Transcripts For CSPAN3 Energy Secretary Rick Perry Testifies On FY 2018 Budget Request 20170714

Good morning everyone. The committee will come to order. I apologize for the delayed start, but hopefully we will have an opportunity to hear from the secretary and learn of the president s views for the department of energy. Secretary perry, i want to welcome you to your first hearing following your bipartisan confirmation here in the senate. While it took us a little bit longer than wed hoped to get you in this role, were glad to have you at the helm. We look forward to helping you get a full compliment of folks there at the department as well. The budget request for the department of energy takes a different approach this year than weve seen in the recent past. The president has made a concerted effort to increase funding for the National Nuclear Security Administration to focus on our Nuclear Weapons program. This is a portion of the department that falls outside the scope of our committee here. The administration has also requested robust funding for the cleanup of Nuclear Waste left behind by our countrys cold war legacy. To offset those funding increases, the budget request proposes deep cuts to research and development for energy and science. It also proposes to phase out innovative programs such as arpe that have demonstrated success. I understand what drove this proposal, but im also concerned by certain parts of it. The United States is the world leader in science and energy. We like it that way. We want to keep it that way. And at the core of that excellence is the work done at our National Labs and universities by the men and women who dedicate their careers to furthering science. Members on both sides of this Committee Want to maintain and strengthen that leadership. So we need to be careful that we dont get in the way of the good work or the proper role of the private sector. But keeping that in mind, many of us have found good bipartisan opportunities where it makes sense to increase funding for r d. I appreciate the need to derive savings and balance our budget, but that cannot come at the expense of our efforts on Energy Innovation. Good science should not sit on a shelf, and the department should continue to push the limits of science in order to ensure that the next generation of Energy Technologies is developed here in this country. Although i do not support all the proposals in this budget request, i believe we do have some areas of agreement here. I also believe we can undertake reforms at the department to help save taxpayer dollars. Our work on the loan programs is a good example i think of how that can work. My goal for the department of energy is to drive down the costs of emerging precommercial technologies to make energy more affordable, reliable, clean, diverse and secure. Take you back to energy 2020, those principles havent changed. And its particularly important for alaska where energy costs are orders of magnitude above those in the lower 48. So secretary perry, again, thank you for being here this morning. I hope to be able to host you up in the state soon. I know that youve made similar commitments to colleagues in the congress here. Look forward to hearing your priorities outlined before the committee this morning. And i turn to our Ranking Member senator cantwell. Thank you, madame chair, for holding this hearing. And welcome back, mr. Secretary. The department of energy is a Global Leader in science and technology with an unrivalled network of National Laboratories. It is also key to our National Security when it comes both to nuclear and cyber threats. The president s budget proposes to slash many of the does essential programs and it would devastate emerging Clean Energy Jobs in our economy. It would kill science and innovation in the jobs that d. O. E. Supports. The budget would raise electricity rates in the Pacific Northwest, i guarantee you a number of people on this committee will not be supportive of that by auctioning off federal utility assets. The budget would undermine u. S. Energy leadership in a sector that is posed to grow millions of jobs around the world, and according to the International Energy agency more than 30 trillion will be invested in new Renewable Energy facilities and Energy Efficiency between now and 2040. So weve heard a lot about the socalled Energy Dominance from this administration. Id like to hear a lot less about exporting commodities than even nations like china are starting to have major blowback on and pledging more on how we are going to focus on winning the opportunity in Energy Efficiency, advanced technologies and things that consumers and businesses around the world are pledging commitment to. As this committee recently showed the cost of clean Energy Technologies have dropped between 41 and 94 since 2008. I was very proud to join the chair on a recent northwest trip where we saw Energy Efficiency helping businesses save dollars and also how grid microgrids in alaska are looking for every advantage they can get in driving down the cost of energy. The Success Stories have been built on decades of strategic investment by the department of energy. And this is something that both democrat and republican administrations have supported. But President Trumps budget is a break in that bipartisan tradition. Its an attempt to turn back the clock on energy policy, i think, at the expense of the future. During your confirmation hearing you committed to protecting science, protecting the men and women who conduct that science and advocating for our National Labs. So i have great concerns for a proposed cut that could affect as many as 1,000 people at the Pacific Northwest laboratory. But specifically this budget poses to eliminate rpe which is the advanced high potential high impact Energy Technologies that are too early for the private sector to either take on or advance, critically important to our nation. Eliminates the Weatherization Assistance Program and state energy program, which provides critical state assistance to 50 states to help them. Draconian cuts to the applied Energy Research program such as the 70 for the office of Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy and 48 for the office of electricity, delivery in electricity reliability. I guarantee you thats something everybody across the board here cares about. And 17 cut from the office of science, which is the largest federal sponsor of basic science and physical science. This week you questioned the certainty of Science Behind Climate Change. And during your confirmation hearing you said im going to protect all the science, whether its related to climate or whatever aspects we are going to be doing, end quote. So, mr. Secretary, with all due respect, i want to make sure you and your office has all the information you need on science. Your Budget Proposal slashing the biological and Environmental Research within the office of science, the office that supports Climate Research by 43 , and another troubling area is the important priority for d. O. E. On Energy Infrastructure. Our grid and our Energy Networks are under cyber attack from 2012 to 2016 the number reported incidents against u. S. Critical infrastructure more than doubled. And according to the Washington Post story last week, russian government hackers have already shown their interest in targeting u. S. Energy and utility systems. So this threat to our grid is clearly growing, and this morning i along with 18 of my colleagues are sending a second letter to the president reiterating that d. O. E. Should address this growing threat on our critical infrastructure. During your confirmation hearing you assured me that the committee assured me and the committee that Cyber Security would be your top two priorities, nevertheless your budget slashes by 30 . So i want to see a larger investment in this very, very critical area to our infrastructure. Id like to mention i know my colleague from washington had a chance to talk to you about hanford funding yesterday. And im credibly disappointed to see the administrations approach to the hanford cleanup in light of the recent tunnel collapse at the plutonium uranium extraction facility followed by worker take cover at the finishing plant and operations budget being cut demonstrates disregard for the health and safety of the individuals who are working in our state. The Trump Administration needs to understand that if we do not prioritize hanford funding and the potential for safety and security, we are going to have issues and serious problems. These recent incidents are a wakeup call for the administration. And thats why im working to ensure that the resources are there for the public. Now, i know that ill have probably a little sheet here somewhere of all the ideas and schemes that people have come up with in the past. We had secretary watson delay the vit Plant Construction in 1991 to reconsider the waste and pretreatment plant, for two years Clinton Administration planned operation of the plant to pay contractors, we saw secretary abramson try to accelerate cleanup by calling waste in the tanks and calling it good. We saw science experts review the vit plan. We had secretary monise explore new ways of treatment. All im saying is every Energy Secretary comes into office pressured, pressured more by some omb person who knows nothing about science trying to do cleanup on the cheap. I guarantee you it cant be done. We have to remain resolute and committed to cleaning this up and based on science. So i look forward to asking more about that. But i know that many of my colleagues throughout the Pacific Northwest both on this committee and on the Appropriations Committee will have a lot to say about our priorities for hanford. Thank you, madame