Transcripts For CSPAN2 House Hearing On COVID-19 Higher Education 20240712

Accompanying regulations, members are required to leave the camera on the entire time they are in an official proceeding. Even if a step away from the camera. While roll call is unnecessary to establish a quorum and official proceedings conducted remotely, whenever there is an official proceeding with remote participation, the clerk will call the roll to make clear who is present at the start of the preceding. At this time i ask the clerk to call the roll. [roll call] [roll call] [roll call] [roll call] [roll call] [roll call] chairwoman, this concludes the roll call. Thank you very much. Pursuant to Committee Role 7c, Opening Statements are limited to the chair and the Ranking Member. This allows us to hear from our witnesses sooner and provides all members with adequate time to ask questions. I recognize myself do for the purpose of making and opening statement. Today, as we know were examining how the covid19 pandemic is straining our Higher Education system and discussing what Congress Must do to support students and institutions to this difficult time. Across the country activities and switch to Online Learning has exacerbated preexisting systemic inequities in Higher Education. For example, the oncampus resources have many students from low backgrounds normally rely on my computer labs and reliable internet are now unavailable to their students. The suspension of oncampus activity is also threatening many students access to basic essentials like food and housing. And for these students, going to school had been their primary way of meeting these needs. This further from earlier this year found students of color are disproportionately suffering high rates of food and housing insecurity due to the closure of campuses. Research also indicates how most students do not perform as well in online classes. Now imagine how students are already started off with fewer resources are more likely to struggle and [inaudible] my name is robert scott. Under these new educational conditions thank you. To address these disparities congress secured 14 billion and Emergency Relief Funding for Higher Education in the bipartisan cares act, and half of this funding was allocated specifically for direct student emergency aid. Additionally, congress provided immediate relief to student loan borrowers by suspending student loan payments and freezing interest on all direct and federally held Student Loans. Unfortunately, instead of quickly dispersing these urgent relief funds to students, however, according to the law that we had passed in march, secretary devos created an arbitrary eligibility requirement for students trying to access the support. These restrictions that only prevent relief from quickly reaching soon but exclude certain groups of students who cannot apply for title for a texas on document students veterans. In response to the state of washington and the California Community College System which includes the san diego Community College district sued secretary devos. Thankfully, these lawsuits have temporarily stop the department from denying California Community College Students and students across washington axis of emergency student aid that congress secured. But setting aside the delays and unnecessary restrictions treated by the department, we must also address how the cares act simply did not go far enough to prepare our institutions for this looming economic recession. In this pandemic institutions are facing an president state and budget shortfalls that will trigger drastic funding cuts for Higher Education, and theyre facing massive revenue losses due to decreased enrollment and suspended activities. [inaudible] these cuts in revenue loss [inaudible] that many vulnerable students need to complete their degree and find fulfilling careers. We know that diversity consequences will fall on historically black colleges and universities, tribal colleges and universities minority Community Colleges which have the fewest resources despite serving most of our countries low income students and students of color. Impending budget shortfalls are also putting many institutions under pressure to permanently reopen their campuses, given the risk at exposing students educators and communities to covid19. Evidence is overwhelmingly clear, Congress Must do more to support our students and our institutions. The heroes act would take a critical step in the right direction. It provides nearly 1,000,000,000,000 to help state and local governments avert massive budget shortfalls and cuts to education. Also provides over 35 billion and direct relief funds for Public Institutions and other institutions that suffered financially, including almost 2 billion for hbcus, tc use, and msis. Beyond extra fines, however, Congress Must also protect students from predatory forprofit schools. These institutions have record of using taxpayer dollars to target vulnerable students during economic downturn, often leaving them with worthless degrees and debt that they cannot repay picks up the put, the covid19 pandemic is testing now only our students and our institutions but congress is commitment to ensuring all students have access to safe affordable and quality education. Today with the help of our witnesses, and we appreciate they are being here, we will discuss whether we can live up to that commitment. I know you to the Ranking Member mr. Smucker for an opening statement. Thank you, chairwoman davis. Its great to see you. Before i discuss the topic of todays hearing, i i would just like to mention the importance of doing our work in purse. I and other several members [inaudible] [inaudible] it was working a little bit ago. Give me just a second. Ranking member smucker . Yes. Yes, sir. We did your initial a v audiovl check word using the air pods at the time, sir . I was not. You sound fine now. Is a a better . For it is better. Yes, i think it is the bouncing back of the microphone. Thank you, sir. Got it. Sorry about that, chairwoman. Does that sound better now . Auvi q to go . Yes, thank you. So again before i discuss a topic i just did one talk but importance of doing our work in person. I and several other members are here in the hearing room. Leader mccarthy had recently written in a letter to Speaker Pelosi that our congress which is literally a come together people and ideas, it works best when it happens in person facetoface. While i know we all learn how to zoom and webex and all this, i really do think that we could be operating here in person, as i will make the same request that Ranking Member foxx made at the start of her last hearing, which is lets return to congressional precedent and hold our hearings here in person. Turning to the topic of todays hearing, covid19 certainly has disrupted nearly every aspect of American Society including our Higher Education, and it was back in early march university of washington became the first school to cancel inperson in pn classes. Today over 1000 colleges and university have switched to online only instruction. From abrupt School Closures promote Online Learning, students and educated have faced overwhelming challenges during this pandemic. Thats why congress at the department of education took several steps to ease the burden for states come for institutions and for students. The bipartisan care act which was passed in march included provisions to students, schools and state governments cope with the changes brought by the pandemic. In addition to relief measure for students and institutions the cares act provided borrowers with temporary respite from the repayment obligations. Specific the legislation requires the secretary to suspend all interest accumulation and Monthly Payments on federally held Student Loans through september 30 of this year. Most critically the cares act created and funded they the hir and Emergency Relief Fund which provided billions in direct aid to students in post secondary education institutions including the hbcus and msis. But, of course, thats that for our work is done. On the contrary, the pandemic has exposed serious underlying deficiencies in our Education System. Government overreach and unnecessary intervention has contributed to a bloated post secondary education secretary at the expense of students. Tuition and fees have far outpaced inflation for decades. Vital requirements stifle our interaction between businesses and College Campuses. Unfortunately, rather than innovating the democrats partisan cares act really doubles down on one of them failed policies. This legislation forgives 10,000 of federal private Student Loan Debt for some borrowers which really does nothing to combat covid19 or Lower College costs. I really do recognize that we want to help people struggling to make ends meet but we have data from urban institute to prove that across the board loan forgiveness is proportionately helps high earner, highly educated individuals but Many Americans facing the greatest as a result of the pandemic did not have Student Loans at all. The bill also launches a socialist takeover of the private student loan market by forcing private Student Loan Companies to offer income driven repayment terms and conditions that are dictated by the federal government. In contrast Committee Republicans continue to support reforms that strengthen innovation incompletion, modernize federal student aid and promotes student opportunities by giving students the tools needed to complete us post secondary education we can prepare them to enter the workforce with the skills they need for success regards of the background these reforms will not matter if we dont reopen our nation schools and businesses safely and responsibly. We have a duty to lead this country back to the prepandemic Economic Prosperity that benefited millions of hardworking americans. Congress can help further unleash our nation economic potential by increasing pathways for americans to succeed. Specifically this means permitting colleges and universities to leverage employer expertise, encouraging shortterm and stackable credentials and creating a Regulatory Framework for new methods of learning like these types of forwardlooking reforms have been championed by the trump administration. Just a few weeks ago President Trump issued an executive order to prioritize skillsbased hiring within the federal government to help strengthen and diversify our workforce. This action will take our nations workers and students in a positive direction as we recover from covid19, and congress should follow the administrations lead on this issue. Look forward to hearing from our Witnesses Today about how we can improve our Education System to better meet the needs of students, families and workers. Thank you, madam chair. Thank you. Iq, Ranking Member smucker. All other members who wish to insert written statement into the record they do so by submitting them to the Committee Clerk electronically in microsoft word format by five on monday, july 21. Its not a pleasure to introduce our witnesses. First is dr. Sharon pierce, phd, president of Minneapolis Community and Technical College. Since 2016 dr. Sharon pierce has been leading the effort at Minneapolis College to provide transformative students experiences. Dr. Pierce has dedicated her career to advancing the role of community and Technical Colleges and reducing disparities and providing underrepresented to students with an opportunity to achieve academic success. Prior to or i or Education Career dr. Pierce worked as a clinical nurse for 12 years and was appointed by Maryland Governor to serve on the state board of nursing. She earned her bachelors and masters degrees from the university of maryland at her doctorate degree in urban education from morgan State University. Our next witness is doctor timothy white, phd, chancellor of california State University. Since 2013, dr. White has been leading the california State University, ss a system comprie twitter campuses and 481,000 students and 53,000 faculty and staff. Dr. White is a champion of Student Success. And a proponent of bringing individualized education to scale through the expansion of proven best practices. Prior to becoming chancellor, dr. White served as chancellor professor of biology and Biomedical Sciences university of California Riverside for five years and is president of university of idaho for four years. Dr. White pursued his Higher Education from valley Community College, as the stick, csu east bay and university of california berkeley. Next is Scott Pulsipher i hope i have that right, sir. President of western Governors University. Since 2016, he has served as president of western Governors University, the nations first and largest competencybased university. Under his leadership at wg you, they have expanded access to online competencybased degree programs that serve students across the country. Prior to joining debbie to you, customer focused businesses including amazon, sterling commerce which is not part of ibm, and to make successful start at there also he holds a bachelors degree from working on university and a masters degree from harvard university. And last is dr. Shaun harper, recognize her as a huge distal, president of the American Educational Research Association and a provost professor in the school of education at Marshall School of business of university of Southern California at usc. Dr. Harper is also a clifford and betty allen chair. Betty allen chair comics you become in urban leadership. I would and of the usc raises Equity Center and a past president of the association for the study of Higher Education. For two decades harper has studied racial and gender equity in k12 school, college and universities in corporate context. He has been recognized and Education Week as one of the most ten most influential education professors in the United States. Dr. Harper earned his bachelors degree from Albany State University and a masters and doctorate degree from indiana university. We greatly appreciate the witnesses for participating today and look forward it to your testament. I want to just remind you that we have major written statements and that they will appear in full and the hearing record. Pursuant to Committee Role 70 and Committee Practice each abuse as to limit your oral presentation to a fiveminute summary of your written statement. I also want to remind the witnesses that pursuant to title 18 of the u. S. Code section 1000 when it is illegal to a knowingly and willfully falsify any statement record, right indictment or material fact presented to congress or otherwise concealed or cover up material fact. Staff will be keeping track of the time and will use a chai to signal when one minute is left and when time is up entirely. They will set out a short china when there is one minute left, and a longer china when time is up. Please be attentive to the time and wrap up when your time is over and mute your system. If any of you experience any technical difficulties during her testimony or later in hearing, you should stay connected on a platform, make sure you are muted within the button highlighted in red, and use your phone to immediately call the committee i. T. Director sheila whose number has been provided. We let all those make those presentation from improved to member questions and when answering a question, please remember to unmute your system. Dr. Pierce, five minutes. Thank you, chairwoman davis, Ranking Member smucker, this english subcommittee members. Thank you for the opportunity to testify today. Im sharon pierce, president of Minneapolis College. My testimony will describe the impact of the Global Pandemic on community and Technical Colleges and our students, and the need for congress to provide additional aid. Our college located in urban setting is the only comprehensive community and Technical College in minneapolis. We serve students who are unlikely to succeed elsewhere, provide an opportunity to complete a credential, and elevate their socioeconomic status and ability to contribute to the economy. Our students face multiple barriers to academic success. Covid19 put many students out of work, leaving the unable to support families or access transportation or social services, and Elevate Mental Health concerns. Now they must learn to navigate forces to an Online Platform often using a smart phone without reliable internet access, creating difficulty connecting to instructors, classmates, tutors, the library and support services. Our college received 2. 