National military park. Were going to have him talk about the expert. He is everything you hope you find when you walk up to the desk of the park and you want to talk to that Great Southern gentleman with the great accent and he will tell you about southern charm. He has been told he is not southern enough. Is that right . Matt yes. I wish he would stop with the gentle man part. Eman part. E gentl gentleman, who was about to speak to you today. He comes from mississippi and well talk about the siege of mississippi. Anyone was ever have the opportunity to be was ever opportunity had the to be on a battlefield with him is kind of like having this immersive experience on the field. And it is kind of like having this standup comedy routine, where he charms hundreds of the visitors with his unique style. If you ever have the opportunity a listen to him speak, it is wonderful storytelling experience. Ado, i present matt atkinson. Matt i always hate the introduction. I think this may be the first time i have ever been on cspan. I dont know if you set goals or iatever, but i always thought would hit the pinnacle if i could have steve scully interview me on cspan. You know who he is, you just dont know who he is. He is the dude from cspan. If he is watching, i would like to make a shout out. [laughter] come to stevenson ranch. Let us get the catch out and the firm out. Let us have an interview and talk. Let us get the couch out and fern out. Andus have an interview talk. I am supposed to talk about vicksburg from a confederate standpoint, which is unusual for me, because i always talk about it from the union standpoint, because i think it is great grants greatest handling. It may be the best campaign in the entire civil war. Very decisive to say the least. I am going to try to speak from the confederate perspective, which is from a biased standpoint, depressing. [laughter] yes. Know that i you to have fortified myself, relaly good really good last night in anticipation of this program. Vicksburg, ift you ever read about it in depth, one of the big problems with vicksburg from a confederate standpoint is you dont have that many confederate accounts. They dont want to write about it. When it is happening, it is a siege. Will be primarily talking about that, the siege of vicksburg. When you are besieged, you cant mail anything. What is the impetus to write . Confederate accounts are few and far between. You got memphis up above. You got new orleans down below. And both cities fall to union forces. Vicksburg becomes that last place. And unlike port hudson or natches or any of the other remaining towns, its got a railroad. And this is where the confederacy is going to make its stand. One of the things that geographic, geographically that most people miss about vicksburg is that the Mississippi River, Everybody Knows about that. And thats to the west of the town itself. I keep bumping into this microphone. The thing they dont realize about the town itself is that vicksburg is actually surrounded on all four sides by water. And thats whats going to prove to be extremely difficult for the union army. Not only do you have the Mississippi River right here, you also have the Big Black River along here and you also have the yazoo river to the north. So you got the big black to the east and to the south. The yazoo to the north. Mississippi to the west. Basic goal of the union army is how to find high and dry ground. How do you get at vicksburg . To be a tough, very tough nut to crack. In 1863, grant basically has two options in the spring. He could go back to memphis and start back down through northern mississippi and try to approach vicksburg from the north or he could march down the louisiana side which his army is basically up north. Heres vicksburg right here. Heres the army up north. Now, im going to do this whole happen. And i know everybody has already looked at the map and already tell the campaign, ok . But what i need you to do is focus on the left side of the map because thats where were starting. Let the campaign unfold and were going to do vicksburg in double quick time. All right . To get to the siege. So grant out of the two options is obviously going to choose the latter. Hes going to march his army the louisiana side which could be its own power point within itself. Very good maneuver by grant. About 20,000 men trying to move through flooded bayous. Grant makes it. He starts out on march 29. Moving his army over there, two separate occasions the union navy will run past the confederate batteries at vicksburg. Down below. When military staff rides come to vicksburg, they dont generally come to study the confederates. But when they study the u. S. Forces, one of the things that they concentrate on is the great relationship between the navy and the army during the icksburg campaign. Theres no supreme commander. Theres no eisenhower, theres no macarthur at vicksburg. The navy doesnt answer to the army and the army doesnt answer to the navy. But yet David Dickson porter, admiral David Dickson porter form a grat form a grat great working relationship and thats what makes vicksburg click as far as getting the job done in capturing this city. So the navy, porter agrees to run past the batteries. Hes to rendezvous with grants army down here. Grant marches all the way down through these bayous and he originally wanted to cross the Mississippi River here at grand gulf. The union navy engages the Small Confederate water Battery Force there. And his is unable to knock out the guns. Why is that big . Because grant doesnt have his