welcome to prime time weekend. i am nicolle wallace. let's get right to the weekends top stories. in the study of criminal minds -- it is actually not uncommon for an arsonist to knowingly return to the scorched earth he or she so brazenly torched. what is uncommon though is the arsonist not just being applauded by the victims upon its return to the scene of the crime, but being celebrated. today, donald trump played the arsonist in the trump run republican party and showed -- with senate republicans this afternoon three blocks from where trump was arraigned last year in connection with his efforts to overturn the 2020 election he lost, comes to washington, d.c. today abounding to equal parts chest thumping, america bashing, and more bizarre incoherent ramblings about dating nancy pelosi today. press spin for today was a trump engaged in forward- looking discussions of policy, hannibal lector kept coming up, including donald trump successive animosity toward the department of justice. maybe the aftermath of his 34 felony count in new york, and in that period trump sought to harness the powers of congress to fight on his behalf. this first call was, too, you guessed it, mike johnson. speaker of the house, now trump's henchmen. they appeared in their matching red ties in court last month, mobilizing. not to pass any laws to help the american people, and in an all-out effort to protect trump, to help him evade accountability. republican lawmakers are trying everything. they are being really creative, drying up bills on jurisdiction, weapon is in appropriations, and expanding blockades. republicans do everything except govern, everything in their power to help trump evade accountability, avoid the rule of law. remember, they didn't always how quite this low at donald trump's feet. >> we are on the verge of having someone take over the conservative movement in the republican party who is a con artist. >> i am a never trumper guy. i never liked him. >> all i can say is count me out. enough is enough. i have tried to be helpful. >> we were really trying to figure out, how can we hold a president accountable to put all our lives at risk? >> there's no question that president trump is practically and morally responsible for provoking the events of the day. no question about it. >> all those people are engaged in a project to make you think we are crazy. they said those things. they said those things, and then they fell into line. democrats, for their part, today welcomed trump to capitol hill in a very different way. this mobile billboard, for instance, sent out by the democratic national committee, had video from the deadly insurrection playing on a loop to remind the gop what exactly happened on january 6th, what exactly they have endorsed for president in 2024. 3 1/2 years later, the blood has been cleaned up, the broken glass has been swept away. the physical damage repaired. but the disgrace and the trauma for the women and men of law enforcement who protected the democrats that they indoors. in fact, donald trump was protected this afternoon i some of the very same police officers and law enforcement officials who bravely stood between his violent supporters and those republican lawmakers who rolled out the red carpet for him today. this is well and truly the trump republican party. let's talk to our most favorite reporter, von hillier is back. also joining us, former lead investigator tim hay fever and the executive director of republican voters against trump . sarah, i start with you, because your pain matches or exceeds mine. at what all these men and women have become. because i was never on board, right? i never thought trump was a good idea. it is divided, circles of former friends, divided family and friends and neighbors. i've always thought it was a bet with the devil. but i guess the point is, so did they. so did ted cruz. so did marco rubio. so did mitch mcconnell. but they did something very different today. do you understand why? >> i understand why they're doing it? no. i'm like you. i both thought trump was unfit from the beginning, and took people like marco rubio and so many other candidates in 2016. it doesn't matter. everyone was on rsa back then. jd vance, they all fought the same way we did. and then we watched them for political expediency, for their own professional growth. not only make, sort of tolerate trump, but make common cause of him. become his biggest toadies. there is something particularly painful, i think, about them cheering him as he returns to the capital where, as nancy mays said, he threatened their lives. one of the things that strikes me -- i run republican voters against trump, and one of the many reasons people voted for trump twice say they will not vote for him again because he lied about the results of the election claiming it was stolen, and then he fomented it insurrection. for a lot of these republicans, that was their redline. the fact that these people are now willing -- they were willing to make videos, put their faces on billboard saying absolutely not, trump is unfit and i won't vote for him. they have the push to deal with that. they have that case. the people who purport to