rally set to start in about an hour in lafayette park there, directly in front of the white house. it is the same group behind the violent rally that happened in charlottesville, virginia, last year that i was just mentioning. so far, very few white nationalists have shown up. a much larger number of counter protesters there to hold their own rallies nearby. we have reporters monitoring the situation. we're going to start with nbc's garrett haake with the white nationalist rally. and a lot happening there. what are you seeing? >> reporter: hey, richard. i'm actually on the edge of that rally. we are blocked by the police on one side from getting any closer. what you're seeing right now is the arrival, or more accurately, the return of a group of antifa counter protesters. they gathered maybe 20 or 30 minutes ago. best probably to think of them as patrolling the outer edges of this park. d.c. police have made it their mission, and they have been very clear about this, that their big goal here today is to keep all of these groups separate on. on the way in, you had this self-contained almost parade of d.c. police, escorting the white nationalists group, who only numbered about maybe two dozen folks in. this counter protest group is many, many times larger than that. and i can tell you, some of them are very, very unhappy about the presence of white nationalists in their community. so the challenge throughout the rest of the day will remain the same, to keep these groups and to keep this tension purely sort of in the verbal category here. there's been a lot of nasty words thrown back and forth. but if these groups can be kept separate by this very large contingent of d.c. and federal police from different agencies, they'll consider this a good day, richard. >> a lot happening there, garrett. let's get over to mike viviquei. what are you seeing. >> reporter: well, the park police and the secret service have allowed us to come and be in proximity to that man. that's jason kessler, the individual who has organized that. as you see, he just started speaking there, as garrett has noted, as geoff as noted, i have noted in the last hour, there are relatively few of these protesters. we count about two dozen. let's have a look over here. many of them have their faces covered who came. they hold signs that say "white people wake up." they hold anti-abortion signs, as well. here's another individual over here to the left right in front of the white house, perhaps you can see the white house behind these individuals. again, very few. why are there so few of you here today, sir? >> why do you think? >> reporter: i don't know why. >> because people want us dead and everyone is afraid to show up and speak on behalf of white people. not just white people. >> reporter: why do they want you dead? >> they want us dead, because it's projection. they're the actual fascists. they're the actual -- >> reporter: are you a racist? >> i'm not a racist. i'm not a white supremacist. i'm not a nazi. i'm not any of those things. i love everyone. honestly, do i. and because of that, i want to fight the people en slaving me. >> reporter: okay, we're done. we're done. >> listen! >> reporter: so that's the scene, richard. i don't know what else to say. the protesters -- i counted a couple thousand. you can see the police, the grass between us in lafayette park. actually booed many of them when they saw the park police had escorted us from our press pen on a different side, on the east side of lafayette park over towards jason kessler and his followers here. they don't want us to give these people any oxygen, any attention whatsoever. and so with mixed feelings we're even here. this is the situation. these white nationalists, these white supremacists here, just across from the white house, are really very few of them. just a couple dozen. half of them hiding their faces. they have come on the day -- to the day a year after the killing of heather heyer, counter protester in charlottesville, a fact that we spent the morning with the counter protesters weighs very heavily on their minds, richard. >> stay with us. i want to get back over to garrett haake. garrett, you heard some of the reporting coming from viq and some of the messaging from one of the what he estimates to be a couple dozen protesters there. how are the counter protesters answering to those sorts of messages that we just heard from one of the white nationalist protesters? >> i would say the messaging in response is not particularly nuanced, richard. these people and their views are not welcome here. the signs of these antifa protesters range from the much more mild, no hate, pushing back on hate. the euphemistic, "no hoods in my woods," referencing kkk hoods, to much more specific. the biggest banner here, the best way to -- takes a bullet to bash a fash is the big banner sign one of these groups are putting out here. look, there is no question here that this is -- i think -- essentially meant to counter balance the intimidation factor that sometimes takes place in these white nationalist marches. they want people inside the security corden behind our camera to know they are out here and to know that message isn't welcome here and will be met just as loudly and just as aggressively if this situation calls for it. it is not what i would consider to be a friendly opposition here. this is a group of folks who are ready to push back as loudly as they feel is necessary, richard. >> garrett haake, viqueira, thank you both so much. we'll get back with you later in the hour, as a lot is moving, and so much can change very quickly. for now, i'd like to bring in our panel. we've got todd johnson, nbc, blk editorial director. gloria brown-marshal, john j. college, professor of constitutional law and author of "race, law and american society." mark thompson, host of "make it plain" on siriusxm progress, and associate of professor of anthropology and