Transcripts For BLOOMBERG Bloomberg Technology 20171009

Again. The california democrat taking to social media to say she is running for a fifth full term. Global news 24 hours a day, pourd by more than 2,700 journalists and analysts in more than 120 countries. This is bloomberg. Corey this is Bloomberg Technology. Coming up, russias google connection and googles russia connection. The Big Tech Company saying they took money from the kremlins hackers. Well discuss googles role in fake news. Plus, tech and taxes. Apple c. E. O. Meets with french p. M. In paris as they waive sweeping overhauls of digital platforms across europe. And a wide ranging interview with the former microsoft c. E. O. Steve ballmer. His thoughts on twitter, trump, immigration and his enduring legacy. But first, to our lead russia linked accounts used google to influence the 2016 u. S. President ial election. Google investigators found that nearly 5,000 dollars, theyre also investigating another 53,000 in ads spending coming from russia at large. First reported in the Washington Post and the new york times. The admission is new. Google previously said it couldnt find any evidence of russian interference. But data from twitter proved the arlier contention was wrong. What are they telling us thats you . Theyre not telling us anything which is frustrating. Theyre still beginning their probe. But we know that theyve used google properties. It sounds like they found, as you said, on there 5,000 worth of ads. Were not sure if they ran on youtube, g mail search. Google right now the problem is focused on facebook but google has a much bigger Sprawling Network of advertising. Theres a bunch of different channels that russian actors could use. Cory we talked about this on Bloomberg Radio a little while ago. People who wanted a preview of this conversation could have been listening to Bloomberg Radio in the last hour. But one of the interesting things is they have all kind of systems suppose lid involved to make sure that, say, their customers pay them. Or to understand that the content gets there on time or gets delivered in a proper way. It looks like they didnt have any system either to vet the stuff before it went out, or even afterwards. Weve been talking about russian interference in this election for more than a year now. Google just coming with this information. Yeah. I think part of the issue is drawing a line. We felt this morning they were saying theres a poll bucket, 53,000 wort of worth of ads. These are either trolls or spreading misinformation or lies o. This is just russian accounts hat were spending on. Cory the notion otherwise is that some of it could be legitimate ads. Not fake news. Yeah. I think so. I think thats where theres probably behind the scenes, both in the board room and negotiating with congress, where the line is drawn here. Cory it might be drawn at disclosure, right . Advertising everywhere, whether on print or the airwaves or all have to say where the money comes from for a political ad. Right. That seems to be the direction were moving. Congress is putting more pressure, facebook and google have been resisting this for a long time. Political spending is pretty big on the platforms and its growing. This election was a really good case point for that. Cory we talked to a congressman last week who has seen what the facebook ads were. Facebook wont share that with us. Theyve seen at that time least. Check this out. When you talk about the issues of race, the divisive points in our country, the issue of immigration and migration. And how the American Public was reacting to that. Just remind yourself how candidate trump used those issues to heat up the American Public and clearly the russians exploited that at the same time. Cory so the idea that this is the stuff that was about it was the racist ads, at least on face boorks racist ads, perhaps antisemitic ads. Certainly antiimmigrant things. The very things that were stirring up voters in some places to vote for President Trump. Right. I think with google, its interesting, a lot of these websites that had a big presence on face boork, one of the reasons on facebook, one of the ways theyre making money is on ads. A lot of the fake news sites probably had banner ads that were run by google. But both google and facebook are in weird position where theyve been telling people, we have amazing tools for targeting reaching your consumers and now theyre going to step back and say, well, maybe these werent as effective and certainly not these werent the deciding factor in the election. Cory this is also its interesting that it was so the russians, the bad actors in russia were so on top of the latest trends in advertising. I can look at the role that google and facebook have in a Global Advertising market. What you see is, number one, that that number is growing. You can see these pies are getting bigger. Bars actually. The columns are getting bigger which is to suggest more money. But also in terms of