welcome to "the saturday show", i am jonathan capehart. this week we marked indelible inflection points in the 2024 election and the state of our democracy. on thursday we watched the disastrous debate that has the nation fearing like never before another trump presidency. not going to lie. biden's performance in atlanta was as horrific as it was sad and now democrats are in full panic mode with calls for the president about out of the race for someone younger. but donald trump's performance was as horrifying as it was terrifying. he put on a campaign rally filled with his usual avalanche of lies, projection, and ■çfail threats. then on friday the supreme court, the one with the 6-3 super majority thanks to trump's one term presidency, handed down decisions that were further exhibits of why elections matter. it throughout a 40-year-old ruling that gave rural agencies the power to use their expertise to determine policies when the law is ambiguous. that will not be in the hands of the court. they also ruled that the protection from cruel and unusual punishment doesn't apply to the homeless arrested for sleeping in public spaces even when a community lacks indoor shelter and its unhoused residents have nowhere else to go. and this is the same supreme court that will let us know on monday if a sitting president is immune from prosecution even if he ■çorders the military to kill a political opponent. if trump wins the election in november, he could fill at least two supreme court seats as justices thomases and alito are sure to retire, making way for young, equally conservative jurists who could spend decades turning back the clock on decades of rights that have made this country more just, more fair. the panic unleashed by biden's performance is understandable. but as vice president harris said in an interview, president biden should be judged on his masterful performance over the last 3 1/2 years, not 90 disastrous minutes. also and most importantly, if republicans are standing lockstep with a 78-year-old, disgraced, twice impeached,■ç four times indicted on 88 counts and convicted on 34 felonies former president who has been held liable for fraud and sexual assault and is awaiting trial for trying to overturn the 2020 election and for refusing to return classified documents, then democrats well should be standing lockstep with their president who has a raft of bipartisan accomplishments many said he could never achieve and is presiding over the strongest economy in the world. talk of replacing biden at the top of the ticket or forcing him to get out of the race makes democrats look weak. why should independents and anti-republicans desperate to defeat trump cast a ballot for biden if his own party goes into a full-scale panic if he doesn't do everything perfectly every time? i talked with■ç the late congressman john lewis. always in attendance was the voice of selma. it is in times like these that i hear her voice, singing out these words from an old folk song with undeterred conviction. keep your eyes on the prize, hold on. and that is exactly what i am going to do. joining me now, former federal prosecutor and senior writer at politico magazine. senior correspondent at fox and author of the agenda, how a republican supreme court is reshaping america. and charlie sykes, msnbc political contributor and columnist. thank you for being here. charlie i'm going to start with you, because from what i understand you don't agree with anything i ■çjust said. >> look, the reality is 50 million people saw what happened on thursday night and they are not going to on ceat. it was not just 90 minutes. it was a shocking moment that comes after years of doubt and speculation about joe biden's age. look, this did not take place in a vacuum. there was an abc poll in february in which 86% of americans said they thought joe biden was too old. at some point we have to move past the denialism and the gas lighting. they need to have a conversation about two things. number one, you know, what is joe biden's condition, but also, and this is the heart ■çof it, what he needs to be judged on, and i agree he should be judged on the four years of his presidency, but the 2024 election is not a gold watch. what he needs to be judged on is can he prevent donald trump from getting back in the white house? that is the question democrats have to ask themselves. do they want joe biden to turn in a performance that will make it far more likely that donald trump will win that election? that is why they have to have this conversation. now if there is not a plan b and i don't know that the democrats have a plan b, i want to know what plan c is, which is how do you fix this? going forward how do you convince millions of swing voters that what they saw■ç was not disqualifying, because this election not to be a referendum on democracy, ought to be a referendum on a man who tried to overturn an election. it ought to be a referendum on the audacity and character of donald trump, but now this issue is front and center and it is not going away. >> charlie, i hear everything that you are saying. i want to read you something that the washington post editorial board has out. it's editorial which i think is actually sort of in tone, the perfect editorial considering the new york times is saying the president