All i hear from the presses that are moving so swiftly, its like a blur going by. This has been a couple of years. Two and a half since the initial investigation of the russian involvement in americas election, which started much of this. And then led to other things. This isnt about ukraine. This is about russia. Who benefitted by our withholding withholding of that military assistance . Russia. Its about russia. Sometimes people say, well, i dont know about ukraine. I dont know that much about ukraine. Well, our adversary in this is russia. All roads lead to putin. Understand that. So if it is all about russia, then what exactly are these articles of impeachment going to look like . Could they be much broader than we thought . We dont yet have an idea. We dont even know who for sure is drafting them. While the House Judiciary Committee is formally tasked with that responsibility, pelosi today said she wanted multiple Committee Chairs involved. And then she met with all six house Committee Chairs, who have been tasked with investigating President Trump. For an enormouslywide array of potential misconduct. So we dont know how many articles of impeachment there could be. We dont know who exactly is drafting them. And we dont know what they will be focusing on or when there will be a vote. And we know even less about what a trial in the senate is going to look like if it happens at all. In fact, going to have a hard time putting anything on their calendars for the month of january because the official Senate Calendar that was released today excuse me, yesterday does not have january. Due to a lack of clarity on impeachment. So lets dive into this issue. Get the latest on capitol hill with garrett haake. And, garrett, im going to set you up here because i know you may want to set yourself up. With this basic question, which is, how broad is this impeachment gonna be . Let me play the q and a that you had with the speaker. You mentioned those previous investigations. Do you want to see elements of the Mueller Report . Im not going to be talking about that. My chairman will be making recommendations. Do you have a personal view on that . As to what the the our counsel, our lawyers, our our chair. Staffs of the committees have been sensational. And we look to them for their judgment about what the articles of impeachment. With all due respect to your question, im not here to talk about that because that thats what theyll be working on. So i guess this gets at the i dont want to say its a disconnect. But a lack of clarity here. On one hand, she said this isnt about ukraine. This is about russia. Which of course many people have said. This is bigger than just ukraine. This is about the larger russia question. But adam schiff never made it that. Jerry nadler never fully made it that. She is. And then she backed off on what that means. Yeah. Its interesting, chuck. I mean, one of the questions that she answered earlier in that same press conference, pelosi was asked if there was a turni turning point in her view on impeachment. And i think i say sort of geared up to hear her Say Something along the way since these public hearings are starting. And she said no, it was the whistleblowers original complaint, the ig report that got her thinking about ukraine. That tells me theyre looking at a longer timeframe or at least the speaker is in terms of what gets included. And its also interesting, as i talked to oether democrats throughout the course of the day, a lot of democrats on the Judiciary Committee really do want to have something from the Mueller Report. Particularly, the obstruction elements of the Mueller Report, be considered as part of the articles of impeachment. Some of them told me they feel like its Unfinished Business almost for that committee, which was investigating this for so long. And they think the president s obstructive conduct as demonstrated there is part of a pattern that speaks to what he was doing in ukraine. But whether theres other things along the way, other acts by this president that could be included. It does still seem like its a very open debate. Its also potentially good politics for democrats if they introduce more articles than they ultimately approve. It would give vulnerable democrats perhaps a chance to vote no on some things and look like theyre being more reasonable and not just rushing to judgment on the president. But i think its clear democrats are trying to move fast here. But these are Unanswered Questions on exactly what goes into the articles. Now, there was a the House Republicans of 1998 and 99 did a similar thing. Had four articles. Ended up, i think, voting out two. Garrett haake. Starting us off on capitol hill. Thank you. Joining me now, two smart minds. Neil, former acting solicitor general in the obama administration. And glenn kershner, former federal prosecutor. Also msnbc legal analyst. Neil, let me just start with you and what how did you what did you hear from Speaker Pelosi . I mean, a lot of us heard, you know, like okay. And and does that mean the syria decision . Does that mean if its all about russia, thats a much bigger lens to start looking at. Yeah. I think its a little artificial to talk about russia and ukraine and to pick out one thing the like the sentence she says well its about russia. Its not about ukraine. Because earlier, she said ukraine changed everything in the press conference. I think