Of your words and you can pause when answering questions so that we capture your complete response. Thank you very much and ms. Barnes, youre now recognized for five minutes. Ms. Bans, yrnes, you may have t unmute. I think were having trouble hearing you. Proceed, ms. Barnes. I think you just unmuted. Okay. Chairman pappas, chairwoman brownley, Ranking Member bergman, chairman takano, members of the subcommittee and task force, thank you for inviting me here today to discuss gaos work for Sexual Harassment at the department of veteran affairs. I will talk about statements from my june report released last week. The protection board estimated that 22 of va employees experience some form of Sexual Harassment in the workplace. Va has several methods to address such Sexual Harassment complaints. But we found that the agency was falling short in a number of areas. Including one, its complaint structure, collection of incidents on Sexual Harassment and actions taken, and, three, provision information to va employees. First i will discuss issues with the current complaint structure which has three problems. The first is that vas organizational structure did not adhere tie key directive from the equal Employment Opportunity commission. This states that the they may not oversee personnel functionsans e, o functions. However, the eeo director has oversight responsibility for both of these. In order to maintain the ining at the drintegrity or avoid the conflict of interest, the director states that those must be kept separate from the agencys personnel function. Our report indicates that he realigns his position to adhere to the directive. The va did not concur with this recommendation. The second problem has to do with the eeo Program Managers. Those who interface with employees in the systems. They say Program Managers should report to office the resolution management or orm instead of the director of the local facility in order to prevent real or perceived conflicts of interest. However, two of these three administrations are not structured this way. Our report recommends the va complete these realignments and va has plans for these realignments that stretch into 2024. The third problem relates to vas Harassment Prevention Program or hpp which va has had for over four years and cited in the Sexual Harassment policy. Hpp is ib tended to prevent and address harassment, including Sexual Harassment, yet neither policy director or the implementation handbook have been approved by va leadership and distributed to employees. We found that the failure to approve and distribute these documents has contributed continue to consistent implementation and lack of aware bnts program. Our report recommends that va finalize these documents. Let me turn to the second area of concern. Information collection incidents of Sexual Harassment and actions taken. First ill talk about what va knows about the extent of harassment. Va relies on complaint data to understand the Sexual Harassment at the agency. But these data are incomplete. Va has data on complaints that are made through Prevention Program or through the formal eeo process but not all complaints are made to managers. Currently theres no requirement for managers to report this information to the orm. In addition, va does not use additional available information that could inform its efforts to address Sexual Harassment such as data from spv survey would suggest many employees do not file formal complaints when they experience Sexual Harassment. Our report requires that va requires managers to report all Sexual Harassment complaints to orm and va said it would implement a new system by the end of september, 2021. Now turn to what va knows about corrective actions taken to address Sexual Harassment. Va does not have a comprehensive plan to make sure that corrective actions such as disciplines that are decided upon as a result of Sexual Harassment complaints are actually carried out. Theres an assurance process in place for corrective actions related to eeo complaints, but not for complaints resolved by managers or through hpp. Our report recommends that va ensure that corrective actions are implemented and the va told us they will require this by the end of september 2021. The third and final problematic area id like to discuss today is the provision of information to va employees. They have overarching Sexual Harassment policy regarding provisioning and of employees that is supplying all of its employees. Va and its three administrations have additional policies to support it, however, some not consistent with the overarching policy and some have outdated or missing information. Our report recommends that va completes these actions and update its policies across all of its administrations in the conclusion, an agencys ability to prevent and address today on the issue of Sexual Harassment within the department of Veterans Affairs. As an Organization Made up of w women, va members rely on the Va Health Care system to meet their unique servicerelated health care and rehabilitative needs. And while data shows us most Veterans Trust vha and are satisfied with their care, certain groups evof veterans including women algbtq report they are still receiving harassment. The report last year found 25 of womens reported inappropriate or unwanted comments or behavior by male veterans while seeking Va Health Care. This is compared to a National Survey finding where only 5 of nonveteran woman respondents reported Sexual Harassment in a private Sector Health care setting. This disparity cannot be ignored and begs the question why are reports of harassment so much higher at va . What is the impact on them being hara harass and what can be done . Women were more likely to report being unwelcome in va and not likely to report being harassed. 