since i was last able to interview her. since then, we as a country have had a fairly consequential presidential election, a major violent effort to disrupt the true peaceful transition of power. a losing presidential can t dictate who has mounted a relentless increasingly bizarre but weirdly successful campaign to convince his followers that he certainly won the election, and it secretly the shadow president. with nevertheless longest war, the ongoing battle against covid, and, and. joining us now for the interview is hillary roderick clinton, former presidential candidate, first lady, u.s. senator, and now novelist. secretary clinton has just cockburn a political thriller called a state of terror, with our friend louise penny. i ve read it, i read it in about a day, it was like i was being chased. very much enjoyed it, secretary clinton, is really good to have you here, congratulations on