3 billion in carriers in cares funding for direct student aid, the guides for this funny was difficult to unravel and distributional plans needed revising resulting more than two week delay in disbursement. Ongoing eligibility rulemaking by the department of education created uncertainty and limited our ability to direct aid to the most at risk students. In response to covid19 we transition over 900 classes to remote delivery. Moving forward, Technology Investments need to be at the forefront of decisionmaking. Students need hardware, software, network access, training and more. Faculty especially in career and technical programs need training to advance their pedagogy using alternative delivery and synchronous and asynchronous formats. Equitable access to education tunnel to be achieved by showing students the Technology Tools they need and received support services whether they are on campus or working remotely. To provide a a safer campus we need to invest in facilities including contactless hardware, additional cleaning supplies, personal protective equipment and internet facilities to allow for physical distancing. We will continue to reallocate and review expenditures as part of our effort to survive potentially significant revenue losses. Moving forward to students already faced significant barriers must navigate a a new economic reality. Additional funding from the federal government providing direct aid to students, impacted by covenanting both support the continued involvement and aid the economic recovery of our nation. In addition, the importance of ongoing federalstate relations operating costs of institutions like ours during this trying time cannot be overstated. While the cares act provide badly needed stabilization funding, more assistance is vital for us to continue to respectively serve our students can provide Remote Learning and prepare to safely reopen our campus. According to recent estimates, Community Colleges face a collective revenue reduction of 10 billion over the next year. We want to stress the importance of formula to allocate future federal stabilization funding to institutions of Higher Education. This will allow us to account for the needs of all of our students including those who attend parttime. And cute for replacing cares act formula with the headbased formula in the recently passed heroes act. We appreciate your recognition that parttime students need access to the same resources as their fulltime pier. We are committed to provide access to the transformative power of education regardless of socioeconomic status. As the nation strives to recover from covid19, Higher Education will be a critical component of rebuilding the economy. Your unprecedented level of commitment to education is needed now as your decision will directly influence students ability to achieve their academic goals. Thank you. Thank you, dr. Pierce. And now dr. White. Look forward to hearing from you. Ranking member smucker i need to am i okay, great. Chair davis, Ranking Member smucker and members of the subcommittee thank you for providing me the opportunity to address you today. For those who may be unfamiliar with the california State University, where we are the ns largest and most diverse for your university system, 23 campuses come come more than 480,000 students at approximately 53,000 faculty and staff. One out of every 20 americans with a College Degree is a graduate of the california State University. For the health of our students, students of color, one in three of the first in the family to attend college. 54 of our of our enrolled students, 230,000, are pell grant recipients, and just last year alone 63,000 of those recipients earned a bachelors degree. This dynamic diversity together with our sheer size and makes is one of americas most powerful drivers of socioeconomic assets. Our response to the covid19 pandemic has been guided by twin north stars come safeguarding health and wellbeing of our students and faculty, staff and the communities we serve, and maintaining our students progress to degree. In march we made the massive pivot to virtual instruction transitioning over 70,000 classes with academic and Student Support services to virtual modalities. We have taken great care to mitigate the pandemics impact to our students, special are most vulnerable. Measures include maintaining onCampus Housing and essential services for students who had nowhere else to call home. Distribute thousands of laptops and tablets at offering safe wifi hotspots to help address the Digital Divide. Continue to meet our students basic needs with no contact Food Distribution and Emergency Housing Services for students both food has insecure, campus Counseling Service are offered virtually during the crisis, and dividing necessary flexibility around academic policies for current students and adjusting admission policies to mitigate hardships to Prospective Students and their families. We are extreme the grateful for the more than 563 million in Financial Relief provide to our students in campuses through the cares act. Because Education Department guidance limited eligibility for cares act emergency grants we have augmented those funds with campus resources so that all of our students in need due to covid19 including doctor to students and International Student could receive muchneeded financial Emergency Support doctorate or informed by the guides of scientific and medical experts along with Public Health officials, we are planning for a primarily virtual fall with exceptions are critical in person experiences that can be conducted within rick russo standards of health and safety. As we planned for the fall and beyond the csu confronts a grim in your physical reality. Our campuses faced soaring costs and onto revenue losses with the pandemic putting our students wellbeing and success at significant risk. The recently passed california budget cuts are appropriation by 299 299 billion, 4. 2 of our operating budget and less additional federal release of funds are forthcoming. So ask for Additional Support during this historic Public Health crisis here i just on behalf of the nations largest and most diverse student body. We believe the students come students from all walks of life enrolled in graduate with a highquality degree not only benefits then, the family and communities, it is also a vital public good for the nation. Supporting Higher Education at this critical moment stimulates important for hundreds of thousands of americans now and into the future, spurring tax revenue by reducing reliance on social services here america through the economic recovery will require an increasingly nimble educated workforce. We need culturally competent problem solvers, comfortable and capable in the sciences and technology, climate literate and aspired to lead the world to a sustainable future. We need them to ensure a vigorous American Economy in the changing world of work and we need them for a vibrant and more equitable society. We stand ready to be a resource as you continue to explore ways to support Higher Education. Thank you again for the opportunity to address you today and im happy to answer any questions that you might have. Thank you. Into dr. White. And now ive recognize mr. Pulsipher for five minutes. Thank you for being with us. Chairwoman davis, Ranking Member smucker and members of the subcommittee, thank you for this opportunity to share my views on the impact of covid19 on the future of Higher Education. We are compelled by i believe in the inherent worth and ability of every individual and in the transformative power of education. We believe the pathways to opportune operative should be open to everyone. Wgu is a private nonprofit selfsustaining institution held in 1997 by a Bipartisan Group of 19 governors who saw the opportunity to use technology and competencybased education to expand access to Higher Education and better align with workforce needs. Today we serve over 120,000 fulltime students in all 50 states. Over 70 of of whom would be classified in one or more underserved categories. We deliver affordable, relevant, highquality programs combined with a student centered and structural model entirely online. That propels students through completion, great jobs and opportunity. Up into for every american and particularly for the nearly 20 Million Students enrolled in Higher Education. Their persistent challenges students have acute needs for Material Support to stay on the path to opportunity and we need to ensure access to the online world in which learning now takes place. Over 21 million americans disproportionately people of color do not have sufficient bandwidth to string the city, take part in our civic life, axis education approaches but in the digital workforce. There are many anxious questions about the fall semester. Students also need us to look lovely on the fall and address strategic questions facing american Higher Education. Higher education rapidly escalating cost, widening disconnect with workforce needs, crushing Student Discount unacceptable racial despairs and outcomes and low completion rate. Nearterm issues are pressing whether safely reopening campuses, enabling institutions online shift for the protection of displaced students due to potential closures. We must reestablish the purpose and mission of post secondary education and modernized way we invest in it. We must embrace the Technology First approach to teaching and supporting students we must move swiftly and radically to not only get enrolled student back on the path to completion but also upscale me of the 40 million americans have been displaced during the pandemic and the tens of millions more whose work is being reshaped by technology. That simply we need to reimagine post second education as a true lifeline model to provide highquality relevant pathways to both individuals first and next opportunity. Even shortterm support should be designed and prioritize with the long term in mind. The written test when ive submitted includes various policy ideas that i believed addressed many of the challenges our country and its students face as a result of covid accelerated shift. Policy ideas are based on a few simple guiding principles. First, students should be prioritized over institution. Second, Student Outcomes matter more than institutional input. And learning or mastery rather than time should be the critical denominator of education. In the 1930s our nation responded to a great economic crisis by passing the new deal. In the 1940 facing an unprecedented need for education as young soldiers returned from war, congress opened the door to direct federal investment in Higher Education by passing the g. I. Bill. In the 1960s facing widespread protests and social unrest in response to structural racism, we saw a wave of of legislation of an civil rights. Today we find yourself at the intersection of several similar great forces there with a significant economic challenge of an unprecedented need for education, workforce and sadly continue to grapple with inequities which both expos and widened by the pandemic. We are living an unprecedented times, times that the rent our best thinking, new framework in smart investment. Congress could renew the path which opportunity for every american we need landmark legislation on the educational work of a new approach to commute the challenges of this moment and the future that follows it. That is designed for the digital and informational age and i can fundamentally what are nice our approach to investing in an unlocking the potential of every individual. Thank you for the opportunity to be a today and to be of assistance as you take on the critical question facing americas Higher Education system. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. Now recognize dr. Harper for five minutes. Thank you for including me in this important hearing. It is imperative that we devote serious attention to the numerous Racial Equity consequences of reopening campuses. I present ten considerations in the written version of my testimony. I will talk only about nine of them here and one pertain to student visas and travel bans is outside the purview of the subcommittee. Here are nine critical Racial Equity considerations. One, disproportionally placing a Center Workers at risk, custodians, Food Service Professionals and maintenance workers will be deemed essential workers when campuses reopen. Professionals of, disproportionally performing these roles. Being required to come to campus and erect with other workers and students places employees of color and the family members with whom they live at greater risk of exposure to covid19. Campus reopening plans must consider the Health Implication of employees of color and lower income workers. Federal aid specifically earmarked for the safety of employees were deemed essential workers with provide ppe, cleaning supplies, Contact Tracing and testing. Number two, layoffs and termination. Financial effects of the pandemic will thwart Higher Education leaders to make tough workforce reduction decisions. In attention to the race of the person being terminated and laidoff will inevitably yield pronounced negative effects on employees of color, given the lowlevel Service Position they disproportionally occupy. Campus reopening plans must specify ways to avoid even more significant racialized employment in equity. Federal investment would help minimize the necessity of workforce reduction of Higher Education institutions. Three, risk of violence for Asian Americans and asian International Students and employees. Recent studies document horrifying acts of discrimination and physical violence for Asian Americans, and asian immigrants in the u. S. Throughout the pandemic. Reopening plans must include ways to protect these students and employees as they return to campuses. Four, trauma and great support for persons disproportionally experiencing loss. Covid19 deaths are disproportionally affecting communities of color. Because of this students of color and employees of color are likelier than are their white counterparts to to have lost a family member, friend or someone in their community. The reopening plan must include ways to ensure these persons have more than adequate mental and emotional support. Five, sending infected students home to vulnerable families and community. Many institutions plan to include oncampus living and learning by thanksgiving in anticipation of a possible second wave of the coronavirus. Given that disproportionally higher numbers of covid19 infection and death among people of color, it is possible that students of color returning home from college could pose an especially big risk to communities that have already been disproportionally devastated by covid19. Six, placing black football and mens basketball players at proportionally high risk. 2018 black men were 2. 4 2. 