nottinghamshire campus, laura goons and so, to the leaders rishi sunak and so, to the leaders rishi sunak and keir starmer, welcome to you both and a the polling day, let's begin straightaway with reference question and it is from sue barclay. people are dismayed by the lack of integrity— people are dismayed by the lack of integrity and — people are dismayed by the lack of integrity and honesty _ people are dismayed by the lack of integrity and honesty in _ people are dismayed by the lack of integrity and honesty in politics - integrity and honesty in politics today — integrity and honesty in politics today after_ integrity and honesty in politics today. after the _ integrity and honesty in politics today. after the recent - integrity and honesty in politics i today. after the recent allegations about— today. after the recent allegations about political— today. after the recent allegations about political betting, _ today. after the recent allegations about political betting, how- today. after the recent allegations about political betting, how would| about political betting, how would you restore — about political betting, how would you restore trust _ about political betting, how would you restore trust and _ about political betting, how would you restore trust and politics? - you restore trust and politics? thank — you restore trust and politics? thank you _ you restore trust and politics? thank you for— you restore trust and politics? thank you for taking _ you restore trust and politics? thank you for taking us - you restore trust and politics? thank you for taking us off- you restore trust and politics? | thank you for taking us off and you restore trust and politics? - thank you for taking us off and both of your parties against allegations in this regard we know five conservatives are being investigated in one labour. rishi sunak. i completely share your anger and houses frustrated as you were when they heard of these allegations. and we initiated our own internal inquiries into what it happened we have suspended two candidates and i've been crystal clear, anyone who has broken the law broken the rules should not only face the full consequences of the law, i'm sure that their booted out of the conservative party. the that their booted out of the conservative party. that their booted out of the conservative pa . , ., , conservative party. the question is on a lot of peoples _ conservative party. the question is on a lot of peoples minds. - conservative party. the question is on a lot of peoples minds. respectj on a lot of peoples minds. respect and integrity in politics you have to lead — and integrity in politics you have to lead from the fraud on dishes like this— to lead from the fraud on dishes like this deck of the last 14 years, politics— like this deck of the last 14 years, politics has— like this deck of the last 14 years, politics has become too much about self entitlement and about what they can do— self entitlement and about what they can do for— self entitlement and about what they can do for themselves and their report— can do for themselves and their report of— can do for themselves and their report of choices and things that i would _ report of choices and things that i would like — report of choices and things that i would like to do if i'm elected prime — would like to do if i'm elected prime minister is to reset politics reset— prime minister is to reset politics reset politics and politics returns to public— reset politics and politics returns to public service. relation to these gambling _ to public service. relation to these gambling allegations, the instinct of these _ gambling allegations, the instinct of these people to think the first thing _ of these people to think the first thing they should do is try to make money— thing they should do is try to make money was — thing they should do is try to make money was the wrong instinct and we have to _ money was the wrong instinct and we have to change that and it's also a question— have to change that and it's also a question of— have to change that and it's also a question of leadership because this is not _ question of leadership because this is notjust_ question of leadership because this is notjust what is happened this week— is notjust what is happened this week trut— is notjust what is happened this week but last week in the gambling commission, party gate earlier in this parliament, the prime minister himsetf— this parliament, the prime minister himself was convicted and fined for breaking _ himself was convicted and fined for breaking the rules when she brought in and _ breaking the rules when she brought in and imposed on everybody else we have seen— in and imposed on everybody else we have seen what happened with the covid-i9 _ have seen what happened with the covid—19 contracts. huge amounts of ntoney_ covid—19 contracts. huge amounts of money made in the sticks leadership. but nty— money made in the sticks leadership. but my team was alleged to have been involved _ but my team was alleged to have been involved in— but my team was alleged to have been involved in investigated by the gambling commission, they were suspended within minutes because i knew it _ suspended within minutes because i knew it was important to be swift and the _ knew it was important to be swift and the prime minister delayed and delayed _ and the prime minister delayed and delayed until eventually, it was... let me _ delayed until eventually, it was... let me get— delayed until eventually, it was... let me get a response to those accusations. it let me get a response to those accusations.— let me get a response to those accusations.- it _ let me get a response to those accusations.- it was - let me get a response to those accusations. it was it was important accusations. it was it was important to me that it _ accusations. it was it was important to me that it was _ accusations. it was it was important to me that it was dealt _ accusations. it was it was important to me that it was dealt with - to me that it was dealt with properly and that's what i've done. we have an internal inquiry into what happened and is suspended the candidates involved and i've been crystal clear that they should face the full consequences of the law. talking about leadership in politics, i think leadership means being straight with people and a means having the courage of your convictions, not changing your mind and every single position you have and every single position you have and being upfront about what you want to do for the country. that is not which keir starmer is doing it is not been honest with people about his plans to raise the taxes and that. ,, . ~' ., his plans to raise the taxes and that. ,, a ., , ., that. sticking to the question, the recent allegations _ that. sticking to the question, the recent allegations of _ that. sticking to the question, the recent allegations of political - recent allegations of political betting and not how you would restore trust in politics, if you acted now to withdraw support from those two conservative candidates, what you find in the investigation? it's an independent investigation which is ongoing and i cannot say anything further about that when we found things that were not appropriate, i took action and suspended the candidates not been crystal clear, i was curious to hear about these things and that is why dealt with it. but this is about leadership, integrity and politics and it's about doing what you say. and keir starmer is made this broader point but he has changed his mind on every major position is taken as that have the courage of his convictions and stopping straight with them but he now about his plans if he wins powers to raise peoples taxes, that's not going to do anything to restore trust in politics that is the choice of everyone in this politics goal campaign. his tax rises which has not been straight with everyone about. ., ,., .., ., ., about. the labour candidate from whom you _ about. the labour candidate from whom you withdrawn _ about. the labour candidate from whom you withdrawn support - about. the labour candidate from - whom you withdrawn support appears to have bedded on losing his own election. the north and the other candidates place business campaign? he was investigated by the commission due to betting on to lose and as— commission due to betting on to lose and as soon— commission due to betting on to lose and as soon as the investigating committee said that, i suspended him and i've _ committee said that, i suspended him and i've made very clear to my candidates _ and i've made very clear to my candidates that i expect high standards in politics and i said last week— standards in politics and i said last week that the prime minister shoutd've — last week that the prime minister should've decisive action and i said last week, — should've decisive action and i said last week, should one of my candidates be investigated by the committee, that they would be suspended in the feed would not leave _ suspended in the feed would not leave the — suspended in the feed would not leave the floor that is what i did and might— leave the floor that is what i did and might candidates know that i expect— and might candidates know that i expect high standards and take decisive — expect high standards and take decisive actions if they fall below the standards. i'm absolutely determined to return politics to public _ determined to return politics to public service.— determined to return politics to public service. none of your other candidates _ public service. none of your other candidates at _ public service. none of your other candidates at placed _ public service. none of your other candidates at placed bets? - public service. none of your other candidates at placed bets? is - public service. none of your other i candidates at placed bets? is seeing what my standards _ candidates at placed bets? is seeing what my standards are _ candidates at placed bets? is seeing what my standards are by _ candidates at placed bets? is seeing what my standards are by my - candidates at placed bets? is seeing i what my standards are by my actions, the consequences of the fall short of those _ the consequences of the fall short of those by the falls by the process of those by the falls by the process of going _ of those by the falls by the process of going to action last week or the week— of going to action last week or the week before we eventually got around to it when _ week before we eventually got around to it when being bullied by the people — to it when being bullied by the people into doing it, that's not leadership and he talks about integrity, i'm sorry but when you -et integrity, i'm sorry but when you get convicted for breaking covid—19 rules— get convicted for breaking covid—19 rules which you imposed on the rest of the _ rules which you imposed on the rest of the country, you really should not be _ of the country, you really should not be talking about integrity and politics — not be talking about integrity and olitics. . , , not be talking about integrity and olitics. ., , , ., , , politics. leadership means being straiaht politics. leadership means being straight with _ politics. leadership means being straight with people _ politics. leadership means being straight with people on - politics. leadership means being straight with people on what - politics. leadership means being straight with people on what you | straight with people on what you plan to do that set up my plans clearly and i appreciate that not everyone is going to agree with me on everything but at least you know where i stand and keir starmer is not being straight with you about his plans to raise your taxes i don't think that's leadership and i don't think that's leadership and i don't think that people should surrender theirfamily finances don't think that people should surrender their family finances to the labour party that is the choice for people at this election. taste the labour party that is the choice for people at this election. we have set out in our _ for people at this election. we have set out in our manifesto _ for people at this election. we have set out in our manifesto and - for people at this election. we have set out in our manifesto and plans i set out in our manifesto and plans their— set out in our manifesto and plans their futty— set out in our manifesto and plans their fully funded and costed and we have set— their fully funded and costed and we have set out that will not be increasing income tax, national insurance — increasing income tax, national insurance or vat for the prime minister— insurance or vat for the prime minister is _ insurance or vat for the prime minister is doing, yes manifesto that his — minister is doing, yes manifesto that his promises to you and everyone _ that his promises to you and everyone watching which are unfounded because his chancellor said that — unfounded because his chancellor said that the money he is relying on its already— said that the money he is relying on its already been spent and that is the mistake that cost so many people so much _ the mistake that cost so many people so much across this country we're going _ so much across this country we're going to _ so much across this country we're going to repeat unfunded commitments and tots _ going to repeat unfunded commitments and tots of— going to repeat unfunded commitments and lots of promises but where's the money— and lots of promises but where's the money coming from and the chancellor himself— money coming from and the chancellor himself is— money coming from and the chancellor himself is said that the money was spent _ himself is said that the money was spent tast— himself is said that the money was spent last year and is not available five more — spent last year and is not available five more years of this, we will have _ five more years of this, we will have the — five more years of this, we will have the same results we have now and the _ have the same results we have now and the cost — have the same results we have now and the cost of living crisis bearing _ and the cost of living crisis bearing down on people across this country— bearing down on people across this country really struggling because the economy is broken and this is the economy is broken and this is the chance — the economy is broken and this is the chance of this election to turn the chance of this election to turn the page — the chance of this election to turn the page and start to rebuild our country— the page and start to rebuild our country with the stable economy. asking _ country with the stable economy. asking his — country with the stable economy. asking his opposite number to rule out raising all your taxes and they've already announced in the first budget the shadow chancellor was not able to do that, that's all the chancellor to today be you don't have to listen to me, just go online, go to the telegraph website because it is not a recording that they put out there from the deputy chancellor of the labour party admitting that their plans will cost hundreds of billions of pounds. that is going to cost all of you thousands of pounds of tax rises and thatis thousands of pounds of tax rises and that is why say keir starmer in the labour party in a big with you and do not surrender to the tax rises. the shadow chief secretary team who in the recording given to the daily telegraph and said the carbonised in the british economy will cost hundreds of billions of pounds. taste hundreds of billions of pounds. we want to do to go to renewable energy and how— want to do to go to renewable energy and how much that will cost, exactly how much _ and how much that will cost, exactly how much will be put in we have a column— how much will be put in we have a column sing — how much will be put in we have a column sing that's going to be funded — column sing that's going to be funded. yes, it is absolutely right that we _ funded. yes, it is absolutely right that we want to get investors to come _ that we want to get investors to come alongside that government money into gtobat— come alongside that government money into global investors for the best part of— into global investors for the best part of two years to say that if you put down — part of two years to say that if you put down this money, will you come atongside _ put down this money, will you come atongside it — put down this money, will you come alongside it and put down many more bittions _ alongside it and put down many more billions of— alongside it and put down many more billions of pounds so in partnership to the _ billions of pounds so in partnership to the government, we can make the change _ to the government, we can make the change that— to the government, we can make the change that we need. let me just finish _ change that we need. let me just finish this — crosstalk ido want i do want to turn to the next question because lots of people are waiting and they would like to have answers. we're in a noises, there taking place outside which is also aspect of our democracy people exercising their freedom of speech. adverted to jobs since i was 18 960 into many— adverted to jobs since i was 18 960 into many people _ adverted to jobs since i was 18 960 into many people don't _ adverted to jobs since i was 18 960 into many people don't understand| into many people don't understand how important _ into many people don't understand how important and _ into many people don't understand how important and better - into many people don't understand how important and better it - into many people don't understand how important and better it is - into many people don't understand how important and better it is for. how important and better it is for you to _ how important and better it is for you to be — how important and better it is for you to be working _ how important and better it is for you to be working hard _ how important and better it is for you to be working hard and - how important and better it is for you to be working hard and manyj you to be working hard and many peopte are — you to be working hard and many peopte are out _ you to be working hard and many people are out of _ you to be working hard and many people are out of work _ you to be working hard and many people are out of work benefits l you to be working hard and many. people are out of work benefits and my question — people are out of work benefits and my question is _ people are out of work benefits and my question is what _ people are out of work benefits and my question is what are _ people are out of work benefits and my question is what are you - people are out of work benefits and my question is what are you going i people are out of work benefits and. my question is what are you going to do to— my question is what are you going to do to help _ my question is what are you going to do to help more _ my question is what are you going to do to help more people _ my question is what are you going to do to help more people come - my question is what are you going to do to help more people come off- do to help more people come off trenefits— do to help more people come off benefits and _ do to help more people come off benefits and back _ do to help more people come off benefits and back into _ do to help more people come off benefits and back into work? - do to help more people come off| benefits and back into work? keir starmer, what _ benefits and back into work? starmer, what are you going to benefits and back into work?