be devout christians, who purport to back the blue or stand the rule of law, they are there to cheer donald trump, that i was morally and temperamentally responsible for the insurrection. it is stomach churning and the kind of emperor has no close kind of phenomenon where it is just important on days like this that we remind people, we are not the crazy ones. they are the craven ones. >> lick spittle isn't it enough circulation. thank you for invoking it here at the top of the hour. i want to show you and add that the biden/harris campaign put out and just get your reaction to some of it. this is on january 6th. >> donald trump lit a fire in this country. >> the siege lasted for 7 hours. >> stoking the flames of division and hate, now he is pouring gasoline. >> we will give them parts. >> there is nothing more sacred than our democracy. but donald trump is ready to burn it all down. >> i am joe biden and i approve this message. >> the term is actually gone farther, he has called them warriors around the anniversary of d-day. this seems to speak to that got rejection of some of the voters that you talked about a lot. what you think about that? >> i think it's good. i think you need to keep the salience of january 6th very high for voters. because people have short attention spans. i talked to voters all the time. and i've done focus groups now. every year now for several years, it has been stunning to watch people change how they talk about january 6th, because of course, when it happened, people were disgusted. they were sad. you know, republicans are so appalled that they had to say was actually antifa and black lives matter. they weren't even willing at the time to say these were actually trump supporters because it was such an important thing to happen. they have moved to a place where time has healed sort of those wounds for them, and they have sort of been by the right-wing infotainment media, by republican politicians. they moved to this place, not just of acceptance, but a celebration that this is an act of patriotism. but that is for core voters. for the swing voters that are still held up by what happened that day, for the people who baby aren't big fans of joe biden need to be reminded that donald trump is unfit and too dangerous to be allowed back in the white house, it is essential that they remind him about january 6, because it's just one of those things -- as the salience falls, people forget about it. >> i think our best example of how that work of what sarah is talking about was, the public hearings were this summer before the midterms. democracy was much higher than a lot of sort of pundits asked acted it to be. one of the factors, along with the odds that the audacious traditions of a red wave, which is more like a quick trip. trump's voracious desire for the violence. trump's enthusiasm for the removal of the mats, which are there for one reason, to make secret service aware of anyone carrying a weapon. >> they are not here to hurt me. they can march the capital from here and take those away. >> this was always to be the smoking gun, if you will, of trump's enthusiasm for his supporters, to both be armed, to be among them, and they proceed on to the capital to do his bidding. >> exactly right. in the hearings, we also developed this really powerful and yet the evening before the attack on the capital, the president was in the oval office. he gathered a group of young staff and the door was open and he could hear the january 5th crowd, you know, allie alexander, mike flynn speeches. and he said to the room, people are very angry. they are extremely upset about this election. mindful of the energy in the crowd and the potential for it to turn violent. there were repeated instances of his specific knowledge of danger and his desire to go. what struck me about these images from today is he's doing today what he wanted to do that day. his intention was to go to the capital and buttonhole republican members of congress somehow that he thought would be subject to the political pressure that he was exerting on the vice president and others in some desperate attempt to prevent the certification and the transfer of power. it is shockingly ironic that 3 1/2 years later, he is making a trip and getting a much more favorable audience from these republican members. that is precisely what he intended to do, had he been successful in that crazy plan to travel to the capital on january 6th. >> vaughn, iron he doesn't live under the sort of mushroom cloud of trump-ism, but there was an ime to mike johnson being the speaker who created donald trump. >> i mean, having him be the one welcoming him, but also, somebody like nancy inside of that meeting room today, donald trump explicitly giving her a shout out after helping her win her primary. just this week in south carolina, nancy mays was going to be the future of the republican party in the days after the january 6th attack. she was voted and rightfully for the first time in november of 2020, and then she made the tv rounds saying she and others could be the voice of the new republican party. they need to turn the page, look away from donald trump. out there in summer 2022, donald