Biden and kamala harris, by the way, also testing negative for covid19 out of an abundance of caution. Ali vitali is following the campaign from wilmington, delaware, for us. Good day to you. Does this change anything out on the campaign trail for the biden team . Well, i guess were going to see, alex. A few things stood out to me from the president conference we just heard from the president s doctor. There were very few specifics on the timeline here and one thing stood out to me when reporters kept asking if the president was on oxygen, the doctor kept saying, not right now. Finally, he was able to be pinned down that he wasnt on oxygen on thursday, friday or saturday, but again, a few vague details there. Well see joe biden later today. Hes doing a virtual town hall later this afternoon. Whether or not this comes up depends on if he takes questions from the pool reporters that are with him ierk imagine. But when you ask if this means anything different out on the campaign trail, we know that this campaign is at least in an event sense keeping it business as usual. Joe biden is maintaining his schedule today. Of course, he was in michigan yesterday. Kamala harris, for her part, is in Salt Lake City and shes still expected to debate Vice President mike pence on wednesday. Pence is actually going to be traveling out to utah on monday, we just confirmed. So from a travel perspective, the campaign is rolling on. What has changed, though, alex, is the tone. This race reached a fever pitch on the first debate stage earlier last week. Now, though, the tone is completely different. The Biden Campaign saying, this isnt a moment for politics. Liste listen. We can get this pandemic under control so we can get our economy working again for everyone. But this cannot be a partisan moment. It must be an american moment. We must come together as a nation. The threat of this virus is real for all of us, and let it be a reminder to all of us that we must remain vigilant, and take care of ourselves and take care of each other. And, alex, that tonal shift extends from the candidates as well as the ads that the campaign is running on tv. Yesterday, my colleague, mike memoli and i, confirmed that the campaign taking down negative ads up on the airwaves. At least for now thats the shift thats happening tonally in the race from the tv ads to the tweets that biden himself is sending, to the way that the candidates are talking on the campaign trail. An appropriate tone, given the tenor of this country, and what everyone is facing with regard to having the president there in the hospital. Ali vitali, thank you for that. Josh lederman is outside walter reed where the president s physician just spoke. Give us the 411 on what we learned. Well, alex, some encouraging information today, but some new questions raised by the first opportunity that the reporters have had to actually question the physicians who are treating the president. The doctors treating President Trump said that the symptoms that he had on thursday night, a mild cough, some congestion in his nasal, as well as some fatigue, that those are resolving, as well as the fever. But they were very cagey about whether at any point in time he has been on some type of a supplemental oxygen to help with his breathing. Although they say he has not been on supplemental oxygen today. His doctor suggesting that his vital signs are all looking very good and that the president even said to his doctors today, he feels like he could get up and walk out of the hospital today. So, as far as the president s spirits and some of those basic medical criteria, he seems to be doing fairly well. However, the timeline is getting to be more and more of a mess here, alex. The president s doctor saying that its been 72 hours since he was diagnosed when, in fact, we didnt learn until only about 36 hours ago that he had been diagnosed with covid. Were not exactly sure how to square those things there. And also dr. Conley saying that the antibody cocktail had been administered to President Trump 48 hours ago. The information that we had on that was that that was a much shorter timeframe. Well have to continue to press the white house on these discrepancies in the timeline of when they knew that President Trump was sick and when they actually started to treat him. Although, as we should be all glad to hear that the president does seem to be doing okay, at least as of this moment, alex. Absolutely. Thank you, josh, for that. Lets go to nbc news dr. Natalie azar to talk about the update on the president s health. Dr. Azar, the word is that the president s doctors say cough, fatigue, they have resolved. Theyre very happy with his progress. What do you make of the update we heard about, i dont know, 30 minutes or so ago . Well, you know, theres a lot to be encouraged about. We have we now know that his heart has been evaluated and he has normal cardiac function, normal renal function. Patients admitted with kidney problems can do worse. And his liver function is okay. His 02 saturation is 96 on room air and hes ambulatory. Thats all absolutely fantastic. I think what were, as a doctor, what im trying to get my brain around a little bit is the renaissance that the doctor had perhaps in divulging that he may have required supplemental oxygen. Thats not that big of a deal. I think that that is something that, were that to be the case, that is perfectly okay. One criteria for getting remdesivir, in fact, being moderately or severely ill in a hospitalized patient with covid19 who does require oxygen. So, again, im a little bit unclear as to why there was any sense of being noncommittal about that. The doctor did mention, of course, that melania was doing very well and had no indications for hospitalization, implying that there was an indication to hospitalize the president. Although when asked a few different times, he answered, we didnt want to hold anything back and he is the president. So i was getting a little bit of mixed messaging there. I think the president was clinically