chair. Thank you, senator cantwell. Secretary perry, its good to have you before the committee. I will note that allison dune is with the secretary this morning, shes the acting chief Financial Officer for d. O. E. I understand that you will not be providing testimony this morning, but thank you for being here with the secretary. And, mr. Secretary, with that if you would like to begin your remarks so that we can turn to questions. Senator, thank you. And its a privilege to be in front of you and the committee again. Senator cantwell, members of the committee, its my privilege to be here, an honor to discuss president excuse me, President Trumps fiscal year 2018 budget request. As each of you know, it is a great privilege to serve as this 14th secretary of energy. As a former legislator, i might add an appropriator as well, and the governor, i am very respectful of the budget writing process and know the importance of the work that youre undertaking. I look forward to working with you to finalize a budget that we can all be proud of and that serves the taxpayers of this country as well. In my three and a half months as secretary of energy, i have seen firsthand the impact of the departments leadership, both domestically and internationally. Ive traveled around the country, been into some of your states, and senator cantwell, i intend to get to hanford asap, most likely this summer, to look at that, to talk to the men and women who are working there, visit with those brilliant individuals that are on site that i happen to take a lot of faith in their knowledge of whats needed and how to address these issues that are driving their mission. So i look forward to being in a lot of your states over the course of the next months ahead. These labs truly are, as you have all noted either today or in previous conversations are national treasures. Theyre the future of innovation in this country. And i have been in absolute awe of the diverse scope of the departments mission and the consequential work that we are charged with undertaking. Ive also traveled overseas representing the United States at the g7 meeting in rome and then in beijing for the Clean Energy Mission innovation ministerials. I had the opportunity to visit japan and meet with leaders and stakeholders about the future of the Energy Partnership that the u. S. And japan has. And on a very somber note, i toured the site of the fukushima disaster and saw firsthand the absolute Monumental Task that they have before them. My trip to asia coincidentally began on the day that President Trump announced that we would officially withdraw the United States from the paris agreement. I delivered his message to the world that even though the u. S. Would be no longer a part of the paris agreement, we are still the leader in Clean Energy Technology and we are committed to that mission. The department of energy does many things well. America has remained on the forefront of technology for over 40 years because of the amazing men and women at these labs. Mr. Heinrich, you particularly understand this with the two you have in your state. They wake up every day knowing that they will make a real difference in the world. And i told them the first time i met with them that the greatest job i ever had was being the governor of texas. But after working here, ive come to realize that secretary of energy is officially the coolest job ive ever had, senator. Under my leadership our experts at d. O. E. Will continue their work for the benefit of every american and our allies alike. As secretary of energy, im also a member of the National Security council. This council supported by d. O. E. In its mission to keep our nation safe. President trumps fiscal year 2018 budget request for the department of Energy Provides 28 billion to advance our key missions and focuses excuse me, on important investments including ensuring the safety and effectiveness of our Nuclear Weapons arsenal, protecting our Energy Infrastructure from Cyber Attacks and other threats, achieving exscale computing and focusing the Amazing Network of our National Laboratories on Early Stage Research and development. And my goals are straightforward, advance our nations Critical Energy and scientific r d missions, strengthen our nuclear security, fulfill our Environmental Management commitments. I just painted you a rather rosy picture. And while there is a lot of good news to report, there are other hard conversations that we need to have. As youre well aware. There are approximately 120 sites in 39 states that are storing spent nuclear fuel or high level waste. In fact, many members of this committee have waste in their states. We have a moral and a National Security obligation to come up with a longterm solution, finding the safest repositories available. This is a sensitive topic for some, but we no longer can continue to kick the can down the road. As a former legislative appropriator and agency head and governor, i understand how important following the rule of law is. Ive been instructed to move forwards towards that goal. The president s budget requests 120 million to resume Licensing Activities for the Yucca Mountain Nuclear Waste repository. We need to be stewards of the taxpayers, congress spent 5 billion on the mox project way over budget with no end in sight. The army corps of engineer estimates cost of 17. 2 billion and a 2048 completion date. The money appropriated for this project is money that could be used towards other priorities, like National Security or cleanup at other sites. There is a better, cheaper and proven way to dispose of plutonium. In fact, were using that process now. I look forward to having an ongoing dialogue with many of you about these tough but important issues in the days and months to come. This Budget Proposal makes some difficult choices, but it is paramount that we execute our fiduciary responsibility to the american taxpayer. The president s proposed priorities dealing with the core mission of the department by consolidating duplication within our agency is in order. And it does in fact respect our taxpayers. He deserves credit for beginning this discussion about how we most wisely spend our scarce federal dollars. As for me, this isnt my first rodeo. Having been the governor of texas for 14 years, i managed under some pretty tight budget consequences. It wasnt always blue skies and smooth sailing. We had some substantial budget shortfalls during that period of time that i was governor. And we were able to budget successfully. And we faced limited resources at times and texas became a shining example of energy growth, economic growth, higher educational standards and important improvements to the environment. I will manage the same way at the department of energy. And we did that in my home state by working together. And thats one of the things that i want to really bring forward today is my intention to working with you. I understand this budgetary process. I understand its a first step. But i am committed to working with you, each of you, in the ways that you direct. I understand this process. I respect it. Set clear goals, manage the best and brightest to achieve those goals and spending scarce resources wisely. With your help i believe we can attain many positive outcomes that you expect, that you want to see that the department of energy is capable of delivering on behalf of the American People. So thank you again, madame chairman, and i look forward to attempting to answer your questions. Thank you, mr. Secretary. Appreciate your enthusiasm for your new role. Im sure that that will help you get through every day and some days are easier than others. We all know that around here. Let me start my questioning by rpe. I am a big fan of rpe. I recognize when we think about the department of energy and the cool things that you get to do, one of the cool things is to really help facilitate some of these great, fabulous ideas that changed the country, change the world. But as we all know, cool ideas that start in somebodys garage dont always end up making it through. We talk a lot around this committee about the socalled valley of death with Energy Innovations, and good things happen but they just cant make it to that point of commercialization. When i think of the role of rpe and how it has really helped to be that bridge, its investments have reportedly spurred nearly 2 billion in followon private sector funding and Spinoff Companies to advance technology in market. This is exactly the type of thing that we should be doing. So the question to you this morning to start things off are do you support the mission of rpe . And if so, if we eliminate it, where are we and where does that put the department of energy and that space you should be occupying which is to help really revolutionize and change the world here. Senator, you asked the perfect question, and i think from my perspective the result of being able to deliver the next big thing, if you will, and when you think about the department of energy and other type of agencies not directly hydraulic fracturing was greatly assisted by the department of energy, as you shared extraordinary stories about the technology and innovation thats come out of the department of energy, arpae was created about a decade ago and it was funded the first time in 09. So my point with this and, listen, again, as i said, i understand this budgetary process, and im going to follow your lead when it comes to i know how the money is appropriated, i know how the instructions come, and so if the result is we want the department of energy to be really focused on pushing these new ideas out, getting them to commercialization, i am incredibly in support of that. Do you think thats a role of the department . I do. Okay. I