Destructive actions. Welcome to washington, mitt romney, and welcome to morning joe. Lets dig in on all of this. So the president hopes to hold a meeting at the white house on Border Security with both parties. Were in the middle of a partial Government Shutdown forced by donald trump to try and get 5 billion to build that wall on the Mexican Border that he promised during the campaign. It is a wall that most people dont want. The data proves that. But whatever comes from todays meeting, one thing is clear. Trump is going to have to surrender both on ending the shutdown and building a wall. The last time trump met with the Democratic Leaders facetoface, he proudly said he was going to own the shutdown. Well, now he does by stubbornly sticking to a promise that only a quarter of americans support, trump has dug himself and his Republican Party into a very big hole. Just as democrats tomorrow, i believe, yep, tomorrow, theyre taking control of the house. The reality is trumps my way or highway obsession with the wall has been, for months, nothing more than a fantasy. And a selfinflicted wound for himself and his party, the Republican Party. Today, as john kellys final day as white house chief of staff, and hes talking. Hes told the Los Angeles Times a lot of stuff including the other day he said that the idea of a concrete wall on the border had been rejected long ago by Homeland Security experts who work in the administration. So the advice to the president is its not a good idea. From his own team. Trump has absolutely no leverage, none, and many republicans are furious that he has left them in political peril for absolutely no good reason, promising a wall that mexico would pay for might have helped trump get the nomination, but right now, its the president , not democrats who are walled in, or boxed in, so to speak. So with us this morning, we have mike barnacle, professor and author of the book democracy in black eddie claude jr. And msnbc political contributor rick tyler, cofounder eo of axo jims vandehei and susan paige. Great to have you all. Here we go. President trump appearing to soften on his demand for a wall, holding his first meeting with Congressional Democrats saying he would, quote, take the mantle for a Government Shutdown. This was about three weeks ago weve been going through all of this. Trump has invited the top eight congressional leaders from both parties from the white house for a briefing on the border wall today, this afternoon. It will be the first significant conversation he has had with democrats since the partial shutdown can began 12 days ago. This hours after trump tweeted Border Security and the wall thing and shutdown is not where nancy pelosi wanted to start her tenure as speaker. Lets make a deal . To which nancy pelosi replied, donald trump has given democrats a great opportunity to show how we will govern responsibly and quickly pass our plan to end the irresponsible trump shutdown. Just the first sign of things to come in our new democratic majority committed to working for the people. And most of the people, rick tyler, dont want a wall. So how does trump get out of this box . And do republicans stay in the box with trump . Well, trump will declare this week that he asked the army corps of engineers to erect a forcefield. And the reason youll know its true is because he tweeted about it. Thats about his only option. Nancy pelosi will pass a continuing resolution to open the government. Shes going to send that over to Mitch Mcconnell. It will be up to him whether hes going to present it to the senate for a vote or not. But the point is the democrats will be able to show that they are acting to reopen the government and that it is, in fact, republicans who are blocking them and keeping the government from reopening and, therefore, the republicans and donald trump will own this shutdown. I think this is going to go on. This will probably prove out to be the longest shutdown in american history, which is 21 days. Were more than halfway. I think were halfway there now. And its just an impasse. And lensy graham and the republicans are trying to give trump a way out by saying its a metaphor. Were talking about Border Security here. But he keeps redoubling down on this idea of a concrete wall. To put it into perspective, there is zero miles of wall. Theres not one section of barrie barrier which is wall. Theres roughly less than 800 miles of barrier. Half of that is vehicle protection so the vehicles cant cross, but you can literally walk right across it. So theres less than 400 miles of actual pedestrian barriers and that is built in the easiest places. All those barriers cost 7. 