and her side of the story, mel gibson's ex-girlfriend speaks out for the first time about their volatile relationship and bitter custody battle "today," wednesday relationship and bitter custody battle "today," wednesday october 6, 2010. captions paid for by nbc-universal television and good morning. welcome to "today" on a wednesday morning. i'm matt lauer. >> and i'm meredith viera. it didn't happen in 2008, but is an obama-clinton pairing being considered for 2012? >> according to bob woodward, it would mean vice president joe biden and hillary clinton basically swapping positions. why would that benefit president obama? we'll have the details straight ahead. and she survived and her was murdered. now a witness had come forward. we're going to have the latest on the case. if you had a piece of gold that was worth about $450, how much do you think you would get from one of those popular money for gold companies. you would not believe the range of offers we received. one offer, less than $39. we'll get more on that coming up. but first let's get a check of the morning headlines. secret talks are underway amid karzai and the taliban. another attack aimed at a nato convoy taking supplies to afghanistan. gunmen set fire to at least 25 tankers loaded with fuel and killed a driver. it was the sixth attack in less than a week. today the court hears arguments in a key first amendment case. at issue, whether it's protected speech when protesters show up at the funerals of returning veterans. at least four people were killed when a sludge reservoir gave way in an industrial plant southwest of budapest pouring into three villages. several people are miss tlchlgt. overseas markets are -- cnbc's melissa frances is the a stock exchange for us. >> looks like a big day for the market. markets are rallying, gold hitting another record high, oil higher as well. although the dollar is at an eight-month low against the euro. we're also watching a key jobs report today. and some wild weather in the west. parts of arizona saw hail the size of golf balls on tuesday. one homeowner shot this video you see there as the hail fell into his backyard pool. and it was an early october snowstorm in parts of nevada forcing driving to be extra careful there. back over to matt, meredith and al. pretty soon that will be us. >> things are fairly quiet today around baltimore. there are a few scattered rain showers. 30% or 40% chance for a little bit of rain. bit of rain. >> let's go to the videotape, slow motion iso. i screw up and -- >> it could have been ugly. anyway, al, thank you very much. let's turn to politics now, as president obama considers a different running mate for 2012. a veteran journalist says an obama-clinton ticket is being considered. what are you hearing? >> reporter: obviously bob woodward last night in an interview on cnn said according to some clinton advisors the idea of hillary clinton joining president obama on the ticket in 2 2012 is on the table. this morning i spoke to david axelrod. he said the report is absolute fiction, he goes on to say how loyal president obama is to vice president biden. the idea that anybody would be on the ticket other than joe biden again is fiction. that said, i can tell you that sources have told me that if there is a new job for hillary clinton in the next year, matt, it's most likely to be secretary of defense. remember robert gates is likely to leave before the end of 2011. that would be a more likely move. but the november midterms are now less than four weeks away and you can see the anger and frustration in the voters being channeled into tv ads 30 seconds at a time. it's october, and that means one thing in a political year. >> i'm not a witch. >> reporter: lots and lots of tv ads. >> barack obama is the worst president in history. >> reporter: with the midterm elections just under four weeks away, republican candidates have settled on a target. >> it would already have been done if i had robin carnahan there. >> that was a simple fund-raiser. >> reporter: and now it's a biting punch line in the missouri senate race for republican roy blunt. >> the disastrous stimulus bill, government run health care, robert carnahan supporting them on. >> reporter: wisconsin republican ron johnson takes on incumbent democrat russ feingold. kentucky republican rand paul went after the democrat jack conway. >> the republicans are nationalizing this election and that's easier to do in a midterm when the president's unpopular. >> reporter: without a national politician to run against, democrats are trying to localize issues targeting hot button issues. >> mr. johnson would put insurance companies back in control. >> reporter: and in washington, democrat patty murray hopes the public's frustration with wall street will hurt republican dino ross si. >> dino rossi out for himself. >> by the way last night, president obama a little funny moment at an event. he was speaking at his podium. the