4 f undergraduates enrolled at universities that make up the five most financially lucrative intercollegiate sports conferences. Yet they comprise 55 of football teams and 56 of mens basketball teams on campuses. Participation in these two Contact Sports place a black grudge been edited for your risk of covid19 infection. Seven, Financial Support for chronically underfunded minority serving institutions. Investing significant federal covid19 Recovery Fund specifically into historically black colleges and universities, tribal colleges and Community Colleges would help them better serve they disproportionally educate, most of whom are students of color. Eight, access and equity. As weve seen throughout the pandemic the low income students lack access to reliable highspeed internet. Many of them are students of color. As institutions reopen with a fraction of courses meeting on campus, lets must include strategy and investment in closing Digital Access gaps for students of color who can get access courses from the rental income communities. And nine, teaching students of color on by the Faculty Development activities included campus reopening plans keep all students [inaudible] they must also be desperate assuring students of color are not experiencing the same racism and virtual classroom that they experience in on campus during a vibrant long before the pandemic. Thank you. Thank you, dr. Harper. We appreciate all of you and appreciate you staying within the limits. Thats helpful. Under Committee Rule eight a we will now question witnesses under the fiveminute rule. I will be recognizing subcommittee members in seniority order. Again in order to ensure the members fiveminute rule is adhered to, staff will be keeping track of time and will use a chime pickets will annoy but nevertheless, it is helpful to us. They will sound a short chime again when one minute is left, a longer chime when time is up so please be attentive. If any member expenses technical difficulties during the hearing you should stay connected on the platform, make sure your muted with the mute button highlighted in red and use your phone to immediately call the committees i. T. Director, sheila whose number has been provided. As chairwoman i now recognize myself for five minutes. At again just putting this in a bit of context. As everyone has done, as evidenced by the last recession we know state Higher Education budgets often the first to be cut during economic downturns asks dates look to balance their budgets. A study by the federal on budget and policy priorities estimates some states will 765 billion over the next three years. Already states across country of announced cuts to education spending. For example, telephone announced a 970 million cut for the university of california and california State University systems. These budgets drive up tuition costs that ultimately place the burden on students and their families and reduced academic quality and, of course, we know its not just the tuition of cost that students a but also his living expenses, a whole host of other needs to be successful in their studies. Dr. Harper, what was the impact of state Higher Education budget cuts on students and institutions in the Great Recession . Thank you for that question. The impact was for sure disproportionate on chronically underfunded institutions like Community Colleges, largely black college and tribal colleges. Certainly the growth to recovery for them was a much steeper climb than for more highly resourced institutions. In many instances the financial pain of that time. Still remain for many of those institutions that theyre seeking to catch up. It is what i am especially worried about the financial consequences of the pandemic on those institutions. We have seen this before. I can with a Great Recession so im hoping that congress will pay particular attention in its investments to ensuring that both institutions that those institutions dont have a huge shield to climb in the recovery. Followed up on that because sometimes people feel that the does need to be a a state, a federal role here. Why is federal investment critical . Why isnt it the state governments or in the case of other schools, without the kind of federal funding . Well, for one will see tremendous unevenness across states in their investment in full secondary education. But secondly and to think most importantly, Higher Education is a public good that benefit the entirety of our nation and our nations position in the global economy. Therefore, federal investment is really an investment in the economic security, the Homeland Security and the viability of the United States. Thank you. I want to turn to dr. White. Dr. White, how will this cut impact your ability to operate answer students . I i know you addressed this somewhat but focusing on those students already having difficulty for a variety of reasons, precovid. We have to deconstruct the reasons why students are having this difficult in the past as well. Dr. White . So in the spring term alone across the california State University we lost 337 million in lost revenue and added costs to pivot of these classes and do it in a helpful way. The state budget that was just approved by our government has a 299 million cut in our base appropriation which is about 4. 6 of our operating budget. Importantly the federal government can play a role here. Today the way our budget is set up, october 15 provide another Financial Support to the states, that 299 billion will be billion dollars will be reversed and given back to the csu. Does have an effect. These numbers are real and we will do our very best to meet the needs of our students come,s many as we possibly can Going Forward. Thank you, dr. White. I think my time is up as well. Appreciate it. Now i want to turn to mr. Smucker on pennsylvania for the Ranking Member to ask his questions. Madam chair, thank all the panel [inaudible] just a question for you with regards to what your party mentioned, College Affordability which is the top priority for policymakers but certainly for students and their families. And i know questions governor has of keeping track record low but this anthemic is adding additional Financial Burdens in all schools. Ive heard from institutions throughout home state of pennsylvania, that covid19 will lead to costs on students in order to [inaudible] protocols. So i would like to get your thoughts on that, including how has federal action helped this sector so far . Thats primarily because much of our investments and operating expenses do not include operating buildings and campuses and many other things that have Revenue Sources from housing or even Student Activities and athletics etc. So with that kind of operating model we are on a self sustaining operation dependent on students alone. It has allowed us to continue uninterrupted. I think these same covid pressures are highlighting now or exposing the many challenges thatexist in the economic model that we have in Higher Education in the us. So i think in general we should be focused first and foremost with this principle on students and how do we consider the funding and support necessary to provide the instruction, the access, improve additionalexperiences they need to continue in the programs. How do we ensure students are not so severely disrupted that there stopping out to where it ends up there not completing . That can be a guiding principle as congress contemplates how to provide that aid in stimulus with the nearterm of pandemics can be impacted but we can design for the longterm and reinvent the Economic Situation i know in apartment and congress have provided institutions some temporary reprieve from regulatory burdens throughout this crisis which i believe, we all believe is appropriate to help institutions quickly adapt. Even to the challenges of covid19 but what can we learn from that in the role longterm . What regulations, what guidance should congress evaluate for the longterm in light of what weve learned . Thank you for that question and i think those were appropriate and surely the rapid shift from traditionally classroom instruction to a predominantly or if not 100 percent online instructional model is does require the rethinking of the faculty student interaction and requires rethinking about the even time of instruction and credit hours and the pacing of learning. And many if you consider eligibility requirements that are program and institution, even at a student level or federal student aid, there constructed around conventional models of funding so now when we are having a rapid shift Technology Enabled models, those paradigms that we are used are being constructed. So i think its appropriate to have shortterm accommodation for that to inform how we should think about distance education and how we should think about paid and learning progress assessment of learning, etc. Those models should be contemplated in the future. Im sorry to cut you off. Im at the end of my time that we use the number of accountability metrics like cohort default rates, financial responsibility and so on. Should we be looking at any of those and thinking about which of those, which should continue andwhich should be changed. We should be looking primarily at what i would call Student Success measures. I think theres elements around persistent progress and completion rates but also attainment and placement rates, loan repayment rates as a measure of accountability for the effectiveness of this educational pathway. I think thats a good example of where focusing on measures of outcomes and learning rapid andinstitutional models. Iq. Thank you. I now turned to the ranking chair of the Education Committee to understand that your boss. Thank you very much man care. I was quite willing to wait until the next person but thank you, i appreciate it. , im going to Mister Courtney but i just got the notice that you wanted to the next in the queue. Mister courtney is okay with it we will hear from doctor fox and go back to doctor portland. Im fine virginia. Thanks joe, i appreciate. Mister pulsifer you for your testimony today, for the work you do to help students and particularly one students i know you felt very grateful for. The Governors University has shown property based education which is an Educational Program where students progress based on mastery of skills instead of time spent in the classrooms and a successful model for many students. Ee can benefit student five time to a degree, lowering College Building portfolios. If you describe wg use experience a cte programs and the success of your students graduates compared to other institutions postsecondary education. Particularly interested in the achievement of your low income firstgeneration and minority students and how cde benefited their lives and again, i know particularly one income firstgeneration students that youve been a big helpto. Thank you Ranking Member fox. Early wg was not the investor of competencybased education but you are one of the pioneers of it. We today have over 191,000 graduates since the founding and the use of competencybased pedagogical models was purely a function of our focus on the students, particularly the working learners that we serve so that it really competencybased approach focuses on keeping the standard for proficiency or learning constant allowing time to very that affords us the ability to better wind learning outcomes with workforce needs, personalizes injuries and increase the probability of individual Student Success and ultimately allows them to both leverage prior learning andmove at their own pace. For wg, we are serving students in all 50 states we had a 45 percent for your Graduation Rates at the bachelors level which is higher than the 13 percent nationally. We have high unemployment rates 95 percent with 88 percent. [inaudible] and maybe more importantly employers are 97 percent of them are graduates, we sexy expectations for the job. Particularly to your question about low income and underserved students, while we still see gas in their attainments, and their higher income heres the reality is they are achieving a higher rate. And we have seennationally and particularly in low income rural and military categories of individuals. Though were quite proud of our ability to access underserved individuals you. I education does not happen clearly defined pathway for the cde models, how is the current laws restrained other institutions from creating cde programs, what recommendations do you have to reform that each day to encourage the proliferation of highquality cde programs . As noted in my written testimony its definitely we believe its time to fully embrace concept based education. If i recall according to c then, competencybased education network, over 600 institutions have pilot or programs developing for competencybased education but they are hampered we were with the disparity with regulatory definitions meaning the design of that be trying to shoehorn programs considerations into credit hours accreditation models, regulatory criteria around fulltime and pacing, etc. This makes it quite difficult to rapidly innovate and expand access to these highly effective and align the program models. So we do believe that legislation and Regulatory Frameworks should encourage innovation, not reported and if we also focus more Student Success and outcomes rather than residing a model, our nation and our American Workforce will be better served. Thank you. You both a strong connection between wg un employers. How did this reach contribute to your success, your Student Success and what can other institutions do to engage employers intheir academic programs . I think we believe that education to be the surest path to opportunity that it has to be aligned with the market presents those opportunities so we leverage large status from partners like nz or Burning Glass about workforce demands and roles and that forms the programs and credentials that we develop and offer and then beyond that we partner directly with employers and experts from the field who designed this curriculum so the learning outcomes directly map to the constancy is required in the workforce. You believe that the future education is faith in skills and competencies and its the language that employers are seeking more fluently as i education can invest in workforce and Employer Partnership models, increasing alignment and relevance of educational pathways to opportunity. Medicare, id like to submit or the record facts related to funding various entities and the growth is in spending that has occurred over theyears. So we will submit that separately and thank you very much. I appreciate and again i appreciate Mister Courtney consideration. Thank you. Ill now turned to mister for comments. Chairwoman davis and Ranking Member smucker madam. Im glad to accommodate your schedule. So doctor hartford, you correct in your testimony that opportunities that do not have to director of the state department over the department of Homeland Security but the Higher Education act does authorize serious programs that does promote Exchange Students in international crosspollination or Higher Education programs. With countries all over the world. And just a quick focus on your monetary standpoint. Theres about 1 million International Students that are enrolled in the us. At about 41 billion in terms of revenue Read Department of congress trancelike tuition money as an export for the purposes of our trade balance and obviously i think as you are im sure can attest, the policies of this administration which is pretty much shut down the visa ability according to a role in theu. S. Census , announcing that our students from this country, hopefully bring to mind over now. So just really kind of goes inside about the fact that we need a regulatory structure that needs to be flexible given the covid emergency and just sort of recognize that Virtual Learning partly because of necessity but also because of how you as we heard from mister pulsifer, its something that we are in place right now where we have to incorporate having the models. [inaudible] puts that education in a responsible position of having to balance standing on the right side of the government and trying to protect their students. [inaudible]. [inaudible] an opportunity to talk through that point. Its important. Those policy sections are not only. [inaudible] but they are also zeno . In my written testimony before we got the news on monday about the ic certification, i had a scary suspicion that this administration would find some way to target students and International Students from other countries is so important to note that International Students make our colleges and universities better. Americas students, they give them the opportunity to interact with people of diverse viewpoints. [inaudible] a commitment. [inaudible] if thats the case we need International Students here to afford our students that kind of learning opportunity we also, i think its important to push against all of the xena phobic and xenophobic actions were seeing in this administration. These most recent actions concerning ice and the deportation of International Students is ridiculous. They require stronger federal oversight. We go on press in connecticut about students, the mca counts about 20,000 International Students and partly mca. Talking about student athletes in his program, one from croatia , one from poland and one from canada who arenow basically unable to get into the country. But tohis credit , he pointed out in the press and im quoting it now not just athletes but kids are going to school, what isthe issue here . That they dont make an mba or based on the nha because of course obviously i students and a lot of the reasons for those athletes are successful. So again, were just dealing with the contradiction of that again, putting pressure on kids who are given where theyrelocated , all these different classes of people to see that we can actually come here and in our country so thank youfor your testimony and with that i know that. You very much in kentucky. Thank you medicare, i appreciate you conducting this hearing and my question for, i know in your testimony you said that suddenly 3. 