should bow out. now the atlanta journal- constitution is saying that the president should bow out, but the washington post editorial, you know, deals and realism. it says mr. biden bowing out would not guarantee a democratic victory in november. history does not provide any ■ç precise precedent, but it is notable republican challengers prevailed in 1952 and 1968 after truman and johnson both opted not to seek reelection. in the second case the democratic convention also in chicago that year descended into chaos over protest over the war in vietnam. the party ended up nominating johnson's vice president, hubert humphrey. i think it is our colleague michael steele who pointed out that, you know, if democrats do this it could lead to people thinking donald trump is right. the democratic party and particularly president biden's administration is chaotic and therefore you should not entrust the white house with democrats again. what you make of that? >> i disagree with that argument and i also disagree■ç with your argument that this debate we are having right now makes the democrats look weak. i agree with the atlantic that in fact this is a sign of the political health of the democrat party. the democrat party is not a cult of personality. it understands what the stakes are here, which is again more of a sign of strength to say you know what, we are not going to put one person ahead of the fate of the country and of the constitution and i think it is a sign of that. look, i don't necessarily think it's going to happen, but an open convention is not necessarily a complete meltdown convention. it could deliver a younger, fresher face and quite frankly donald trump i don't inc. wants that. ■ç >> charlie, maybe you are talking from utopia, but have you watched democrats? you actually think democrats will have a comb by our moment and settle on one person? i mean that is the thing about this argument of the open convention. sure, yes it is going to be younger than the incumbent president, but the battle to get that domination, if indeed that were to happen, is going to produce a bruised and broken nominee. i think this talk of having the president bow out of the race, it is just sort of guaranteeing that trump will be reelected. once again, charlie, try to convince me that i am being overly pessimistic here. >> okay, so, i was actually at ç the 1968 democratic national convention so i have seen a convention and complete meltdown. i was on the floor of the convention back then, that is how old i am, but you know this is why, and i will be honest with you, up until thursday i was one of those who said it is pointless to talk about moving on, because this is what it is. you have to play the cards that you have been dealt, but you started the show by pointing out the obvious. the what happened on thursday night was a disaster. it was a terrible performance and either joe biden has to come up with a way of convincing swing voters that he is fit for another four years in office and that he can be donald trump or we have to have this conversation. because right now there is nó ç good scenario unless you come up with a possible plan c to say that was a one off. and again, 50 million people watched it and like everybody here and everybody watching the show right now, we and they were all shocked by what we saw. this is part of the credibility problem because it is one thing to say it is trump or fox news or fakes talking about donald trump's fitness for office. now it is the new york times, the washington post. it will be the focus of conversation where the focus of conversation not to be on the danger and lies of donald trump. that is how bad it is that we are not talking about donald trump's criminality, we are talking about this ■çright now. >> let me play you some sound from the dnc chairman who was on with reverend al sharpton on politics nation. listen to this and we will talk about it on the other side. >> you hear the handwringing coming from punditry and op- ed's like the new york times, but you don't hear it from the people. what i've seen is a gavin is asian, particularly in the black community. i am a black man. i've seen a gavin nation of support. >> what he is saying is while those of us in the chattering classes are trying to temper down and inferno, ■çdown on the ground it is not that way. >> as i mentioned before every poll has indicated the vast majority of americans are worried about joe biden's age. it is not just the political leads. the political class had decided this was a chance worth taking, that they did not think this would be disqualifying up until thursday and that is why you are having this rethinking about it. and again i guess one of the questions that people are going to be asking is were we misled about this? who knew that this was the problem that it was and how deep does it go? now maybe there are good answers to this and that is why i keep talking about a plan c, because the what -- the white house can't say it was 90 minutes. this was,■ç as you pointed out, this was an inflection point. this was a pivotal point. there is real panic, so they have to not pretend that it is only people in the media that are noticing this. look, we saw it with their own eyes. you cannot convince people that what they saw with their own eyes did not happen, so they have to address that and there has to be tough love. it has to be honest and in some ways kind of brutal to say okay, what are we going to do about this and how are we going to prevent donald trump from getting back in the white house? >> so charlie sykes, i went to to stay with us. we are going to take a quick break and when we come back, congresswoman jasmine crockett. stay with us, you are watching "the saturday show". this summer. snacking. just. got. serious. introducing new $3 footlong dippers. the world might not be ready for them... ...but at $3 a pop? 