percentage of revenue. This is a percentage of revenue for google in the advertising market. Much bigger than facebook. A growing percentage of revenue in the Global Advertising market which shows that the Russian Hackers were on top of the most effective ways to reach people in modern society. Russia got it even if u. S. Regulators didnt. Yeah. I think daily beat had a fascinating story, they claimed their video bloggers on youtube, that Russian Networks had paid. Thats where these are, as youtube is all usergenerated content, they might not be even running ads. Certainly isnt something that google made them be aware of. That would be an instance of organic reach. This is not necessarily paid ads but these are using youtube. The worlds biggest video platform to spread lies and propaganda. Cory thats the u. S. Who knows whats going on in other elections all around the world. Emily chang sat down with Steve Ballmer, Los Angeles Clippers owner, of course, for a wide ranging interview in seattle. Ballmers home. Ballmer confirmed he still has a big chunk of twitter but he thinks the company could be oing more. Theyre drivinging forward. More, better faster is always good. Id love to see more, better, faster. More, better of what . More better products, more better revenue, more better earnings, cost structure, you name it. Thats not a specific criticism. Its just a general view that things need to move even faster. Cory full disclosure, bloomberg l. P. In partnership with twitter to produce a global breaking news video network. Were putting that together right now. Later were going to show a lot more of that interview. Plus Steve Ballmers thoughts on President Trump, immigration and his legacy at microsoft. Coming up, more of Bloomberg Technologys d coverage in seattle this week. Talking to politicians, business leaders, all about the tech industry. Transforming the emerald city. Cory all this week Bloomberg Technology broadcasting from seattle. Amazon, microsoft and v. M. Ware, its a hub for technology and innovation. Outside of those tech giants, also a home to a growing number of startups that could lead the way with a. I. And Cloud Computing. Always a pleasure to see you. Look at you with the bloomberg monitors behind you. Weve been talking about this for a long time. About what makes seattle such a tech hub and i wonder, we mentioned those great big companies. Surely microsoft in the historyry of microsoft in that city, you have to start there. You have to start with microsoft. Theyve been a huge driver of the Software Ecosystem and now the cloud ecosystem. As you say, two of the top five market Cap Companies in the world are the Tech Companies in amazon and microsoft. Just a plethora of startups and theres thousands and thousands of folks working to get Companies Like google and facebook up here. So we really have it covered in terms of diversity of perspectives in the tech industry. Cory i guess we leave out facebook and other companies that have very a large presence up there. Google included that have hired so many people and have such big operations there. Tell me, is it trying to chase after all those great engineers who might be falling off of all those other places or have gone to seattle for opportunities at amazon and microsoft, but find themselves, oh, wow, facebooks here, googles here, theres opportunity . Let me give you an example. Theres a great team that was up here for google that invented this technology called which manages containers. That team is up here from google. They decided to leave and build a business around that and we funded it, along with our friends. These are the kind of things that happen. Or a company like a smart sheet which has a deep ecosystem rely on the cloud partners both at microsoft and amazon in building up a business now thats well over 100 million and rapidly growing. So thats what we like to see. Theres talent that comes and goes from this Different Companies and oftentimes they get inspired to start from scratch and build something new. Cory is there any kind of industry area we might want to say that seattles known for . I would venture cloud is a certain thing up there, with Amazon Web Services and v. M. I think hands down were the Cloud Capital of the world. I was visiting with a group of executives from a company today and we have alibaba offices and other companies trying to understand whats next cloud. We believe thats serverless technologies and microservices architectures. But i think whats overlooked sometimes is just how big areas like Machine Learning and Artificial Intelligence are up here. With paul allens Artificial Intelligence institute, university of washingtons school of Artificial Intelligence. Theyre doing great things as well. And then finally, what about all the ways we interface with computing . Think about alexa with voice or mixed reality in some of the areas that microsofts involved with. So we have the full stack here. Some of the leading edge things that are going on