african-american studies and author of "shape shifters: black girls and the choreography of citizenship." let's start with you on this, gloria. we were talking before we got on the set a little earlier. civil rights attorney. >> yes. >> you've worked in alabama during some tough times recently. and we just listened to one of the protesters who was -- and i'll just reiterate what was said. he believes that there are those that want him dead. he also said he loves everyone. and he feels like he is enslaved at the moment. he is saying he is not a racist though. what is your response to what you heard? >> i don't call this a white supremacist march. i call it a march of the ku klux klan, because that's what it is. and they have changed the name to make it fancy and make it nice and palatable. and their argument being made is an argument that could have been made in 1925 when the ku klux klan marched in washington, d.c., the first time. and this idea that they are somehow enslaved because these other people, the other americans -- they don't want to share the country with us or anyone else who doesn't believe what they believe. so the sense that their the victim in this is really the sad part and the fact that donald trump continues to pour gasoline on those flames -- i mean, this idea of victimization means these people are going to do whatever it takes to control their country. and that's what the clan believed from the beginning when slavery ended in 1865 and what we're dealing with now in 2018. >> you remember how quickly what was calm at one moment -- or the appearance thereof, quickly, quickly changed and heather heyer was then killed. when you're watching this, we're hearing the numbers are not what they thought. a couple dozen, right? and there were some estimates that they thought there were going to be 3, 400 that were going to protest. and when they came out of the subway and they got there, it was only a couple dozen, at least so far. what are you watching out for here? >> well, i just think it's a matter of, like, to what end? what is the goal of even, you know, a couple dozen folks showing up, trying to proclaim that this country is somehow theirs and no one else's? and i think we saw this a lot during the election, leading up to donald trump's election as president. his voters, his supporters, talked about they were the silent majority, not wanting to necessarily put a face on some of these elements, that anti racist activists abhor so much. the racism, the bigotry. and then we had this guy that viq just talked to, not really wanting a label on how he feels and wanting to kind of have it both ways in a sense. and i think that's what makes a lot of critics not only of this administration and how they handle race but critics of where we are as a country and the lack of progress we have made. that's what makes those folks so upset, because we talk about healing, we talk about progress. but it doesn't seem like we're seeing any of that in front of our eyes. >> and then we're seeing here, amy, direct response, which is in the thousands, compared to the couple of dozens that are there at the moment. and not wanting to be identified, as todd was underlining there. how would you identify this group? >> it's interesting. i think what we are called to respond to in this moment is to be clear about our definition. so we spend a lot of time talking about the rhetoric. right? the language, the representation that we're using. this gentleman who doesn't want to be identified as a white nationalist, who is essentially a neo-nazi. and so i think it's important that in this moment we are very clear on the distinction between white nationalistism and white supremacy. these are two different things that are directly related. so when we talk, we spend a lot of time trying to untangle white supremacy, which is an ideology, a belief system that is a false belief in a superiority. which white nationalism is a demand for political, social, economic dominance, needing white supremacy in order to en liven itself. we spend a lot of time focusing on how we respond to white supremacy as sort of an esoteric value system, or spending time focusing on language, when we really need to look at that connection between language, representation, value systems, and the way that policy and legislation and racist violent acts play out. and so this is -- there's that space between -- >> right. >> there's a slippage in how we're using these terms. we need to be clear on that. >> right. >> and i think we're seeing that, and it plays out in the ways that whether we're talking about white nationalists or the protesters, envision themselves. >> right. and the way that you might put that into a framework that has been laid out by our first three discussants, and we bring you and mark on this, and you look at some of the signs -- i was just looking at one -- no islam phobia. white nationalists, by the description that amy gave us, it's not white versus black. it is white versus all others that are not. >> right. >> well, that is the ideology. that white is supreme. it's the same philosophy hitler had. the aryan race, the master race. trump tweeted, he is against all types of racism. but that goes back into that many sides foolishness he was talking about. there are no all types of racism. there's one type of racism. white supremacy and white nationalism. there are no asian racists. there's no black supremacy. there is no asian supremacy, no jewish supremacy, no latino supremacy, no native american supremacy. so this is being enabled by him. and this is the most direct association with white supremacy, white nationalism and racism. trump is a racist and a white supremacist. this is the most direct association between these groups, and a president in office since i think woodrow wilson. you know, we have had other presidents who clearly were racist. but it was a more indirect and more subtle dog whistle going on. we know