Thank you for joining us for c two nights discussion with our independent scholar and author tonightsnd book boss of the groups perk up along as part of a series of programs at our current exhibition about harlem if you have not had a chance to look at the exhibition will be up through the end of december there are all these things you will hear about tonight and historicalbout tonight and knowledge examining black place making offering institutions committed to Community Education and innovation in political engagement, global perspective, culture affirmation, and creativity. To highlight include the brotherhood of the first union for black workers particularly the pullman porters work also find selections f from the collection that we recently acquired perk also lee also items that are so much more. Save the date november 13 we will have a conversation with curator jeff green. Event taking a place in december in conversation about making community. Talking about how the black community is hosted inom partnership with the barbershop chronicles who we was a rich tapestry of fatherson relationships and black masculinity set to black afro beat and score. Please pick up one of our brochures we will have a book signing following the conversation a new york city based independent historian and author and the owner every conduct reneged reconnecting through toxin tours and on song areas over manhattan the exhibition script is the memphis right Civil Rights Museum and interpretive signage and west. Harlem one of the municipal societies celebrating the waterfront location of the first book manhattanville the current book is a biography a division of ww norton from Columbia University community scholarsmm program the center of biography and residency his new book as he reintroduces a figure who live between 1878 in 1948 in the senior based the most railroad station that had the life blood of the new Negro Movement and to the story of the 19 twenties bracket we will first hear from eric and then we will sit down to have a conversation. Please welcome him to the podium. [applause] thank you to the Schomburg Center for being the stewards of such an incredible collection and valuable to my research on thisle m book. Research on thisle m book. Talk. September 14th 19 oh 92 reform us all on 53rd street despite the growing exodus this was still a hub of black life only recently promoted to the chief attendant official category name was rarely used by travelersat even they refer to themselves by the conspicuous headwear. Reds. Caps. But this evenings assembly seemed more formal and we summoned them to the church to organize the association of Grand Central terminal. That itself the number of occupational and Emotional Distress is fueled this particular gathering working in and around fully functioning Railroad Service while construction crews built up the new terminal complex an accident claimed one of the men and more personally succumbing in the hospital a week later. That makes red caps truly selfaware they were uninsured independent upon tips. And with the news influential positions to call to action to organize their own Benevolent Association and is sickness or injury or death with the new Mutual Aid Society and his assistant chief then study for the occupation thrusting them into history as sergeant in arms. This ist 19 oh nine. And with that grassroots base labor force building out from Grand Central station and distinct from the collective bargaining based organization. Which in turn risks inspire the red caps the National Union movement and we have the greater harlem and to start something from the introduction. Are rightly celebrated Tour De Force to captivate the traveling public for more than a century on february 12th 1913 the largestew railroad station built by the american firms and showcases the host of such artistic talents whose monumental sculpture above a tiffany clock and charles has a mind wandering traveler to the blue heavens. And the civic landing in new york and masterwork of innovative design and engineering. And those cascading rams and shadows belies the operating model the servitude of africanamerican workers in this case it was rooted in the american tradition of racial exploitation comfortably regarded their territory as an enlightened refuge from those practices of the south or the bygone era. However 20th century had its own policies notably Grand Central to deploy a singular core at baggage quarters who at times numbered in the several hundreds for go the nature writer eb white noted to be in the class of beast and burden often backbreaking and demeaning labor to the stations functional b efficiency and it is inevitable the red cap order system is the model for numerous stations across the nation categorically identifiable by their complexion the black workforce embodied americas color line the bylaws and amendments and social attitudes to close the doors to the b blacks the color line was a deep seated contrivance over generations a panoply of contradictions only intuitively but yet as palpable as a rope it could be woven into the collective selfconscious by social mores or deliberate legislative acts. But blacks found ways to circumvent and mitigate an impasse from the color line in the event into opportunities leverage. Such was the case at Grand Central where the black workers means proverbial this speakingng to make a way out of no way. Into be flourished as those that originated at Grand Central depot with a dozen fight staff to become exclusively black by 19 oh five a source of pride the job was coveted by and associated with africanamerican men educated whites shunning and status to recognize it as an employment option in the era of racial barriers and that Grand Central africanamerican College Students a means to pave their way through school men who created this opportunity to secure a foothold was James H William those that Grand Central terminal is steeped in urgent but one urban legend formally enslaved 1878 of those red cap attendance in 19 oh three the former public reminder to carry baggage but were stationed passengers