3 million teachers were suddenly grappling with how to teach online. And i know that western Governors University is online and you got to match confidence and i had the opportunity to have my daughter on this semester and watching her and although the pricing change, the quality was the same between, she was at a traditional Oncampus Program so i guess my question is what has western governors done to build students into theworkforce. That is at least equal to if not i guess in your opinion would be superior to traditional student programs. But what are the things online that you figured out that other universities need to do if we move forward this way and specifically you address the minority students, students of color. Particularly with the Digital Divide Mister Harper now and our k12 students, the Digital Divide was also urban as much as anything else. So its still real. So one, [inaudible] what areas would you recommend, other University Needs a corporate Online Learning cannot be addressed in the Digital Divide. Congressman, i appreciate question. I wanted to Say Something about capability of the median but what i really mean is you have to have a test first mindset, how does technology enable all facets of content, with the instruction, with your students and Everything Else like that and if you do consider all the evidence that comes into it, we as a consumers experience, we argue that they experience diverse than the traditional places. [inaudible] because we realize teaching a learning model online is about posture so you have to think about are we providing access to the subject matter and different instructors and help on an individual basis. Exchange the need for constant instruction only from a lecture hall to the virtual courses that you can speak with that you can hear on, so much of the construction is physically, that combined interaction with the instructor and i think. [inaudible] rather than an institution lecture schedule. Lastly i would point out that this data really tests all the different pedagogical approaches. The technology in an important sector andyou can measure the impact on student progress on learning. Thanks again to the other search students and individuals of color because you can actually engage with them everystudent on a onetoone basis. I would extend what doctor white has also said in his testimony that has invested scholarships that cover students, particularly Technology Like laptops as well as highspeed , [inaudible]. Also, my thing is if youre looking at a model, online model and youre on the other side of the Digital Divide, then you might not see that as an opportunity. Even though that can be an opportunity for you so how does the Governors University reach out to students that may not view this as an opportunity for them tomake sure that they know its there . Ideal back. Thank you very much. Mister harper of california. Youhave five minutes. Mister carter. Esther takano. I dont have you. , you are next i havent had earlier so ifyou are ready to go. Go ahead. Chairwoman davis. States believe funds, Public Institutions must first plan theyre experiencing, and funding to the Education Systems first. When they are experiencing shortfalls. These thoughts almost always disproportionately impact low income students. Against students of color. Institution will be forced to provide less resources to public students. Congress provides in the care. But both essential lifeline but it does come close to covering the full extent of the. The American Council on education has previously estimated institutions and students will need at least 46. 6 billion across the challenges created by covid19 and after last week, the ace now estimates that institutions may need an additional 74 billion to cover just the cost of resuming in person hybrid instruction in the fall. In my district, the university of California Riverside has experienced a revenue loss of 22 billion dollars. My first question for the chancellor is its good to see you again sir. Can you please. [inaudible] as a result of covid19 doctor white. Just had to hit my unmute button. Nice to see you again you are just in the spring for aloan , theres for the two month mark through the end. We had 300 77 million in lost, cost to california State University increased cost of limiting personal protective gear, buying laptops and likewiseand giving them to students and faculty and staff and all that. That was just a period oftime so hundred Million Dollars a month. We got ready to continue his nextthree months. Just before that the state of california has cut our state appropriation by 299 million which is 4. 6 percent of our operating budget for next year. However the federal government can play a role in reversing that. If there is another federal stimulus package received in california for october 15. Its a reverse trigger proposal that the governorhas signed. And that in our state appropriation would be reversed for the next fiscal year which would be enormously hopeful to me as you point out hitting students firstgeneration and also the low income we need a little extra support in order to stay engaged with their studies. Thank you for that answer chancellor white. Its imperative for congress to, for the senate to act on future legislation that would address, and i know we do much of that in the heroes act. Doctor, what are the revenue losses at your institution and mark. Thank you for that question. We are not a system, were a Standalone Institution so our numbers may sound small but impact is the same. We are looking at approximately 800 50 thousand dollars in just parking and auxiliary services alone. Our original fy 21 but was based on our enrollments to flatten meaning we didnt anticipate the growth or loss we are now projecting a deficit of anywhere 10 to 20 percent enrollment. That would essentially mean 4. 2 million if we are down 10 percent. 7. 78 million if we experience the 20 percent loss. Thats a Significant Impact on our overall budget. We would have to mitigate ways that would be very detrimental and painful for our students and staff and having overall impact on our community area. Thank you for that doctor pierce and doctorharper , my question to you is what lessons can we learn from the last recession about the impact that state budget cuts on College Access affordability and quality . Sure. We can certainlylearn from the last time. Taking a largely rates list approach to correcting longstanding inequities. Its only going to best sustain those inequities but perhaps even exacerbatethem. So i think as i documented in the endpoint of my written testimony, we have to bring a race forward lens to thinking about covid19 recovery because the truth is, we have way too much evidence to confirm that covid19 has had a racially disproportionate impact on communities of color. Therefore it would be just really reckless of us to attempt to remedy those inequities in a largely restless way. I am not suggesting that class and socioeconomic status is somehow unimportant but there is a way that race and class lingo in these United States america. To really produce just outcomes. For people of color. Thank you for that response and i see my time is up andideal back area. You mister takano. And now were going to turn to Mister Grossman but before hand , mister guthrie, if you want to reclaim your one minute. I guess i should reclaim my one minute to. But go ahead and you need an extra minute, lets see. Is mister duffy there mark. I have mister dockery. Will go on to Mister Grossman. If mister gross guthrie comes back. He can get his limitagain. Mister grossman. I always love these online things as we can see the beautiful decorations that we have in our membershouses. You can do a very good job there. And i appreciate looking behind you, im kind of in a boring Conference Room myself but next time ill try to give you more interesting decor as well. Mister pulsifer, is all of your lasses online . They are. Okay. Do you feel compared to a traditional college, a higher percentage of your graduates come out with the skillsbasededucation . Yes we do. Based upon the surveys that we utilize from gallup and harris and others is that theres a pretty good indication from the employer as well as the graduate surveys that our graduates are better prepared for the workforce. 97 percent of employers they are meeting or exceeding expectations, 97 percent report higher again, it seems our alignment in the curriculum with competencies needed in the workforce is significantly increasing the readiness of graduates. And give me a comparative number, is there acomparative number you have or other universities . At least in our surveys which are annual reports i would look at things like so in the gallup and her surveys, if we look at graduates, 67 percent versus nationally38 percent. Does it preparing for a job, 76 percent versus nationally it was below 50 percent. From the employer standpoint, theres real life 97 percent of graduates from wg meet or exceed expectations. The other thing in the Gallup Survey is that i think the numbers, i think we can provide at testimony after the fact i think on gallup its more than twice as likely rw he grabbed are performing well in all management of wealthy versus nationally. Thats pretty incredible. Do you think its because online or you just think its because you approach your job with a different attitude. Attitude of a student first attitude. You could duplicate these fantastic numbers in a more Traditional University, if they would adapt the same. Based upon the research from gallup and others there are probably three things i do think should be considered. One is how do you really think about faculty engagements with students more personal and interaction. If you will office hours and the one interaction becomes vitally important because the lecture is just content online. Confidently based in our design as soon as you demonstrate proficiency against the learning outcomes and progress and so its very clear that time now becomes a variable in most of our students lives versus sitting in a seat for thisprescribed 15 hours a week for four months. So i think that the mentoring, the faculty engagement model is important and noted that if you have a faculty that encourages your dreams and aspirations i believe gallup noted your 2 and a half times more likely to say your school is right for you i often think College Affordability actors a graduate satisfaction, performance and of course designing curriculum and learningoutcomes that are directly relevant , ready and a graduate for success in the workforce. That also dramatically increases graduate student satisfaction. I think we have opportunity to advanceeducation and all of these dimensions. Im particularly concerned with middleclass students. They dont get held grants in our society we put the middleclass students at a guest bed. How do you deal with students after . Do you feel your middleclass students come out with higher or lowercompared to a Traditional University . We know for a fact its lower. 57 percent of ourstudents utilize that aid in some form or receive aid in some form for their education. On average are graduates are graduating, im just trying to find the specific statistics. There are graduating with just over 12,000 in debt. And that the nationally 29,000 per graduates. More importantly you can see our cohort people faced lower payment rates and are also performing better than the National Averages. Our cohort default rate is four percent versusnationally its 10. 