about reagan and the bushes. but this is a direct relationship. and he can't deny that. i know you all have been covering amarosa all day. she can talk about what she's talking about now. but she helped to enable this. anybody in that white house who has stood with this president has helped to enable what is going on today. the good news is, if your reporting is accurate, only half -- a couple dozen people out there. so that means there are more of us good people, more children of the light, as dr. king would say, than children of darkness. but it also means that most of them are still on social media. there are dozens of them on social media. they have no voice modulation control. they're always on social media tweeting and sharing and posting on facebook. some of them are even russian, we know. we need to do a better job of calling them out. they have been called out in the streets, they're scared to come out today. that's good. we need to call them up, back them out. >> we are watching live pictures in washington, d.c., as a white nationalist group is now proceeding for their protest. and a very large number of counter protesters in these pictures we're bringing to you. of course, the concern, please no flashpoint, no violence. that is what the officials on the ground are asking for. we're going to take it straight back to washington, d.c. our panel is not going anywhere. we'll be right back. en is a plae on earth ♪ uhp. i didn't believe it. again. ♪ ooh, baby, do you know what that's worth? ♪ i want to believe it. [ claps hands ] ♪ ooh i'm not hearing the confidence. okay, hold the name your price tool. power of options based on your budget! and! ♪ we'll make heaven a place on earth ♪ yeah! oh, my angels! ♪ ooh, heaven is a place on earth ♪ [ sobs quietly ] ♪ ooh, heaven is a place on earth ♪ whoooo. tripadvisor makes finding your perfect hotel... relaxing. just enter your destination and dates. tripadvisor searches over 200 booking sites to find the hotel you want for the lowest price. dates. deals. done! tripadvisor. and welcome back to msnbc. we're watching breaking news coming out of washington, d.c. this a white nationalist demonstration and protesters there. we estimate at this moment a couple of dozen counter protesters also in these live pictures. numbering in the hundreds if not thousands, as we have seen so far. now 4:17 local time. sunset in about three, three-and-a-half hours. a lot to watch here in the coming moments. and, of course, the concern is it's a repeat of what happened in charlottesville, virginia, one year ago, when this very same group that is protesting here in washington, d.c., that led to one death. heather heyer. it's now one year ago since she lost her life. one of the issues is our panel still with us here. mark, you were bringing up the idea of social media. i mentioned just two dozen that are there, that are part of this white nationalist demonstration. there is the criticism that perhaps we were overmagnifying their voice. number one. and number two, that social media is assisting in that overmagnification. >> of course, it is. and that is what swells in numbers. they're all cowards. that's the nature of these individuals. so they blow it up on social media. and we can't even be too sure how many of them are, because social media has got to do a better job, facebook, twitter and everything else, to filter out what's real versus what's a bot, versus what's a russian. but we don't really know how many there are. but there are obviously more right now. if you go on social media right now, more than there are even at this rally. so why didn't they come out today? why are they afraid to come out? they don't want to be seen. so social media serves as the hood that the kk used to use. they can hide under that hood of social media and not be seen. >> and speaking of social media, president trump did tweet yesterday on this very topic, and -- the way he decided to respond to the issue related to race relations, as he said, i am proud to have fought for and secured the lowest african-american hispanic unemployment rates in history. now i'm pushing for prison reform to get people who have paid their debt to society a second chance. i will never stop fighting for all americans. and hold your gun powder for a second. mpr did a fact check after the president did imply this very same point on low unemployment rates for african-american and latino americans. and this is what they found. rates had fallen long before trump took office. this implies there is nothing specific that trump did to change this rate. these rates have been falling relatively steadily since around 2010 early in president obama's tenure in the white house. >> exactly. right? so he keeps trotting out these same statistics and we know they're not really real. it has nothing to do with his administration. so he's trying to find a way to combat the fact, it's very clear, transparent now, that his entire rhetoric is built on a white supremacist ideology. it's revealed. we see this. and this is what emboldened the sense of self righteous, white, racit indignation that we see. i want to talk about social media for a second in a different way. so when we think about social media as a cover for white supremacists, i also want us to think about what is the charge that we level against self proclaimed, nonracist progressive whites? this is a conversation that we really need to have, and as social media operates in a different vein when we are talking about nonracist whites. a way you can demonstrate or perform solidarity with black lives matter movements, for example, on social media. you can even march in the streets with folks. >> we're seeing that, amy. look at the crowds there, right. >> exactly, but my point is this. there needs to -- there's a difference between in a very public, protected way, showing alliship. and the realm of private interactions or in these protected spaces. but