began to take on a new definition starting 19 oh nine the chief reporter or a red cap from Grand Central terminal with the firstot africanamerican officer and remained there until his death in 1940 in his capacity to embody a unique juncture between black and White America the tenure makes that monumental station not only a gateway to the greatest city but just as much a gateway to the nations greatest africanamerican neighborhood of harlem. For nearly half a centuryn those that were relegated to the lowest stratum of the force although always and trickle into the Railroad System like the pullman porters were also to the station bound red caps were crucial to that decision of the terminal to woven into that experience of earliest 20th Century Railroad travel. To coincide with those key periods of the soul troll central cultural in the everchanging metropolis of new yorkk city and post civil war america and that optimism of the reconstruction era active if unassuming agents of that ideological cause of racial uplift with white prejudice through selfimprovement civic interest in the arts in the 19 twenties of the harlem renaissance follow him through two world wars. Ingeniously transformed the selfeffacing job into a coveted Employment Opportunity as the tribune would observe scores of promising that young strapped college men on their way to work under our red cap his luggage porters many were greek letter to men upon that example they form for themselves when categorically barred as purse on unknown greta the academic credentials notwithstanding as well as the unschooled brothers worked as an salaried neighbors they were ubiquitous throughout the concourse and toadying the golf club of those whom they depended upon four tips while about race and labor of resourcefulness and philanthropy over the course of his life under the most Seismic Shift in history at the new york central employee as a society italy and sports heroes but to stand out conspicuously as the chief who created a platform to create to sustain black students and to showcase in that light and in that capacity to be applied to both baggage and handlers part of the harlem renaissance the era of the cultural literary and artistic expression also a renaissance of vibrant business andan industry as race enterprises as well is dispirited civic movements in which chief williams was noted. Admiring as a forthright advocate of the community the day after he died the journalist had to go to chicago so headed down to grant certain loan Grand Central boarding that train which was advertised on the main concourse the vast majority of passengers went to chicago did not know about williams death and did not id step some of the caps off couple of strangers some old passengers and friends of the chief that they had read about his death in the morning paper. They were crying. So i wondered whom is this black man from friends and strangers that was a dogged but fascinating task although not a man of letters and in the chronicles of his time to take shape and flush out and breathe. [applause] thank you. You already know what you have to do at the end of this progra program. Will be going into chief Williams Book because thats the title that you carry and also i want to take a moment to give a special shout out and thanks to margaret who is the great great granddaughter of who is here today. [applause] so how does your bio that you have an amazing job to illuminate the existence of leeveryday people and the impact of their work on society so you say it is a fascinating task so have you unearthed to develop this rich composition of a man like chief williams sometimes the easy part is the names andeasy part is newspaper articles sometimes its just a name on the list of people who were attending a party. And more often than not if you are searching for someone or something to find what you are looking fornd right away for something that captures your attention. And in that way there are different strategies and non strategies for digging up and finding people. And then to listen to peoples aims and what you shoulde know and with access to database particularly when there was a gathering or o an event it was a mystical thing but somewhat firstteam i feel like why we are mentioning them and then to go back to what i have read over again and then go back and see another familiar with these other names. That was very useful. To have these names spill forward and then to find out who those people were. So in the beginning to be part of the way a lot of migration of construction the population and natalie picking up the biography but also black new york so could you talk about the black communities . His parents were both enslaved in the same county i hadnt come across any evidence they knew one another they are but it seems that the friedman bank records one from 1872 and was a runaway and after the war had family and was a hotelel later in norwalk virginia norfolk connecticut . Are the other way around . [laughter] he was in virginia. And then the next year in new york but living at a very posh address of what today is greenwich village. One of those areas on thompson street that was the subject of jacobs investigations. And one of the troubled areas so it was clear it was an interesting dichotomy thats where he landed but with this really posh address on 29th street and broadway. And then still appears to get established. Of those that like themselves have come up from the south to the big city to new i york and to say this was important to get an idea but as a native new yorker born on 50th street which is now part of chelsea but the tenderloin and it was known for clubs and the red light district and everything that comes with that mimic anything above 14th street was uptown. Pretty much it references uptown above 14th street to give you an idea of how the city was moving up words. Not that they didnt live farther away but the centers and the businesses in commercial enterprises you could feel them migrating and and from becoming ensconced. It was amorphous communities that like Hells Kitchen would have been