trump is on stage calling her a rhino. she narrowly won her re- election. she even told me of the time, look. they are going to find if anybody did a crime related to january 6, we will bring appropriate charges. nancy is speaking a different tune. the message that was sent from donald trump to every other house republican in that room was that you may have turned your back on me at one point, or you may cross me at some point, and ultimately, you are safe in this republican party if you come back and you stand beside me. nancy is the representative of that. if you take those words of or after january 6th, she was hiding her kids during that attack, to where we are now. >> there are a lot of accounts from contemporaneous sort of social media posts about the incoherence that you highlighted sunday night. some of the non sequiturs, which i think is a generous way to describe them. this is from jake sherman on trump's meeting with house republicans. quote from trump to house republicans, close to exact quote, quote, nancy pelosi's daughter is a wacko. there is an age difference, though. jake went on -- i don't know what this means, but this is what he told a group of house members. he talked about silence of the lambs famous villain, hannibal lector. there was a lot of, i think, his supporters call it riffing, but a lot of non-policy topics raised. >> i've been covering trump for a while, and that's kind of a regular trump rally, if i may. >> they got the vip experience, kind of. >> right. a little more intimate. >> up next, we will be joined by mitchell andrew and much more ahead. don't go anywhere today. our right to reproductive health care is being stolen from us. the rights for ourselves, our kids, and our grandkids. gone. just like that. i can't believe this is the world we live in, where we're losing the freedom to control our own bodies. planned parenthood fights for you every day. but we need your support now more than ever. visit this website, call, or scan the code on your screen, with your $19 monthly gift. help us win the fight for the constitutional right to control our own bodies. there's never been a more urgent time to join. so go online, call, or scan this code now. sign up with your monthly gift today, and we'll send you this "care. no matter what" t-shirt. it is your right to have safe health care. that's it. we need you now more than ever. go online, call, or scan right now. when we say it'll be on time, they expect it to be on time. turn shipping to your advantage. keep those expectations with reliable ground shipping. thanks brandon. with usps ground advantage®. ♪♪ >> it was bump stocks that resulted in 60 people being dead in las vegas, in nevada. and what the court did today is really rolling back what otherwise is important progress to be made to prevent gun violence in america. that was vice president kamala harris reacting to the nation's highest court in the land today deciding to roll back a ban on bump stocks. president biden in a statement urging congress to take action in the wake of the supreme court decision, saying this, quote, americans should not have to live in fear of this mass devastation. we know thoughts and prayers are not enough. i call on congress to ban bump stocks, pass in assault weapons ban, and take additional action to save lives. send me a bill and i will sign it immediately. joining us, mitch landry is with us. thanks for joining us today. >> thank you for having me. >> as you know, i came out of republican politics and republican campaigns where the supreme court was an issue that animated republicans. the supreme court is now out of step with the majority of republican women in about half of republican men on issues like abortion and guns deep. how do you make sure that it's is motivating an issue for the democratic coalition as it was for 40 years for republicans? >> first of all, thank you for having me. this decision today is just another kick in the gut. it's not a surprise. it shouldn't be for anybody with seizing power in state legislatures, and yes, the supreme court. this is what a supreme court who wants to take america back again into the dark ages looks like, and it should cause people in america to shutter when you take it not only for what was said today, but taken in context. the decision today, to basically make peaceful streets in america with a machine gun in everybody's hand, it is hard to fathom. the number of americans that have been killed on american soil from gun violence since 1980 is over 1 million people. that's more americans denizens and were killed in all the wars americans fought in in the 19th and 20th century. clarence thomas thinks the best way to deal with that is to just give everybody a machine gun. you saw what the vice president said, but here's the most important message -- this election is going to be a choice between a guy named joe biden who gets up every day to fight for the american people and who passed the largest gun safety measure in history, and appoint supreme court justices that reflect the ideals of america and hold true to the constitution in a way that awful judges should. this court has demonstrated in the last couple