landing spot. What does u. S. Grant do . Never thinks about retreating. He simply just has the navy go further south. He marches his army a little bit a little bit further south to bruinsburg and he crosses right there. On april 29. Now, grant has a foothold within mississippi. April 30, his Army Continues to cross and basically by the night of april 30, hes got 20,000 men. 20,000 men across mississippi. The confederates for that matter and this is what grant does really well grant leaves a feint, william t. Of you heard of him is going to be north [laughter] i once went to a Civil War Party one time and went in the bathroom and they had im not kidding yall they had a roll of sherman toilet paper. [laughter] so theres a feint up above here with sherman. And lets get into the confederate defense of vicksburg. Im about to talk about john c. Pemberton in just a second. But pemberton, the confederate commander setting here in vicksburg, and he is he bites on this feint. While grant is marching south, with the main part of the army he thinks is the main union threat is going to come from north of the city. He guesses incorrectly here. Meanwhile, down here, at port gibson, youve got the confederate commander there, john c. Bowen, screaming at pemberton, hey, the whole union armys coming over here, boss. I need some help. But he doesnt get any reinforcements in time. Pemberton is as i said is an interesting study. About hard luck about hard luc you know, hes hes a yankee. I mean, we all have things in our life were not proud of. [laughter] that one got a money. I like that. Suddenly cspan goes dark, you know . And pull the bluing plug on him. Ere not to have the callins, i dont know that he thought he was funny. We get steve scully, you know, so, man, tell us about your childhood. [laughter] john c. Pemberton is born in philly. August 10, 1814. 1837 he graduates from west point. From a military academy there. He stands 27th out of 50. Average student. Not too smart. Not too dumb. Pemberton became a career military officer receiving two brevets for gallantry in the mexican war. In 1848, he married a virginian. A torn man erton is which side he should go to. Should he go north . Should he go south . His wife writes him, one of the few letters that still exist between pemberton and his wife and she says to him, my darling, why have you not joined us yet . Jeff davis has a position waiting on you. Pemberton chooses the south and probably because of his wife. He comes down on june 17, 1861, he gets a star. Brigadier generals commission, the Confederate Army. And now watch. This is july excuse me. June of 1861. The fall of 1861 found him in South Carolina overseeing coastal defenses. By january of 1862, the War Department appointed him to the rank of major general. Followed in march as formal assignment of the commander of outh carolina and georgia. Ok. Hats in South Carolina . Theres a little place where the civil war began. You ever heard about South Carolina . Ok. There is a reason a south carolinian was not named president of the confederacy. Theyre known as a bunch of hotheads. As one person said, i forget who said it South Carolina is too small for a republican, too arge for an insane asylum. [laughter] needless to say, needless to say oh, here come the letters now. South carolina. Congress will by the time i leave out of here congress will be debating cutting off funding for cspan. E dont like your programming. They put pemberton in charge of charleston. You see where im going with this. A yankee. In charge of charleston. Nd then pemberton makes some faux pas, charleston cant be evacuated and we may have to evacuate the city if the yankees come you dont say that. They get on the phone to jeff davis and nare like whos this guy . And why is he here . And davis i think is embarrassed by that. Davis, Jefferson Davis has a lot of flaws. And this might be a flaw in some cases. But it can be a strength. If you were a friend of jeff davis, you were a friend of jeff davis. He was very loyal to people who were loyal to him. And he felt that the impugning John Pemberton was basically attacking him indirectly. So he removes pemberton from South Carolina and reassigns him. What better way to show your confidence in a commander than to reassign him to defend literally your own home in mississippi . And so pemberton is transferred from South Carolina to mississippi. He gets there in october of 1862. Hes a major general. Theres a problem. Theres a guy by the name of Earl Van Dorn already in mississippi. To he has a senior rank pemberton. O how do you fix that . You promote pemberton again so pemberton becomes a Lieutenant General arguably in charge of the most Important Department in the entire confederacy. And john c. Pemberton, a Lieutenant General, has never fought a battle as a commander. Thats how that works. No event in the resume of pembertons military career warranted the rapid rise in promotion. Pembertons strength lay as an administrator and he was a competent man as a Department Commander but he had never commanded an army in the field of battle. To compound his woes, pemberton had a domineering personality. And he tended to irritate his subordinates. The rank and file des trusted him from the beginning because of his northern birth. And these ingredients, everything, put together, would spell disaster for the confederacy. Pemberton doesnt have corps at vicksburg. He has divisions. And he has five division commanders. John c. Bowen who arguably i would like to say is one of the most underrated, overlooked combat command eshes