in next generation computing. Cory i would be amiss if i didnt mention the role of udub which you just did. Not just because theyre 60 and number five in the country right now. Much to the pain of my heart. T i think nationally maybe u. W. s role, university of washingtons role, is overlooked in the role sort of driving this what is the university of washington so good at when it comes to teching to . One area is this area of Machine Learning and Artificial Intelligence. They recruited an incredible professor five years ago from carnegie melon and he became the amazon professor of Machine Learning. We promptly started a company with some of his team and built that company which was called dato into one of the leading players in Machine Learning as a service. That company was then bought by apple and apples now building a bigger and bigger presence up here in seattle. So i think Machine Learning and a. I. Professors over there at the university of washington probably one of the most interesting examples now is a Company Called xnor that a professor has founded. Thats all about Machine Learning and Artificial Intelligence at the edge. So the Edge Computing side versus the Cloud Computing side. Some of the things that are starting to happen at the internet of things kind of area related to deep learning. Cory so when we talk about all these places that want to start, what looks like Silicon Valley, where chicago or phoenix or austin or grand rapids or you name it, another thing that seattle has going for it, you have your very strong university focus and technical skills. You have your established Technology Innovators that are throwing off people made a lot of money and want to try again. But you have a very active Venture Capital community. You can pat yourself on shoulder right now but madrona has been there from the start. You were one of the early backers of amazon. Whats the venture scene like in seattle and how is it different than Silicon Valley . Our focus is going all the way back to the First Investors in amazon back in 1995, focus on day one opportunities and day one founders. Get involved at a very early stage. I mentioned carlos and some other examples. So thereby at day one but be there for the long term and be there focused on the specific northwest. We think there are a bunch of great Capital Venture firms. We just focused on Early Stage Companies in the northwest. We also really work well with those other firms and theres a growing interest once again. There was kind of a cycle in the late 1990s and now were back here 20 years later with very strong interests from Silicon Valley partners, working in conjunction with us and others. We have a vibrant angel community. Not just superangel investors but large Family Offices. Paul allen and others. Trilogy with john stanton from the wireless industry. So theres really a nice mix of folks in the kind of large Family Offices that we like to work with together as well. Cory you cant beat the state taxes. If youre an entrepreneur who thinks youre going to get rich, i remember this guy, a woman i used to work with, her husband was about to come into a bunch of money from a Wireless Company her father was selling. They moved to washington to establish residence because there wasnt going to be any state sales taxes for them but they wanted to stay involved in the technology community. It seems thats a big draw for the like of bill gates and others. I think that some of those folks very intentionally either started their company or moved their company here to washington and seattle specifically for that reason. We dont have a state income tax. Thats a massive competitive advantage over other states. And i think thats why youre seeing thousands and thousands of employees from Companies Like google and facebook that can choose to live up here to live up here. So that advantage is very important. But heres the punch line on that. Our tax revenues are up from 28 billion to 38 billion, 10 billion in the last six years. Thats because we have this proinvestment, progrowth, proopportunity community up here in seattle. And the other punch line there is, we have the lowest Unemployment Rate in the history of the city of seattle and the state of washington. So i think we have a pretty good tax system. No tax system is perfect. But ours is growing and our economys growing. I think thats going to really serve the entire Community Well for the long term. Cory couldnt agree more. I dont want to throw cold water and mention the weather in february because thats when the cold water gets thrown but i think its worth it up in seattle. Matt, always a pleasure. Always appreciate it. Hell be joining us again later in the show. So stick around. Elon musk spacex launched its 14th rocket of the year. Bringing the Company Close toirts target of missions in 2017. The falcon 9 rocket carrying 10 satellites for communications. Another rocket launch from florida next wednesday. That rocket will deliver a satellite. Coming