67 skriend positive for military sexual trauma and 80 reported combat or lifetime exposure to trauma. The consequences in delaying or missing here could be devastating for the veteran who Needs Mental Health services for treating ptsd due to War Time Service or sexual trauma. And we know veterans of any gend we are a history of trauma are at a greater risk of Poor Health Outcomes and suicide. Despite significant increases in women come together va for care over the past decade, they still comprise 8 of vas 7 million plus patients. As such, women in va care find themselves outnumbered by male veterans in nearly all health care settings. And given that Sexual Harassment and assault remain a persistent problem in the military, it is not unexpected that we would see this behavior continued in va. In both the military and va, women have not always been recognized and appreciated for their contributions in military service. And we continue to hear reports from Women Veterans who use va care about a general lack of regard from their male peers. One woman veteran noted you get the feeling that you shouldnt be here, not as much as a man. And, that your service doesnt matter. A veteran Service Organizations can play an Important Role in changing the va culture and im proud to say that were all in and well do our part to help make vha a safe, welcoming, and harassment free environment for all va staff and veterans. Dbs leadership continues to champion this effort. Our National Commander recently showed a video message across social platforms to raise awareness about harassment and called on db for to us do our part in being respectful and welcoming to sfellow veterans. In a recent article dedicated his column to this important issue saying none of us should be willing to stand by while a fellow veteran, regardless of gender, faces any type of harassment or disrespect. Respect must begin with each and every one of us. And while vha stand up to stop harassment now declaration is commendable, we cant rely solely on words. We need action. We recommend va leadership develop a comprehensive campaign with a strategy for effecting change at all levels of the department and a policy that responsibilities and includes staff training to ensure implementation of the plan systemwide. As a first step, we suggest all Va Medical Center leadership make an honest assessment harassment in their facility and then partner with veterans encouraging them to help recommend solutions to identify problems. For women and minority veterans, harassment is not just an aannoyance, but detrimental to their Overall Health and wellbeing. For these reasons, we appreciate the subcommittee and the task force attention to this issue and efforts to find Viable Solutions to end this unacceptable behavior. Mr. Chairman, that concludes my remarks and im happy to answer any yes questioquestions you ma thank you both for your testimony. Well begin the questioning portion of this panel. Ill begin by recognizing myself for five minutes. I just want to thank our gao and dav witnesses for being with us today and for your comments. Im hopeful that you both were here for the first panel and heard the comments from deputy secretary powers. Im wondering if i could get your comments on her testimony, specifically to the point of if v sanction movi va is moving in the right direction and if theyre moving quickly enough to address some of the concerns that you both have . Well, im happy to go right ahead. Im happy to take a first stab at that question. Certainly we appreciate vas efforts that seem to be under way. But like the subcommittee has mentioned, a number of you, we certainly have concerns about the length of time that its taking them to get a policy in place. And i think the Ranking Member put it nicely that, you know, theres almost theres two different issues. One is the harassment issue within va from an hr an employee issue, but also this issue with veteran on veteran harassment where we get continued reports, especially in Women Veterans and minority veterans. We want to see the va move expeditiously to move both of these issues at the same time. They vishd a declaration in vha that they want to stund stop harassment now and theyve listed a number of points that they want, which i think would satisfy everyone. But we want to see what are those action plans . We want the dso community to be involved in those solutions to really put out this problem, that needs to happen. So while we appreciate the work that theyve started, we want to make sure that they work on getting a plan together to work on this very expeditiously. And we also look thanks for your comments. Barnes, go ahead. Sure. We also appreciate the work that va has done, that they have started and we do commend those efforts. But there are certain efforts such as finalizing the policies, especially with respect to the Harassment Prevention Program, making sure that their central policy is consistent across all of their administrations and things like that that we think should be done pretty quickly as well as looking, again, at the alignment of the structural issue that they have. This is one where theyve been notified several times by the eeoc and they received a program deficiency notice about this in february. And i know they said they would reach out to their eeoc and consider, you