presidential sale, off camera, it falls off, makes a loud noise, the president joked about it, take a listen. >> we cannot sustain. oops. was that my -- oh, goodness. that's all right. all of you know who i am. >> reporter: well, look, those poor advanced people that hang those things, they carry it around, that seal is in its own briefcase, matt, sometimes those things happen. >> chuck, thank you very much. former virginia governor tim kaine is the chairman of the democratic national committee. governor kaine, nice to see you as always. bob woodward said there is consideration on the table that we might see obama-clinton in 2012. have you heard talk about it? >> other than seeing speculation about it in the press, i have been to the white house and talk to people all the time and i haven't heard anything about it. >> do you think that might be a good idea? >> my job is pretty focused on november too. i don't even know, is there going to be a november 3? i'm really focussed on the next four weeks. i think it's kind of like is randy moss going to get traded from the patriots to the vikings, it's speculation, but i don't think there's anything to it. >> let's talk about voter turnout. obviously it's key to you folks in the november midterm elections. the president has said that it would be irresponsible for democratic voters to stay home in the midterm elections, yet in the latest polling, even with a high turnout, republicans hold a 13% lead and even if it's low, that lead swells to 18%. how do democrats chip away at those numbers in the next four weeks? >> we have got a lot of work to do, but the good news is this, since labor day to october 1, the po democrats have done a little bit better. the enthusiasm gap over the summer has narrowed. we're seeing our hand improving both because our candidates are out there doing good work and the republicans are nominating folks that i think paint a real stark choice between the two parties. >> let's talk about some themes. newt gingrich, the former speaker of the house wrote a mem me to some republican candidates saying they should make democrats the party of food stamps and the republicans the party of paychecks. if republican candidates use that idea out on the campaign trail, how do you suggest that democrats counter it? >> i think the american public will laugh if republicans try to be the party of paychecks. they put the economy into a tank, into a lost decade where americans lost money under republican leadership. they don't have a credible claim about being the paycheck party. the democrats who have turned the economy from shrinking to growing again for the first time in years will be able to trump them on that. >> there is some talk the president has talked tough as of late saying it's time for democrats to buck up, the vice president said it's time for democrats to stop whining. polling though shows governor kaine that some democrats have some real differences of opinion with the white house over issues like the economy and health care reform. so when they use talk like that, are you afraid at all that it might backfire? >> there are differences, matt, one of the great things about the democratic party is that we're a very diverse party regionally, demographically, but that also means -- it's a good aspect of our party, it's also occasionally maddening. i think the president and vice president's language here is kind of like the coach giving you the tough love talk before you start the game. i have been traveling around heavily the last couple of weeks as the president and the vice president have been say thachlgt i don't see the president bummed out or mad that those things are being said. we're seeing the enthusiasm gap being closed because our democratic voters are realizing the stark choice to be made between the party that's doing the heavy lifting and the party that's saying no. >> there's been some talk that robert gibbs is eyeing your job and that you may actually move inside the west wing. what do you want to tell me about that? >> that was also news to me when i read it saturday. i'm just out doing campaign events. i guess it must be on a need to know basis. 7:13, here's meredith. the seoul suole survivor in brutal home invasion in connecticut -- jeff rossen as covered the trial from the start and he has details for us. >> reporter: good morning to you. the jury didn't take very long here, less than five hours over the course of two days to reach a verdict and they really threw the back at him. not only did they find steven hayes dpiguilty of murder, they found him guilty of capital murder. >> my family is still gone, it doesn't bring them back. it doesn't bring back the home that we had. >> dr. william petit had waited in pain for three years for this moment. tuesday the jury found this man, stephen hayes guilty of torturing and killing petit's family, his wife jennifer, and their girls michaela and hayley. >> what happened