up, apple c. E. O. Tim cook in the city of light. How he plans to combat e. U. Tax reform without first targeting big Tech Companies. This is bloomberg. Cory apple c. E. O. Met with french president macron in paris monday. The meetup comes amid calls by european nation for an aggressive overhaum of how Tech Companies are paying tax across the e. U. Joining us now, our Bloomberg Technology reporter who has agreed to talk in a funny accent for us today. Thank you. [speaking foreign language] cory im all for the french. This is an interesting drive right here. Apple is center in this. Particularly because of the deal they got in ireland. Yes. Apple very much says they didnt get a deal in ireland. But apples facing increasing heat in ireland as well to pay this tax bill which hasnt been delivered to ireland as far as we understand it. In escrow perhaps somewhere. Cory is it or not . They got criticism following the demand to pay it saying that they hadnt put it aside. Yes. They put it aside in their account somewhere but ireland hasnt received it and they were talking about putting in escrow for itself while it appealed it. That hasnt happened. We knew that early last month, four European Finance ministers, france, germany, italy and spain, they sent a letter to the European Commission proposing a system whereby big Tech Companies are tax based on revenue and not by profit. I think the argument then being that its harder to push the profit into the low tax nation, perhaps like ireland, and therefore they wouldnt be allegedly abating evading taxes so to speak. Cory is apple the canary in the coal mine here . Are they the company that will ultimately make the deal that all the rest of the companies are going to have to follow . Or is it going to be different treatments for these companies . The companies are not going to make deals with nation states or indeed with the european regulatory authorities. So its going to happen, there will be a change in the law at that level. We know the European Commission sorry, the European Parliament can be very slow moving when that stuff happens. The fact is that apple is not the only company doing this. There is of course issues with amazon and others and indeed companies outside tech. Cory and what is a fundamental issue, how have they been able to skirt these taxes and follow the law as they see it but not pay the same amount of taxes as Companies Based on the continent . Apple, whats happened historically and the whole issue of contention, bone of contention last year, was that they were paying essentially a license fee for intellectual property which was held in different geographies and that was why they said, were not actually generating any profit in this country. The profit is being generated by another unit elsewhere. That deal ended several years ago so apple is now for this year and last year, for example, paying the higher tax rate. The issue then comes that the tax rate in places like ireland, just organically, is a lot lower than it is in the u. S. So they pay 12. 5 tax in ireland. The moment they bring back murn from ireland, for instance, they have to pay that difference with the u. S. I think its 35 in the u. S. And that 22. 5 goes into u. S. Treasury coughers. Which is why the deal coffers. Which is why the deal in the white house right now is so important. Cory and where the intellectual property resides and all that stuff gets very complicated. Thats why were glad to have you explain it to us. Our own spy who came in from the coal. Did watch that. Thank you very much. Coming up, Steve Ballmer speaks out. Our interview with former c. E. O. Of microsoft. His take on tax reform, immigration and the idea of fake news next. And if you like bloomberg news, check you theous us out on radio, check me out on the radio. Listen on Bloomberg Radio app, bloomberg. Com and the u. S. And sirius x. M. Station 119. This is bloomberg. Who knew that phones would start doing everything . Entertaining us, getting us back on track, and finding us dates. Phones really have changed. So why hasnt the way we pay for them . Introducing xfinity mobile. You only pay for data and can easily switch between pay per gig and unlimited. No one else lets you do that. See how much you can save. Choose by the gig or unlimited. Xfinity mobile. A new kind of network designed to save you money. Call, visit or go to xfinitymobile. Com. Youre watching Bloomberg Technology. Lets begin with a check of first word news. British Prime Minister teresa may says the framework of her brexit plan has not changed since her speech last month in florence. May addressed britains house of commons today as a fifth round of negotiations with the e. U. Are set to get under way. As i set out in my speech in florence we want to take a cretive creative and pragmatic approach to the to securing a new, deep and special partnership with the european union, which spans both the new economic relationship and a new security relationship. European