part of the northern end of it and 1h street were James Williams was born at the southern end toward the Railroad Tracks on the east. It dissolved to come i. C. E. Around the broadway area which is commercial. One that is interesting working on 28th street is in the posh area oft broadway that only a couple of blocks away. And its walkable within ten minutes but there is a contract. I feel the work that chief williams was doing graham tim from grand seat central station. Line of the principal of the gilded age of new york its not really clear when it began but certainly the turn of the last century when williams is working and is known for hiring especially africanamericans because jobs are hard to get. Looks like somebody and was a sports manager but was an artist at what he did. And everybody liked him. But this is one of the things the Africanamerican Community in new york always considered him a friend. He would cater events not o only to the elite but when harlem started to take hold he would cater those events as well and decorate them with flowers so he was known for fair play and getting a square deal and a lot of people like williams and even langston hughes. And this is in the later years and it wasnt connected. [laughter] but really one of the few people who is very influential. A family guy who had a lot of pull and probably he who made introductions to the admin of Grand Central to get williams this job which he integrated forces to become manhattans first black fireman and the most important letter and those were written by the likes of Teddy Roosevelt as well but it with that recommendation. So James William at a key time there is this other incredible thing where he owns property way uptown on 42nd street across broadway and Seventh Avenue a little Triangle Hotel their downtown and he sold that property to the new york times. And it became time square. One of the deals is that his name has to appear on the building in the lease and it remains there for many years. That williams was witness to all of that and was in charge of Madison Square garden was in a different location for when prince henry prussia it was one of the biggest events for tour of several american cities. At his house, tl palace. At his house, tl he was a boy then and had never gotten over it, so he became a this big advocate for black culture and wanted to know more. He thoroughly was in charge of the decorations, but also he was about fair play, so he had his staff do it which meant that he put one of the coworkers in charge and the prince was so impressed that he asked him to come back to decorate the state room anstateroom and the palaced them back with a diamond watch and everything. These kind of things really affected James Williams coming of age. It was like an apprenticeship where you learn what people want and seeing what people are ordering, what occasions they te getting flowers for her and what kind of flowers. Flowers. These are informing him he has become so when he gets to the position at Grand Central, hes just toting bags but also something of a diplomat. You get that feeling. It commanded a presence no matter who he was in conversation with were working with. One of the resources we have here at the Schaumburg Center we also have digital exhibitions. We have one of migrations in new neighborhoods of 66 and going to read a portion of that. As important as it was, it was dwarfed by the europeans mostly from ireland, germany and italy. In new york, irish and italian immigrants as domestics and skilled physicians which we see between 1890 and 1910 during the largest increase in the black population at that particular time, so 24 , the next with 66 or the next iteration so thats what im talking about in terms of the increase in the population at that time. It goes on to say it became more black new yorkers found themselves in the city that continue to bargain segregated them in the poor neighborhoods and entries into many public spaces. The. In the telling of the story we see the unveiling of the Grand Central station but we also are learning more about jim crow. How do these moments influence the position that he eventually takes . While they were relegated to these positions, towards the end they were starting to lose a lot of t these positions because a part of the old american story now that there are others coming in who wer are unrooted and beadwork, what are comfortable hiring them. One of the things this is the riot in 19 which were so terrific on a number of levels but one it wasnt just that they were battered by the Police Officers and this came into the court to and catalyzed the communities and blackandwhite as well in protest and the news. Across the country. Peopleas were so ashamed and disgusted by this moment that its sort of a dawning of the reformers to start offering jobs, so now these were so bottom of the rung jobs but one of the main proponents of the loudest voices of protest against the actions of the police and the Justice System that they thought were whitewashing what had happened das that reverend w. H. Brooks. One of the things that he said that within th was in the paperi imagine he was either there at that meeting were heard it the implication being we will work with this and see what happens. He did just that. He wouldnt have been hired from whomever it came from a that just wouldnt have happened so the job immediately shifts to being allblack. There were no protests that i cambut icame across which was oe case when blacks entered the work case. I get the impression that there was a plan to change. It gives an opportunity to turn this into Something Else and strategy, part of the strategy several years later would organize a union at. For him the organization is getting the job, getting the worword and then the otheren sty is disability and he does that in a number of ways by organizing because a lot of them are musical and they end up recording and he organizes a Baseball Team, he does all the same but they are carrying the moniker of Grand Central you think Grand Central and you are traveling by train. This is how you