from the american civil war. He has missouri, arkansas boys and i think theyre the best troops in the entire campaign. Watch how much theyre utilized. Ou got william loring. Interesting chap. Lost an arm in the mexican war. Really, really, really irirritable fella. Him and Stonewall Jackson just did not get along in 1861. So what whats the confederacy always do . They kick him out west. He will prove to be a thorn in pembertons side. In fact, some would argue he might have even thrown a battle just to get pemberton fired. You got the Senior Division commander, you got cardale stevenson over here and john h. Forna from alabama and this gentleman right here who actually is going to tie in to ironically i believe is chris mccowski, ski this is martinel smith and you never paid attention to martinel smith and i wont talk about him today but notice the name and how much he pops up at various places. And in 1864, after vicksburg, hes going to be robert e. Lees chief engineer. Some people say he was in charge. Not known 100 of the but he may have been the one that drew out the mule shoe at spotsylvania in the darkness. Small world, huh . All right. So vicksburg, grant gets over. Hes got a toehold. Bowen is down here, confederate division commander. Hes got 5,000 men. Grant has about 20,000 men and grant could have been had 200,000 men at fort gibson and wouldnt have mattered, why . Because its nothing but pure jungle. Im talking about a forest. Im talking about not what were used to up here. Grant cant deploy his men. And it takes a while. Hes got 41 odds but bowen manages to hold him up all day long. And by the time he gets his toehold here, he pushes the confederates back and basically he has gained his ground. He uncovers grand gulf and that sets up his supply base where the navy can resupply him from there. So hes got a tenuous supply line coming down through louisiana and over to here. Most people think he cuts loose. Thats not exactly true. So what does grant do . If youre pemberton, youre the Confederate Forces once again, this is from the confederate viewpoint, it looks like grant would take the shortest route to your objective, right . He would just go straight north. As you can see from the map, he does not do that. He moves to the east. And when he moaches inland, this Big Black River, the name of it, Big Black River right here, stands as an obstacle between him and vicksburg. Well, grant turns that that obstacle into a strength by utilizing the big black to cover his left flank as he advances in to the interior of the state. Grants objective is vicksburg. But what grant is aiming for, and what pemberton, the confederate commander, does guess correctly, is that grants objective is the achilles tendon of vicksburg which is this railroad right here. If you cut the railroad, vicksburg is dying on the vine so to speak. And literally you talk about confederates right here, those of you in the back have a hard time saying this but edward station right here is where pemberton comes out from vicksburg and collects his army. He and grant are about to have a huge battle right there. When suddenly the battle of raymond is fought over here. Long story short, confederates another confederate force from port hudson was supposed to be attacking the rear of the you know armey. They turned out to be attacking an entire you know corps with one brigade basically and that turned out, ladies and gentlemen, to confederates hold them up but it turned out to be a union victory. But what does grant do . Theres confederates in my rear. I dont want to deal with pemberton right now. So grant backs out, heads to jackson. Defeats that confederate force there, pushes it away from pemberton. And then severs the railroad and starts moving toward vicksburg. On may 16, the battle of Champion Hill is fought. The battle of Champion Hill roughly has oh, probably have 60,000 men combining both forces fighting it out right there. Doesnt even have one monument there today. It decides the fate of vicksburg. Pembertons forces are defeated at Champion Hill. They fall back toward they fall back toward vicksburg. The next day they fight a rear guard action at the battle of Big Black River on may 17. And then pemberton makes the fatal decision to withdraw his army into the interior of the city. May 19, grant comes up. Grant doesnt want to sit in front of vicksburg all through the mississippi summer. May 19, he starts his attack. All the union troops cant get up. Only portion that are ready to attack are up here on shermans front in this area. Nd they attack along there and severely repulsed. Specifically at the stock aid red stockade redan. May 19 cost grant 942 men. To show the strength of fortifications here its not known but the confederates if grant loses 1,000 the confederates are estimated to have lost 250. Thats what a man behind fortifications with a rival musket can rifle musket can do. And what causes 41 casualties . These Little Things right here that ring the city, the confederates have built a defensive work around the city and at weak points, basically this is one long entire ridge. Im oversimplifying it but thats basically it. One long ten stackhouse ridge surrounding the city. And wherever theres another ridge coming out or a road or anything like that, the confederacy erected massive fortifications there. Forts or variations of forts in order to control the terrain. As you can see, you would place ditches right here, fortifications. Saids, fray, al other stuff, ill talk about siege materials in just a little while. But you slow up the