what does it mean to really take a stance, to really intervene in a larger macro platform that requires a political stance that addresses white nationalism? >> okay. >> that is a very different proposition. >> we're going stay on that. amy, that's a question i'm going to ship over to you, gloria. how do we do this ally-ship that she's addressing? how do you step forward, based on what amy is saying, gloria? >> there is actually a case before the u.s. supreme court that's coming up in this upcoming session that deals with membership. and who can belong to what and still have it be covered as a quiet member. like, you're not exposed. your privacy is protected. and so when we're talking about -- if you're a member of the ku klux klan, and that's why i say, this is a klan march. and you can call it whatever you want, fancy name, white supremacists, et cetera. how do we then address those people, based on freedom of speech, who want to join a white supremacist organization? under our constitution, they have the freedom of speech. they have the freedom of association. they can join these organizations. in other countries, it would be against the law. in ours, it's not. and until they actually ban the ku klux klan and other organizations that are offshoots of the ku klux klan, these people can be members of these organizations. now, how far are they allowed to go in their rhetoric? if they threaten human life, that's a different story. >> and tom, we're not seeing a lot of numbers, though, that are deciding to do what you just described, gloria, stand up and participate as a protester with a white nationalist. >> with charlottesville last year, the man who has been indicted and charged with murder and federal hate crimes, he was on social media, you know, expressing these pro nazi, you know, pro white sort of views. and no one knew who he was. his family was aware, his teachers were aware, his friends were aware. and the numbers weren't necessarily outrageous last year in charlottesville. so it just took that time on social media for this young man, james alex fields, to develop this sort of belief system, and show up and cause harm. and, you know -- i think that's important. i had a chance in early july to go down to charlottesville and talk to the new police chief there, a black woman, who talked about how, you know, what healing looks like. and i think we talk about these buzz words, healing and solving america's racial wounds and problems, and we don't really know what that exactly means. and what the chief was talking about was that the police officers in charlottesville and the larger institution as a whole need to be called to account from inside. so it was part of her mission to make sure her police officers knew that they needed to be accountable when they didn't act the right way. or they needed to be accountable and aware there was a long history of resentment in certain communities of how they have acted, not just over the years, but throughout the centuries that this country has existed. so i think that's important. naming what healing looks like, talking about accountability, and then following up and seeing if that is actually happening, whether it's charlottesville, whether it's d.c., ferguson or wherever or what have you, and see if these improvements have been made. >> but racism is a chronic disease. death is embedded into this country. when thomas jefferson wrote those words, he wrote it in the presence of enslaved africans. taking the land away from native americans. this is part of our ongoing struggle. and in order to have a struggle, you have to know that you have a problem. and you have to actually say i'm going to address this problem, going to do what i need to do, to keep the chronic disease from actually destroying the host. my concern is, as we heard with these politicians on in the earlier program here, that they don't want to talk about the issue of racism. as this one person said, we're tired of talking about race. we're tired of talking about this issue. and whenever you have an economic down turn, which we did with the great recession, then you have poor whites who are shaken out of the economy, blaming people of color, blaming immigrants, for their economic disposition and their economic, you know -- i guess being able to put on the periphery of everything else. when they say we're not going to be replaced, i'm not replacing them. technology is. their lack of education is. and blaming people of color and blaming immigrants is not the answer. >> we've got to leave it there. i want a one-word answer from all four of you as we watch these pictures and look at the question as our race relations getting better or worse. that's been polled. six ways to sunday. your views, amy. >> it's becoming more complicated and it's asking us to be accountable in ways that are going to make us deeply uncomfortable. >> mark? >> quantitatively, yes, we see that by the very number of those out there counter protesting today. but qualitatively, no. because they make a lot of noise. >> todd. >> i think no. because i don't think we're -- i think we're talking about all different types of race relations. and i don't think anyone is really talking about the actual ingrained issues that are kind of uncomfortable to talk about. >> gloria, one word. >> white racists are fighting a generational war. 2044, this country will be majority people of color. ask they're trying to make it into an apartheid state. >> thank you all. a great way to cover this very important news event today. breaking news coming out of washington, d.c., appreciate all four of you. duly noted, or in amarosa's case, recorded. nbc has exclusive audio of the moment john kelly fired her from the white house. in the situation room. plus, what she regrets the most during her time as a former aide to president trump. >> i was complicit with this white house deceiving this nation. they continue to deceive this