“ starmer, what are you going to do? work is about being able to pay her own way— work is about being able to pay her own way and support your family but it's also— own way and support your family but it's also about dignity and respect and my— it's also about dignity and respect and my dad worked in a factory all his life _ and my dad worked in a factory all his life and — and my dad worked in a factory all his life and having a secure job for him was _ his life and having a secure job for him was really important for his respect — him was really important for his respect and integrity in relation to those _ respect and integrity in relation to those who— respect and integrity in relation to those who are out of work, but my rule is _ those who are out of work, but my rule is this, — those who are out of work, but my rule is this, if— those who are out of work, but my rule is this, if you can work, you should _ rule is this, if you can work, you should believe a plan to get people into work— should believe a plan to get people into work with businesses to support people _ into work with businesses to support people and _ into work with businesses to support people and we need to change the job centre _ people and we need to change the job centre in— people and we need to change the job centre in the career service because at the _ centre in the career service because at the moment but as businesses, if you have _ at the moment but as businesses, if you have a _ at the moment but as businesses, if you have a vacancy, job centre to -et you have a vacancy, job centre to get that— you have a vacancy, job centre to get that and we need to do that and the other— get that and we need to do that and the other thing we absolutely need to do— the other thing we absolutely need to do is— the other thing we absolutely need to do is get the waiting list down at the _ to do is get the waiting list down at the nhs because so many people are not— at the nhs because so many people are not able to work or work in the way they— are not able to work or work in the way they want because they're waiting — way they want because they're waiting for an operation because of the catastrophic level of this government. to the catastrophic level of this government.— the catastrophic level of this government. the catastrophic level of this covernment. ., , ., ., government. to the question, what are ou government. to the question, what are you going _ government. to the question, what are you going to — government. to the question, what are you going to do _ government. to the question, what are you going to do to _ government. to the question, what are you going to do to get - government. to the question, what are you going to do to get people i are you going to do to get people off of benefits? the are you going to do to get people off of benefits?— are you going to do to get people off of benefits? the situation isn't riaht off of benefits? the situation isn't ri . ht and off of benefits? the situation isn't right and if— off of benefits? the situation isn't right and if you — off of benefits? the situation isn't right and if you want _ off of benefits? the situation isn't right and if you want more - off of benefits? the situation isn't right and if you want more taxes i off of benefits? the situation isn't i right and if you want more taxes and lower welfare, us. right and if you want more taxes and lowerwelfare, us. people are right and if you want more taxes and lower welfare, us. people are better off and work and notjust lower welfare, us. people are better off and work and not just for the financial security and brings you blood the purpose, the dignity that it brings to people which you alluded to and i strongly agree with. and the people are out of work due to ill health is gonna buy 80,000 since the pandemic and 60% of the last two years with to do something about it and i made a speech by this a few months ago set out a conference and plan to reform the welfare system and tighten it up so those who can work can work to work and stricter about those eligibility criteria is unfair for all of you were working hard and paying your taxes and better for those people and that is what i do but i announced that, and again recently, keir starmer the labour party imposed every single thing that i set out to deliver what you want to come every single thing. they do not think that you can save a single penny and the brain welfare bill. that is a numbers show. crosstalk we actually have a related question, so i'm going to bring in beverly mckenzie. i so i'm going to bring in beverly mckenzie-— so i'm going to bring in beverly mckenzie. ., ,, ., , , mckenzie. i worked on my life, but had to stop — mckenzie. i worked on my life, but had to stop due — mckenzie. i worked on my life, but had to stop due to _ mckenzie. i worked on my life, but had to stop due to illness. - mckenzie. i worked on my life, but| had to stop due to illness. disabled people _ had to stop due to illness. disabled people like — had to stop due to illness. disabled peopte like me _ had to stop due to illness. disabled peopte like me get _ had to stop due to illness. disabled people like me get hit _ had to stop due to illness. disabled people like me get hit in _ had to stop due to illness. disabled people like me get hit in the - had to stop due to illness. disabled people like me get hit in the worstl people like me get hit in the worst way. people like me get hit in the worst way what— people like me get hit in the worst way. what we _ people like me get hit in the worst way. what we want _ people like me get hit in the worst way. what we want to _ people like me get hit in the worst way. what we want to get - people like me get hit in the worst way. what we want to get back- way. what we want to get back to work _ way. what we want to get back to work and — way. what we want to get back to work and help. _ way. what we want to get back to work and help, often, _ way. what we want to get back to work and help, often, we - way. what we want to get back to work and help, often, we can't. . way. what we want to get back to i work and help, often, we can't. how will candidates _ work and help, often, we can't. how will candidates ensure _ work and help, often, we can't. how will candidates ensure we're - work and help, often, we can't. how will candidates ensure we're not - will candidates ensure we're not punished — will candidates ensure we're not punished by— will candidates ensure we're not punished by benefits _ will candidates ensure we're not punished by benefits sanctions? thank— punished by benefits sanctions? thank you — punished by benefits sanctions? thank you very _ punished by benefits sanctions? thank you very much. _ punished by benefits sanctions? thank you very much. rishi - punished by benefits sanctions? i thank you very much. rishi sunak, you said you would be stricter. what does that mean for people like beverly? it does that mean for people like beverl ? . , �* , �* , beverly? it was beverly? beverly, i actually believe _ beverly? it was beverly? beverly, i actually believe in _ beverly? it was beverly? beverly, i actually believe in it _ beverly? it was beverly? beverly, ij actually believe in it compassionate welfare system that supports everyone, and use only that during covid, making sure we got support to the most notable. that will always happen under a conservative government and under me. what we want to is have a system where people are not supported into work if they can work. what we're going to do is make sure we will form the fit sick note process, which isn't working. we will look at — us about benefits — we will provide active support. i also think if people are offered jobs, they can do and they don't take them, that's not ok. —— you asked about. what i said is we will do something about that. if yourjob will do something about that. if your job says will do something about that. if yourjob says to you that there's work you can do, there's a job for you that you're fit enough to do, and he refused to take it, i don't think that's fair on everyone else after 12 months of support. we will tighten that up. i think that's fair for everybody and i think those people who can work should work. the fundamental tenet of fairness, that's why i think we can save money in the welfare bill because it's forecast to grow at an extraordinary rate... ,, ., , .., rate... keir starmer... one second. what is wrong _ rate... keir starmer... one second. what is wrong if _ rate... keir starmer... one second. what is wrong if you _ rate... keir starmer... one second. what is wrong if you believe - rate... keir starmer... one second. what is wrong if you believe what i what is wrong if you believe what rishi sunak is saying, if someone is offered a job and they cannot do —— they turn it down it's wrong? there's nothing wrong with that. you o- ose it there's nothing wrong with that. gm. oppose it when i announced it! you opposed it! if oppose it when i announced it! you o- osed it! ,, oppose it when i announced it! you opposed it!— opposed it! if you listen to people more often. _ opposed it! if you listen to people more often. you _ opposed it! if you listen to people more often, you might _ opposed it! if you listen to people more often, you might not - opposed it! if you listen to people more often, you might not be - opposed it! if you listen to people i more often, you might not be quite so out _ more often, you might not be quite so out of— more often, you might not be quite so out of touch.— so out of touch. applause beverly. — so out of touch. applause beverly. you _ so out of touch. applause beverly, you make - so out of touch. applause beverly, you make a - so out of touch. applause beverly, you make a reallyj so out of touch. applause _ beverly, you make a really important point _ beverly, you make a really important point very— beverly, you make a really important point. very many people with illness or disability do want to get back into work— or disability do want to get back into work for the very reason it was attuded _ into work for the very reason it was alluded to— into work for the very reason it was alluded to before — respect, dignity and support he gives. it is difficult _ and support he gives. it is difficult to do so because they're worried — difficult to do so because they're worried about whether they can do it and whether their last period of months — and whether their last period of months. what the number of business are doing. _ months. what the number of business are doing, and i support this, is having — are doing, and i support this, is having a — are doing, and i support this, is having a supported team where people can be _ having a supported team where people can be supported back into work for a number— can be supported back into work for a number of— can be supported back into work for a number of months to make sure they can make _ a number of months to make sure they can make that transition and get back— can make that transition and get back into — can make that transition and get back into work. i think that's a realty— back into work. i think that's a really good scheme, that's what we would _ really good scheme, that's what we would put _ really good scheme, that's what we would put into place. i do have to address— would put into place. i do have to address this question. the prime minister— address this question. the prime minister keep saying he's going to cut taxes — minister keep saying he's going to cut taxes. he has raised taxes 26 times _ cut taxes. he has raised taxes 26 times. nobody has raised more tax. this is— times. nobody has raised more tax. this is not— times. nobody has raised more tax. this is not the question about tax. the numbers have risen considerably since the pandemic of people economically inactive. how would you... you are seeking power. what would you get those numbers down to? we want to get those numbers down, but the _ we want to get those numbers down, but the plan to get people back into work, _ but the plan to get people back into work. and _ but the plan to get people back into work, and that's partly supported and it's— work, and that's partly supported and it's partly the changes we want to make _ and it's partly the changes we want to make sure that where businesses and public— to make sure that where businesses and public services, the nhs shoutdm _ and public services, the nhs should... we want to merge the services — should... we want to merge the services. the other thing if we are going _ services. the other thing if we are going to _ services. the other thing if we are going to get people into work as we have to _ going to get people into work as we have to tackle these terrible waiting _ have to tackle these terrible waiting lists because nearly 8 million — waiting lists because nearly 8 million people on the waiting list. it's million people on the waiting list. it's not _ million people on the waiting list. it's not their fault that they can't -et it's not their fault that they can't get back— it's not their fault that they can't get back into work. it's the fault of the _ get back into work. it's the fault of the government that's put us in this terrible position. we have to address— this terrible position. we have to address this.— address this. applause there's a _ address this. applause there's a very _ address this. applause there's a very clear- address this. applause i there's a very clear choice. address this. applause - there's a very clear choice. i think you have to change the eligibility nigeria in the welfare system. make it clear that people who can work should work. —— eligibility in the. asking people to provide medical information when they make these claims, reforming the sick note process, being stricter about saying to people who don't accept a job that's on ok. those are all the practical things i've set out. i think that's fair. keir starmer can stand here and say what he wants when i made the speech — and you can all go and read it, they oppose every single measure. two weeks ago, they said they opposed all those measures. it's one thing to stand here and say all these things. you should at least be upfront. you are going to have a higher welfare under you and that's why you can't deliver tax cuts the way i can.— tax cuts the way i can. applause peo - le tax cuts the way i can. applause people should — tax cuts the way i can. applause people should not _ tax cuts the way i can. applause people should not surrender- tax cuts the way i can. applause people should not surrender to i tax cuts the way i can. applause i people should not surrender to this. crosstalk they've been in powerfor14 years. they've been in power for 14 years. why does _ they've been in power for 14 years. why does he onlyjust thought about this? honestly... who is the guy in charge _ this? honestly... who is the guy in charge of— this? honestly... who is the guy in charge of the system? why is it so bad? _ charge of the system? why is it so bad? ., ., ., , . ., , bad? you want to be in charge, but ou have bad? you want to be in charge, but you have nothing _ bad? you want to be in charge, but you have nothing to _ bad? you want to be in charge, but you have nothing to say _ bad? you want to be in charge, but you have nothing to say to - bad? you want to be in charge, but you have nothing to say to people i you have nothing to say to people about what you would do about it. this about the future.— this about the future. applause will be welfare _ this about the future. applause will be welfare bill _ this about the future. applause will be welfare bill be _ this about the future. applause will be welfare bill be higher- this about the future. applause | will be welfare bill be higher under you? will be welfare bill be higher under ou? ., , ., _, ., will be welfare bill be higher under ou? ., , ., ., _ you? know, it needs to come down by caettin you? know, it needs to come down by getting people — you? know, it needs to come down by getting people back— you? know, it needs to come down by getting people back into _ you? know, it needs to come down by getting people back into work. - you? know, it needs to come down by getting people back into work. it - getting people back into work. it needs— getting people back into work. it needs to — getting people back into work. it needs to come down and tackling the waiting _ needs to come down and tackling the waiting list— needs to come down and tackling the waiting list so that more people can uet waiting list so that more people can get back— waiting list so that more people can get back into work, which is why would _ get back into work, which is why would a — get back into work, which is why would a first thing that we will do if we _ would a first thing that we will do if we are — would a first thing that we will do if we are elected to serve the country— if we are elected to serve the country is _ if we are elected to serve the country is to put in place 40,000 extra _ country is to put in place 40,000 extra appointments in the nhs, each and every— extra appointments in the nhs, each and every week. that's 2 million per year to— and every week. that's 2 million per year to drive — and every week. that's 2 million per year to drive down the waiting list to get— year to drive down the waiting list to get people the comfort and operations that they need and to allow— operations that they need and to allow them to get back into the economy— allow them to get back into the economy so that we can grow the economy, — economy so that we can grow the economy, which is what's been missing — economy, which is what's been missing so _ economy, which is what's been missing so desperately over the last 14 years _ missing so desperately over the last 14 ears. ~ . �* , missing so desperately over the last 14 ears. ~ ., a ., 14 years. what he's not telling you is actually. — 14 years. what he's not telling you is actually, most _ 14 years. what he's not telling you is actually, most of _ 14 years. what he's not telling you is actually, most of the _ 14 years. what he's not telling you is actually, most of the people - 14 years. what he's not telling you | is actually, most of the people that we're talking about aren't on nhs waiting lists. talking about that isn't an answer to this.- isn't an answer to this. nearly 8 million. the _ isn't an answer to this. nearly 8 million. the answer— isn't an answer to this. nearly 8 million. the answer is _ isn't an answer to this. nearly 8 million. the answer is actually i million. the answer is actually beinu million. the answer is actually being stricter _ million. the answer is actually being stricter about _ million. the answer is actually being stricter about the - million. the answer is actually i being stricter about the eligibility criteria and making sure everyone who can work does work because that's fair to everyone like sue, who was working very hard. i promise you will deliver on that. we will cut the growth in the welfare bill. we spend too much on it. labour oppose all of it, so the choice for you is simple — if you want higher taxes, that's what keir starmer will do. if you want lower taxes... [10 do. if you want lower taxes. .. do not do. if you want lower taxes... do not surrender... i'm going to turn to the next question, and this is from steve curtis. ,., ., ., curtis. good evening. in ireland, why can't — curtis. good evening. in ireland, why can't we _ curtis. good evening. in ireland, why can't we easily _ curtis. good evening. in ireland, why can't we easily close - curtis. good evening. in ireland, why can't we easily close our - why can't we easily close our borders? _ why can't we easily close our borders?