what she really means to be saying here is ukraine is one example of a larger situation in which the president has been doing, effectively, russias bidding. I dont think that necessarily changes the impeachment calculus in terms of the articles. It may influence the breadth of them. But, you know, this investigation has been moving with a lot of velocity on ukraine. Ukraine. Ukraine. Theres a separate set of things about russia. Which are breakaway and could be standalone and i think maybe this has a little bit to do with that. For example, did the president lie to the grand in the Mueller Investigation . And does the grand jury have information about that . That is about russia but its also about something much broader than that. Or different than that. That is, you know, something that we could see come out in in an article of impeachment. That pelosis lawyer told a federal court two weeks ago thats what they were investigating. You know, glenn, it was interesting. On one hand, her announcement today. Okay. Theyre moving to the next phase. On the other hand, you hear that. And youre like theres a lot more to investigate. And and and so and you hear more moderate members going lets move, guys. Lets get this. So we know theres some political. What did you hear out of all this . So the old prosecutor in me likes to hold all wrongdoers accountable. All coconspirators. You dont want to leave a stone unturned. No and what we have right now, chuck, is a very compelling case. Particularly, i mean not just the 12 fact witnesses. But those expert witnesses really brought into full focus the fact that the two things that the framers were really concerned about was foreign interference in our elections. And a president abusing his power and his office. And in one thing, President Trump managed to do both of those. And then he covered it all up to boot. By completely ignoring and refusing to take part in congresss lawful responsibility, sole responsibility, of impeachment. So the problem is, theres enough for the president. No now, i dont think anybody suspects that once this shifts over to the house, the republicans are gonna have a spasm of patriotism and lawabidingness. But where does that live us if we stop the investigation right now . With a lot of potential complicity. We have learned weve gotten the sense in the upper echelons of the state department, in the upper echelons of omb, and that has not yet been gotten hold of. Neil, this gets at a guest i had on earlier this week about disinformation. She made an interesting point about impeachment. She goes, you know, when the history of the Trump Presidency is told, will ukraine be the number one thing for those critics . And it was an interesting point she made. Its sort of like its what they have. And it goes to this question. Is it the thing . Right. No. Its iron clad. It reminds me a little bit of the johnson impeachment under johnson 1867 who was impeached for violation of the tenure of office act. This is what youre saying. Youre making the capone tax evasion. You know, youre not getting em for the big crime. Certainly, dont want to make it about something technical. The problem is or the difference is here are the ukraine stuff is this is what glenns getting at is not actually technical. This is the heart of what impeachment is about. The president tried to cheat in the 2020 election with the help of a foreign government. And so i think the problem for the democrats is thats actually pretty clear. I dont think theres actually much disagreement on the facts. But then theres also all these other allegations. About russia and lying and so on. So what do you do . This is something prosecutors deal with all the time. And i mean, i think here, the fact is theyve got a very strong, airtight case, they can make that case. They can move it quickly. And then continue to investigate these other matters. All right. But you say they continue to investigate. How much momentum gets lost if you stop this . Right . Isnt that the concern . Right. And thats a political calculation because it doesnt look like theyre playing for republican votes. It looks like theyre playing for the hearts and minds of the American People with respect to where the poll numbers are gonna go. I had a strategist to me say this is the democrats with the swing voters that are weary of impeachment, all they have to do is make the case that it was legitimate. That this was a legitimate thing to be investigating. They dont have to make the case that he should be thrown out. They just have to do that. Thats, you know, do you stop there . Can i tell you what the the big unknown is right now, chuck. Ordinarily, i think we could say lets move out against the president. Because theres enough evidence right now. And lets let the department of justice deal with the criminal investigation of whatever was going on at omb that might be complicit in what trump was doing. Whatever was going on in the state department. But with bill barr, can we trust that the doj is going to get that investigative work done . Thats a rough charge. Sdny is doing some stuff. They may stumble into some stuff. But i think what ultimately is likely to happen and should happen here is almost a rolling impeachment. You break out one set of allegations that you know and that youve got ironclad. You dont stop the investigation. You keep it going. Here the president has given ammo to the democrats because he has stone walled the investigation and congress. Not a single witness permitted to testify, not a document or the like. Democrats would be on good footing. Would they be in good political footing to look like theyre always trying to impeach . Serial impeachment . If the president gave this information over to congress now, it wouldnt be forever. We could resolve all this stuff soon. Its because this president is hiding it. All right, guys. My favorite thing of the day was the senate putting out the no the calendar with no january. Were 60 days from iowa. We have no idea what the next 60 days are going to look like. Neil and glenn, thank you very much. Coming up, dont mess with me. 