envision him to travel as a part of the iconography. This is a set of people they wanted to put out there because they realized that women needed support from catching the train they needed someone to help them withhe their baggage. The other side of that, this is a fairly loved positions i formber reading in the buck instant everybody talks about making 300 a month where on average people might have made 32 a month. One o area stratford at the taxi and turns, yes. The roots were all there it represented with sugar hill representative to harlem. When it started out it was a dozen white workers and they spoke german, spanish, danish. They were very concerned about travelers it was very noble but it was also interesting because in all of the advertisements they reminded that public that they are all on staff. Its just something we do. This was really controversial at the end of the 19th century. A lot of people thoughteo it was repulsive. By switching to allblack i think the culture is represented gallantry like the knight in shining armor who dont tip the night but i think that kind of result the incident in 1905. They were still fairly fresh so they were not always making a lot of money. You had to hustle and turn on the charm. One of the superintendence was outraged that sounded like from the account he wasnt so outraged that they were taking tips, but they were so successful at it so the battle notes he was able to save 300 or 400 a month. Its like why did you do that. It was very likely more than that but the supervisor was making. So, we are situated right now at lenox avenue and two names youve already mentioned, Leslie William and can you tell us a little bit about each of those men and also their relationship to chief williams . The assistant chief attendant under James Williams and in 1909, he started studying for the exam to become a police officer, which he succeeded in doing in 1911 and he became the First Black Police officer. So he was a red cap while he was doing this and obviously this was groundbreaking. He was also something of a mentor. Williams were very close, they were brothers in the Manhattan Lodge number 45 which was the first socalled colored oaks in manhattan and that they were often in charge of helping to organize a lot of big function for the clubs like booking the acts and collecting the fine but have you. So, by the time that i get seven or eight years have passed and there is another black firemen from queens and manhattan doesnt have one and at the time looks really right for this. And Wesley Williams, chief william son who is coming of age now, and hes a superman and there is a picture i have in the boobuck and you can see that hes stunning. I dont renumber the phrase, but he was one of those people you wonder why he didnt get snatched up by hollywood or Something Like that. He did an exhibition weightlifting, and allaround athletes like paul robeson was into this discussion was taking place. He was kind of an obvious choi choice. He was the perfect example, the perfect one to get it. It wasnt without some pushback though because hes black and this is where a lot of his own influence and personal friends are able to say you know, my son is a candidate, you know, can you write a letter . And others like that. So 1919, 100 years ago Wesley Williams becomes manhattans first, so in any profile or often any mention of chief williams, he gets mentioned alongside not only so many of the students that have come through the system, but particularly the two most famous black Civil Servants in new york, samba or jesse battle as he was bestknown, and hi best n son, Wesley William because they were almost always mentioned in the same breath if they are talking to chief williams have any link. He actually kind of supersedes him at some point in being chief williams and knowing chief williams. Is not only the first black mafiremen coming into the Fire Department is very slow in integrating as opposed to the Police Department which did a little better. But he also becomes in 1927 the first black fire b lieutenant ad in 33, the first black fire captain and 38 the First Battalion chief, first black battalion fire chief. He had been the only one for a very long time. And by 1938, obviously his dad is getting along and hes got fame of his own. Its about this time hes starting to eclipse. Hes always spoken of as his fathers son and then after around 38, more often than not, he is being referred to as the father of the other chief. Its kind of perfect. Thats what you are working towards i think. So, i come from a family of trained people. I was a traveler, my father was a pullman porter. He passed when i was about 7yearsold, but i know what it means to know a Family Member in that kind of way. My father worked for the leilroad, some of my aunts and uncles worked for the railroad, there was a point in time you could write a real road for free because they lived for amtrak and then you write for discounts and then as a college student, you are like do i want to spend this money, does this make sense, and it didnt make sense at that particular time, but one of the tips that my grandmother and m my aunt would often tell , and my uncles and my father would be when you get to the station, find a cab because red ycats do what times the trains were, the date they were leaving off and they could take you to the tracks must sooner cant take you on the train with no fuss before anybody else could get throughre the gates, so it s a wonderful thing. Even up until, and im not sure now because i dont travel by train as much, but at least up until early 2000, thats where it was at. That is my job in the station, no matter what station. That is part of the Job Description they were often described as walking encyclopedias. And it was part of the original Job Description with the caveat that they were only supposed to assist and not be laden with all of your burdens. That didnt last very long as it wasnt. Find tuckered out and have all this stuff into somebody looks like they might be able to take that, you are getting at. Et but the difference was it was