we start with what it takes for president trump to say he believes a woman when she alleges sexual harassment. party affiliation would appear to be the answer. the president's taken to twitter to lash out at senator al franken, minnesota senator accused of groping and forcefully kissing a radio anchor during a tour. he apologized and calls the photo of the alleged groping of a joke gone wrong. leanne tweeden saying franken reached out to her and she expected to talk to him soon. president trump has remained quiet, though, on roy moore. earlier today supporters of moore, including his wife, spoke out forcefully for their candidate. >> so, let me set the record straight. even after all the attacks against me, against my family, against the foundation and now against my husband, he will not step down. >> moore for his part has denied the multiple allegations against him, which include one involving inappropriate sexual contact with a then 14-year-old. nbc's gabe gutierrez is in montgomery, alabama. kristen welker is on duty for us at the white house. you have new reporting on steve bannon pushing back on the moore criticism coming from some republicans. what have you learned? >> reporter: that's right. i spoke to a source close to steve bannon and essentially sending this message to the establishment -- back off when it comes to roy moore. we can also report that he reached out personally to sean hannity and told him to drop his intense criticism of roy moore. you'll recall that earlier this week sean hannity came out and said, roy moore has 24 hours to explain the inconsistencieses in his story. if he can't do that, he needs to drop out. then a day later sean hannity changed his tone a little bit, backing off some of that heat rhetoric and instead saying, this is up to the voters of b . bomb. a couple of things are striking. it was very similar to the message we heard from the podium of the white house. sarah huckabee sanders when pressed on what the president thinks about all of this continued to reiterate, look, this is ultimately up to the voters of alabama to decide. we haven't heard from president trump this week, as you pointed out in the open. he has ignored shouted questions for two days in a row. undoubtedly we'll try to get more questions to him today. craig, this will be a big topic of conversation again at the white house press briefing. why haven't we heard from the president? and when will we? >> 3:00 that press briefing set to happen. you mentioned shouted questions. there was an event at the white house that just wrapped up a short time ago. the white house had invited a number of college championship teams there to visit with the president. our understanding is the president did not take any questions. but at the end there was another question yelled at the president about roy moore and he ignored that question. there's some video of that event. gabe, meanwhile down there in alabama, tell us about this rally we saw last hour. . >> reporter: hi, craig. we'll get to that rally in just a second. what kristen was saying about that messaging with several republican leaders at the white house and now steve bannon reportedly telling some people -- some people in the republican establishment that it will be up to alabama voters, that's something we're hearing down here in alabama from the republican governor kay ivey as well. she earlier said she would vote for moore. it has shifted to now she wants the facts to come out and we want alabama voters to decide that eventually. we expect to hear from her at an event in the montgomery area. the event that just wrapped up was women for roy moore. several dozen saying they didn't believe the allegations. you just played some portion of the speech by kayla moore, roy moore's wife. all this as we're hearing more about the accusers that have come out against roy moore, nine in total so far from flirting to sexual assault. tina johnson claims she was 19 years old when she was at roy moore's law office trying to settle a custody case. this morning she spoke with megyn kelly. take a listen. >> he asked me, did i have two small girls? i said yes. he asked me their ages. i told him. then he proceeded to ask me, did they have my eyes? it was already uncomfortable when he started mentioning the two girls. bells went off. my mother got up and walked out first. and then he just grabbed my behind, i mean, forcefully grabbed it. >> reporter: now, roy moore has repeatedly denied all the allegations and sort of blanket denial but its notable he did not take questions from reporters yesterday to speak about the latest allegations, including those of tina johnson. today his wife took no questions from reporters either. there are signs, even though there is still strong support here in alabama from the women we saw today, there are signs this could be taking a toll on the moore campaign. of course, that fox news poll that shows roy moore now trailing his democratic opponent, doug jones, by eight points. >> we'll get to that poll in a moment. gabe, thank you. kristen, let me come back to you. the president spending some time talking about al franken. no words about roy moore, but what is president trump saying about al franken? >> reporter: let me read you some tweets, craig. we can do analysis on the other side. the president tweeting today about al franken. the al frankenstein picture is really bad. speaks a thousand words. where do his hands go in pictures two, three, four, five and six while she sleeps? and then this, and to think just last week he was lecturing anyone who would listen about sexual harassment and respect for women. lesley stahl tape, question mark. that's a reference to a "saturday night live" skit he