Transcripts For CSPAN3 Hearing On Policing Practices Oversight 20240714

Along with public trust. The House Committee on the judiciary will come to order. Without objection, the judge is authorized to declare recesses at any time. We welcome everyone to the oversight hearing on Police Practices. Before we begin, i want to briefly recognize susan jensen whose last day on the committee after 20 mores of service is tomorrow. Susan is highly respected on both sides of the aisle, is one of the preeminent experts on bankruptcy Administrative Law and the federal court system. It is a testament to her knowledge and fairness that she worked as counsel and later senior counsel for both republican and democratic chairs of this committee. First hired by former chair henry hyde for her expertise in bankruptcy law, susan later moved to the democratic staff under former chair and Ranking Member john conners where she expanded her portfolio to include Administrative Law and ethics issues. When i was elected to serve as chair, i also asked susan to serve as the community parliament. It included preparing reports and working across to aisle for markups and other committee activities. Regular viewers of this committee will recognize her as the person sitting behind me providing me wise counsel. Susan has been essential to the operations of this committee and she has been involved in nearly every piece of Committee Business over the last year. Although she will be leaving the commit, she will continue to Public Service as they transitioned to a position with the Administrative Office of the u. S. Courts. I wish you well and i thank you for all your years of service to this committee. You now recognize the Ranking Member for any comments he may have. Thank you. Theres so many things we do agree and this is one. As you just mentioned a minute ago, the two of our faces are on the screens of america a great deal, the greatest part about it is susan being behind us to soften the blow and make sure that i behave. Sometimes shell disagree and she can make you and i Work Together. Shes been amazing to work with. They know our faces and the members and they see these folks behind us, the folks behind us on both sides are a mission. The staffs of democratic and republican members have to put up with us, but in a Committee Role like this, you have been a friend, you are probably the one that i hear the name most often when i say john, he says well, susan called. Was i in trouble . And she said no. But susan, youre going to be missed and it will be hard to turn around and not see you here. But i am so happy for you. The beneficiary here is what youve done for the committee, but also what the Administrative Office of the courts is going to do. Theyre gaining, were losing and we acknowledge that. With that, i yield back to the chairman. I thank the gentleman. [ applause ] i thank the gentleman for his comments and i will now recognize myself for an opening statement. Todays hearing furthers our committees longstanding commitment to conducting meaningful oversight of state and federal Law Enforcement as initiated by former chairman and his establishment of the bipartisan policing stat jees working group. Together we have had productive conversations with improving relations between Law Enforcement officers and the communities they serve. And today we continue that important discussion. Without question, the vast majority of Law Enforcement officers serve honorably under difficult conditions, often risking and sometimes losing their lives to protect us. There have been, however, a disturbing number of incidents of Excessive Force used by police against civilians, many of whom were unarmed, most of whom were people of color and many resulted in tragic death that have put incredible strain on the relationships between Law Enforcement and their local communities. For example, on july 17th, 2014, five new York City Police Department Officers attempted to arrest eric garner, a 42yearold father of six, for allegedly selling loose cigarettes, by tackling him to the ground and placing him a an illegal choke hold. He repeatedly told the officers, i cant breathe. The officers ignored his pleas as he slipped into unconsciousness and death. No one was held criminally responsible for mr. Garners death. We are fortunate to be joined by mr. Garners mother, and i say to you that the criminal Justice System and the Justice System failed you, your son and your entire family. Shockingly, the officer responsible for placing mr. Garner in a departmentally banned choke hold remained on the force for five years before being finally fired this past august. On september 9th, 2015, james blake, an africanamerican, professional tennis player was standing outside a hotel in mid town manhattan when an officer charged him, wrestled him to the ground and placed him in handcuffs. New yorks civilian complaint board and review agency that reviews complaints of policemens conduct terms that the policeman used Excessive Force and recommended that the officer be punished with departmental disciplinary charges that could lead to suspension or dismissal. Instead his only punishment was to lose five vacation days. Mr. Garners death and the assault on mr. Blake, both at the hands of Police Officers sworn to protect and serve, should alarm all americans regardless of party, regardless of political ideology, regardless of race, religion or gender. This is not a partisan issue. There are no sides. Too often, the discourse on policemens conduct deskrends into a dichotomy of us versus them, black lives blue lives versus black lives. This is a false and dangerous dichotomy. The United States stands as the worlds greatest experiment in self government. Legitimacy rests on the consent of its people, we the people. This principle particularly applies to Law Enforcement, which has been given the authority to use deadly force under cover of law. There can be no doubt, unfortunately, that communities of color perceive Law Enforcement as a threat to their everyday freedoms. These perceptions go back decades, predating both the 1994 los angeles riots and the 1965 riots, both of which were sparked by a lack of accountability for incidents of Police Brutality. These perceptions are reality for africanamericans, according to the center for policing equity, africanamericans are two to four times more likely than white americans to have force used against them. For far too long, claims of misconduct coming from communities of color have often been ignored or not believed. Mr. Garners killing and a series of other examples of Police Misconduct against africanamericans, many of which were caught on video, make it unmistakenly clear that claims of Police Misconduct are all too often real. To list just a few, on august 5th, 2014, John Crawford was shot and killed by a Police Officer in a Walmart Store in beavercreek, ohio for holding a toy bb gun. On august 9th, 2014, Michael Brown who was unarmed was shot and killed by police in ferguson, missouri. On november 22nd, 2014, 12yearold ta mere rice who was unarmed was shot and killed by police in cleveland, ohio. On april 2nd, 2015, eric harris who was unarmed was shot and killed by police in tulsa, oklahoma. On april 4th, 2015, walter scott who was unarmed was shot and killed by police in north charleston, south carolina. On april 19th, 2015, freddy gray who was unarmed died in Police Custody in baltimore, maryland. On july 6th, 2016, samuel was shot and killed by police in cincinnati, ohio. The frequency of these killings and the absence of full accountability for those responsible sent a message to members of the Africanamerican Community that black lives do not matter. Let me state clearly for the record that black lives matter. Our criminal Justice System, including our preeolice departms cannot function unless people believe the system works to protect them. We must also be able to put ourselves in the shoes of our Law Enforcement officers. We must be able to celebrate the service and sacrifices of our men and women in Law Enforcement who put their lives on the line day in and day out. We must recognize the psychological toll that serving in such an inherently dangerous job can take on individual Law Enforcement officers and their families. It is also critical that we not paint Law Enforcement with a broad brush. The vast majority of officers execute their jobs with dignity, honor and respect for the citizens they serve and protect. Every american should take pride in that. Research shows that a small percentage of repeat offenders are responsible for the majority of incidents of misconduct. Todays hearing presents a unique opportunity for us to hear from some of the individuals of families affected by Police Misconduct. So i want to personally thank ms. Carr for speaking at this hearing on behalf of her son and mr. Blake for sharing his personal story with us. Today presents an opportunity for us to explore Bipartisan Solutions to make policing a safer more fulfilling job for Law Enforcement officers by restoring the trust and goodwill between police and the communities they serve. We can reexamine the efficacy of reforms and determine what further solutions are warranted. For example, we should examine whether the incentives created by the doctrine of qualified immunity remain useful in todays environment. We should consider legislative proposals to end racial profiling and to restore trust between Law Enforcement and the community. And we should explore ways to strengthen Data Collection on use of force and racial profiling so that Police Departments can measure the practices they manage. But most important, we can all agree that too testimony lives are put at risk and have been lost in Police Citizen encounters and that it is incumbent on each of us to Work Together as fellow americans to solve this problem. I tharcnk all of our witnesses r appearing and i look forward to their testimony. I now recognize the Ranking Member of the judiciary committee, the gentleman from georgia, mr. Collins for his opening statement. Thank you, mr. Chairman. I appreciate that. And before i get started i would like to add a letter from the Detectives Association of new york and also the National Police association for the record. Without objection. Thank you. I appreciate the chairmans opening and i think you covered a great deal of stuff. For me, and i have a lot of notes here and i think one of the things to start out this, is it is very important that Excessive Force where used ought to be punished. It should not be thought about, it should be punished. It should be acted on quibble and not drug out. If its in a Minority Community in particular or any other community, it needs to be looked at and processed and done so in a fair way to all involved so that there is justice, there is responsibility so that people do trust. But the one thing that i do want to focus on and the chairman did a good job, because it is very fair that theres a lot of things that have happened in communities that raise a lot of concerns. We even on this committee have a job to look over and say how do we fix this. And theres actually officers on this committee that i serve with and mr. Denny is one of those who have put on the uniform and been out there. I do want to emphasize and i think this is why we have this hearing today, because im going to take it from a perspective that i dont think anybody wants to see justice go unserved. And i think the interesting perspective here is my perspective that there is no one that wants the bad actors out of Law Enforcement more than Law Enforcement itself. Im the son of a Georgia State trooper. I made the joke before that i fought the law and the law won every time, okay. 62 t 250 pounds in a blue and gray uniform, i was a skrauny kid from gainesville. Daddy loved us, but he was in georgia, and he would come home. Im the little kid that would watch dad go out to work and when he would on come home at night, he would come in with his uniform torn and blood on his collar. How does that affect an 8 or 9yearold kid . Thats my daddy. Thats the man that to this day, hes a big teddy bear now because of grandchildren, but this is the man that i admire to this day. I am who i am because of him. And what would happen, my dad was a strong man and is a strong man, and one of the interesting things that i always found was is when something would go wrong with an officer and we had an officer in georgia who was a Georgia State trooper who i knew personally who, and im attempted to call it a mistake. Its not. He had a sexual encounterwith someone in his custody and hes in jail. He was punished for it. You know whats more amazing to me was my dads reaction to that. My dad came home and he was upset, he was mad, i could tell it because the chairman talked about how this plays out in the police force. It played out at home because my dad came home and didnt talk about it. There are people in this country who want bad actors who do bad things in the police force out of the police force themselves. And as someone who understands this and watch my father live it every day, when he was painted because of others, then it affects everybody. In a highrisk, many times lowreward area. Some of the things i would love to see us talk about, the thin blue line separates us from chaos. No one in our country should not look at our police force and know this is what keeps us safe, no matter what we are or our beliefs or the color of our skin. It is what keeps us different than the rest of the world. An Orderly Police force that carries out our laws faithfully. But too often i served on that Police Working group and ive been all over the country in georgia and other places, and we have problems in our police force because theres so many folks who are bad actors and get pushed from one job to another. Youve got bad actors who cant make it at one job and they go to another police force, yeah, do you know him, hes got another job. The one police chief is saying thank god and the other one is saying i dont know what ive got into. You know why . Because of pay, benefits, the issues of communities. I live in a Rural Community in north georgia and the kids who live in some of my smaller counties, theyre going to go to work with the Sheriffs Department that theyre making an amount that they can go 40 miles down the road and double their salary. They know they can go somewhere else and get another job no matter what their record is. When we come to this hearing today it does need to be a hearing of what ill call the terrible acts. We need to acknowledge them and admit that Justice Needs to be served. But there is nothing about this hearing that the 98 or 99, whatever percent you want to do of those men and women who wake up every day with only one responsibility, taking care of their communities. And taking care of the lives that they have. And they want nothing more than these bad actors to go away so that they can do their job. And when they lay their head down at night, they know theyve done their best and they want to be wrpd because they have done their job and not because somebody else has acted badly. When that happens, then our Law Enforcement understands that we respect them, we love them and were going to help them when they need help. And for every other 10yearold kid who watches their dad go out not knowing if theyre going to come home or when they do come home, theyre beat up and battered because they were out helping others. And when they see their dad or their mom upset because their profession, their calling is tarnished by those who would tarnish it, justice must be swift, it must be firm and fairly applied. Because if not, we lose who we are. We would not be who we are without poour police force. We now need to help them make it better. With that, i yield back. I thank the gentleman. Without objection, all Opening Statements will be included in the record. I want to note that the gentle lady from massachusetts, ms. Pressley is with us and we thank her for attending. I will now introduce todays witnesses. Gwen carr is the mother of eric garner who died during his arrest by Police Officers. As a result of this event they became an advocate for improving policing practices and currently facilitates the this stops today program, eliminating racism and inequality collectively. Shes here today to share her personal experience. Ron davis served as director of the u. S. Department of Justice Community Oriented Policing Services office from 2013 to 2017. In december 2014 he was appointed to serve as executive director of the president s task force and 21st century policing. Prior to serving as cops director, he was the chief of police of east palo alto, california for more than 8 years and previously served 20 years with the oakland Police Department. He received his b. A. From Southern Illinois university and completed the state and local Government Program at Harvard University school of government. Patrick yose, i proposal i pronounced that right, is the National President of the fraternal order of police since 1984, he has served in a variety of rolls in the Sheriffs Office in Saint Charles parish, louisiana and currently is the commander. He earned a bachelor of science and an associate of science. Hes also a graduate of the fbi National Academy. The reverend al sharpton is the founder and president of the National Action network, the National Civil Rights Advocacy organization. He attended Brooklyn College and received a degree from Virginia Union university, as well as an Honorary Degree from ap bible college. James blake is a former tennis professional and correspondent and host for the tennis channel. Hes also the tournament director for the miami open, so i suppose we can get good tickets. Mr. Blake is here today to speak about his personal experiences with Law Enforcement. Gina hawkins has served more than 30 years in Law Enforcement and is currently the chief of police for the North Carolina Police Department. She also serves as an executive board member of the National Organization of black Law Enforcement executives. Chief hawkins received ther bachelor of science from Georgia State university and a master of science from john hopkins university. She is also a graduate of the fbi National Associates academy. Heather mcdonald is the thomas w. Smith fellow at the Manhattan Institute for policy research. She has written numerous books on the criminal Justice System and previously clerkd with judge steven ryan hart on the u. S. Court of appeals. She received her b. A. From yiel university and her m. A. From Claire College and her j. D. From Stanford University law school. Phillip goff is the cofounder and president of the center for policing equity. He also serves as professor of Police Equity at john j. College of criminal justice. The professor has written extensively on policing issues. He received his ab from Harvard University. And finally, linda garcia is the policing Campaign Director at the Leadership Conference on civil and human rights. Before joining the Leadership Conference she served as a Trial Attorney in the special litigation section of the Civil Rights Division of the department of justice. She also served as a law clerk to judge john gleason in the Eastern District of new york. Ms. Clark received her b. A. From Hunter College and her j. D. From law school. We welcome all of our distinguished witnesses and we thank them for participating in todays hearing. If you would please rise, i will begin by swearing you in. Raise your hand, please. Do you wear or affirm under penalty of perjury that the testimony you are about to give is true and correct to the best of yournge, information and belief, so help you god . You may be seated. Let the record show the witnesses answered in the affirmative. Please note that each of your written statements will be entered into the record in its entirety. Accordingly, i ask that you summarize your testimony in five minutes. To help you stay within that time, there is a timing light on your table. When the light switches from green to yellow, you have one minute to conclude your testimony. When the light turns red, it signals your five minutes have expired. Ms. Carr, you may begin. Good morning. Turn the mic on and speak closely into it. Yes, chairman nadler and members of the judiciary committee, i thank you for having me this morning. My name is gwen carr and i am the mother of eric garner. Five years ago my beloved son eric was murdered by people who were supposed to serve and protect. On july 17th, the nypd Police Officers approached my son. One of them put him in an illegal chokehold. Eric cried out 11 times i cant breathe. 