diplomats are ramping up efforts to ensure President Trumps decision to dessertify irans compliance doesnt risk scuttling the International Nuclear accord. Allies are said to be seeking out members of congress and trying to influence administration advisors. Tokyos governor says that her doubts about the Trump Administration, her party of hope is challenging abes ruling party and the general election scheduled for october 22. I am not yet sure whether the Trump Administration is stable. There are extremely dynamic personal changes in the Daily White House posts. Along with the american people, i want to look carefully to see what kind of administration this will be. Japans election is less than two weeks away and she must decide today if she will run. More than a dozen wildfires whipped by powerful winds swept through California Wine country, destroying at least 1,500 homes and businesses and forcing an estimated 20,000 people to leave the area. At least one death has been reported. This is bloomberg. Its just after 5 30 p. M. Here in new york. 8 30 thursday morning in sydney. Paul allen has a look at the markets. Good morning. Good morning. Lets start off in new zealand where tradings been under way for about 30 minutes tuesday morning. And the index off. 10 . This after we saw u. S. Stocks drift lower on pretty low volumes due to the columbus day holiday. We saw gold up a little. West texas slightly higher. Still under 50. A barrel. Here in australia, futures down. The aussie dollar little changed. After a horror retail read a week ago. Nikkei futures pretty flat at the moment. Waiting on current accounts na numbers for august out of japan. Estimated to come in at 19. 7 billion surplus. More from Bloomberg Technology next. Cory this is Bloomberg Technology. Now a look back at our top story. Tech companies are finding russianlinked accounts that interfered with the 2016 president ial election. And that worries twitter shareholder and former microsoft c. E. O. Steve ballmer. He says companies cant do more at the present moment to police the spread of fake news. Emily chang sat down with the l. A. Clippers owner in seattle. We launched our platform of data from the government, about the government. No fake news. No alternate facts. We launched on tax day. We keep adding more data and we keep the information current. But the real thing were doing now at usafacts. Org, in case somebody wants to check, is were trying to help citizens really run through topics of the day. So we have a walkthrough up there right now that will walk you through the president s budget, in the context of what has happened historically. What does g. D. P. Look like, what has tax revenue looked like . What does the deficit look like and how does all of that compare to the c. B. O. . We make no predictions. Were going to make sure people can walk through and look at these government proposals in the context of the past. Thats all thats factual. Then be able to say, does this make sense to me or not . We have a little video that goes along with it that will explain to citizens, this is kind of the set of data and the way to think about by the number, how do you think about Something Like the Budget Proposal . Reporter you say its just the facts. I know you know these facts better than almost anyone. As the lawmakers and the president talk about tax reform and health care, do you have any advice . Yeah, in a way i do. These things are holistic issues. Its sort of funny to me. We look at tax reform and the budget and we look at health care. Yet when you really look at the economics of these three things, theyre laced just like this. What does it mean to have a budget without tax reform . Its our process, im not condemning anybody. But its kind of nutty. You have to have a tax plan in order to have a bufplgt be like a company having an expanse plan without a revenue plan expense plan without a revenue plan. It doesnt make sense. One of the biggest pieces of expenses, thats health care. You dont i mean, how do these things so really understanding how these things mesh together would be a key piece of advice i would certainly give decision makers, legislators and executive branch. Reporter you mention this is an age of misinformation, of fake news. How big a problem is that . And whats the responsibility of these platforms . Facebook, google, twitter . I think this notion of people being able to sort of be fed whatevers going make them feel good, because thats what people are really doing. People want to feed whatever the instincts are. I think the goal has to be to say, this is how it looks. You can see it any way you want to. But some place you have to come and be able to take a look at stuff objectively. Im not sure you can say thats facebooks job. Theyre not in the news business. They pass along other peoples news. Same thing with google. Thats part of the issue here. Things can look authentic. We did a u. S. A. Facts poll and when surveyed people would say, i find my information