was apparently working on that floated the idea of some inappropriate behavior toward lesley stahl. bottom line, i want to get back to a point you made, which is what is the political calculation here? kellyanne conway said, look, there's nothing contradictory about this. the president did weigh in to some extent on roy moore while he was overseas in asia. and now he's weighing in on the news of the day, which happens to be al franken. the reality is he didn't really weigh in when he was in asia. he punted it to when he was going to come home. we have yet to hear from him. i think there's a real reluctance for this president to weigh in, not only because you have the bannon branch of the party saying to back off, but the concern is that if he does speak out that it could ultimately energize roy moore supporters. they would say, hey, look, this is an example of the establishment of washington meddling in our election and we are the ones who get to decide who holds that u.s. senate seat. can't underscore this enough. there is a lot at stake with this senate seat, including the president's agenda, tax reform, all of it on the table. >> kristen welker at the white house and gabe gutierrez in alabama. big thanks to both of you on this friday. hugh hewitt is a conservative radio talk show and josh moon is a columnist for the alabama political reporter and shannon petty is a reporter for bloomberg news. the news regarding steve bannon, you are a member of the conservative media. what do you make of this new nbc news reporting about bannon telling sean hannity to essentially shut it down when it comes to criticizing the embattled republican? >> i haven't talked to steve bannon, only once in my life for 30 seconds when i asked him to object my show a year ago and he turned me down. i don't know if he called sean hannity. he didn't call me. if any alabama cares what hugh hewitt thinks, i want roy moore to get out of the race. i have come to my own conclusion about the evidence that, in fact, the charges are valid, he wouldn't seven very long, he would get thrown out. i wouldn't jump to anyone else like the new supreme court judge in ohio, a new story breaking. each one on its own merits, i think judge moore should get out of the race, i think al franken should resign and everyone should. >> kristen gillibrand said she's donating money she got from franken but the senate is quiet on franken. why is that? >> they're afraid of setting up a rule that will come back to bite other members of the body having to do with contact before they join the body. the senate is struggling with where they draw the line on conduct before the member joined the body. thus far the ethics committee has limited itself to conduct like with bob packwood while senator, i don't think that's a tenable line with the picture. i think al franken has to quit. >> shannon -- this is what kristen was alluding to. i want to play the white house line from yesterday on why the president won't talk about roy moore right now. this is just yesterday after the franken allegations came out. >> the president believes that these allegations are very troubling and should be taken seriously and he thinks the people of alabama should make the decision on who their next senator should be. that's also something, and a decision the people of alabama need to make. not the president. the people of alabama should be the ones to make the decision. the president, as i've said about seven or eight times now, thinks this is a decision for the people of alabama to make. >> that's likely what we will hear from sarah huckabee sanders roughly two hours from now. how do you square that with the president's tweets about al franken? >> yeah, i don't hear anyone asking the people of minnesota to decide on this or the people of minnesota decide. maybe that will be a line today. we'll see. the interesting thing about this issue of, well, the president's just going to stay out of this and let the people of alabama decide is that just a few months ago the president was very involved in this alabama senate race. he endorsed luther strange, who was running against roy moore in the primary. was very outspoken in his support. went down there and campaigned for luther strange. and then when moore won, he, you know, gave a sort of concession, you know, congratulations, i believe he called him a good guy tweet. so he has been involved and weighed in on this race already. to say the president doesn't want to get involved in a senate race, they'll leaf that up to the people, its just completely contradictory to what he was doing just a few months, a few weeks ago before this primary. >> i want to float another theory that started to bubble up over the last day or so, shannon. you might recall that during the campaign there were some 14 women that came forward and accused the president of the united states, then the candidate, of sexual harassment, sexual assault, allegations of reaching up women's skirts, forced kissing, multiple allegations of groping women's breasts. the president has denied all of these allegations. these allegations go back 20, 30 years in some cases. in fact, he didn't just deny it. he went after his accusers. this is what one of the accusers had to say last year and then trump -- listen to how the president attacked her. take a listen. >> the person on my right who unbeknownst to me at that time was donald trump put their hand up my skirt. he did touch my vagina through my underwear. absolutely. >> every woman lied when they came forward to hurt my campaign. total fabrication. the events never happened. never. all of these liars will be sued after the election is over. >> to be clear, there have been no lawsuits, by the