not as stable as we were led to believe initially. Okay. Is that why you believe he was sent to walter reed . We were all surprised, given this diagnosis, if you will, or update from dr. Conley after being there for not even 24 hours. I use the word a sunny description, really, to how hes doing right now. He does seem to be doing well. Of course, everybody is glad for that. Absolutely. But do you think that there was something that indicated, we better go . Because in covid, things can happen very quickly, quite dramatically. Exactly. And i think thats where i am sort of walking this line between was everything done because of the fact that hes the president , or were they really just looking at this incredibly objectively and saying, hes 74, hes male. By criteria, he is obese. That is exactly the kind of patient that we worry about around day five, day six, day seven, who may do well initially and then have a rapid deterioration. If thats the case, where do you want the patient to be . They mentioned his care staff, three Critical Care pulmonary folks, pharmacists, two Infectious Disease specialists. You want that because, god for bid, his oxygen saturation were to drop and he needs to be intubated. To your point, a man of his age and physical type he has been described appropriately, he checks all the boxes for being obese, thats something that you just indicated, if you want to repeat that, five to seven days after being diagnosed would be kind of a time to keep looking for . Right. So, generally, we say, alex, people tend to develop symptoms about four to five days after their diagnosed and its another five to seven days after that where they can really decline, which is why dr. Conley was saying its the first seven to ten days really in the course that are the most important. People dont generally get very, very sick in the first week. Its usually the week after, and even a little bit beyond where patients, if they do enter or transition into that hyperimmune response, that storm where things can really go downhill rather quickly. For patients who fit the demographic or the clinical picture of someone you would be worried about, you want to keep a much, much closer eye on them after the first week and second week of their illness than you would an otherwise younger, healthy person without any comorbidities. Lets talk about remdesivir then. He has been given a dose of that, at least one. To what extent does that alleviate any concerns about the severity of what the president could face if the description of what could happen does ultimately come to pass for him . So what i found interesting about that was that, in fact, the indications for remdesivir are in hospitalized patients who are moderately to severely ill who are on or requiring supplement supplemental oxygen. Its been found to lessen the severity of their illness, shorten the hospital stay and improve mortality. Its generally not given to patients who are early in their illness, who are doing well. It is an antiviral. A different sort of approach, and i think this underscores that as clinicians we like to combat something from multiple different angles, is that he got this polyclonal because he two different antibodies given as a cocktail from the company regeneron. This is similar to the convalescent plasma where you take antibodies from a recovered person and infuse that into someone who is sick. This takes that concept but fine tunes it. They find the most potent neutralizing bodies and clone those and bulk manufacture and infuse that. That is a treatment as opposed to remdesivir that is being looked at in very mild, very early disease to see whether or not it can prevent progression to more serious illness. So, in a sense, its a little bit of a mismatch. I dont know how first of all the monoclonal antibodies are being given as a compassionate use but is currently only be studied in clinical trials. Remdesivir is part of the protocol for hospitalized patients but it appears that the two patient groups who get this might be a little bit different. He got it all. Yeah. All right. Stay with us, dr. Azar. Ill bring into the conversation as well my esteemed colleague, andrea mitchell. Welcome to you. Couple of things we learned here, and one is sticking with me, that dr. Conley suggested that the president is 72 hours into his diagnosis. Right. If one does the math, that would put it back to wednesday morning, which would be considerably sooner than the public was told that he had covid and that, of course, he went on and continue wtd rally wednesday, also went to bedminster for that large fundraiser thursday. Is it possible that dr. Conley misspoke, or is there any concern about full, complete transparency with this white house . I think the evidence would be more on the side of being concerned about full and clear transparency with this white house since, first of all, this was the first briefing weve had. Until now weve only had several sentences from the doctor, which is very unusual when a president is hospitalized. I cant think of any precedent myself, when there hasnt been some kind of medical briefing. And, in fact, questions ask askasked. He was very precise about when the president was first on oxygen, suggesting he wasnt on it on thursday, wasnt on it when he got to walter reed but clearly could have been a window on friday, just from the inference of what he did not y say, as well as the fact that its now becoming clearer that the president became aware, according to mark meadows, when he was leaving marine one for bedminster, for Andrews Air Force base, became aware of hope hicks diagnosis, that it was positive. They had that window, 10 or 15 minutes when they get to andrews, they could have turned back. They made a decision not to turn back from that trip where upwards of 200 people in new jersey could have been compromised by the president s appearance and others around him. We dont know who was staffing him. They did leave some people back who did not Board Air Force one. That decision already