Im chuck todd and joining me are president obamas former White House Press secretary. Kelly odonnell. Carol lee of the wall street journal and michael steel, former chairman of the Republican National committee. Welcome to sunday. Its meet the press. Good morning. The shock waves of the paris terror attacks continue to be felt particularly in europe. Muslims angry at Charlie Hebdo have taken to the streets across the world, churches torched and three People Killed in the former french colony. There have also been antiterror raids across europe and a number of countries including belgium. And my exclusive interview with the new editor of Charlie Hebdo. Reporter all over Europe Police and Counter Terrorism officers have been raiding homes, making arrests and in one address in belgium exchanging heavy fire with suspected trysts who terrorists who were just about ready to launch an attack. They are being pulled in all at once in the wake of the terror attacks in paris. Europe is stepping up its efforts to stop home grown terrorists and continuing to send jets to isis targets. The French Parliament broke into a spontaneous national anthem. The fact is the u. S. Is doing most of the bombing in syria and iraq. About five of every six sorties are conducted by american jets. We are putting them on the defensive and helping local forces in iraq push these terrorists back. Reporter are they on the defensive . Theres another way to look at the paris attacks. Things like that cost them almost nothing, but yet it creates a huge amount of fear and anger in the west. So for a very small investment theyre able to have a big psychological effect. Thats the way they are on the offensive and have the initiative. Reporter being bombed by the u. S. And its allies has elevated isiss status and upped its recruiting game. Now they are telling their supporters in the west that they dont have to travel to syria and iraq to join the war. They can stay at home and find targets. Charlie hebdo and the immense popularity of its most recent issue have enraged muslims around the world. At least three demonstrators were kill bided by police in niger. The slogan i am charlie meant to express solidarity and the french expression of speech is being understood in the muslim world as being against profit. That helps isis and other terrorist groups with a weapon that no jet can destroy, the weapon of propaganda. And this brings up a phrase that was very familiar during vietnam, hearts and minds. The fact of the matter is we kill a lot of leaders of this radicalist istist movement but we dont defeat the enemy. What is the next strategy and what should it be . I think theres a hearts and Minds Campaign internationally to try to convince the world yet again that by fighting isis the United States and other nations are not engaged in a wider war against islam supporting Charlie Hebdo worked what against that message. And then there is the very tactical message of degrading and destroying isis in syria and iraq. There has been some progress in iraq. Military officials told me they do not believe there has been as much progress as some of the officials are claiming. Just a few days ago turkish intelligence said in this country there are about e ling have been linked to isis. The numbers arent going down. Not at all. Richard, thanks very much. Its been ten days since the horrific attacks on the magazine Charlie Hebdo. I had an exclusive interview with its editor in chief. I was wondering if you could share with our audience if you could put into words the difficulty you had and the staff had in putting an issue out. Well its very complicated because we have all been enormously affected each in our own way. Some of us were present during the at the tacktack. Others arrived after the shooting. Personal i was not in france. I was in london. Those who experienced the attack each experienced it differently. Some of the injured are still in serious condition. And then there are those who were present during the attack but who escaped injury. They are trying individually to understand why they escaped unharmed. They are also trying to process how they help the wounded. It is very difficult to process because when obviously feels an enormous relief to have escaped, mixed with a sense of guilty. I want to get into some of the criticism that the publication has received including from pope francis. And i want to get your response to the pope answering a reporters question about the extent of freed of expression. The pope illustrated his point by describing what would happen if his personal vatican aide said something bad against his mother. And the pope said this. To kill in the name of god is an aberration. We have the obligation to say openly to have this liberty. If a good friend says a bad word against my mother then a punch awaits him. But its normal. Its normal. One cannot provoke or insult others faith. What do you say to the pope . Every time that we draw a cartoon of mohammed every time we draw a cartoon of a prophet. God must not be a political figure. He must be a private figure. We defend the freed of relijom of religion. Religion should not be a political argument. If faith, if religious arguments step into the political arena, it becomes a totalitarian argument. Secularism guarantees democracy and assures peace. Secularism allows all believers and all nonbelievers to live in peace. And that is what we defend. Your line is you will attack any religion that is being used in your view for political reasons. But you dont attack people of a of a religious ethnic group . We have a problem when faith and religion become political. Then we become worried and we attack. Then we respond because we are convinced that religion has no place in the political arena because once religion injects itself into the