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That was easy glad i could help. At xfinity, were here to make life simple. Easy. Awesome. So come ask, shop, discover at your local xfinity store today. Welcome back. We do have a lot of questions about where this impeachment process is going next. So lets ask someone whos going to be involved in it and is involved in it. Joining me now, democratic congresswoman and member of the Judiciary Committee, madelyn dean. Congresswoman, nice to see you again. Good evening. How are you . Im okay. So let me start with this question about invest keeping the investigation going and starting to write articles of impeachment. I know whats being said. Youre gonna not stop investigating. But there is a momentum switch that takes place once you start writing articles. I know that theres this idea you can walk and chew gum at the same time. But there are going to be leads left uninvestigated as you turn this over to the senate. What, to you, is this balance that youre striking . And are you concerned that youre leaving some stones unturned . Thank you for having me on, chuck. I want to say that the evidence that we already have, as incomplete as it might appear to be, is undeniable. Its undenied. And its damning. So it is important and, in fact, urgent that we move forward. I respect the speaker and her decision today for our Judiciary Committee to move forward with articles of impeachment. We learned yesterday from the professors. I loved yesterdays hearing because it brought to life our constitution and why our founders put in the impeachment clause in article two, section four. Why did they do that . Because no one is above the law. Especially, the president of the united states. And so to protect us, keep our elections free and fair and full of integrity, its important we move forward. Im not concerned. We will continue other investigations. But i am not concerned. Do you feel as if, though, that those that after you send over the articles and you keep investigating, that if hes not convicted, that it just that that no matter what wrongdoing you find, it doesnt it it just doesnt have the same impact. Well, let me describe the other side of that. Its interesting that the Republican Party and the president have said youre moving too fast. You dont have enough evidence. What is the very reason we dont have complete evidence . An extraordinary obstruction by this administration. Historic, as we know. No other president subject to impeachment has ever blocked every subpoena. Every subpoena. Every subpoenaed document. We have none. In fact, the only document we have, which was sent over by the president , is the record of the july 25th call with president zelensky. It is a damning condemnation of this president seeking foreign interference in our election. And its a continuation of a pattern of behavior. The Trump Trump Campaign had more than 100 contacts with russia. The president openly asked for russia to interfere. Asked for china to interfere. And then privately, in that phone call, asked for ukraine to interfere. And all to the benefit of whom . Putins russia. Thats what the American People need to know. So at this point in your head, how many articles do you think are are realistic here . It sounds like an abuse of power. A obstruction of justice that you just brought up with the Mueller Report. You decided a few of those. And do you believe a bribery standard has been met . I certainly believe bribery has been met. This president tried to bribe, extort, coerce a foreign leader. In a fragile democracy, under attack by russia. Lets make no mistake about this. By withholding aid that we, congress, republicans and democrats, authorized to help this fledgling democracy. Im not going to speculate on the articles of impeachment. I feel that my duty on the Judiciary Committee is not to engage in any speculation. Instead, to engage in study and make sure that the facts supported by the constitution are what guide our articles of impeachment. Do you have an idea of what the other four committee committees may be sending over to you guys . We know what the Intel Committee sent over. Financial services, foreign relations, oversight. What are they possibly sending over to you guys in order to discuss articles . I look forward to all of it. I dont know what the other committees are sending. I i have the great honor of serving not only on judiciary but also on Financial Services. So one of the things that you have seen is weve been in court. In addition to upholding our duty as a coequal branch of government in this investigation. And now, the drafting of articles of impeachment. Weve been in court in both Financial Services an