way. the president calling all 14 women liars there. shannon, do you think perhaps we haven't heard as much from the president about roy moore because there is a fear if he starts talking about that, then everyone else starts to bring up all of this? >> that was a theory yesterday morning when i talked to people who were close to the president that, you know, this just wasn't an issue he wanted to get involved in. but then he brought up al franken last night. he clearly opened the door, you know, by bringing criticism of al franken into this. but as you were playing that, one thing i would note is that the response from trump at that time was so similar to the response we're hearing from al moore. and i think it is very inspired by steve bannon. this fight, fight, fight mentality. don't back down. fight, stay until the end. bannon was the one during the "access hollywood "take encouraged him to stick in the race, don't back down. hang in there. that's very similar advice roy moore is taking from steve bannon. you can see a very similar approach he's taking as well. >> josh, let's talk about alabama here. this poll that's come out we've been referencing and i want to put it up on the screen for our viewers. this is the fox news poll that shows doug jones has an eight-point lead over roy moore. he is at 50% right now. how much stock do you put in that poll and do you think or have you ever gotten the sense -- it reminds me of the polling done during the presidential election, oftentimes when controversial candidates are on the ballot, a lot of people don't say to the pollster, yeah, i'm going to vote for the guy even though he's an accused pedophile. >> no, i don't necessarily buy that poll. there will be a lot of fluctuation back and forth. typically when a big event like this occurs and this controversy that's out there, i think you get a lot of people that do exactly like you just said. they won't admit to anyone that calls that they're going to vote for this guy. but i think the numbers are essentially unbeloved. i think we're basically at an impasse in this state. you believe roy moore is a holy christian warrior that will battle for you or you think he's a nut case and you won't vote for him. i don't think there's going to be any change whatsoever that matter what comes out from either side. >> really? despite the fact you've had nine women who have come out and said some pretty disgusting things, there are still large swaths of alabama who believe the women are lying? >> oh, i just -- i was just at a rally of republican women, of republican women, who were for roy moore. i mean, and the things they said. they were confident that these things are untrue. they are confident these women are lying. they are confident that roy moore is the man -- one woman compared him saying he's the closest to a founding father we have ever seen. okay? this is the attitude that are among the roy moore supporters. they are not going to budge off of this. you have this kind of -- these people in the middle who are maybe would hold their nose and vote for him otherwise, but i think those people fled a long time ago. you're just stuck with can roy moore's basis push him over the edge and i think it's pretty close. >> why is the state party backing the guy? >> because moore's base of support can swing pretty much any state wide election here. it's political peril for them if they come out against him now. people are going to bring that up in the next state wide election those people are in. it's going to cost them down the line. there's no chance any of those people are going to come out on the right side of this and say for the good of the state, roy moore should step aside or you should not vote for roy moore. we need some republicans in this state to man up and say, don't vote for this guy. vote for doug jones. he's clearly going to represent us a little better. >> hugh, good have you. shannon, thanks so much. this is the first time we've had you on, at least i've had you on, josh, thanks for your insight in alabama. do appreciate your time. we're going to have a bit more on senator gillibrand's comments against -- she declared former president bill clinton should have resigned after his inappropriate relationship with an intern came to light nearly 20 years ago. should he have resigned? someone who worked for hillary clinton's campaign is going to weigh in on that. and the outcry over sexual harassment reverberating in the halls of congress. pennsylvania republican charlie dent is in the house. he's going to join me on set next. also, some sad news to report on this friday. in a statement reverend jesse jackson sr. a short time ago revealed that he has parkinson's disease. it's a disorder of the central nervous system. he says best -- he is 76 years old. he admitted he finds it increasingly difficult to perform routine tasks, but the reverend also says that he is going to be using this as an opportunity to fight for others with parkinson's while he undergoes therapy. quote, i would rather wear out than rust out. people would stare. psoriasis does that. it was tough getting out there on stage. i wanted to be clear. i wanted it to last. so i kept on fighting. i found something that worked. and keeps on working. now? they see me. see me. see if cosentyx could make a difference for you- cosentyx is proven to help people with moderate to severe plaque psoriasis... ...find clear skin that can last. don't use if you're allergic to cosentyx. before starting cosentyx, you should be checked for tuberculosis. an increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms. or if you have received a vaccine or plan to. if you have inflammatory bowel disease, tell your doctor if