock to everyone in capitol hill. kevin mccarthy and everybody has put on a good face. i asked him if he was going to drop out and he said "no." he reminded everybody he had the longest floor speech and health history. he said he might have the most votes for speaker before this is all over. again, i keep coming back to 1856 model where they took 133 votes and 132 more after this one, we have to get there. we would be hard-pressed to see how much longer they could let this go on. again, frankly, it looked at the beginning of the week that this was, in fact, going to take a few days. the 19 higher number than when anticipated that when you talk to everybody on capitol hill, everybody thought, yeah, we will be here wednesday, thursday, friday, maybe the week next week in the realm of that second come along for speaker's race, which is what happened in 1849. >> sandra: chad pergram with us on the breaking news there on the house floor as the vote concludes. chad, thank you very much and we will see you shortly. >> john: thanks, chad. ronna mcdaniel is still with us and she is back now. when you look at what andy biggs tweeted, ronna, let me repeat it again, "my colleague made clear we deserve a new leader and should stand down and select someone to make someone else in the next ballot. we have 19 republicans who voted for others, kevin mccarthy, some of that might be sort of jumping on the bandwagon for now and voicing opposition but a few of those votes can change. by the a hardened position among a core group of republicans here who are sagging, "nope, it will not be kevin mccarthy." if they hang in, what do you do? >> yeah, then you have this other side, right, 199 voting for kevin. that is obviously where the vast majority of the members are. so, i think they have to get together. they have got to talk to each other and find out what is dividing them? what are the things that you need to bring this together to get a republican speaker elected into the business of the american people? if you look at the math, kevin has by far the most support of anyone. we will see if any of those 19 move over to him as they have discussions in between votes. b1 184, actually. >> sorry. >> john: math was never my strong point. >> mine either. >> sandra: ronna in new tweet from freedom house caucus chair scott perry, republican from pennsylvania. he sent out a tweet a few minutes ago. and obviously, members of the freedom caucus have been instrumental in trying to block mccarthy's leadership. what he tweeted is this, in good faith over the summer i tried to start the conversation with g.o.p. leader kevin mccarthy and respectfully and repeatedlye longer he waited to engage in the speaker race, the more support he would lose and here we are." so ronna, what do you say to people who see that and see where republicans are today on this house floor? and the optics of this make it look like republicans didn't get their homework done here. >> you know my had some friends texting me who aren't as politically in tune and said, what is going on? why did we just win the house and can't get a speaker? this is what average americans are seeing on tv. what is going on? they are not paying attention to the math and party infighting. i think they want to see nancy pelosi retired and i saw kevin mccarthy has the minority leader doing his job, taking back the majority. they don't understand the inside baseball. i think republicans need to come together. we need to make sure we have a speaker. we don't want to have this falter and let the democrats gain ground. everyday we are delaying, we are delaying getting the work done of the american people like getting the board are sold in the 87,000 irs agents. there was a lot of work to be done so i hope they can find common ground. like you said, john what is the issue and articulate what is the division quest market is not like kevin mccarthy is some moderate but somebody in tune with the grassroots and the american people and certainly the republican party. so, let's find that common ground and get it done and elect a speaker. >> john: you know, kevin mccarthy and others who support him are complaining this is all procedural demands that these opponents are making and that is really and you articulated at this point, that is not what the american people are looking for the republican party for is just procedure but the action on big issues. but it seems if you look at what biggs has been saying and others, this doesn't appear to be procedural? i don't want to say it's personal but they just don't think that mccarthy is the right person to be the leader. if they hang in, he will not get the votes necessary. so at some point, the republican party will have to start thinking about who can get the votes? the short list of people out there on steve scalise, lee zeldin or maybe one or two others thinking about at the moment, who could carry the day? i know -- >> i don't see -- we are talking about the 19 come i get that but what about the 100 people saying i am kevin only? are they going to budge also so? we have to have more votes and everybody should be ordering pizza. i think they will be eaten in the halls of congress and they will be sitting there a long time as they have these votes and have these discussions. i know the longer it takes, the longer it is taking us to do the business of the american people. and i will ask you this, who else raise the money and flew across the country? record of these candidates? we won back the house 2020 and won 50 seats no one expected. we were expected to lose 15 seats and we didn't lose a single incumbent seat when kevin mccarthy a minority leader and took over that job. 2022, we won back the house. tell me another member of the conference who did as much work to take back the house think of a mccarthy? and a lot of voters right now are confused about why democrats always seem to come together and hakeem jeffries is getting this, no retention and republicans continue to fight each other which puts us at a disadvantage heading into a critical 2024 election. >> sandra: so lead us off, ronna, the conversation that will be happening behind closed door to change these minds. how