of months how they are so willing to eviscerate the rights from dobbs to the redistricting decision they made the other day, and now to this incredible legislation. and if you want more of clarence thomas and alito, then you vote for trump. if you want the kind of court the joe biden has presided over through the years and has been both the senate and vice president and now the president, it really is a very, sad decision that is tortured in its language and its reasoning from justice thomas. >> it is so interesting. the polls support everything you just said. 85% of americans support gun safety measures. i think it's even higher than that on bump stocks specifically. i think 83 is the number that supports background checks. i think the decision they have before them about domestic abusers -- most women who are murdered are murdered by someone they know. the victims of the extreme right policies are -- everyone knows someone who either hasn't had access to healthcare they need -- the women who are aligned with the campaign who have been on my show talking about their variances in texas after abortion bands are walking, talking examples of how devastating republican policies are. do you think the race is close because people haven't focused in on the people in our own communities who are hurting because of the extreme republican policies? or do you think it's where we are in the calendar? what is your theory of the state of the race. >> first of all, it's a close race and it's going to be a close race all the way through election day. we have seen that in the past. but you could not have a more stark contrast between two visions of america. joe biden, everyone who knows him, people who work for him want to continue to work for him. he has demonstrated an ability to get massive pieces of legislation done. he is very respectful, by the way, people who don't think like he does. he told me, you go everywhere and make sure everyone gets this, because i'm a president for all america. donald trump is told you many times that i am in this for myself. i would to seek retribution on people that oppose me. he went to the hill yesterday, which was disheartening and disgusting, to watch him walk into capitol hill, a place where, as president, he sat and watched ticket desecrated by an insurrection that he promoted, and what did the republicans in congress do? did they do what they said they would do after mitch mcconnell and a couple other said? they embraced him. they gave him the game ball for that congressional race. if that doesn't mean the donald trump now owns the republican party lock stock and barrel, and now he has the cord that represents him, people will continue to do what he says, which is what he will do that's worse than the first time he was president. it's a very stark choice. it's going to be a very close election. we have to continue to tell them what the stakes are, but evidently, the supreme court and congress are going to help them figure out very quickly what it looks like when you take america back again. i don't think women want to go back. i don't think minority communities want to go back. i don't think reasonable and thoughtful americans want to go back to the way it was a long time ago when we did not share democracy in the united states of america. democracy is on the line, freedom is on the line, our rights are on the line. and the ability to actually live at a reasonable, thoughtful pace with neighbors who are different from us. donald trump is going to destroy it. when we come back, with the conservative majority on the supreme court already ushered in, the all-out assault on reproductive rights in red states all across the country. one mom from texas forced to flee her home in her home state for medical care. we share her harrowing testimony after the break. the . and just lived with the damage that was left behind. but even after all this time your thyroid eye disease could still change. restoration is still possible. learn how you could give your eyes a fresh start at tedhelp.com. if advanced lung cancer has you searching for possibilities, discover a different first treatment. immunotherapies work with your immune system to attack cancer. but opdivo plus yervoy is the first 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(man) every time i needed a new phone, ask your doctor about opdivo plus yervoy. i had to switch carriers... (roommate) i told him...at verizon, everyone can get that iphone 15 on them. (man) now that i got a huge storage and battery upgrade... i'm officially done switching. (vo) new and existing customers get iphone 15 on us when they trade in any iphone. verizon i was at risk of organ damage to my kidneys and brain, but i still wasn't bad enough for an exception for abortion care in texas. i was going to have to flee the state where my family has lived for 8 generations, and i was terrified. the bounty laws in texas had is worried about who could turn against us. was it safer to attempt 12 hours in a car through rural texas where i was violently ill? exceptions to abortion bans area fiction . they don't exist in texas, and i am living proof of that. >> that was lauren miller