symptoms develop or worsen. serious allergic reactions may occur. never give up. see me. see me. clear skin can last. don't hold back... ...ask your dermatologist if cosentyx can help you find clear skin that lasts. republicans took a few big steps yesterday towards overhauling this country's tax code. the house passing their plan, the senate poised a vote on theirs after thanksgiving, but those two plans still have some critical differences, making this far from a done deal. i'm joined by republican congressman charlie dent of pennsylvania. always good to see you, sir, especially in the flesh. before we get to the tax bill, i want to pick up on the conversation we were having before the break regarding koyie moore down in alabama. i know what you said about al franken, he should consider stepping aside. what about roy moore, should he drop out of this thing? >> absolutely. after he was nominated i said this man was unfit and he disqualified himself from serve negotiate u.s. senate just because of his previous statements, his actions where he was removed from the supreme court twice for disregarding constitutional limits, his comments about religious minorities and the lbgt community. i think that disqualified him. even before these very serious allegations of sexual misconduct. i think he's unfit and should not be elected. >> sexual harassment allegations in alabama to the halls of congress, the office of compliance since its creation, $17 million in sexual harassment settlements, some 260 claims. why is that? what's happening in our nation's capital? what's happening at your workplace? >> well, i was a former chairman of the house ethics committee so i had the opportunity to deal with some of these situations. all i tell you is we have an office of compliance. that's oftentimes where a staff member can bring a complaint against a member. not just for sexual harassment but some other issue. those are settled there. we did not deal with them in our committee generally. but we do have challenges with members. believe me, i've been through this where we have often gotten members to resign from office because of various misdeeds. you may remember several years ago there was a member who was in trouble for inappropriate contact with male staff, tickle fights, you remember that, and another one with shirt off, he resigned. we had a resignation about a month ago of a member of congress. so, sometimes we deal with these situations that way. there have only been seven expulsions in the history of the house. about four or five were from the civil war for treason. we have issues we deal with. >> let's talk about this tax bill you voted for yesterday. among other things, it eliminated the interest on student loans. that's no longer deductible. graduate tuition waivers as income, limits the deduction teachers can take for school supplies. some will increase graduate students' taxes by roughly 400%. how is that good for the middle class? >> well, let me first say this. in my district we estimate about 70% of income tax filers do not itemize that is these deductions aren't particularly relevant. now they'll have doubling of the standard deduction and their rates are coming down. >> but for these -- >> this is most everybody. >> but for students and teachers, particularly this particular group, are you acknowledging this group is going to get hosed? >> i will acknowledge any time we limit any deduction credit or loophole or break, that will have an impact. but have you to look at that versus the rest of the package. rates are going to be coming down for a lot of people. we have to balance that out. >> but some have also said with the change in inflation that these rates you guys are talking about, they may come down in the first year but by the second and third year a lot of these folks are actually going to see tax increases. is there any truth to that. >> i think it's a bit of a stretch. my estimates are that most people, most, i can't say everybody, but most people will see a reduction in their overall tax liability. certainly working and middle class families. a family of nour my district with income of $90,000, if they had previously -- they would probably get a $2,000 reduction in their taxes overall. and if they -- with the standard deduction if they itemize it's about $1100. that's typical across the country. >> we have to leave it there. congressman, good to have you in the flesh. you'll have a lot of free too many soon so come back any time. senator gillibrand saying former president bill clinton should have resigned when his affair with a white house intern came to light. would a clinton resignation, would that have changed the current culture in washington? also senate judiciary leaders sent a letter to jared kushner's attorney asking for e-mails they failed to disclose. why does the president's son-in-law have trouble scloegs information about russia? ♪ this holiday, the real gift isn't what's inside the box. it's what's inside the person who opens it. ♪ give ancestrydna, the only dna test that can trace your origins to over 150 ethnic regions... ♪ ...and open up a world of possibilities. ♪ save 20% for the holidays at ancestrydna.com. i'm ginnwith chantix.smoking it takes a lot of planning to be a smoker. it's like when am i gonna be able to sneak out of here and go have a cigarette? i just knew i had to quit, and chantix was the method that actually worked for me. along with support, chantix (varenicline) is proven to help people quit smoking. chantix reduced my urge to smoke. when you try to quit smoking, with or without chantix, you may have nicotine withdrawal symptoms. some people had changes in behavior or thinking, aggression, hostility, agitation, depressed