and today if a majority of -- or if justice kennedy is the controlling vote here and he sees this more as federalism than discrimination, that could be a very narrow opinion as well. >> pete, let's look at this thing. here's justice kennedy. it focuses on his concerns about the defense of marriage act. i think he's going to strike it down. doma. and how it interferes with state rights, as you say. let's listen. >> when it has 1,100 laws, which in our society means that the federal government is intertwined with the citizens' day-to-day life, you are at -- at real risk of running in conflict with what has always been thought to be the essence of the state police power, which is to regulate marriage, divorce, custody. >> so how -- i'm sorry. i want to bring howard in. >> reporter: i was going to say,