most often on social media and i trust it the least. Reporter do you think facebook and google and twitter should be policing this more or thats not their job . They cant much its not in the nature of whats going on. I think over time there needs to be something thats the equivalent of authenticated user on twitter where you get the little bullet that says you really are who you say you are. I think it would be nice to have authenticated sources so that people can say, i really want to see not just what the crowd is saying, but i want to hear from some authentic sources. Reporter what if that information isnt coming from the crowd . If its coming from our own president . Is it a problem if hes the one spreading misinformation . Well, we elected the president. Our country as a whole. He is our sort of president in chief and i know theres people who have problems with that and people who are supportive of that. But at least when the president speaks, hes speaking authentically for himself. In a sense that is a set of facts. When a mainly policy Leader Speaks major policy Leader Speaks, you can say, its true, its not, you like what he says, you dont like what he says. But what hes thinking. And every voter probably benefits by having the ability to hear directly, just as we hear directly from other people. I get a chance to speak directly on the internet, lebron james gets a chance to speak directly on the internet. Not everyone want to hear what people say to one another. They dont always agree. Certainly weve seen that with lebanon and the president lebron and the president. Reporter there are some who say the president is taking it no another level. Perhaps even inciting nuclear war on twitter. Should he be kicked off twitter . Should he be allowed to make these statements on twitter . Everybody has the right to speak for themselves. That includes the president of the united states. Everybody has the right to speak for themselves. Thats kind of in the fundamental nature of this country. And i think its an important one. I think the citizens have an obligation to elect the people who i think who they think will best represent their interests. And that gets a chance to get battle tested, every two years, every four years, i love our system. Because people have to constantly prove themselves and if people are doing things that are not valued, that will come across. And if people are doing things that are valued. Now, the way our system works, it doesnt take 100 to win. It takes logically 51 , of course with the Electoral College thats not really what it is. But it takes logically 51 to win. And people have a right to hear directly in their as they go cast their ballots. Reporter you ran microsoft for many years. Youve dealt with issues like immigration. Do you have any concerns about the stance the president is taking on things like daca, for example . I think immigration is a super important thing. My dad was an immigrant. My grandparents on the other side were immigrants. I value the fact that immigrants come in to this country. I think it is hugely, hugely important. Its not something that was just important 100 years ago. It remains important. It remains important in terms of hightech workers coming into the country, it remains important in terms of people moving back and forth across our southern border. And there are complicated issues, there are issues of National Security. But there are also issues of economy and fundamental humanity. I do think its important to look at all of those things, including humanity. As we kind of address the plight of the socalled daca. Cory great stuff. That was some of our conversations with former microsoft c. E. O. Steve ballmer. Coming up, more ballmer. His thoughts on the knicks legacy and the future of Artificial Intelligence. This is bloomberg. Cory back to l. A. Clippers owner Steve Ballmer. Emily chang sat down with ballmer, former microsoft c. E. O. , of course, to ask what he thinks about the current c. E. O. , what its like to watch him take over. He recognizes the good, he recognizes the things that needed to be changed. I think hes navigated that very, very well. From my perspective, you know, we knew we needed to get into the cloud. I got that started. Hes taken it to another level and i respect the fact that hes had to do things differently. I knew things would have to be done differently in that area. Thats the reason it was a good time for a change, if you will hardwares a whole different deal. Hes pushed that along with xbox and surface and i kind of respect that needed things done differently. And over time things need to be shaken up and freshened and i had been at microsoft the whole time. It reflected my personality and bills personality. But kind of like children, things need to keep growing if you will. And we rev he will when our children revel when our children are grown up and are sort of making their own way. And i revel that hes taking microsoft to its next level. Sort of