mood, or suicidal thoughts or actions with chantix. serious side effects may include seizures, new or worse heart or blood vessel problems, sleepwalking or allergic and skin reactions which can be life-threatening. stop chantix and get help right away if you have any of these. tell your healthcare provider if you've had depression or other mental health problems. decrease alcohol use while taking chantix. use caution when driving or operating machinery. the most common side effect is nausea. thanks to chantix, i did it. ask your doctor if chantix is right for you. many insurance plans cover chantix for a low or $0 copay. in the face of sexual misconduct allegations, many decades old, another powerful figure has been pulled into the fray. former president bill clinton. in addition to his affair with white house intern monica lewinsky back in the '90s, clinton has been accused by multiple women of inappropriate sexual misconduct, including rape. clinton has denied all of the allegations, but as a national conversation over inappropriate sexual behavior continues, it's prompted kirstin gillibrand with long-standing ties to the clintons to weigh in. >> is it your view that president clinton should have stepped down at that time given the allegations? >> i will -- yes, i think that is the appropriate response, but i think things have changed today. and i think under those circumstances, there should be a very different reaction. and i think in light of this conversation, we should have a very different conversation about president trump and a very different conversation about allegations against him. >> former director of progressive media with hillary clinton, with that campaign. now director of progressive programming at sirius/xm. liz plank, executive producer of fox media's divider of women. she's a bona fide internet sensation. and jessica contreras, a reporter with "the washington post." a big thanks to all of you for carving out time on a friday afternoon. should we be talking about bill clinton right now? >> no, i don't think we should talk about bill clinton. there were plenty of feminists at the time those allegations were happening that we're having this conversation right now, but at the time, we weren't listening to feminists. we thought they were outliars. and the conversation about the cultural shift in terms of the power dynamic and abuses of power, those were conversations that weren't a part of the mainstream. i do think it's important to process -- >> sounds like you're bill bill clinton a pass. >> i'm not giving him a pass. i'm saying the reason we're having this conversation with bill clinton and presidents because the current president has been accused by over a dozen women of inappropriate sexual behavior and he is in office. right now. and so i think that he's the cat lis for this entire conversation. and i think, you know, we need to understand this in sort of a more comprehensive way. it's a spectrum of behavior. on the one end of the spectrum, the more severe end, are the harvey weinsteins of the world, bill cosbys at the world, roy moore. and then street harassment, al franken, more benign behavior that are traumatizing to women but not necessarily criminal. so, i think we have to understand that all women have these experiences. all women have been victims of harassment but at different ends of the spectrum. >> liz, do you agree with senator gillibrand, do you think bill clinton should have resigned? >> i think he should have resigned and the conversation we had back then was about adultery but it was a conversation we should have had about sexual harassment and about potential, you know, rape, that were very real rape allegations against him. so, we had a consideration also where we called hillary clinton an enabler and made her responsible. i've seen even today people writing about bill clinton. at -- i disagree with her, i think we should be talking about bill clinton but i think we should be talking about bill clinton, not the fact that hillary clinton should have never run or bring in huma abedin into this. we should hold men accountable for their actions. if they're going to bring up a past president's behavior, we should be bringing up the current president's behavior and the 14 women who have accused him of very serious crimes and we should be all asking the white house why they're going after al franken but not addressing their own allegations. >> where is the ethics investigation into this current president? >> jessica, so far for the most part of the last month or two we have been focusing on powerful people in the spotlight, whether they be politicians, current politicians or politicians from 20 years ago, the harvey weinsteins of the world. but there is an article you wrote in the washington post that caught my attention and a lot of other folks' attention as well. here's the headline. they were sexually harassed at work. they reported it and here is what happened. talk to me about the women you talked to and what they told you. >> yes, thank you very much. it's important to remember that this conversation, though we're having it now, is something that women have been talking about for years because it's been happening to them forever. and long before people decided to speak up on social media, there are people who are speaking up about what happened to them at their workplaces. i wanted to understand what that process was like because it's often shrouded by confidentiality agreements and legal processes that we don't really know a lot about. so we talked to each women who had been through that process. they reported everything from he lifted up my skirt to i was raped. these were regular women, nurse, prison