— why can't we easily close our borders? ., ,, , ., ,, borders? thank you, steve. keir starmer. steve, _ borders? thank you, steve. keir starmer. steve, the _ borders? thank you, steve. keir starmer. steve, the biggest - borders? thank you, steve. keiri starmer. steve, the biggest threat to our borders _ starmer. steve, the biggest threat to our borders at _ starmer. steve, the biggest threat to our borders at the _ starmer. steve, the biggest threat to our borders at the moment - starmer. steve, the biggest threat to our borders at the moment is i starmer. steve, the biggest threat. to our borders at the moment is the very many— to our borders at the moment is the very many people arriving by small boats _ very many people arriving by small boats over — very many people arriving by small boats over the channel, and their record _ boats over the channel, and their record numbers since rishi sunak became _ record numbers since rishi sunak became prime minister, 50,000 people have come _ became prime minister, 50,000 people have come across by small boats. the government _ have come across by small boats. the government has effectively lost control — government has effectively lost control of our borders. that means it's not— control of our borders. that means it's notiust — control of our borders. that means it's notiust a — control of our borders. that means it's notjust a border security issue. — it's notjust a border security issue. it's _ it's notjust a border security issue, it's actually a national security— issue, it's actually a national security issue, because the government lost control of who's coming _ government lost control of who's coming and what their background is. ithink— coming and what their background is. i think that _ coming and what their background is. i think that nobody but nobody should — i think that nobody but nobody should be making thatjourney i think that nobody but nobody should be making that journey across the channel. and we have to smash the channel. and we have to smash the games— the channel. and we have to smash the games that are running this vile trade _ the games that are running this vile trade they— the games that are running this vile trade. they are making a fortune putting _ trade. they are making a fortune putting people into boats across the channel, _ putting people into boats across the channel, and i think they can be taken _ channel, and i think they can be taken down. i was a audition, i was chief— taken down. i was a audition, i was chief prosecutor for england and wales— chief prosecutor for england and wales and ran all the court set, and we had _ wales and ran all the court set, and we had to— wales and ran all the court set, and we had to deal with terrorist plots and other— we had to deal with terrorist plots and other plots — drug plots and gun plots - _ and other plots — drug plots and gun plots — across various other countries _ plots — across various other countries. we grouped together with police _ countries. we grouped together with police and _ countries. we grouped together with police and law enforcement across europe, _ police and law enforcement across europe, but we took down those terrorist — europe, but we took down those terrorist gangs. i've seen it done, i've terrorist gangs. i've seen it done, i've been— terrorist gangs. i've seen it done, i've been part of the operations to do it and _ i've been part of the operations to do it and do— i've been part of the operations to do it and do not accept, and will never— do it and do not accept, and will never accept that the only gangs that can't— never accept that the only gangs that can't be taken down are the gangsm — that can't be taken down are the ans. .. �* , ., that can't be taken down are the ans... 3 ., , ,, gangs... let's turn to rishi sunak. we haven't — gangs... let's turn to rishi sunak. we haven't heard _ gangs... let's turn to rishi sunak. we haven't heard from _ gangs... let's turn to rishi sunak. we haven't heard from him - gangs... let's turn to rishi sunak. we haven't heard from him yet. i gangs... let's turn to rishi sunak. i we haven't heard from him yet. why can't ireland easily close their borders? ,, , ., �* �* , borders? steve, you're right, it's completely _ borders? steve, you're right, it's completely unfair. _ borders? steve, you're right, it's completely unfair. when - borders? steve, you're right, it's completely unfair. when peoplel borders? steve, you're right, it's - completely unfair. when peoplejump the queue illegally, it ought not only threatens our security, it's an affront to the fairness that is fundamental to our actual character. we have made progress in the numbers have come down. we have made progress in the numbers have come down-— have come down. there are record numbers- — have come down. there are record numbers- in _ have come down. there are record numbers. in order— have come down. there are record numbers. in order to _ have come down. there are record numbers. in order to fully - have come down. there are record numbers. in order to fully solve i numbers. in order to fully solve this problem. — numbers. in order to fully solve this problem, you _ numbers. in order to fully solve this problem, you need - numbers. in order to fully solve this problem, you need a i numbers. in order to fully solve i this problem, you need a deterrent. we need to make it crystal clear to people if they come here illegally, they won't be able to say. that's why i find your prime minister on july the 5th, the flights will go to rwanda, we will build the deterrent that multiple countries agree is the right way to deal with this problem, and that's how we solve the problem. if keir starmer is your prime minister, all those illegal migrants will be out on our streets, and that is the choice for you. do not surrender our borders to the labour party. surrender our borders to the labour pa . ,, , , party. steve, this is utter nonsense. _ party. steve, this is utter nonsense. applause i nonsense. applause i want nonsense. applause i want to _ nonsense. applause i want to clarify, i nonsense. applause i want to clarify, theyj nonsense. applause i i want to clarify, they did art nonsense. applause _ i want to clarify, they did art come down this year, but at this year, it's more than 13,000 at a record high. have you lost control? trio. high. have you lost control? no, they have _ high. have you lost control? no, they have come _ high. have you lost control? idfr, they have come down. the way to come down... the plan is a deterrent. you down... the plan is a deterrent. you do have to listen to listen to what the illegal migrants themselves are saying. 0ne the illegal migrants themselves are saying. one of them to said, "moats are still in france due to the fear we have about rwanda." "i won't cross the channel until the plane is destroyed." the people smugglers are going to need a bigger boat. don't surrendered our borders to labour party. he surrendered our borders to labour pa . . , surrendered our borders to labour pa . ., , ,. ., , surrendered our borders to labour party-_ record - party. he was scrap... record numbers — party. he was scrap... record numbers have _ party. he was scrap... record numbers have come - party. he was scrap... record numbers have come under i party. he was scrap... record | numbers have come under this party. he was scrap... record - numbers have come under this watch. it numbers have come under this watch. it says— numbers have come under this watch. it says is— numbers have come under this watch. it says is the _ numbers have come under this watch. it says is the deterrent. a few hundred — it says is the deterrent. a few hundred to go on a flight to rwanda at huge _ hundred to go on a flight to rwanda at huge expense to the taxpayer. there _ at huge expense to the taxpayer. there are — at huge expense to the taxpayer. there are tens of thousands, 50,000 people _ there are tens of thousands, 50,000 people have — there are tens of thousands, 50,000 people have come since rishi sunak has been _ people have come since rishi sunak has been prime minister. a few hundred — has been prime minister. a few hundred going every year means there is a 99%_ hundred going every year means there is a 99% chance you're not going to rwanda _ is a 99% chance you're not going to rwanda i've — is a 99% chance you're not going to rwanda. i've worked with criminal gangs. _ rwanda. i've worked with criminal gangs, rishi sunak. i know they are telling _ gangs, rishi sunak. i know they are telling the _ gangs, rishi sunak. i know they are telling the people there is a 99% chance _ telling the people there is a 99% chance of— telling the people there is a 99% chance of not going. that is not a disincentive. that is not a deterrent. it's not working. if it were _ deterrent. it's not working. if it were working, why are record numbers under— were working, why are record numbers under your— were working, why are record numbers under your watch? were working, why are record numbers underyourwatch? how were working, why are record numbers under your watch? how on earth you say is _ under your watch? how on earth you say is working? you put the scheme and plates, — say is working? you put the scheme and plates, and the flights could go up. and plates, and the flights could go up you _ and plates, and the flights could go up. you called the election for any flights— up. you called the election for any flights could go off. interesting timing — flights could go off. interesting timing. if this was such a deterrent, why is obviously not working? — deterrent, why is obviously not workin: ? ., , , deterrent, why is obviously not workinu? ., , , ., , working? you spent all this time sa in: working? you spent all this time saying call— working? you spent all this time saying call and — working? you spent all this time saying call and election, - working? you spent all this time saying call and election, and i working? you spent all this time | saying call and election, and then we called one, you spend your time... ,, ,, . time... crosstalk this is _ time. . . crosstalk this is about i time. . . crosstalk this is about the i time... crosstalk - this is about the future! i can time... crosstalk _ this is about the future! i can tell everyone what i'm going to do with illegal migrants. they will be on planes, be sent away, because they were shouldn't be here. what will you do with the illegal migrants? you've had three weeks to think of an answer. you've had three weeks to think of an answer-— an answer. they are things of thousands — an answer. they are things of thousands of, _ an answer. they are things of thousands of, unlawfully. i an answer. they are things of thousands of, unlawfully. --| an answer. they are things of- thousands of, unlawfully. -- ten. thousands of, unlawfully. —— ten. the rwanda — thousands of, unlawfully. —— ten. the rwanda scheme takes a few hundred. — the rwanda scheme takes a few hundred, literally 300 years to get all the _ hundred, literally 300 years to get all the people there unlawfully. if all the people there unlawfully. elected, all the people there unlawfully. if elected, what would you do? git all the people there unlawfully. if. elected, what would you do? at the moment, elected, what would you do? at the moment. they _ elected, what would you do? at the moment, they are _ elected, what would you do? at the moment, they are not _ elected, what would you do? at the moment, they are not being - moment, they are not being processed. they're sitting in hotels. _ processed. they're sitting in hotels, what you are all paying for. they're _ hotels, what you are all paying for. they're not— hotels, what you are all paying for. they're not processed and as a result. — they're not processed and as a result, that means not a single one, even _ result, that means not a single one, even those — result, that means not a single one, even those that shouldn't be here, could _ even those that shouldn't be here, could be _ even those that shouldn't be here, could be returned anywhere. once they got— could be returned anywhere. once they got here under prime minister, they're _ they got here under prime minister, they're here for life. that's an absurd — they're here for life. that's an absurd situation to have gotten to. we do _ absurd situation to have gotten to. we do need to process them. what will ou we do need to process them. what will you do? _ we do need to process them. what will you do? you're _ we do need to process them. what will you do? you're sitting - we do need to process them. what will you do? you're sitting there i will you do? you're sitting there with tens of _ will you do? you're sitting there with tens of thousands. .. i will you do? you're sitting there i with tens of thousands. .. crosstalk what will you — with tens of thousands. .. crosstalk what will you do? _ with tens of thousands. .. crosstalk what will you do? i'm _ with tens of thousands. .. crosstalk what will you do? i'm trying... i i what will you do? i'm trying... i will ut what will you do? i'm trying... i will put the _ what will you do? i'm trying... i will put the planes _ what will you do? i'm trying... i will put the planes to _ what will you do? i'm trying... i will put the planes to rwanda i will put the planes to rwanda because they should be able. 30c} because they should be able. 300 ears! because they should be able. 300 years! what _ because they should be able. 300 years! what will _ because they should be able. 300 years! what will you _ because they should be able. 300 years! what will you do _ because they should be able. 300 years! what will you do with i because they should be able. 300 | years! what will you do with illegal mi . rants? years! what will you do with illegal migrants? ls— years! what will you do with illegal migrants? is a _ years! what will you do with illegal migrants? is a simple _ years! what will you do with illegal migrants? is a simple question! i years! what will you do with illegal. migrants? is a simple question! what will you do? migrants? is a simple question! what will ou do? , ., , will you do? they need to be processed- _ will you do? they need to be processed. to _ will you do? they need to be processed. to be _ will you do? they need to be processed. to be clear, i will you do? they need to be processed. to be clear, it i will you do? they need to be i processed. to be clear, it means most will be _ processed. to be clear, it means most will be given _ processed. to be clear, it means most will be given asylum. i processed. to be clear, it means most will be given asylum. at i processed. to be clear, it means| most will be given asylum. at the moment, most will be given asylum. at the moment. 10096 — most will be given asylum. at the moment, 10096 are _ most will be given asylum. at the moment, 10096 are effectively i moment, 100% are effectively being granted _ moment, 100% are effectively being granted asylum. they can't go anywhere. the prime minister knows this. anywhere. the prime minister knows this if— anywhere. the prime minister knows this if he _ this. if he thinks i'm wrong, he should say so. they cannot be returned — should say so. they cannot be returned to where they came from. if you want _ returned to where they came from. if you want to _ returned to where they came from. if you want to correct that, but... cannot be... you want to correct that, but... i cannot be... he's— you want to correct that, but... i cannot be... he's not— you want to correct that, but... i cannot be... he's not answering | you want to correct that, but... i i cannot be... he's not answering the cuestion. cannot be... he's not answering the question- you _ cannot be... he's not answering the question. you can _ cannot be... he's not answering the question. you can see _ cannot be... he's not answering the question. you can see that. - cannot be... he's not answering the question. you can see that. iran, i question. you can see that. iran, s ria, question. you can see that. iran, syria, afghanistan. _ question. you can see that. iran, syria, afghanistan. is— question. you can see that. iran, syria, afghanistan. is he - question. you can see that. i�*e�*i, syria, afghanistan. is he going to sit down with the iranian and do a deal with the tell a man? it's completely nonsensical what you are saying. completely nonsensical what you are sa inc. �* ~ ,, saying. applause -- taliban. i saying. applause -- taliban. you i saying. applause | -- taliban. you are saying. applause - -- taliban. you are taking saying. applause _ -- taliban. you are taking people —— taliban. you are taking people for fools. —— taliban. you are taking people forfools. they —— taliban. you are taking people for fools. they will be on planes to for fools. they will be on planes tr: rwanda. for fools. they will be on planes to rwanda. crosstalk _ rwanda. crosstalk will you _ rwanda. crosstalk will you send - rwanda. crosstalk will you send all- rwanda. crosstalk will you send all the| rwanda. crosstalk - will you send all the tens of thousands to go to rwanda? 50,000. that is the choice _ thousands to go to rwanda? 50,000. that is the choice for _ thousands to go to rwanda? 50,000. that is the choice for you. _ thousands to go to rwanda? 50,000. that is the choice for you. they i that is the choice for you. they should be sent somewhere else to build the deterrent and i will deliver for that. build the deterrent and i will deliverfor that. do not surrender our borders to keir starmer. the situation willjust get worse and will become the soft touch of europe. they are queuing up in calais waiting for keir starmer to be in charge. 50 calais waiting for keir starmer to be in charge-— calais waiting for keir starmer to be in charge. so you will send tens of thousands _ be in charge. so you will send tens of thousands of _ be in charge. so you will send tens of thousands of people _ be in charge. so you will send tens of thousands of people who - be in charge. so you will send tens of thousands of people who are i be in charge. so you will send tens i of thousands of people who are here out of the asylum system? are promising to send them all to rwanda? ldate promising to send them all to rwanda? ~ ., ., , ., rwanda? we will have a number of fliuhts rwanda? we will have a number of fli . hts to rwanda? we will have a number of flights to build _ rwanda? we will have a number of flights to build his _ rwanda? we will have a number of flights to build his deterrent. i flights to build his deterrent. that's what i always said. i don't think people who come here should be able to stay. you talk about this is if you care about the issue. when you ran for the labour leadership, this wasn't very long ago. you promised to perfect free movement and you said you would promise to close dissension systems and you posted in the letter of getting illegal migrants more welfare. but that's what you actually believe and that's what you actually believe and that's why you can't trust him on this issue. do not surrender our borders to the labour party. i’m borders to the labour party. i'm very clear- _ borders to the labour party. i'm very clear- we _ borders to the labour party. i'm very clear. we need to get our security— very clear. we need to get our security borders pack. they've lost control _ security borders pack. they've lost control. they have to smash the gangs _ control. they have to smash the gangs in — control. they have to smash the gangs in the first place. | control. they have to smash the gangs in the first place.