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-five years. introducing the comcast business 5-year price lock guarantee. powering 5 years of savings. powering possibilities. joining me joining me now, congresswoman jasmine crockett of texas. she is a member of the house oversight and accountability committee. congresswoman crockett, thank you very much ■çfor coming to "the saturday show". i was just having a spirited conversation with charlie sykes, who disagrees with me. i don't know if you had a chance to hear my opening statement, basically telling democrats to buck up and stand behind the president because republicans are clearly standing behind there twice impeached, convicted felon of a nominee. what say you? >> i stand with you, jonathan, and i stand with the president of the united states. i've been thinking about this. obviously republicans will stand, it seems like, the devil, if it means that they are going to get their disastrous policies in place. that is all they care about and i've been trying to ■çstress to people that this election should be about them as individuals and they should be voting not for the exact person, but the team. they should be looking at who can control the house, who can control the senate, as well as the white house and what policies they will put forward. also this is kind of like cold syrup. nobody likes the taste of cough syrup, but at the end of the day they take cough syrup because cough syrup is what they need. right now this country needs to be healed and they will not find healing if they decide to deal with donald trump, but they will find healing if they decide they want to give this administration another four years, so that hopefully we may have an opportunity to get a better supreme court. we may have ■çan opportunity, s long as we get the house, to go ahead and get another child tax credit past. to make sure there is a housing stipend past and people can go ahead and move into new homes and things like that. >> congresswoman, the new york times called on the president to bow out of the race. this afternoon before we went on air, the atlanta journal constitution called on the president to bow out of the race. what are you hearing from fellow members of congress about whether the president should drop out? is there even a hint of a groundswell that he should leave the race. >> i don't think there is and what is so frustrating for me, jonathan, you know better than almost anyone that most people came to know me when i fled the state of texas over voting rights. what we have to think about, what people are ■çasking us to is subvert the will of the people. the people have spoken and this is our democratic nominee. at, what those people did, because of what some pundits decided. because of what the new york times thought we should do. listen, that's not what we do in a democracy. we don't just replace somebody because there is this feeling that there was a 90 minute situation that they felt like wasn't his best day and if i'm real it wasn't his best day, but here's the deal. this man has given us so many amazing and incredible days of his life for almost 50 years and the fact that we want to delete that because of a 90 minute performance in which his opponent did not perform well. he just kept talking the ■çwhol time, but he didn't answer half the questions and the other half the questions he did answer he was lying about. but that is not what we are talking about. instead people want to talk about our president who has performed in an extraordinary way. history will look back and talk about the record of joe biden. it is going to be one of positivity. >> congresswoman, i want to bring in these two gentlemen who have been sitting here since the top of the show. ankush khardori -- gentlemen, we were talking during the break and i didn't come to you during my conversation because i figured you are here to talk about the court rulings, but you have thoughts on the presidents debate performance and all this talk about dumping president biden from the ticket or the president dropping out of ■çthe race. you go first. >> the debate was not good. it was not a good performance. however i have to say these scenarios about him being replaced or whatever, particularly the involuntary ones, they sound like fanfiction to me. i think the party and i mean not just the official party operatives, but the media sort of aligned with the party, they made their decision months, if not years ago. i think as a practical matter, i don't see a scenario in which they could switch them out that would not be riskier than the status quo and one thing i would say to people that say was such a shock to see joe biden perform the way he did on thursday night is