nation but by how mentally declined he is. how difficult it is for him to process complex information. ♪ this is a story about mail and packages. and it's also a story about people. people who rely on us every day to deliver their dreams they're handing us more than mail they're handing us their business and while we make more e-commerce deliveries to homes than anyone else in the country, we never forget... that your business is our business the united states postal service. priority: you ♪ i've been making blades here at gillette for 20 years. there's a lot of innovation that goes into making america's #1 shave. precision machinery and high-quality materials from around the world. nobody else even comes close. now starting at $7.99. gillette. the best a man can get. essential for the cactus, but maybe not for people with rheumatoid arthritis. because there are options. like an "unjection™". xeljanz xr. a once-daily pill for adults with moderate to severe ra for whom methotrexate did not work well enough. xeljanz xr can reduce pain, swelling and further joint damage, even without methotrexate. xeljanz xr can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes fatal infections, lymphoma and other cancers have happened. don't start xeljanz xr if you have an infection. tears in the stomach or intestines, low blood cell counts and higher liver tests and cholesterol levels have happened. your doctor should perform blood tests before you start and while taking xeljanz xr, and monitor certain liver tests. tell you doctor if you were in a region where fungal infections are common and if you have had tb, hepatitis b or c, or are prone to infections. needles. fine for some things. but for you, one pill a day may provide symptom relief. ask your doctor about xeljanz xr. an "unjection™". today, life-changing technology from abbott is helping hunt them down at their source. because the faster we can identify new viruses, the faster we can get to stopping them. the most personal technology, is technology with the power to change your life. life. to the fullest. and i am a senior public safety my namspecialist for pg&e. my job is to help educate our first responders on how to deal with natural gas and electric emergencies. everyday when we go to work we want everyone to work safely and come home safely. i live right here in auburn, i absolutely love this community. once i moved here i didn't want to live anywhere else. i love that people in this community are willing to come together to make a difference for other people's lives. together, we're building a better california. mr. president, do you feel betrayed by amarosa, sir? >> uh -- >> get it out of the way! >> low-life. >> instead of talking about how to unify the nation, he actually insulted me by calling me a low-life. that is a man who is inclined to start racially charged engagement and use race to kind of stir up his base. >> well, there it is on a sunday. amarosa versus trump, in a very real, reality tv-like showdown. this morning amarosa newman joining nbc's chuck todd on "meet the press" in an exclusive interview about her tell-all book, her exit from the white house, and claims president trump is a racist. for more on this conversation of race, firings and audiotapes, let's bring our panel, greg spouse, new york one political reporter and host of new york 1's off-topic. republican strategist. tara dardel, former "apprentice" contestant. tara, let's start with you. because we are talking about a another former "apprentice" contestant, i think she is out-apprenticing -- if you will, mr. donald trump at this moment. >> well, i would say this. donald trump surrounds himself with people who are like donald trump. and i want to make a point about amarosa. a lot of people are sort of belittling the role she played. they have had a long-standing relationship for nearly 15 years. much of that relationship has been financial in nature. so she has been very much aligned with him from a business perspective, from a personal perspective in terms of -- they had some sort of friendship from my dealings with her, that existed too. so i think that while people are impugning her credibility and certainly she hasn't helped her credibility, she knows a lot about donald trump. >> and she also knows a lot about general kelly, the chief of staff. and i want to play what was also an exclusive to "meet the press." this was a piece of sound that came from what we understand to be the firing of amarosa by general kelly. let's take a listen to it. >> i think it's important to understand if we make this a friendly departure, we can all be, you know -- you can look at your time here in the white house as a year of service to the nation. and then you can go on without any type of difficulty in the future relative to your reputation. >> can i ask you a couple of questions? is the president aware of this? >> let's not go down the road. this is a nonnegotiable discussion. >> i don't want to negotiate. i've just never had a chance to talk to you, general kelly. so if this is my departure, i would at least like to have an opportunity to understand. >> we can talk another time. this has to do with some pretty serious integrity violations. so i'll let it go at that. so this staff and everyone on the staff who works for me, not the president. >> we are listening to audio of the chief of staff sitting down with amarosa in the white house in this situation room, we believe here. and it's being recorded by somebody's -- what appears to be cell phone in what is supposed to be one of the most secure places, at least in washington, d.c. >> i don't think she should have carried her cell phone in and recorded this private situation at all. number one. and number two, a lot of people that know amarosa think that she's a major opportunist. and when she joined the trump campaign, a lot of people were wondering, you know, what is she doing? you know, i've been a republican