- gangs in the first place. i don't want to- -- _ gangs in the first place. i don't want to... you're _ gangs in the first place. i don't want to... you're right, - gangs in the first place. i don't want to... you're right, we i gangs in the first place. i don't want to... you're right, we do| gangs in the first place. i don't i want to... you're right, we do have to smash the gangs. they've arrested thousand criminals and sent to hundreds of years. the labour party voted against that law. when you stand there and say smash the gangs like on every other issue, you say one thing, you do another, you just don't know which keir starmer you're going to get. l’gre don't know which keir starmer you're going to get-— don't know which keir starmer you're going to get-_ do - don't know which keir starmer you're going to get._ do not i going to get. i've done this. do not surrender our _ going to get. i've done this. do not surrender our borders _ going to get. i've done this. do not surrender our borders to _ going to get. i've done this. do not surrender our borders to the i going to get. i've done this. do not| surrender our borders to the labour party. surrender our borders to the labour pa . �* ., , ., , ., , party. before i did this “ob, iwas runnina party. before i did this “ob, iwas running crown h party. before i did thisjob, iwas running crown prosecution i party. before i did this job, i was l running crown prosecution service. it was _ running crown prosecution service. it was my— running crown prosecution service. it was my responsibility to take down _ it was my responsibility to take down criminal gangs on behalf of everyone — down criminal gangs on behalf of everyone in this room. i know that this could — everyone in this room. i know that this could be done. we share the data, _ this could be done. we share the data, analysis and intelligence. we have to _ data, analysis and intelligence. we have to have a strategy of know what — have to have a strategy of know what we _ have to have a strategy of know what... we did it to take down really— what... we did it to take down really dangerous terrorists gangs. there _ really dangerous terrorists gangs. there was — really dangerous terrorists gangs. there was one gang that involved bringing — there was one gang that involved bringing down nine planes in the atlantic— bringing down nine planes in the atlantic at the same time with bombs — atlantic at the same time with bombs. that was one of the cases that i_ bombs. that was one of the cases that i had — bombs. that was one of the cases that i had to deal with as a prosecutor.— that i had to deal with as a rosecutor. ., �*, ., , , prosecutor. that's a very different kind of threat. _ prosecutor. that's a very different kind of threat. this _ prosecutor. that's a very different kind of threat. this was _ prosecutor. that's a very different kind of threat. this was a - prosecutor. that's a very different kind of threat. this was a very - kind of threat. this was a very sophisticated... _ kind of threat. this was a very sophisticated... crosstalk | sophisticated. . . crosstalk i don't accept _ sophisticated. . . crosstalk i don't accept this _ sophisticated. . . crosstalk i don't accept this can't - sophisticated. . . crosstalk i don't accept this can't be l sophisticated... crosstalk - i don't accept this can't be done. right _ i don't accept this can't be done. right how~~ _ i don't accept this can't be done. right now... spending hundreds of years in ourjails because of the laws that the conservatives passed. when it came to it, the labour party oppose the laws. they voted against it. just look at his record. this is someone who defended free movement. he campaigned against not believing that was part of our manifesto and we've now left it. i think people. i'm going to turn out to the next question from mohammed. you have both made lots _ question from mohammed. you have both made lots of _ question from mohammed. you have both made lots of promises, - question from mohammed. you have both made lots of promises, but - question from mohammed. you have | both made lots of promises, but have not set _ both made lots of promises, but have not set on _ both made lots of promises, but have not set on a _ both made lots of promises, but have not set on a clear— both made lots of promises, but have not set on a clear plan _ both made lots of promises, but have not set on a clear plan to _ both made lots of promises, but have not set on a clear plan to pay - both made lots of promises, but have not set on a clear plan to pay for - not set on a clear plan to pay for those _ not set on a clear plan to pay for those where _ not set on a clear plan to pay for those. where is— not set on a clear plan to pay for those. where is the _ not set on a clear plan to pay for those. where is the money- not set on a clear plan to pay for| those. where is the money going not set on a clear plan to pay for. those. where is the money going to come from? — those. where is the money going to come from?— come from? you haven't set out a clear plan. — come from? you haven't set out a clear plan, where's _ come from? you haven't set out a clear plan, where's the _ come from? you haven't set out a clear plan, where's the money - come from? you haven't set out a i clear plan, where's the money going to come from, kamaru rishi sunak? taste to come from, kamaru rishi sunak? , talked about it in sue's question. it's forecast to grow at an unsustainable rate, and i don't think that's right. those savings we will use to cut your taxes. i want to cut taxes for people at every stage of their life. £900 this year, and for pensioner, we have the triple lot plus. we will raise the allowance, and make sure the state pension is never subject to income tax. fora pension is never subject to income tax. for a young couple buying the first home, abolishing stamp duty. if you're with children, we are going to expand child benefits. these are the tax cuts that i want to deliver. we are going to abolish national insurance for the self—employed. that's how we're going to pay for the tracery thus the tracery of the selection. tax cuts with the conservatives are thousands of pounds attacks were part of raises under the labour party because he's not being straight with you. mark my words, your taxes are going up if he is in charge. your taxes are going up if he is in charae. . , , your taxes are going up if he is in charae. ., , , ., , charge. false, but i will answer our charge. false, but i will answer your question. _ charge. false, but i will answer your question, mohammed. - charge. false, but i will answer- your question, mohammed. everything in our— your question, mohammed. everything in our manifesto, we have set out all of _ in our manifesto, we have set out all of our— in our manifesto, we have set out all of our plans, for growing our economy— all of our plans, for growing our economy for creating wealth to make sure our— economy for creating wealth to make sure our country is better off. it's -ot sure our country is better off. it's got ctear— sure our country is better off. it's got clear columns setting out each of our _ got clear columns setting out each of our plans is going to pass, and a cotumh_ of our plans is going to pass, and a column saying where that is going to come _ column saying where that is going to come from — column saying where that is going to come from. we've got various strong for stroll— come from. we've got various strong for stroll rules because we have economic— for stroll rules because we have economic stability. —— for school rules _ economic stability. —— for school rules the — economic stability. —— for school rules. the reason for that, because this is— rules. the reason for that, because this is really— rules. the reason for that, because this is really important. —— fiscal. we know— this is really important. —— fiscal. we know what happens if unfunded tax cuts are _ we know what happens if unfunded tax cuts are made because liz truss tried _ cuts are made because liz truss tried that — cuts are made because liz truss tried that experiment on the country _ tried that experiment on the country. and we're all paying the price _ country. and we're all paying the price for— country. and we're all paying the price for that. when she was elected as leader— price for that. when she was elected as leader of— price for that. when she was elected as leader of the conservative party, but rishi _ as leader of the conservative party, but rishi sunak said we should unite behind _ but rishi sunak said we should unite behind her — but rishi sunak said we should unite behind her. i don't think we should have, _ behind her. i don't think we should have, i_ behind her. idon't think we should have, ithink— behind her. i don't think we should have, i think we should learn the lessons, — have, i think we should learn the lessons, which is why i'm not prepared _ lessons, which is why i'm not prepared to allow an incoming labour government ever, ever to inflict that kind — government ever, ever to inflict that kind of damage on people across the country — that kind of damage on people across the country. people are still paying the country. people are still paying the price — the country. people are still paying the price. many people have come off a fixed _ the price. many people have come off a fixed rate _ the price. many people have come off a fixed rate mortgage and paying hundreds— a fixed rate mortgage and paying hundreds of pounds more. rishi sunak hash't _ hundreds of pounds more. rishi sunak hasn't learned the lesson because his manifesto has commitments that are unfunded because he is chancellor said that the money he says he's— chancellor said that the money he says he's going to use has already been _ says he's going to use has already been spent. everybody knows you can't _ been spent. everybody knows you can't spend the same money twice. but mohammed's question... crosstalk each of you had a say on that. i'm going to make clear that mohammed is not alone in thinking that neither of you have set out a clear plan to pay for your promises. the iss think—tank said you are both ignoring raw facts and huge decisions need to be made —— ifs. it will likely mean either a higher taxes or worse public services. well, the ifs also said it's right to a down five welfare as a challenge and acknowledge that when the conservatives previously set out savings, they would get from the bill, the ifs didn't think it would happen and they were delivered. but two years ago, i warned repeatedly about what liz truss's policies would do, even if it wasn't what people wanted to hear at the time. i was right then. that's what you can trust me now, when i say that the labour party's policies will mean all your taxes are going to go up by thousands of pounds. it is in their dna. mark my words — your pension, council tax, dna. mark my words — your pension, counciltax, home, car, you name it — they will tax it, which is why he can't rule out reading your taxes. he has been asked multiple times. now ask him again, but do not surrender yourfamily now ask him again, but do not surrender your family finances to labour�*s tax rises. let surrender your family finances to iabour's tax rises.— surrender your family finances to iabour's tax rises. let me address this directly _ iabour's tax rises. let me address this directly because _ iabour's tax rises. let me address this directly because he _ iabour's tax rises. let me address this directly because he said - this directly because he said he warned — this directly because he said he warned the country about liz truss and the _ warned the country about liz truss and the damage she was going to do to our— and the damage she was going to do to our economy. and in the next breath, — to our economy. and in the next breath, he — to our economy. and in the next breath, he said we must unite behind her and _ breath, he said we must unite behind her and support her. why on earth would _ her and support her. why on earth would he — her and support her. why on earth would he will unite behind someone...— would he will unite behind someone... ., ~ ., ., �*, ~ someone... you know what it's like to fall behind _ someone... you know what it's like to fall behind the _ someone. .. you know what it's like to fall behind the leader— someone... you know what it's like to fall behind the leader of - someone... you know what it's like to fall behind the leader of your - to fall behind the leader of your party. to fall behind the leader of your .a _ �* , , ., to fall behind the leader of your party. he's repeating the problem. crosstalk heat she's one of his candidates. his elections pitch to you seems to be, my— his elections pitch to you seems to be, my predecessor, a tory prime minister. — be, my predecessor, a tory prime minister, broke the country, did huge _ minister, broke the country, did huge economic damage, please vote tory~ _ huge economic damage, please vote tory~ you _ huge economic damage, please vote tory. you have to decide whether that's— tory. you have to decide whether that's persuasive. he's now openly admitted _ that's persuasive. he's now openly admitted that the damage the tories have done _ admitted that the damage the tories have done and saying please vote for him. have done and saying please vote for hint that's _ have done and saying please vote for him. that's the last thing we need in this— him. that's the last thing we need in this country.— in this country. when it comes to the economy. — in this country. when it comes to the economy. i— in this country. when it comes to the economy, i was _ in this country. when it comes to the economy, i was right - in this country. when it comes to the economy, i was right then. i in this country. when it comes to - the economy, i was right then. since i've been your prime minister, inflation is back to normal. energy bills are falling, and we start cutting taxes and i will keep cutting taxes and i will keep cutting your taxes. that is my... that's a choice at the selection. taxes that he wants to put up on you are coming. he won't re—evaluate... every pensioner that is watching should realise that for the first time in our country's history, the state pension will be subject to a retirement tax under labour. that's what their plans are. we're not going to do that. we will have the triple lot plus. going to do that. we will have the triple lot plus— triple lot plus. don't insult eo - le. triple lot plus. don't insult people. don't _ triple lot plus. don't insult people. don't put - triple lot plus. don't insult people. don't put out - triple lot plus. don't insult - people. don't put out falsehood. which _ people. don't put out falsehood. which ones are false? can people. don't put out falsehood. which ones are false?— which ones are false? can you confirm- -- _ which ones are false? can you confirm... the _ which ones are false? can you confirm... the only _ which ones are false? can you confirm... the only way - which ones are false? can you confirm... the only way for . which ones are false? can you confirm... the only way for it. which ones are false? can you i confirm... the only way for it not is for you to match our triple lot plus. maybe you could change policy here when you match the triple lot plus. here when you match the triple lot lus. , ., , ., here when you match the triple lot lus. ,.,, ., ., here when you match the triple lot lus. ., ., , ., here when you match the triple lot lus. ., ., ,., , ,., plus. the position on state pension that we set — plus. the position on state pension that we set out... _ plus. the position on state pension that we set out... we _ plus. the position on state pension that we set out... we need - plus. the position on state pension that we set out... we need to - plus. the position on state pension that we set out... we need to hear| that we set out... we need to hear this response- _ that we set out. .. we need to hear this response. i— that we set out... we need to hear this response. i think _ that we set out... we need to hear this response. i think we _ that we set out... we need to hear this response. i think we should i this response. i think we should resect this response. i think we should respect the _ this response. i think we should respect the audience, _ this response. i think we should respect the audience, who - this response. i think we should respect the audience, who wantj this response. i think we should i respect the audience, who want to know— respect the audience, who want to know what— respect the audience, who want to know what i got to say about this without _ know what i got to say about this without constantly being interrupted.— without constantly being interruted. ~ . h . , without constantly being interruted. . . �*, ., , ., interrupted. what's the answer to the question? _ interrupted. what's the answer to the question? the _ interrupted. what's the answer to the question? the pretension - interrupted. what's the answer to the question? the pretension on| the question? the pretension on ensioner the question? the pretension on pensioner tax — the question? the pretension on pensioner tax that _ the question? the pretension on pensioner tax that we've - the question? the pretension on pensioner tax that we've set - the question? the pretension on pensioner tax that we've set out | the question? the pretension on l pensioner tax that we've set out is exactly _ pensioner tax that we've set out is exactly the — pensioner tax that we've set out is exactly the same. it is the position of the _ exactly the same. it is the position of the government of their last budget — of the government of their last budget. the prime minister now says he's going _ budget. the prime minister now says he's going to change that. when asked _ he's going to change that. when asked where the money comes from, his chancellor says is being spent that isn't— his chancellor says is being spent that isn't there. that is making the same _ that isn't there. that is making the same mistake again.— same mistake again. crosstalk you should _ same mistake again. crosstalk you should know _ same mistake again. crosstalk you should know there's - same mistake again. crosstalk you should know there's a - same mistake again. crosstalk - you should know there's a retirement tax coming for you, r, t.