think there is a real role to play on getting basic research funded, gap funding to get that to the point where you can commercialize it. Were going to argue about, senator franken, whether is it this much or this much, or what have you, but i dont think were going to have an argument about i truly believe and you look at my history. I mean, as a governor of texas, we helped create emerging Technology Fund in that state that commercialized technologies that would have died in that valley of death as you referred to if the gap funding had not been there. I understand that. I support that. Now, senator, were going to have a discussion here and debate about whats the proper structure. Is it in is it the arpae structure . If thats what the Congress Sides perry this is the structure were going to have, you go make it work, and i will salute and go get that done. Do you think the structure has not worked in recent years . I will tell you that i think its worth having a conversation about, looking at each of these programs, having a good open discussion about is this the proper structure, is this the right way to deliver the result. And ive got a pretty good background of 14 years of managing a pretty big entity. And what i would ask you, senator, and each of you in both personal and professional way is i hope you will trust me, if you will, to manage this agency to deliver the results that you want. Is it absolutely in this structure that we have today . I cant tell you yes or no. What im going to tell you is im going to work with you very closely. Senator franken asked me this off stage and ive answered it yesterday as well, when somebody said, you know, defend this budget and i said, you know, the budget was written before i got here. It was written before the second day of march the best i can tell, but my job is to robustly defend that budget. And im going to. With that said, i highly respect this process. And this is the first step of this budgetary process. As a governor, i put a lot of budgets forward. Senator cantwell, i never got one back the way i sent it. But with that said, were in a process, i respect that, i want you to know that on the arpa side of things i will work diligently to deliver for you the results that you expect, you demand and that the American People will salute and say well done. Well, i think you will find at least among this committee that there is theres good support for what comes out of arpae, so im hearing that youre willing to work with us on that. And i think that that is important. But, again, you got good supporters here. Senator cantwell. Thank you, madame chair. Mr. Secretary, i would like to follow up. I know representative newhouse had a chance to talk with you about the Pacific Northwest labs and when he mentioned the potential of 1,000 layoffs you tried to assure him you would try to manage in a way that keeps innovation and technology that this countrys going to need, end quote. So are you suggesting that those 100 employees would not lose their jobs . Or would those employees im trying to understand where you think this is going because theyre so involved in innovation. I would say d. O. E. Experts from pnl have been key partners in the fukushima cleanup and the hanford cleanup and so many other things, so i just want to understand where you think this is going. Senator, there is a there are a lot of numbers that have been thrown out about theres going to be this many people lose their jobs at the labs, theres going to be this many people lose their jobs at the labs, im not going to sit here and tell you guarantee theres not going to be one person lose their job at a lab. Im not going to do that. Because thats not realistic. What is realistic is to tell you that my priorities are going to be to make sure that we get the job done at these labs. It obviously requires a lot of really capable, smart, brilliant individuals. We have the flexibility with our budget, i hope you will consider giving me even more flexibility than maybe previous secretaries have to be able to manage those dollars the best way that we can to keep those labs both functioning at the high level that they are and to keep as many of those individuals employed that youre going to need. So i understand how to manage during some times that you have budgetary challenges. There may be some there may be some hard decisions that get made about whether or not this number of employees is the right amount or not with the goal being using our unexpended balances, using our flexibility for that not to be a challenge for our labs. Look, i will give you this, you are not the first Energy Secretary to come before this committee with ideas of changing things, but most of the time i think our committee and the appropriators have probably set those administrations straight because we have been the stewards of these concepts and prioritizations and continually focus on them, as regional issues or as national issues. But im just curious, what area do you think we dont need innovation in . I mean, in the context of these lab workers, theyre working on Cyber Security, nuclear nonproliferation, hanford clean up, grid reliability, building efficiencies. Are any of those areas you think we dont need to continue to innovate in . No. Okay. So none of those would be on the chopping block . Senator, everything is going to get analyzed. And, again, im not going to tell you publicly or privately that there is not an employee thats going to get lose their job in the process. Im going to manage it. And im going to manage it in a very well way. But, you know, nothing that you said is not an important part of what the department of energy does. Can we do it better . I think we can. Can we do it more efficiently . I think we can. Im not just talking from a, you know, political standpoint. Ive done that before. I wanted to ask you about worker safety at hanford. This is a critical i know we only have a few minutes here, but all of these issues are critically important to our state and very much in the forefront of whats concerning. What specific steps are you taking on worker safety . And will you look at this air tank issue for us . The workers at various sites have come up with what they think are more Workable Solutions that are being implemented at d. O. E. On other locations to help the workers continue to do the cleanup they need but to be safe and secure on their air systems . Senator, one of the things that i want to in a global way just kind of share with you one of the first videos i sent out agencywise was about worker safety, about our commitment to it, about if they see if workers see an issue, that they should never fear that they cannot report that back to the secretary of energy, all the way up if thats whats required. And i think that was an Important Message that we sent out there, our commitment to the safety of these workers. Were going to continue to find ways to implement programs whether its your site may be the biggest challenge that this countrys got, hanford. Hanford is the largest Nuclear Waste cleanup site in the entire world. Yes, maam. That is why you cannot do it on the cheap. So, anyway theres a difference between doing it on the cheap and doing it as efficient as you can. And i want to have that conversation with you and the committee often. Cant wait to welcome you to hanford as soon as possible. Thank you. Thank you, senator flake. Thank you. Thank you, mr. Secretary. Good to see you again. Thank you, sir. During the confirmation process, we discussed some of the issues that customers in arizona have had with wapa, the western area power association. The effective delivery of federal hydropower around arizona and the rest of the west as you know is very important to rural and urban customers alike. And as the chairman of the water and power subcommittee, i see our oversight role as improving the efficiency and transparency at wapa. Rate payers and taxpayers deserve to know how their money is spent, to know its spent wisely and for the intended purpose. I know that wapa is staffed with a lot of good people, but unfortunately a string of past fraudulent spending has cast a shadow over the agencys finances. Fraudulent spending of rate payer money has been recently reported by Arizona Television stations and by newspapers. This march d. O. E. Inspector general reported a list of actions taken by wapa to address concerns over fraudulent or improper spending in the governments Purchase Card Program. However, the d. O. E. Reports did not, quote, determine the effectiveness of corrective actions in addressing the identified weaknesses, end quote. Then just last week it came to my attention that on several instances in sworn testimony this spring senior wapa official has said that problems with the governments Purchase Card Program have not been adequately fixed. Now, its troubling to see that there is disagreement at the highest levels of wapa over whether sufficient safeguards are in place to stop this from happening again. My question for you is, obviously its unacceptable what weve seen the investigations, news stories, hearings, audits. After all that there could still be waste, fraud and abuse at wapa. Do you agree that thats an untenable situation . Yes. And if i may just be sound on that. You know, we at this particular point in time after the i. G. s investigation are unaware of any current fraud or waste or abuse for that matter at wapa. It is unacceptable. We hopefully will send that message loud and clear that the i. G. Inspection did that as well, number one, that were watching and were paying attention. If from your perspective and the individual you make reference to, if you think that there is a continued investigative effort that needs to come from d. O. E. , can