was being called into question. Now were getting the possibility, because dr. Conley refused to say he wouldnt look backwards at when the president s covid tests when he was asked about when did he first test positive. He said im not going to go backwards, if you recall, or something to that effect. Its possible that he first had a positive indication on wednesday before, importantly, that very large minnesota rally in duluth with all of those people, and not masked. He didnt engage with people on the tarmac coming off, as he normally would, with greeters. Maybe already they were trying to be careful. But there were people on air force one, including hope hicks. Weve seen, going back to saturday, that that rose garden event could very well, within the window of infection, and results being noticed in the testing again, that rose garden event with all those people glad handing after the event, the receptions they had indoors, indoor events in the diplomatic Reception Room. Weve seen white house photos and pool photos by the great photographer doug mills, in the diplomatic Reception Room of people we can see i see Maureen Scalia talking to judge barrett. Those are indoor events, and also there were events up on the state floor, we understand. I believe in the state dining room or east room. There was a lot going on there after the public event in the rose garden. We already know that two senators who were there, we know that bill steppien, who was involved with the president in debate preps that weekend, Campaign Manager right now Chris Christie has announced, former governor, who also obviously has comorbidity, as the president does, from being overweight and in that age category, Chris Christie is quite a bit younger, but the president by being 74. Of course, its very good that the president is Walking Around and walked to the helicopter. Very good that they say he is not on oxygen now, is not compromised that his lung function is good. They did now give Blood Pressure ratings, heart ratings, which were good. Im not a doctor but have been covering these things for so many years the indicators were all good in that regard. Being in the hospital they can monitor his other functions much better than they could, of course, at the white house. Its clear he will be there a couple of days and there are political ramifications. I want to point out, we just saw the statement from Mitch Mcconnell where putting the session postponing for floor votes until october 19th unless a 24hour call back. There will be virtual hearings and that Lindsey Graham is proceeding on october 12th with a judiciary hearing for Supreme Court justice virtually because now two members of the committee, and they are in a very short timetable initially, before this even happened, they could only afford to lose two more republican votes for a floor vote and theyll proceed. But they wont be voting on the floor unless theres some emergency session for any covid relief. They are going to proceed with this very rapid schedule, but they are now going to take a break from any kind of floor actions. Youve got three senators now with covid and you dont know how many more will be diagnosed. There were a lot of senators present at that rose garden event. Yeah. And with the president for the rest of the week. Yeah. So, there are both political and medical ramifications to all of this. To you i ask the political question, andrea, what might be the fallout for this president . First, if there is a lack of transparency, how will that be disseminated, how will people feel about that across the country if not around the world . And also among his supporters, the base of donald trump. Many of them are absolutely loyal to him and, be that as it may, do you think that the fact that he has been stricken with covid19 may be because he flaunted the prospects of not wearing a mask and saying repeatedly that he wasnt afraid of it, and any number of other things that have been chronicled over these past months . Might this have a detrimental effect to his base of support in these last critical 30plus days before the election . I would say based on everything weve seen, because we dont have any polling data yet on this, that it will not in terms of the base. A lot of sympathy will be engendered and concern about the president s health. Certainly if he battles through this successfully, it could be a plus wifor him, with his base. A lot of people on the fence, suburban women who have been evaluating how they were going to vote, if theyre going to vote, may not be happy with joe biden, not happy with some of the president s behaviors, that this is possibly, you know, a demonstration that this disease is a serious disease and that Wearing Masks should not ever have been a political statement. The viral load for anyone infected with the disease is a lot worse for someone who has not used face coverings. So the president himself now faces the risk that his infection would not have been as serious, or as serious as it could become. After the first few days, thats the critical point, where we see which way this thing is going. If had been wearing face coverings. And, as well, dr. Fauci only said last month in his testimony to the hill that theyre first beginning to see really disturbing signs of longterm, real problems, cardiac problems, inflammation of the heart among people who have survived covid. We dont yet know much about this disease. Its not something to be trivial about. And i think certainly the other factor here is that hes off the trail. Very Effective Campaigner with the base. Those rallies are his meet matte and potatoes. He cant do that now. No, he cannot. This is so close to the election, hes losing time. The Vice President is taking his place. There are a lot of concerns being expressed about the Vice President , who is now, you know, so important a figure in terms of continuity of government not getting infected and should he be out there, campaigning and taking any risk at all . Thankfully, hes negative again today. Those