going forth in new and in different ways. Emily so Amazon Web Services still much bigger and growing faster. Do you want more, better, faster from that and the cloud . Sure, i do. Absolutely. [laughter] as an investor on our quarterly call, i say, come on, lets keep it moving. Emily are you listen into all the calls . No. Like any other large investor, do i a quarterly call with the c. F. O. And i think microsofts done a pretty phenomenal job. Particularly on the office side. But also on the azur side. But is there a lot of room for improvement . Because the Market Leader on the azur side is pretty damn big . Yeah, i do think there is. Emily what kind of improvement . You need to have even better attachment and ability to sell to startups and other development companies. Developers, developers, developers. And with azur you have to win the developers. I think microsofts getting there. But still has a lot more to do. Emily you said youre done being an investor. Is that still the case . Yeah. Im not making, quote, new investments, unquote. Emily just mutual funds and microsoft and twitter . Index funds. Keep it simple. Have everything pegged to the market. I have some bonds. I have microsoft. I have twitter. Then i have a couple small private things that i dont do much of. But i have a basketballbased investment. I have one investment with a couple friends. Thats it. Emily theres a big debate about the future of a. I. And whether its dangerous or not. Elon musk thinks robots could take over the world. They could supersede the human race. Mark zummerberg has said thats irresponsible to talk zuckerberg has said its irresponsible to talk like that. What do you think . There thats the usually, what vessence , he waser of the tech company. Lets Say Something extreme, lets tune it down. When you get down to it, is a. I. Very important . Yes. Will it improve the way people live . Yes. Do we know all of what we will accomplish today . No. But getting computers to be smarter at helping people do what they want to do every day, that part cant get bad. Im sure theres a place in time and time where we can speculate about all of the tough societal issues. Ut were years away from that. Elon musk, of course what he says in the long run could be right. But the long run could be a long, long run. Not going to happen the next 10 years or so. And of course zuckerbergs ready and prepared and, you know, sort of right to talk about that. But right now, put some of that clutter out of your mind. This Artificial Intelligence stuff will make a big difference. Emily you think its possible that the human race could become extinct . No. The human race isnt going to become extinct. But how powerful will be computers ability to reason and what will that fully mean, we dont know. But were not going to deal with that problem for 20 years. Cory that was bloombergs emily chang with clippers owner and exmicrosoft c. E. O. Steve ballmer. Now back with matt, managing director. Talk to me about steve and his role there in seattle. Obviously hes got an l. A. Team even while he lives up in seattle. Yeah. He still has a significant presence up here. I think people overlook what a great job he did on growing the top line and the profitability of microsoft and making the early bet scenarios like cloud and hardware. Im sure there were areas, acquisitions that were tough. There were other challenges. But in the aggregate cory you think . Oh, yeah, there were some. Cory nokia. Can we remember nokia . Can we talk about some of the things i mean, i think steves great and hes a great owner of the clippers too, but there were some multibillion dollar things under his leadership that went way off board. Not to mention all the problems with antitrust around microsoft windows. Well, i think advertising and mobile were areas that were real struggles in that era. But if you look at things like where he laid the groundwork and sachi leading the Cloud Business before he became c. E. O. , theyve headed in the right direction on the cloud side. They have massive advantages there. Not only do they have real established apps in office 365 and other things, but theyve got all the onpremise presence that allows you to collect this increasingly hybrid world. So i think they have a really good strategic position. I think they doubled on the things that were working and leveraged some of their strengths. But steve did a good job setting the table in a bunch of different areas. Cory what is the Lasting Impact . I mentioned the antitrust issues around explorer and microsoft windows. But i wonder if seattle what the Lasting Impact is . Particularly around Companies Like microsoft and amazon, when they start to think about those issues . I think those are interesting topics around antitrust. Its being raised in a bunch of different ways these days. I think that all of the big companies, whether its the facebook and googles down your way, or the microsofts and amazons here, need to be cognizant that as platform