8 percent. I guess what it means is setting up the eastern Governors University . The nice thing is that included from student. [inaudible] i guess youre giving me thehope. Thank you. Id like to thank you again or letting us see your beautiful house. Very wonderful. Were happy to hear next from chairman scott in education and labor committee. Chairman scott. Thank you madam chair and thank you for holding this hearing. Id like to start with doctor white and you thought about this a little bit but can you tell us exactly what would happen when, if the cuts go through. Iknow were dealing with this in virginia. Our General Assembly passed a budget when we came back to the schedule what we call redox sessionwhere we can serve governors details and amendments. We learned a new word. On allocated. The two percent teacher raise was on allocated. The counselors in the schools. The age low income studentsof Community Colleges, construction ecologist. All unallocated caused of the three forecasted revenue. We assume we will learn another word if the heroes were to pass and the revenue were restored by federal assistance reallocated. So could you tell us what would happen if who gets laid off and what effect it would half on education if the cuts actually remained . Thank you member. I think weve done several things to increase our costs. So we immediately put in a hiring freeze across the system. Weve also took band travel initially forhealth reasons and now for economic reasons. Though when our various constituent groups gathered or are doing it virtually, Going Forward we also have during the last eight years that ive been chancellor have been positioned to grow and we put aside a reserve during that time as has the state of california. Though were going to be using some of that reserve, spending that down in order to mitigate the cost but there will also be of employee attrition issues will lower our cost as well. So we think we will, our enrollments are steady. In the summertime and all indications are for the ball and they will remainsteady. This will bevariable across campuses. Are going up, some of the more rural ones are goingdown a little bit but overall , but from the state budget is 299 million can be reversed if congress within the next federal bill that will help us continue to make access and support of our students generally of low income and middle income to the last members questions. As well as to our students of color. So we think its very vital role for the federal government to play here. Asking the state to maintain effort so the state doesnt further cut us. The federal dollars come in will make a hugedifference. Before our students Going Forward to maintain their degrees. Doctor harper, are you familiar with the new regulation from the department of education, making it harder to get a recalculation, for your Financial Aid if the you lose your job or have other reasons to once youre a recalculated. I havent followed that legislation. There making it harder so the problem there would be if you lose your job, and are not able to make the anticipated anticipated contribution. Obviously if you cant recalculate a needed, bad things will happen area but if you cannot, doctor peters. Can you talk aboutreopening. A lot of things that you didnt mention. How can you reopen without testing all of the students before day one . Was for the nonresidential campus, we would be following the specifics provided by the cdcand the Minnesota State Health Department. The state of minnesota is providing testing or those who wanted and needed but we are able to work in concert with them. So as our screening procedures followed the guidelines from the cdc, Minnesota State of health and office on higher. Does that include testing everyone before day one mark. Is not. What about ventilation. Of our reopening is to look at air quality because we are very much aware of the fact that something ive recently learned actually is that we want to minimize any cross ventilation in terms of air moving from one Geographic Area to another. Were looking at air quality and were also looking at space. So were looking at our hvac system and thequality of air and our hvac system. And ive been actually upset about it in terms of standards which are our way of measuring air quality is air efficiency. So were looking at. [inaudible] my time has expired and we wanted to talk about airconditioning, as it recirculates the air has been identified as problematic , if they recirculate, hold air out turning outside and the resident recirculates, just cool air that they can. Youre better off but the ventilation has been identified as a problem and a lot of the things about reopening that are problematic and so youre dealing with the best you can and i appreciate you. You medicare. Now altered to mister monica of new york for five minutes. Mister bonnie. We will go to mister banks. You madam chair. I want to start with mister for you Many American families are about the federal grant income eligible level. How can a better be distributed tostudents who need help to return to school in the fall . Thank you for that question congressman and i do think that there is no doubt as shortterm hardship that should be contemplated and considering how to support students who need to continue on the event while our institutional operational models have not been impacted our students given this unfortunate number that we serve in underserved categories have been largely impacted by the economic fallout of the pandemic. Though there are considerations around supporting nonjewish and related expenses later that thehousing , food , other necessities of life that we ourselves have established a 10 million refund in the last week of distributed a 2 4000 students. There are those things can be contemplated as we consider shortterm and longterm considerations with not just only be related to help eligible students but individuals are trying to advance from lower middle income to upper middle income and how do you support investments . What are one of the longterm examples is something as simple as a lifetime learning and model after things Like Health Savings account or even a home equity line of credit that just allows individuals to tap into muted ages for their scaling and rescaling that will be increasing as part of their life Going Forward. ,turn my focus in the subject we havent talked a great deal about today and thats Liability Protection. All of your institutions along to advocacy groups who have called for Liability Protections and i want to go first to doctorpierce. And you talk about how important our Liability Protections to reopen your institution or in classroom training inthe fall. Thank you for thatquestion. We are a state institution we are covered under the state of minnesota. However, i am very much aware that institutions feel a great rest in terms of liability opening and in terms of how they are going to be able to cover any lawsuits that may emerge as a result of students returning students, faculty and staff returning to campus who may come into contact with covid19, who may have increased hospital bills and things ofthat nature. Even though the schools are following every guideline provided by the cdc. Their individual state Health Department and office of higher vacation, life is sarah, liability is real and has affect on our plans moving forward. Doctor white, did youweigh in on the subject as well . Our twin northstar is about moving to a fairly virtual fall and quite frankly Academic Year driven by the health and safety issues and our student progress ofsuccess. Open safety issues not only for our students but for back the. Our staff and the campuses in california special miles from the north coast of san diego state. And a lot of our students come from other parts of the state so we are very concerned about those two things. Do not use liability as one of our determining factors to move to a essentially virtual fall and quite frankly Academic Year, one of the issues here that i think is really important to recognize is this is not, a lot of people are using past tense, how did you manage the pandemic. This is not a twomonth problem or a sixmonth problem. This is a 12, 18, 24 Month Program and were in californiaapproaching it that way. So the flexibility around policies cant be shortsighted. Some of the recent policies that have come out that fm done some of that flexibility seem to be tone deaf to the reality of the biology of the disease. That is something were not able to get our hands around. Mister pulsifer your situation is different. Can you talk about how important Liability Protection is for institutions. Congressman as youve noted obviously with no in Person Instruction and no campuses on which students congregate this is not a circumstance that we understand all the variables you are considered so it is a topic i would defer to my colleagues have campus that have prior considerations there. Im not unaware of is not something i personally spent time and attention understanding the details on because i coach an answer. You very much, i feel back. I now move to miss jayapal. Shes not. Miss parker, you have five minutes. Mister carter of california. Mister lovett of michigan. Thank you very much madam chairwoman, i am here i appreciate it. And i appreciate you convening this hearing on the super important topic. I want to get very concrete about the difficulties of running a university for a Community College during this pandemic. And as michigander i want to mention the covid19 outbreak in east lansing thats been linked to a popular bar near one of our great institutions, michigan State University. As of july 6 yesterday there has been 170 confirmed cases, 170 confirmed cases of covid19 linked to this one restaurant including 27 secondary cases meeting people who did not visit establishment cause the virus from someone else who did. Entire lansing region has been moved back into the high risk category of our governor Gretchen Witmers reopening plan given theenormous impact of this outbreak. This is over just an eight day period following that restaurants reopening. It is has since closed again. I bring this up because its a cautionary tale of the risk involved in reopening College Campuses this fall. We cant justthink about classrooms and dorms. Allergist anchor entire cities. Restaurants, bars, stores and so on. Cases in covid19 within the student body or faculty arent going to stay within the campus walls. Many reopening plans developed by institutions centered around the need to test students. Faculty, test data to contain cases of covid19 on campuses. However estimates show that the Testing Capacity of most is still far below what is needed to contain the virus and in fact, the lack of adequate testing is the lead story intodays new york times. Doctor white, when you decided to remain online for this fall and as you say perhaps the whole Academic Year, the Testing Capacity and possible scenarios like the situation in east lansing play intothat decision at all . Absolutely congressman love it. When youre having, we are responsible for well over 530,000 people. With our employees and with our students. Let alone to your point exactly whats happening in east lansing and the communities where we are embedded. 50 million a month to do testing on a routine basis which is not in the cards. And quite frankly your point, if you test today and or negative and inaccurate test it doesnt mean you dont pick it up tomorrow. So we had gone to the notion of really anywhere from three or four percent to maybe 10 percent of our courses are going to be in person. These are laboratories that are Healthcare Training where they work on mannequins etc. Everything else will be done in the virtual space because of the cost and the inefficiency really helping solve this and keeping the disease under control for students but like 25 percent of our employees are in their 60s and above. And you consulted with back began staff when you made your decision as well i assume. Faculty, staff, local Public Health officials, epidemiologists and Infectious Disease experts and the state government. We have brought consultation across the system. It seems like you could easily see whats happening in east lansing play out at any college. Or even in a party. On a campus beware. So let me ask doctor pierce, if we improve testing and stood up a nationwide Contact Tracing program, do you think School Administrators like yourself around the whole country would feel better equipped to reopen knowing theres an infrastructure in place tocontain the break . Im talking about doctor pierce, the federal government fully taking responsibility we will have on national Contact Tracing and Testing Program in place, with that affect your decisionmaking . I believe it would. I think we follow the guidelines provided for us the state of minnesota, the cdc and office of higher ed having a robust screening and testing policy and practice in place and certainly it plays into our total decisionmaking and excess the a lot safer about welcoming our students campus. Ill hold based on the health and safety of employees so we think that would enhance that would be welcome. Thank you so much and as i hear madam chairman time has expired. Ill just feel so badly has a number of congress which is supposed to govern our country. Putting these wonderful administrative of our universities, the Community College this position of having to deal with this pandemic when were not providing the National Infrastructure of Public Health are able to work capable of providing that would help them so much that i yelled back. Decline. Go ahead. Thank you madam chair. As were adjusting to this new normal, ethical, im not partial to doctor but some are calling it that. Its important we evaluate how this pandemic as impacted the traditional way Higher Education has been delivered to students and how we will continue to transform moving forward. Online learning has done many approaches that proved to be successful in its implementation and exploring opportunities for expansion of promising alternative to internal classes during this time of increased personal connection. Not only does it allow possibility their individual response, so many of the contributing disparities in educational access, to minorities and those that lower certain barriersdoes create new ones. As was already discussed in relation to the lack of broadband access. Online learning offers more affordable option that can be customized to meet individual schedules, allowing for continued learning to be a viable option for those islands and other commitments a good job area prior to the pandemic 20 percent of student loan borrowers are behind on their payments and this further emphasizes the importance of affordable and likable education particularly as student debt has climbed of 1. 5 trillion. Lesser comportment the commerce i offered go by the Governors University structure. I directed the virginia secretary of education and state council of Higher Education to work with virginia public colleges and any private colleges willing to develop a program for online degree with lower cost. Virginias many great institutions, its important they are affordable and acceptable to students and im committed to continuing to work on ways to incentivize the path forward while i serve in congress so i asked president pulsifer, you mentioned 70 percent, 77 percent of alumni respondents reported that their education was worth the cost compared to the National Average of 38 percent. Thats a testament to the work youve putforward. I want to ask as the trends whether covid and disrupted lives, you note in your testimony that many people need midcareer rescaling. What are some barriers robbing people from seeking additional education and how can Congress Help people whose lives were disrupted by the pandemic caused economic downturn. Thank you congressman for that question. I think one of the various increasing evidence for sure that learning to earn if you will or educational work is absolutely the loop of what adults are going to go through in the future and some of those barriers are simply what is the Program Design and whether those programs are eligible for federal aid many of our lower skilled workers need to advance their careers and professions. And such and so forth for example that many such programs whether they are apprenticeship and design or short form in duration, whether they be technical coded boot camp models were short microcredentials as is often referred to. These often dont meet eligibility requirements, whether its fulltime attendance or whether its elements related to a degree seeking a credential model that is a credit hour based model so these are typically contemplated within the scope of federal regulation governs Higher Education. Education generally is granted towards the notion of a firsttime fulltime student pursuing an associate or a degree of some sort area and what were seeing is that employers are now increasingly entering into the space and providing employer training programs, state internships, apprenticeships or even partnering with Technical Colleges that are advancing the availability of these programs. Those are opportunities forus to address not only the first term sense but the rescaling of students. Thank you, i yelled back. You mister klein and i now turn to mister salon in mariana islands. Five minutes. Thank you madam chair and thanks to the witnesses for their participation today. My question is to doctor pierce and doctor white. Then i will submit for the record. So the karabakh provided 14 billion in Emergency Support institutions of students who are impacted by the pandemic. All of us are required to use this, how can we the draft while the otherhalf can be spent on institutions themselves. And delivery of education resulting from covid19 so distribution of other funds and administration to my district , directly relief payments began the first injection of economic was for individuals in the marianas to the beginning of the pandemic