i don't think those people have been paying enough attentog to the president schedule and public appearances. when they issued the report among other things identifying possible cognitive deficiencies on the part of the president in connection with the special counsel investigation on classified documents, joe biden went out and gave an impromptu press conference that night. you could've seen everything you saw last night at that press availability months ago. >> i disagree with that only because he mistakenly said the president of mexico, versus another president. but in the news conference there was news that was made that was ignored because everyone focused on the fact that he slipped up on the name of a president. ian, let me get you in here before i go back to the congresswoman. >> i guess i will give advice to the biden campaign, which is i want to see kamala harris all the time.■ç i want her on every tv show. i wonder on the morning shows, afternoon shows, i wonder on the night shows. she famously loves to cook, i want to run the cooking shows. if there is a sports team she is interested in, i want her on sports shows. we need to make the american people very comfortable with kamala harris for two reasons. after last night a lot of people including myself are reasonably asking does joe biden, a man who has served his country honorably for 50 years, have four more years in him? and if he does not, what i think the biden campaign needs to do is reassure folks that the person will be his caretaker if he does not have four years is someone they are comfortable with. the second reason is the idea of a brokered convention is a fantasy. the delegates weren't elected by anyone. they don't have0çany legitimacy to choose a president. we have already chosen who takes over for joe biden if he is unable to do the job and that is kamala harris. if they have to swap them out, she has it. >> we were talking about this before we came on and i said we already have a mechanism in place and a scenario that people are very concerned about, which is that the president cannot serve in this capacity. it's called having a vice president. so what people are talking about in terms of instituting a new ticket is really inserting someone else in the line of secession. >> i agree with you that vice president harris should be out and in our faces every day, every possible moment, but the only quibble i have with what you are saying is the vice president is out there every day. i get her schedule. everyone in the media gets her schedule. we know ■çwhere she is. she's been out west all this week. what needs to happen is that my colleagues in the press need to cover her. they need to bring cameras to wherever she is and they need to report on what she is doing. exactly for the reasons you are talking about. congresswoman crockett, what you make of the suggestion, which i think is an excellent one, to make sure that the vice president of the united states is out front and center so that people and folks in my profession cover her in the way that they should as a vice president, so that they get, quote unquote, comfortable with her. >> i hear you and i absolutely agree. number one, the vice president has been keeping a very intense schedule and she is doing amazing work. it is quite frustrating for me, though, because as a black ■ç woman who was elected in this country i always feel like we still kind of come back to this very same thing. that she has to do more than anybody else has ever had to do. was this a question for any other vice president that came before her? she is the vice president of the united states. we have had scenarios where we lost presidents because they have been executed or otherwise passed away and the deal is there wasn't all of this let's insert someone else. it is very frustrating because again i feel as if there is always this different bar that is set for her. i ask people all the time, can you name for me five other vice presidents, because they really have always wanted her out front and that has never been the role of a vice president. the role of a vice president isç to be a supporting cast member and at the end of the day when we talk about comfort ability, what we should be talking about is are we comfortable with the policies being pushed? the republicans right now are pushing project 2025, so at the end of the day do you want project 2025 or do you want row restored? do you want project 2025 or do you want affirmative action? you want project 2025 or do you want loyalists that will include having loyalists instead of those committed public servants who have always served in these capacities. there is a real danger and to act as if this comes down to personality, i need all of america to grow up and decide if they are going to choose what makes sense going forward in this■ç country are they can decide we can have more of our freedoms taken away. >> in the less than a minute we have left i would love for you to talk about the significance of overturning chevron deference and what that means for the country. i'm coming to you last because you said that was the most important case. >> it is an incredibly important case and it continues the trend in which the republican appointees are delegating more and more power to themselves and to judges throughout