testifying earlier today before a senate subcommittee about the horror that she and countless women are being forced to endure every day after donald trump's hand-picked supreme court justices stripped away a constitutional right for the first time ever. in attendance today was caitlin cash, who was also forced to leave her home state of texas to get abortion care after she found out that her 13 week ultrasound that her baby was unlikely to survive until birth and would suffocate soon after being born. her home state of texas has been the leader in an effort to try and block women from leaving their homes, from leaving their state to receive abortion care. the movement, which has been growing and antiabortion states all across this country, become a reality. caitlin cash joins us now. caitlin, i have to thank you for telling your story and for talking about these things. so many women have been with us and so few women are able to talk about it in their life let alone on tv, so thank you. >> thank you for having me here. it is a horrible thing to have to relive, but as i have been telling people during my visit, if it is something i have to relive to let women know what it is really like in states with these bans, i will keep doing it. >> tell us your story . >> mi 13 week ultrasound, i found out that my second pregnancy, that there was a fetal abnormality. it was skeletal dysplasia. during that appointment, i was told that my child's bones would most likely start breaking in utero to a condition called brittle bones. when my child was born, his rib cage would not be able to support normal lung function, and he would most likely suffocate or need extreme medical intervention. at that appointment, the doctor told me that i needed to start thinking about what kind of end- of-life care i would want for my child, and it was a hard stop. and it never occurred to me that this was just 45 days after sb-eight went into effect in texas, and my doctor couldn't even say the word abortion. >> from your doctor, it sounds like it was a boy. >> yeah, it was a boy. >> he's going to suffer. there is no gray area. he survives pregnancy, he will suffer. and your options in texas are nothing. so then what happens? >> so we talked in circles, and we kept saying, what can we do to help our baby? what can we do as this babies parents to help the suffering end, and we just didn't get anywhere. finally, the doctor looked at me and said, you should probably get a second opinion, but outside of texas. it was very clear what he was saying, which was, we needed to leave the state. we walked down to the lobby and at that moment he handed me a big stack of papers. it was my medical records, and they were saying, we can transfer them anywhere, we can't tell you where to go. good luck. on the same day that i was told my son wouldn't survive, that this pregnancy, that from the moment this test turn positive, i had dreamed of this life -- the same day i learned that, i was also told to go figure out where to get the healthcare that i needed. and i went home and immediately fell to my bathroom floor, sobbing, because of this loss. i had to pick up the phone and start calling clinics and trying to figure out, how do i get the my records? what do i do? it was one of the most dramatic days of my life. >> what happened next? >> so we finally found a clinic, and we actually found two clinics. there were some competing timelines, and there was a lot of -- some states have -- sorry. some states have waiting restrictions, so i had to sign a lot of paperwork saying i had read all the concerns and i knew how long. we had to travel based on those wait times. i was finally able to find one clinic that was able to get me in, and we had to figure out what we were going to do with our son, what i was going to tell my employer. this was 45 days after sb- eight. i didn't want to put anyone else at risk for being caught getting me the help i needed. and so we just laughed. my husband and i just laughed. we got on a plane and we went out of state, and then i had to go to a clinic where they allowed protesters within a certain amount, and i walked past signs that told me i was a murderer. and as i went in to get basic healthcare to and my child suffering. >> and this wasn't your last brush with tragedy and the inability in the year 2023, right? to care for yourself, and your unborn child. tell us what happened next for you. >> so after we returned, i kind of fell into a deep state of depression, because i just still was having this very hard time processing the loss of my child and this whole thing being politicized. i just kind of the conversations and things that were happening, but i was able to see mental health in my own resources, and i was able to get pregnant a few months later . i unfortunately miscarried that pregnancy. when i went to my doctor, i found out that my body was not processing that miscarriage on its own and i would i would need mifepristone. i left my doctor's office, went to the pharmacy, and the pharmacist told me they would need more indication from my doctor as to why i needed this prescription. i remember just turning around and walking out, because i was