tackers. The thing if youve never been to vicksburg which is hard for me to explain, let me put it to you like one confederate engineer said after the war. He said when the lord made all the mountain, but thats never been done on cspan. [laughter] and he made all the valleys, he dumped all the scraps in vicksburg. [laughter] thank you. Remember, thats thats a quote. But really, ladies and gentlemen, its basically two ridges and a ravine or multiple ravines between the two lines right there. It is very good ground to defend. Say very hard ground to the very least. Some of the for the of indications they will erect this is a redan. And basically a redan is an inverted v. What do you do . You put a redan, if you got a weak point in the line, lets say my line is running like this, you put a redan jutting out front and anybody attacking, my line to the left or the right, i can shoot down it. The problem with the redan or any of these fortifications is once you go to a siege work, theyre subject to a crossfire. From the union. So its very deadly, too, for the confederates. Lunet, another variation of the confederate fortifications, redoubt, not quite a fort. Got an open back end on it. Confederates had an earth work here called the great redoubt. Thank you. [laughter] grant cant get into the city on may 19. Im perturbed. You know u. S. Grant. You dont give up. Three days later grant decides to renew the assault again. May 19, hes going to come up here, excuse me, may 22, at 6 00 in the morning, hes going to open up a massive artillery bombardment on the confederate lines. The union navy will join in. Huge shells if you can imagine those big guns firing a rocketing into the confederate lines and into the city itself. At 10 00, they set their watches. The first assault that was ever clocked if you will. They all got together and synchronized their watches. At 10 00 the Union Infantry goes forward. With a loud huzzah they surge across those deep are a convenience. A couple of stories and now you can see how wide this assault is. Remember, may 19 was just up here. Now look. May 22. Look where grants going. Hes assaulting all those confederate strongholds. A couple of stories here. At the second texas lunet, which is roughly about right here, burbridge and benton are here, this is john a. Mclearnens section of the line. There was texans obviously inside the lunet. And one tevin wrote, one confederate said my cannon belts cannister, my men made the air real with yells and shouts as they saw the earth strewn with the enemys dead. End of quote. As scores of federals level, you can imagine, the texans divined a large figure marching toward them. Another view. Here is the lunet and the railroad redoubt. The Railroad Running in and the ballwins ferry road and how theyre building these fortifications to guard against the weak point in the line. This is the story im talking about. Actually its going to be right in here between the two. You can imagine in the midst of this assault the texans look up and theyre shooting all these yankees out in front of them and this lone soldier, Union Soldier, keeps walking toward him. It was private Thomas Higgins of the 99th illinois. At least 100 men took deliberate aim at him wrote a texan. Some of the confederates ran along the line, their own line shouting dont shoot that man. Dont shoot that man. While others cheered him on. Higgins made it all the way to the confederate line karke the u. S. Flag. And the first thing the texans did after they pulled him over the earth works and took his flag from him right there is they patted him down for body armor because they couldnt believe that they had missed him that many times. Coming across that field. Right there. Higgins would get the medal of honor for that. Talk about great defenses, you wont ever hear about this again in the civil war. Right here. May 22, once again, around here, in this area. Union soldiers are going to be coming up. Theyre going to get bogged down. Theres higgins right there. This is the side of the second texas lunet. Its been made into a cemetery. But you can see the side of the fort still exists. See that marker right there, these markers right here . Union boys cant get into the fort. You know what theyre going to do . Chicago mercentile battery is going to hand tow a sixpound cannon up to the confederate fort and fire it into there at point blank range. Never hear of that before or after. You talk about great defense he is. How would you like to be on the receiving end of that . Right there. Theres the marker for the embrasure or cannon, however you look at it. The confederates still dont fall. Up here, graveyard road, aptly named because it goes past the city cemetery, is the stockade redan. See the remnants of it right here. The entrenchments. Basically this is one half of that inverted v. Obviously this is the ditch in front of it. And you can see the union markers, the blue markers which are out there today. Union troops are going to charge down this road in this direction, and theres the stockade redan. Theyre going to charge this is the direction looking the other way on this road. Ohioans are going to lead the advance, ok . Got an ohioan in the back giving me the fist pump back there. Regimen, ely, first 30th ohio will make it all the way to the ditch. The second regiment, the 37th ohio will fall flat on their face. In the middle. Road. And you know what that means for everybody behind them . Theyre stuck. And what do those confederates going to do to those union troops that are massed in column on that road . Theyre going to kill them. And the Union Soldiers have to dive for cover. Talk about great defenses and they have to dive for cover on either side of this ridge or this road bed right here. Theres the confederate view. From atop. See how deep the ravines are. How do you charge across that . See what i mean . Thats the reason this defense is going to go on so long. Its another view from the union side. Right there. The end result of those attacks on may 22 were 3,200 casualties. For the union. Including 502 killed. The confederates lost approximately 500. Thats what fortifications, a defender behind fortifications can do. So grant has no choice. He has to settle down for a siege. And what is a siege, ladies and gentlemen . Grant described it as basically outcamping the enemy. [laughter] yep. This is the last thing you want to do. Now, getting into the siege operations, basically when you have a siege, any type siege, it becomes a matter of time between how long the besiegers, the assaulting force, can maintain their position outside of the city or the position or whatever, and more importantly, how long the defender can maintain their defense inside the city . Because a true siege, ladies and gentlemen, is where all communication is shut off. Where the position is entirely surrounded and in this case it is. The union navy has them blockaded over here. And you can easily follow the blue all the way around the city. Pemberton is shut up like he was inside of a bottle. Union and confederate soldiers hunker down and they start to dig in. Some of the interesting things like here, they need Construction Material and it still grows and one of the interesting things in the area, they still had this i want to say i may have it twrong but its a type of bamboo. I want to say its chinese bamboo. But it grows in mississippi. How it got there i dont know. But these stalks, these bamboo shoots will go up like for two stories. And, union, the stalks on them will be can get to be over several years, just get to be huge. Union soldiers, confederate soldiers are going to chop down that stuff and theyre going to start making these baskets. Theyre called gabbeons and fafmentines and stuff and they manufacture these baskets and roll them up to the front lien and dig out the earth and they place them into the wall and then they throw earth into the interior of them. And that makes the fortification wall keeps the for the he have indication walls from crumb fortification walls from crumbling. You imagine what kind of scale this requires along a siege line of this lent. Thats a good picture of it. Thats from petersburg. Yeah. See the loopholes . Right here. This is where youd shoot see how it goes down . Yeah. Not bad for farmer boys, is it . One of the things, though, i want to spend some time on is this right here. Any siege, ladies and gentlemen, any siege, just brought out some more lemonade. Lemonade, that cool refreshing drink [laughter] thats eddie murphy joke. He was funny. [laughter] what were going to talk about right now is called is called parallels. A siege operation, this goes back to like roman times. It may even go back further than that. But how do you get at a fortified position of the enemy without getting killed . Especially when youre in a place like vicksburg with the deep are a convenience . Ravines and so forth . The union army will start 13 pare lells and a parallel, ladies and gentlemen, is lets say that the enemys position is straight in front of this podium right here. A parallel, i could dig the fastest way between two points is obviously a Straight Line. If i dug the Straight Line toward the enemys position or the confederate position in this case right here, the enemy can shoot down the line. The confederates could shoot me as im digging. A parallel, therefore, varies its degrees of approach. And the if i dig this way, and my objective is over there, if i dig this way, then i throw the dirt on this side. If i dig this way, i come back this way, i throw the dirt on this side. And in that way, i inch my way forward to the enemy position. Watch. Want to see it again . [laughter] now, when i get to a certain point, what i do is i create a parallel. A parallel is basically where i cross the t. In other words, i fortify the. Sition thats in front so what i have is an offensive operation follow me here i have an offensive operation with defensive capabilities. See . That goes way back. That goes back to like crusades and stuff like that. Union army is doing that. How do the confederates defend themselves against such a thing . The confederates are supposed to, ladies and gentlemen, i dont know how well it will show up but a defending force can also dig a parallel out here in front of their position and cut off the enemy before they have reached the mainline. The confederates failed to do that in front of any of their positions basically. You can also, one of the harrowing things about this is the enemy, the confederates in this case can come out and they can attack the assaulting forces as theyre digging. Very hard to defend yourself while you have a shovel in your hand. Especially in a gun fight. The confederates will only do that on one place, along the siege line. The salient work. So what are they going to do . Well focus on this is shirleys house and ill show you a picture of that in a minute. But heres the approach trench. See it coming . See how theyre varying it . And here is the confederate position. Here is the parallel right there. In that area. To show you how fast that this goes on, Union Soldiers are going to break ground back here on may 26. 