know, what they needed to do along those lines. But they have a number of things that they can move out on in a shortterm fashion pretty quickly. Well, i appreciate those comments. Ms. Barnes, i want to thank you as well for the gao report on todays hearing topic. It examined many important aspects of va Sexual Harassment policies and procedures and provide the committee with very helpful information. And i hope youll convey that to all of the staff that was involved in the report. And beyond that, ms. Barnes, id like to, you know, dive a little bit deeper into the question of the equal Employment Opportunity leadership. And we raise this with the va witnesses, your testimony stated that we should realign its eeo director position to adhere to eeocs directives. It seems that va says the assistant secretary of Human Resources in charge doesnt handle Sexual Harassment and other eeo work on a daily basis so theres no problem. But can you elaborate a little bit more on whether vas response makes sense to this question . Sure. This is just one of point out, one, eeoc is a federal Government Agency that oversees eeo matters. And this directive structure alignment issue is an eeoc directive. And the problem with it is that when you have the same agency official, ieceven if theyre sag theyre not personally responsible but they are responsible for executing and advising on Personnel Matters and actions is the same person thats going to be managing and advising and overseeing the eeo complaint process, theres still that appearance or potential conflict of interest there. These functions need to be separate because the eeos program processes are to scrutinize and challenge the motivations, impacts of the personnel decisions. And with the eeoc already pointing out this deficiency several times to the va and the e, oc also has agreed to work with them to provide Technical Assistance, we just think that the va should get in line with this eeoc directive. Well thank you once again for your comments. My time support. With that id like to turn things over to general bergman for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman. And, again, before i start, you know, as one of the original requesters of the report i want to commend and thank gao for your efforts and what you provided for us. Because it i know it doesnt have all the answers, but its certainly going a long way towards getting us to ask the right questions. Ms. Barnes, we kind goff back a of go back and forth on where should offices be placed for maximum effectiveness. According to the report, gao spoke with the eeoc about its concern that the misalignment of the eeo director position in va. Does the eeoc have a recommendation as to exactly where va should place the eeo director . Our understanding is that the eeoc does not have a specific recommendation, but they are willing to provide Technical Assistance to the va to help them work through this structural issue. And that Technical Assistance or that meeting was supposed to have occurred, but we had to finish our work so we dont know what the status of that or we dont know if it happened. When youre providing Technical Assistance, you know, sometimes you can be i facilitator not really having an expertise or understanding, you just want to create the conversation. You could be a subject Matter Expert that potentially could could help you help you help va to establish a plan of action. Seems like the waters still a little bit muddy there as as what do the difference entities believe is the correct, you know, place for this eeo director position within the va . Th does gao have an independent recommendation on where va should place the office . We dont. Our advice is that they work with eeoc, take them up on that Technical Advice and work through that to make sure they can overcome the structural issue. Okay. It might be interesting, i believe, mr. Chairman, for the committee to know, even though we deal with Veterans Affairs here, it say Bureaucratic Agency of the federal government, for us to see a list of where these offices are placed within the other agencies, whether its do, dod, whatever it happens to be to get us comparison. But in the end, we need to get it working and place whered it will be part of solutions, not potentially either a conflict of interest or part of problems inhibiting growth or inhibiting advancement. Va was not in compliance, ms. Barnes still for you, please, va was not in compliance with eeoc guidance. The gao ask the eoc whether the other agencies out of compliance and whether cure notices were issued to those agencies . We didnt ask about other federal agencies that was outside of the scope of this review. But im sure thats something that maybe the va and eeoc can talk about as kind of a model to help them decide where to place this position. Okay. I guess, again, it might be helpful for the committee to know if there are any existing if theres any existing data within gao that, again, reflect other agencies. Because to try to build a historical model here to go forward with our recommendations or what we might hope for the va to do. Ms. Ilem, the 2016 mspb survey found that va employees reported that 29 of Sexual Harassment that they experienced was at the hands of the customer member of the public, which in this case that means the veterans you represent. Additionally, 25 of female veteran patient reported inappropriate or unwanted comment from other veterans. Would you please expound on what dav has done and what it is doing to educate its members on their role in making va a more