we have that conversation . And go forward from there. Because its just unacceptable, sir. And any time those kind of activities occur, people lose faith in government. And, you know, i came to this job to be of assistance, to help. And i hope i can be. Well, thank you. What i think would be helpful is to follow up with the i. G. At d. O. E. To ensure that procedures are put in place to ensure that this cant happen again. Yes, sir. And apparently some believe that they are not and the i. G. Their report saying that it did not determine the effectiveness of corrective actions in addressing the identified weaknesses. So obviously they need to do that. And also, if you could request of the i. G. To ensure that money from the fraudulent and improper purchases has been recovered. Yes, sir. Thank you. With regard just in the minute i have left, Research Done at d. O. E. Obviously the budget makes some tough choices. In time of tight budgets weve got to prioritize this kind of spending. Im exploring a bipartisan effort to help d. O. E. Identify some specific Clean Energy Goals in the area of advanced Nuclear Reactor technology and grid scale storage with intermittent power coming on increasingly particularly in the west, then weve got to have clean base load power. This puts pressure on Nuclear Power that wasnt there before. Weve got to make sure that Research Done at d. O. E. Can help us into the next generation of nuclear and also grid scale storage to take advantage of intermittent sourcing. Yes, sir. And ill just quickly, i happen to think and senator murkowski and i have had this discussion from our first meeting, small reactors and the work that has been done and the work that will be done, i happen to think is one of the areas that we need to spend some substantial time and resources on and our National Labs, inl in particular, is working on that. Weve got the private sector that we help fund new scale thats out now moving towards commercialization. So i think were making some good progress. Not fast enough to suit me and not broad enough to suit me. Thank you. Thank you. Senator heinrich. Thank you, madame chair. Its great to see you, secretary. I want to start by thanking you for your trip to new mexico. I think it meant a lot to the folks at whip. I know cindy is looking forward to get to connect with you at some point as well. I think one thing youve heard is the importance of safety and i want to thank you for your commitment to that whether its los alamos, whip, hanford, all these places, worker safety has to be number one. As you know los alamos, which i believe you visited in may, has long been the Nations Center of excellence on plutonium research. Is it correct that this budget fy18 the request maintains los alamos central role in the nations plutonium mission and that its your intent to stay on schedule and meet the statutory requirements for production . Yes. Thats good to hear. Is it also your intention that los alamos continue into the future to fill that Important Mission for the nation as was approved by the Nuclear Weapons council . Yes, sir. Just ask you one more thing on this front, can you assure me that you will make the final decision on additional plutonium facilities based solely on strictly objective criteria, things like cost, schedule, compliance with your Mission Requirements . Yes. Great. I want to ask you something that isnt strictly a budget related item, but its certainly timely and is incredibly important from an economic perspective. As you well know, Wind Generation in west texas has really taken off over the last few years. Now it accounts for about 23 of Power Generation for the electric Reliability Council of texas, ercot as you probably know it. Further, ercot believes close to 100 of the new Electricity Generation thats going to be added to texas over the next ten years is likely to be wind or solar. Do you agree with ercots Technical Assessment that they can accommodate such high penetration levels of Renewable Energy . Im going to be cautious about answering that with definity. Were in the process of doing a grid study now. Thats why i bring it up. That i think will give a better certainly more indepth answer than i could just off the top of my head today. So if i could punt this to the first weekend in july, we should be getting that finalized. Obviously you and the members will have access to that as we talk about it. You know my history with wind and you know my history with having a very broad portfolio. And i bring that to the department of energy. Nothings changed from that perspective. I raise largely because ercot is already managing dramatically higher levels of renewables than most states in the nation. So i think looking at what theyve been able to do is instructive for whether or not we actually have a problem. Yes, sir. And what i would remind folks is that texas has a rather substantial Baseload Energy production as well. And thats probably where were going to be getting down into the weeds on this, senator, is what is the percentage of base load whether it comes from fossil fuels, either from coal or natural gas or from nuclear that maintain that base load. And obviously having solar and wind as part of your overall mix i think, let me put it that way is a very good thing. I dont actually remember base load being a term when i was studying engineering because weve always had a situation where for maintenance purposes you take entire facilities offline. So just like solar doesnt work at night, also coal fired and natural gas fired facilities get taken offline in their entirety in many cases. So i think we ought to be looking at reliability and on being able to manage the grid effectively for that reliability as opposed to saying, well, this is good and thats bad or vice versa. Absolutely. I think youre correct in that particularly in the sense of making sure that you have enough Energy Sources that are going to be reliable and stable and economical. Thats what the public wants. I mean, you and the engineers and myself well all have a great discussion about some intricacies here, but the American People want to know that when they flip that switch on, when its 117 degrees in las vegas as it was two days ago that that airconditioning is working. Might be something to this Global Warming thing after all. Thank you, secretary. Thank you, senator heinrich. Thank you, madame chair. Thank you, mr. Secretary. Thank you for being here today. Want to talk about some things in the budget request. The budget request includes some steep cuts in developments in the fossil fuel energy redevelopment program, thats the Program Includes Carbon Capture and Storage Research which the department proposes to cut by more than 80 . And i have concern that these proposed cuts conflict with what the president has said in terms of his goals to bring back coal jobs and increase coal production. In 2005 coal accounted for about half the u. S. Power generation, this past year declined to about 30 . So i think we have to reverse this decline in order to maintain a reliable and resilient electric grid. Its critical that we need to have all of the Energy Sources. Now, there are emerging technologies like Carbon Capture and storage that have the potential to reverse coals decline while also reducing emissions. I think successfully achieving the commercialization of these technologies is both going to protect the environment and ensure that coal plants remain in service and competitive in energy markets. So could i just ask you to visit a little bit about the assurances that the departments budget request is sufficient to support the development and the commercialization of the clean cole technologies. Excuse me, sir. As i said earlier maybe before you stepped in im going to do my best to vigorously defend this budget. It was win before i got here. But with that said i understand this budgeting process and prioritizing parts of it that may on the face of this budget look like theres been massive cuts over here, i hope well have the back and forth and management of this budget where we prioritize some things and fund them and get good results. Ccs is one of those. At our trip to china at the clean energy ministerial, we were able to get them in an International Way to agree to put that Carbon Capture utilization and sequestration issue at the forefront of the clean ministerial to do some investigative work to have that conversation internationally. I think thats good not only for the environment, i think its good for American Technology. As you know, one of my first acts as secretary of energy was to go to the plant right outside houston, the Worlds Largest sequestration that coal capture and it is a fascinating we had this conversation with the vice premier in china, they are interested in this technology. I mean, i think were doing, not only what the American People but this Congress Wants us to do as a country that is to promote these technologys that are coming out of in this case d. O. E. And a lot of cases and the private sector working together. So im committed to promoting that technology, committed to this all of the above approach which the Carbon Capture side of coal utilization is very important. Were going to use it. And were going to use it wisely. And were going to use it in a way that affects our environment in a positive way and in a way that affects our economy in a positive way. One other thing the departments Budget Proposals includes significant cut to the office of electric delivery and Energy Reliability. And thats the program thats responsible for research and development to improve grid reliability and security in terms of attacks. I know you talked about in your prepared remarks among the most Critical Mission is to develop science