when they were reading the verdict, guilty, guilty, guilty. >> just relief, trying to maintain my kmoez your. >> prosecutors showed the jury some disturbing images about how the defendants tied pet -- and video of jennifer petit's time act, trying to pay the suspects off at a local bank. and then prosecutors say hayes and his accomplice burned the house down killing this mother and her children still inside. yet william petit came to court every day to face the man who did it. >> if your family was destroyed by evil, i think that you would all try to do the same thing and be there for your family. >> reporter: the jury found stephen hayes guilty of 16 crimes including murder, kidnapping and sexual assault. hayes is now facing a possible execution by lethal injection. >> over the last couple of weeks, i just kept trying to tell myself that good will overcome evil. >> for william petit this is and has always been about the loves of his live. >> i miss them every day and i think i just try to focus on them and the goodness that they had to try to get through each day. >> reporter: he has been through so much. later this month, the same jury that decided guilt or innocence in this case will be back in this courthouse to start the penalty phase and they will decide once and for all whether stephen hayes should be put to death. then a new trial for joshua comb sar jeff sky. >> yes the state may have proven that stephen hayes poured gasoline all over the house and all over the victims, but that doesn't mean he started the fire. so that's the one count he did get away with. >> as jeff just pointed out t jury did find stephen hayes guilty of 16 of the 17 counts against him and they did so after deliberating for just five hours. from an outsider's point of view, it always seemed that there was evidence against this man, but from a lawyer's perspective, what do you make of the length of the deliberations. >> i think it's a comparatively quick deliberations. in high profile cases particularly when you've got 17 charges, we tend to see jurors really want to take their time. why? because they know the world is watching, they want to make sure they're really, really careful. but the problem in this case or the difference in this case was that the evidence was absolutely overwhelming and so they didn't have to take the sort of- >> the defendant had even admitted to some of this. >> yeah. so they didn't even have to take the sort of time that they often take in a case like this, even when there's 17 charges. and you can see from the comment that jeff was making about the arson charge that they very carefully looked at this count by count, they didn't just say that he's guilty, they went count by count, charge by charge, they defined what the charge meant. what would be the necessary things. >> the judge's remarks about the arson, they were saying if you can't prove that hayes literally struck the match that caused the fire you can't convict him of arson? >> how do you define starting a fire? does this necessarily make sense in a legal sense? not necessarily. but jurors verdicts don't necessarily have to be consistent. and if these jurors believed that the legal definition wasn't met, in the end it's not particularly significant in terms of the sort of sentences. >> how can you find him not guilty of arson but find him guilty of murdering the petit daughters when they were killed by the fire. >> they can't talk now because they're effectively still in the middle of the trial. but they may have focused specifically on the intent to start the fire, meaning to light it, as opposed to the idea of laying down the gasoline. so we don't know for certain, but that's my guess. >> dr. petit has said that he would like to see both of these defendants face the death penalty. given the speed at which the juror reached its decision, will that have any impact on this next phase, the personality face? >> i don't think the speed tell us us a whole lot. the guilt face was easy. now in the penalty phase, the defense is going to try something different. they're going to try to get these jurors to believe that this guy has been a troubled guy, this guy was not the guy who was leading. >> so he was manipulated by the other guy. >> exactly. so even if you think he's guilty, even if you think he should get a very severe punishment, it doesn't mean that he should get the death penalty in this case. and they're going to talk about what he was like and all the troubles that he endured. think the guilty phase was basically an effort to safe his life. it is 7:20 and once again here's matt. this morning we have learned that the federal trade commission is taking action against a company that it says built a -- lore people's tax debt. kevin tibbles is in chicago with this. >> reporter: this morning the ftc is calling it an elaborate fraud that preyed on those desperate to get out from under a mountain of tax debt. >> if you owe over $15,000 