are really concerning issues. And just to say that covid is now front and center in the campaign. They had wanted the Supreme Court, which really energizes their base, and a lot of other voters who might have been on the fence, who are really energized by those issues and by barretts record and the prospect of cementing a conservative majority on the court for decades and decades to come if judge barrett were to be confirmed, that that issue is now not going to be as front and center inevitably, because of his being hospitalized and having covid. Yeah, of course. The pandemic is going to be the main issue. It definitely is. And the confirmation hearing, were it to have to be held virtually because of literally the lack of presence of senators able to be there in one of the rooms, one of the chambers, if theyre even going to go there to begin with, given covid to that point. One last question, andrea, before i move to our colleague, kelly odonnell, who is outside walter reed. You said the president is off the trail. That is obvious. Bill steppien, Campaign Manager, has succumbed to having covid19, as having to quarantine as well. Its been said that it feels within the white house that this campaign is over as a result of this. Is that what youre hearing as well . Is there any sense that they would be able to gear up in any effective way were the president not to be able to take back out to the campaign trail publicly and have those rallies that he so loves . Well, theyve got all sorts of surrogates they can get out there. I think they can campaign, but they cant avoid the fact that the president is off the trail. You know, as i say, i dont think its wise for the Vice President to be out there. A lot of people are saying that he should just, you know, bend over backwards to keep himself safe and away over other people. You never know where this thing is going to hit you. Now we know its airborne and can travel farther than six feets. And there are all kinds of questions that are being raised about any indoor activities certainly. So, they can have an Effective Campaign such as it is, i would think, but their main issue, you know, is they have other issues, not covid, not the pandemic. Thats not the best issue for them. Thats been joe bidens issue. Then you have to be concerned about outside interference, Election Security in terms of just the poll watchers that they say theyre delegating, the lawsuits. There are all kinds of other ways they could slow this thing down. Its hard to say, though, that they could be really effective without bill steppien, without the president and others being sidelined. Absolutely. The Vice President is planning to head to utah on monday. Of course, he will not have senator mike lee by his side, were that to even have been in the original plans, because he has been stricken with covid. We do know that the Vice President ial debate is scheduled to be held on wednesday at the university of utah. That is at least full steam ahead. Perhaps with some adjustments in terms of distance, social distancing, spacing there for the two candidates. And to your point about intelligence, im going to be speaking with representative adam schiff about all of concern in that regard as well. Andrea, thank you so much. Well let you know if you are free to go, but goodness knows, im always glad to have you, your expertise and insights with me. As we go to my colleague, kelly odonnell, outside there of walter reed. What was your big takeaway from this, the implications of that which was said by dr. Sean conley and that which was not, despite repeated questioning . Reporter well, if we look, alex, at the visual that the white house wanted to present, dr. Conley was there at the center behind the lectern. They wanted to show the breadth of medical help and expertise treating the president. Visually, that was one signal that the white house and Walter Reed National military Medical Center wanted to convey, that theres a lot of expertise, theres a lot of knowledge and a lot of care surrounding the president. That was something on both a visual and even a subconscious level in terms of trying to convey confidence about the president s care. Then they went to such pains to say that the president talked about wanting to walk out of here today when, obviously, that is not appropriate at this time. Again, its that signaling of things are under control. The big, Unanswered Questions do need to be addressed. And it is troubling when a briefing takes place and we had some significant questions after that briefing that were left unclear, confusing or unanswered. Couple of those stand out. The way that the doctors responded on questions about supplemental oxygen, being so precise in saying in present tense that today the president has not received that and hedging when they were pressed simply leaves the possibility that the president did receive supplemental oxygen, unless and until the white house categorically tells us that did not take place. That was just definitely a question. And how significant is that . The other big and maybe even more important issue is the timeline. We were all notified publicly when the president s tweet first came out at 1 00 in the morning the other night about his positive diagnosis. We certainly understood that the white house would have had information in advance of that, had a testing history on the president. They would have had insights from him directly about his symptoms. Today they gave us a larger window of time than we had been aware of publicly. That is important in part because the president was not in isolation. I was with him on wednesday when he was in minnesota. It was a cold night. He did a short er than usual rally in duluth, minnesota. The following day, the president left the white house to go to his bedminster golf resort to go to a fundraiser. Based on the timeline the doctors laid out today suggested that the president had symptoms like fever or some ind kags he was sharing with others about not feeling well at about the same