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Working for closely together. i think we will see a more balanced relationship across the atlantic. so with all of the tragedy and all of the challenges that we face, with a more dangerous russia in the years ahead, i think we might see a strengthening of our west in europe as a result of this, apart from the fact that i think it s necessary. before i let you go i have to ask you one question which is the one place where there does seem to be i don t know if a weak link is the right way to describe t but there seems to be some problem is germany. the germans tried to send their president stein meyer to ukraine, the ukrainians i think somewhat foolishly rejected that offer, now the germans seem to be upset, trchancellor sholds h publicly criticized the ukrainians. is there a danger that the germans will not follow through on what seemed like a very ....
Territory y all defense, who is going to attack belgium, but really to secure the eastern border of europe, the baltic countries, countries that have been so far thought difficult to defend. now, if the entire orientation is to forward deploy east, you have a europe that actually becomes more secure, correct? i think that would be the case and as you indicate this is part of a wider pattern of changes that we will see. we see increases in defense spending, sweden, denmark, northern europe are moving up to 2% where the others ron rivera are. denmark having a referendum to lift some of the restrictions on eu security compensations. you will see a stronger nato. i think you will see also a stronger eu on security issues. nato being the military alliance for territorial defense, eu having a somewhat broader array of instruments being security lines. i think you will see nato and eu ....
They have close to the border of norway and finland, probably the greatest concentration of nuclear weapons anywhere in the world. so what he threatened with has actually already happened. i don t think that will have any impact. as for nato, that s for the nato countries to decide, there are 30 of them that have to say yes. united states being the most important, but i do think the indications so far, and i think rightly so, is that nato will see this as strengthening the security and the democratic credentials of nato in a period when nato would be more needed than ever for the security of europe. and correct me if i m wrong, carl, but what this could do is orient europe and give europe a strategic orientation so that european countries realize that when they spend money on defense it s not just make work programs or for kind of notional ....
Carl bildt was sweden s prime minister from 1991 to 1994 and he was foreign minister during russia s last invasion of ukraine. carl, welcome on the program again. let me ask you is this for real, because we have heard about these kind of talks before, but is it your sense that in all likelihood finland and sweden will, in fact, apply for nato membership? yes, it is for real. february 24 changed the security situation in europe in a profound way and that has led to various deep reconsidering primarily in finland, i mean, the fins from security in the dna in other ways that swedes have and now in sweden. you will see a process in both of the countries during the next few weeks that will lead to formal application before the nato summit in madrid at the end ....
Orient europe and give europe a strategic orientation so that european countries realize that when they spend money on defense it s not just make work programs or for kind of notional territorial defense, who is going to attack belgium, but really to secure the eastern border of europe, the baltic countries, countries that have been so far apart, though difficult to defend. now, if the entire orientation is to forward deploy east, you have a europe that actually becomes more secure, correct? i think that would be the case and as you indicate this is part of a wider pattern of changes that we will see. we see increases in defense spending, sweden, denmark, northern europe are moving up to 2% where the others ron rivera are. denmark having a referendum to lift some of the restrictions on eu security cooperations they have had. you will see a stronger nato. ....