300 men. Theyre 400 yards from here to here. 400 yards. Ay 26, they start digging. They work behind a Railroad Flat car with some 20 bales of cotton on top of it. In three days, they have progressed 200 yards out of the 400. The confederates, digging a ditch toward the confederates was eight feet wide and seven feet deep. Thats turning some soil. By june 3, the head of the sat was 130 yards from third louisiana redan. Thats the confederate position. It was at this point that they created the parallel, 130 yards. Bringing in forward artillery they named the battery hickenlooper. By june 8, five days later, the sat was within 75 yards. Starting from battery hicken looper the confederates became more and more object stan at in their object stint in their defense. Now within range of their small arms and although the confederate artillery was basically smothered, all arms still reined. They used to pack shells they used to pack stuff like we have those styrofoam peanuts today and pack stuff in. They used to pack stuff back in what they called tow which is basically like the shredded paper. I dont like seeing you, chris. And they have this shredded paper, and one louisianan came up with the novel idea, well, they couldnt shoot the yankees behind these 20 bales of cotton. So they take the tow and dip it in turpin tine, take a piece of it, put it in the hollowed out base of the mini ball, reduce the charge on it, meaning dont put a full charge of powder in the musket and fire it into that cotton bale. And you know what happened . It burned straight up and they had confederates standing by to pick off any Union Soldier that tried to put the fire out. Right there. Yeah. Undeterred, Union Soldiers just built another sap roller. Theres a famous picture. Surely house, illinois monument, i think this is one of the greatest civil war monuments ever created. If you havent seen this, go check it out sometime. Heres wartime picture. Thats in this ravine. Right here. Closeup of it. Union position i should say. Kind of neat, isnt it . By the time they get to the third louisianan redan on june 22, Union Soldiers excavated a 400yard zigzag approach trench that reached there. And then former leadminers in the union army began to tunnel underneath and in less than three days, a gallery measuring four feet in width and five feet in height stretched 45 feet underneath the confederate position. And two side galleries extended at 45 degree angles. Another 15 feet. Into these rooms union troops gosted 2,200 pounds of black powder. And ran fuse lines out to the entrance. Mere is the parallel. You cant really see it good but this is the confederate position. Another picture. This is the third louisiana, excuse me. This is the third louisiana redan right here. And here this is louisiana monument. Now you can see it. Afternoon of june 25 the ground began to shake and a few seconds later a large mass of earth lifted a huge dust cloud. And earth rained down on the confederate and union troops. Immediately union troops are going to leap into the crater and start assaulting up through there. They cant break through. John c. Bowen and his missouri boys are there to meet them. The assault against the crater will go on for the next 24 hours. Union casualties will total 34 killed, 209 wounded, while the confederates suffered 21 killed and 73 wounded. Undeterred, union forces are going to open up the mine again and explode another 1,800pound powder charge underneath the third louisiana redan on july 1. Now, the confederates lost a lot of good men on the june 25 explosion. So what they were doing on july 1 is they had started digging countermines. And in order to do this, they brought forward slave labor. When the union blew up the second mine on july 1, one of those slaves that was working in the confederate countermine will several of the slaves say a half were all killed in the explosion. One of the slaves, though, was blown sky high. All right . And if you can believe it or not, sorry for the bad picture. Thats the only one i could get right there. Thats a picture of him. He was blown, when they blew that mine, abraham, which was his name, was blown all the way into the union lines. And the Union Soldiers said he landed on his head. And he dusted they pecked him up and dusted him off and everything and obviously he was in shock. Can you imagine . And they tried to calm him down and everything. And they said, well, what happened . And i dont know. I dont know what happened. [laughter] later through the grapevine telegraph word spread along the union line that said there was this slave that had been blown to freedom. Enterprising Union Soldiers put him in a tent and charged a arter to see americas first astronaut. [laughter] newspaper interviewed abraham and they said what happened . And they go, well, when i was old master met my going down. [laughter] he said abraham, you better grab your coat. Ts old cold up there. Got to wrap it up. I got the mean look in the back. I got you i want to tell you something, though, you talk about improvising, do not go home and try this, ok . To the cspan audience, do not go in the back yard and try this, all right . This is a homemade mortar. Made out of wood. They would have made them out of oak. The Union Soldiers built three of them. One sixpounder and one two 12pounders. The thing about them is they didnt put two pounds of powder in a wooden mortar. They were only putting like two or three or four ounces in it. They brought these wooden mortas up next to the confederate