companies, they have to be good at creating a genuine platform that other people can succeed on. And also being successful for themselves. I think that if you look at all of that group, id probably highlight google. Lets take a recent example of google cutting off amazon echo shows from youtube. Whats up with that . I cant get access over wifi to youtube because i dont like the device its being accessed from . Theres lots of questions you can ask on that area. I dont think the companies in seattle are in as difficult a position as some of the companies down in the valley. Cory maybe because they remember the days of yore. I know you remember a lot, were grateful to have you all the time. Thank you very much. Thank you. Cory coming up, investors cant get enough of the apple iphone suppliers, giving rise to an interesting new e. T. F. Well explain next. This is bloomberg. There how did you feel losing that amount of net worth . We almost went bankrupt. Somehow i survived. Cory with the iphone 8 and iphone 10, suppliersre only growing. Theres a new apple supplier e. T. F. Bloomberg he is bloombergs north asia correspondent is in hong kong and is kind enough to join me. Thank you very much. This is fascinating because this has been an investment scene for the longest time. Whats going into the new device and certainly whats going into the next iphone . You see this all the time in taiwan with the leadup of the apple product releases in the autumn. The gyrations, the ups and the downs and theres lots of rumors of course about what apple is going to release and whether its going to be popular and weve seen already a lot of these suppliers, a dip in september, some upwards of 25 , 30 , because early iphone the 8 sales or orders were not as robust as expected. But now its going back up on anticipation for the x or the 10 coming out november 3. So there are lots of gyrations. If you look at this particular ishares, it really exemplifies the sweet spot that taiwan has in the supply chain for apple and all the suppliers. Because 49 of the 91 companies in this e. T. F. Are tied to apple. 41 of the Companies Say apple is their top customer. 18 of all the companies, the 91 companies, say apple is their top revenue source. So you can see that sweet spot. But on the other hand, you can also see why the likes of the president are trying to diversify the taiwan economy. Into biotech, into other areas. Because Companies Make up a quarter of the tie ex and they want to diversify thaix. And they want to diversify. Cory it seems like it allows investors to at least in theory lower transaction costs for acquiring that portfolio in terms of how many trades they have to put up. But secondly, figure out what the hecks in the iphone and know which companies to own. Yeah, thats right. One of the biggest hallmarks of becoming a supplier of apple is secrecy. You have to keep your secrets pretty closed and those doors closed at those suppliers. Ike pegatron, like largon. You go down the list. Quantum computer. Advanced semiconductor. So many of these companies. Again, citigroup is saying, because of those gyrations that we had in september, now coming back up, time to buy Companies Like largon, they make everything from the screen, the opotoelectronic components to of course becoming the assembler of the iphones. Cory and of course the challenge, you never know where the profits are. Some of these companies can supply a lot of stuff with almost no profit. Others mike take might be taking away millions. Absolutely. Again, we have to kind of dig into each individual stock. Catcher technology is one in particular that ive been looking at. They make the casings for the smartphones. It took a tumble like a lot of the other ones but a lot of these companies, at least the numbers, are looking pretty cheap in fact. Estimated forward p. E. Of catcher, 11 times earnings right now. Sales in september record high, 48 up. Third quarter looking like a record as well. Cory thats your bet, not mine. Ill let you go there. Thank you very much. That does it for they hadition of Bloomberg Technology. Tune in tomorrow for our coverage of the geek wire summit in seattle. Well talk to starbucks c. E. O. 1 00 back east. 10 00 a. M. On the west coast. Right here, bloomberg television. This is bloomberg. Nurle im done. Done with figuring it out for myself. Im done with surprises. Im done with complicated. If youre on medicare, and ready to be done with complicated, turn to unitedhealthcare and our Medicare Advantage plans. Like aarp medicarecomplete. These plans can combine your hospital and doctor coverage, with Prescription Drug coverage and more, all in one plan for a low, or even no, monthly premium. So call now. Lan for a low, or even no, monthly premium. So call now. We can answer your questions, even help you enroll. I deserve to get the most out of my plan. Well make sure your doctors are all connected, you know what your copays are. 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