operative for a long time. amarosa has never been involved in any sort of political movement or anything. and i think that what -- i think that she is trying to remain relevant. why would you go and praise donald trump over and over and over again and be a side kick to try to help him win the election and then now you're turning, you're recording conversations. i'm sure john kelly didn't know she was recording. >> i bet general kelly when seeing or hearing this is probably going -- and then you can see the smoke staff off, grace. because how is this white house being run, right? there are security protocols that are involved in this. there could be legal action now taken, based on what those security protocols are for the situation room. >> right. i'm having flashbacks to the rob porter situation, where in the wake of his dismissal after he was accused of abusing his ex-wife, or multiple exes, there was a whole question and discussion and debate around security clearances. here was someone who was potentially vulnerable to blackmail, or someone had leverage over him and yet he received very high-level security clearances. now with amarosa's departure, we're not really talking about her book, we're not talking about these accusations but now suddenly she realizes the president is a racist. but the security question. how does somebody get a recording device into the situation room, how was something like that allowed to even happen? >> and it's not even good? i mean, she's being fired because she's violate -- she's taking the white house car meant for dignitaries as her regular commute back and forth. >> serious legal issues is what he says. we don't know necessarily what they are specifically. at least it's not on that tape. >> well, if she's going to record it, she should have gotten some good stuff. she got a nothing burger. >> the thing is -- >> the fact that she had a recording, it shows the level of chaos that exists in the trump white house. the fact that all of this shenanigans continues to go on day after day after day, this is a white house that continues to be out of control, and the amarosa situation is just yet another example, i've said this again, i'll say it again. it's yet another example of the chaos, the corruption, the cat fighting and the coverups that exist -- >> she didn't do anything like this when she was at the white house. >> but trump picks all of these people and then he surrounds himself with these same personality types. and then he acts surprised. >> when she was campaigning, she sure did like him then. >> also, to your point earlier that he surrounds himself with people who are like him, he's known to have recorded conversations. we know that michael cohen has cord recorded conversations. so this is someone saying i need to get my ducks in a row, when i tell my story, i have some sort of evidence backing me up. although that tape is sort of less substantial than the fact it was created in the first place. >> so gloria, what i was saying is that not recording personally conversation in the situation room was so 2017. >> it really is. but here is the recording i'm looking for. the one that has the evidence that robert mueller needs. all of these people are recording. they're all doing the same thing. watching their back. so when that recording comes that shows obstruction of justice, or conspiracy to obstruct justice, witness intimidation, that's the recording that's floating out there and we need to hear. >> and that is the question. is this the tip of the iceberg of recordings? is she only representing, with this tape, the first of a series, a practice that potentially are doing in the white house. what might that mean? not only for bob mueller, but for national security? >> yes. and i believe that tapes are being made, because all of these people are backbiting and sneaky, and like amarosa, it's a personality he wanted to have around him, and that will probably be his down fall. and i said this for a year now. watch the people around him. they're going to be the ones who bring him down. >> last sentence. we have to go really quickly. >> these are the same people who are leaking. all of the leaking is coming from trump's own hires. so if these people are so bad, it begs the question, why did trump hire them? >> last sentence. >> well, you know -- i can't even -- [ laughter ] >> okay. >> that's a wrap for me. >> thank you all. we'll have to leave it there. we've enjoyed our conversation. also, we're watching this, of course. you see the lower right hand part of your screen, live pictures in washington, d.c. white nationalists preparing to rally on the anniversary of the charlottesville protests. these are the counter protesters, as you see, holding up signs. it appears to be calm right now. officially, they are supposed to start at 5:00, but we've already seen them -- already begin speaking. we've got a live report from the ground, next. let someone else do the heavy lifting. tripadvisor compares prices from over 200 booking sites to find the right hotel for you at the lowest price. so you barely have to lift a finger. or a wing. tripadvisor. crisp leaves of lettuce. freshly made dressing. clean food that looks this good. delivered to your desk. now delivering to home or office. panera. food as it should be. we're still following breaking news coming out of washington, d.c., there in the beltway. the white nationalist rally, kicking off there what was supposed to be planned in about the next 15 minutes or so. this is marking the one-year anniversary of a very similar protest last year in charlottesville, virginia, where one woman was killed. opposition groups are also gathered nearby to protest the far right group, which is expected to be, at least the estimations in a couple dozen or 20 or 24 or so. there's also a heavy police presence to ensure this year's rally does not turn violent. nbc's viqueira on the ground for us. and viq, as we