time there was a confirmed positive diagnosis of his close aide hope hicks. Yet the president still went to that event, saw other people, et cetera. The white house previously explained to us that he had been cleared to go, but we dont really know what that means. Now this new medical information suggests that the president may have had some sense of feeling unwell even at that time. And perhaps in ordinary circumstances, you could say a candidate who is really working hard and is traveling and is working at all ends of the clock might not feel well daytoday. Certainly those of us covering him get tired as well, and that that might not be a big deal. But in the age of a pandemic with all the concerns it is a different level of indication. That remains a question that we will have more opportunities, i hope, to get clarification from the white house on those points. Where we are right now is outside Walter Reed National military Medical Center. This is a joint military hospital. So you have navy, army and so forth working collectively here. It has become a magnet for people interested to see whats go i going on here. There are certainly a lot of passersby who have stopped. People have brought their children, their dogs, their phones to take pictures. And, of course, some supporters of the president have been camped out at that corner there, maybe a dozen or two at different times, waving flags, loudly proclaiming their support for the president , chanting get well soon, things like that. A couple of protesters from the other side against the president or probiden, but very few of those. Mostly it has been supporters of the president , in small numbers here, and people driving by with flags and honking and waving. Theres sort of a raucus environment outside the hospital at a time certainly when the president and every other patient in there probably needs rest and quiet. But that is not the way it is when President Trump is involved. There is always a magnet of attention and sort of a loud atmosphere. That is certainly true here. Alex . Kelly odonnell, thank you so much for that. Kelly, you may want to take a listen to what i have as well. This is coming to us from our colleague hallie jackson, who is reporting that her sources tell her that the president of the United States, here is the quote, is still not on a clear path to a full recovery and there is more that the vital signs of the president over the last 24 hours were very concerning and that the next 48 hours will be critical. So that is information, kelly, that was just coming to us as you were speaking to us with your report. On the heels of that news, lets bring back in dr. Natalie azar. I would love your comment on this. It falls in sync with what you suggested earlier to us, that a man by the description of President Trump, his physique, sbanlg the like, there are a few days yet we should consider before he gets the allclear and can leave walter reed. Absolutely, alex. A few things that were missing from dr. Conleys report that i would have wanted to know about was specifically if or how much lung involvement the president may or may not have had. The virus starts off in the upper airway and then in people who get really sick, it travels down into the lung. Did he have any typical opacitys on the check xray . I dont know other than liver and kidney function are normal, which is good, but no inflammatory markers, crp, ddimer, rdw. Those are important prognostic indicators. While we always say that the first seven to ten days are important or at least in the first 72 hours hes feeling great. We know hes not necessary ily t of the woods, but its hard to give you a complete interpretation without all of the clinical data. Demographics aside we all know, but more specifics about all of those things that they would have done on admission, that they have given them a little more reason to give them to say were going to give him remdesivir, not wait till he starts to deteriorate before we pull out our bigger guns if that makes sense. It does. Thank you, dr. Azar. Not sure were letting you go as yet. Were getting more information to discuss. Congressman adam schiff, thank you very much. I presume you were listening to dr. Sean conley and the discussion thereafter. First, even before all that, your reaction to the president being treated for coronavirus and all that you interpreted from what we heard from his doctors a short while ago . Well, a few things. First of all, i hope that he and the first lady, and all of the Administration Personnel and my Senate Colleagues get well soon. I hope they make a rapid and complete recovery. I wouldnt wish this virus on anyone. And its encouraging that the prg noesz looks good. I am concerned over a few things. First of all, that the white house may not have been candid about the president s condition when they knew that he had the virus or may very well have had the virus and the president may have exposed people in the white house, his own staff, his own security, people from the secret service, supporters of his in bedminster or other events, may have knowingly exposed them or a chance he was carrying the virus. Obviously that would not have been a responsible thing for the president of the United States to do. Also struck by how tragic and unnecessary all of this is. The president has the best care and protection of anyone in the country. And this was avoidable. Just as the sad reality is that the you know, the fact that we have millions of americans infected was avoidable. If we had, you know, followed scientific advice, evidence and worn masks and masks hadnt been made into a political issue, so much of this misery around the country could have been spared, and the president himself and the first lady may have been spared if there was more adherence to what the scientists and epidemiologists ands have been telling us for months and months. Its a terrible tragedy i have concerns about what it means for our National Security, which im happy to discuss. We are going to get to