guard, assembly line worker. some of them had full investigations and the person who harassed them was fired. others found themselves fired themselves. so they had no repercussions. in fact, suffered extreme financial and emotional damage for reporting. there were women who said, if i could do it all over again, i absolutely would because i stood up. no one else had to go through this. and there were women who told me, look, if i could go back, i wish i wouldn't have said anything at all. >> i want to play for our viewers and our sirius satellite radio listeners some sound from one of the women that you interviewed. her name is ralinda, a customer service worker there in maryland. take a listen. >> coworkers would use phone apps and they would call your name and as you turned they would take a picture and your breasts would be, like, five sizes bigger. and that type of behavior continued even though i complained. this led to an environment where my coworker came into my cubicle to speak to someone on the other side. he bent over to hug me from behind. as he released his hands, he grabbed my breasts. it was inappropriate. they made it seem like there was something wrong with me, i was too sensitive, i need to get over it. >> victim blaming, victim shaming is something we hear a lot about being one of the major reasons a lot more women don't come forward. during the course of your reporting the sentiment she just expressed,there is that a sentiment a lot of the women also expressed? >> absolutely. something she went through that many of the women did is talking about how the environment at their workplaces led to a scenario where when they were harassed or touched or assaulted, it wasn't taken seriously. at her customer service call center, it was normal for people to talk about their sexual endeavors, to make jokes about women and their appearances. so when she had spoken up about those things, she was told, this is just how it is here. then when something serious happened to her, because she had spoken up before, it seemed to her that she was seen as just a complainer and her complaint wasn't taken seriously. and that's something that many of the women expressed. >> you know, there are moments in our country where you feel like you're at an inflexion point, you feel like maybe this is a watershed moment and then some time passes and you look back and, clearly, that was not what we thought it was. is this different? do you get the sense this time around -- literally every day there's a high-profile politician or entertainer who we found out is a scumbag. do you get this sense it's different from now or do you think five, six months from now we'll be back to business as usual? >> we were talking about this before, coming on set, it's extremely draining as women who are in the media having to report on these stories day in day out. it's hard for men who are victims. it's hard to talk about it every single day and hard to be explaining how systematic. a year ago we were having the conversation about donald trump and now it's harvey weinstein, al franken. i think it's a watershed moment because we're finally placing the blame on men and the consequences of their behavior and that comes back to bill clinton. we are seeing a lot. donald trump has sort of brought to light the worst parts of our society. he gave us a master class in victim blaming saying he's going to sue these women, go after these women. these women are not to be believed. >> problem liars. >> exactly. it's out in the open and it's our role as a society to decide where we want to go from here. >> here's the thing, i want men, all men, not just famous ones, need to reflect on this kind of behavior. have you treated women like they were not full human beings deserving of respect snits not to say all men are criminals or abusers, but i think men should reflect on their behavior. if that's what we get out of this moment, then men are taking stock of their own treatment of women, then we'll have made some progress. >> jessica, big thanks to you. always good to have your insights. special counsel robert mueller subpoenas the trump campaign to produce russia-related documents as senate leaders say president trump's son-in-law has failed to disclose all the e-mails related to their investigation. also nbc news investigates what are the president's business interests overseas that insiders and a prosecutor say attracted dirty money? 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>> for one thing it suggests the mueller team is not happy with the current voluntary compliance situation under which it was requesting documents from the trump campaign and getting them voluntarily. the source toll me the campaign has turned over some 20,000 documents but now we have this subpoena, which is a legal demand. it raises the stakes for noncompliance. failure to comply with a subpoena can be a criminal act. it's a significant escalation there, craig. >> matt, if the campaign has been turning over documents voluntarily, what's the need for a subpoena? what do you see here? >> it is a clear indication, i think, that bob mueller didn't think the campaign was turning over everything they were supposed to. it's not surprising when you look at the behavior of everyone in the trump orbit not supplying documents, as jared kushner didn't do. it's not surprising they probably haven't turned over everything. remember, we saw this before in the investigation into paul manafort. the reason mueller conducted that no-knock raid on his house is because he believed and believed rightfully, it turned out, that manafort hadn't produced documents he was supposed to under subpoena. >> forgive my ignorance of situations like this, but