look up, the concern might be weather as well. and then the sun goes down. and that's also maybe a potential difficult point there for law enforcement. >> >> reporter: right. it also may serve to disperse the crowd earlier and more peacefully than otherwise might have happened. although, i've got to tell you, if there is going to be violence here, if there is going to be confrontation, they've got a lot to overcome on both sides of this. richard, we are standing right now in the quadrant reserved by the park police for kessler, the leader of the white nationalist movement, and the speaker on the one year to the day anniversary of the killing of heather heyer and the protests and confrontations that were so disturbing in charlottesville. i'm going to flip the script, though. i'm not going to turn the camera on jason kessler. i'm going turn the camera on these folks. i'm going to say, it's always dangerous to estimate crowd sizes in washington. a couple thousand, easy. and now you can hear the thunder rolling in from the south and west of us. but these folks are here to protest what has turned out to be a minuscule turnout from jason kessler and his group. now, the last hour you may have heard me talking to some of his cohorts and copatriots over the. they are scared. many have their faces turned. i'm just going -- covered, rather. you see some park police who have horses held in reserve and ready to deploy. to your left, peter, you can see one of the individuals over here, two of them, actually, with jason kessler, one of them with his face covered. and walking further south, you see jason kessler. the rally wasn't -- as you pointed out, the rally wasn't supposed to start until 5:30. they started way ahead of time, just across from the white house. much more press than there are adherents to jason kessler and his group. richard? >> viqueira, in washington, d.c., watching what is a big concern there for local officials that should not get violent. and so far that's been the case. viq, i know we'll be getting back to you here on msnbc. thank you, sir, for now. still ahead, see how life has changed for survivors that were injured during the deadly attack that happened one year ago in charlottesville, virginia. managing blood sugar is not a marathon. it's a series of smart choices. and when you replace one meal or snack a day with glucerna made with carbsteady to help minimize blood sugar spikes you can really feel it. glucerna. everyday progress. i've been making blades here at gillette for 20 years. there's a lot of innovation that goes into making america's #1 shave. precision machinery and high-quality materials from around the world. nobody else even comes close. now starting at $7.99. gillette. the best a man can get. if you have moderate to thsevere rheumatoid arthritis, month after month, the clock is ticking on irreversible joint damage. ongoing pain and stiffness are signs of joint erosion. humira can help stop the clock. prescribed for 15 years, humira targets and blocks a source of inflammation that contributes to joint pain and irreversible damage. humira can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes fatal infections and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened; as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. before treatment, get tested for tb. tell your doctor if you've been to areas where certain fungal infections are common, and if you've had tb, hepatitis b, are prone to infections, or have flu-like symptoms or sores. don't start humira if you have an infection. help stop the clock on further irreversible joint damage. talk to your rheumatologist. right here. right now. humira. you're watching breaking news here. this has turned out, at least as of now, to be a small protest by white nationalists in washington, d.c., numbering about a couple dozen. and a very large counter protest numbering in the thousands. we also remember, though, on this day 32-year-old heather heyer. she was killed when a white nationalist plowed into a crowd of counter protesters. that happened one year ago today in charlottesville. dozens more, though, were injured in that. nbc left field reporter and producer, katie ingle hart went back to charlottesville to find out what happened to those survivors and for some, the future still looks a bit uncertain. >> so i broke a right rib. i broke two parts of my spine, and i broke both legs. a right . i broke two parts of my spine and i broke both legs. >> squeeze down here. >> right there. not horrible, but yet that hurts. >> on august 12th, a man drove his car into a crowd of counterprotesters. killing one woman. starr was one of the people he hit. >> yeah. i really don't want to do a fifth surgery. it's already really pushing it to go back to work we january. and no one's paying my rent anymore. no one is paying my electric bill. so that's really scary. >> coming up to the one-year anniversary of the unite the right rally, it occurred to me that i knew very little about the specific people who were hurt that day. and how they were doing. so i started making calls to charlottesville. >> i haven't worked since the accident. >> tay wasn't part of the unite the right counterprotest, but that day she and her sister were running errands in town and were detoured onto the street of the attack. they were directly hit by the driver. >> i can't pay a bill. i can't work. i can't drive for too long. >> get the salt and pepper out. >> i need help taking care of my 9-year-old child because she helps mommy now, you know? >> tay was eventually diagnosed with complex regional pain syndrome. symptoms include burning, spasms, and tremors. do you have any kind of long-term disability insurance from your last job? >> no, my job did not offer that. so i do not. >> this is really common. only around one in three american workers has long-term disability insurance. to cover them if they're out of work for more than a few months. but