political debate the political debate becomes totalitarian. Im curious of your reaction. Many News Organization including our own, have not shown your cover completely either blurred out. And its a decision we made editorially. No government told us to do anything. But it was a decision we made. And every News Organization is making their own decision. What are your reaction to our decision and others who have chosen not to show your cover . Listen we cannot blame newspapers that already suffer much difficulty in getting published and distributed in totalitarian regimes to public newspapers that could cost them at best jail and at worst death. On the other hand i am cite critical of newspapers which are published in democratic countries. This is a symbol. Its a symbol of freedom of speech of freedom of religion of democracy, of secularism. When they refuse to publish this cartoon, they insult the citizenship. Do you feel like youre part of the this war thats taking place in the western world thats taking place between some radical islamists . We did not kill anyone. We must stop conflating the murderers and the victims. They are throwing gas on the fire. We must not place thinkers and artists in the same category as murderers murderers. We are not warriors. We only defend one thing, freedom, our freedom, secularism secularism freedom of conscience and democracy. I appreciate you coming on meet the press. I know this is not an easy time. And i know youre still mourning many of your friends. So my con doll ensdolencescondolences. Its interesting debate that goes on in france. And some of this interview we left on the cutting room floor for time and franceulation andtranslation and things like this. When you worked for president obama and the administration if a religious leader in this country appeared to be inciting muslims, including the pastor that was burning the koran, you guys were aggressive in stopping him from doing that. That of course would have been totally frowned upon in france. I think one of the things that were going to have to do is show to the more than billion muslims in the world that were not at war with their religion. We are at war with people that take the believes of that religion and bastardize them to the point that justifies killing. I think you talked about hearts and minds. We are going to have to have a greater effort on counter radicalization to let people know in this world that they have an outlet for frustration that doesnt include either joining an army in syria or training in their home country to attack somebody who doesnt believe what they believe. Theres going to be a lot of folk that is watch that and realize who were very supportive of wanting to stand by Charlie Hebdo and realize theyre no friend of religion. And i wonder if there are going to be a lot of americans going thats some harsh stuff they would do against catholics and evangelicals. People do get uncomfortable and they are really struggling with trying to be supportive of the victims, but as people learn more about the publication, it doesnt always feel comfortable for them to support some of the ideas. We can see if you just interpret some of their artwork and put it against your own religion how would you feel . I think americans do want to show support for freed domom of expression. Michael steel, your party, theres a big religious core to your party. Very much so. If that publication for over here hes basically saying he would be totally mocking anybody that uses religion in politics. It would be a real problem. A lot of the grass roots evangelicals out there with respect to the sense of attack on them personally. Its a real balancing act between what both of you just said that feeling of expression and wanting to be free to do that and then the personal feeling i have when you express. I think a lot of evangelicals in this country would rise up and make a lot of noise. There would be a lot of protests against a publication like that. Congress has one take and they want to see, i think, a more aggressive particularly republicans in congress. The president seems to be wanting to walk a line here. Yeah. Theres a couple things. Its interesting to see the white houses response to this particular new cover of Charlie Hebdo. And when the original cartoons had come out, they were very critical about them doing that. And now you see the White House Press secretary this week saying that it was a poignant cover. So thats different. And they eeshre trying to figure out how to balance in the wake of the at the tackstacks that robert was talking about. They wont say radical islamists. They wont say war on terror. Theyre trying to figure out how to talk about this. As you mentioned, they have this congress and mr. In particular republicans who want them to be more aggressive about it. All theyre hearing is Charlie Hebdo. Coming up more on the threat to the u. S. And then as mitt romney goes from no no no no to well why not. Republicans go from we miss you mitt to thanks but no thanks. Some come here to build something smarter. Some come here to build something stronger. Others come to build something faster. Something safer. Something greener. Something the whole world can share. People come to boeing to do many different things. But its always about the very thing we do best. At ally bank no branches equals great rates. Its a fact. Kind of like mute buttons equal danger. That sound good . Not being on this phone call sounds good. Its not muted. Was that you jason . It was geoffrey it was jason. It couldve been brenda. At ally bank no branches equals great rates. Its a fact. Kind of like mute buttons equal danger. That sound good . Not being on this phone call sounds good. Its not muted. Was that you jason . It was geoffrey it was jason. It couldve been brenda. Welcome back. To discuss the Terror Threat and Foreign Policy challenges that face the country, joined from jerusalem by Lindsey Graham, republican senator for South Carolina, spent the last few days traveling in the middle east has visited saudi arabia, qatar, prior to arriving in israel today. Senator graham welcome back to meet the press. Let me start with a basic question that ive been hearing from a lot of folks over the last 14 years, the policy of going after these terrorist groups has been to disrupt, dismantle and destroy george w. Bushs policy promise, president obamas. 