and technology that will assure americans of a resilient electric grid and Energy Infrastructure. We all agree. So according to the north American Electric reliability corporations report last year in terms of cyber and physical threats to the grid, they say the threats continue to increase. Were hearing all over the country, not just the electric grid but all components. Im just concerned Less Research and development for this innovative work could place our nations grid at risk to these threats. So i just, if you could spend a little bit of time talking about how we can make sure that this security is there for the grid for the future. Yes, sir. Im deeply aware of the president s executive order, the department of homeland security, the department of Energy Taking the lead on Cyber Security. Even before that was done we had stood up three of our National Labs in what is referred to as the cyber core to be working on it. It is a prioritization, when i o be working on it, it is a prioritization, when i had all of the Lab Directors in, that was one of the things they heard that we were going to spend the resources and spend the focus and have the result of being able to deliver to the private sector and to the government. The challenges and fixes and were working on that diligently. Im committing to you, senator, that that is a top tier priority at the department of energy and i suggest to you again those labs have the capability. Inl has its grid where it can go and break things and invest it if you will and duplicate what were seeing. So im im concerned about it as an american citizen. Im confident that the department of energy has the intellect, the capability, and i will suggest to you the funding to do what the both the president and you as members of congress expect us to deliver. Thank you, mr. Secretary. Thank you, madam chairman. Thank you. Senator franken. Thank you madam chair. Welcome back to the committee, secretary perry. I dont envy your position. You seem to be a defense counsel for someone charged with murder and you seem to be staying i know hes guilty but im going to give him a robust defense. So thats an interesting observation, sir. Two days ago, the American Energy Innovation Council, a group of ten current and retired Corporate Leaders including norman augustine, former ceo of Lockheed Martin and bill gates, released a report about the importance of federal investment in Energy Research and development. The Group Recommends vastly increased funding for rpe from 300 million to a billion dollars per year. And increasing federal investment for advanced Energy Innovation to 16 billion per year, two and a half times the total amount for Energy Research proposed in the budget. Secretary perry, the president s budget is frankly antiinnovation. It does the exact opposite of what the American Energy Innovation Council recommends, it absolutely guts private investment and research, including slashing energy, Research Programs by 3. 1 billion in cutting Renewable Energy and Energy Efficiency research by nearly 70 . And again, on rpe, its the president s budget completely elimina eliminates. You said at the hearing that the budget was written before you were confirmed. And you said that today. But you do support this administrations budget cuts . Senator, im going to do everything i can to deliver to the American People within the bounds of the budget that you write. And again, i understand and support respect this process. Of course. Is rpe the result of rpe a good thing . Yes. Is rpe the holy grar of how government needs to be structured . I will suggest to you maybe not. Lets talk about these things. During your confirmation hearing you talked about how the federal government helped in developing Technology Central to hydraulic fracturi fracturing. Yeah. We talk about base load, natural gas, really important, right . I will suggest to you there are as is nuclear as is clean coal. So that would be a yes. Now the most successful one fifth of rpe projects raised 1. 8 billion in private funding and launched at least 56 new countries companies. That is 1. 8 billion is much more than rpe expended during first seven years of its funding. This whole idea that there isnt a role im not going to make you defend it because i just want to say the whole idea that the valley that the governments job isnt to take things to the valley of death is wrong and its just that is the governments job in certain technologies. And we need to do that. We tried in the 80s, the Government Cut Energy Funding by 52 . Do you know what happened to private Research Investment then . No, sir. Okay. Well, they fell by 40 . Private industry doesnt fill in in these kinds of emerging technologies when the government doesnt do it. The government increased what the government does is incentivizing private industry to jump in. The industry industry cut research by 79 when overall r and d expenditures were cut. So let me turn to Climate Change because thats what were im out of time. Did wait a while here because the health care thing. Can i start . I guess you can. Go ahead. I think well go to senator manchin but well have a second round. Thank you so much very much madam chairman. First of all its good to see you back again. You were here last january 19th and we had a very good conversation and you committed that when i asked would you come to West Virginia and you are coming to West Virginia july 7th to see all of the advances weve made in Clean Coal Technology and i appreciate that. Youre a person of your word. I thank you. Yes, sir. I also remember secretary when we were governors together in 2005, i never forgot this. We were sitting in a Southern Governors Association meeting if you recall. Yes, sir. Katrina was getting ready to hit and i asked you, rick, is this hurricane going to have any effect on you . Joe, ive been told by my weather people that its going to miss us. It might have missed you but you got hit directly. The results didnt miss you. Ill never forgot that. You had a quarter Million People come to your state looking for refuge and took them all in. And senator murkowski if i could add one thing, its a little off subject, about working together, this is a democrat governor of West Virginia and republican governor of texas and i got a call from the governor of louisiana then and she said, can you handle 1 can you handle 25,000 people . And i said, send them. And about 125,000 later im on the phone to him saying, hey, joe, can you send some aircraft to help us move some people because we had another hurricane that came in and moved all of those people. Yes, sir. Anyway, and had it not been for joe man chin of people of West Virginia and National Guard of West Virginia, i will never forget that, sir. Thats the way were supposed to work here. Its the way it should work in congress and senate. Were trying and the chairman and i work work very much along these lines. We sent six c130s and 1200 troops and worked well together. With that being he had, i thank you again. We look forward to your visit we will entertain you in a bipartisan way. I understand the study, that you have undertaken, thank you for taking this, drawing some krit accident. I dont know why you would draw criticism from finding out how secure the grid system is and what it takes to energize the system. Being both former governors were on the same page whats been best be left alone we should be collaborating with the federal government because weve got to make sure this thing doesnt collapse on us and the study fits into that collaboration column. In West Virginia our existing existing capacity is 90 coal. We have Super Critical plants and bag houses and looking for that new technology i believe the department of energy is looking how coal should play a part in National Defense. Its not about one fuel type over another. Its how do we energize and secure the grid. Can you please comment on why you believe the study is so important and basically focus on ensuring the reliability that the country depends on. I think you said when its 115 degrees and they flipped a switch, they want something to work. Yes, sir. Senator, it is very much i think one of the im so glad that we got tasked with this grid reliability because i think it is important for us to have this conversation. I think all of us would love to see blue skies and clean air everywhere in the world. Were talking about base load runs 24 7 uninterrupted and you have 60 days of coal laying there, they are going to feed it and its going to give you power. Nuclear gives you that. And. Senator, ill just mention this and in passing, yesterday, there were places where they had either brown outs or blackouts in the western in some of the western states. I saw this on the news, im not reporting it as guaranteed fact. Im telling you, we know when theres that kind of stress on our grid system, that we need to be prepared for that. And so its so important that we economically and from a National Security standpoint have these multiple sources of energy that will be there when we need it, when its called on. Having 60 days of coal on the ground i think is important. Having Nuclear Plants that are functioning and being able to move the waste offsite of those so that industry knows theres going to be a future for them is important. I think the natural gas that we have been blessed to be able to retrieve now is an incredibly important part of that. Our wind energy and our solar energy and hydro, all of those collectively are part of a portfolio that weve got to protect. And making sure that our grid is when its stressed to its highest levels, will still be able to keep that air conditioning running in a place that temperatures are reaching 120 degrees outdoors, i dont want to take that