welcoming place . Thank you for the question. As i mentioned in my testimony, dav takes this issue very seriously. And from our leadership on down we want to make sure that were conveying the message that this is a problem, it needs to be corrected, and its going to take all of us to Work Together to do it. In talking with many of our members, most cant believe that this happens. And theyre appalled at this behavior. So, weve talked about, you know, what do you do when you see inappropriate behavior . You know, either report it to someone at the va or intervene yourself. But dont just stand by and let someone be harassed. Its really going to take all of us to help each other and same thing, if another veteran sees a veteran another veteran harassing a va employee, the same goes. So were trying to make sure that people are aware of this and that its a continuing problem and for the veterans that are harassed, it impacts them tremendously that theyre not going to come back to the va to get the care that they really need, which could be dit t detrimental. I hate to cut you short but im about a minute over my time. Could i ask one quick question because its a yes or no question for ms. Ilem. Does dav staff at the national and local level receive training on how to assist members to deal with to deal with Sexual Harassment . Does training exist for dav members . Well, we do have our no. We do have our National Staff has certain training regarding Sexual Harassment. But were looking to va to partner with va at va facilities to be involved in the training that they were talking about, which is doing that scenario training. Okay. Thank you. And mr. Chairman, thank you and i yield back. Well thanks for your questions and also your constructive point about what happens in other agencies with that role. And id love to take a look at that with you. With that, id like to turn things over to ms. Brownley for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman. First question for me is to ms. Barnes. Ms. Barnes, i appreciate your report. There were several things that were very surprising to me in reading the report, but the one thing that jumped out the most for me is around the reporting piece. And the fact that there is no requirement or mandate that these harassment cases are reported. So, you said that the va has accepted that and is going to start collecting that data in 2021. I cant remember what month you said that they would comply in 2021. But, to me, this just seems like something that, you know, the va could turn on tomorrow. What doesnt i dont know what it requires other than saying, you will report these cases. So, is it is it more complicated than that . Can you speak to that . Sure. Va has a process or several processes, i should point out. They have their eeo process, the harassment prevention process, and then Sexual Harassment complaints that come in to managers. Its that last bucket here that we are talking about in our report. Theres no requirement, they dont have a centralized Information System that where they report and not only where they report, but where they can even see if actions were taking to corrective actions that were taken to address the Sexual Harassment. What they responded to us is that they are developing a Case Management system and theyre ryg requiring all requiring all of these managers to report that ractiaction, but will not be in place until september of next year, 2021. So, i mean, to me it just doesnt seem complicated. It just sort of to me it says, you know, tomorrow we will direct managers to collect this data. Is it i mean, is that possible for them to do . Yes, that is possible for them to do. They do it in a number of different ways and because they dont have a centralized, you know, way to report it and to track it, they just, you know, dont know, you know, fully whats reported throughout the agency. Okay. Yeah. I can give you some additional examples like vha has a spreadsheet that they use. Vba has, you know, some different procedural changes that they use. So its kinda disjointed throughout. So they really need that centralized tracking system. Okay. Thank you. Ms. Ilem, i wanted to ask you the va folks are saying, you know, that vsos were part of the process of their development of their harassment of prevention strategies. Can you confirm that thats the case and that you were involved and other davs were involved and had opportunities to make suggestions . Well, i think that while when he some opportunities to let va know that there that there are issues, you know, where we can all Work Together and partner. But what wed like to see more, were not really having seen the va reach out in our Service Organization level at each of the facilities. We all have different departments and chapters that are willing to work with va at those facilities to try and make those changes. And i think thats really the missing link right now. Va does say on their declaration that they should partner with vsos to stop harassment. But what does that you know, we want to see specifics on that. There needs to be, you know, bringing folks together to really talk about this issue, whether that be a town hall meeting, bringing folks in to do focus groups within their facility to really determine where the problem spots within the facility, what have they seen and have come up with Good Solutions for thank you. And the other im pretty sure it was in your report, it might have been in another testimony, i should say, not report, but that that 25 of women report harassment at va facilities but at nonva