this country to second-guess public servants. it will be bad across every dimension of social policymaking that is managed by any federal agency. it's going to be bad. >> there are all sorts of should be made by experts and i- these are all kinds of issues. everything from who gets overtime pay to what your cable rates are in some places. so many different things. the justices don't know anything about cable rates and more than that there are tens of thousands of public servants who make these decisions. it takes a lot of research and talking to people. the justices are nine people. they have 36 law clerks. they don't have the personnel to perform the tasks they've assigned to themselves. >> and chris hayes pointed out in the decision, just this example that the justice confused laughing gas with another gas that is actually regulated by the epa. i mean come on. congressman jasmine crockett, thank you very much for coming to "the saturday show". ■ç also ankush khardori, ian millhiser, and my buddy charlie sykes even though we disagree. thank you very much for coming to "the saturday show". and up next, donald -- we will be back after a break. ♪♪ citi's industry leading global payments solutions help their clients move money around the world seamlessly in over 180 countries... and help a partner like the world food programme as they provide more than food to people in need. together, citi and the world food programme empower families across the globe. ♪♪ nothing dims my light like a migraine. with nurtec odt, i found relief. the only migraine medication that helps treat and prevent, all in one. to those with migraine, i see you. for the acute treatment of migraine with or without aura and the preventive treatment of episodic migraine in adults. don't take if allergic to nurtec odt. allergic reactions can occur, even days after using. most common side effects were nausea, ta healthcare provider allergic reactions can occur, even days after using. about nurtec odt from pfizer. sfx: [screams] [crowd gasps] bleeding gums are serious, jamie... dr. garcia? whoa! they're a sign of bacterial infection. crest gum detoxify's antibacterial fluoride works below the gumline to help heal gums and stop bleeding. crest saves the day! crest. sleep more deeply and wake up rejuvenated. purple mattresses exclusive gel flex grid draws away heat, crest saves the day! relieves pressure and instantly adapts. sleep better. live purple. right now save up to $800 off mattress sets at purple. visit purple.com or a store near you today. hours after hours after the supreme court allowed emergency abortions to continue in idaho, at least for now, and a day before iowa's highest court ruled in favor of the states six-week abortion ban, donald trump continued to peddle lies about roe v. wade at thursday's debate. >> they will take the life of the child in the eighth month, the ninth month and even after birth. >> i will restore roe v. wade. >> that means you can take the life of the baby■ç in the ninth month. you have late-term abortion. you can do whatever you want depending on the state. we don't think it is a good thing. we think it is a radical thing. we think the democrats are the radicals, not the republicans. >> to be clear, neither president biden nor other democrats support taking the life of a baby in the ninth month of pregnancy and there is no state anywhere that allows abortion after birth. that is actually not abortion. that actually would be murder. joining me now, president of reproductive freedom for all. thank you as always for coming to the saturday show. you were at a debate watching party in atlanta. how dangerous are donald trump's lies about roe? >> they are so dangerous. you can get past■ç the gibberis because a lot of it was unintelligible. there were lies that you just pointed out about abortion and pregnancy. we know the majority do not happen. it is like 1% and when they do happen later in pregnancy it is for some of the most horrific and tragic reasons. some of the reasons we've heard since dobbs. at the end of the day, abortion is healthcare and you should be able to access at no matter what stage of pregnancy. donald trump and republicans are -bent on pushing this laughable lie that it is dangerous because it stigmatizes abortion providers and those with abortion care. also rampant misinformation about roe. it is almost laughable except some people might not know that the majority of legal sqholars actually supported roe and did not want to see it overturned and we now know the majority of voters overwhelmingly supported the president. i think the most troubling lie he told was about his position on medication abortion and his position on abortion care. he tried to moderate his position and frankly it is just a lie. >> i was going to say, does he even know what his position is? >> it is troubling because it shows like so many other things in the debate, he is extremely comfortable not telling the truth and telling the exact opposite position. his facts about the economy. so many things that roloff the tongue. complete lies. >> in the supreme court case in the iowa decision, that for now in idaho emergency access to an abortion is still in place, but some other case could ■çcome up this issue is not over. you know of any other states that are going to