that. Before those details, what about when you were informed . Youre a member of the gang of eight, those with Important National security and intelligence standing. Were you, congressman, informed that the president was going to walter reed Medical Center . No. No, i wasnt. And, you know, i think most of us learned of the president s illness the way we learn about much from this white house, in a president ial tweet. And, you know, in terms of his going to walter reed, thats not something we had any advance notice of. But more concerning, frankly, is the fact that theres still so many open questions about not just the president s health but also when people who are aware that he was carrying the virus and what steps were taken or not taken to inform the public, but also inform people around him. It is vitally important that the president be transparent about this, that the white house be transparent about it. If theyre not, the public will not trust what theyre being told about the president s condition, but it also presents an opportunity for foreign bad actors to take advantage of the situation. We need honesty and transparency, two things we have rarely seen from this white house. I want to get to the concerns you have from an intelligence. Before i do that, though, what is the obligation of the white house to the gang of eight or to the Intelligence Community in terms of keeping you updated as he is being treated . How concerned are you that this lack of transparency youre describing here will persist . Well, i am very concerned that the lack of transparency will continue. I think its honestly less of the gang of eight issue. We certainly need to be kept up to speed on any pressing National Security threats to the country. Now, a vulnerability to the president s health certainly impacts that. But, you know, my paramount concern is that he be transparent with the american people, that the public have confidence that they can get the truth about the president s condition at any given point. That, to me, is of paramount necessity. But we also need to be paying attention to how foreign powers might take advantage of the president s condition. Uhhuh. Its not just that he is ill. Rather its not just kind of a transfer of power, whether he needs to delegate to mike pence at some point but if hes in a diminished condition, if hes fighting off this virus what does that do to his Decision Making at a time when we have the russians actively interfering in our election . We have iran still, you know, burning to retaliate for the killing of soulemani. North korea is looking for opportunities to provoke. And so we need to know what the president s condition is and we need to make sure that we have all those continued themes covered. With regard to the president s condition, i want to reiterate we were provided by our colleague nbcs hallie jackson, that she got from a pool source, that group of reporters standing out walter reed, asking questions of dr. Sean conley, what she is passing along to us is that the president is still not on a clear path to a full recovery, that his vitals over the last 24 hours were very concerning and that the next 48 hours will be critical. There is always a question about the prospect of implementing the 25th amendment, the third article of acceding the power from the president to the Vice President. With foreign or Domestic Intelligence here, keeping this country safe from nefarious actors of any kind, if the president is diminished in any way, is this something that you would support moving into the hands of the Vice President to take over a Decision Making, any dealings with anything that might come up . You know, it really depends on how incapacitated the president would become. Hopefully, thats never going to happen. But if the president is conscious but delirious, you need someone with the reins of power in the government. You need to be able to make that decision if the president is not capable of making it, because hes unconscious, for example. But i would hope that well before you would get to that point, and hopefully that never happens, but if we were to get to that point, hopefully, you would have the president making the decision, im not feeling well enough. Im not at my best. At this point im going to transfer authority to the Vice President. I will let you know when i feel well enough to resume my full responsibilities. Thats what the president should do if the president feels that his Decision Making may be impacted. So hopefully, you never get to the point where others have to make that decision because the president is not conscious or not could not kognitively able to do so. Thank you for being here. Thank you. Thank you for bei. Thank you my father always reminded me, a good education takes you many different horizons and that sticked to my mind. So, when 1 a day came out, i said, why not . Why not just utilize that resource. And walmart made that path open for me. Without the 1 a day program, i definitely dont think id be in school right now. Each week for me in school is just an accomplishment. I feel proud every step of the way. Latest update on the president this last hour as doctors say hes not having any trouble breathing. The coronavirus is adding a new wrinkle to the Supreme Court fight. Sounding the alarm saying its premature to proceed with confirmation hearings for judge aimy Coney Barrett as two Republican Judiciary Committee members, mike lee and tom tillis, have tested positive for covid19. Mitch mcconnell, Lindsey Graham, theyve indicated they plan to move ahead with births nomination as scheduled. Joining me now, former minnesota senator al franken, also host of the al franken podcast. Awfully glad to talk with you, senator. Thanks for having me. Before we get to the Supreme Court, sir i want to get your rks to the president of the United States being treated for covid19. How much of a surprise was that for you . I think every american was a little shocked and little surprised that the american president has it. This is