call that a family has been put in distress or even died because we didnt do our work to make sure that there is a base load of energy to take care of the needs that this country has 24 7, 365 days out of the year. I think its one of the most important studies you have taken on and i thank you for that. Its going to be imperative that we find out how do we keep these grids alive and keep energy flowing. Thank you very much. Yes, sir. Thank you, senator manchin. Thank you, madam chair. Mr. Secretary, good to see you. As you know montana is an incredible state known for fly fishing and elk hunting, Glacier National park, yellowstone and were an energy state and we have more recoverable coal thanny state in the United States. I think we strike a pretty good balance. One that believes in the importance of developing our national renatural resources, without doing that, we dont have jobs and low cost, affordable reliable Energy Sources tax receive news for schools and teachers and as monta montanans may we always be a state where mom and dad can go down to walmart a buy an elk tag, where only the rich and famous can afford to live there. Coal, oil and gas are an important component and we balance out a large amount of hydroelectric power and some wind. We have these large deposits of coal. We have Critical Minerals which we develop responsibly and safely. And i really do believe we can bring this montana balance on a national scale. I think Clean Coal Technology will play an Important Role in that Going Forward. I really do believe as we think about the longer term here we need to lead in this Important Technology development. I want to talk for a moment about Energy Exports, mr. Secretary. I was struck by data i saw, in fact at the Energy Summit i put on in Billings Montana last year, we took a look at the big picture, the long term and there are projections around whats going to happen between now and 2050 globally and every projecting is simply that, a projection but it was from the u. S. Chamber, reliable and good source of energy. They tell us the global population will increase by about 1. 6 billion people between now and 2050. They also told us Energy Demand will increase 85 between now and 2050. With the growth in global Energy Demand and with the u. S. Playing a larger role in supplying europe and east asia, with coal and liquid natural gas, how do you see the departments budget supporting Energy Exports . I think ive heard you say it, its not about Energy Independence but Energy Dominance. I completely agree. It is so strategic from an economic viewpoint Going Forward but also from a National Security viewpoint and the world security. Secretary perry . Thank you, senator danz. And i was struck about two things the Natural Beauty of the state, its extraordinary. I understand why folks from my part of the world whaant to spe smerz up there and money too. But the other thing that hit me and i didnt understand initially, montana is 49th in the nation in wages. One of the reasons is because of the attack that we have seen historically on that form of energy and coal and tim better industry, regulations and generally speaking, government regulations and federal government regulations have really impacted your state in a negative way. President trump has given us instructions whether it was myself or all of us, congress i should say secretary zin ski who knows your state well, putting regulations in place that absolutely take care of our beautiful resources that we have but also keep in mind the men and women whether they are tribal members or whether they are the citizens of coal strip, that we understand rules and regulations well be making. Being able to sell the coal. I had the president of the ukraine in the office on monday. Poroshenko and i were talking about u. S. Coal being able to be delivered to ukraine so they dont have to rely upon the prerve you ares from russia at this particular point in time. Prime minister modi is in town soon to talk to the president and i can assure you that country is going to be the most populist country in the world in the very near future. Their electricity demand, we can be a part of that, american lng, american coal, American Technology. Its the ccus, i was talking to the vice premiere of china about, our being able to deliver that. America i dont think has had a greater opportunity in our history to be able to play a powerful role in securing before our National Defense making sure economically that we are a Massive Player in the in the global marketplace and having an impact on the environment. The way texas drove down emissions was transferring from the older inefficient power plants to natural gas. We have i feel confident we will working with you find strategies to put in place to promote American Energy and American Technology and strengthen our security and economy. Secretary perry, im out of time, but i want to thank you for your support in that area and vision. Ill tell you when the Vice President pence came out to montana, several weeks ago, he met secretary zeenky in billings, i flew out with the Vice President from d. C. The very first place he went, first visit to montana as Vice President , we jumped in the suburban and drove out to the Crow Indian Reservation to the west moreland coal mine and horse back up to tour the mine. Those jobs for Indian Country are critical. They lose those jobs there, their Unemployment Rate goes to 80 . Unacceptable. It is, thank you. Senator cortez. Secretary perry welcome back to the committee when you were nominated, we had a frank and serious conversation about my grave concerns about citing Nuclear Waste at Yucca Mountain. You called me ahead of time to let me know you were going there. Since that trip you went from touting the importance of state sovereignty to a full throated support for depositing the nations waste in nevada, against the will of my state. Undermining states right to defend the communities against dangerous Nuclear Waste. What has prompted such a change in your viewpoint . Senator, with all due respect disagree with your analysis of my position nothing has really changed. It is wise for us to have a very open conversation with this country about the moral obligation that we have as a people, there is statutory requirements for us to move this waste. There are multiple options about where the waste could go, as i clarified yesterday, there are no plan in place to put that in a particular place at this particular point in time but i think we need to be looking at our options and having an open and productive conversation about i dont think its wise for us to continue to leave high level waste, spent rods in pools, not unlike what they had at fukushima, particularly, that over in california in the ring of fire. The gee logically, you could have an event that is not unlike what they had in fukushima secretary perry, i appreciate it. I received your comments. Lets talk about yucca mount continue. The concern i have and many in our state have when it comes to Yucca Mountain, your predecessor and the doe, they were steadfast in the position that yuck ka Mountain Program is unworkable and the department concurred with the recommendation from the Blue Ribbon Commission that a phased adaptive consent citing is the best approach to gain the public trust. Let me say this. You previously stated that you want to have a good working relationship with as many governors as you can. I can tell you as you well know that not only talking let me say this, western Governors Association which includes passed a policy resolution which states that a Nuclear Waste facility in the boundaries ofny state without the written consent of that governor or territory. What should occur, thats what were asking to do. Why is that such a difficult concept . Why is that something that you think should not occur and in fact this yucaa mountain process should go forward and interim storage, a whole new conversation at the nevada National Security site. Let me help with the last issue you brought up, senator, as i can. And i was making reference to let me say this, what were looking for is at least some sort of commitment that youre looking for at least the science to prove its safe. Even your deputy secretary recently commented when he was in here in his nomination hearing, if the science is not there we would not support the project. If you cant get behind consent based sighting, which is what all states should be looking at for all states and individuals there, ats least look at the science and commit if the science isnt there and its not workable, then we should not store Nuclear Waste or spent Nuclear Waste at Yucca Mountain. Can you commit to that . I can. I think its important for us to do two things, Pay Attention to the science and also to the rule of law. Thank you, i appreciate that. Thank you senator. Just so you know, ive been asked to submit as part of the committee record here today a letter that senator cantwell and i received as the chairman and Ranking Member from senator heller also from nevada along with a request specific to the department about repository costs in previous studies and a request for new cost studies on geological disposal in repositories. This will be included as part of the record. I believe you may have already received it or in the process of receiving it about the hes asked for that request. Taken under consideration. Senator king. Thank you, madam chairman. Youve been sent up here to defend the indefensible. This is the worst budget for any agency ive seen in 12 years of public life in terms of corresponding to national priorities. Its amazing. You made a statement in your Opening Statement when you first appeared before this committee in your confirmation hearing, when it comes to Climate Change im committed to making decisions based on sound science and also take into account the Economic Impact. This is not a sound science budget, mr. Secretary. This is a nonscience budget. Youre cutting the very areas where the science which we need to make good policy decisions is going to be examined. Earlier today you said the u. S. , a direct quote, the u. S. Is the leader in Clean Energy Technology and were committed to this mission. The budget doesnt say that. 93 eliminated. Youre even cutting the Energy Information agency, 3. 