facilities the number falls to to me, thats another glaring statistic. Im frustrated by the fact that everybody has different data, they dont they dont seem to jive. They dont, you know, you dont see trends in the data the way i think that you would like to. At least in my opinion. But, ive run out of time. But, i am what the cultural forces are within the va that fosters this kind of prevalence within an organization. So, i think well just have to pursue this at a later point. But i i thank you for your testimony and your presence here today and i will yield back, mr. Chairman. Thank you. I now recognize mr. Bost for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Ms. Barnes, in the last panel, im sure you heard when i asked why it was going to take until 2024 to implement the gaos second recommendation dealing with the eo Program Manager realignment at vha, you think that it really has to take till 2024 to fulfill this request . Or you think it can be done inc we lost it paused. Please. Im sorry, i didnt hear the question you you froze. Okay. The question the dba heard from any of its members have had Sexual Harassment since weve been working on this. Harassment at the vba, Veterans Benefits facility . Yes. I i have not heard reports within vba. How about va . Are you talking about overall yes. Since weve been going through this process, as your group been continuing to hear these concerns and of new cases . Yes. We do we have continued these have been continued complaints that we hear from veterans and we have our seminars, when occasionally when the veterans call in to talk about the issue, something thats happened. These have been ongoing for, you know, sometime. Is it more patientonpatient . Those are generally the reports we get from Women Veterans, that theres certain congregations of veterans at certain facilities where it might be the atrium, it might be the outside, it might be in a in the lunchroom or waiting area where they say they experience these. And thats why we called on leadership in those facilities to look and have people go out and sit and observe to see whats happening. And this is kind of a rough question to ask, but im going to go down this path because do you find that when it is patientonpatient, it is an older generation that is stepping down this path . I dont know necessarily that its, you know, just an older generation. I think it happens in a variety of places with younger veterans as well, from what weve heard with talking with them. Okay. Thank you both. And i got a little bit of time left, but i will yield back. Thank you. Thank you. I would recognize mr. Cisneros for five minutes. Thank you, mr. Chairman. In vas testimony they state that va continues to emphasize that Customer Service is one of the vas overreaching priorities. However, bsos have raised the concerns of clerks and greeters asking Women Veterans if theyre there for their husbands appointment. Are you hearing from your veterans on issues around the culture of Customer Service at the va . Do they do you agree with the vas statement . To be fair to va, i think theyve done a lot to improve Customer Service overall in general from what weve seen. But this is a persistent problem we hear from Women Veterans when their name is called out, being called mister or when they approach someone for assistance and theyre asked, are you asking for your husband . You know, so just not having that recognition they feel assuming that youre a veteran, and that makes them feel that theyre not understood in a place where, you know, its a system made supposed to be made for them, for veterans. And they need to express that and it continues to happen. Is it Customer Service straini training that we need to continue to work on in order to change that . I think making sure that Customer Service at all levels, you know, from that front greeter to, you know, the volunteer thats helping someone will help, but also just making sure that the training and providing some information about the role of women in the military today and their service and highlighting what they do so that theres a better understanding i think in general how the va employees at all levels to understand and recognize Women Veterans. All right. Thank you. Ms. Barns, gao found that the mandatory Training Programs do not adequately inform employees about how to identify and address Sexual Harassment. In previous administrations, the efte worked to Design Training on this issue and others issues as well. Will you speak to the value of Labor Management partnerships that would the value that it would bring to the va if they engage afta and other unions to work on this training . Yeah, sure. The value that it would bring to the va is hopefully they could identify where there were continued gaps. They could find out what employees needed, what supervisors needed and fill in those any gaps or any voids in the training. One of the things that we talked about in our report about training is va has this overarching training, but it was providing, some details providing specific modules that really got into some details of how to recognize and how to report Sexual Harassment. Its one of the things we focus on as well as more on their Harassment Prevention Program which was lacking in a lot of their overarching training materials. Also in the gao report there was mention the need for bystander vintervention to help employees recognize problematic behaviors and how to empower them to take action as listed in the report. Will you elaborate on the importance of Bystander Intervention . Yes, because