in taxes -- >>er you've probably heard the pitch. >> this is your one second chance. use it well. >> reporter: ads promising to help people climb out from under tax debt. >> american tax relief got them to accept a fraction of what we owed. >> reporter: tim fullerton was desperate when he heard the ad. >> we can reduce your tax debt by up to 90%. >> reporter: and you said? >> it sounds like a plan. >> reporter: turns out fullerton wasn't the only one. some 15,000 people paid american tax relief fees totaling as much as $100 million. the problem is they didn't deliver. >> because of the downturn in the economy, scam artists are trying to take the last dollar out of people's pocket. >> reporter: today the federal trade commission has shut american tax relief down accusing it of bilking consumers. >> preying on the most vulnerable, people who are deeply in debt to the irs. >> it's a god thing, i just want to fix it. >> reporter: he said american tax relief $2750 but nothing happened, then he fessed up to darlene who just happened to be an accountant. >> the ftc claims american tax relief took the cash but never even approached the irs. they lived in a beverly hills passion and drover luxury cars. >> i was very, very an by with american tax relief. >> reporter: the fullertons have gotten half their money back after protesting. >> it comes down to the old phrase if something sounds too good to be true. >> it is too good to be true. >> lawyers for american tax relief did not return phone calls from nbc news. meanwhile the morning, the ftc is saying if you owe money to the irs, then consult the irs or hire a certified tax professional. >> kevin tibbles in chicago for us this morning. coming up on a wednesday morning, a witness comes forward coming up on a wednesday morning, a witness comes forward with an alleged attack on a bge's instant discounts got our homeowner to switch to energy star® cfl bulbs. these covered cfls look great and last longer- perfect for 'them hard-to-reach places. 3-way cfls really click with my style. go to participating retailers for bge's instant discounts on select cfls. learn to speak the language of energy efficiency at bgesmartenergy.com. heyhey, i go all night long and still save! coming up mel gibson's exwoo opens up about their relationship. >> live, local, latebreaking. this is wbal-tv 11 news today in baltimore. >> good morning. i am stan stovall. time to get check on the morning commute with sarah caldwell and traffic pulse 11. >> kind of a busy ride all of a sudden. in monkton and jarrettsville pike and manor road, watch for accident and delays because of that. heavy delays on westbound security at rolling road. all lanes are closed due to a police-involved accident. 14 miles per hour on the outer loop west side. earlier accident and wilkens. we will check on that in a moment. southbound 795, backed up at owings mills. two accidents at 108. this one involves a motorcycle. if you are going to travel on the northeast side, heavy delays on the northeast outer loop and southbound 95. 12 miles per hour on average. wilkens avenue, there is the accident on the outer loop. it is off to the side. we will switch to a live view of traffic in the white marsh area. tapping the breaks to the 895 split. >> good morning, everyone. we have the scattered light rain showers out there. nothing of any significance. a 30% or 40% chance of this light rain at your house. most of it is in southern pennsylvania. we expect additional showers later on this morning. mostly cloudy, maybe a peek at the sun. a chance for a few rainshowers. unseasonably cool again, with high temperatures in the upper 50s to around 60. we will take up to 72 mar bid 75 on friday. >> be sure to check the bottom of your screen for updated news and traffic information. we are back at 7:55. 7:30 now on this wednesday morning, october 6, 2010. and we're looking at a sea of smiling faces on rockefeller plaza. and coming up, where are your tax dollars going? >> many cities and towns are struggling to pay for their public works and teachers, some government workers are being paid hundreds of thousands of dollars every year. coming up, we'll tell you where the biggest offenders are. and a revealing interview with mel gibson's ex. she's opening up about the threats that the actor made against her. what she's now saying coming up. and a warning before you consider selling some of your unwanted gold jewelry to make a little extra cash. wait until you hear just how little some companies are actually giving you for that gold. just ahead the results of our "today" investigation. but we begin with new details of an alleged attack of an american couple by mexican pirates on a texas border lake. authorities say a witness has now come forward. janet shanlian is outside of the mexican consulate with the very latest. >> reporter: just a devastating time for this young woman as she's trying to get some answers, trying to get her husban