will it be different in the conversation i know you've had over the holidays leading to this moment. it was expected that this vote would happen. what is the conversation? how will it be different than the one you've been having the weeks leading up to this? >> obviously, i'm not in the caucus so i don't hear with the members of congress are saying to each other. they have these relationships but my guess a lot of conversations member to member, "you guys, we just took back the house of representatives and retired nancy pelosi and right now we look like we don't have our crap together and let's get a speaker and do the work of the american people ensure we are a republican party that can govern." the american people are hurting right now. they don't feel like our country is on the right track. they don't feel like biden is doing a great job here they know the borders chaos and people are being laid off. gas prices are high. you can see that in the polling. they are looking at republicans and stating, "please help us. get this done, hold them accountable and make our lives better." we delay and prevent the work of the american people from getting done. this republican and republican infighting is hurting one thing: our party in the end because the american people. >> sandra: thank you for your time here and how do you know those who cast their vote for mccarthy, how do you know they are kevin only? all of them? >> i don't know if all of them but a large portion of them are. you have heard them say that they are not getting the same attention. that is why you don't see alternate names being put forward. that is why you don't seek, you know the alternative to kevin being put forward because those names are supporting him. he has vast support among the leadership in the conference and among the members because he has worked so hard to elect them and support them year after year. remember, they are all up for election in two years and they will want someone out there campaigning and raising money and kevin has shown he can do that. it's been ronna, thank you so much for hanging with us. we appreciate it. >> sandra: thank you, ronna. >> john: arthur mccallum, we martha maccallum delaying the work of the american people. it looks like they will be delayed for a while. i mean, this is i don't want to say it is endemic mitigated disaster for kevin mccarthy but close. >> it goes back to the midterm elections and there was an expectation of reds who nominate a big red wave and ronna mcdaniel's it is exactly right when she talks about how hard the campaign across the country because he understood in order to get through the process, that he is a part of today, he had to have a large majority. he worked very hard and raised $240 million in his pack and tried to channel that money through candidates who would then support him in the end. he saw clearly that he needed big number in order to get past the house freedom caucus and these challenges. he knew then access to because they existed back in 2015 as well. so this is the day he absolutely did not want to happen. he worked hard during the midterm cycle to make sure you have the support to get past this benchmark and not to have to worry about these folks. you can see what is happening. this is blowing up in a way that he feared and that he anticipated and was not able to work around, unfortunately, for him. she is absolutely right, no one worked harder through the midterm cycle throughout that year. he went out to long island and met with jewish leadership in districts he thought would potentially swing. republican and they got up big wins places like new york. >> john: the state of arizona. >> absolutely. you cannot fault his efforts in this fight. but he seems to be coming up short at least in the first round. we hear the conversations around between people patrick mchenry and bishop from north carolina come up with the bishop has been a no vote. obviously, mchenry is an ally of mccarthy and they are trying to bring him over the finish line. they will go one by one with the individual to see if they can make this happen in the next round or several pounds after that. >> sandra: sandra here, this was ronna who joined us first as the vote was happening earlier. i will get your reaction to this. >> okay. speak with the people in the country are looking at this and stating, why do mike what is going on and why can't this party get it together to hold biden accountable? the people who elected us are being let down. that is what they see because of these holdouts refusing to elect a speaker of the house the first time in 100 years. >> that is a big statement and certainly look like this heading into this vote and the reality is actually worse than some had feared with 19 voting for others, other than mccarthy in this vote. we know, obviously, this will go into a second ballot. but martha, you are in washington and can take the temperature there. what does this look like, and where does this go next? will there be a big conversation had in washington about the direction this party is going to move in? >> you know what, most of us i was lucky to have a few days off christmas eve and new year's and you got a sense people were filling in other parts of the country. i heard the same thing ronna was hearing, and an enormous amount of republicans frustration that they were feeling about why this process has to be so ugly. you see the new york piece calling for the adults in the room to stand up and take charge. there has been frustration with the back but these individuals who are against kevin mccarthy have not been able to articulate or gain support what they are for. i think there is a large understanding on the republican side of the political fence in this country that there is a lot of people that want real reform. they want to see budgetary discipline. they want to consider things hallmarks of the party taken seriously. and i think that is an element that people across the country feel very strongly about and perhaps they feel has gotten very sloppy over the last several years. so, you have that element of it. you have a hangover from the trump presidency and the divisions that that created