11 times he said i cant breathe. But those officers who were on the scene that day, they didnt seem to care. Eric died that day. There was a video that was captured that captured the incident, including the chokehold and my sons cry saying that he couldnt breathe. This went viral around the world. So my thought is today, how come no one was held accountable . No one was held in charge for my sons death. But not only the officer that murdered my son, but all the officers who were on the scene need to stand accountable for his death that day. I will never forget that day in july. I got up that morning, i spoke to eric. I spoke to him for about ten minutes. And afterwards we said our good byes, he said i love you, mom. I said i love you, too, eric, never knowing that would be our last and final conversation. My entire life was uprooted on that july day. I felt helpless, in a dark place, scattered in millions of pieces. It is impossible to describe the pain that i felt that day. Losing a child is just indescribable. Having the burden of finding out exactly what happened to your child by the police who was responsible for his demise. How is a person supposed to get answers . Who do she go to for help . Most people cant even comprehend how difficult it is to suddenly lose a child and to fight for five years and just get an ounce of accountability. It has impacted our lives in many devastating ways. Almost two months ago i lost my husband. He was my partner in every sense of the word. He fought the long fight with me, even though he wasnt in front of the cameras. He supported me and he really supported the cause. My granddaughter, erica, she died december 17th of a heart attack. She was only 27 years old. But when my son was murdered, she fought the good fight. She fought until she became ill. I say she died of a broken heart. These are the wounds of the seen and unseen from the Police Brutality. The loss of loved ones and no recourse, no accountability. The entire family is traumatized. Each and every time we enter the courtroom or watch the officer responsible for my sons death get a pay raise or hear the department of justice saying theyre not going to seek charges, or when the officer who is the Commanding Officer of the person who was on the scene when my son was murdered said it was not a big deal that eric laid on the ground doa. I come before you today not only to share my sons story or the long quest of justice that weve been seeking for five years, but i urge you to take immediate action to imply national changes and standards towards policing. In 2015 i stood with representati representative joaquin jeffries as we introduced a bill that would make choke holds illegal under federal civil rights law. Once the bill is reintroduced, this season i call for you to support and vote for legislation. The Excessive Force use the excessive use of force prevention act of 2019, please vote for it. Violent police have no place in this society, so like you said, mr. Nadler, lets get them out of there. No officer who is not there to do his job should be on the police force. So again, i ask you to please vote on this bill. Ms. Carr, thank you for your moving testimony. The committee understands how difficult this was for you and has agreed not to subject you to questions out of respect. We now invite you to join us for the remainder of the hearing in the front row if you so desire. Mr. Davis. Good morning, mr. Chairman. Ranking member collins and distinguished Committee Members. My name is ronald davis and i have the distinct horn of serving as the director of department of justice policing services in the obama administration. I also served as the executive director of president obamas staff force for 21st century policing. Before my service in if administration, i spent close to 30 years in local policing, 20 years in the great city of oakland, california, and eight years as police chief in the great city of east palo alto. My testimony is based on these perspectives, as well as my perspective as a black man and a father of black children. First as the 20year police veteran, i know first hand the complex challenging and dangerous nature of being a Police Officer. As a police chief, i have to tell a wife that her husband, one of my brave Police Officers, was shot and killed in the line of duty. Ive personally seen the toll being a Police Officer takes on so many. Ive lost friends colleagues to suicide, a threat which is now growing at an kpoe nenchl rate. However, as a black man, i know that despite these efforts, significant Racial Disparity still exists in our policing and criminal Justice System. I do not believe these disparities exist because the profession is full of racists. I believe they exist because of structural racism. Many of the systems and practices in policing that exist today were designed in the 1950s and 60s to enforce discriminatory laws and to oh press black americans. We must acknowledge the history of policing in this country and the role that police have played in enforcing discriminatory laws and continue to play through draconian policing practices. With that being said, i think its fair to say that positive changes have started. Working on president obamas task force on policing, as i testify today here, mr. Chairman, my concern is not that we havent made progress. My concern is that this department of justice is attempting to stop this progress by returning to the failed policies and practices of the 80s and 90s, policies that resulted in unequal justice. I was a street cop in oakland during the 80s and 90s and i can tell you first hand that the policing practices of those years was dangerously misplaced. I made thousands of arrests of men of color, while simultaneously watching the homicide rate climb. I also watched this destroy the future of thousands of men of color with unfair sentencing practices. We now know that these practices caused significant Collateral Damage and they did not work. What did work in oakland and so many oakland was policing and the use of evidence programs such as operating a ceasefire and focus on strategies. There will be those thatll argue that the tactics of th the 90s that did work. I guess it is taking a lot of people to jail and having crime numbers going up and down for a couple of months is a success and it works. Our democracy, Public Safety is not just the absence of crime. This idea taken from dr. Kings quote, must serve on how we evaluate of our Justice System. The american policing system is be design and control locally so that police in practice are accountable for Community Values and priorities. This is disheartening to hear the attorney from the United States attacking local mayors and prosecutors. It is also disheartening to hear people including those in the Administration Talk about how to support the men and women. Dont talk about cops having to resources necessary to jobs. They do not demand respect for the office while advocating policies thatll destroy that trus trust. In new york it was implemented none the less. When it was bad, the officers were blamed. Now the Justice Department is advocating return to the same types of policies. Theyre ignoring the lessons of the past while ignoring the voices of the field. Once again officers and the community, this is why this hearing is so important. Grant programs and Technical Assistance and civil rights enforcement, the Justice Department can play a role to help the Police Agency in the United States. To make sure whether or not the department has four cops or 40,000 cops that they have best access of training and practices in the country. There is much the federal government do can help. The first recommendations that we rescind the sessions memo and restore the civil rights department. We work collaboratively with local enforcement and new and enkne innovative enhancements. We increase funding to the National Justice of its capacity to conduct research to evaluate crime strategies that we work with local prosecutors instead of criticizing them to reform the criminal Justice System. We stand to develop strategies to enhance off and we support the profiling act to make sure accountability is in every department of this country. As a black man and a former cop, i should be able to drive anywhere in this country and expect the same constitutional treatment and should not depend on how big the department is and how much money the department have. Thank you. Good morning, chairman nadler and distinguished members. Thank you for the opportunity to speak on nearly 50,000 members of the internal police. In just over a month ago, i was elected for the National Internal police. My full testimonies have been submitted for the record. I would like to summarize at this point. My profession is evolving. Some of these changes are driven by technology and others by society. Of course, our internal efforts to improve Public Safety and the service we provide to the community. As a Law Enforcement officer i answer calls for help. I am here to let you know the police is ready to sit with anyone who genuinely wants to work and selectivity to help policing in this country. We are calling on you for your help. Law enforcement officers are respected. Parents would tell their children children, if you need help finding a Police Officer, this may no longer be true. Few officers was suspicion and disdained. We are Public Service and not public enemies. We live and raise your family in the same community. Our jobs becoming increasingly dangerous. Ambush attack on Law Enforcement officers have been increasing over the last eight years and a recent study by the fbi concluded many of these cases are motivated to hurt officers. Introduce by representatives rutherford. Thank you for your support. What it will do is give the u. S. Department a tool in limited circumstances to fight back against target attacks like those that occurred in dallas, texas and baton rouge, louisiana in my home state. Last year this legislation passed it new hampshirely of 38235. Passing the legislation again would demonstrates this house supports the men and women in Law Enforcement. Right now we are feeling abandoned. These changes and attitudes are an impact in our community. Applications for positions in Law Enforcement have decreased by as much as 66 . Leaving too many agencies short shifted and over worked. My organization is also working to improve. We have engaged many of the organizations here today. A representative here today on issues of body cameras and improving Law Enforcement transparency while still protecting privacy rights. We participated in each and every Public Meeting for the president s task force. We supported the majority of body findings. We have engaged in the administration and many of the groups represented here today. While many of our fellow Law Enforcement organization shows to withhold their support, we are able to support it because we engage in a conversation and we are committed to improving not just our profession but the criminal justice as a whole. Everyone can be proud of the results because we achieved it by working together. Another issue of which there is bipartisan support, there is address in the issue of Mental Health and wellness in Law Enforcement. Being a Police Officer is not an easy job. It includes the role of therapist and marriage counselor. A Police Officer will experience more dramatic events in a six month period than a regular person. There is little has been done to address this and a number of Police Suicides have grossly under reported. In 2017, there were 100 officers took their own lives in contrast in that year and 46 officers were fatally shot and killed in the line of duty. Police officers run towards danger while most run away. Rather than casting them aside, we have a responsibility to fix that has been broken in the service of our community. The passage of legislation like Mental Health and wellness act also known as stoic. Finally, my profession must continue to work hard to build trust and respect for the community that we protect. There must be an open dialogue and will it build consensus . We cant do it alone. I thank you again for the opportunity to speak here today. Thank you. Reverend sharpton. Thank you, chairman nadler and Ranking Members. I would like to summarize by saying that what we really seek is this committee to begin moving towards federal law and federal standards that would define clearly where the line is in terms of Excessive Force and take this argument from a state and local level to where there is federal standards that all must abide by. What we have seen in the last several years that in different cities where we are called in and every case and including the cases that we submitted this morning of mother of Michael Brown and the mother of stefan cox submitted testimonies. We see different counties reacted in different ways. It reminded me of the early stages of the 1960s of the movement for civil rights. Until the federal government steps in, they would have to fight state by state county by county against segregation. So it was the judgment of Martin Luther king jr. And others to appeal for federal Government Intervention rather than fight in alabama and fight in georgia and etcetera and etcetera, unless the federal government steps in and dealing with federal standards and federal laws. Well be subjected to the local politics and local back and forth that could different another state. We need to have federal law that sets standards thatll be followed. What do i mean by that . Federal government determines in several states, several counties. Several cities that they will place Police Departments in where the Justice Department which be over and supervised them because there was a pattern and practice that demonstrated Excessive Force. When this president and administration came in, they suspended that in several of those cities. They have not been long enough to make an investigation so what was the determination that made them decide that they would stop. Would have been determined by the Justice Department before the investigation. This committee needs to investigate why. General sessions upheld by barr withheld and removed this designation because it sent the signal that well allow practice to continue even though a Justice Department, not activ t activists or back lives matter. The Justice Department says there was a pattern. We must have certain standards in terms of when we talk about body cameras must be regulated where they cant cut the body cameras up. We must define when we look at a car, five years waiting on the decision of the federal government whether charges will be brought. The local didnt chant to charge for families that had to go through this it shows how nebulous and undefined the federal laws are. Intervene and save us from states rights mentality. We need to rise above states rights mentality and Law Enforcement. I am hearten to hear they are willing to be on the table and these decisions to see where there could be con sensensucons. Another was killed, if family invited me to see some of the union got angry. We gave 5,000. We are not antipolice. We are antiPolice Brutality. Even when we stand up when police are killed, we yet to see a police union stand up one time when all of the officers killed, someone in the community unjustified it. The majority of them go out with many reasons to wonder whether theyll come home and they protect all of us. Those that steps outside, the law must be punished and the federal government must make it happen. This is not about antipolice, this is about upholding the law and no one should want bad cops punished more than good cops whose names are smeared because people get to choke people on tape, hearing 11 times i cant breathe and you got to go through five years of torment and finally be turned down and got a bad praise to just take his job. This is what america should be about. The president and others can excuse it it is under congress to act. The president says i hate cops, no, i just dislike the president. I dont hate cops. Thank you mr. Chairman. [ applause ] chairman nadler and members of the judicial committee. I believe we have the video when this happened. This is extremely vulnerable and this is an abusive power. What happened to me was unfortunate but it could have been tragic with only minor changes. I was aware of that. Those are tragedies that did not need to happen. I realize how common these occurrences were and still are. It forced me to speak up to give the voice to those who did not have those options. Whats amazing was i was in new york and how many people came in with similar stories or worse stories. We talked about the case on Good Morning America the next day. The video shows the attack clear and made all the difference. Before anyone was aware of the video. The police was in damage control and stated they were investigating. Had there been no video, it would have been my word against the police. We all know how that goes no matter how credible the victim was. That gave me more responsibility to find a way to hold the city accountable. Even with evidence, too often families are undermined and not relieved. Police have raised questions and theories on what we have seen in the tape. The state that this country is in right now is in a crisis with regards to the lack of accountability. I feel compel just to get my personal experience. I was attacked in broad daylight without raising a hand or making any move to run. This was done by officers who had numerous complaints. This information was leaked to the press when my opinion should be a national database. So this led me to believe the solution should be determination for me at the nypd. The hearing dragged on two years and he lost five vacation days. I would lost far more. All the while hes still connecting his paychecks in the city of new york. This guy is one of the Serious Problems that i have seen. Well set from the time of police or policing themselves. When i ask the civilian complaints, they let me know they could not and would not let me do that. My status hinder any hope. I did not want preferential treatment. I wanted justice. If this was supposed to be deterrent. I cant imagine it on anybody with the attitude of authorities. This leaves blood on the hand of those in power. One example of the harm suffered by countless people. Until we know these stories, it will be difficult to obtain police reform. Congress must also advance legislation bike the racial profiling act by jackson lee. The pride act sponsored by congressman joaquin castro. I think about my account at dnypd, i think about those who were not so lucky. Eric garner. A choke hold that was still used and led to his death. These acts cant change what happened to me, it cant bring back walter scott. Adding the level of accountability if it does