expected also and it was part of what kind of knew you needed to do to ykn kind of make the travr feel it was worth their while that you were a lifesaver, so you not only knew everything, like you know, how to get to the ballpark or what hotels were in town or where they could freshen uplp or whatever, but you had to carry bags. Individual culture of american travel, and you see they are depicted they almost always seem to be carrying golf clubs. I dont know that much about golf or if there was a particular time, but everyone, men and women. I know my father had golf clubs in m the house. They are heavy and not with all of the reasons and t everything else. So this was not an easy job but aside from all that you would expect them to have information and be able to ask people and make suggestions but it was also because of one of his strategies of hiring particularly Young College men. This made them very useful to organizations like the naacp because these were you had interesting graphics, disseminated information, there was one particular moment in silent protest parade of 1917 which followed the riots in east st. Louis. Again, another spot in american history. There were silent protest parade down fifth avenue and one of the accounts is that when they go to 42nd street, there were explaining to passersby what was going on. And it intrigued me because they wouldnt have likely been off the premises without having direct permission. Obviously have been one of those things that he couldnt talk about that people ask questions like whats going on outside. So, pretty good reason to believe the fact that it was mentioned by one of the prominent writers of the time, lester that this was a strategy to keep them involved. And this particular launch they were contributors to the site and protest parade the fundraising committee. A lot of students came to new york for this particular purpose as well and being students, you know, they were very likely to need jobs while they were going to school here, so this is where they wouldoo go. There is a transient nature i think about that particular time. I know for me when i used to ride the train i didnt necessarily have any bags that i needed to find one and we have struck up conversations that i learned interesting stories about. I would love for you to tell us about the more interesting rople that have come through and then also talk about all of the organizations that the chief form in i think response to the transient nature of many of these red caps. You might have only been there for a period of time. Maybe a summer or you are there as a student, but you were able to create communities that they could want to take care of each other during the time with one another. One of the interesting things was on the next block, the crossroads of Seventh Avenue and the boulevard at 134th street, 135th street was known as the campus because the ymca is there so a lot of people who are new to the city stayed there. He also launched a lot of Young College folk. In ywca was a few blocks up. So, young men and young women would converge absolve him of problems of the world hanging out on the streets as young people tend to do. Many off them came and hung out specifically not just to attack and meet up and socialize it so that they could be visible for people like william to say are you looking for work so they could be seen because they had to pay their costs and thats where you would go so the campus was a virtual place but it was an interesting kind of nickname for the 20th. Some of the things im not sure exactly when you say some of the organizations that we started for them there was baseball americas favorite pastime, baseball, everybody plays it, blackandwhite unlike. Its another way to get people together to rally people, not just to entertain yourself, of course it is entertaining, but you are representing so he organizes the team to Grand Central terminal. Hes there at the critical time of the formation of the league. He does this interesting thing where he plucks a lot of the star players from the famous brooklyn team, the brooklyn royals another team and the owner of the team, backstrom, is one of the most powerful men in baseball and he runs, and forgetting the name of the organization, public baseball. He is a hotshot and williams does this interesting things where he gets the players to kind of jump ship and play for the red caps. So, there are a lot of people that are accused of not giving blacgettingblack managers a squn the game but he is making a lot of money off the talent. Williams takes it to the newspapers and there is a back and forth between williams and backstrom response, but he said something to the affect that, you know, if he can offer these people a job, but that is actually kind of critical because that i isnt what he was offering. Baseball had a season and when heu become what he ha co what ht somebody to play and still be a good team because they have all been playing together. He makes the team, many of whom are off to war and some havent come back, but he can offer them a perk which is employment which backstrom could do and things like that are what kind of felt solidified williams reputation for. He keeps the game solved. Its baseball still, but theyve got this other thing when the season is over they still got work. He stops playing baseball eventually and he is a big star in the team. There is a poet who published poems and even after he goes over to the manhattan side, he stopsng playing baseball but is still broadcasting for a while and is actually living in Williams House for a while and then when he moves to the dunbar house, williams is one of the first to move on to the row in harlem when it opens up. And then he moves just across the street. So, organizations like that, i imagined the orchestra and the benevolent society. And there were two quartets, but the initial one is made Grand Central even before the tree at Rockefeller Center became sort of manifested at the point at holiday time. People would go to Grand Central to hear the red caps singing on the balcony, Christmas Carols