1 billion to make. So where is trump going to start to begin this 5 billion wall to cover the rest of the 1250 miles that have virtually no barrier whatsoever . So i point all this out to tell you its just raw politics and it bears no resemblance to the reality of whats really happening here. Dont politics usually have some give or take . Jim vandehei, i know its just tweets, but i am sensing, as rick take ler answers rick tyler answers my question with a question, because there are no answers to trumps thinking, there is maybe a shift in dynamic between Speaker Pelosi and donald trump. You see trump in a different place. How does he save face . Yeah. I think youre talking about him being backed into a corner. He really is. There is not an obvious solution. It comes down to whether or not nancy pelosi and to some extent Chuck Schumer want to squeeze him. If they say were not going to give you any more money for the wall, there is no way to save face. You would basically saying there are protections for dreamers and a resolution on daca. If they could do that, that might be a way out, but its not clear that democrats would go for it, particularly in this environment because they really do feel like they have their boot on trumps throat and why let him out if you dont need to let him out. Because what i think tweet is not reading correctly, hes assuming the Democratic Party of today is the same Democratic Party of 06 or 010. I think the feeling that they have to be strong by supporting a lot more Border Security, that that has waned and that the enthusiasm of the Democratic Party is for protecting immigrants. And i think thats a miscalculation that he made and he continues to make in those tweets. Susan paige, continuing with the boot metaphor, maybe trying to think of a different one, but they do have it right now. They have him cornered. And the question is, why in the world would they give him an out, given the way this president has behaved personally, given the way this president has led, given the way this president has behaved on the International Front . It seems like he is such a run away with beer truck that there really isnt any Relationship Building leverage they would want to create out of letting up on him. And, of course, this is a different Democratic Party. This is the first day of President Trumps next two years, which is an empowered Democratic Party with a position to have leverage they have not had previously in his presidency. And jim vandehei said its not the same Democratic Party as 2006. Its not the same Democratic Party as 2018. This is a great particularly less willing to compromise, less trusting of trump. Remember a year ago, they talked about a big deal on immigration that would include protection for the dreamers along with money for a wall. That is not a deal democrats would make today. The relationship with the white house will be at issue. This is on a different level for democrats completely. For many, many months, they have been waiting for a voice with this president. They have been waiting to be able to hold him accountable on many levels. And now they have it. They dont want to squander it, but it is a different dynamic. And im not sure President Trump completely understands that. As the president faces the prospect of abandoning large scale plans for a physical border wall to end the shutdown, aides and allies have tried to down play trumps Signature Campaign issue. Theyre trying. In his exit interview with the l. A. Times, chief of staff john kelly said, to be honest, its not a wall. The president still says wall. Oftentimes, frankly, hell say barrier or fencing. Now hes tending towards steel flats. But we left a solid concrete wall early in the administration. Trump pushed back on that. But others suggested the wall was merely symbolic. First of all, lets not all acquiesce to the ridiculous sound bite that this is about a wall. The president has been talking about Border Security all along. The wall has become a metaphor for Border Security. And what were talking about is a physical barrier where it makes sense. The president has made it clear with his own words over and over time during his campaign, he wasnt talking about the idea of a wall, he was talking about an actual wall. I will build a great, great wall. It is a very serious wall. They say you dont really mean youre going to build a wall, do you . Youre kidding, right . I built 930 story buildings. 92 stories, 98 stories. Walls are so easy. Building a wall, boy, is that easy. That will go up like magic. It will go up like magic. When are the walls going to be made out of . Hardened concrete. Did you ever see precast plank for barkiparking garages . Concrete plank, you have to be kidding. I can see it now, beautiful, precast plank. All beautiful. Plank thats laid for, like, highways. It comes 30 feet long, 40 feet long, 50 feet long. 90 feet long. Do you know how long 90 feet if youre 90 feet up, you want to come down very gently. Its so beautiful. I can see that precast plank. And you put that plank up and you dig your footings. Good solid foundations. Precast. Sucked right into a foundation, beautiful. Easy. Precast plank. Precast, boom, bing, done, keep going. And you put that plank up. Theres no ladder goes over that. Nice