position and lob shells at point blank range. For 48 hours, before the siege ends, ladies and gentlemen, they drop 468 cannon balls or cannon rounds into the third louisiana redan. At point blank range. Can you imagine having to defend that position with explosive shells raining down . One confederate officer after the surrender said in 48 hours, they lost 21 killed and 72 wounded. From these wooden mortars. Meanwhile, back in the city, the civilians are trying to make it. They have to hunker down within caves. Unfortunately, none of these caves still exist. There was a child born in one of the caves. His mother named him siege. Its a true story. Some of them are quite elaborate. Some of them are multiple rooms. Another picture. Confederate soldiers are living on field peas. One confederate wrote, ladies and gentlemen, when the siege began, we were receiving a third of a ration of meat and about two therds of a ration of meal. This was soon greatly reduced. In lieu of the cornmeal we had cow peas ground and made into bread. This bread after being baked was about the color of an indian. And a few hours after being baked would stretch a foot or more before finally breaking. For a time we had fresh beef instead of bacon and for a few days at one time we had rice bread issued to us. Then the bread ceased altogether. Our ration consisted of about i want you to think about the confederates subsisting on this. Daily ration was one tea cup full of boiled peas and a small bit perhaps two ounces of bacon. For several days before the capitulation, we had instead of bacon about three or four love this quote. And i had to get to it. And i beg your forgiveness, chris. This confederate writes, curl the lip in derision if you will, ye dainty he cures. Epicures. [laughter] but i but i weanye never tasted a morsel more sweet than mule meat and peas was to us. The flesh of the mule seemed of a courser grain but more tender than that of the ox. And had a decidedly horsey flavor. [laughter] to starving men, though, however, it was very good. Right here. All right. I got to wrap this up. But the confederates, ladies and gentlemen, as you talk about great defenses which is the theme of this seminar, and i hope you enjoyed some of the short stories i told you. But basically this is it in a nutshell. A siege is boring. Its monotonous and its also very deadly. The confederate soldiers are living in these dches and theyre absolutely the union are, too, but they get relief and confederate soldiers never get any r r and never taken off the line. They might go behind the line and sleep or Something Like that. But theyre constantly have to be near the line. Theyre on reduced rations and Drinking Water from the Mississippi River. It it introduces into the ranks mass disen terry. From that contaminated water. And they just they just start. They just cant function anymore. All right . And so their only hope, the few confederate accounts which you have, right here, is this gentleman right here. Joe johnson. Who has the confederate relief force over at jackson, mississippi. And johnson is not coming. Its unfortunate for the confederates. But if you talk about sieges or you talk about defenses, i looked up on the internet eight famous sieges before i came here. Out of eight sieges, famous sieges, vicksburg being one, only two of them were ever successfully relieved. And this is World History im talking about. Pemberton and grant are going to get together and pemberton ladies and gentlemen is going to surrender the city on july 4. 1863. A p. R. Fiasco. For the confederacy. But that, ladies and gentlemen, results in the surrender of 29,500 Union Soldiers that would be great. 29,500 confederate soldiers. 50,000 small arms. 172 pieces of artillery. 38,000 projectile. S, 58,000 pounds of black pouder and 4,800 artillery cartridges. 600,000 rounds of ammunition and 350,000 percussion caps a complete Confederate Army of 30,000 men is taken off the field. And you could say that the 12 punch of gettysburg and vicksburg, ladies and gentlemen, hindsight being 2020, sounds the death knell of the con fed ralse. The question i leave you with was the confederate defense f vicksburg good or bad . Thank you all very much. [applause] we have the time for one or two questions. Got a question in the back here. As i make my way let me remind folks please stand up and introduce yourselves and tell us where youre from and please be sure that you have a question. I fell into a burning down, fire i went down, down daniel sharen from northern virginia. A quick question. Pemberton or johnson, who deserves more blame for the fall of vicksburg . Wow. I know what this guy thinks over here. Pemberton or johnson. Well, let me think about that. Ultimately let me start with pemberton and ill let you decide. Ill punt on the question. Pemberton receives two conflicting orders. How do you reconcile a order from jeff days hold the city at all costs with a directive from your field commander, excuse me, your Department Commander, josefy johnson evacuate the city and join forces with me . Pemberton tries to please two masters and ends up pleasing none. Ut of the five divisions for example, pemberton at Champion Hill which was the pivotal battle that sealed the fate of pemberton out of five of five divisions only brings three of them with them. The other two remain in the city. And when grant attacks the city on may 19 and may 282 thats why he is up such a hard time because those troops are fresh where he attacks. But pemberton, he just was he just was indecisive. I could go either way with holding the city or evacuating it. But he just wouldnt make up his mind. He couldnt do both. Johnson on the other hand, tells pemberton to come join forces with him. And in one of the most bizarre ncidents of the civil war. Telling pembr ton to march and d him, johnson is johnson gets to jackson, mississippi. May 13. The day before the city falls. And the first telegraph, this is a quote, the first telegram he sends to jeff davis is i am too late. So what you got here is just an is more to blame . Pemberton is on the scene more. He is the field commander. Ultimately. But it takes two to have a marriage, right . There was another one. Time for one more question . Joe trulio from new jersey. New jersey. Jersey. [laughter] 1989. 