and spirituals consulate was really embedded in the holiday tradition. So hes always sort of had his hand in organizing these things that kept him around the ring, keeping it sort of worthwhile which i think is something that the universal sentiment any of us would have been to any schools, junior school, high school, there was a Baseball Team, there was a track team, there is a glee club, whatever and sometimes when you really hated school, these were the things. He did those things and really i think this is why the other thing was because a lot of the students i a lot of them didnt finish school, it wasnt unusual to see an article that said phd carries her bags and it was that one out of every three red caps have college training, which wasnt the case for other departments. Williams was very proud of this that they had more collegeeducated, seeing more people in college of their department odepartment, the redp department and any other department in Grand Central. Also, his efforts in the war for the campaign certainly during the great First World War were notable and there were articles written about how chief williams had gone over the top in what he was able to fund raise. So, it wasnt always constant. There were not always solid phase, sometimes youre really scraping why but i think that because of the morale he was able to instill in a lot of thee men when the cause seemed really righteous, they made it work. And this was true. They were acknowledged by the end of the naacp, selling raffle tickets or whatever, so for this reason the orchestra dot walter white when he was in naacp promoting the orchestra, writing to the famous mexican artist during the harlem renaissance and is inviting him to be ballroom. He says you have to come here to the Grand Central station red c caps. They will play the blues like youve never heard it before. Hes gushing. So, those kind of things, the way that he was able to sort of in so this good row was he was a booster and a lot of these young men didnt finish college and a lot of them are taking social work courses and became leaders who would eventually when they move to the next stage inspired by the pullman porters organizing union by around 1937 to 1941 when the convention is in new york some of those leaders are former red caps. He wrote a letter to the conference. It was a natural progression that i think williams really is getting along at this time and it was stylistically different from the organization that he was used to when he started out, but it was all a part of the same effort into same struggle in the same result. And there are many figures that fit prominently in the book like the agent who helped to sweeten the deal to help black people to move from those areas so maybe we will save that for those of you get the book but to talk about his politics the interest or non interest around with that activism because earlier in the century you had the club does not a union but a way to bring together fellow musicians and to make sure theyre not getting short shifted at the jobs they were hired for as a musician but then when they get there they are expected to be Service Waiters and that sort of thing. He doesnt have the loudest voice. And its not really clear of his position other than by inference. There are those like moments i come across in research he is critiqued but its very slight. And they almost feel as if its for show. And managers are concerned we have this that they must be sympathizing with them to pacify them. Of any of those critiques of the system of that grunt work they are never personal against williams. And my sense of that if science is really a strategy it appears to be an insider but to do the right things and has an important and delicate position that everybody who is the strongest voice in the union effort appreciates that he can get an audience to a certain degree. Maybe not talk to her directly but to get on her radar to shift what is happening and is a support so it remains unclear precisely and by the same token what he was doing earlier on he was organizing the red caps before the pullman porters organized as a union. That this kind of organization so lets own this and put a stamp on it. And by the time the red caps have the trade union he is in a different place. So its not really clear exactly what his position is but i dont get the impression that it is against it and i get the sense of even protection because especially since a lot of them were red caps themselves so they know what he was about. Bill brown who was a journalist and an athlete is a key figure in said if not for people like williams who is proud of their ways and then to come to the next level. And my own sense is that and then he was on his feet all this time is 60. And what he has been doing because the activists they are not monolithic. And the blacks to move up the harlem of the great wave of black migration. So i get the feeling like if you do this i will do this. So with that clear definitive action my hunch and conjecture is he was very proud of where the red caps were going by this time. Does anybody have any questions quick. I am doing research on a subject who is known but not well known. I actually do have access to an archive and i remember they needed to have an archive on this gentleman to work with. So how long does it take with that initial discovery to finish the book quick. The newspaper database and is charles here cracks and it is a repository much of the visual matter its not and archive with the stamp of the shellenberger but it was invaluable to look through that and then matching up with the municipal archives and newspaper articles and those of which had fallen into his lap and the steward that i could say this picture here is an article. She was on the beach and this is who shesac with. So those are not formally archives the way that we think about it the other question is how long did it take quick with my feeling of chief williams in 2013 and six years ago in the Municipal Art Society had the contract for the centennial. But i knew there was a relationship between africanamericans