actively miscarrying. i was actively bleeding and i said, i am not doing this again. i was able to find a pharmacy that filled it. then i got pregnant again and i miscarried again, and after that, we chose ivf as our next journey so we could try to get a better medical understanding of what was happening. i was fortunate that my ivf worked and i was able to get pregnant, and then 10 months later, i gave birth to my daughter. i remember holding her on my chest inking, it's over. you are here, i can meet you. my doctor told me that there was a problem. my placenta was not delivering and that i needed to go to the o.r. to have a d&c to remove the remaining tissue. and then we waited and we waited and we waited. i started throwing up, i started shaking violently. they finally took me back to the o.r. there was intense confusion. it was just chaotic. not what you expect when they say were going to take you back here a very standard procedure. as i'm laying there waiting for the procedure to start, i felt something on my arm dripping, and i grabbed a nurse and looked down and i was actually bleeding from my i.v. i was going at a hemorrhagic shock. i lost consciousness after that. i woke up sometime later and was told that i have lost half of my blood volume and that i should be grateful that i didn't lose my uterus. and after that, i was transferred to the icu. and the first night of my daughter's life, i didn't get to spend it with her. i spent it in an icu three floors away, because for some reason, they couldn't give me standard medical care for a postpartum hemorrhage. >> kaitlyn, you are so lucky to be alive right now. i know you know that. you are not alone in losing a baby you desperately wanted and wanting to end your sons suffering. you are not alone in needing healthcare after you delivered your daughter, but you are in a very, very small, small, small club of telling your story publicly. with so many women have endured privately. i believe i said this to amanda. i believe you and she and the others who are talking about your most painful, and in your case, your harrowing health moments, and in amanda's case, the very same, you are hoping to change the country and change the trajectory of this moment in our history and saving other women hopefully from the same thing. i am so happy for you and your daughter and your family and i'm so grateful to you for telling your story. thank you. >> thank you for having me. i really hope women take from this story that you don't know the reproductive care you are going to need until you need it. emergency care, ivf, miscarriage management, everything is under attack right now and the only person on the ballot this november was pledged to get us those rights back is joe biden. biden. ♪ ♪ [ engine revving ] oh now we're torquin'! the dodge hornet r/t. the totally torqued-out crossover. 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it can be killed. it is wounded when the people involved in the judicial system and the adjudication of alleged crimes are being threatened and harassed and intimidated and pressured out of jobs were continuing that work. >> the rule of law is mortal. that was my colleague, rachel maddow, building up to an interview. it will make sense the way i played it just now. donald trump has spent the better part of the last eight years doing everything in his power to strip from the american people their confidence in all of our institutions. by his telling, elections are rigged, everything is rigged. in the long-term, these attacks have an overwhelmingly corrosive and dangerous effect on the very foundational pillars of our democracy. the rule law is under attack, and in rachel's words, it needs to be protected. senator harding seems like maybe he was listening when attorney general merrick garland submitted to the washington post today an op-ed that served as something of a public warning. unfounded attacks on the justice department must end. after ticking through a series of recent conspiracy theories and threats of violence, garland exists such acts could help carry its mission. it was reminiscent of what he told the republican-led house judiciary committee just last week. >> certain members of this committee and the oversight committee are seeking contempt as a means of obtaining for no legitimate purpose sensitive law enforcement information that could harm the integrity of future investigations. i will not be intimidated, and the justice department will not be intimidated. >> these threats will not go away, they won't go away because of what he said or wrote. they won't go away in short over order. in fact, if today proves anything, it's that even when the rule of law works out in a way that damages the current president, trump's political adversary , and it could actually benefit trump lyrically -- president joe biden's own son was convicted in a court of law. many elements of the far right insist that there is some conspiracy in play and that it is all a sham. again, to rachel's warning, the rule of law is mortal, and now it's up to all of us to put protected. the host of the rachel maddow show here on msnbc, rachel maddow. she's also the host of the podcast