1989. Yeah. Ive been talking to this old gal from new jersey. They got some different customs over there. That we do. Pretty hard. Do we have any estimate or information about civilian casualties during this siege . Well, yes. Yes and no. Very light is the answer the short answer to a long question right there. There are several civilians that are killed during the siege. Im trying to think if i remember an exact number. It couldnt be more than 10. I five is sticking in my head. So ive always had a problem, let me answer the question this way. Ive always had a problem in my mind rationalize rationalizing what the union the United States forces did during the siege of vicksburg as far as shelling the city. I can see militarily on one hand it is within the siege lines and so forth, but theyre dropping 13 inch mortar balls into the city every 15 minutes. One every 10 or 15 minutes. A ball fired 2 1 2 miles with 25 pounds of powder. Theres nothing really to be gained i dont think by shelling the city. So ive often ive been torn as to whether i agree with that or not. One of the most dastardly things that occurred during the siege of vicksburg. The union sets up an artillery battery, not big guns but field guns across the river, the Mississippi River from vicksburg on the louisiana side. Well, if you can believe this or not, the citizens of vicksburg will come out and go shopping while the union navy would be breaking for breakfast, lunch and dinner. They quit shelling for like an hour. Thats when the civilians would come out and enjoy themselves, sun themselves or Something Like that. And one time they were having if you can imagine trying to have a Church Service in the midst of a shelling, some parishioners were coming out of the church and the Union Battery across the river could see right up that street and started shelling them as they were coming out of the church. I think they killed one right there, at least horribly mangled him. I dont know what you got out of that. I dont know what the purpose of that was. And on that happy note [laughter] hey, its your people. Ladies and gentlemen, matt at kennison. Hes here all week, ladies and gentlemen. [applause] thank you yall. Announcer trg interested in American History tv . Visit our website. Cspan. Org history. You can view our tv schedule, preview upcoming programs and watch college lectures, museum tours, archival films and more. American history tv. T cspan. Org history. Cspans washington journal. Live, every day, with news and policy issues that impact you. Coming up sunday morning, Tea Party Patriots cofounder Jenny Beth Martin discusses her groups call for Senate Majority leader Mitch Mcconnell to resign. Politico climate and Energy Reporter emily holden on the e. P. A. s decision to roll back the obama administrations clean power plan. And former cbs and nbc chief Diplomatic Correspondent and author marvin kalb talks about his new book on russia and communism. Be sure to watch cspans washington journal. Live at 7 00 eastern sunday morning. Join the discussion. Sunday night on after words, historian Craig Shirley on the life and political career of newt grich with his book citizen newt the making of a reagan conservative. Hes interviewed by former virginia congressman tom davis. This is an era before cable television. Cable television was prominent today. Cable news wasnt. It wasnt there. Before msnbc and pockets of cable here and there but mostly reruns of i love lucy and Andy Griffith and stuff like that. Theres no talk radio. To speak of. That theres the big media. And cspan. Nd he quickly realizes the potentcy of giving special orders every afternoon, a fiveminute speech and then being carried over cable into 100,000 homes around the country. And dick armey, former congressman dick arm ye used to rib him about it and said and grich would say, this is dick, would you go give a speech to 100,000 people . And said of course you would. Well, thats what youre doing with cspan. With special orders every afternoon. So cspan became he quickly becomes a cult political leader and hes getting 700 letters a week from people around the country. To the back bench, Junior Member from georgia who is a member of a Minority Party and already achieving a national following. Awful after words sunday night at 9 00 p. M. Eastern on on lectures in history, Ashley Riley Sousa teaches a ands on native americans capitalism in early 19th century california. She focuses on local tribes commercial interactions with Spanish Missions and for traders. She also talks about the commodities these groups exchanged. Her class is about one hour and 15 minutes. Right, todays lecture will pull together the topics we have been exploring, spanish colonization of north america contributions of native american societies to the colonies, manifest destiny, the conquest of mexico