5 which provides information about our countrys energy situation. Energy efficiency, 69. 6 cut, office of science 17 , those are National Labs. By the way, 56,000 people that work for the National Labs and the budget im quite confident is largely personnel. So a 17 cut in a 56,000 Person Agency is about 9500 people. Now probably there are other areas that can be cut. To come here and try to tell us that youre about sound science when youre cutting these the very departments, very portions of your essential agency that are going to give us the science is just is it doesnt pass the straight face test. You and i were governors together but youve been sent on a Suicide Mission here. I want you to go back and tell the people that are pushing you to do this, i cant do, its not responsible. You can find a question in there, youre welcome to it. I was hooking for it, sir. How do you justify giant cuts, you cant cut something and say youre going to find efficiencies. Governor, heres what i would tell you, is that if were going to continue to do everything like weve always done it, were going to probably continue to get the same result i hope i can tell you i understand this budgeting process and respect it and bring a rather substantial management history of running things and doing it in a substantial big way. Sometimes we had the money that most agency heads thought we needed. Sometimes we didnt. I hope that we will can agree that this is a good starting point its not a good starting point. Its a terrible starting point. Lets take 4 or 5 , 69. 6 is not a good starting point. I meet you in the middle and its still not adequate. Well Work Together to try to get it be adequate is the only answer i know to give you. Let me go to the other one that just is electricity delivery and energiry liability, 47. 8 cut. Are you aware our grid is incredibly vulnerable right now . Probably more so than most people. Than how in the world can you allow people to say youre going to cut the department that works on Energy Reliability and delivery, thats the grid by almost 50 . If we get flexibility in our budgeting, i feel comfortable well be able to protect the grid because thats not the only place were doing grid work. By substantial margin, theres substantial places in our National Labs. Were doing work to protect the grid. Thats a National Security concern and i want to follow up with you on that. If there are other places and you can move money around. Cutting money for the reliability of the grid right now is a National Security threat. It is a i serve on other committees around here that deal with this issue. It is a serious National Security threat. You said theres a progress and congress disposes, heres the question though, if and when i believe will you administer them as intended by congress and will you staff adequately to those needs . Will you administer and implement the budget that Congress Pass . To the best of my ability ill follow the rule of law, sir. Thank you. Thank you, madam chair. Well have opportunity for another round of questions, senator hoefen is hoping to make it back. I want to ask you secretary perry about the office of Indian Energy that provides assistance with energy development, cost reduction, for tribes in alaska, natives. This is a tough area to cut in my view. We have a situation in alaska, we have half of the tribes in the country and a lot of opportunities in the energy space when it comes to our native people. We have doubled the staffing in the office of Indian Energy in alaska. We now have two doe folks, permanent employees. Weve been working with secretary moniz because we had one fellow who had been running things for a period of years. He promised that we might be able to see as many as three, were up to two. But the realty is that we have had lack of adequate and consistent doe staffing within our state and im not suggest to you that you need to be on a hiring spree here but i do want to make sure again that our needs are met. Office of Indian Energy is one of those areas where you have high need and important priority. We need to make sure that not only resources are there but those to help effect wait the initiatives are in place. The question to you at this time is whether you think that theres some opportunities within office of Indian Energy to do more with sharing not sharing of the funds but dr distributing the funds through different grant programs. What are we going to do to make sure the role of the office of Indian Energy is not diminished . And id ask you to speak to the issue of staffing that we tried to make a priority in the state and where you see that might go. Im actually grad that senator franken rejoined the committee because this is something we have talked about often is that within the office of Indian Energy, theres Good Opportunity there and senator hoven out of north dakota priappreciates tha well. You have three interested in this budget category. Senator, if i might now, ill try to be as brief as i can on this. As a matter of fact, this is just a new released today. I like youre using new technology instead of paper. The oofs of Indian Energy program announce announced today it collected 13 projects to receive funding at 7. 8 million. Im not going to delve into it anymore, but were making some were making some progress on that. We will work closely with you and senator hov en and franken both, as you both have tribal interests in your states and in this program, so well, i appreciate that and its always nice to hear news of grants but again, id like to know that weve got. Staffing and sustainability comes with staffing. You know weve got a really big state. Yes, maam. And dont need to go into the alaska texas comparison. But were two and a half times the size of texas and got one guy. I was given that tshirt that shows texas inside of alaska with the addage size matters. Im glad we have connected here. This is good. Im going to im going to defer to senator franken and then senator hov en so they have a chance to ask a question. Senator hoven is chairman of Indian Affairs and he has signed on along with others on the Loan Guarantee program for Indian Energy and i im glad to hear theres 7 million and more money in the Loan Guarantee program also nfor indian projects. I want to ask about Climate Change. At your confirmation hearing you acknowledged the climate is changing but on monday you were asked on cnbc do you believe co2 is the primary control knob for the temperature of the earth and for climate and you answered no. If the climate is changing and if you disagree that co2 is the primary driver, what do you think is driving the change . Yes, sir, ill finish the rest of the interview for the public. That may not have got be as much coverage as me saying that i did not think co2 was the primary knob that changes it. I dont. I think there are some other naturally occurring events, the warming and cooling of our ocean waters and some other activities that occur. I also said in the next breath, that mans impact does in fact have an impact on the climate. And the question is, what is going to be the Economic Impact for this country . And i referred yesterday to a hearing in front of the appropriations, Senate Appropriations that even an individual as celebrated from the standpoint of his capabilities that he under secretary of energy under the previous administration, steven kunz, he says that the science isnt settled yet. And i asked the committee and ill ask you, dont you think its okay to have this conversation about the science of Climate Change and we have a red Team Approach and get the politicians out of the room and let the scientists and listen to what they have to say about it. Im pretty comfortable that, you know, whats wrong with being a skeptic i think is about something that were talking about thats going to have a massive impact on the american economy. You said the thing about you told senator coons we need a Red Team Blue Team Exercise to establish Climate Change. Its my understanding Red Team Blue Team Exercise, the blue team makes an argument and red team tries to knock it down. The blue team refines their argument and go back and forth until consensus is reached. But thats exactly how science works. Including Climate Science, researchers collect evidence and poke holes in the argument and it goes back and forth. Every peer review climate study goes through that Red Team Blue Team Treatment and thousands of studies are gathered in those reports and they go through rigorous Red Team Blue team. This is thats the scientific proce process. Youre not first to do Red Team Blue team. The Koch Brothers hired a red team of except ticks in 2012 in an effort to cast out on mainstream science, the best project. And much to the shagrin of their funders, they found that mainstream Climate Science is the scientific of best, dr. Richard mueller, call me a converted skeptic. This was in 2013 or 14. Last year following an intensive Research Effort involving a dozen scientists, i conclude that Global Warming was real and that the prior estimates of the rate of warming were correct. And im now going to step further. Humans are entirely the cause. If you say that this is caused by the