so id like to share some of doctor doctor white, about how they use the federal funding that precedes today could you please briefly approach, the campuses, specifically id like to share how you prioritize the students with the most need a warning to the state, how will have to use the care funding that you receive what other key pieces of services would you find that you can access additional federal support. Thank you for the question. What we considered the funding in terms of the intent from congress to meet the needs of students and especially students who were, had higher needs levels and we also credit load because that part of the funding formula. So we identified eligible students and they each received a basic award of 100 and tell eligible students receive additional supplemental funds on credits. We also upheld the total grant so we get more traditional funding based on the short application and traditional needs such as housing, food, health care technologies, transportation and things of that nature. So thats how we dispersed the funds because it was very important for us to use an equity lensindustry getting the funds. Software licenses, internet access, additional computers. [audio difficulties] we anticipate that the significant amount of funds for instructional costs because of the restrictions that we must operate under. This may mean that to have any comments . Anything to add to what pierce just said . We distribute it to under 60 in direct student funding. Directly to Financial Institutions so our students who lack documentation could access the funds. We wanted to make sure students who were involved. [audio difficulties] our awards rank from 500 to over a thousand dollars and be used within the student body which is over to stay present for students we expected contributions first and work our way up bottomup till we were out of money. [audio difficulties] doctor pierce used it for covid19 induced additional expenses across those 23 institutions and then you have a student population that is just as great as the district they represent in numbers. I have been to your institution. I have additional questions to ask. I will submit it for the record. I appreciate your answers. Thank you. Thank you. Now, i believe doctor murphy, doctor murphy of north carolin carolina i know he was here earlier. I dont see him. Lets see. We will move on to the rest of the democrats that are there. I just want to be sure that doctor murphy does appear to be Still Available and the participant list. Oh, okay great, great. Doctor murphy. Are you there . We will come back to doctor murphy. Mr. Watkins was on previously as well but i dont know if he is still there. Oh, okay. Doctor murphy is visible. Terrific. I will go back because i didnt see him. Doctor murphy you will need to unmute, sir. I consider myself an muted. Spirit great. Doctor murphy, you have five minutes. Thank you guys very much for your time. I want to ask different members of the committee to answer this question. Can you help me walk through this because i think we have lost a little bit in Higher Education and a little bit about what our purpose is, in some ways. I want to say a lot in the industries and the nations been hit with a calamity, the like of which we did not expect to see. We want to train and educate our individuals that go out to colleges and universities to lead lives of constant learning. It is not Technical School per per se but it is allowing could go minds to think and i am wondering that in and of itself where industry is example we have times are we have to cut our bill and trim our fat and given the fact that money now fs freely from the federal government and colleges and universities with no Strings Attached i am wondering how and what suggestions each of you could offer that colleges and universities could tighten their belt and areas they could . We are here to forest them a blank check from the federal government and out given the shortage happening across every industry in the country where colleges and universities will fall in that line . If everybody could just do it in sequence i look forward to your responses. Sure. I will weigh in on this one first. I want to acknowledge that so many college and University President s, as well as campus reopening taskforces, are working incredibly hard and they are figuring out how to wring recovery plans to life, understanding that they will be really tight fiscal constraints. I wonder if it said that energy might be better placed on figuring out how to effectively educate students in a virtual environment at least for this fall semester and thinking about how to do that well it feels to me like that is a much less excessive project in terms of both the expenditure of human and fiscal resources. I frequently find it annoying that so many campuses that are scrambling to figure out how to play football this fall and how to ensure physical distancing in stadiums. It feels to me like the money would be better spent trying to figure out how to close the Digital Equity access cap and again how to better prepare faculty to teach online, at least for the fall semester. All right, thank you. Thank you for your comments. I would like to just speak to the point of the Technical College. In terms of that is exactly where we are spending our time and our effort and resources and figuring out how to make sure that our students have the same quality level of an online experience, hybrid experience they would have two lead [audio difficulties] delivering instruction. However, there are some career and technical programs that simply cannot be offered in an online environment. For example, air force, im sorry technicians, external accrediting bodies and the work they must do in the be facetoface with their instructors so they are demonstrate a level that is acceptable for the faa. It is incumbent upon us to spend the time and the resources to make sure that we are able to deliver that type of instruction to students in a safe environment to protect the faculty and staff who work in those for exam, [inaudible] is another. [audio difficulties] we are balancing the needs of the programs, the needs of the students, the needs of this external accrediting bodies so that we can complete our mission and those are all incredibly important for us to do. We are balancing the need to control spending by delaying or different types of instruction programs. Thank you, i want to make sure everyone gets a chance. I appreciate the answer. Thank you. Congressman murphy. Tim white here. An educated citizenry is the publics equity matters so federal funds and for msis and institutions matter good education really is a matter of social justice at all times particularly i get all that matters stuff. How are you going to trim costs . We have trim cost by decreasing hiring, decreasing travel, going together with other universities on procurement for better rates and eliminating unnecessary activities that can be postponed in terms of construction and maintenance. But it is important to recognize that the investment is in an investment in the future and on the planet is one half if you have a public degree versus not. It is not just looking at the cost but looking at the return on investment. I understand that. I have a degree so i appreciate that. One other individual. Thank you. To get to the heart of the question one of the considerations should be what considered is the operating budget that is on instruction and advancing Student Outcomes and credentials and the question would be for those costs that are not related to instruction but i would echo what doctor harper said which is that the emphasis and priority, i think, should be focusing on how does an increase in percentage of operating budget focus on teaching and the transfer of learning to the individuals that are acquiring credentials. There is no doubt that in universities have taken on many different purposes and much of that is emerging adult experiences and that can be a very costly undertaking with a very different operating an economic model. But now that has been disrupted by covid and one of the considerations is what percent of operating budgets are dedicated instruction and increasing probability. Thank you. Thank you, doctor murphy. Thank you so much. You have five minutes. Thank you. Thank you so much to the panel for participating. In my district the schools are right now announcing their efforts to resume oncampus instruction. And what that will look like this fall, clearly it will be very different from what it might have been last year and while our csu will hold classes primarily online i think its important to make sure our educators and their families and the businesses themselves are getting guidance for reopening for it ever letter to secretary devos with bipartisan support asking for guidance from the department of education and i continue to hear from teachers and parents that there top concern is that we are going through this reopening process and that we make sure were doing it safely with the right guidance to folks on the front lines. Doctor wright, my first question for you is will be in uncharted territory, whether schools choose to do so in the fall semester or if they choose to do so later on so what measures and what guidance and support would you hope to see from the department of education in advance resuming oncampus classes . The cdc has been helpful with their guidelines for and their guidelines and the thing that could really matter here is there such a variability on the state of california and across the country with respect to disease progression. We cannot change the biology of the disease. What we can do is change the Human Behavior around that biology and here in california and and others have commented in other states in the union where things have started to re escalate again that we imagined another bump later the summer and we have a forecast of very strong forecast of a greater wave of this, influenza, october and november and another wave in march and april. Our plan and horizon has been for the longer term that theyre trying to figure out how to get to the next two weeks or two months. I think that is a fundamental mindset and it took a while with collaboration from our faculty, staff and communities to go from how we preserve in person to how we move to virtual and back away from that is the progression allows us to do. That is helpful. My question comes from connectivity. I think making sure that we have the right infrastructure in place will be important. This pandemic has exposed a Digital Divide in rural areas such as my district and the president of [inaudible] shared with me that shes concerned about the lack of access on wifi and internet in the 21st century and access for a student is simply not acceptable and doctor wright, what could the csu system do to help connect students in the area to the internet and what could the federal government do to support you in those efforts . The university we had a lot of our campuses create wifi thoughts in our parking spots and have Security Services for students to drive in the car and do their work. There always is the edge of rome internet capability that perhaps a College Student could be close to an Elementary School and grew up in sacramento or in fresno and still get access to the internet. The Governor Council on secondary education that govern gavin newsom appointed and other other private educations in the state is made get rid of the broadband Digital Divide in one of the Top Priorities for california and this is a place where i think federal investment could help jumpstart that, if you will,. [audio difficulties] it is to remove that divide. Thank you. Thats a big focus for a lot of students in our area. Finally, doctor harper, question for you. We know the Great Recession disproportionately impacted education in underserved communities which reduce enrollments, higher dropout rates in students graduating with large debt and no jobs to gain access to pain those Student Loans. How can we better support our students in this pandemic . I think is impertinent to get ahead of the protected outcomes and recognizing that the everything it is named has a disproportionate and. [audio difficulties] with that i yield backward thank you so much to our panel. In q. Thank you, mr. Harper. I believe mr. Watkins of kansas is with us. You have five minutes. Thank you very much. Thanks to the panel for offering your time and expertise. What are the practical ways colleges can we make or remain affordable for students . Has the pandemic change that recruited any new changes to making schools more important . I did think the pandemic has accelerated a trend towards increasing digitally approach and digitally native means it weathers technology in advancing the students ability to access an experience education. There is no doubt that when you have a digitally native approach to things you will remove a lot of elements of an operating budget that are necessary to that. I think that is definitely been one of our core models is how you focus the largest of your operating budget and how you make it more interactive with faculty and how you provide more higher student to faculty ratio and how do you make sure the technology is accessible anytime, anywhere so students can learn independent of time and place. A lot of those elements that are addressing things that are not related to the acquisition of knowledge, skills and abilities that they need and so you can take that [inaudible]. Ultimately, we are at this point i think we are fundamentally going to start addressing higher costs of education and bending it down rather than finding out or devising new funding and financing mechanisms to afford it and ever increasing cost. Those are opportunities that are not being accelerated because of his rapid shift to digital and to doctor harpers point i would simply add that the investment required to enable and expand the Digital Infrastructure necessary can cover 100 of individuals in our country would be far less than an vesting in campuses to make campuses available in every 15 minutes. You cannot bring education to every american and not only is that making sure that the Cellular Networks and the highspeed internet and fiberoptic cables or whatever it may be is successful and programs that can devices et cetera that are there for students to learn and that is typically been contemplated and yet we are willing to look to have accommodation and it can be expensive. Understood, you did touch on this in your answer but i would like you to think of any other mistakes that institutions of Higher Learning are making with his back to their Business Models and kennel schools do better to adopt to the changing landscape in the post secondary instruction . I think the first most port thing is to realize the institution and ask yourself what is the primary purpose of how you solve for that and let Everything Else become secondary to that. If your primary purpose is fundamentally about teaching individuals and helping them achieve the credentials they came to achieve then you will focus all your faculties, design and your cost and investment model and your pedagogical engagement, peer to peer interactions around learning. When you do that you can slop off investments but quite frankly because we were designed in the age of the internet we view place place classroom campuses constrains to access and we also view them as constraints to even the advance and quality of instruction in learning because you can now personalize, and away, learning in an online digitally native environment that you cant necessarily do in a classroom of 30, 100 or 500 students. So i think it is an opportunity for leaders and for individuals like yourself and legislators and regulators to consider how is Technology