happen. Thank you all for allowing my voice here to improve the community and police relations. Thank you very much. Committee and members of the u. S. House representatives on the judiciary. I bring you hearing of members o f the organization black law executives, noble. My name is gina hawkins. The chief of police of fayetteville in carolina. Noble has been at the forefront of promoting Police Accountability since the organization inception in 1996. To serve as a conscious of Law Enforcement by being committed to justice by action. Laur Law Enforcement agencies and their leaders have the responsibility. Mobile members chiefs and sheriffs hold ourselves to a High Standard and officers in the community we search and protect are in line of everyones safety. We recognize the needs to take steps to improve service. Build trust in our communities and increase operational transparency. Nobl he has been actively in involved on the key areas of Police Accountability and use of force and reducing gun violence. There has been universal recognition expressed by noble so the United States of justice on the importance of maintaining a level of Police Accountability in the forum of the previous model of the Collaborative Reform Initiative or similar styles. Law Enforcement Agency, sleep to improve their operations. Use the nationally adopted blueprint and guild trust with their communities should be afforded. Agency leaders should also have access to high quality policing professionals who can assist that agency with assessing areas for improvements and developing strategies to modernize Police Operations and culture the need of policing as already outlined by the department of justice. As chief of the fayetteville Police Department, my predecessor used the Technical Assistance resources provided through the collaborative form to help the agency develop a strategy to improve engagement at all levels of the department and particularly communities of color. Our department did not shy away from taking a close look at our training, traffic and pedestrian stop data and our Citizen Engagement to identify areas of improvement. Today we are better informed and engaged in the department because of the leadership i and other noble leaders provide to their agencies because we recognize a need to measure up the expectations of our community. Policing is a credible profession respected in our community for being honest. Trust worthy and fair to everyone we serve and protect. The federal government can play an Important Role influencing local municipalities and their Police Agencies to address systematic issues that are adversely impacting their ability to protect and serve their communities. A Key Assumptions thats challenged by noble is policing organizations can easily police themselves with out the best practices. As the data shows, it is very rare for the principal government toen for consent a d. Most Law Enforcement agents are filled with committed and fair and honest men and women who put our Police Uniforms on everyday with the soul intent of keeping everyone safe. In the instance. Al third party in the intervention could be beneficial in my states and many ages adopted the policies and public trust component components. The office of the goal and Police Accountability is to strengthen trust and legitimacy between the Law Enforcement and the community. Al legitima a legitimate agency can create the safety of our Law Enforcement and the community. Noble Police Chiefs and sheriffs providing the leadership to over half of the largest city in the nation. We are committed to effective policing and holding our officers to the highest standards and police and professions. On behalf of the Law Enforcement of noble, thank you for supporti supporti supporting Law Enforcement while continuing to build strong relationships with our communities. Our members stand ready to meet the needs of our diverse community. Thank you again for this opportunity. Thank you. Mr. Mcdonald. Thank you for the opportunity to speak today. My name is heather mcdonald. Since the 1990s. Felony crimes in the United States dropped 50 . Tens of thousands of lives the majority of blacks and hispanics have been saved. Crime drop began in new york city 1994 and spreads nationwide. New York Police Commissioner Willi William bradton dared something that few police risk. The next year he up the anti and declaring the u. S. Department lower crimes by 15 . That year crimes dropped at 16 . The idea that the police would take measurable responsibilities for Public Safety was transitive. Brett accomplished his route with three main strategies. Timely information and accountability and proactive policing. Deputy commissioners started to man crime information in realtime. The crime patterns can be addressed since they first broke out. Officers were asked to intervene proactively when they observe suspicious behavior. Broken windows was a crucial aspect of this. It arizonddresses loitering, br window policing is not a crime strategy. It is a moral imperative. It is the hardworking of high crime neighborhoods who be sieged the police to address street disorders. Go to any Police Community meeting in a high Risk Community and you will hear the good people there beg the police to get the drug dealers off the streets to clear the corners of youth and crack down on loud music and illegal street parties. The residence know that it is out of such unchecked social disorder that more serious crimes emerges. A 2015 poll found that 61 of black voters in new york city wanted the police to issue summons or make arrests in their neighborhood of quality of life offenses comparing to 59 of white voters. The broken windows policing is racist . We are also told we are living through an epidemic of racially biassed Police Shooting of black men. This two is false. A study publish this august in the proceedings of the National Academy of sciences is the latest research under cutting the media narrative about race and Police Shootings. It is the rate of Violent Crimes that determines Police Shooting the study found. Frequently officers encounter violent suspects of any given racial groups, the greater the chance must be shot by a Police Officer. Black civilians are shot less compares to whites. The antipolice narrative deflect attention away from solving the real justice problems. Blacks die of homicides at eight times the rate of whites. The homicide death rates for black males between the ages 15 to 24 is 16 times higher than that of young white men. That is the civil Rights Problem that should most concern us. Those black victims are killed not by cops, whites but by other blacks. Blacks commit homicide nationally at eight times the rate at whites and hispanics combined. In 2017, 8,000 homicide vicks. More than all white and homicide victims combined. The vast majority are with a gun or otherwise dangerous or killed by a cop. The best solution is to reconstruct the family. Thats a longterm project however. In the meantime the policing revolution began in new york in the 1990s and spread nationwide has given lawabiding residents greater freedom to take their children to school or go to a Grocery Store without fears. Policing today is more professional and restrain than any time in history. There is no government attempt agency more dedicated to the proposition that black lives matter than the police. Thank you for your attention and i look forward to your questions. Thank you. Dr. Goff. Thank you, chairman members. I am a professional nerd, i am phillip goff. My love for the country and respect for this body and mostly my vocation as a scientist will not allow me to move to my prepare remark just yet. I feel that i have to address the record on some statistical elements. The crime of the course of the last quarter century is not in response to Police Behavior alone. If members would like further reid on this. I can recommend it. Community base and antiviolence work is a large and under appreciated component of reductions in crime and not just Police Behavior. I should say i believe that 2015, evidence perhaps implying that black people actually liked broken windows policing, if memory serves that exact, shows that black people concerned of racial biassed within Law Enforcement. A trend that escalated over 2015. To suggest that black people enjoy the treatment in new york or any place else of broken window policing. Hearing only of what is convenient to the narrative and not the fullness of what those communities calling for which is safety and justice at the same time and surely not too high bar for Law Enforcement. Last in terms of clarification, a study of the National Scientists just sited. Fir cited. No, thats not what it says. The author of that study acknowledged to the Scientific Community that their central cause or claim is unsupported by the data and factually wrong. This Committee Hearing should not be ad dumping ground. Dr. Goff, we heard a lot of central cause of claim. Could you tell us which clause of claim you are refuting. The study cited by mr. Mcdonald, it does not show why officers are less or more likely to be involved in deadly shooting. The author themselves admitted that the central causal claim they make that there is no biassed in this is unsupported by the data that had been made public and bulkily analyzed by scholars at princeton university. I do not like to be apart of anything that becomes a i would like to thank you the privilege to testify. In my day job, i am a professor, i am al nerd. I accepted to ucla. A member of the National Academy Sciences Committee that issued on proactive policing. I am likely best known for my work with the center of Police Equity. For the past decades, i have had the plr to resident of cbe. It is the largest Police Behavioral data funded by the u. S. Department, u. S. National science foundation. Today i have been asked to talk about what science has to say about Public Safety. So what does it have to say . Well, first, with all science, it is important that we define the problem correctly. We speak only about the role that Law Enforcement has in keeping Community Safe, our conversations will never elevate above blaming people or communities. Framing should be Public Safety, not just Law Enforcement. I cant echo the comments of mr. Yeos strongly enough for talking about safety and Law Enforcement understand the officers that patrol these neighborhoods need of the sound mind. They need to have the resources to make sure Mental Health and officer wellness are essential. Now having to find the problem as Public Safety, what are some of the solutions . My colleagues articulated five policies rooted in science and practice called for by the large majority of our Law Enforcement partners that we believe to have the best chance of returns and reforms. They are National Models for e using the force. I see i am out of time because of my impromptu mark from the beginning. Those five policies are introduced in the record and i would encourage members to look at it. One of the last words withi within we talk about data. I think it is important we move the conversation from data to analysis. I released a ted talk on september 9th, we talked about an issue called comp stat or justice. It is possible to make a crime. Comp stat was a revolutionary police to help to importantly this initiative at cpe and elsewhere is at the request of Law Enforcement. They want to know and they want to lead on that. I will be remissed if i got out of here without saying or leaving you the impression that it was a legislation that has not been introduced that moves us forward. I apologize for going over my time. I thank you for the invitation and i absolutely look forward to your questions. Thank you very much. Miss garcia. Chairman nadler, Ranking Member collins and members of the committee. I am director of the policing campaign at the Education Fund and the Leadership Fund on civil hi human rights. Thank you for the opportunity to testify today. Thank you cherairman nadler for calling this. Safety is a human right. In recent years tragic incidents of Police Violence have deepen distrust in Law Enforcement and made people feel less safe especially the community of color. It is time to rethink and create approaches to Public Safety that relies on criminalization and which disproportionately affect black and brown people and failed to address Public Health issues. When Police Practices harm communities, it shows mistrust and hinder Community Engagement. The federal government has a role and indeed a responsibility to promote the values of fairness equity and procedural justice and transparency and accountability within Law Enforcement agencies. However, the Current Administration severely curtailed the department of justice. It has also abandoned collaborative Reform Efforts of the office of Community Oriented Community Services under the Police Department it goes to the communities and suffering from misconduct. High profile Police Shootings of unarmed black men and other incidents of Police Misconduct coupled with a heavy enforcement of low level offenses eroded trusts in Law Enforcement and many communities including those that are deterioraiscriminated on the bases of race, gender, gender identity, sexual orientati orientation, age, disability and proficiency with the english language. People perceive the legal system to the arbitrary, bias and unfair, they are less likely to cooperate with police making us alle all less safe. Well much of the reform is happening at the state and local levels, success will require the Leadership Support and commitment of the federal government including you members of congress. Every Year Congress provides millions of dollars to Law Enforcement agencies through federal Grant Program to support police. This creates a duty for congress to conduct oversight to ensure funds are not supporting Police Practices and harm Public Safety and a Road Community trust. Additionally, this responsibilities empower congress to incentivize Police Department of best practice and Community Policing. The Leadership Conference offers the following recommendation to the committee. Reduce the use of Excessive Force by passing the Police Exercising Absolute Care with everyone act of 2019. Prohibits discriminatory policing by passing the religious profiling act. Mandate robust Data Collection. And the militarization of Law Enforcement agencies by passing the Law Enforcement act. Promote officer health and well being by redirecting grant money towards officer support programs and services. Invest in nonPolice Responses to crisis by expanding community Mental Health and substance services. Strengthen Accountability Service system. Congress has the power to bring about transformative policing. You can provide practices that are fair, safe and effective. To realize this division of Public Safety, Community Must rebuild trust. Our coalition is committed to ensuring police and practices that respect dignity and humanity of all people. We look forward to working with you until the days of these reforms are signed into law. Thank you. Thank you very much. Since one of our witnesses specifically commented on the testimony of another vote. If she can comment and i will grant 1. 5 minutes to miss mcdonald for that. It is ironic to call a study in the proceeding of the National Academy of science, the fact that it is correlational means it is not an analysis and never the less the findings remains accurate of the Police Shootings. This is a finding thats supported by numerous other studies in a paper of 2017, harvard economists and found no evidence of Racial Discrimination and shootings. The most Sophisticated Lab studies from the university of washington. Found officers were three times less likely to shoot unarmed black suspects and unarmed white suspects until longer to decide to shoot longer. Other studies found no police bias against black civilians. The believes that we are living through of selective supporting. The white victims fatal Police Shootings including a 50 years old suspect and a Domestic Assault in alabama and a 28 driver in iowa who exited his car and walked towards the officer after a car chase and a 21yearold suspect in a Grocery Store robbery in akron, ohio escaped on a bike and did not move his hands from the waistband. Added their names to the rost roster, because they are white, they are unknown. Thank you for the opportunity. I thank you the witnesses for the testimonies. Well proceed under the five minutes rule. My first question of dr. Goff, will you comment on what we heard on the evidence and etcetera. I think i can stay under my time, none of that is true. If you would loo i cike me to elaborate i can. The citiplease do. Hes confessed and embarrassed about. It is debunked to say that and i should clarify, miss mcdonald is no not from the university o of everybody who studies that research commented on the fact there was no time pressure in the simulation. So with infinite amount of time and you know you are being studied for racial bias, it turns out, you can correct for it. Thats why i did not replicate the literally thousands of other research. There are two forms of racial biases that you can see in the racial study. One is the era rate and the other is the lengths of time it takes. Black suspects were shot quickly and white suspects were shot slowly. It was only the kids of zero error rate for officers who are well trained. But all this is besides the point. The idea that there is not bias is just not a serious position when you look at the science. Where there is bias and whats the definition of bias . Thats a worthy discussion. We ha when you are looking at the hearts and minds of officers, you often do not see it. I am not saying because there are disparities out there on the streets that officers hold in their heart defective characters. It is situations that produce a different outcome. We need to have a way to identify what those situations are and then keep officers out of it. The officers were very close to an individual who may have had a weapon. Thats in the words of my chiefs that i deal with, often in a situation that can be avoided. The way that you avoid that is you dont put your car up next to someone you think is armed. You keep in a safe distance. The officers dont need to be bigoted in their hearts. So if we define that narrowly as the only problem, again, we cant elevate to solving it. The question of the science and none of that is right. The question of how we move forward, we should define the problem for precisely so we are not debating whether they are good or bad. Thank you very much. Reverend sharpton. You have had experience representing multiple victims of Police Misconduct. Can you describe the misconduct complaints . I think that the process begins first of all of the section that well never get involved in this. The first part is to try and pure s pursue with the authority. And to support with the family. Whatever resources we can and whatever help we can because they have been traumatized. Even when they are settlement, we dont ask for reimbursement. One against those that may discriminate. It is not a person of color as i listen to the Color Exchange between the nerds on the panel. We are willing to fight for whites that are victims of Excessive Force. There was an orthodox young man killed named gilleon bush. We went out and supported him. I am here for white people and black people and the other people that are victims of Excessive Force. When we talk about Consent Decree and body camera and things that we have said today mr. Chairman, we are not talking about blacks only. Police are not violating anybodys civil rights. I think thats what was important. Thank you. In your testimony, you recommend the