14 years we killed a lot of people, but we have not defeated this enemy. Why . Well, once you liberate a country like iraq, and you dont have a force, they fill in the gaps. Syria is a failed state. The civil war in syria basically broke the country apart. And only thing i can say is you have to deny the enemys safe haven, withdrawing from iraq prematurely was a mistake. Not supporting the Free Syrian Army three or four years ago was a mistake. You have to stay after these guys. Are you advocating more troops in a place like syria now, more troops potentially . Is it yemen we need to do . What is the answer now . We want to debate about some of the things in the past about iraq, but what is the answer now . Well, the answer now is to deny isil the safe haven they enjoy in syria and iraq because it is a platform to strike the United States. There are more paris coming until you disrupt the there are more terrorist organizations, more safe havens with more capability to hit home than before 9 11. The answer is the former Regional Coalition america has to be part of it go in on the ground and get these guys out of syria. The current strategy is failing. Everybody has told us on this trip that if you dont have a no fly zone the people who are training the Free Syrian Army were training is going to go back into syria and get slaughtered by assad. There is no reason to be successful on the ground without neutralizing assads air advantage. And so we need a no fly zone desperately. What you to fell a country that is war weary . Fight them over there or theyre coming back here. You got to show the ability to stay with it. You try to get partners, Free Syrian Army would be a good partner. They have been punished pretty hard by assad and isil. It is in our National Security interest to deny them a safe haven. When it comes to iraq, lets get it right this time. The most vicious Islamic RadicalIslamic Group might be in nigeria. You didnt bring it up. A lot of people dont bring it up until it is boko haram slaughtered thousands in the same week that 17 people were killed in paris. Should the United States be doing more in nigeria . Other countrys . What is the answer there . I think we should be doing more but boko haram doesnt represent the threat to the homeland in my view that isil does and al nusra and other groups in syria and iraq. But this problem is spreading throughout the world. The next stage of the fight i think is africa. But if we could show some resolve in syria and iraq and reset the table and go after these guys in syria and iraq with success, i think it would change the landscape throughout the world. Success anywhere breeds success everywhere, fair in any one spot hurts you everywhere, but youre right, 2,000 people were killed in one weekend in nigeria and the world basically ignored lets move to iran. Let me play what the president said in pushing back at congress attempt to apply more sanctions before the negotiations are done with iran. Heres what he said. My main message to congress at this point is just hold your fire. Nobody around the world, least of all the iranians doubt my ability to get some sanctions passed should the negotiations fail. Thats not a hard vote for me to get through congress. Why not wait . I think were trying to tell the iranians we would like a political negotiation a diplomatic solution, but please understand in iran that the Congress Intent on reapplying sanctions if you walk away from the negotiating table, and if you cheat. I dont think thats a disruptive message. All were telling the iranians, if you walk away from the negotiations, sanctions will be reapplied. If you cheat, they will be reimposed. But me just say this, im willing to forgo sanctions, chuck if the president will take any deal he negotiate and brings it congress for our approval. If he thinks sanctions is disruptive to a good outcome, im willing to forgo that vote with the understanding that any daily negotiates will come to the congress for our approval or disapproval as a check and balance. I want to follow up on two other things very quickly. Last week you said something pretty provocativevoluntary provocative. Campaign promises are getting a lot of People Killed. Is that proper rhetoric . You think the president of the United States is getting People Killed . I think his policies are getting People Killed. I think sound military advice was given to the president to leave a residual force in iraq and he turned it down. As a result, iraq has collapsed. His entire National Security team suggested three or four years ago to create a no fly zone and train the Free Syrian Army while it mattered. Almost 3,000 People Killed in syria on his watch. Syria, the worst has yet to come. Lebanon, and jordan have closed their borders. Where do the people in syria, where do they go now . Hell on earth is about to descend upon syria and it matters to us. The safe havens in jordan and syria and iraq isil and other terrorist groups are a direct threat to the United States. Letting people out of gitmo in this environment i think is irresponsible. So, yes, his Campaign Promises should be adjusted based on reality. And final question, john mccain when he was asked about mitt romney running for preside