the gofund mes helped enormously. i've been lucky. >> in all, around $1.4 million was raised on gofund me for victims in charlottesville which got me thinking, why has this become almost standard practice after terror attacks? >> money's definitely a stress factor and the fact that i don't know when i'm going to be able to make my own money again. >> at the time of the attack, tay was uninsured. >> i couldn't, you know, health care is expensive. >> for the last year, victims have been negotiating with insurance companies and state compensation agencies for support. >> the victims are stuck in dealing with a pretty complicated bureaucracy. >> in the meantime, the local charlottesville area community foundation is helping starr and tay with nonmedical costs, things like food and rent. >> but eventually, that money will run out. >> i've budgeted enough so, like, i'll be okay through january. >> what happens if you don't start work at the start of january? >> i'm screwed. i mean, i don't know how i'm paying rent. yeah. i have no idea. i'm very, very scared about that. >> good boy. good boy. >> i had to get used to this body of mine because i can't do things the way i useded ed tee them. i can't see ahead. >> nbc's katie inglehart joins us. katie, thank you for sharing that piece with us. such a snapshot of their humanity, suffering economically, physically, and emotionally. >> and financially. in some ways, this is part of a larger health care story. i posted a longer version of this report on nbc left field's page, and some say the women should buck up, pull themselves up by their bootstraps. the reality is according to federal data, about half of americans could not come up with $400 in the event of a medical emergency. this is a systemic issue. medical emergencies bankrupt americans all the time. >> we're looking at some of the video that is so tough to watch a year later. are they still going through ptsd? no doubt. >> they certainly are. some of the victims have been getting help from a local organization paying for mental health counseling, but that local organization is quickly running out of funding. now, there is some federal compensation available to victims through the victims of crime act, but it can be really hard toing a set that funding. it can take a lot of time. a year later, it hasn't come through for a lot of the survivors. they feel like they've been left to fend for themselves. >> did they know about what's happening today, another protest, and quickly, here, if you can, 30 seconds for us, what was the reaction to that? what was the mood? >> you know, they were certainly aware of it, and all of the women i spoke to had avoided downtown charlottesville since the event. what was really striking to me is that some of the victims weren't familiar with the name james fields jr., the alleged driver behind the car attack. for femme t tthem the experienc different. for us, attention has been put on the purpose traerpetrators a offof the victim experiences. >> take a look at a longer documentary version of katie's report, go to nbc left field, the youtube channel. tonight, also, on the one-year mark of the deadly clash between protesters, and white nationalists in charlottesville what you've been watching, msnbc shares a story of a former white supremacist who dedicated his life to reforming others. watch "breaking hate" tonight at 9:00 p.m. eastern on mns msnbms. be right back. by funding scientific breakthroughs, advancing public policy, and providing local support to those living with the disease and their caregivers. but we won't get there without you. join the fight with the alzheimer's association. ialing] no. no, no, no, no, no. cancel. cancel. please. aaagh! being in the know is a good thing. that's why discover will alert you if your social security number is found on any one of thousands of risky sites. booking a flight doesn't have to be expensive. just go to priceline. it's the best place to book a flight a few days before my trip and still save up to 40%. just tap and go... for the best savings on flights, go to priceline. uhp. i didn't believe it. again. ♪ ooh, baby, do you know what that's worth? ♪ i want to believe it. [ claps hands ] ♪ ooh i'm not hearing the confidence. okay, hold the name your price tool. power of options based on your budget! and! ♪ we'll make heaven a place on earth ♪ yeah! oh, my angels! ♪ ooh, heaven is a place on earth ♪ [ sobs quietly ] well, this is the part of the show when yasmin usually does her share for the week. today, a very special share from yasmin, at she's not here. ladies and gentlemen, meet the newest member of our msnbc team. yasmin giving birth to this little guy last week. his name is nur ahad, named after yasmin's father. he joins big brother and mom and baby are doing just well. just fine. well wishes to them from your weekend news team. we can look at those pictures all day, david gura. yasmin, congratulations. david gura is going to pick it up from here. on that very note, that's a home run for you, friend. >> i was co-anchoring with her early in the morning this week. when she didn't show up thursday, i thought something happened. i'm david gura at msnbc headquarters in new york. ayman has the night off. we want to get to what is happening in washington, d.c., at this very moment. within the last few hours white nationalists kicked off their rally in lafayette park. directly across from the white house. it's the same group from last year's rally in charlottesville. they are actually celebrating that event that left one young woman dead. a small group is being met with a much larger crowd of counterprotesters. with police in washington out in force to try to keep the peace there. n nbc's garrick hake is on the ground. >> reporter: yeah, david, gathe the past tense. in part because it started raining, thundering and like out here. in part, you mentioned the fact this rally wasn't much of a rally to