one thing that the merit system protection board study, we cite the 22 of those that have experienced Sexual Harassment, but there was a number of 33 of those who had observed Sexual Harassment. What the bystander training would do, would help for those who are observing this behavior, recognize the implications there, report it to the appropriate officials so it can be addressed appropriately. Has there been other departments within the government where this training has been held and its worked and youve seen results . Our review focused on the va. Its i cant speak to, you know, the other the departments and the government and thousand the training has been successful. But its a proven training, right . You wouldnt recommend this unless youve seen results or theres been published results that this Bystander Intervention as worked. Its certainly a necessary training to help, you know, with reporting and the addressing Sexual Harassment. All right. With that, i yield back. Thank you. Thank you. Ill now recognize ms. Kuster for five minutes. I appreciate the opportunity to stick with you this afternoon. I wanted to ask a question of you, ms. Barnes. I said earlier the frustration i feel that after eight years in congress were still having this conversation about the va and i cant help but feel that this is partly due to the leadership at top of this country, not having the respect for members of the military but most importantly for women serving our country and this type of implicit bias that runs throughout persistent, pervasive throughout the va in some ways is just exhausting. They put their lines on the line and the least we could do as general bergman said is to treat them with respect. I want to thank you, ms. Barnes, and your colleagues for your incredible diligence and thoroughness in this report. As we look at your recommendations and vas plans to address them, im curious if there are issues that we have not discussed that concern you the most at this point in this hearing . Well, we certainly have addressed it a lot of the issues. I think some of the timing aspects that weve been talking about, certainly with respect to issuing finalized policies for their Harassment Prevention Program i think also making that their overarching policies are consistent throughout with all of the administrations, things like that, should be done pretty quickly. I know weve been talking about the timing of it. So that is something that, you know, we also are looking at. I think some of the longerterm plans, one in particular, i was just asked this question a few minutes ago in terms of the eeo Program Manager alignments. I think whats key there is theyve done it with one of their administrations. Vba is in process. But vha said they didnt see whether it was necessary to do and they were going to wait until the other ones are done. That was key to point out in terms of timing and why things are taking so long. If you dont agree that it needs to be done, youre not going to start implementing it. I want to point out a few of those and to emphasize that. That sounds like dragging their feet or they dont understand the extent of the problem or they themselves have difficulty with respecting the role of women in our military and the respect that our Women Veterans deserve. Ms. Ilem, thank you so much for your testimony as well. Its an important reminder that the task before the va is to protect the patients and workforce alike from Sexual Violence and harassment. Could you comment on cases in which veterans end up going to work for the va . Im concerned that situations can arise where veterans who have experienced harassment and violence during their Service Careers can be retraumatized by harassment they encounter in their va workplace. Very good points. I think in some of the research that va has done, theyve outlined that issue of retraumaization. So whether theyre an employee or, again, just a patient go into here that they need for ptsd related to Sexual Assault, the issue of, again, you know, experiencing that harassment is so detrimental and so that is a piece that, you know as you said, its so frustrating that were still dealing with issue and the impact on the people that what an effect this has because i think people dont realize how that impacts them when they go home. They turn around, go back to their car, call in and say i cant make my appointment. No one knows what happened to them and what are the situations that, you know, are created as theyve been retraumatized for Something Like that happening. Well, i can certainly say here in New Hampshire from the meetings that ive had with Women Veterans, and, by the way, this type of harassment can happen to male veterans as well. We know that. We know the Sexual Assault in the military impacts men but the women that ive spoken to here in New Hampshire have talked about how they simply do not seek care because our Womens Health clinic was on the sixth floor and they would it was abusive honestly for them to step onto an elevator. They would be assaulted in the elevator. And so we were working with the administrators at the hospital to move the clinic to the first floor and have a separate entrance and we had done that in White River Junction at the hospital there and its been highly successful. They literally needed a separate entrance so that they werent in a waiting room mixed gender where they suffered from harassment, they werent assaulted on the elevator. They werent harassed throughout the visit. But they could come in a separate entrance, separate staff, be treated