Shaping the futu future. [audio difficulties] thank you, sir. That is all i got. I yield back. Thank you, mr. Watkins. We now turn to missus lee of nevada. Thank you. Thank you, madam chair. I would like to thank all the panelists for their insight today. I represent Southern Nevada and we were hit, obviously, during the Great Recession and now impacted tremendously during this time. With the Great Recession taught us was a lot that may be happening now in the Higher Education space and in our economy. Following that recession many people sought out quick opportunities to gain skills and training in order to rejoin the workforce. This trend was also coupled with loosened accountability standards which resulted in expensive growth of forprofit colleges. In Southern Nevada alone we saw 34 off at schools close within the last ten years. Data suggests we are seeing this pattern again now and we know the track record of forprofit colleges and their predatory tactics of using to defraud students. In particular, itt tac are a couple of institutions that are probably close their doors leaving tens of thousands of students strapped with worthless degrees and mounds of debt. Unfortunately, secretary devos borrower defense rule has made it nearly impossible for them to seek relief for this burden setting the precedent that fraudulent that actor schools are coddled by the government and taxpayers are stuck putting footing the bill. I would like to ask this question of doctor harper and others are welcome to chime in. What you think congress can do right now to prevent predatory bad actor schools from preying on students during those recession . I think that the Obama Administration began to make some really serious traction on this. Obviously, lots of those efforts have been rolled back. I think we need to restore those efforts. I think about this and i care very deeply about it because we know that it is, people of color and more specifically low income women of color, single mothers, working mothers, who are really the target of the predatory practices and we owe it to those women of color to safeguard them from being preyed upon when they are most vulnerable. As we see joblessness rates increase across the country, who is most affected . Africanamericans. When those people are out of work and inking about, you know being out of work, affording them an opportunity to help scale rescale and pursue Higher Education we must protect them from being preyed upon by forprofit institutions. I will move on to doctor pierce. How does the Department Failure to protect students from predatory actors hurt the ability of Community Colleges to serve the students . In terms of the severe impact our ability to serve the students they arrive having and used up a great deal of their eligibility or having used all their eligibility. They also frequently arise arrive already in debt because they taken on position of debt and in addition to having use their eligibility. They arrive with credit but not credentials that dont lead to a degree and dont lead to a living wage and it makes. Difficult the students and it limits what they are able to do. They start ten seats behind the starlight and its just a mass and makes it more difficult for them to get to a place where they are able to complete a credential and earn a living wage. Instead of a program taking 12 months, it takes 24 months they are increasing their debt steadily. And they started with the deficit to begin with. Thank you. Just one final question. The pandemic has brought obviously great uncertainty and we have seen many choosing to delay or forgo college altogether. I am concerned that some students may never return. I am even more concerned about picking out exactly who these students are. We know that fafsa renewals among students, low income families, has dropped about 8 compared to the same time last year. Doctor piers and doctor weitz, have your institutions seen a decline in enrollment and can you expand upon what type of students you have seen a decline in . The california State University weve not seen a decline in enrollment but that is because of a massive effort by our faculty, staff and administrators to reach out and recreate in the virtual space all these things that students. [audio difficulties] so that is our approach and so far, so good. We can let you know where we are headed connect that is good news. My time is up. [inaudible] from pennsylvania. I hope you are there. Gas, madam chair. Thank you. As for our witnesses thank you for being with us and for your Important Information on this important topic. Over the last 30 years Public Schools cost for tuition, room and board, total cost tripled after being adjusted for inflation. Private schools have doubled. Now, i certainly know the argument and i was on our state board in the Public Schools went up and cost more because in some states they were cutbacks in Education Funding from the states but even if it hasnt doubled after being adjusted for inflation in the Business World costs largely due to technology and efficiencies remain or were caught in many cases or remain relatively neutral outside of, of course, payroll costs. Just to ask [inaudible] to start off with, seen your background as a business person you were in the Technology Field and now ahead of a college, Online College. How do you explain that . The high level of increased costs over the last ten years, 20 years, 30 years to all virtually all Higher Education universities and colleges. Yeah, much longer answer than time allows but let me highlight two things that i think about. One is there is an investment or operating model with utilization which does not support the total consumption so when you consider that for most classroom based on these models of that you really have to dramatically increase the utilization so that you can get the longridge cost curve to decline otherwise to support and operations for the buildings for facilities for housing et cetera will ever increasing costs and will be difficult to not let grow with it so that if he fixed enrollment you will not grow revenue because of that increased in cause and there is a dynamic of the economic model. Also important to note is over the last several decades a percentage of operating budgets that is spent on instruction has been declining over time. The emerging things spent on student life or even research. That is another thing that has been growing as a percentage. There is one other dynamic i dont think it is often talked about which is this notion that quality is amount measured by scarcity or exclusivity. As such, in that model you have this behavior where if you increase price the digital quality goes up versus the demand goes up. Whether the university costs 25,000 a year or figure or 60,000 a year, and i dont get good answers on this in previous testimony, when they review their major, how much guidance is received . You take the major into consideration. You take the level of loan caretaking out. Students feedback on whether on track to achieve that major in four years. Loans outstanding. Theres no big surprise at the end they cant get a job for more than 38,000 a year, say, in many cases and yet they have 60,000 60,000 in loans. It doesnt seem to be, im going to ask you all, is that type of feedback strong . Do you feel a responsibility providing that that feedback to the student . This is tim white. Our tuition and fees is 7300 a year. More than half of our students graduate without debt. Those who do have debt is well below the National Average. We are about 17,000 in debt. With analytics we provide a lot of advice, keeping them on track and were having alltime highs in any way Graduation Rates. Finally in terms of bending the boss curve cost curve, its just not Online Colleges a could do that. We raise tuition one time in the last eight years for 237 in nine years. We and yet 40,000 more students every year and graduating 75,000 more students every year than we did before. There are ways of getting the calls cost curves and keeping costs down to the states. You have to be [inaudible] thank you and congratulations. Those are good stats. Appreciate it. Thank you. I yield back. Thank you. Ms. Bonamici, you now have five minutes. Thank you so much and thanks to the chair and Ranking Member and to all the witnesses here just to follow up on the comment from my colleague, the value people contribute to our communities and to our society is not necessarily measured amount of their salary reaches why with things like the Public Service loan forgiveness program. I want to start by saying technology and Online Learning have a place especially during a Global Pandemic. I would be very concerned if we are having a conversation about the trend of Higher Education moving to Online Learning. Portland State University in oregon did a survey, 70 responded they have a challenge with the transition to Remote Learning. 82 had difficulties had difficulties focusing on remote instruction and prefer facetoface learning. Importantly 50 said they dont have access to reliable internet service, and a third of the students said they are very serious challenges with accommodations. We know there are a lot of inequities in Higher Education, even before the pandemic and the pandemic has exacerbated so many of those. I have spoken with a College Students precoronavirus about the challenges of housing, food insecurity, childcare for students who are parents. And now with most classes mobic online or moved online and most Campus Housing and dining halls closed, students are facing emergency expenses. We know historically underrepresented students have had, have been disproportionally affected. Dr. Harper talked about a recent hopes in a survey on 19 percentage point gap in basic needs insecurity between black students and their white peers. Dr. Harper can you talk more about how this contribute to gaps . I want to get entire front of the question but id like your answer on that. Ill be concise. It is really important to think about the important work that colleges like Compton College due to ensure that students have their Transportation Needs met, that they have access to food and so on. And that we dont have a solution necessary if we go too far online. I do think the college really stepped up in in a really impressively during the pandemic to partner with grubhub and other institutes to get meals the student and their families. But im not sure that kind of model necessarily is scalable. What i think is more scalable is what Compton College calls wasg before the pandemic where they were centralizing those resources so we need more of that as we return to campuses at some point. We need a serious strategy to continue to meet students basic needs. I appreciate that and also very much appreciate, dr. Harper, your statement that Higher Education is a public good. I think chancellor white astonished that with his comments about whats happening in the california system. I was a state legislator during the Great Recession and know how hard it is to balance the budget but im also graduate of a Community College, Public University and a public law school, and recognize the value of these institutions and a detriment to students when education budgets are cut. We did provide some funding and the bipartisanly cares act but i know thats not enough as mr. Takano discussed. What specifically, to dr. Harper and dr. Pierce and chancellor white at this time, what specifically is needed to make sure that Higher Education institutions can continue to provide academic programming . I want to emphasize that is to all students and close those equity gaps that are so critical and maybe well start with the dr. Pierce and see if theres time for dr. Harper and chancellor white. Yes, we are committed to making sure it is continuing and so helping us meet those needs is critical. Student transportation, then you childcare, access to affordable healthcare. They need access to Mental Health counseling. They need access to collegiate recovery program. They need access to mentoring and tutoring and they need access to the learning community. For some of our students the active coming on campus and being on campus is what inspired them to persevere. The new disconnected from the campus is very difficult for them. Everyone doesnt have a quiet, stable environment in which children at home. We need to be able to maintain access for specialty labs, computer labs, especially software, career technical programs where students have to perform skills that must be done once thank you. I see my time is expired but i will ask dr. Harper and chancellor white two, on the record, to respond to the question. Thank you and i yield back. Thank you, is bonaduce. Mr. Smucker, a as far as you know is anybody on the line that i looked through and i dont see anybody waiting. I think youre correct. I think we are through all the republican ms. Adams. Okay. I will get to ms. Adams, absolutely. I just wanted to double check in with mr. Smucker. Great. Ms. Adams is next and followed by mr. Norcross, if hes available and in the room. But dr. Adams, you have five minutes. Thank you, madam chair. Thank you to the Ranking Member as well. Thank your for convening the hearing today into the witnesses. Thank you for your extraordinary testimony. Historically black colleges and universities, tribal colleges, universities of minority serving institutions of Community College are primarily Public Institutions that serve many of our cultural income students and students of color. However, these institutions are chronically underfunded. They have fewer resources to support the students. Dr. Harper, havel state budget cut disproportionally impacted hbcus, pc use, the Community Colleges and then her ability to operate effectively and continue to serve their citizens . As as a proud graduate of aly State University, a a public of stroke the black university, i especially appreciate this question. State undercuts will affect those institutions in the way state corporation of affected them. They have been inequitable for far too long, and, therefore, when erica those cuts are going to have [inaudible] on those chronically underfunded institutions. I really appreciated chancellor white earlier response to the question where he named the price of what it cost to be a student at the california state universities. So many hbcus, tribal colleges and Community Colleges effectively educate students of color with far too few resources. Its quite remarkable as a matter of fact happening so much out of so little. Just imagine if we were able to finance them appropriately. They could, in fact, together, they could help us close Racial Equity gaps across all industries if only we would invest in them equitably. Absolutely. Thank you for your question. I i am a proud to son graduate f north carolina, the largest public hbcu in the country right now, and im a 40 year retired professor on Bennett College in greensboro which is the final school but ive been reading some of our nations hbcus could face a moment drops of up to 20 in the fall due to the nature of this pandemic and the impact its going to have on low income students. Dr. Harper, schools like hbcus are heavily tuition driven. These schools rely heavily on tuition for revenue. How should congress support them at this time and how do we prevent we saw during the 2008 recession where many of our schools in particular hbcus face in moment drops and, therefore, fiscal calamity down the road . Is a way to change that in your opinion . Sure. I think federal investment that are specifically earmarked for bolstering enrollment would be incredibly helpful. Just six months ago i concluded a project was funded by the bill and Melinda Gates foundation in which i was looking at hbcu enrollment. The good news that enrollment actually have not