bring cases and if so, are you at reproductive freedom for all, prepared to file challenges? >> we don't litigate, but our colleagues at the aclu, center for reproductive rights and planned parenthood are involved. texas has a similar challenge. in texas, folks with the same situation, emergency abortion care, cannot get it, while idaho you can. this is another example of this court making a ruling on a technicality. they threw it back to a lower court. they did not address the issue about whether the federal statute preempts state law. justice ketanji brown jackson called it out. c this is a delay. much like in the medication abortion case the court is laying out here is how you can keep challenging this and how we can get away with this, until donald trump is president and decides to resend or overturn these laws through executive action or his appointees. >> avenue to get you onto things before we go. the six-week abortion ban that is now back in place. i know you said you don't do litigation, but are their moves and are you party to or whatever you guys do, trying to stop? >> it is the iowa supreme court. i don't know that there is a next step, but what we are doing in iowa is partnering with advocates on the ground on campaign activity because that is honestly our best ■çshot, changing who is making the rules and changing who is on the court. >> let me get you on something that ian millhiser was talking about in terms of his advice to the biden campaign, which was put vice president harris out there every day, all the time, on every possible platform so that the country can see her. why do you think vice president harris isn't automatically part of whatever, if there is a need for a second scenario, why isn't she part of the conversation, since she is in the line of succession as vice president of the united states? >> i have so many opinions, but here is what i will say. we came out right away after the debate and said look, this is the administration taking care of abortion rights and reproductive freedom. the tip ■çof that spear is kama harris. we are relying on her to basically protect our fundamental freedoms. she is the best spokesperson for joe biden and this administration. it is the top issue in this election. i absolutely agree we need to see a lot more of her and in the coming months we will. >> we've been seeing vice president harris speak on this issue since the draft of the dobbs decision. >> she is leading the fight. >> she speaks from here. mini timmaraju, as always thank you very much for coming to "the saturday show". still to come, my own aunt gloria will join me live with her thoughts on this week's presidential debate and her message to vaux calling on president trump, president trump, what? a freudian slip. calling on president biden■ç to drop out of the race. trump should get out of the race, too. don't go anywhere. aunt gloria is coming back after the break. try dietary supplements from voltaren, for healthy joints. virtually everyone has an opinion about thursday's debate between president biden and donald trump. from politicians to pundits to the folks next door. my next guest t this week that she was disappointed with biden's performance but added, quote, president biden is the best choice. he represents all people. it is his wisdom and caring of people we need. trump is not qualified to be president. who said that? my aunt gloria. welcome back to "the saturday show". you told me president biden needed to slow down. talk to me more about that. >> he really does. it's not like we need someone who can run across the country. he went from atlanta to north carolina. he doesn't need to be doing all of that. we need his wisdom in this world. that is the only way we will stay away from world war iii. he does not have to be on the campaign trail 24 hours. we need$çhim to be there with his wisdom. he is the only person who can handle what is going on in the world right now. >> aunt gloria, how do you think donald trump came across in the debate? >> that is the most racist man i've ever seen. the way he said the blacks, that migrants were taking jobs from the blacks. he doesn't think about anybody other than himself and rich people and the sad thing about it, a lot of his people who follow him, from small-town, working-class middle people and he described everyone as low class. >> aunt gloria, let me play something from the debate ■çon thursday that made you, in your email to me, you said this particular thing, quote unquote, you off. watch this. >> the fact is that the millions of people they allowed to come through the border, they are taking black jobs now. >> aunt gloria, what is a black job? >> anything that is low income. he does not respect anyone other than rich people. you are saying we are the only ones who are going to work those jobs. that we are no more than slaves. we build the country■ç off our back and then the migrants are coming and keeping it going, but he has no respect for people of our race, any race. and what is so sad is the constituents don't even realize, he would not even sit down with you at the town hall. let's see if he will sit down and talk with people, but he won't. he just likes to throw out stuff. but to say the blacks, what are we? i know. >> yeah. >> you are now jonathan capehart, one of the