sessions memo to be rescinded. Could you describe the memo and why it should be rescinded . After taking office at the attorney general, general sessions put out a memo that curtails the activity of the civil rights that memo stops the volunteer the impact of not having counter practice organizations and assessment means the department cant learn whats happening in their own organization. There is no transparency and you cant do an internal review or assessment and in many cases the agencies asked for this review. Mr. Chairman, not only that memo was signed and curtail that activity, there were four or five reports completed as i ended my administration with president obama that they failed to release. The community is begging for r the release. And so this idea that we heard the department of justice that well not offer any report that critical Law Enforcement is a disservice to Law Enforcement. They want to know whats working and whats not working and to do so. People think of the Consent Decree as it is signed by the city and not the Police Department because in my cases it is the functional sitting government to make sure officers have the training and equipment or held accountable that the strong disciplinary process and it is not just about the police. Those Consent Decree when i was at the Justice Department served the foundations for thousands of agencies to voluntarily make the changes. As you mentioned, it was mentioned 16,000 agencies for the United States, mr. Chairman and the average is smaller than 100 officers. They do not have the capacity to do research and development to identify best practices and understand whats happening in the industry. This profession must become a profession and we need to have National Coherence and best practices and accountability that comes with Consent Decrees. Thank you very much. My time is expired. Gentleman from georgia, mr. Collins. I want to pick up some of those. There is a lot of ways we can go with this question. We had to put money back this year. We actually put that money back in the accounting process. We believe it works in a lot of those. I think this is the part. I consider to be a nerd in the panel here. I believe facts matter. We can deal with emotional all day long but lets hit some things. You are in favor of North Carolina. You represent in the National Organization how did we come to grip of how here is how you do it. How did we come up with a system where we are better reporting. As i said in my opening statement. I am sure that you as chief wants the bad one out now. Put them in jail. How do we do that to get the smaller forces, the four man or five men forces. The big one is in new york city. There is an under line current here that we dont talk about because we dont have the news coverage. How can we do this through the National Organizations and others to help Police Chiefs and commissioners and just share. Get a better quality and it cant just all be money. We are dealing with the budget. How do we do that. I would love to hear your comment on that. As i mentioned in the testimony, all agencies in all departments need to have the ability to ask for assistance in examples like the collaborative reform or any other type of method to be able to ask that question or to be able to ask another professional who has figured out some things and provide those resources. How we can go and make those request to do best practices. They may have the ability to make a phone call to an organization. Anyone can call me and my agency and we do it all the time. We share information consistently. What did you do . What else are you doing . We dont have to reinvent the wheel. We can get some guidelines and thats what we need. The two of you this is where rubber of the road. I am concerned and how much are we seeing this, i need a new offer and i want to get rid of this. Oh, how did he do . So we are missing this sort of, is there any way we can look at that further . I will share a little bit because i am from georgia. What georgia did and what North Carolina does as well is the certification. When ever someone leaves the organization, both se certifications outline why they left and whats going on so the next organization is well aware of any issues going on and why they have been released. In georgia, the hiphop from one job to the next and the one thats in trouble. When officers leave from agency to agency, every agency does an extensive background. There are standards in given states. Every state has its own standards, Police Standards are all based on the same criteria. Let me stop you. I am only taking lets peel the onions back a little bit. Thats the way it is. We also know if you have a five person force. It is harder sometimes when you are attempted to hire that person who is already certified and i dont have to send them to school and get them in now and yes they may have a little. He told me there is a little problem of the police chief. I agree with the certifications, we have seen this. I know what the story is. The question is how does that seep down to the departments that frankly dont have the resources to do that and to keep up their force . I can only speak as a leader. As leader of noble and a police chief, there is no standard that i am going to weigh out the need to have someone qualifies or someone represents me. When i hire someone, all the background and investigations done. Yall live the gold standards here. Thats why we ask these questions. We dont look at the bigger question and discuss the problems. These are the real nuts and bolts issue. You got the find the mentality. There is a temperament of being on police. You got to take it into account. You got to sort of eat everything and go forward a and thats the biggest one right there. Standard practice, you got a small community, thats a tough, tough issue right there. I do appreciate for the overtime. I yield back. I thank you chairman members for this hearing. Lit me s every aspect of your testimony is vital to a construct that we and the judicial committee, every human being deserves to go home to their family. Thatses the mo thats the most striking point that comes and to our friends in Law Enforcement, you are no more diminished than tamar rice or ag mother that was a father of six and a grandfather and maybe there is a show now which has been added to this wonderful family. And i hope that we dont have to take a litmus test to tell you all of our friends in Law Enforcement and all of our neighbors and all of our times that we flew to dallas where officers fell in their duty and the many funerals where the men and women but we wont get together and fall into the divide of the emerging White Supremacy and to be pardoned and celebrate from each other. From these questions that were asked and hopefully get us to the point where we can resolve this. President youlls, you are committed but working through congress and ensure that reporting on Peace Community that would make the same commitment in the Police Department that will comply with the death and custody reporting law will. You work with us to advance legislation and a Law Enforcement agenda that will require Data Collection for the other encounters to also and racial profiling . We are very much committed to that Data Collection and valuable information for us to move forward of this monopoly. There are a number of agencies at the ability to collect that data and its available now. Its useful, its something that we can do readily put our hands on and put it in the right direction. The concern we do have is a Smaller Agency in order to be able to collect data. Our concern would be that the agency is small, having to collect that data may in essence affect their ability to be able to police. So to respond to that, i think the important thing is to not be tied to any type of Grant Funding or anything because agencies, thats kind of counterproductive. Do you believe that Law Enforcement however should not engage in racial profiling . Its unconstitutional. I absolutely agree. Any legislation that would make that simple point, you could take back and support . I think the constitution is very clear that it is illegal and its already its there, and it exists. It would not be offensive to have legislation that provides grants and opportunities to ensure that it doesnt happen. Its unconstitutional. The law has already spoken. I take that as a yes and i thank you for that. Let me ask the question to mr. Blake. Do you we are speechless. But we are also speechless for the lives lost whose names i will call. Clearly, you were racially profiled, did you encounter a language or a comment or did anyone ask what your name was . No. I didnt have any sight of flight or flight response. If you watch the video, which we dont need to do again, but i was smiling. It was due to my previous life as a tennis player. I was under the misguided opinion that this may have been someone coming to give me a hug or a fan or i find myself extremely lucky because i thought, what could i possibly happened had i thought this was something coming to do me harm, after speaking to many officers since then, i thought about i asked them what would have happened if i put my arms up or made an effort to fight or if my brother or one of my best friends with with me or my wife and had acted in any way accordingly. You are clearly a man of color standing in front of a prominent hotel in downtown, in manhattan. 42nd, right outside Grand Central station. Something else happened. We need to pass this among other absolutely. It happens far too often. Can i ask doctor goff because of my time. Let me respect all the witnesses, let me also thank miss garcia for indicating black and brown women as other individual that may be racially profiled in different ways. But when we have statistics, and i want reverend sharpton to speak to this, the high number of African Americans that are killed by Law Enforcement, i think the point i want to distinguishes, this whole question that comes back to us about black on black crime, what i hope is that we will pass hr40 so we can address systemic issues and the impact of slavery. But about, oh, black People Killed themselves, make the distinction of color a law. Because what we are talking about is democracy, we are talking about the response, so it both of you answer the difference when Law Enforcement is gauged to me arise, walter scott, Michael Brown, eric garner, the color of law. Mr. Goff . The witness may answer the question. Go ahead, sir. Thank you for the question, congresswoman jacksonlee. Theres a difference between a neighbor who is violent, which is obviously, its scary. When the state says its okay, its terror. We see that in the responses from communities, and in the responses from Law Enforcement, but i think one of the things that you mention, i want to put a fire point on this, the statistical element. Rime the idea of black on black crime gets raised and response figured that that is the reason why Law Enforcement is using force in black communities. As distasteful that may seem, its a statistical question that maybe the cartel youre driving and theres no involvement with Law Enforcement. Purdue answer the question well, theres not a study that takes into account crime rates, poverty rates, school jasmine, house inequality and yields to other than those elements crime and poverty are not sufficient to the studies. We should be able to distinguish between the two. Reverend sharpton, quickly. I concur with that answer and i would say that for the record, when we had campaigned against stop and frisk in new york it was discriminatory. The administration came in and crime went down, crime is at an alltime low so im not a nerd but i can read and write. Crime went down with stopping frisk law and i think that we need to be very clear about that. As far as black on black crime, and the community most people are the victim of the same race. The problem in the black community is that we have fear of cops and robbers. The time as acquired. Thank you mister chairman. I thank them for appearing here today i appreciate it. Earlier this year we held a hearing with commercial background checks and a few weeks ago this Committee Held a hearing on red flag legislation and as i understand it the committee will hold a hearing on assault weapons and violence in urban areas. While i appreciate the majoritys focus on the control legislation i think its important for this committee to act in a responsible matter and our efforts are misdirected and im a Firm Believer in the rights and that are proposed by the majority this year and unfortunately im afraid they will restrict the rights of hardworking law binding gun owners and the majority tends to remedies which may sound good but would have done little to stop the attack that weve seen occur on the station and unfortunately im afraid to do anything about future attacks that might occur. We do need to Work Together to find a way that we can make americans safer. Mr. Yoes, you are the National President of the fraternal police, backtracked . Yes sir. Thank you. Anna thank you for being here today and representing the men and women all across america that keep us all safe so thank you for that. And my home state of ohio, its a priority that those who shouldnt have firearms can get access to those firearms and thats what we work on making sure that those people are eligible and that they cant get them and guns should not be in the wrong hands. One way that this could be accomplished is to ensure that next system, the National Instant criminal background check system his accurate and that is up to date and that is checked before paying the firearm that really works. Would you agree with that . Sir, i think everyone in Law Enforcement which share the same opinion and would like to take guns out of the hands of people who would have harm. Wed rather fix that rather than respond and explain why it happened. Certainly, we are in favor of any process thats going to allow us the greater ability to do that. Our concern is and should be that it should have a strong due process to work through the issues. Im sure you are familiar with the gunfire detention technology that is out there today, and in some cities, including my city, in cincinnati, we are currently using it. At the federal level, i would say that we should try to help cities and counties invest in that technology, to help reduce gun violence. In effect, its a technology where you have microphones or you have sound waves, equipment that can identify very quickly where this shooting is taking place, and you can oftentimes get there quickly, stop something thats happening, capture a criminal, pick up casings from the gun thats been fired. Could you do you have an opinion on that type of. My opinion is this, Law Enforcement officers have a difficult job, and any tools we can give them, more effectively and efficiently do their jobs, should absolutely be a priority. To be able to respond accurately in times of very stressful and tense situations can mean a matter of life and death. Any tools we have available to Law Enforcement should be explored and made available. Thank you. Let me follow up, also, some of our most highly trained individuals about how to handle an active shooter situation, whether in a school or a place of worship or anything, our Law Enforcement people. Theyre the most highly trained people in our society. And they tend to retire after 25 years or whatever, they may be in their fifties, and oftentimes, they are seeking out other employment. It would seem that you have a source of trained people, perhaps, as School Resource officers in the schools. Do you have an opinion, have you thought about that . Actually, i served as a researchers officer for several, years the best job i ever had, working in the schools, interacting with the youth, changing attitudes towards Law Enforcement. I absolutely agree that a presence in school plays a pivotal role. In my agency, we started it way before it was a trend across the country, recognizing that it was important to be able to protect the safety of children in schools. And if you have a safe working environment, a safe school environment, you will have learning occur, i agree that there is a positive element to resource officers, and thats whats across the country. The ability to include other people into protecting schools, protecting the security within schools, its well worth it. Thank you very much. My times expired, but i want to thank the committee and hope that we can Work Together to keep the American People as safe as possible. We will do our best to do that. I think the gentleman. Gentleman from tennessee. Thank, you mister chair. I am deeply concerned about the crisis interest and this is true in my home city of memphis, unfortunately, because we are not a stranger to the issue. From my perspective, there are several things we can do here in congress to help. I have introduced bills to address many of these issues. One could be the way to be use the technology and data to improve Police Civilian interactions. The Police Camera act 120 could provide grants to local jurisdictions to purchase cameras further officers. And we also need to collect Data Technology to be useful about policing practice to make Law Enforcement more responsive and responsible, and thats why introduce the National Statistics on deadly ports Transparency Act of 2019, which is hr119 communities need to feel safe and know that no one is above the law. Its a shame that he has stepped back from providing independent review and accountability for Police Practices. Along with congressman lacy clay, weve introduced the Police Training and independent review act, and at this point, id like to introduce a letter of support for that act from the naacp from june of 2019. Thank you. I like to ask chief hawkins, what our bill would do other than have sensitivity training for policemen regarding minorities in areas that might not be of their history. It would say that Law Enforcement agencies would determine if there should be a grand jury and determine whether there should be a prosecution, and also prosecute the case, should come from the jurisdiction other from that which the Law Enforcement came. In my experience, i started my professional life theres no question theres home cooking. Many people from long force men go and work as investigators for the da, and its almost like a farm team. So from my perspective, you cant have absolute independence if the da has to go to the grand jury, and if the da indites of policemen, then the police, as we saw in new york, i think it might have been i dont know if there was the governor case or another one, but the police all went out against the da in protest. Are you saying change jurisdictions . Yes. Yes. I think its a good idea. It gives an unbiased ability to gauge the facts of the situation and the facts of the case and a good review of it. R. Davis give any tho mr. Davis, you have any thought about that concept . I do. Its the president s task force and the first was starting with the investigation that would be investigation about the department not overseeing the officer that was involved in the shooting. Law Enforcement Agency . Yes. As a detective, i dont have to interview and investigate somebody that worked with for 20 years. Second part would beat that as prosecutors and police Work Together on a daily basis that is not necessarily making the Community Safe outside that are 16 as well so we have a separate jurisdiction and the prosecution and the grand jury. I believe this level of independence is important to build trust and process that people will think so its designed to benefit the officers that we need and those are two recommendations. Ill take it a long shot and