warming of the oceans, the ocean the reason the oceans are warming because they observe water absorbs the heat. Thats why sea level is rising. When the water heats it expands and also because of the melting of the ice cap. This is theres no peer review study that doesnt say this is happening. And the biggest proponent of this is our military. And their quad ren yell review says this is the biggest threat to our world, the time for red team im sorry, thats what we do every day. Thats what scientists do every day. 100 of Peer Reviewed scientists have a consensus and that is that this is happening. Senator, you said something that caught my attention in your remarks, the person who became a converted skeptic, and you said that he made the statement that Global Warming was 100 due to human activity. Uhhuh. I dont believe that. 100 . Every bit of that Global Warming . Dont buy it. Thank you, senator franken. That was someone hired by the Koch Brothers. Everybody has hired someone who has gotten something wrong from time to time. But to stand up and say 100 of Global Warming is because of human activity, i think on its face is indefensive. Probably not going to resolve that here today. Lets go to senator hoven. Hence we should have a Red Team Blue Team Approach to this again. Never mind. One of the things good to see you again, one of the things we talked about at our energy water and appropriations hearing was how to do Carbon Capture sequestration, senator franken before you what we did talk about and you were on board with, with the projects we got under way and helped do them. That is the using new technology for more energy improve environmental stew ardship. There was one question i did want to follow up with you on that i didnt get asked yesterday. Our energy Environmental Research center, which referred to yesterday and which were going to get you out to visit, look forward to doing that and seeing what they are doing. They have contracts and cooperative agreements with the department of energy with your office of fos sill energy. So energy and Environmental Research center at the university of north dakota has cooperative agreements with your office of fossil energy at doe. So under those agreements they are doing this development of carbon both capture and storage. Its a big regional project, covers a huge area where they are putting co2 down in some cases its recovery and other cases its just storage. Yes, sir. Interestingly enough, were not only doing that for the fossil industry, but we have an ethanol, we have ethanol plants out there and one of the ethanol plants now, because we put the legal and regulatory structure in place to actually store co2 from plastic swells, just store it, not for secondary recovery but we have the Legal Framework which we develop from the iogcc, i think urm chairman and i was chairman several times, we have developed that which we passed in north dakota. That Legal Framework is in place. Epa gave primecy on ability to regulate it. Now not only are we working with the fossil industry to give secondary recovery, we actually have an ethanol plant that is capturing the co2 out of their process and then they are going to actually store too. That will be just sequestration. So were doing it on the renewable side too. These are kind of cooperative agreements we have with doe. My request to you is, would you ask your office of fos sill energy to expedite the Grant Funding. They are being held up on the projects right now because that Grant Funding the share and its shared between north dakota, private enterprise and your office, were waiting on your piece of it. And senator, is it your understanding of this, that the delay has been because of a review process going on at the doe . I dont know the answer. Do we ill find out. I dont know the answer to that. But these are agreements that are in place, im not saying sign up the agreement is there, its just there are waiting on that funding for the ongoing projects. Ill find out. Thank you, sir. Appreciate it. When i see senator franken, ill tell him were working hard on these Carbon Capture projects. Secretary perry, i thought we would keep you to quarter of 1 00. Apologize for the late start and appreciate your indulgence going over here. As it gets warmer in washington, d. C. , you need to know that this alaska girl longs for the arctic and i start thinking about arctic, arctic all the time, what are we doing . Here in congress and here in the administration to really take that leadership role that i think the United States should as an arctic nation and we discussed that at the confirmation hearing and prior to, this is a focus of mine and i dont really see much in the budget here that will help us build that Arctic Energy vision. Id like to know if there is Something Special in here that you want to point my attention to. Its something i would like to sit down with you and your team. Your team is a little skinny right now. Well help with that but we want to try to make sure there is an energying within the department of energy, play a very key role in so many of these initiatives as we work on our arctic Global Leadership and look forward to that with you. The one thing i would reiterate with you, i spoke to you in the committee, the room behind the Committee Prior to coming in, my great belief and hope that small modular reactors the work is being done in the private sector, the work that we will be doing to advance that the next generation if you will, is i think one of the ways that we can address the arctic the real challenges are not having a widespread grid. This vast area of land where the population is thin in places and being able to deliver a source of energy to them that is practical, that is economical and stable would be a goal that i look forward to working with you. I sew agree, there are multiple applications where you might not think that nuclear would be a bit for ill ask if everybody think this is a great fossil producing state and we have that in abundance as we do our renewables, whether its the wind or solar or hydroclearly, senator cantwell noted we have an opportunity to go to cordova to conduct a field hearing of the Energy Committee focused on microgrids. Were pioneering microgrids in alaska that the rest of the world is paying attention to. We have a lot to offer and again, these are areas where you might not think of it in the context of the arctic substitution but theres clearly a role, we can absolutely provide that to you. In fact, ive got a Renewable Energy fair in mid august in the interior of alaska, doesnt get any more beautiful than that. And if you want to get a slight preview of the innovation that goes on, i have a grow tower in my front Reception Room in my office here in the heart building where were growing lettuce. Just here to tell you that people dont think we can grow anything in the cold and dark but with a little ingenuity you can grow is it your Reception Room. I look forward to spending some time in the great state of alaska. We look forward to welcoming you. Thank you for being here and thank you for your time. We stand adjourned. Cspans interview with linda ma man airs tonight. Before becoming a member of President Trumps cabinet, she was ceo of World Wrestling entertainment. Join us tonight at 8 00 p. M. On cspan, online at cspan. Org or on the free cspan app. On sunday, elliott engel, Ranking Member on the Foreign Affairs Committee Discusses russia, north korea and iran, thats on news makers sunday morning at 10 00 and later that evening at 6 00, also on cspan. The National Governor aegs Association Summer meeting Live Saturday on cspan starting at 9 30 a. M. Eastern, governors talk about computer coding and the importance of Computer Science in schools with girls who code ceo former microsoft ceo Steve Ballmer and tesla ceoelon musk who will speak at the governors closing session. Watch the national Governors Association closing meeting live on the cspan networks and listen live on the free cspan radio app. With the help of comcast partners, the cities tour takes booktv and American History tv to con cord, massachusetts, where the first shots of the American Revolution are fired. And then less than a century later, the town becomes home to Ralph Emerson and louisa mayal cot. Saturday, noon eastern on book tv, inside Orchard House where Louisa May Alcott wrote little women and walden pond to see the place that influenced Henry David Thor roe and where emerson wrote nature which set the foundation really a house of two revolutions. The beginning of the American Revolution through its windows down the hill. Later the second American Revolution of intellectualism and thought, its really a house that has such great history to it. On sunday at 2 00 p. M. Eastern on American History tv, well take you to the north bridge where the battle of concord began in 1775. This is what is considered to be the beginning of American Revolution because it is here that americans, colonial militia if you will and british regulars encounter one another and lives will be lost on both sides. But more importantly where the colonial militia was ordered to fire upon the kings troops creating an act of treason. Then see the largest collection of materials used during the earliest days of the revolution displayed at the concord museum. Watch cspan cities tour of concord massachusetts, saturday at noon eastern on cspans book tv and American History tv on cspan 3 working with cable affiliates and visiting cities across the country. Now a conversation on the causes and geopolitical consequences of the 2015 coup attempt in turkey. Hosted by the turkey focus think tank called the Seta Foundation for political and economic and social research. This is about an hour and 15 minutes