with respect, and i think thats a model that i would recommend for the va. Again, mr. Chair, i very much appreciate the opportunity to be with you today. I miss the va committee, but as chair of the Bipartisan Task force to end Sexual Violence, this is discouraging and i really thank you for putting your shoulder to the wheel to my good friend Julia Brownley for her role in chairing the womens task force and to all of you on the second panel for the work that you do. Thank you. And i yield back. Thank you very much. I just have one quick question for ms. Ilem. In your testimony you described some particular charges for lgbtq veterans and you noted a 2013 study by the va identifying barriers to care for lgbtq veterans that included concern about the overall culture of the vha. Could you comment on how this impacts the vas ability to address Sexual Harassment. I think its just it just shows another sub population of veterans who have made points about experiencing gender harassment at the va and i think the important pieces, you know, it has to be acknowledged, like the experience office that deputy secretary spoke about, the veterans experience office. Theyve done something related to Women Veterans. I think they need to do that for other minority veterans. To really look at what is their experience, what is their typical experience when they go to va and what is beneficial to them in terms of, you know what do they value most in terms of going to get their care from the va, but at the same time, what that experience is actually like for them so that they can address any issues. Listening to veterans and doing focus groups, that was a new thing that you saw and appreciated that va did. Thank you for that. Ms. Brownlee, did you have an additional question . One quick one for ms. Barnes. Weve heard from women employees at the va that theyve been discouraged from reporting harassment by male patients because of a reverence for male veterans service. Im wondering if you heard from employees if you heard from employees regarding this issue while youve talked to employees in conducting your study . Can you comment on that . We did not specifically hear about that in our study because of our focus on employees. And so but you interviewed employees, right . Yes. And did you interview more women than men employees . Or it was just a random sampling. It was a random sampling. It was mostly those in charge of administering the program. Mostly in charge of administering the program. So just not employees working at the va who might be victims of Sexual Harassment . Right. Thats correct. Okay. I yield back. Thank you. Anything further from any Committee Members . Do you have any closing comments . With that i want to thank our witnesses again for their testimony today, their knowledge, personal experiences and perspectives are critical to this conversation moving forward. And without a doubt, both sides of the aisle feel strongly that addressing Sexual Harassment at va must be a priority. I look forward to working with all the members on both sides of the aisle of our house Veterans Affairs committee and others as we continue to conduct oversight, monitor developments and press for improvements. Congress has a role to play and i plan to introduce legislation that will require va to implement gaos recommendations in a timelier fashion. With that, all members will have five legislative days to revise extended remarks and include any materials. The hearing is now adjourned. Weeknights this month, were featuring American History tv programs as a preview of whats available every weekend on cspan3. Tonight, a look at the Supreme Court historical society. Founded in 1974 to collect and preserve the history of the nations highest court. We begin an evening of their programs with yale law professor justin driver on the 1956 southern manifesto, a document written by congressional members who opposed the Supreme Courts 1954 brown v. Board of education decision which ruled that segregated schools were unconstitutional. Watch tonight at 8 00 p. M. Eastern. Enjoy American History tv this week and every weekend on cspan3. American history tv on cspan3, exploring the people and events that tell the american story every weekend. Coming up this weekend, saturday at 2 00 p. M. Eastern, the white house conference on American History with president trumps september 17th executive order establishing a National Commission to promote, quote, patriotic education. Then at 5 05 p. M. Eastern, a look at nazi persecution and murder of the disabled with the u. S. Holocaust memorial museum. Sunday at 4 00 p. M. Eastern on reel america, a series of films on wildfires, firefighting and fire prevention. And at 6 30 p. M. Eastern, watch the 1984 Vice President ial debate. Exploring the american story, watch American History tv this weekend on cspan3. Sunday night on q a, the Cato Institute talks about ilva shapiros book. Roe v. Wade and the issue of abortion didnt play too large a role in the first couple of nominations after roe came down. Roe is 1973. Two years later, president ford nominated John Paul Stevens who was a moderate republican in his day, but sort of to the left but was not asked about that case. It had just been decided two years earlier and san dra day oconnor, i didnt play that large of a role. It wasnt until 1987 that roe assumed the huge role that it plays in all of our Supreme Court discussions. His book supreme disorder on cspans q a. Youre watching cspan3. Your unfiltered view of government. Created by americas Cable Television companies as a public