we dont have some kind of idea where the interest would be and turned over to police and i appreciate your position and your former i cpp person that might give the Law Enforcement be fair shake . I can tell you that the collaborative effort not a local level or agencies are based on local jurisdictions that is the very first part of reviewing any systemic problems with the agencies. Their process within each state is how they handle them and that we support those positions that are taken within those states to investigate those crimes. Thank you sir. Later this week all introduced deep force independent review act which will provide a review on a federal Law Enforcement officer uses deadly force. I think that will help to. Reverend sharpton, youve been acting for many years on these issues. What do you think are the most important reforms that we can take up trying to hear these problems . What works best . I think that what we need is clear legislation on where the police to be dealing with federal charges and Excessive Force. What raises this to the bar of a federal crime and its evidence now and secondly that we would have some preventive measure with cameras on police that cannot be turned off and that would consent to please an order by the Justice Department that would remain even if the administration changes would be made. Then we would have constant views by the Justice Department and the department there on policing around the country particularly looking for in practices. If we start with legislation and not just feel good programs and legislation we know that they are accountable legislatively, not just on the global and state level which was what happened with other things a civil rights movement. Thank you i, yield back the balance of my time. The gentleman from texas. Thank you mister chairman, appreciate all the witnesses being here. I appreciate the comments and if you have someone that is not bigoted or president prejudice that there either pursuing or investigating and hopefully at some point the attorney general will have somebody review the investigation and the determinations ranked by which were struck and took advantage which obviously wasnt trump. I was concerned about the exchange between doctor goff and i would offer for the record this from the afn s and from David Johnson and carly taylor and also characteristics and disparity from the officers and i didnt know that would be made part of the record. No objection. Also, we had a couple of articles about the truth from city journal and some are 1999 and from august 34th of 2002 those offer for the record. But in looking at this, what staff just brought me from this study, with mcdonald references, i dont know the statistics underlying this, im just reading from their results. We found no evidence, and says, of any black or any hispanic disparities across shootings, and white officers are not more likely to shoot minority civilians than non white officers. Instead, race specific crime strongly predicts civilian race. This suggests that increasing diversity among officers by itself is unlikely to reduce Racial Disparity in Police Shootings. I dont know underlying statistics, but thats what it says on its face. But during my days as a prosecutor, id ride along with Law Enforcement and ill never forget, we had a threat in my home county against some Law Enforcement folks, and i went with them, and he was supposed to be there and have an arsenal, but theres nothing like standing outside the door. And i was four years in the army, never in combat, but lots of training, then standing outside the door of somebody thats threatening to kill the people that you are with, and knowing that person has an arsenal, and you are about to go into this home. Its. Officers all over the country do that each day, and put their lives at risk, so that others hopefully dont end up killed. And as a judge, i can acknowledge, not all officers are paragon of virtue. But it seems to me, from what ive dealt with, there is a lower percentage of bad apples in Law Enforcement and there is in the general population, and one of the things that i said earlier about the family, i will never forget testimony of a gang owner, he had been convicted of murder, his attorney had wisely advise him not to testify. But he refused the advice of his attorney on sentencing, took the stand, for one reason. He made it very clear. Im not following my lawyers instructions because i cant sit there anymore, i sat through this whole trial and listened to people talk badly about my game. He was a gang leader. He had killed a guy. And he said, im sick of it. Thats my family. I dont know my father. My mother is never around. That is my family. And i couldnt sit still and not Say Something about people badmouthing my family. And boy, that comes home. He never knew his father . He never had a mother that was around . I just cant help but think if he had had one or both of those, he would not have ended up in my courtroom, having a jury sentence him to life in prison. So, there are a lot of things we need to look at, and i appreciate the effort of everyone trying to get back to more stability, but i hope that we dont overlook the importance of the family and what it used to be in america. But i appreciate all your time. Ive read your statements, and thank you for the trouble of being here. Thank you. I yield back. The gentleman from georgia. Thank you, mister chairman, for holding this very important hearing. I want to thank each of the witnesses for their testimony. Let me begin by saying the men and women who served in law to enforcement in this country are, for the most part, brave, dutiful, honorable, and they keep us safe. That is not a question for debate. However, its undeniable that there is an epidemic of Police Shootings of unarmed civilians in our country, and by failing to recognize that, we are contributing to the problem. I want to point out the fact that i believe that police should be accountable just as the citizens who they seek to hold accountable, and that means that just as citizens have to be questioned by police, after an incident happens, why should it be that police are protected from having to answer questions from Law Enforcement agencies when they have been involved in a Police Shooting, when theyve kill somebody or when they have choked someone to death . Why should they have a week of response it without a legal right to not be questioned about what happened because they have it in their employment agreement and collective Bargaining Agreement that these kinds of rules that insulate police with accountability need to be removed from our practice and thats why im going to be filing what will be called the cool off period so that we can make sure that Police Officers are treated the same way and citizen suspects are treated and with respect the next time they say the agencies that does the investigation hes that will prosecute the heat and if it ever gets to that point but they usually take in many cases and its allowing the people to sleep that there are a no prosecution or terms of congress in any grand jury reform act which will cause these shootings be investigated and the authorities in a case of georgia of the georgia borough in the investigation happening soon Investigatory Authority and also an independent prosecutor which would be appointed by the governor to provide the investigation and the results that would have to be submitted to a judge in an open court and a grand jury and an open court for a preliminary hearing and that would be the way that these cases were disposed of. And the event that a jurisdiction declined to prosecute an officer for what might be an obvious offense in the eric garner situation that we choked a man to death, why shouldnt the federal government be able to prosecute for murder in that way that you bring about some accountability with Police Officers and it sends a strong message which would reform their conduct to Society Norms you and i look for your support and the Police Accountability and the cool off period and our Law Enforcement officers in the military and we went to the military as young men and were trained in terms of the impact they should have and general mad dog mattis and got our nickname and said that it was during the Training Session he told his marines to be polite and have a plan to kill everybody you meet and a good soldier follows the true war rear and makes his enemy skin like a poncho. That is the military he throws going into battle and when you have a Police Officer has been drained in that way its hard when a Police Officer is trained to a Police Officer thats been bred into them and they protect and serve mentality and a lot of local Law Enforcement and were reservists who were trained here and were trained to kill and occupying and destroying the streets and the the more Police Officers die every year of suicide than they do from being killed in a line of duty. Theres an or under a lot of stress and plays out in terms of their reactions to situations and theyre overreactions to situations and that people of color are predominantly the victims of that. I think we need to i think we need to take a comprehensive view of Mental Health as applied to our Law Enforcement officers and with that ive run out of time and i wont have a chance to ask anybody any feedback but i want everyone to think about that carefully and lets work on that issue, thank you and i yield back. The gentleman yields back. I would like to briefly address the audience here today. We welcome you and respect your right to be here we. We ask you any respect to proceed in the business of the committee today. The attention of the committee to perceive this hearing because it is against the rules to permit and applause or for that matter negative applause or disruption of any kind so please refrain. The gentleman from florida. Thank you mister chairman. Reverend sharpton, for current msnbc coworker and is alive congressman. And they had a bit to say about the contributions with the hundred and six congress. That filed the current resolution in condemning the semantic views of al sharpton and mr. Scarborough ended by saying as the reverend aisle sharpton has reputed that they are bloodsucking jews and my question to you as, does mr. Scarborough assertion lead to that true or did you not say those things . They are flatly untrue and i never said that. Can i finish my answer . Its actually my time. I thought you raised the question. Can i answer the question . Since dispersions were cast on the witness aspersions warren cast. You asked were the true that i said that. The witness they witness will be given the answer. The question was asked and it was not true and as you know, Mister Scarborough and i were inaction that was convinced and i think it was a great guy and know each other often. Excuse me. The gentleman who the timekeeper will add 30 seconds to his time. You mister chairman, parliamentary inquiry. Parliamentary inquiry . Is it appropriate for a member to personally attack a witness before the party . Shall i say, can a candidate congressmans words be taken down in the event that he cast a dispersion on a witness . We asked everyone to be too hear two roles of the quorum and they will proceed. Joe scarborough dan wrote that the shot al sharpton as viewed white witnesses and diamond robbers. I view afford to them as white interlopers . I preferred to one individual no i dont even know was jewish and said i should never refer to his race. I said that i was against those that were using diamonds and i did a funeral in 91, because we were boycotting oppenheim or and selling diamonds. May i finish . And i like to finish my answer . You asked a question and im answering it. I got a few more. I have a few more answers. Apparently duke as you dont want me to answer. So since you raised it let me finish. This is not how its going to work reverend. Mister chairman, a parliamentary inquiry. They will state a parliamentary inquiry. It will be an inquiry statement about is appropriate for a member to do a constant tirade of attacking the witness and then allow the witness to answer. My personal opinion is that is not part of a inquiry. The gentleman controls the time. Mr. Scarborough continued as ill sharpton led a protest around his hood and led to a protester was signed that red white man is the devil. Did you mark thanks to a sign that said that . I have no recollection that i stood next to a sign that i did or did not agree with. I would say that if i was aware of that that i wouldve said that i would not want to have that signed. I want to know you could say yes or no. I cannot answer mister chairman a yes or no. Youre asking me whether or not hes disrupting the committee. First of all, theres nothing we do it policing so since he wants to bring the subject Joe Scarborough and i then we answer it. Last i know Joe Scarborough was that the Police Department or heading Excessive Force. But im loving to engage in a civility finish. Its a matter of opinion and the gentleman controls the time. Youre not going to restore my time . No. Joe scarborough continues the reverend al sharpton incited violence, cry ends and murder in the Crown Heights section a brooklyn. Do you disagree with that statement . The new york state did extensive study and said that i wasnt even air until the death of bianca roosevelt. I had the family until the day after have you ever referred mr. Sharpton, have you referred to African Americans you disagree with you as cocktail heroes . I have. Have you ever referred to African Americans i have a parliamentary inquiry. If a Congress Person is persistently questioning a witness about a nonmatter, is it proper . Matt applause the gentleman makes a fair point with the rules providing that they had very wide latitude. The gentlemen will state is parliamentary inquiry. Its decorum for a member to raise specifically verbatim on a document filed integration all records as a resolution . The gentleman from florida may proceed. You have preferred to African Americans that disagrees u. S. Yellow . I preferred to people as names i dont know if its because they disagree with me. But i have said things about blacks and whites and made clear that i dont only attack whites. Ive ever said that have you referred to African Americans that disagree with you as militants . I dont know that was a drawer rugged tory statement. I didnt say it was. I dont recall. Have you ever said, if the jews want to get it on tell them to pin or yarmulkes back and come over to my house. There is a man that was charged with threatened a march among activists new jersey and said he was going to come there and im referring to his hairstyle i said for him and that was not talking about all jews. I said about more the kyle levy. Im in hell already. Because i had been threatened and if i came over first of all, i believe that you can deal with the constant but you cant disrespect a witness. You cannot ask a question until the witness he can answer the question. Hes committed to answer the question. Then let me answer sir. Im enjoying this. I think that youre in a committee about policing. Dont get upset, calm down. Youre yelling. Calm down. Im trying to answer your last question. The time of the gentleman has expired and the witness may answer the question. The witness may answer the question but the time has expired. The question that he raised and what i was saying was clearly that i have disagreed with blacks and whites and used the language graphically sometimes to do so. Some of which ive grown beyond. But none of which shows anything other than i am an equal opportunity attacker and im glad that Joe Scarborough and i both are equal opportunity attackers and Work Together. Id like to be recognized for inanimate consent request. I seek unanimous consent that Joe Scarborough resolutions and part of the committees record. Reject. The gentleman from georgias recognized. I have a motion. The fox edition is over . Im just checking. Mister chairman, now that we wasted five minutes had nothing to do with the subject on how we make our communities safer for black and white and how we make our officers safe. I want to start with mr. Yoes, who is in my district and represents the fraternal order of police. We met with fraternal order of police last year and brought in police and i thought we had a good meeting. What i want to ask on the record is that we come together and those recommendations from the 21st century in police battle. Those that the death opp are behind. Can you submit to us the recommendations are for and against the ones who are neutral on so that we will know where this Common Ground and that no one has adopted the entire report and if you will give us that then at least we will know where the to Law Enforcement group stand on the 24 century police. I have so you can for that information to you and is documented and you can make it part of the record. Second, doctor goff, listed some recommendations of his testimony and i dont know if we have it but if you could take five recommendations and get us your position that it would be very helpful. Second, part of your testimony and making it a federal offense about Law Enforcement and which i agree with. He uses an example of dallas in baton rouge which was very personal to us for. But i want to point out that thats not necessarily apples to apples in the relations and their domestic terrorist organizations and they target Police Officers that are a lot less to do Community Relationships with the police and i didnt want to the scene that way but since you didnt mention baton rouge and then i will point you next door to saintjean parish, where we lost two officers and two who were ambushed. Two things that we have in common sense of multiple Police Officers is that we were outgunned by the perpetrator they both had ar15s let me know if the police were outgunned by be perpetrator . Thank you for bringing up Brendan Nielsen and they are friends of mine. There are ten to 15 minutes from my house and i would say absolutely that they were armed with weapons and the officers who are not prepared for it and for what happened. The baton rouge incident was an ar15. When we talk about assault weapons, were really talk about weapons of mass destruction in question of whether they have a place on the streets and a civilized community. I wont put you on record as whether youre for or against assault weapons ban but i would like to ask you are, you troubled by the fact that ordinary citizens are more equipped and more weaponized than Police Officers . As a Law Enforcement officers are very much concerned about our ability and the safety of officers. The other thing i would point to and the doctor asked this of chief hawkins. The mentality that we have in terms of police so we have a warrior mentality and any warrior mentality you are rewarded in terms of how many stops you make, how many tickets you issue how many summons you give out. Which encourages that mindset and the guardian mentality is how often you engage with citizens. So, in that setting, my time is going to run and i hope you can comment on it. Lets take the sterling case and this is an example. He sold dvds outside the same store for years so when there is a call to Police Officers to come check on what he is doing and may not have a weapon, where is the breakdown and Community Police that the Police Response to that to know who is . If youre the same person from the same store, to the Police Officers never get a sandwich or a drink from those communities stores . Where is the breakdown . Im trying to understand why did the police on already have a relationship with a guy who has a business set up in front of another business for years. If you could answer that