— tax coming for you, r, t. crosstalk he won't match _ tax coming for you, r, t. crosstalk he won't match our _ tax coming for you, r, t. crosstalk he won't match our triple _ tax coming for you, r, t. crosstalk he won't match our triple lot - tax coming for you, r, t. crosstalk he won't match our triple lot plus. i he won't match our triple lot plus. that will happen if i'm prime minister. that's what i will deliver. do not surrender your finances to their tax rises. heat finances to their tax rises. next question- _ finances to their tax rises. next question. pensioners _ finances to their tax rises. next question. pensioners will - finances to their tax rises. next question. pensioners will not i finances to their tax rises. next| question. pensioners will not be better off. _ question. pensioners will not be better off. but _ question. pensioners will not be better off, but he's _ question. pensioners will not be better off, but he's making - question. pensioners will not be - better off, but he's making promises he can't _ better off, but he's making promises he can't keep because they're not funded _ he can't keep because they're not funded. we cannot repeat... there's one thing _ funded. we cannot repeat... there's one thing we — funded. we cannot repeat... there's one thing we cannot repeat, please do not _ one thing we cannot repeat, please do not go _ one thing we cannot repeat, please do not go back to liz truss mach two with this _ do not go back to liz truss mach two with this prime minister. crosstalk we are going — with this prime minister. crosstalk we are going to _ with this prime minister. crosstalk we are going to end _ with this prime minister. crosstalk we are going to end this _ with this prime minister. crosstalk we are going to end this topic. - we are going to end this topic. thank you both. lots of topics to get through. thank you. this next question is from karen durand. l’m get through. thank you. this next question is from karen durand. lift a question is from karen durand. i'm a children's nurse _ question is from karen durand. i'm a children's nurse at _ question is from karen durand. i'm a children's nurse at a _ question is from karen durand. i'm a children's nurse at a local _ children's nurse at a local hospital _ children's nurse at a local hospital i_ children's nurse at a local hospital. i see _ children's nurse at a local hospital. i see families i children's nurse at a local- hospital. i see families affected by libraries— hospital. i see families affected by libraries and — hospital. i see families affected by libraries and children _ hospital. i see families affected by libraries and children centres - libraries and children centres closing _ libraries and children centres closing how— libraries and children centres closing. how will— libraries and children centres closing. how will you - libraries and children centres closing. how will you help i libraries and children centres - closing. how will you help councils after _ closing. how will you help councils after nottingham _ closing. how will you help councils after nottingham city _ closing. how will you help councils after nottingham city council - closing. how will you help councils after nottingham city council has. after nottingham city council has effectively — after nottingham city council has effectively gone _ after nottingham city council has effectively gone banquet? - after nottingham city council has effectively gone banquet? thank| after nottingham city council has - effectively gone banquet? thank you, karen _ effectively gone banquet? thank you, karen wins _ effectively gone banquet? thank you, karen wins bankrupt. _ the council was run by labour since 909i _ the council was run by labour since 9091. �* �* , . ., . the council was run by labour since 9091. ~ �* _ . 9091. and i'm very concerned about the situation — 9091. and i'm very concerned about the situation because _ 9091. and i'm very concerned about the situation because i _ 9091. and i'm very concerned about the situation because i think - the situation because i think anybody— the situation because i think anybody looking at this council is concerned — anybody looking at this council is concerned about basic services, whether— concerned about basic services, whether it's libraries or other support _ whether it's libraries or other support. this is a position for councils— support. this is a position for councils of— support. this is a position for councils of all political stripes. they— councils of all political stripes. they have _ councils of all political stripes. they have gone bankrupt because of the lack _ they have gone bankrupt because of the lack of _ they have gone bankrupt because of the lack of adequate and structured funding _ the lack of adequate and structured funding and from the government. you asked _ funding and from the government. you asked what— funding and from the government. you asked what we would do and i think it's important to set out what we would _ it's important to set out what we would do — it's important to set out what we would do if — it's important to set out what we would do if you came into office. we would _ would do if you came into office. we would change the way the payments are made _ would change the way the payments are made at the moment. leaders are saying _ are made at the moment. leaders are saying they— are made at the moment. leaders are saying they are made on a yearly basis _ saying they are made on a yearly basis if— saying they are made on a yearly basis. if there are longer—term, we could _ basis. if there are longer—term, we could make — basis. if there are longer—term, we could make much better use of that. secondly. _ could make much better use of that. secondly, they're saying if you could — secondly, they're saying if you could do — secondly, they're saying if you could do what the conservative promised — could do what the conservative promised that didn't actually do, to stop no—fault evictions, that would massively— stop no—fault evictions, that would massively help councils. a lot of them _ massively help councils. a lot of them end — massively help councils. a lot of them end up having support from local— them end up having support from local authority. them end up having support from localauthority. i them end up having support from local authority. i think we should actually— local authority. i think we should actually get on and get rid of... gn actually get on and get rid of... on our actually get on and get rid of... your point actually get on and get rid of... (131 your point about county actually get on and get rid of... on your point about county funding, a multiyear funding your point about county funding, a multiyearfunding plan your point about county funding, a multiyear funding plan doesn't necessarily... are you saying there is more money that will come to local authorities under a labour government? it local authorities under a labour government?— local authorities under a labour covernment? . , ., ., ., , government? it means the available money could — government? it means the available money could be _ government? it means the available money could be used _ government? it means the available money could be used better - government? it means the available | money could be used better because any council— money could be used better because any council leader will tell you that trying to make the best use of the money— that trying to make the best use of the money within the constraints of the money within the constraints of the 12—month period doesn't work. it's the 12—month period doesn't work. it's better— the 12—month period doesn't work. it's better use for existing money. i'm it's better use for existing money. l'm not— it's better use for existing money. i'm not going to stand here and say there _ i'm not going to stand here and say there is— i'm not going to stand here and say there is some magic wand that i can waive the _ there is some magic wand that i can waive the day after the election and find money that isn't there. huge damage _ find money that isn't there. huge damage has been done to our economy. it is damage has been done to our economy. it is going _ damage has been done to our economy. it is going to _ damage has been done to our economy. it is going to take time. that's why our manifesto is a manifesto for growing — our manifesto is a manifesto for growing our economy, for creating wealth. _ growing our economy, for creating wealth. to — growing our economy, for creating wealth, to making sure that we can make _ wealth, to making sure that we can make sure — wealth, to making sure that we can make sure all of our services, whether— make sure all of our services, whether that's councils or others, properly— whether that's councils or others, properly funded, providing the services — properly funded, providing the services that people expect. rishi sunak, services that people expect. rishi sunak. how _ services that people expect. rishi sunak, how will _ services that people expect. rishi sunak, how will you _ services that people expect. iii si sunak, how will you help services that people expect. iii. si sunak, how will you help councils? karen, my firstjob in government was local government minister, sol was local government minister, sol was responsible for councils, and they do an extra ordinaryjob. actually, most politics is local and it's what's happening in your street, your neighbourhood and your community. the services you mentioned are so important, particularly those that concern families and children. one thing i do want to do is actually roll out family hubs, as we've done over the past few years, which are special places were families can come and get support. in terms of funding councils, we have announced just over half £1 billion of extra funding for councils, for disability for social care, which is where some of the big pressures are. we'll continue to work with councils to provide the support they need. you mentioned nottingham. that is a glimpse of the future. nottingham city council bankrupt under labour. birmingham city council, the largest counsel in the country — in fact, the largest in europe — notjust bankrupt, but everyone in birmingham is now paying a 20% higher council tax bill. that is a snapshot of what will happen if keir starmer is in power and across the country. as labour always do, they run out of money, bankrupt the economy, and that's why everyone in birmingham �*s paying a 20% higher. you that's why everyone in birmingham 's paying a 20% higher.— paying a 20% higher. you do know... you will be — paying a 20% higher. you do know... you will be aware... _ paying a 20% higher. you do know... you will be aware... you _ paying a 20% higher. you do know... you will be aware... you will be - you will be aware... you will be aware of course that... do you will be aware... you will be aware of course that. . .- aware of course that... do not surrender _ aware of course that. .. do not surrender your— aware of course that... do not surrender your councils - aware of course that... do not surrender your councils to - aware of course that... do not i surrender your councils to them. similar problems wouldn't conservatives were in charge of. exactly the same problem. what would you say— exactly the same problem. what would you say about that? the prime minister— you say about that? the prime minister gloating... crosstalk he's responsible... _ minister gloating... crosstalk he's responsible... you - minister gloating... crosstalk he's responsible... you can - minister gloating... crosstalk he's responsible... you can go | minister gloating... crosstalk i he's responsible... you can go and check. he's responsible... you can go and check- the — he's responsible... you can go and check. the same _ he's responsible... you can go and check. the same thing _ he's responsible... you can go and check. the same thing happened i he's responsible... you can go and | check. the same thing happened in nottingham. that's what you get with the labour party. you remember what happened last time they were in office, and they run out of your money and they bankrupt the country and you will pay for it in higher taxes. that is the choice for you. we are making progress, the economy is growing. taxes are now coming down. the financial security that you want i can deliver, but if we put that risk, your family finances will get hammered. taxes will get whacked up and that is a choice for you at this election. do not surrender. reminding everyone watching to we have more questions coming in this prime ministerial debate but on mine on the bbc live page you will would bbc verify are already doing in fact checking the claims made here. good evenina , checking the claims made here. good evening, gentlemen. _ checking the claims made here. good evening, gentlemen. i— checking the claims made here. good evening, gentlemen. ithink checking the claims made here. good evening, gentlemen. i think they have _ evening, gentlemen. i think they have done — evening, gentlemen. i think they have done a _ evening, gentlemen. i think they have done a fair— evening, gentlemen. i think they have done a fairjob _ evening, gentlemen. i think they have done a fairjob of— evening, gentlemen. i think they have done a fairjob of being - have done a fairjob of being chancellor— have done a fairjob of being chancellor but _ have done a fairjob of being chancellor but a _ have done a fairjob of being chancellor but a pretty- chancellor but a pretty mediocre prime _ chancellor but a pretty mediocre prime minister. _ chancellor but a pretty mediocre prime minister. sir— chancellor but a pretty mediocre prime minister. sir keir- chancellor but a pretty mediocre | prime minister. sir keir starmer, chancellor but a pretty mediocre i prime minister. sir keir starmer, i think— prime minister. sir keir starmer, i think that — prime minister. sir keir starmer, i think that your— prime minister. sir keir starmer, i think that your strings _ prime minister. sir keir starmer, i think that your strings are - prime minister. sir keir starmer, i think that your strings are being i think that your strings are being pulled _ think that your strings are being pulled by— think that your strings are being pulled by very— think that your strings are being pulled by very senior _ think that your strings are being pulled by very senior membersl think that your strings are being i pulled by very senior members of think that your strings are being - pulled by very senior members of the labour— pulled by very senior members of the labour party — pulled by very senior members of the labour party. are _ pulled by very senior members of the labour party. are you _ pulled by very senior members of the labour party. are you two _ pulled by very senior members of the labour party. are you two really- pulled by very senior members of the labour party. are you two really the i labour party. are you two really the best we've — labour party. are you two really the best we've got — labour party. are you two really the best we've got to _ labour party. are you two really the best we've got to be _ labour party. are you two really the best we've got to be the _ labour party. are you two really the best we've got to be the next - labour party. are you two really the best we've got to be the next primej best we've got to be the next prime minister— best we've got to be the next prime minister of— best we've got to be the next prime minister of our— best we've got to be the next prime minister of our great— best we've got to be the next prime minister of our great country? - minister of our great country? applause _ minister of our great country? applause l— minister of our great country? applause-— applause. i can understand everyone's _ applause. i can understand everyone's frustration - applause. i can understand i everyone's frustration because applause. i can understand - everyone's frustration because the last few years have not been easy to have dealt with a lot of the country and i certainly will be the first three notes we have not done everything right. but i've been prime ministerfor 18 everything right. but i've been prime minister for 18 months and at that time, we have gotten inflation down and all the damage is doing to the cost of living back to target. the economy in the first quart of this year the fastest growing in the g7. wages rising and the primaryjob was to deliver that economic stability so i could start cutting your taxes. that is the journey we are now on. whatever your other frustrations, the choice is about the future. if you want more taxes, if you want your borders secure and steve is asking before for a sensible approach to net zero amateur pension protected for the triple locked plus, that is what i will do for you. this is a serious election with consequences for you and yourfamily election with consequences for you and your family and election with consequences for you and yourfamily and i get the frustrations but think about the choice and allow me to finish the job i started in touch her taxes and secure your borders. if keir starmer and labour party are in charge, borders and secure, taxes up, saddled with bills and your reverse net zero changes and every pensioner will have the tax increase that is the choice you will have in your mind. ., , ., , , the choice you will have in your mind. .,, ., , , .., mind. robert, early in my careeri worked in — mind. robert, early in my careeri worked in northern _ mind. robert, early in my careeri worked in northern ireland - mind. robert, early in my careeri worked in northern ireland as - mind. robert, early in my career i| worked in northern ireland as part of the _ worked in northern ireland as part of the good friday agreement. with the team, _ of the good friday agreement. with the team, i— of the good friday agreement. with the team, i set out to change to make _ the team, i set out to change to make sure — the team, i set out to change to make sure to gain the confidence of all communities in northern ireland which _ all communities in northern ireland which is _ all communities in northern ireland which is really important part of the peace — which is really important part of the peace process is december we delivered — the peace process is december we delivered. and the crown prosecution service _ delivered. and the crown prosecution service for— delivered. and the crown prosecution service for five years and 7000 staff— service for five years and 7000 staff would improve the way it would do it and _ staff would improve the way it would do it and we made the change we got on with— do it and we made the change we got on with it _ do it and we made the change we got on with it we made that change is more _ on with it we made that change is more successful. leading a four nap years— more successful. leading a four nap years ago. _ more successful. leading a four nap years ago, we would change her party to make _ years ago, we would change her party to make sure we will be a part of a credible _ to make sure we will be a part of a credible opposition for the country and change in the country and would always— and change in the country and would always say— and change in the country and would always say country first, party second — always say country first, party second. and what i now asking for is the opportunity to change our country— the opportunity to change our country for the better because he had 14— country for the better because he had 14 pretty awful years and we have _ had 14 pretty awful years and we have ended up with almost everything not working very well and when this government came and, most people not feeling _ government came and, most people not feeling better off and this is a choice — feeling better off and this is a choice collection and if we go on for another five years of this because _ for another five years of this because of rishi sunak, that is not going _ because of rishi sunak, that is not going to _ because of rishi sunak, that is not going to change. and this is the opportunity to turn the page and rebuild _ opportunity to turn the page and rebuild our country and rebuild a public— rebuild our country and rebuild a public service and rebuild our economy— public service and rebuild our economy and make sure we can genuinely— economy and make sure we can genuinely say to ourselves we are a better— genuinely say to ourselves we are a better country, better run better public _ better country, better run better public services and people feel better— public services and people feel better off and i have done that change — better off and i have done that change them asking for the opportunity. i change them asking for the opportunity-— change them asking for the ouortuni . , ,,. ., opportunity. i suspect they know our opportunity. i suspect they know your background _ opportunity. i suspect they know your background and _ opportunity. i suspect they know your background and he - opportunity. i suspect they knowj your background and he certainly knows that you have been chancellor and probably been familiar with your arguments and still says are you two really the best we've got to be the prime minister of our country. polling suggests there is no great enthusiasm for either of you. do you recognise that, do you hear that on the campaign trailand recognise that, do you hear that on the campaign trail and are you aware of that? l the campaign trail and are you aware of that? . ., , the campaign trail and are you aware of that? .., , , of that? i recognise his frustration. _ of that? i recognise his frustration. it's - of that? i recognise his frustration. it's more i of that? i recognise his - frustration. it's more personal of that? i recognise his _ frustration. it's more personalthan that, it's talking _ frustration. it's more personalthan that, it's talking about _ frustration. it's more personalthan that, it's talking about but - frustration. it's more personalthan that, it's talking about but then - that, it's talking about but then you. that, it's talking about but then ou. �* �* , . that, it's talking about but then ou. �* h ., . ., . that, it's talking about but then ou. ., you. but there's a choice for everyone- — you. but there's a choice for everyone. you _ you. but there's a choice for everyone. you don't - you. but there's a choice for everyone. you don't get - you. but there's a choice for- everyone. you don't get change unless you have a plan to deliver change. just think it is going to bring about any change and as you've heard tonight, there's no plan to cut your taxes, no plan to reform the welfare bill, no plan to deal with the legal migration and that's the reality of it. there will be change but it may not be change that you like, when tax goes up and become the soft touch for illegal migrants and pensioners are playing tax for the first time. that is the change that is coming do not surrender that because your families are going to pay the price. —— paying. l are going to pay the price. -- -a inc. . are going to pay the price. -- .a in.. ., ., are going to pay the price. -- -a inc. . .,, ,, are going to pay the price. -- - in. . ., , , , ., paying. i am not surprised that after 14 years _ paying. i am not surprised that after 14 years of _ paying. i am not surprised that after 14 years of this, - paying. i am not surprised that after 14 years of this, people i paying. i am not surprised that i after 14 years of this, people feel that the — after 14 years of this, people feel that the hope is been beaten out of them _ that the hope is been beaten out of them because the countries in such a state _ them because the countries in such a state and _ them because the countries in such a state and they have had promises made _ state and they have had promises made over— state and they have had promises made over the last election over what _ made over the last election over what would happen which have not been _ what would happen which have not been on _ what would happen which have not been on and that does bit to help out a _ been on and that does bit to help out a people of a fist question was about— out a people of a fist question was about integrity and politics and people — about integrity and politics and people have not seen that integrity in the _ people have not seen that integrity in the event of breach of covid—19 rules— in the event of breach of covid—19 rules and — in the event of breach of covid—19 rules and the contracts of covid—19, the instincts — rules and the contracts of covid—19, the instincts for covert and trying to make — the instincts for covert and trying to make money and the gambling commission nonsense for the last few weeks _ commission nonsense for the last few weeks and _ commission nonsense for the last few weeks and this is an opportunity to restore _ weeks and this is an opportunity to restore that hope and i don't think we can— restore that hope and i don't think we can do— restore that hope and i don't think we can do that by making grand promises — we can do that by making grand promises for things that cannot be delivered — promises for things that cannot be delivered and i think it's the ordinary— delivered and i think it's the ordinary hope of working people, my family's— ordinary hope of working people, my family's working class, the ordinary hope _ family's working class, the ordinary hope of— family's working class, the ordinary hope of getting on for your family and getting off your community and your country. it has to be rooted if you're _ your country. it has to be rooted if you're going — your country. it has to be rooted if you're going to restore hope in my view— you're going to restore hope in my view and _ you're going to restore hope in my view and returning politics to service — view and returning politics to service in _ view and returning politics to service in the sense that you come to serve _ service in the sense that you come to serve~ 0" — service in the sense that you come to serve. ., ., , ., to serve. on that note, the question from rachel— to serve. on that note, the question from rachel webster. _ to serve. on that note, the question from rachelwebster. how- to serve. on that note, the question from rachel webster. how can - to serve. on that note, the question from rachelwebster. how can i - from rachelwebster. how can i ensure that _ from rachelwebster. how can i ensure that the _ from rachelwebster. how can i ensure that the five _ from rachelwebster. how can i ensure that the five of - from rachelwebster. how can i ensure that the five of three - ensure that the five of three interview— ensure that the five of three interview two _ ensure that the five of three interview two men, - ensure that the five of three interview two men, you - ensure that the five of three interview two men, you put| ensure that the five of three - interview two men, you put women's interests _ interview two men, you put women's interests first? — interests first? applause - applause good question. as a team, have partners with me were very good strong women who will deliver for the country. rachel reeves would be the country. rachel reeves would be the first woman chancellor if we are elected into government and in the bank of england, period keen and strong on the fiscal rules what we need to do for economy we have angela rayner who again as an incredible background coming from a difficult background where as a character many years and now deputy leader of my party and these people and plenty of others and bridget phillips, you name it, really good strong women who will be a part of my team and leadership is about empowering your team in making sure it is a team on the pitch that are all working together and that is the way i lead not suggesting for a moment that i am the one with all the answers but knowing if i lead my team and put my team into this and work as a team, and serve as a team, we will get the opportunity to do so that i would do it with really fantastic wonderful women who have been on this — fantastic wonderful women who have been on this journey _ fantastic wonderful women who have been on this journey changing our. been on this journey changing our party— been on this journey changing our party to— been on this journey changing our party to put it before the country with that, — party to put it before the country with that, no essential principle of country _ with that, no essential principle of country first, party second. rishi sunak, country first, party second. rishi sunak. how _ country first, party second. rishi sunak, how would _ country first, party second. rishi sunak, how would you _ country first, party second. iii. si sunak, how would you ensure country first, party second. ii si sunak, how would you ensure you country first, party second. ii1 si sunak, how would you ensure you put women's interests first.— women's interests first. rachel, i have two young _ women's interests first. rachel, i have two young daughters. - women's interests first. rachel, i have two young daughters. and i women's interests first. rachel, i. have two young daughters. and that is i can trust me because as a dad, first and foremost rather than the prime minister, i want them to grow up prime minister, i want them to grow up in a country which is safe for them when they become teenagers and can walk around on their own and make sure we have the right police on the street in the community safe for women and girls girls it's very important to me and make sure they have the health that they need and we were making changes to things like hrt maternity care and hospital spouse want to make sure that when they grow up and have jobs and start a family that they're supported too which is why we are rolling out free childcare for every working parent from the time the little one is nine months old and when they go off to school it for years not make a big difference to families up and down the country and that is why. i'm going to lots more policies and i want my girls to grow up in a country where the skies the limit for their ambitions and there's nothing they cannot do because they are women and that is the kind of place that i believe in.— place that i believe in. printing and a related _ place that i believe in. printing and a related question, - place that i believe in. printing and a related question, the - place that i believe in. printing | and a related question, the bbc place that i believe in. printing - and a related question, the bbc your voice, your vote, vicky asks this when doubly protect women's rights to single—sex basis for many males regardless of if they hold a grc, gender recognition certificate? yes. gender recognition certificate? yes, unequivocally _ gender recognition certificate? yes, unequivocally and _ gender recognition certificate? yes, unequivocally and will _ gender recognition certificate? i;e:s unequivocally and will change the law so that the equalities act recognises that sex means biological sex and that will allows to deliver on what vicki wants which is to protect female only spaces, female only services and it is crystal clear that there is a choice on that question at this collection. keir starmer is not matched my pledge to reform the equalities act and as the only way to deliver on what vicki says and the reason he will not do that, he can explain this because he is not sure, like i am to these matters, sex means biological sex and that is how you protect female only spaces and services. applause. only spaces and services. applause-— only spaces and services. applause. , , , ., applause. yes, it is very important that we protect _ applause. yes, it is very important that we protect women _ applause. yes, it is very important that we protect women spaces - applause. yes, it is very important that we protect women spaces and i j that we protect women spaces and i saw this— that we protect women spaces and i saw this first—hand when i was back in 2008 _ saw this first—hand when i was back in 2008 at — saw this first—hand when i was back in 2008 at 2013 i was working with groups— in 2008 at 2013 i was working with groups who are supportive of women who have _ groups who are supportive of women who have been subjected to st domestic— who have been subjected to st domestic violence and sexual violence _ domestic violence and sexual violence not important it is to have this woman's places and in sports, yes. _ this woman's places and in sports, yes, yes _ this woman's places and in sports, yes, yes to— this woman's places and in sports, yes, yes to that answer but what i will also _ yes, yes to that answer but what i will also say as i do recognise that there _ will also say as i do recognise that there are — will also say as i do recognise that there are a — will also say as i do recognise that there are a small number of people were born _ there are a small number of people were born into a gender that they don't _ were born into a gender that they don't identify with and i would treat— don't identify with and i would treat them as a treat all human beings, — treat them as a treat all human beings, with dignity and respect. and if— beings, with dignity and respect. and if you — beings, with dignity and respect. and if you don't, you end up with the prime — and if you don't, you end up with the prime minister of the united kingdom — the prime minister of the united kingdom standing in parliament making — kingdom standing in parliament making an anti—trans joke kingdom standing in parliament making an anti—transjoke in kingdom standing in parliament making an anti—trans joke in front of a mother— making an anti—trans joke in front of a mother of a murder trans teenager— of a mother of a murder trans teenager and i will never ever allow myself— teenager and i will never ever allow myself to— teenager and i will never ever allow myself to be put into that position. i myself to be put into that position. i was _ myself to be put into that position. i was pointing that you changed your mind on this question multiple times but the answer vicki's question, it cannot deliver on what vicki wants everyone who wants female spaces protected, has to be prepared to change the laws of the equalities act and recognising that sex means biological sex. act and recognising that sex means biologicalsex. it act and recognising that sex means biological sex. it is pretty straightforward. keir starmer says that he won't change the law to do its wings not being straight with you again. saying one thing and doing another eight not will not change not recognise that sex means biological sex you cannot sit in vicki and everett also cares about this issue that she will actually ensure that their spaces are protected. ensure that their spaces are protected-— ensure that their spaces are rotected. �* , , , protected. being in his may support sentences i have _ protected. being in his may support sentences i have been _ protected. being in his may support sentences i have been in _ protected. being in his may support sentences i have been in with - protected. being in his may support| sentences i have been in with sexual violence _ sentences i have been in with sexual violence and — sentences i have been in with sexual violence and domestic violence and you know— violence and domestic violence and you know very well that is being done _ you know very well that is being done that— you know very well that is being done that supported it being done when _ done that supported it being done when supported being to manaus chief and i always believed in safe women spaces _ and i always believed in safe women spaces back into 2008 way before this latest iteration and i recognised myself how important it was to— recognised myself how important it was to have that space, women only spaces. _ was to have that space, women only spaces, biologicalwomen was to have that space, women only spaces, biological women on the expense — spaces, biological women on the expense particularly in that area and other— expense particularly in that area and other areas.— expense particularly in that area and other areas. how do you ensure it without changing _ and other areas. how do you ensure it without changing the _ and other areas. how do you ensure it without changing the act? - and other areas. how do you ensure it without changing the act? it - and other areas. how do you ensure it without changing the act? it is - it without changing the act? it is actually spelled _ it without changing the act? it is actually spelled out in front of the examples — actually spelled out in front of the examples in the act and it always has been — examples in the act and it always has been. fabricating a difference here in— has been. fabricating a difference here in a — has been. fabricating a difference here in a situation or should be trying — here in a situation or should be trying to— here in a situation or should be trying to find common ground and work— trying to find common ground and work together and proud of the record — work together and proud of the record of— work together and proud of the record of my party on women's rights we have _ record of my party on women's rights we have done amazing things in terms of equality— we have done amazing things in terms of equality and labour governments and bag _ of equality and labour governments and bag a _ of equality and labour governments and bag a massive difference to millions— and bag a massive difference to millions of lives in is much more work— millions of lives in is much more work to— millions of lives in is much more work to do— millions of lives in is much more work to do on women's equality going forward _ work to do on women's equality going forward but _ work to do on women's equality going forward but the only way i think we can make _ forward but the only way i think we can make that progress is if you change — can make that progress is if you change the way that we do politics and stop— change the way that we do politics and stop this business of always trying _ and stop this business of always trying to— and stop this business of always trying to divide everybody and actually — trying to divide everybody and actually use the opportunity of leadership which is what i would do, to say— leadership which is what i would do, to say the _ leadership which is what i would do, to say the job of the leader of the country— to say the job of the leader of the country is — to say the job of the leader of the country is to bring people together and with— country is to bring people together and with different and difficult discussions and different opinions but the _ discussions and different opinions but the role of the country is to bring _ but the role of the country is to bring that— but the role of the country is to bring that together so that the country— bring that together so that the country itself is less divided and on the _ country itself is less divided and on the issues for me is with sadness, _ on the issues for me is with sadness, the fact that over the last 14 sadness, the fact that over the last m years. _ sadness, the fact that over the last 14 years, there's been this tendency on almost _ 14 years, there's been this tendency on almost every issue to try to find the point _ on almost every issue to try to find the point of— on almost every issue to try to find the point of