in the railroad. At that time i thought it was the same thing just interchangeable. And quickly i realized because it was Grand Central whatever happened there was being copied. His being the first black red cap that quickly caught on all over the place so i wrote an article and set i met somebody new and interesting and put it away then two years later i applied for a fellowship for people working on biographies so altogether it was five or six years but the better part of five years. It was an urban legend that is repeated without any direct retribution that the first red cap and what was repeated on labor day of 1890 a young man by the name ofby James William to get the attention of the crowd and then to never really push that and to say thats say. They and we have the benefit of havingso access with the internet we have faster access to newspapers so it is well documented the general passenger agent for Grand Central established march 1st 1895 for the white to red caps to do these jobs and by his own account started to replace a man named walsh. It is an interesting story so it wasnt a big surprise but one of the things that you could see how useful a story was in terms of building up morale for the community. So just the variety of things that people were doing when it came through the system of William T Davis who was an endurance motorcycle rider and he tries to break some records and in 1929 he takes off down the block to go around the world on a motorcycle. And one of the Sports Editors and is doing travel writing and goes to japan and russia and africa and comes back the following year. I think this is so inspirational how many of you have been around the world cracks. [laughter] it is impressive. So those kinds of things were surprising. Mainly because there are things that people are not doing so much today but they are doing then it with those prohibitions to have that sense we know what the prohibitions are and the obstacles i have a map im going there. The other way around we are not thinking of people at thatay time to have those inventions i love that particular set of recommend i highly it a large percentage of the red cap do you know have a College Degree if they were from the hbcus colleges down south crack cracks. They were dead hang out at the campus from the south and then the First Encounter with the blacks going to colleges in f the north might going to princeton or wilson was at nyu. So yes they were from there but not all. It was known as a place to go to get the hiatus. And those that came out with degrees but certainly there was a high instance of doctors, particularly dentists there was a lot of reasons as opposed to other medical doctors in places where they could not get in a lot of clergy and educators w and judges that one article was titled phd carries her bags and the writer and the chief gave the staff. What was the relationship between william and a Philip Randolph quick. There was no direct relationship because the organization they were doing was different im sure they knew each other and there were instances in social settings together. But there certainly wasnt that tacit working relationship and they say that very likely given the nature that they might have had conversations like can you take care of this my then are on it so i dont know the relationship formally. Thank you. Im glad and when i did the two of Grand Central. And my curiosity of the red pscaps in the first that was plagued by the terminal or with the company. And that incident i mentioned in 19 oh five was the culmination they were not getting any money. But that is what came down that was the penalty. It depends on the times and the economics it seems like in the twenties when everyone seem to have money and tell the stock market crash and then it crashes for everybody. He interestingly enough, that was one of the surprises because and in some ways it doesnt seem to skipnd a beat so while some may tighten their belts on the other hand other things go on as normal because travelers tighten their belts as well. Also later on one of the things that helps to start organizing is that they start to losese their tips and it was per bag and now people feel this is unfair because they were ready to give more so it becomes a be controversy. So people are starting to travel later and passengers are finding their own way and their own strategies and not to be encumbered for baggage is as they are travelingls later. It is timely because it is less fashionable the advent of superhighways and increased airplane travel and people driving where they want to go as opposed to taking trains. We have time for one more question. Thank you so much for doing orthis book. I learned additional things i did not know about my greatgrandfather. Led the author in the Baseball Team i did not know about. To recognize the photos butt then again there is a lot more that i dont know but i appreciate you doing all that you do to gather those things together for thiser great book. Thank you. [applause] thank you for joining us for this conversation in the audience for the same thing. There are quite a few Family Members here so raise your hand and lifted the lights a little bit so we can see the Family Members in the audience. You are Unsung Heroes we are so appreciative of the stories we hope to continue to on earth as a peoples archives here we will sign books. Convictions have a history is that to start off as identities centered values but passing opinion that Climate Change is not a real thing. That can start as an opinion to be hardened into conviction something that becomes reflective of that persons identity and one set become part of that identity its hard to change it because to change it, it, to change your mind is to change your mind about yourself. And therefore its not surprising and they will go to Great Lengths for evidence and logic to defend themselves against what they see as a threat. I am honored to introduce our author the center for middle east studies this is a nonfiction thriller of a todaynary tale of combining realworld policy experience that is fci