the most secure workplace, supposedly, in the world. I think this is in large part because they did not take the correct precautions. We all wish him well. We all hope for a quick recovery. But, you know, they said they were taking him to walter reed out of abundance of caution. Well, this is the first time theyve seemed to use an abundance of caution. He was ridiculing Vice President biden at the debate for wearing a mask as frequently as he does. And the first family was there at the debate. They were required to wear masks. They took their masks off, were approached, given new masks and refused to wear them. Melania was one of them. There are so many people now close to the administration or part of the administration that are testing positive. This just puts tremendous stark relief. The difference between how people who would treat this responsibly and how the Biden Campaign and people who take this seriously. I wear a mask everywhere i go when i go outside. And this lack of transparency, this ridiculing people who take these kinds of precautions, the underplaying of the importance of wearing a mask, even, as i said, ridiculing them, all of that, i think, is just it just is in stark relief how wrongheaded their approach has been, how irresponsible the president has been, how he is responsible for this being an outofcontrol pandemic. We were going to have a pandemic. We knew that. And when he knew that, he told bob woodward he knew that. He told bob woodward how serious this was, and then he lied to the american people. He said its a hoax. And that is completely irresponsible. We did not have to have over 200,000 americans die from this. We did not have to have that happen. We should have had testing and Contact Tracing and encourage people to socially distance. He did exactly the opposite. He said on the debate stage that they didnt have indoor rallies. Yes, they did. They had indoor rallies last week. They had indoor rallies in tulsa. There has been ridicule of the Vice President , as recently as in the debate. Look, no one wants anyone to have this, no one wants anyone to get seriously ill if they contract it. Youll see from all the people around him, hope hicks, the first lady, conway, now Chris Christie, steppien, the Campaign Manager. You saw tom tillis and mike lee came to the announcement of Coney Barretts nomination, not wearing i got in contact with mike lee, wished him well. I texted him actually. I heard he tested positive. Stay away from me. And we had a nice back and forth. And i wished him well. I wished everyone well. Uhhuh. But i dont think theres anything, any one thing in this campaign that puts more in stark release the importance of getting this guy out of office. I think its a Fair Assessment that the prospect of covid19 in this panic will be the singularly top focus for the remainder of this campaign. And hes trying to get it should have been. It should have been from the very beginning. It should have been his focus as president from the very beginning. But it want. Senator, lets talk about the Supreme Court. We know thats a big focus of this campaign, as well as loes elected officials in congress, despite the president s diagnosis. The Senate Republicans appear to be pressing forward with confirmation for Supreme Court nominee amy Coney Barrett scheduled to begin october 12th. There was some discussion abo about october 19th as well and whether or not that will be officially pushed back by one week, given those members of jushry that are literally out of pocket. Theyre having to quarantine right now for the next 10 to 14 days. What do you make of the decision to push ahead, nonetheless . I think the decision to push ahead in the very beginning after Ruth Bader Ginsburg died was absolutely, totally hypocritical. I was there in 17 when the president nominated Merrick Garland. All of them said the same thing. The president cant nominate someone this close to an election. Coney barrett went on cbs tv after scalia died and made the exact same case, saying that the president cant nominate someone during an election year. She contrasted it to when Anthony Kennedy was sworn in, in february of 88. She made the point that that had come from powells resignation. She said well, thats a conservative judge and the new judge, justice will be conservative. Thats appropriate. But when she said scalia was an arch conservative or committed conservative, whatever the word she used and said that obama appointee would change the balance of the court and that was inappropriate. You go back and see her words. Shes a total hypocrite. Not only are the republican members of the senate hypocrites, they wouldnt meet with Merrick Garland. They lied about what the socalled biden rule was. There was no biden rule. And this is so hypocritical. Also shes a terrible choice in so many ways. I questioned her, as you may remember, she had taken money from the alliance for defense of freedom, a hate group, a Southern Law Center had labeled them as a hate group. They are for the sterilization of trangender people. She took money from them. Shes an extreme choice and believes conception starts at conception that life starts at conception and that it would be a crime to destroy an egg that was fertilized in invitro fertilization, a frozen egg. Despite all of this, it is entirely possible she will be confirmed. As we know, Mitch Mcconnell is trying to push this through prior to the election. If she were to be confirmed, lets take that as one prospect, and if joe biden were to be elected president , what are your thoughts on stacking the court . Theres a history of this court, as you well know, the Supreme Court since its inception, of volleying between five, nine, up to 11. There are any number of configurations. We have nine now. The prospect of stacking the court in favor of liberal justices, how do you come down on that prospect . Look, what theyre doing now and what they did in 16 with Merrick Garland was absolutely cynical and hypocritical. If they manage to get this to get Coney