in terms of into the Police Guardian release and warrior. Ill yield back present my time. In regards to the guardian and warrior mentality. The way you describe it sir i believe in both. T i believe in that perspective that as a citizen that i am of community and that i am a mother and a warrior if somebody comes with my family and in that aspect, Law Enforcement of lawyers in that committee is what we train for. But we have better tactics and a dual relationship of the guardian because we are protected and having Community Policing is the acts of engagement so that someone is selling anything in that community and whether it would be ice cream or a teacher so that comes with a lot of work and that comes with effort and action and proactive to still shun in addressing all the biases and all the theories that you may have in your mind, personally in training it and acknowledging the fact that we do not personally have some type of belief and only have talks and discussions with our Committee Members to actually bring out hardcore discussions that it would get past this. I believe, personally that there is the ability to have the gentlemans time has expired. All consideration i will withdraw my previous objection that the document will be entered into the record. I yield to the gentleman to the florida mr. Gates. The contentment for yielding. Reverend muir cited in the Washington Examiner piece jul july 30, 2019 of saying, if the jews want to get it on, tell them to pin the honor because back and get over to my house. In response to my question you said you were referring to one person. Here is my limited question, were you misquoted in the story when you say the jews and them referring to a plural group of people rather than one person you had agreements with. Am i allowed to answer . We know your name go ahead and answer. I was referring to an incident and a threat to come to my home into the homes of others how you examine, im not looking at it so i do not know whether they quoted me or not. I do know what i said and who i refer to. Did you say them . I just said im not looking at the statement, you are talking about a situation that happened in 1991. If i said them, the over those, i dont know. I know the incident and i know what i was referring to in a Man Threatening to come down who had that kind of criminal record and i had two Young Children under five years old. Again let me talk. Is it your belief if i said them or not without help the police . I think its significant with nobody wants to preach to us [inaudible] the gentleman will say his point. I dont believe you talk about the people becoming before you. The gentleman will suspend and make the polyp enter inquiry. When a witness is asked the question in a hearing before the judiciary committee, to the rules provide the witnesses permitted to answer the question . The witness is permitted to answer the question. The member can controls the time. If it suited to his satisfaction he may go on to another question. When a witness is attempting to answer the question, is it the rules of this committee of that that the witness be allowed to answer and isnt also in the form of this committee do not badger the witness if the witness is attempting to answer the question . The member controls the time and if the member thinks that the quick question has been answered to his satisfaction, he may go to a further question. However, it is not committed to badger a witness and we have for the members a considerable latitude with badgering witnesses is inappropriate and they should not conduct itself in that matter and we expect all parties to go with these proceedings and support themselves with professionalism in a matter that reflects on the house of representatives. They require the chair maintain the decorum and i will do so. The gentleman controls the time. Thank you mister chairman. I have i believe in fighting, well, fight then. Hey nobody holding you, all off the men and plenty of crackers Walking Around here tonight. Did you see those words . I do not recall saying i will not march. I think for the last 40 years i have marched and i think that you are referring to and im not sure but i think you are referring to when i was dealing with some people that said that they dont want to march and that there are going to and i said there are plenty people Walking Around that they called the name and are not feeling that theyre trying to disrupt us to not and the context that they were pursuing and was quoting as i said the reference made about pets or soccer tees were not around two did, you say that . I talked about african history and i talked about that we had dealt with astrology as well as mathematics and philosophy and religion in africa. You referred to people then you . I do not recall how i referred to anyone. You have to sight your statements in 1991 are excusable just because they were 1991 . And the statement that ive made that was wrong i have clearly said that we should not be including the statements including me. Have you made statements . You can ask all the questions you want but im going to answer. The gentleman yields. When you talk about light crackers those are bigoted statements. I made it clear that i was quoting with somebody said. Yelling and getting upset is your thing and you called down. They will status point of order. Once again, mister chairman, after a sustained attack on the character of a witness that has been called by people on this panel and that panel is getting taxed that witness is a stain deliberate manner which is non jermaine through the subject at hand. Is it appropriate for a member to ask the offending members words be taken down . It is not under the rules and the time is the gentlemans. I would note, these are highly relevant to the issues that were facing and reverend sharpton is a part of the committee and as a reported expert in policing and these bigoted statements underlined the bipartisan work to ensure that all citizens are able to come together and have saved communities. How is this part line of inquiry to remain. Is it appropriate . May speak to the point . I dont think we should allow our did you mister chairman, weve had a series and a witness who came before us for two days ago mr. Lewandowski who was totally tipped zealously dealt with this panel and now, we have a reverse of that and we have one of our members do we can say played to a witness who we have told. I dont think it is within. Our best practices to allow our process to get down to the level that we have sunk. Im asking the chairman to in the wise use of discretion, to roll up at the gentlemen of his line of inquiry with this specific witness who is trying to attack his character and theres no question about that. Im reading his own words back. I have the time. Now you dont. It is a point of order . You dont have the floor. Its under the point of order. Hes being heard in the point of order. I havent heard a single word of relevance to the issue at hand. Is it appropriate for this committee to allow the misuse of this platform to attack the character of a witness . This is taking up time of a level that this should never allow to dissent to. Im objecting to im objecting to a swallowing in the mud with these comments. Its not whether or not its true or false at, the fact that its non jermaine. The chair will rule. The chair will rule on the point of order. Allow the gentlemans comments maybe obnoxious, although they maybe thats an improper characterization. They may be characterized as however you want to characterize an ice. Your words be taken down. I pick a fight and now i need help. The gentleman as wide latitude but the question of jermaine us and the language that he uses. Unfortunately, under the rules i, cannot overrule him. The gentleman will proceed. Thank you mister chairman. You sold your life story ill sharpton to your own charity. How much money did your charity pay you for the rights to tell your story . Parliamentary inquiry. This is an outrage, the question is whether youre going to see the motives or insult or badger the witness or costs or characterized his presence at this table. This young lady was not recognized. The lady is not recognized. Stop the clock. State the parliamentary inquiry. The gentleman from georgia made a point about they witnessed that we had two years ago in which, the puny of the motive and character of destruction was not in about questioning. What i say to our good friend from florida is that you are now helping jermaine but you are attacking the character in addition, bringing up information let me just finish. Bring up information of the inquiry and bringing up information that is destroying and the questioning of a witness that will use items that are referred to the witnesses character and the meaning of the witnesses character is an appropriate line of questioning. Whether it is appropriate light of question lead is not relevant. But with respect to the parliamentary inquiry, they questioning of a witness is character and motives which may go to ascertaining to the credibility we have always given very latitude and the answer has to be that we cannot object that. The gentleman will proceed. How much money did your charity pay you personally for the right to tell your life story . My charity held a certain amount of money to me and asked if they could use that money to have the right to sell any rights to my life being documented by a man of play or other items. That it already began reaping the dividends. They had to pay for the same some anyway cause it was odd to me. Can i finish . Was it over half 1 Million Dollars . This sum was whatever some most people would see that as fraud . Charity owed me a certain amount of money. They wouldve had to pay anyway and they were going to allow them. I allowed them to use those funds to strike my record. Is it more than half 1 million bucks . The time has expired. Bigtime from new york is recognized. Thank you mister chair. Before i begin, let me take a moment to thank mrs. Car for her presence here today and sharing her thoughts with this committee and what mrs. Carr went through and no parent should have to go through with their child. Particular when that child was killed by those who are sworn to protect and serve. I wanna thank you for turning your pain and to progress and for your willingness to share the story in such an authentic way and i will be reintroducing the chokehold legislation that you made reference to in your testimony and we will be renaming it the eric garner excessive use of force act tribute it to your son and thank you for all that you have done. I want to enter into the record of consent in a tweet from Joe Scarborough, from july 29th of 2019. The entire line of inappropriate questioning format gates was based reportedly on a resolution that had been introduced over 20 years ago by congressman Joe Scarborough. Which leads to those reminding me of how ill sharpton and i opposed each other 20 years ago. We take pride in our friendship today because of that history and recognizing jesus his words all have fallen short of gods glory at we should forgive each other, 70 times seven times. Not a direction will be put into the record. Id like to thank reverend sharpton for continuing to be a voice for the voiceless and for all that youve done throughout the country and the contents of this issue with Police Violence and for the manner in which you stood with individuals over the years in new york and whether that was who inaudible was hailed by 42 shots at his doorstep unarmed, african man which was patrick and he was a Security Guard and a Rudy Giuliani maligned and how the witness turned out and he was actually an altar boy who went to the same Catholic School as the socalled mayor, giuliani. John bell, who was shot dead with 50 shots on the eve of his wedding whether it was omar edwards, who was off duty black Police Officer who was killed in harlem. Whether that was eric garner who was killed for all the world to see, unarmed and given a death sentence for selling loose cigarettes. Thank you reverend sharpton and all those instances where fortunately, there was no measure of justice for the officer who would engage in resulting in the death and those individuals. What could be done and recognizing that the majority of Police Officers are there to protect and serve with the best of intentions. But like any avenue of whom in endeavor and there are bad apples and went about apple engages in action that results in the death of an individual, what can be done to make sure that theres a degree of accountability . Youre asking me . Reverend sharpton. I think that we need to have and thank you for your comments on our. Work i think the gentleman from florida for allowing me to straighten out the distortion on the record that ive been misquoting and hes done a Great Service. I want to say that i think that the federal government has an obligation and congress can initiate to really set certain laws in place and become federal law that overrides state law and in many ways stops the prosecution of mishandling these matters. One for having independent feuds and in the Justice Department in a group in the Justice Department can handle that and determine whether to go criminal or consent degrees of its police force and things like training for a certain bar and otherwise that violate federal law. We have to have things like cameras on police that has to be mandated on how theyre handled. They must be federal standing edge and subject to criminal back and change. In all thats happened in the last decade i will not answer that with any new legislation. Its important that we do it and im glad we could see this in a regard to the chokehold. Thank you evan sharpton. My time is expired. The time is expired and the gentleman from california. Thank you mister chairman, i think every Police Officer strongly supports body cameras because they provide an accurate record and that protects every honest officers just as much as a pretext every on a citizen. I saw the video of the killing of eric garner and it is appalling. Particularly when you consider the fact that he was selling loose cigarettes. Who would make that a crime to begin with let alone one that would be enforced by police force. Mr. Blake, the attack on you clearly looked unprovoked. What was the justification of the officers and we use another attack . They suspect that they claim that look like was making credit card fraud and was ordering bags and expensive clothes to the hotel. They do know youre somebody else . Thats what he claimed. They asked for any idea . He never declared that he was an officer and only knew later when i saw badges. Whatever the statistics are, i tend to trust the accuracy of this like donald study. Clearly, that is not the Public Perception among a significant portion of the population. I think this could work for former chief of the lapd and davis. He was chief from 69 to 77 and i think that during the time he was chief it exploded and it was up 50 and and actually went down and was not adverse to a very unique law in Law Enforcement and it was not the job of the Police Department to enforce the law. That is the job of every citizen of this department who is there to help. He is the chief who pioneered Neighborhood Watch in los angeles and introduce policing and the l. A. Basic our plan. Because he viewed a Law Enforcement as a partnership between citizens and police and the car plant says were going to become a partnership with the local neighborhoods and will have the same officers in the same neighborhoods and the people that were involved and as soon as we made our philosophy work the essence of Law Enforcement in increase society and the governments will make it opposed to gun control laws that will disarm lawabiding citizens that lawabiding citizens were the first line of defense and an important part of that partnership to enforce the laws that are enacted on behalf of all of us. Ultimately, had philosophy requires a neutral respect for the Police Officers any neighborhoods from the Police Officers. Clearly weve lost it and maybe its too much to ask for in this day and age of Mutual Respect and his community but i would ask chief ron davis about the respective of a great deal of experience at a. I have how do we go about restoring the Mutual Respect that the central for a long force man in our society . I thank you for that question. Because i think thats the route of everything we should be talking about. At the end of the day it, doesnt matter what we are, its all about the relationships. We apply this to Law Enforcement because we are allowed to do certain things a Law Enforcement officers. What gives us the right to do it is the trust of people who empowered us to do it. Along the way we have clearly lost that way and we lost our way because weve had changes it a goalie in the way we interact and all these things have changed our world and change drastically. I think the knowledge would help though. We have surveillance cameras that you make a job easier. I agree. There is no disagreement with that. The point im making is that at the end of the day, its easy to point out that there is a sinners them. The reality is, theres people on both sides of this issue and those relationships will be fostered and took a difference at the end of the day. And in this case were talking about Law Enforcement need to get back to basics and understanding whats important for Law Enforcement and whats in force in our communities and we have that understanding of the tear down on the laws and destruction across this country. Its involving the federal naturalization of please policy at the level. I would argue that all politics along it and if were going to be policing and the trust of those communities that its how we do it and how we interact at that level which will determine what this is a service that we will provide. Congressman, thank you for the question. All started the headfirst. I dont think its a question of federalizing or nationalizing but whether youre an attorney or a doctor. The idea that the profession will not have national standards. I expect it i dont know what possible i go to in this country, the best evidence will take out an appendix this way is what youre going to do. And and doing that they will cause harm with the malpractice. We have 18,000 that are engaging in malpractice because of the lack of national standards. The idea that you set poor standards which is accountability is not counter to the idea of the local policing. The request of going to push back and say that for many, this is not a question we get back to the trust that has never been there. It is just now visible because of videos and will be marches in devastation and will be at a trust level to strain based on abuses and current practices. I think the question congressman region asked that they did know and we had policies and practices the tell the officers that we shall enforce the law so that any crime rate that mr. Mcdonald is talking about that goes down, which is now talking about private numbers of 2 in ignoring the people that are involved in counterproductive. To release themselves his false it is. Completely false and we have a lot of discussion the other day about firearms and the gun debate but it was a blackmail that i had its effect and this is more privileged than a gun . We will add to fight to push back on anything that was strict it when it comes to the Fourth Amendment and the 14 seizure of my body and theres all kinds of reasons to do it and we need to show this to the communities and move forward. The time of the gentleman as well expired. Thank you mrs. For carr your grays and your powerful words and thanks for being with us and im sorry that you had that