difference in division rather— the point of difference in division rather than doing what were actually net rather than doing what were actually get out _ rather than doing what were actually get out as— rather than doing what were actually get out as a country which is bring people _ get out as a country which is bring people together. this get out as a country which is bring people together-— people together. this is where the coura . e people together. this is where the couraue of people together. this is where the courage of your— people together. this is where the courage of your convictions - people together. this is where the courage of your convictions and . courage of your convictions and principles. i believe when it comes to these matters, sex means biological sex. to these matters, sex means biologicalsex. of to these matters, sex means biological sex. of course we should have compassion and tolerance of people are going through questioning that, but fundamentally, when it comes to women safety, women's only spaces, sex means biological sex for me, that is the only way to make sure you can deliver the protections that vicki wants in on this question, keir starmer, one of us on female mps made that point a while ago, he said that she was wrong. she was hounded. he has now changed his mind on that question and then goes back to the trust goes back to having the courage of convictions and i know not all of you will agree with my stance, but i'm being clear with my stance, but i'm being clear with you. sex means biological sex interchange the equalities act to deliver the security of people space in women's services and if you do not agree with that, that's fine. this is all set out of the equalities act and the specific instance _ equalities act and the specific instance of safe spaces and with the legislation— instance of safe spaces and with the legislation look at the notes on legislation look at the notes on legislation that's been there for years — legislation that's been there for years. notjust use this as legislation that's been there for years. not just use this as a political— years. not just use this as a political football to try to divide people — political football to try to divide people across the country. this is from julie waters. _ people across the country. this is from julie waters. i _ people across the country. this is from julie waters. i own - people across the country. this is from julie waters. i own a - people across the country. this is from julie waters. i own a vinyl i from julie waters. i own a vinyl record business _ from julie waters. i own a vinyl record business with _ from julie waters. i own a vinyl record business with my - from julie waters. i own a vinyl i record business with my partner. post-brexit, _ record business with my partner. post—brexit, we _ record business with my partner. post—brexit, we have _ record business with my partner. post—brexit, we have lost- record business with my partner. post—brexit, we have lost 90% i record business with my partner. | post—brexit, we have lost 90% of record business with my partner. - post—brexit, we have lost 90% of our business _ post—brexit, we have lost 90% of our business with — post—brexit, we have lost 90% of our business with europe, _ post—brexit, we have lost 90% of our business with europe, how— post—brexit, we have lost 90% of our business with europe, how can - post—brexit, we have lost 90% of our business with europe, how can we . business with europe, how can we mend _ business with europe, how can we mend our— business with europe, how can we mend our broken— business with europe, how can we mend our broken trading - business with europe, how can we i mend our broken trading relationship with europe? — mend our broken trading relationship with europe? 9096— mend our broken trading relationship with europe?— with europe? 9096 of her business with europe? 9096 of her business with our with europe? 9096 of her business with your best _ with europe? 9096 of her business with your best been _ with europe? 9096 of her business with your best been lost, - with europe? 9096 of her business with your best been lost, keir- with your best been lost, keir starmer you were a remainder and you voted for leave, rishi sunak, how to mean mend our broken trading relationship with europe? thank you for doinu relationship with europe? thank you for doing what _ relationship with europe? thank you for doing what you _ relationship with europe? thank you for doing what you do, _ relationship with europe? thank you for doing what you do, my _ relationship with europe? thank you for doing what you do, my mother i relationship with europe? thank you i for doing what you do, my mother was a small business owner in a group of the family that on the small business and all of the struggles are like in the economy is built on people like you you deserve all our support and affirmation and praise. i'm sorry but we have to referendum and focus should be on making sure we have the best opportunities in an economy wide sense, were doing very well and exporting around the world but in order to help you, if two specific things that i can do that will help. one of them is to make sure that we cut your taxes on business rates and small retailers, i think you said you princess, everyone talks my business rates and when we cut business rates for retail restaurants and shops across country and labour on wells, they have not done that in the second thing will do for you and all of those like you are self—employed and others in small businesses, i want to abolish national insurance to have more financial security. as a person is make sure we have good relations with europe, will continue to do so by the best i can help your small business and of hundreds of thousands of others like us is to continue to cut your taxes because as i will give you financial security. as i will give you financial security-— as i will give you financial securi. . , ~, ., security. that is £46 billion, £46 billion being _ security. that is £46 billion, £46 billion being spent _ security. that is £46 billion, £46 billion being spent in _ security. that is £46 billion, £46 billion being spent in the - security. that is £46 billion, £46 billion being spent in the past i billion being spent in the past minute — billion being spent in the past minute without saying where that money _ minute without saying where that money is — minute without saying where that money is coming from, that money is used for— money is coming from, that money is used for nhs and pensions, for going to cut _ used for nhs and pensions, for going to cut that— used for nhs and pensions, for going to cut that money, is it the nhs is that pensioners that are going to pay for— that pensioners that are going to pay for it? — that pensioners that are going to pay for it? so that pensioners that are going to -a for it? 1, that pensioners that are going to -a for it? ., ., ., that pensioners that are going to -a forit? ., ., ., ., pay for it? so far, none of you have answered your— pay for it? so far, none of you have answered your question _ pay for it? so far, none of you have answered your question as - pay for it? so far, none of you have answered your question as to i pay for it? so far, none of you have answered your question as to how l answered your question as to how we can mend our broken trading relationship with europe. the economy. — relationship with europe. the economy. they _ relationship with europe. the economy, they say _ relationship with europe. the economy, they say they're doing very well come _ economy, they say they're doing very well come by dumping millions of people _ well come by dumping millions of people feel it is going very well at all. people feel it is going very well at all the _ people feel it is going very well at all. the expo performs is going very badly— all. the expo performs is going very badly and _ all. the expo performs is going very badly and it's hurting them. in relation — badly and it's hurting them. in relation to— badly and it's hurting them. in relation to the eu, i did vote to remain— relation to the eu, i did vote to remain in— relation to the eu, i did vote to remain ina— relation to the eu, i did vote to remain in a voted to remain but we left we— remain in a voted to remain but we left we have — remain in a voted to remain but we left we have left the eu when we are not going _ left we have left the eu when we are not going back to the eu, but i do not going back to the eu, but i do not accept — not going back to the eu, but i do not accept that we cannot get a better _ not accept that we cannot get a better deal than the more me that because _ better deal than the more me that because too many businesses are in the position— because too many businesses are in the position you are in and you put yourself— the position you are in and you put yourself into your business, your money— yourself into your business, your money into— yourself into your business, your money into your business and you take risks — money into your business and you take risks for your business and you should _ take risks for your business and you should be _ take risks for your business and you should be supported. and we want to arrange _ should be supported. and we want to arrange to _ should be supported. and we want to arrange to get a better deal in trade — arrange to get a better deal in trade relations with the eu and adding — trade relations with the eu and adding borisjohnson botched it and he just— adding borisjohnson botched it and he just wanted to get a deal across the line _ he just wanted to get a deal across the line and i think we can get a better— the line and i think we can get a better trading deal and on research and development where we can work together— and development where we can work together and will be better for the country _ together and will be better for the country at — together and will be better for the country at a better deal when it comes— country at a better deal when it comes to — country at a better deal when it comes to security and defence. the ke thin comes to security and defence. the key thing for _ comes to security and defence. tie: key thing forjulie is the trade part, can we get a better trading deal with europe? we part, can we get a better trading dealwith europe?— part, can we get a better trading dealwith europe? we might be able to bu the dealwith europe? we might be able to buy the price _ dealwith europe? we might be able to buy the price of— dealwith europe? we might be able to buy the price of it _ dealwith europe? we might be able to buy the price of it will _ dealwith europe? we might be able to buy the price of it will be - dealwith europe? we might be able to buy the price of it will be free i to buy the price of it will be free movement of people that is why keir starmer is not being straight with you about. it's hard to sit down and anything is a set a custom for the last 18 months, negotiated the windsor framework for northern ireland and got us into their horizon programme, all the things he is talking about involve excepting more migrants. free movement via the back door and that is the choice for you in the selection. if you want free movement to come back about borders migration, that is the price of any deal like that of the eu and they have been crystal clear about that and if you want our migration, fair enough, that and if you want our migration, fairenough, i that and if you want our migration, fair enough, i don't think that's right i want to bring migration down that would not do any deal with the eu that increases migration mowing that a referendum that is what i will deliver for years.— will deliver for years. there is the give-and-take — will deliver for years. there is the give-and-take and _ will deliver for years. there is the give-and-take and you _ will deliver for years. there is the give-and-take and you get i will deliver for years. there is the give-and-take and you get deals| will deliver for years. there is the i give-and-take and you get deals like give—and—take and you get deals like this. we give-and-take and you get deals like this. ~ 1, give-and-take and you get deals like this. 1 ., ., ., give-and-take and you get deals like this.1 ., ., ., ., this. we are not going back into the eu and not rejoining _ this. we are not going back into the eu and not rejoining the _ this. we are not going back into the eu and not rejoining the single i eu and not rejoining the single market— eu and not rejoining the single market customs union and we are not accepting _ market customs union and we are not accepting freedom of movement but please _ accepting freedom of movement but please let— accepting freedom of movement but please let me finish answering the question — please let me finish answering the question i— please let me finish answering the question. i am please let me finish answering the question. iam not please let me finish answering the question. i am not a defeatist elected — question. i am not a defeatist elected prime minister, bad luck, that's— elected prime minister, bad luck, that's as — elected prime minister, bad luck, that's as good as it gets, you have to go— that's as good as it gets, you have to go arm — that's as good as it gets, you have to go arm of— that's as good as it gets, you have to go arm of the problems you've not, to go arm of the problems you've got, l'm — to go arm of the problems you've got, l'm not— to go arm of the problems you've got, i'm not going to say to you that— got, i'm not going to say to you that there's nothing i can do to help you — that there's nothing i can do to help you are the people in the same position _ help you are the people in the same position l'm — help you are the people in the same position. i'm going to say i thought we can— position. i'm going to say i thought we can get— position. i'm going to say i thought we can get a better deal than the botched — we can get a better deal than the botched deal that we have and i'm going _ botched deal that we have and i'm going to _ botched deal that we have and i'm going to go out and fight for it. l'm not— going to go out and fight for it. i'm not going to go back into the eu, but— i'm not going to go back into the eu, but im— i'm not going to go back into the eu, but i'm going to fight for a better— eu, but i'm going to fight for a better deal so you can trade more easily— better deal so you can trade more easily so — better deal so you can trade more easily so you can succeed and eric economy— easily so you can succeed and eric economy can succeed —— our economy economy can succeed “ oui’ economy can economy can succeed —— our economy can succeed _ economy can succeed —— our economy can succeed l— economy can succeed -- our economy can succeed-— can succeed. i have negotiated for the windsor _ can succeed. i have negotiated for the windsor framework _ can succeed. i have negotiated for the windsor framework restored i can succeed. i have negotiated for. the windsor framework restored the government and strengthen our union and make sure we are a part of the horizon scheme on positivist terms and welcomed the research community or universities with a track record of doing the stills of the eu. but you just say you'll get a deal, what will it cost, you're not being straight with people. i know it will us more migration. you think it's just magic, some good thing for us and they won't want something in return. it'sjust and they won't want something in return. it's just taking and they won't want something in return. it'sjust taking people and they won't want something in return. it's just taking people for foolishly been crystal clear that the price many of those things is greater migration. you the price many of those things is greater migration.— the price many of those things is greater migration. you would have to rive greater migration. you would have to give something _ greater migration. you would have to give something in _ greater migration. you would have to give something in return _ greater migration. you would have to give something in return for - greater migration. you would have to give something in return for the i give something in return for the kind of deal that you want. is kind of deal that you want. is important that you are very clear of the line _ important that you are very clear of the line she — important that you are very clear of the line she will not cross and i've set up _ the line she will not cross and i've set up the — the line she will not cross and i've set up the lines on the cross but i am not _ set up the lines on the cross but i am not a — set up the lines on the cross but i am not a defeatist and i nod and saw julie, nod and sanulie, this road is millions— nod and sanulie, this road is millions of— nod and sanulie, this road is millions of miles away from the lived _ millions of miles away from the lived worlds of the businesses in the farmers are trying to support there _ the farmers are trying to support there is— the farmers are trying to support there is a — the farmers are trying to support there is a massive gap and that is a problem _ there is a massive gap and that is a problem. will there is a massive gap and that is a roblem. 1 ,. there is a massive gap and that is a roblem. 1 y., ., .. , there is a massive gap and that is a roblem.1 , ., , ., problem. will you accept any greater mi . ration problem. will you accept any greater migration is — problem. will you accept any greater migration is a _ problem. will you accept any greater migration is a deal? _ problem. will you accept any greater migration is a deal? yes _ problem. will you accept any greater migration is a deal? yes or - problem. will you accept any greater migration is a deal? yes or no. i problem. will you accept any greater migration is a deal? yes or no. but i migration is a deal? yes or no. but i will say this, the migration is in record numbers at its prime minister he is the most liberal prime minister when it comes to immigration, the number sunk onto the roof and their much higher than we were when we are in the eu they really don't think you can start lecturing other people about higher migration when they've never been as high as they are under watch. this year, because the actions i've taken, the number of visas we've issued is down by 30%. net migration issued is down by 30%. net migration is down a half in the next 12 months because of the measures i've taken but i've been prime ministerfor18 months that's coming down sharply. that is the progress that will continue to find the prime minister will have a legal cap to make sure the numbers keep falling after that if keir starmer should prime minister, you do not get any of that. he opposes those changes will not have a legal cap on migration it will go up. that is your choice. the forecast i have open borders. he’s forecast i have open borders. he's makin: it forecast i have open borders. he's making it up _ forecast i have open borders. he's making it up as — forecast i have open borders. he's making it up as he _ forecast i have open borders. he's making it up as he goes along. forecast i have open borders. he'sl making it up as he goes along. no, forecast i have open borders. he's i making it up as he goes along. no, i am auoin making it up as he goes along. no, i am going to — making it up as he goes along. no, i am going to the _ making it up as he goes along. tip, i am going to the next question. our next question. am going to the next question. our next question-— next question. universities in the uk are turning — next question. universities in the uk are turning out _ next question. universities in the uk are turning out students. i next question. universities in the | uk are turning out students. start auain, we uk are turning out students. start again. we did _ uk are turning out students. start again, we did not _ uk are turning out students. start again, we did not hear— uk are turning out students. igiiiiiii again, we did not hearthe again, we did not hear the beginning. t again, we did not hear the beginning-— again, we did not hear the bearinnin. 