declined over time. They have flatlined. I think with some specific federal funding results institutions could, in fact, invest in the very expenses, technology that my university and others like it used to recruit students. Those institutions dont have the money. When you have to make a choice between we are repairing the sidewalk to ensure students are safe, or investing in technologies that are going to allow you to really bolster your enrollment, most students are left with the choice of having to repair the sidewalk. Okay. Thank you for your question. I really want to get some input from the other panelists in terms of the importance of the meticulous department of education oversight over the cares act funds were dispersed and used by institutions and you may have to send me to somebody but i have like one more minute. Dr. Wright or dr. Pierce, if you could respond. We believe in inclusive excellence of our students, whether their documentation or not, whether their International Students, whether theyre from florida or from california. So we supplemented the cares act with our own money to make anybody who had a covid19 induced added expense was able to be supported. But it seemed in comprehensive all to me that the department of education would exclude those tubes because theyre part of the fabric of Public Education bringing perspectives from around the world and around the country. Okay. Im out of time. Thanks to all of our panelists for your responses and for your participation today. I yield back. Thank you. Thank you, dr. Adams. I want to go back now to mr. Norcross. Is mr. Norcross available . And then mr. Castro. Mr. Castro, you have five minutes. Naked chairwoman. And thank you to the panelists for your testimony today thank you, chairwoman. [talking over each other] i had a few questions about what you believe the longterm impact of covid19 will be on Higher Education and let the preface my question with this. When the pandemic broke i had conversation with both superintendents in my district, k12 institutions and also leaders of the Higher Education institutions, our twoyear colleges, and for your universities. They all expressed some different ones but, for example, many of the fouryear universities said they were seeing students drop off plans to enroll in their institutions in favor of Community Colleges simply because of the fear that they wouldnt be able to afford to go to those fouryear institutions any longer. We have seen that the pandemic especially in certain states like mine in texas has stretched on longer and longer. And given that in Higher Education theres often this inverse relationship between cost and completion, in other words, the places that are cheap as a go too often have the lowest completion rates. What is the longterm impact of covid19 on where students go to college, the ability to complete, and also the support that are colleges and universities are able to offer them . And open that up to any of the panelists. Thank you, congressman, for the question. I will go ahead and offer a perspective on it. Theres little doubt that individuals and the families are of Higher Education, what we offer. When you have Something Like a pandemic create real disruption in the Value Proposition that was previous a contemplated to, that is going to change how the consumers of education think about it. So simply being the father of two children who are currently in the traditional model of Higher Education as well as a graduate of it but also being the leader of an online comedy based education, i think the dynamic is such that in many of the really beneficial emerging adult expenses, student engagement, if the strings and a part those was because of longstanding or long tenured effects of Something Like a pandemic, then the return on investment for the cost actually paid is going to be challenge. Such a many individuals i do think well start focusing more specifics on how can i still acquire the learning and couldnt find it depends the opportunities i require and what is the more affordable roi i can get for that. If many of the other values that i i previously had available to me are not available. The other thing i do anticipate is that you will see an emerging number of employers and alternative pathways will start to emerge as you also consider the 40 million adults and 10 million workers that will be displaced because of either technology pandemic that needed rescaled and upscaled, and a fouryear degree pathway will not be fast enough. You will see emerging credentials and alternative pathways that are certainly not just the firsttime fulltime student at the working and adults who need to find the next pathway. Thank you. I i dont know if the other panelists have congressman, i will be very quick and say exact would you describe is exactly the mission of community and Technical Colleges meeting the needs of students as they emerge. I anticipate over time you will see an increase in enrollment in Community Colleges as people come back to seek shortterm credentials, longterm credentials, transfer programs as well as opportunities to transfer into different areas of growth. Community and Technical College are affordable. They are a Value Proposition and the offer excellent opportunity to retool our economy. Thank you. Congressman castro, one thing that at different day, but this learning deficit that is apparent in our k12 system with the interruptions and disruption happening in Public Schools, that will lead to a disproportionate across the spectrum of race and ethnicity income level that the students when you do finally get to a kindred to college or a fouryear university or an Online College Community College will have different preparation, colleges and universities are going to have to deal with. They may not be causing the problem and will be ours to resolve at the end. That will fundamentally change i think the relationship of public Higher Education in particular in the years and decades ahead. Thank you. I appreciate it. I just back. Thank you very much. Appreciate that. And i believe that we have come to end of members who are ready for questions. I will just check our grid again to be sure. Anybody that we didnt see . Then i wanted to just remind my colleagues that pursuant to Committee Practice, the trails for submission for the hearing record must be submitted to the Committee Clerk within 14 days following the last day of the hearing. So that would be at the close of business july 21, 2020. Then the truths of it must address the subject matter of the and only a member of this subcommittee or an invited witness may submit materials for inclusion in the written record. Packed with limited to 50 pages each. Documents longer the 50 pages will be incorporated into the record by internet link that you must provide to the Committee Clerk within the required time frame. Please recognize that you somehow that link they no longer work. Pursuant to House Resolution 965, items for the record should be submitted electronically by emailing submissions, members are encouraged to submit materials at the time the member makes the request. The record will remain open for 14 days for Committee Practice for additional submissions at the teetering, and without objection i would like to enter those following reports into the record. I want to thank our witnesses certainly for the participation today. Its been outstanding, and we know that there are many more questions out there. We are all anxious and worried quite honestly about whats going to happen. And so we know how important it is that you are remarks have been today. Members of the subcommittee may have some additional questions for you, and we ask the witness to please respond to this questions in writing and that hearing record will be open for 14 days in order to receive those responses. I want to remind my colleagues that pursuant to Committee Practice the witness questions of hearing record must be submitted to the Majority Committee step Committee Clerk within seven days and the question submitted must address the subject matter. I now want to recognize that distinguish Ranking Member for his closing statement, mr. Smucker here thank you for being with us today, and would welcome your comments. Thank you, madam chair. I agree this was a great discussion and appreciate you scheduling this hearing. I want to thank the witnesses for all of your testimony, for your insight, your perspectives and for the great work that each of you are doing in your institutions. Weve heard from all of you about the challenges that the schools have faced in the spring as the mr. Coronavirus woodd will be for the obstacles that schools have to grapple with in the fall. The pandemic accelerate the underlying trends that are shaping the post secondary education, students are demanding a better return on investment, demanding ondemand education and the ability to fluidly transition between the classroom and the workforce. Simple fact is that the pandemic exposed what members on our side have been asking for for some time, that congress was truly pass real higher ed authorization reform. We need to get beyond just doubling down on the failing status quo which unfortunately is what the heroes act does. And Congress Instead should come together in a bipartisan manner to pass we did come together i i should sit in a by patterson by personnel to pass because i think we provided billions to release the students and institutions that been impacted by the coronavirus. Unfortunately my colleagues on the other side of the aisle are insisting on spending billions of more in taxpayer money, without first understand the full effect and impact of the cares act. As congress discusses additional believe we should broaden the conversation beyond simply just more money for the fact we should be judging our success by how well we enhance opportunities for students to seek education and to improve their station in life. Over several decades the federal government has played an increasingly larger role in our Higher Education system with some pretty dismal results. Just over half our nations College Students are graduating within six years, and those who do graduate are finding themselves woefully unprepared for the workforce. So Congress Must Work Together in a bipartisan manner to pass legislation that encourages universities to innovate and adapt to meet the needs of todays students. Our focus should be on reopening responsibly. We cannot lose sight of doing what is best for students. Congress can help all students regardless of the background succeed by encouraging proven methods of learning such as competencybased education, brooding workforce participation in the College Classroom and allowing for innovative and stackable credentials with time for sensitive reform is now again. I want to thank the witnesses for your testimonies today. Look forward to working with my colleagues to reform in the best interest of students, institutions and taxpayers. Madam chairwoman, thank you and i yield back. Thank you, mr. Smucker. I now recognize myself for the purpose of making our closing statement and i certainly want to thank once again our expert witnesses for joining us on our committees First Virtual hearing and for your compelling testimony. Our discussion certainly offered an important reminder that Congress Still is much work to do from providing institutions with additional relief to protecting vulnerable students from fraud and ensuring that all students get access and complete a College Degree. I think if we would look at that, students in the room as well to share for us how devastating for number of students this has been to try and make some adjustments to anticipate and even inquiry and ask themselves and their families, is to try to continue with my Higher Education at the time, what should i do, for freshmen who are just entering, for those have been a be that a year of school behind them and now they are really troubled about what the next step yes. Im sure you all couldve offered some advice about that but our role here is to try and understand what can we do . What can congress do . What should we be doing . So again we have a lot of work to do in that regard. We are well aware there are a number of alternative pathways. In fact, the committee on higher ed has been working hard on workforce investment, looking at how we still up apprenticeships and more. How do we help young people who may be looking for alternatives to be able to access those and especially in a time like like this when things are so uncertain. But at the same time we have to be sure that those institutions and this programs are highly accountable, not just to the people they serve also to the taxpayers. Thats a keen interest of ours and we are working very hard on that. We also know there are a lot of reasons why young people are not able to profit from the education as well as they should. Added think as we look at how we can reimagine, how we can think differently about Higher Education that we need to be certain that we understand what are those reasons for them not being able to achieve what they wanted in the past and how do we work or how do we adjust by our Higher Education system to respond to that . Again, look at our workforce investments. So again i thank you very much for being here, and we know that we must advance the heroes act. I think different than my colleague mr. Smucker. I think we need to have that support their in order to do what needs to be done to create this reimagining within our communities. If we dont have that then those students who benefit from that support, that mentoring, all that weve been able to do in the past will not have that in school. And they will probably leave the system and maybe never return. Even though they have the Great Potential to be able to have made those contributions as individuals in the future. We cant let that happen. So we have to be certain that we are thinking ahead about the support thats needed, and theres no question that covid that its impacted the ability of each and every school to prepare their students and to be able to deliver in a way they need to deliver. So i hope we can come to get on behalf of the heroes act and overcome this pandemic and excel into the future. Thank you again. We really benefit from your expertise today, and with that, theres no further business, without objection subcommittee stands adjourned. Thank you all. During the summer months reach out to your elected officials with cspans congressional directory. It contains all the Contact Information you need to stay in touch with members of congress, federal agencies and state governors. Order your copy online today at cspanstore. Org. We will talk next about the spending of the covid19 relief fund approved by congress over the past couple of months. We are joined by the Healthcare Team manager for the Government Accountability office. Thanks of being with us this morning. Thanks for havinges me. Tell us why the gao did this report. The cares act that was passed in march required us to provide ongoing oversight of the funding and activities of the federal government, specifically required i us to provide ongoing oversight of the governments efforts to prepare for, respond to and recover from covid19. It includes a requirement for us to assess the impact of covid19 on Public Health as well as the economy as well as track the funding and the use of that funding. The act requires us to report every 60 days starting 90 days after an accident. Enactment. We will be issuing additional reports every other month term basically as soon as this legislation is signed and inactive and signed, the gao is monitoring its spending . Guest absolutely. Where providing realtime oversight of the funds and we have experience doing this. Going back over a decade ago, for example,