ultra. the first episode is available. rachel, it is such a heavy new cycle. your thoughts. >> well, i think that if the biden administration has weapon iced the legal system of this country to only ever go after republicans and never go after democrats, i think today proves that they are doing an absolutely terrible job of that. are they really falling down on the job. allowing the presidents son not only to be prosecuted, but convicted, and then somehow manipulating president joe biden into saying i respect the rule of law, am not pardoning my son. he may appeal, but we respect the jury's verdict. that is really not what you would expect. we've also got bob menendez on trial, democratic senator. we have a democratic congressman who is criminally indicted and going on trial. the important thing about this is that it gives lie to the republican critique, to the trump creed that there is something about the justice system that is skewed against them and is designed to help democrats. i mean, i think we know in our heads that that hasn't been a good faith critique, but a day like today should disprove it, right? if they were arguing on a rational basis, it is not based on facts. it is just designed as an attack against the american system of government because they are running against the american system of government and it is really not about the facts of any individual case. >> i think that my habit that i am determined to break in this election cycle is to stop looking for the circuit breaker, or the thing that breaks the fever. did we get them? can we show them? do they believe now that the rule of law is a real thing ? and it didn't. and i was disappointed again. i want to stop asking the wrong questions, and i feel like so much of what we have to get right this time, because way too much is on the line, is that the question isn't -- did some on the right finally become persuaded that the rule of law is a real thing, but it also treats everything fairly is joe biden stood by when his son was convicted and said no, he won't pardon him? the question is, was it all a projection? and i wonder what you think, what you take from this, that there is no equivalence. there is no need to seek out symmetry, because the right isn't asking the same questions. they are not having the same conversation. >> there's a reason that donald trump and supporters of trump have been immune to fact checking over the past five to eight years, or nine years i guess now. it's because they don't care about being wrong. this isn't a fact-based appeal they are making to people. they are trying to make you feel like america is in an emergency. that america is under existential attack from evil people who must be destroyed by any means necessary. there is an enemy within and we are in such dire straits as a country we need to get rid of our system of government, get rid of all this process, get rid of all the safeguards and checks and balances and instead just have somebody who is going to slay the demon. just have somebody was going to vanquish our enemies once and for all. and if you are going to make that kind of a case, you are not making it based on the observable facts in the world, where you are horrified if you are found to be wrong and then you correct it, or new factor i that disprove what you have previously been saying and so you course correct. and so it's not about the fact of what they are asserting. it's about the fight. and so it puts of those who are sort of still living in a reason based world at a disadvantage, because you can't bring reason into a fight with somebody who's not trying to actually rationally persuade you. they are just trying to upset you. i still think that is what we need to do, right? i don't think we should expect the trump right and the trump republican party to be persuaded by new facts. but we should continue to report and describe and contextualize responsibly the actual facts of the world. in the hopes that the crazy conspiratorial fact free stuff that they are selling will ultimately have fewer buyers in the larger public. right? you can't move cash patel. you can't move lara trump, or whatever her name is. you are not going to move people with rational argument, let alone trump himself. maybe someone who doesn't pay that much attention to politics will also hear the facts from you and from responsible news organizations. and they will recognize that what they are trying to sell his bunk, and they won't vote for it. it's unromantic, that is the task. stay wedded to the truth. keep confronting them and contradicting them when they are wrong and pointing out true things. and believe the best of our fellow citizens. >> this has been prime time weekend. i am nicolle wallace. please tune into all of our prime time shows weekdays on msnbc. blocks heartburn for a full 24 hours. for one and done heartburn relief, prilosec otc. one pill a day, 24 hours, zero heartburn. salonpas lidocaine flex. a super thin, flexible patch with maximum otc strength lidocaine that contours to the body to relieve pain right where it hurts. and did we mention, it really, really sticks? 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