experience. I have an unusual perspective and the defence lawyer before i became were spots vote for the greatest number of cases against the civil rights cases and the Public Safety commissioner and in the Police Department today are among the most in america and the department had to federal investigations including a standard practices investigation and fully credited department of the lowest crime rate in 40 years. What i learned in that experience is that its the most powerful weapon that we have to reduce crimes and its not any of our guns already equipped bit. Its the trust of the currency. It divided the city into subdivisions and in the neighborhood and build relationships with leaders but one of the early challenges is that we didnt have a Police Department that had diverse city so i found that to be one of the most powerful ways to build up that trust that people saw in their communities and their department so im wondering if you have any ideas of what congress can do to incentivize the diversity departments of recruitment or pretension and the challenges that that faces and committees that have not been part of the to Police Department and what could we do as members of congress to help the departments work aggressively to die first the diversity as weve seen. Its a very quick question because not only are we thinking of different ways to recruit to make it more diverse or to make it more open for the field which are being effective track to drastically which not being able to recruit individuals so in regards to what congress can do. Maybe incentivizing opportunities for funding, support. I know we had it in the past in regards to being able to recruit a better salary and of course the equipment that is coming and is being offered and if theres a think tank with other opportunities which can be offered and will be the first one to raise my hand and do whatever we can do to recruit within our communities. My other experiences that we had a recent study that confirmed this. And they have the vast majority of Law Enforcement officers which are doing their job and will never get enough credit for the work that they do. In fact, the number of incidents come from a very small number of the departments and theres a recent article using civilian allegations for misconduct which is a small majority and repeat offender is responsible for the vast majority of misconduct and if you consider the case of mr. Garner and mr. Blake, they had previous misconduct sustained against them so one of the things is recreating and urban detection system but, we learned is that these things start off as false small things and the Substance Abuse issue with any early system to detect to intervene and what was going on to prevent it so i want to know whether we had incentivized the creation of so those early detention so that we can prevent the things that are subject to hearings and whether or not the experiences that is in fact a small subset within the departments and the precip since. Rub jim reverend sharpton . And chief. Most agencies have that and they offer more awareness and more trading for whether you could have complaints these units and the community and they are giving the oversight within offering these issues and ask questions about whats going on. But there are Early Warning systems that will identify things that are outliers for those individual officers an extra training as well. I agree. I think there clearly needs to be inside performance really under the supervisors to monitor and guide a lot of the behavior of the officers that they keep getting repeat complaints with. Because those Human Factors outside of the job does bear a lot of what happens on the job. The child that could become and not saying in all ways it could but are the ones that bear the brunt of the situation the name may be facing. All and dry began in this issue about the trust of the community is the key and i knew we had been successful in the city of providence when i ran down the street and sought to bury big officers playing hopscotch with the little girl in her neighborhood. They had become so much a part of that community and so respected and i think thats one of the things that we can work on two departments who can will those relations with that community and that i yield back. The gentleman from louisiana. Thank you mister chairman and thanks everybody for being here. Want i had a couple questions r you. I want to thank you for your long service and congratulations on a well deserved election as the National President of order police eye and all of us and louisiana our Great Service so thanks for that. And earlier today are really alarming 66 and the 66 reduction and the recruitment thrives in. Thats why in stain yes since i had their five times the rate of ptsd occurrence are things that are alarming. Stuffed this is the elephant in the room. We dont like talking about it because of the country will. But the debates that are placed on Law Enforcement professionals and the shift work that they do and the level of the calls that they respond to. The things that they see in the things they deal with two carbon mental lies a things in their life. It takes a toll on the individual and for far too long we refuse to talk about it and wanted to be strong and expect our officers to be strong and it wasnt until we realize we dont have the service to recognize the impact of what is happening. We see an officers that are acting out and we think that theyre about officers and a lot of cases we need to acknowledge the fact that theres a reason why these actions are being taken and its signs of something much greater than that. Ill argue, i feel very strongly about the fact that when someone subjects their life to the family, everything to the profession will too good for women within that community and recognize these things. We will not put them aside and will find programs to save those officers and will find a moral responsibility in the service of our community and we think its very important to recognize it and focus on the fact that it does exist and we need to tackle it and get some serious consideration and thoughts with the holistic approach of saving officers who are damage because of the type of work theyre doing. I grew up in a First Responder and my dad was a assistant chief for the Fire Department that was disabled and injured in a fire in 1984 so have a real appreciation for the danger and i grew up with a police and training because my dad was a trained officer. I remember one time and its pretty well known now. Society is divided into three groups of people which are cheap and most people but are all peace loving folks who wouldnt harm anybody else and the second category is the wolves and the people and evil men that prey upon the innocent and there is another category and the ship dogs are called to protect the sheep and confront walls. Im so grateful that we have them in our society and or the military and First Responders and thank all of you that serve because it is a thankless job. The commander, you refer to you or yourself witness reduce the reaction times two Police Officers who have violence because somewhere in the thought process theyre looking and afraid of being fired. The second parties, if so, does that affect their safety and by extension the safety of by standards . Ill speak in general terms of i can. Having discussions with officers where their decision to take action is delayed with a thought process and how it will affect their family. The good news is, were able to have that conversation and as it turned out with the peace and resolution that a number of officers have the situation where noncompliance and its an escalation its an uncertain outcome. Its an uncertain outcome that affects the officers and also affects the by standards. We need to focus on tremendous amounts of our energy on the escalation in training and when it comes to looking at all these situations, we elevate the point because its escalating. We definitely need to improve on our skills because of the uncertain outcomes that could be irreversible. I see heads nodding all around and i think thats universally understood. Last question in my short time left to. You see policing as being the responsibility of policing government are also the republic as well . Its clearly an obligation of public i think its a partnership and it will not be effective. I thank you for my time and i yield back. The young lady from washington. Thank you mister chairman and holding the support and thank you very much. I want to thank you in particular and channeling your anger and your grief around the brutal killing of your son eric garner. Giving inspiration with a mothers love and giving inspiration to the movement for justice and and to this kind of violence we deeply appreciated and for sharing your story for i. Wanted to start i think cheap davis you, said it in your opening remarks. Refused to acknowledge the structural flies sees that are in our institutions. And the institutionalized racism that exists but within all systems within our government and Law Enforcement in every system where we unfortunately have tried to malign witnesses and discredit the idea that we are all working together to try to get to a solution here. But we have to acknowledge the privacies that exist and if we dont acknowledge White Supremacy any history of institutionalized racism we, cannot move forward. I do believe that all of us in Law Enforcement, community we do want for the vast majority of people to find a way forward. I come to this i resident of seattle area but before a member of congress i was a civil rights leader and we wrote to i was a signatory to the letter that went to the department of justice asking for practice investigation in the use of force of Police Brutality and Police Violence in our community. We got that and i am deeply grateful for those practice investigations that the department of justice used to conduct. Im sorry because we are still not true we are not through the process that is not an easy process and are not true and i wish you can go to the department of justice for support and cant do that right now. We also recently passed as a state a Deescalate Washington Initiative and you would be happy that it came from another family that was killed. Who came around and said in the restrictive laws in the country that made it impossible to see any police suiting incidents because we needed to prove to our constitution a standard of malice that was impossible. You know what happened is that those families got together with Law Enforcement and put together an initiative that ive bumpy starts but was passed and part of that included deescalation. I heard mr. Yoes and i saw doctor goff nodding and in changing the standard and making it clear that we need a different standard to hold Police Officers accountable. And also provided resources to the frontline officers. I do think that our Law Enforcement is being forced to address issues on the front lines that are frankly the negligence of under funding the federal government which has been doing enough spin creating people who are homeless or creates hunger or creates all types of issues in our communities. I wanted to ask and maybe ill direct this to both chief davis and mr. Yoes. Do you are encouraged deescalation and makes it clear that the use of force is a last resort ill. Start with you chief davis. Thank you congresswoman, yes i do. I think that a good policy to look at new jersey and also the executive Research Forum where the force should be a necessity and the last resort doesnt mean that its not the first option and that its proportionate and that it should be a strong tactics of sticking to distance covered so, yes i do. You want to add to that . I agree that the escalation is going to be a very big key of stopping our preventing things from hurling in a very unpredictable way. We need to focus as much energy as we can to include that. I think that there is no doubt that in instances forces is going to be required and because of that its acknowledged. I should have mentioned that they have the support of Law Enforcement and the black Law Enforcement of washington in our local sheriff which both endorsed that initiative and my last question in my remaining time is that they are a former doj official and you conducted these investigations to determine whether Law Enforcement actions were in practice and to enforce Consent Decrees. Why is that doj oversight so critical for excessive use of force in police . The young ladys time has expired. When doj initiate practice its because there has been such a severe breakdown in the state and local level to keep those departments accountable and they do have a common sea to correct them. Once they have the systemic constitution the consent results in Court Enforceable and overseen by independent monitors. That is what is crucial to correcting other problems that come with the constitution violations and everything from training to resources and to policies and two officers wellness and most importantly the Community Engagement because the engagement in a matter is whats going to take hold and will see that through once doj is now gone. Our monitor is playing a big role and thank you mister chairman i, do yield back. Young lady the yields back and now its the lady from arizona. Thank you mister chairman i thank you for being here today. I think both republicans and democrats would agree that we need to penalize a bad actors and bad actions. What i am concerned about today, and also in the media is that its all focused has been relatively small number of bad actors and bad actions. We heard it from our chairman nadler in his beginning statement enlisted a whole bunch of instances that were not a good outcome and as we see on the screens today as we are talking, just that. Not all of the good things and Law Enforcement will focus on that too. Because of that, i will have some examples of good things happen recently thought Law Enforcement has done in arizona. And the First Responders in arizona including the department of Public Safety rescue is an 18yearold hero who had fallen about 75 feet in arizona. On august 23rd, arizona Police Officers rescued a baby left in the car in 100degree heat for nearly an hour and she survived. On august six, tucson Police Officers spotted a kitten locked inside a car in midtown parking lot on saturday and rescued it. On july 11th, there was a fire at the apartment complex where officers bravely placed themselves in harms way to rescue a family. And in phoenix, just the other day, there was a severe traffic collision where one of the motorists unfortunately lost his landing. Due to the quick thinking of the Police Officers who are first to arrive, prior to medical union, his life was preserved by the make ship turning kit that was obliged. One of the police one of the things that the Phoenix Police is doing is that they have the newest unit on the force in the form of an ice cream truck. Theyre using it to lower socioeconomic neighborhoods where theyre concerned that there is a bad feeling about Police Officers so theyre trying to mitigate and yesterday afternoon a, suspect entered the store for the customers and rob the store a knife point. He fled the store and hijacked another victim at knife point and was arrested. I am just saying that we need to take care of bad actors but lets not forget, our Law Enforcement are doing so many great things and each and every day. So many heroic things and i want to think that for what they do and i have a question for mr. Yoes. Previously, under previous testimony, the white witnesses suggested that we support the bill that would prohibit choke holds. I just want your professional advice on that. If we prohibited choke holds, what it can lead to not having an option on the table where you actually have to use lethal force more . Thats a very complicated and fluid question and asking for an outcome thats very much unpredictable. There is an escalation and the escalation causes actions and it dresses up at some point becomes an issue on whether or not its necessary to maintain or to not lose control the situation. Its a very fluid concern and its not an easy answer and im not too sure i can answer that but i will tell you that everyone and every time that we find ourselves in a situation that escalates word becomes a physical artwork asian i think the outcome is always going to be different. Mr. Yoes, this is been touched on a little bit. Do you think all of this publicity and focus on negative actors actually hurt the morale of Law Enforcement and causes problems with tensions and hiring Law Enforcement officers . I dont think so, i know so. Whereas a point now where its easier to demonize and often its done without knowing all the facts. In these laws that of due process and were rushed to judgment and making assertions on whats happening. I think its to create an atmosphere that is been very difficult for endorsers to do their job. We have perspective and as you mentioned, things there are incidents that should be reviewed and handled but it doesnt reflect on every law office and every officer is there. Mister id like to yield anytime i have left to use stir yates. Jeans unanimous consent request. The time is expired. Gentlewoman from florida and youth. Thank you so much mister chairman. Thank you to all of our witnesses who are here today as ive listened to your testimony, i feel very hopeful about the subject that we are discussing. This is a serious topic and some of the statements today have been helpful and some have been downright disgraceful and shameful. I think through all of the yelling and carrying on that weve seen in the theatrics. Some of my colleagues forgot that they are other families in the room who lost their loved ones. On their behalf, because i know that they forgot and that we are sorry for your loss were. Talking about a profession that i love and that i worked in for 27 years. My first four speeches as a member of congress, i thought it would be about health care or some other topics and ended up being about a female sergeant and African American sergeant which is against the chief of police who was shot and killed trying to arrest a murder was shot and killed from his pregnant girlfriend. I worked with some of the finest men and women who wear the badge. Good Police Officers are like my family. But weve had some problems. And republicans democrats fit and every congresswoman in this room that Police Officers are celebrated but they are held accountable. Ranking member said it correctly that, there is no one who wants to get rid of bad cops more than good cops. I can tell you as a former chief of police i, spent every dog on day trying to get rid of the bad cops. You heard the badge over our hearts its a and we were the badge over our hearts as a reminder that you have to have the heart for the job. That we are dealing with people and families and mr. Or captain yoes talked about what the men and women go through. The third but we are going to save this and get it back to the level which he deserves to be we have got to Work Together to do that. When we when we talk about leading up to individual states we live and look whats happening right now and would help to create standards and it doesnt matter if youre one officer department or 1000 or 30,000. When you put on that badge and the gun the, standards in which you police with should be standards and i believe you said chief davis and going for other professions that are minimum standards that they should have. How ring standards and we want anybody doing a job of Law Enforcement officer in which he or she should be out there on the streets by themselves making life and death decisions. We want the