blacks. you are one of the blacks. >> aunt gloria, i have to get > aunt gloria, i have to get have to let you go. how do you respond to the chorus of democrats telling president biden to drop out of the race? >> no, he should not drop out of the race. he is the most qualified. believe me, he is the only one that can handle all of the things that are coming up. you know, with trump there, no one else has his wisdom and he's going to be fine, you know? he has a really capable person behind him, vice president kamala harris and he is the only one who can do this job. we need him there. you know, like he said when you came to north carolina, you get knocked down, get back up and fight, and that is exactly what you have to do. >> aunt gloria, i want to thank you as always for coming to■ç "the saturday show" and i'm going to call you, because there is a weekend next month in july that will mark the 100 days before the november election and i'm going to get you here to washington if you want to come. >> oh good. >> americas aunt is going to be live here on the show that weekend. aunt gloria, thank you as always for coming to the saturday show. >> you're welcome, take care. >> up next, as pride month draws to a close, one journalist writes that we should remember the heroes, not just the trauma of the aids epidemic. he joins me in studio next to also share his personal journey, including why he chose to reveal his own hiv status now. you are watching "the saturday show" on msnbc. ■ç ♪ you don't have to worry... ♪ i thought i was sleeping ok... but i was waking up so tired. then i tried new zzzquil sleep nasal strips. their four—point lift design opens my nose for maximum air flow. so, i breathe better. and we both sleep better. and stay married. dad is a legend. and his legendary moves might be passed down to you. get ancestrydna and see which traits were inherited, where they came from, and who you share them with. discover what makes you legendary with ancestrydna. to me, harlem is home. but home is also your body. i asked myself, why doesn't pilates exist in harlem? 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>> it was an interesting journey that started with beyonce. it actually started with beyonce's mother. a conference down in birmingham. beyonce's mom came down to talk about hiv-aids. it is still killing us, can you talk about this? i'm sitting there and i'm thinking to myself, well, i am positive, i need to do my part. then the times came to me about this and i decided to reveal my truth through that peace, inspired in large part because of tina knowles. >> you kept this diagnosis secret ■çfor years, even from your own son. how freeing has it been to go public? >> you know what, i've been talking about this to friends and not to keep everything about beyonce, but the song cozy, comfortable in my own skin, i know what that feels like in a different way. i don't have to feel as if that part of my comfort is compartmentalized. so it is very freeing, sure. >> what was your son's reaction? >> he said wow and he said i'm proud of you, pops. we have been processing. i'm sure he will read it months before everyone else. i didn't send them a link and said go work this out for yourself. i didn't do that. we've been talking about it and one of the things that was a revelation for him was recognizing when i started■ç re- prioritizing my life because he recognized what was happening, but he did not know the emphasis behind it, so to go back and think about his childhood through a different prism. >> as you know black men die of aids at a greater rate than any other group in the united states. what is your message about this disease and the importance of getting tested? >> number one, we can't afford to lose us. we have mass incarceration, we have shootings, we have lots of things against us. this is one thing we can take ownership of and have agency to protect our own lives. i'm talking about heterosexual black men as well, but we all need to take ownership of this. the first person in this country identified of dying ■ç from hiv-aids was a black kid during the heights of the civil rights movement. here we are in 2024 and we are still number one dying from this disease. not because we don't have treatment, but because we don't have the courage to push back past the shame. >> i encourage everyone to go to the l.a. times website. put in the search engine lz granderson and find his column. i heroes journey often begins without knowing. i am so happy that you know that you are indeed a hero. lz granderson, thank you very much for coming to "the saturday show". and stay right here, we will be back with more of "the saturday show" on msnbc after the break. all in one. to those with migraine, i see you. for the acute treatment of migraine with or without aura and the preventive treatment of episodic migraine in adults. don't take if allergic to nurtec odt. allergic reactions can occur, even days after using. most common side effects were nausea, indigestion, and stomach pain. it's time we all shine. talk to a healthcare provider about nurtec odt from pfizer. i'm a rusty old boat hitch, and i am barely hanging on... ha ha ha. and while we're still miles from the lake, i'm gonna launch this boat right here. see ya. 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