do you get the sense that the special counsel is looking for something and knows that they have something and wants them to produce it and since they haven't yet, that's the need for the subpoena? or is it -- or is that an oversimplification of what's happening? >> i think it could be a couple of things. one thing could be he's asked them for voluntarily requests and the pace they're returning documents he doesn't think is sufficient. but the other can be exactly that. in a lot of cases he'll know -- for example with e-mails. there are two people on the end of an e-mail. he may know from the other person's e-mail that an e-mail xiss but if he hasn't gotten from someone in the trump campaign he knows they're intentionally withholding documents and, therefore, sends a subpoena to comply. >> mr. kushner and we have been responsive to all requests. we provided the judiciary committee with all relevant documents that had to do with mr. kushner's calls, contacts or meetings with russians during the campaign and transition, which was the request. any ideas based on that response from the attorney, what exactly the committee might be looking for here, that they haven't gotten? >> well, yes, craig, we know from the committee letter, and it's exactly the scenario you and matt were talking about, charles grassley, republican in the judiciary committee has issued a letter to jared kushner saying, we know, we have documents from other people and suggests that you didn't turn over crucial information in our russia investigation, including, and the term was used, a russian back door overture. we don't know exactly what that was about, craig. there was also an e-mail regarding wikileaks that went to mr. kushner that he didn't turn over. it's an example of something they got from elsewhere in their investigation. they were expecting to get from mr. kushner and they did not get it and now they're issuing a letter demanding. >> we'll leave it there. matt miller, enjoy the weekend, gentlemen. >> thank you. an nbc news investigation of property that licenses the trump name revealed to be a place where criminals were able to hide their cash. nbc's chief foreign correspondent richard engel takes us to panama for the details. for your heart... your joints... or your digestion... so why wouldn't you take something for the most important part of you... your brain. with an ingredient originally found in jellyfish, prevagen is now the number one selling brain health supplement in drug stores nationwide. prevagen. the name to remember. i work ovi need when i my blood sugar to stay in control. so i asked about tresiba®. ♪ tresiba® ready ♪ tresiba® is a once-daily, long-acting insulin that lasts even longer than 24 hours. i need to cut my a1c. ♪ tresiba® ready ♪ tresiba® works like my body's insulin. releases slow and steady. providing powerful a1c reduction. my week? 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>> no. not that i'm aware of, no, no. not at all. >> reporter: ventura is a fugitive wanted for fraud. we agreed to disguise his appearance because he said he feared for his safety. he said he sold units no questions asked to buyers including david guzman in custody in the united states convicted of laundering millions of dollars for mexican drug cartels. ivanka trump, ventura said, was involved in the panama project but not directly in sales. >> hello. i'm ivanka trump. >> reporter: she was featured in the promotions. our investigation reveals several of ventura's brokers and buyers also had ties to russian organized crime. documents from panama's public record office show that units were bought through anonymous shell companies hiding who owned what. and that a former panamanian prosecutor who investigated the building told us drew in people with a criminal history. patrick ali is co-countdowner of anti-corruption group global witness and the report on the trump ocean club is also out today. >> any responsible businessman should want the know who the clients are and where the money is coming from. if that responsible businessman is now the president of the united states this is a matter of public interest. >> reporter: in a statement the trump organization said in part the trump organization was not the owner developer or seller of the trump ocean club panama project. and that the organization had no relationship with ventura or knowledge of the allegations against him. we also asked ivanka trump for comment but her team referred us back to this statement. i believe this is the picture of you with president trump. >> yeah. that's correct. that's marlago yes. >> a lot of people, yes. but i was one of them, you know? >> reporter: the trump organization is distancing itself from a project that earned its millions but involved a dubious cast of characters. financial documents show that president trump is still making money from the building. the trump organization says because this was just a licensing agreement that it's not responsible for what happened in this building. but legal experts we have spoken to and experts reuters have spoken to disagree. they say that if a company, the trump organization or any company, deliberately turns a blind eye to criminal activity or failed to do due diligence in a lie risk place like panama with a high risk of corruption that could be what's called willful blindness and that that could be the case for raising a case. craig. >> richard engle for us in panama. to see more, you can watch "on assignment with richard engel" tonight 9:00 eastern only on msnbc. lower premiums? extra benefits? it's open enrollment. time to open the laptop... ...and compare medicare health plans. why? 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