least guiliani and sidney powell are under criminal investigation based on public reporting. and so they might also have a fifth amendment right to not incriminate themselves, which could be another hurdle for the committee to get their testimony. so i think it will be very difficult to get that testimony, certainly in the near term. it s kind of off-subject but not really, just one thing to remember with donald trump s lawyers, back had they were filing these lawsuits about the 2020 election and donald trump kept saying there was fraud, there was fraud. we still hear from a number of officials that there was fraud, there was fraud. when these lawyers were filing their lawsuits, sidney powell, giuliani, et cetera, they weren t claiming fraud in court because they had no proof of fraud and you can t lie to a court. everybody, thank you so much. tom winter, carol leonnig, daniel goldman, fascinating conversation. as with everything, it seems, lately, it all depends on what