1, , ::, again, we did not hear the bearinnin. . , ::, , beginning. i am in my 20s it feels like universities _ beginning. i am in my 20s it feels like universities in _ beginning. i am in my 20s it feels like universities in the _ beginning. i am in my 20s it feels like universities in the uk - beginning. i am in my 20s it feels like universities in the uk are i like universities in the uk are turning — like universities in the uk are turning out— like universities in the uk are turning out students - like universities in the uk are turning out students year- like universities in the uk are turning out students year oni like universities in the uk are i turning out students year on year. young _ turning out students year on year. young people _ turning out students year on year. young people like _ turning out students year on year. young people like myself- turning out students year on year. young people like myself have i young people like myself have lost hope for _ young people like myself have lost hope for if — young people like myself have lost hope for if there _ young people like myself have lost hope for if there will— young people like myself have lost hope for if there will ever - young people like myself have lost hope for if there will ever get - young people like myself have lost hope for if there will ever get a i hope for if there will ever get a good _ hope for if there will ever get a good job— hope for if there will ever get a good job or— hope for if there will ever get a good job or buy— hope for if there will ever get a good job or buy a _ hope for if there will ever get a good job or buy a home. - hope for if there will ever get a good job or buy a home. manyl hope for if there will ever get a l good job or buy a home. many of hope for if there will ever get a - good job or buy a home. many of my peers _ good job or buy a home. many of my peers are _ good job or buy a home. many of my peers are leaving _ good job or buy a home. many of my peers are leaving the _ good job or buy a home. many of my peers are leaving the uk _ good job or buy a home. many of my peers are leaving the uk and - good job or buy a home. many of my peers are leaving the uk and going l peers are leaving the uk and going to countries — peers are leaving the uk and going to countries like _ peers are leaving the uk and going to countries like australia - peers are leaving the uk and going to countries like australia or - to countries like australia or dubai — to countries like australia or dubai what_ to countries like australia or dubai. what would - to countries like australia or dubai. what would you - to countries like australia or dubai. what would you do . to countries like australia or| dubai. what would you do to to countries like australia or - dubai. what would you do to make to countries like australia or _ dubai. what would you do to make me stay in _ dubai. what would you do to make me stay in the _ dubai. what would you do to make me stay in the uk? — dubai. what would you do to make me stay in the uk? find— dubai. what would you do to make me stay in the uk?— stay in the uk? and this is going to be the last question _ stay in the uk? and this is going to be the last question and _ stay in the uk? and this is going to be the last question and set - stay in the uk? and this is going to be the last question and set of - be the last question and set of answers. keir starmer, what would you do? answers. keir starmer, what would ou do? . . answers. keir starmer, what would ou do? , . ., answers. keir starmer, what would ou do? , . . you do? ensure that we have good well- aid you do? ensure that we have good well-paid skilled _ you do? ensure that we have good well-paid skilled jobs _ you do? ensure that we have good well-paid skilled jobs here - you do? ensure that we have good well-paid skilled jobs here for- you do? ensure that we have good well-paid skilled jobs here for you | well—paid skilled jobs here for you and other— well—paid skilled jobs here for you and other young people who i do think— and other young people who i do think in— and other young people who i do think in recent years of government making _ think in recent years of government making sure that we build the houses necessary— making sure that we build the houses necessary to ensure that the dream of homeownership lives again because of homeownership lives again because of the _ of homeownership lives again because of the moment, it is been killed in the average age for young people to -et a the average age for young people to get a house is in the 30s now. i think it — get a house is in the 30s now. i think it should be in their 20s and if we _ think it should be in their 20s and if we have — think it should be in their 20s and if we have five more years this government, ill go up to the 40s we have to _ government, ill go up to the 40s we have to build more houses and that mems— have to build more houses and that means tough decisions about planning and where _ means tough decisions about planning and where those houses are going to be we _ and where those houses are going to be we also _ and where those houses are going to be we also need to deal with the verified — be we also need to deal with the verified high rents that young people — verified high rents that young people are often paying and many are paying _ people are often paying and many are paying more without actually paying mortgage in huge proportion and saving _ mortgage in huge proportion and saving for— mortgage in huge proportion and saving for the mortgage that i need and low— saving for the mortgage that i need and low mortgage deposit scheme in place to— and low mortgage deposit scheme in place to allow young people in by a stick on _ place to allow young people in by a stick on the housing ladder we have to build _ stick on the housing ladder we have to build houses and prime minister is ticking _ to build houses and prime minister is ticking down the targets for house — is ticking down the targets for house building and they are going off a cliff. — house building and they are going off a cliff, sinking in that is ticking _ off a cliff, sinking in that is ticking down with it in your dreams of young _ ticking down with it in your dreams of young people across the country who cannot get the job they want and very often— who cannot get the job they want and very often if they been to college or university and returning back home. _ or university and returning back home, they have to give them a future _ home, they have to give them a future that— home, they have to give them a future that they deserve and that mearrs— future that they deserve and that means we — future that they deserve and that means we have to go out with our manifesto — means we have to go out with our manifesto for growth and wealth creation — manifesto for growth and wealth creation and seize the opportunities in the _ creation and seize the opportunities in the future in the countries are doing _ in the future in the countries are doing this — in the future in the countries are doing this and i think we should be the rates _ doing this and i think we should be the rates for the jobs of the future and i_ the rates for the jobs of the future and i think— the rates for the jobs of the future and i think we can win that race but also, _ and i think we can win that race but also, rott— and i think we can win that race but also, roll up— and i think we can win that race but also, roll up our sleeves and start building _ also, roll up our sleeves and start building the houses that are necessary to make sure that you can afford _ necessary to make sure that you can afford to _ necessary to make sure that you can afford to buy a house in your 20s and not — afford to buy a house in your 20s and not as— afford to buy a house in your 20s and not as it _ afford to buy a house in your 20s and not as it currently is in your 30s and — and not as it currently is in your 30s and that is the tragedy of the last ten— 30s and that is the tragedy of the last ten years in the go up if we have _ last ten years in the go up if we have five — last ten years in the go up if we have five years of them last government.— have five years of them last government. have five years of them last rovernment. , . , government. remember what it feels like when you — government. remember what it feels like when you get _ government. remember what it feels like when you get the _ government. remember what it feels like when you get the keys _ government. remember what it feels like when you get the keys to - government. remember what it feels like when you get the keys to first. like when you get the keys to first flat and it's incredibly special feeling and i believe in a country were all young people can aspire to that and realise that ambition. it is a very special thing. it is too hard to buy her own home and i have two very practical specific things that we would do if i am your prime minister which will help make it easier. the first is to introduce a new form of help and it means that you won't have to save for the entire deposit, just 5% and you'll be able to get a help to buy loan from the government which covers another 20% of that potentially can save you tens of thousands of pounds in the second thing that we will do is effectively abolished stamp duty for first—time buyers. is effectively abolished stamp duty forfirst—time buyers. the vast majority will abolish stamp duty. two very practical things that would save you thousands of pounds. the reason why that is important is when i talk to people like you, the most important thing they tell miyazaki help me with the deposit. actually i'm probably 0k and into a decent job that can probably afford the mortgage similar to my rent but what i cannot do this even for the deposit. i cannot do this even for the de osit. ., , .,, ., .,, deposit. young people of lost hope about ever getting _ deposit. young people of lost hope about ever getting a _ deposit. young people of lost hope about ever getting a good - deposit. young people of lost hope about ever getting a good job. - deposit. young people of lost hope about ever getting a good job. by l about ever getting a good job. by helping abolish this duty, will be able to speed about quickly you can get on the housing ladder and fulfilling the dream of owning your own home and as i said, to very specific things, help by, abolish stamp duty and again, this very clear choice for you because of you should prime minister, stamp duty is going up and that is of the plans are and if he prime minister, again, more back to the welfare to bed and i'm happy to have that now think you think there's a need to be made from that. help you get on the housing ladder the that. help you get on the housing ladde ., y that. help you get on the housing ladde ., , , ., ladder the money is not there, the chancellor. — ladder the money is not there, the chancellor, not _ ladder the money is not there, the chancellor, not me, _ ladder the money is not there, the chancellor, not me, george - chancellor, not me, george chancellor, not me, george chancellor said that. you cannot fund _ chancellor said that. you cannot fund things from nothing, the money has been _ fund things from nothing, the money has been spent in every go on for another five years like this, were going _ another five years like this, were going to — another five years like this, were going to end up exactly where we are now or— going to end up exactly where we are now or in _ going to end up exactly where we are now or in a _ going to end up exactly where we are now or in a worse place, we have to turn the _ now or in a worse place, we have to turn the page — now or in a worse place, we have to turn the page and start and that nreans— turn the page and start and that means building those 1.5 million houses — means building those 1.5 million houses and we have to have a strong plan behind — houses and we have to have a strong plan behind it already talking to the partners that we build those houses — the partners that we build those houses because i'm absolutely determined that every single young person— determined that every single young person in— determined that every single young person in this country and liberal government will feel that the future is tfetter— government will feel that the future is better for them but my parents, they have — is better for them but my parents, they have been comforted even though they have been comforted even though they had _ they have been comforted even though they had tough times and not a lot of money, — they had tough times and not a lot of money, but the thought and the idea that _ of money, but the thought and the idea that there will be better for their— idea that there will be better for their children comforted them and nrade _ their children comforted them and made their lives worthwhile. we have lost it— made their lives worthwhile. we have lost it and _ made their lives worthwhile. we have lost it and we have to get it back because — lost it and we have to get it back because in— lost it and we have to get it back because in the end, the futures about— because in the end, the futures about our— because in the end, the futures about our children and young people are to _ about our children and young people are to build — about our children and young people are to build a country that is fit for them — are to build a country that is fit for them to in and absolutely realise — for them to in and absolutely realise all of their aspirations of the dreams and i'm determined that we would _ the dreams and i'm determined that we would do that. applause we would do that. applaus: ., ., , ., applause fundamentally the reason wh one applause fundamentally the reason why gone we — applause fundamentally the reason why gone we went — applause fundamentally the reason why gone we went with _ applause fundamentally the reason why gone we went with very - applause fundamentally the reason l why gone we went with very enormous privilege of standing here is your prime minister and i do not think my story would be possible in any other country and that is why i feel an enormous sense of duty and gratitude to our country forward has done for me and i went into politics to make a difference and make peoples lives better and that starts with young people, making sure you have the opportunity that you need to succeed in life whatever you want to do and how if you live, that's the type of country i believe in and when you get that job, country i believe in and when you get thatjob, when you work hard, i want you to keep more of your hard earned money and decided to spend it for yourself and i believe in a society that's aspirational and that's what i want to cut your taxes, it's notjust this, that's what i will do. that was the final question _ that's what i will do. that was the final question of _ that's what i will do. that was the final question of the _ that's what i will do. that was the final question of the evening. - that's what i will do. that was the final question of the evening. in i that's what i will do. that was the final question of the evening. in a| final question of the evening. in a moment, we willjoin clive myrie and laura kuenssberg and the spin room for more analysis. before we you from here, rishi sunak and keir starmer are going to have 30 seconds each to leave you with a final thought. the order was decided to earlier by a coin toss. i thought. the order was decided to earlier by a coin toss. i understand why you're — earlier by a coin toss. i understand why you're frustrated _ earlier by a coin toss. i understand why you're frustrated with - earlier by a coin toss. i understand why you're frustrated with our - why you're frustrated with our party, with me. i get it. but this is not a by—election. it's a choice with profound consequences for you and our country. and before you make that choice, think what a labour government would mean. can you afford to pay at least £2000 more in tax, and why won't keir starmer be straight with you about what he wants to do? if you are not certain about labour, don't surrender to them. don't vote for any other party. vote conservative. thank you very much- — party. vote conservative. thank you very much- that _ party. vote conservative. thank you very much. that is _ party. vote conservative. thank you very much. that is a _ party. vote conservative. thank you very much. that is a lie. _ party. vote conservative. thank you very much. that is a lie. and - party. vote conservative. thank you very much. that is a lie. and this i very much. that is a lie. and this is our very much. that is a lie. and this is your closing — very much. that is a lie. and this is your closing statement, keir . is your closing statement, keir starmer. mt; is your closing statement, keir starmer. ~ , , is your closing statement, keir starmer. g , ., , ., is your closing statement, keir starmer. g ., , starmer. my message to you is simle. starmer. my message to you is simple- if — starmer. my message to you is simple- if you _ starmer. my message to you is simple. if you want _ starmer. my message to you is simple. if you want your - starmer. my message to you is simple. if you want your nhs i starmer. my message to you is - simple. if you want your nhs back, you have _ simple. if you want your nhs back, you have to— simple. if you want your nhs back, you have to vote or it. if you want a growing — you have to vote or it. if you want a growing economy, you have to vote for it _ a growing economy, you have to vote for it if— a growing economy, you have to vote for it if you — a growing economy, you have to vote for it. if you want more police on the streets. _ for it. if you want more police on the streets, more teachers in our schools. — the streets, more teachers in our schools. you _ the streets, more teachers in our schools, you have to vote for it. if you want — schools, you have to vote for it. if you want to — schools, you have to vote for it. if you want to end 14 years of chaos and rebuild — you want to end 14 years of chaos and rebuild our country, then that power— and rebuild our country, then that power is _ and rebuild our country, then that power is in — and rebuild our country, then that power is in your hands. 0njuly the 4th, _ power is in your hands. 0njuly the 4th, they— power is in your hands. 0njuly the 4th, they change, though labour. thank— 4th, they change, though labour. thank you — 4th, they change, though labour. thank you very much. applause —— a vote change. and that brings to an end this last head—to—head debate of this complaint.

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