Barrett through, then theyll have a 63 court. It will completely change the balance of the court. And the question becomes, what do you do . They stole essentially two justices, in my mind, Merrick Garland, and this one is so close to the election that its and under any normal terms, this would be ridiculous. So you have to ask yourself that question. Of course, if you do it, then where does it stop . But i think you have to maybe sit with the 63 court. If theyre overturning anything that a President Biden and a Democratic Congress pass through, and it takes a while to learn if theyre going to do that. But if they do that, then that will give, really, democrats in the senate no choice, and the president , if its President Biden. But you look at how we got here. This is so cynical, so hypocritical and not just Mitch Mcconnell and the republican senators, but judge Coney Barrett herself. Former minnesota senator, al franken. Thank you so much, sir, for weighing in on both that from your experience and reflecting on all youre talking about in your podcast, al franken podcast, and how americans are reacting to all of this. Thank you very much. The president s diagnosis certainly threw the 2020 race into a tailspin. Jim messina, former manager for president obamas 2012 reElection Campaign. I have to imagine youre kind of happy youre not dealing with a reelection or an Election Campaign right now. I mean, it is just unprecedented, all thats happening right now. As we look at whats happening with the sitting president , hospitalized with a dangerous virus one month from the election. I mean, unprecedented to say the least. The Biden Campaign is responding by taking all negative ads off the air for now and when the former Vice President spoke yesterday in michigan, he really emphasized the need for unity across this country. What do you make of that approach, jim . How does a Campaign Even approach this situation . Were living in historic times. Sunday night you have the revelations that the president of the United States hasnt paid taxes in 10 or 15 years and pays less than minimum wage worker. On tuesday you have the debate where the president has an historically bad performance and polling this morning in states like florida and pennsylvania, the race is beginning to open up for Vice President biden because people were so turned off by the president S Performance and now you have the president of the United States with the coronavirus. The coronavirus problem issued to the president is really twofold. Number one, it makes coronavirus back to the number one issue in the campaign. Thats all were going to be talking about in the next few days. And we know from polls, from focus groups, that is really bad for the president. On his handling of covid, over 60 of the country thinks he has handled it poorly. Now you have stark example of how badly he has handled it. Second, were 30 days out from the election. 2 million americans have already voted. Now if youre the Trump Campaign and, youre totally right, i would not feel very im so glad thats not my job today, alex. Now, 30 days out, they dont have their best weapon for at least the next two weeks. So, you know, they cant do anything. Theyre going to put pence on the road. Theyre going to do surrogates, but this is a very serious problem for a campaign that trails in every single battleground state and well go ahead. Sorry. No, no, nothing to apologize for. Jim, i want to jump in here and say the president has been trying to make his reElection Campaign about anything but the pandemic, but this, it pushes it to the forefront of the election, if it wasnt there already. How does this impact the last days of the campaign . Is this campaign over from the Trump Campaign perspective . Well, i think its a disaster from the Trump Campaign perspective. If you look were only at about 4 to 5 of voters who are undecided in this election. And theyre looking at this and, you know, majority of them are women voters, already leaning toward biden. Theyre look at this, saying how irresponsible is this guy . They dont wear masks. Even yesterday, alex, the white house chief of staff said after the president of the United States gets covid, theyre not going to change their policy at having masks be optional at the white house. Its just turning off these swing voters all over the place. If youre the Trump Campaign, at some point you just look at this and say what do we do now . They wanted to end this thing talking about Supreme Court and law and order. Yeah. Now theyre talking about the president s health and covid. And thats a disaster for the Trump Campaign. Look, jim i have to ask you, are the polls real . Do you believe them right now . Does joe biden have that much of a lead . Look, alex, you know how i feel about polling. In the obama reElection Campaign i threatened to fire my staff who read the daily polls, because i think most of them are garbage. I think what both campaigns have to do, and i think the Biden Campaign is doing this very well, just ignoring those things. Looking at the data we actually know. Who is voting . Every day, were getting numbers from north carolina, from pennsylvania, from florida about people who have already voted. More democrats are voting than republicans. Those are good signs. We also know in 2016, you know, the party got fat, happy and lazy and decided they had this thing done. Lets ignore all the polls, understand that this race has already changed three times this week, and you cant assume anything. And lets go make sure that we win this election, because this guy cannot be president of the United States any longer. Former Campaign Manager for president obamas 2020 reElection Campaign, jim messina. Considered yourself booked for next saturday. Goodness knows what well have ahead of ourselves to discuss for next week. Good to see you. Congresswoman Debbie Stabinow is joining me next to talk about the president s condition and the push to confirm amy Coney Barrett. 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