brightest in the best and every agency should spin their time trying to hire the best and the brightest men and women to do the job we. No its going to cause us to do that but he we need to Work Together and see how we can get it done with training standards and we dont only want the brightest but we want the best trained so that men and women who want them to survive and not just physically but to survive their jobs and be in front of a courtroom where we have to give them the tools to survive. Training is one of those tools. Use the force trains in standardized trading that involves use of force. Across the nation and Community Partnership when we not off survived but we had a good day we had a bad day but would create a Police Department in which they serve but i would not have a question mister chairman but i feel extremely hopeful today to Work Together which have endured and are still here and want to get this done so. I thank you and god bless you all. The gentleman from florida and the document without objection because this votes on the floor and i hope we can finish with where we come back. The young lady from pennsylvania. Thank you. I want to thank miss carr and mr. Blake and the families here to experience and thank the Law Enforcement officers who lay their lives on the line every day including former chief dinings. And for their commitment to excellence because i think thats what were looking for here and representative jennings talked about the tools that we need our Law Enforcements to have. As a representative from philadelphia, i am familiar with a huge supporter of the robust Community Policing work of charles rams e and the former police chief and philly and one of the cochairs of the 2015 task force on 21st century policing. That report and the document to guide us which would be able to work with that already except for six Core Principles and starting with the broad challenge to change the culture of policing but including attention to officer wellness and safety and cutting edge technology. In a limited time that is coming, i wanted to focus on some of the tools that the department of justice has used in the past which is not currently available and miss garcia, can you comment on the impact of the department of justice is reversal a policy regarding Consent Decrees and how that makes it more difficult for the doj to obtain enforcement and agreements to stop civil rights and could be a carrot that is held upon the police force the obligation to the public. Jeff sessions memo in the last day that he was overseeing the doj and is under cut the consent to create things such as time limitations on them and a couple of years and really stripping the discretion of the korean attorneys from crafting the remedies that are necessary for a systemic reform and there are the folks that are doing the fact finding and are talking to the communities in these investigations are not political appointees so really at the best position to deliver justice and the communities that need it because the systemic violations that have occurred. I understand the u. S. Commission on civil rights is been critical of that decision. That is correct. Mr. Davis. I want to focus on the opportunity for Police Forces to request assistance because the two major cities in my district, philadelphia and chester both reached out in d. C. Are i program in chester there, was a Police Shooting after a subject was chased and was killed after 100 bullets so theyre working into the outrage and a series of policed involve shootings. That Department Released and requested my understanding that the department of justice has entered that program which provided advice and recommendations on how Police Departments could do a better job of engaging their community. Can you talk about that . What the department has done to remain those critical reform programs which has the original assessments. Philadelphia is a perfect example where they spent close to a year at the commissioners request looking from top to bottom with policies and found some serious deficiencies on threat perception failures and people were perceiving that by changing policies when the commissioner left they were down almost 50 . Stay check for Technical Assistance and for a lot of the departments they call the saying, look, i want to find out whats going on at the department and i want to find out what i need to fix and could you help. That is no longer there. Which means are going to keep operating under the same estate and depending on the size of your organization, there could be systemic challenges or failures that will lead two years to get to the point where theyre going to fix them but usually i would strongly recommend program to be brought back and to what lindas talking about, the agencies cant reform and wont reform and its not committed to reform and some are prepared and want to do it but the leadership there are working with them where you can help look you forget theyre in an affair sufficient way. Ill be a supporter of having multiple tools so thank you i, yield back. The young lady yields back. The lady from texas. I want to thank the witnesses for being here i apologize if i did step out a lot with this hearing but we have a markup next door with the services and were preceded. Mister chairman, the relationship between Law Enforcement in the community is a very important one. Which is supposed to promote the safety and wellbeing of all people. Its awareness and activism that increases the commitment to envision Public Safety and honors the humanity of all people. Throughout my career, ive spent time in Community Members and leaders and Police Officers and congress of the founding chair of independent Police Oversight lord and former mayor lease parker in houston. Im familiar with the issues involved in relationships between Law Enforcement and the communities that are supposed to protect. Houston chief of police testified in his Committee Earlier this year. The community has suffered the Chilling Effect and reporting a Violent Crime since 2017 when our anti immigrant racial profiling billet was before making the law. Unfortunately, for many of us and used and in some parts of the country. If the driving while black is now turned into driving while brown. We have seen that even weve seen it more against our immigrant community and this texas law enforcers local governments and Law Enforcement agencies to pack its federal immigration officers and diverse limited resources within communities and currents public trust and enforcement and drives witnesses and victims into the shadows. According to the chief though, the immigrants and lawful immigrants are now afraid to report crime and in houston advocates of Domestic Violence and workers and immigrants share stories of women who are not afraid of contacting Law Enforcement because of the deportation threats in threats of abuse. Across the unit, they say authorities have documented the crime reported by immigrants. The pain in frustrations are real and face serious challenges of trust between the policing communities. We must do more i, think that the witnesses have come here today and are working together with policies to ensure that when it comes to Public Safety, all will be protected. I want to start with you miss garcia because i havent met you before. I want to start with you. I read with some interest that you handed out this book and i will refer to you on the use of Police Oversight forwards. I started at the one in houston under the guidance of parker and they call them which is listed in the book of the tools that would help among 14 or 15 others. S. And are the y how many cities are doing tha . And are they working and weve only got less than two minutes. High, in terms of whether theyre working their the biggest tools for Committee Engagement and for the community to be involved in that oversight process. So, there is extremely important in your home state of dallas and the chief their worked with local Community Coalition to before Committee Oversight so, they are really an important step and we would encourage that they actually have the ability to have discipline in terms of the numbers i have to get back to you on the total number across the country. Alas the chief over there, in your experience, and in your discussions with other colleagues. Are we seeing an increase only in the impact of the influence of the White Supremacy rhetoric and things that are anti jewish or anti people of color and anti immigrant in terms of what is going on with policing . I think were seeing an increase in hate crime and violence in the community and were seeing quite frankly and infiltration of White Supremacy and Law Enforcement which is also a challenge so i think were seeing that. How can we get it that . How can we what do we do other than the training and the things that somebody grants can do so we can make sure that we can get that element out of policing. One of things when i was in the administration it was so significant of hate crimes you. Look at the numbers have a whole state at five he crimes. Making sure this clarity is not a hate crime and also are treating hate crimes were the severity of these acts and the Police Department making sure that they make thorough background investigations and most agencies do it but they cant be superficial and character references so they can find out some of the views and they use social media and others if the person youre hiring for the job is congresswoman which is making those independent lives part of it. Young lady lilt back and we have three minutes and 50 seconds left for both on the floor when 321 people havent voted yet. I think we have one more witness now. One more question in the young lady with from georgia. Thank you chairman and i dont have any questions today so i will be brief. Ive a statement id like to make. Thank too each and every one of you today and its by the really important and i know i was running back and forth between other hearings as well and i definitely want to make sure that was here today. I want to make an exceptional thank you and welcome to mama going as i call are and miss gwen carr. She and i have worked together as one of the movements around the country in this very vital important issue and your testimony was powerful and just so invaluable. Ill say more about that in just a minute. I want to say how much i appreciate the Law Enforcement officers who put their lives on the line every day and for the communities that they serve and those officers who serve their communities with dignity and respect they deserve. Our officers do face typical situations that we must empower them to respond appropriately. It is imperative to give them evidence Space Training and implicit bias. We must also Community Based policing. And they must hold individuals accountable when they abuse the power that we the people have given them and no doubt we have more work to do to build bridges that connect Law Enforcement and our communities. Our communities must respect Law Enforcement as protectors, not the enemy. Butc communities as the enemy either. Rather, they must respect the Human Dignity of every person that they encounter, even and especially when it is challenging for them to do so. That is much easier when our Law Enforcement officers look like the communities that they serve. And see that community as their brothers, their sisters and their neighbors. When that fails to happen, the costs are great. We know this from the personal stories that we have heard today, and we also know it from the data. In 2017, a study of over 1100 lawsuits against Law Enforcement the largest study of its kind to date found that our Legal Framework for these cases, the doctrine of qualified immunity, is not even achieving its stated goals. It is often raised as a defense at a trial not in the early stages of litigation as it was intended. Of course, the human toll is the most significant reason for the need for reform. But the financial costs are also significant. Contrary to what you might hear, a study found that taxpayers ultimately pay for 99. 98 of the amount paid to victims and families when an officer abuses his or her power. Those who abuse their power often serve no time and dont pay families a single cent for the immeasurable harms they have caused. But not enough can ever be said about the lives that we have lost when officers dehumanize and devalue the life of another perp. And i want to say to my mother sister, i want to say to her, thank you for sharing your story, a story of injustice you and your family and your son, eric garner, should never have ever had to bear. And we will keep fighting for eric. We will honor his memory and all those that are taken from us by abuses of power. We will not forget eric, and we will not forget the stories of those who are speaking out. Mama gwen, your voice is truly a catalyst for change, and i thank you for that. I speak to you mother to mother, and i hope that we can make sure that not another person ever bears the pain of losing a child such as you have or such as i have. Until you suffer the death of your child, you can never truly understand the depth of iniquity and inequality that we still face in this country. And i vow to you that we will take action. We will hold people accountable when they have the power to do right and choose instead to devalue life. And when our systems are failing to those who abuse power excuse me, and when our systems are failing to hold those who abuse power accountable, we must see to it that these systems change. S it is imperative our Law Enforcement and our citizens Work Together to build the trust, the respect and the community that every american in this country deserves. And i yield back the balance of the lady yields back. The gentlelady from florida. Thank you, mr. Chairman. Thank you so much to the witnesses for coming here and to all of you in the audience. I know that youve come here today to this hearing seeking justice, seeking equal treatment. It is okay to have these conversations despite what you hear from some of the Minority Party on the other side. It is not just okay to have this conversation, i think it is incredibly important for us to have this conversation today and all over america because the facts are that people of color are affected by act of police brew untillalty brutality two to four times more than others. I represent a district, its a minoritymajority district. And we have had those issues, but i also want to point out that i have met many members in Law Enforcement whom i respect greatly who understand the intricacies of our communities and who have been working so hard to build the trust which i think is so important. We know that theres tension between communities and Law Enforcement, and we have seen through now social media which sheds light on the lack of trust between the police and the populations that they serve. And i think that most importantly we need to Start Building trust, but we cant do that without acknowledging that theres inherent racism in this country. We cant do that if we cant have an honest conversation which is why i think its such an important moment for us to discuss this here today. So Police Involvement is more than just enforcing the law, its more than just making arrests. I think that it is important to Start Building trust in these commitment communities. Bringing Police Officers together to shape, to build an understanding of one another. And we have started those programs. Im very proud to share with you that in my district in the hammocks which are communities in my district, Police District regularly puts on events designed to get the cops acquainted with the citys residents. The deputies hold regular coffee with cops at restaurants, and they schedule bike rides to engage with the people that theyre protecting. Events like these help foster real and open relationships in vastly different defense like these help open relationships and vastly different communities. At a federal level i, think its our duty to make sure that Community Policing initiatives are fully funded and continues to succeed. Sadly though, many of the essential programs have been caught and are pushed out of the existence of the of the Current Administration. My first your questions to chief davis given the cuts to federal Community Programs over the past couple of years special Assistance Program what recommendations do you have for local communities to build those relationships as weve seen more funding with. Thank you for the question. Many cases sorry and the department of justice has walked away and they consent degree and a cloud reform and the attorney general has stepped in so i think you go to the state level and as chief hawkins mentioned they have the experience and have the best practices and you integrate with the organizations that are working to establish these National Practices and are definitely significant gaps that can be filled in. The real challenge for these communities is all of the assistant provides no cost that jurisdiction. Its a small or large second have access to it. The challenge now that they pay for the Technical Assistance and that becomes a challenge and in terms of the associations and in their own groups what are the best practices. Thank you for that and mr. Phillip atiba goff xi goff as, a member of congress what you can do to bring back the communities to the relationship between Law Enforcement and the communities that they serve. Its a great question. I thank you for it and i would say that the department of justice had put forward an initiative that just concluded in the Building Community trust and justice. The goal of that initiative is to take the science that we already knew worked in the laboratory and had six cities across the United States. From the turns to both training and culture ships to training and culture ships and this data will have these elements. Given the time i think its in the proposal. Thank you. I yield back my time im impressed by the remarkable work youre doing and the safety. The question has been running through my mind is how americas vast and quite unique problem of gun violence complicates the problem of police so we have lost more than 1 million and a half since 1968 to gun violence. The rates of gun violence are 25 times higher and 22 under wealthy countries on average. This must be a very serious problem in terms of Community Relations and i wonder if you would pylon. Theres not as much Good Research on that question as there should be and are available from the science and some cbp ease and on foursome and. And it has a huge book we look at acevedo and houston and understands that going out to a place where you can escalate putting hands on somebody causing might be armed. But i think one of the elements are not talking about nearly enough is that just as much as gun violence should be making the Law Enforcement even more dangerous. Its suicides that are responsible for a larger proportion of lost officer lives. Out on we have to go back to or to talk about it. As were having metabolized and live with it at home, the availability of guns and violence are not just on the streets and in private homes of Law Enforcement as well. Thank you. Can i ask one yes or no question . Okay, i think this is for chief davis. You mentioned the problem of White Supremacists entering the Police Forces and we reported that you have. Any research to suggest that this is actually a conscious strategy and groups to send people in to local forces. The additional question for the witnesses and we think our witnesses without objection this hearing is adjourned and zero time left on the floor. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] morning. Good morning. Okay, now