and high, make the ceiling look like a little low ceiling. The taller it gets, the safer it gets. A real wall, not a toy wall. Its 10 feet fall and its a fence. See the way they go over our fences. Its not a wall, its a fence. People dont go over my wall. I want it to be so beautiful because maybe some day theyre going to call it a trump wall. Its not a fence. Its a wall. I dont know how he gets around that. Republicans are trying to help him around it business saying its a metaphor and then he just walks it back and says, no, its a wall. Theres that and this. You know john kelly, you know mattis. These guys are leaving. And i guess my question is for you. What do you think your friends responsibility is as they leave this white house to talk about what theyve seen in there in very real terms with the democrats taking power, questions about the shutdown, and how that is being held and other questions surrounding this president. Well, i think general kelly has spoken to some extent with the l. A. Times. A little bit. General mattis has spoken out strongly in his Resignation Letter to the president. But i dont think theyre going to be on sunday talk shows. Neither man is like that. So i dont think you can look forward to that. I think what we can look forward to, though, mika, is despite all the wall talk this morning, all the inside baseball surrounding the wall, whether its going to be constructed or not, theres Something Else going out there that americans can identify with more than just the wall. And it is this. The democrats, tomorrow, are going to pass a series of bills as jim vandehei and you pointed out earlier to fund the government and so set aside Homeland Security funding until february or so. They in essence are going to go to work. Theyre going to do their job. They are confronted with another party, the Republican Party, that cant do their job because the leader, the president of the United States, wont do his job. So it comes down to a level of incompetentence on the republican side that i think a lot of americans are begin to go recognize. I dont know about you, eddie, but i mean, the frustration about people who see this mess in washington continuing on an hourly basis, its pretty frustrated and its going to have a huge impact on the president ial election and it begins now. Absolutely. And its not only confidence. Weve been talking about the Democratic Party, nancy pelosi pursuing the speakership and the party pursuing its agenda. But theres kevin mccarthy. Theres trumps base. We know trump has governed to the 39 , that 40 , those folks who will follow him no matter what he does. And those were the people clamoring for him to double down on the immigration policy, the folks clamoring for him to double down on the wall. Hes not only caught by the democrats, hes caught business his base. Because if he backs down on this issue, conservative talk radio, fox news, all of these folks who have been pushing him will be up in arms if he backs away. You know, mika, one interesting aspect of the wall that weve been talking about, its nearly three years to the day that we were all in iowa at java joes doing the show and then candidate donald trump was going to be on with us that morning and he was indeed on with us that morning. He arrived a little late. I was back in the kitchen where i prefer to hide out rather than being on the set. Trump came in and he had had a rally the night before i think in ames iowa or one of the iowa towns. There was a very small crowd, according to the news reports. And i asked him in the kitchen, i said, i guess you had a pretty small crowd there. How did it go . He said it doesnt matter about the crowd. If the crowd is depressed, if theres no noise, if theyre not wildly into it, all i have to do is mention the wall and they go crazy. And hes been doing it ever since. Well, it worked for the campaign or the nomination, really. But the question is how to get out of this box. This kind of paints the picture of how this president is kind of starting the new year up against nancy pelosi, up against democrats when it comes to the wall with a Republican Party that is increasingly frustrated that he keeps digging and desperately holding to this wall while we have a Government Shutdown. Let me read the title of mitt romneys piece that he wrote. The president shapes the character of the nation. Trumps character falls short. Its a big piece that hes written in the Washington Post and it is searing. If trump thought he had a challenge in john mccain, if trump thought he had a challenge in jeff flake, i have a feeling mitt romney is going to bring in a whole new dose of reality for this president. Mitts run for president himself and he didnt win. You know what he decided to do . Serve anyway. And i think trump is going to regret not talking him out of this. There was some possibility he could have done that. Mitt romney is making it very clear hes going to be much more than a thorn in President Trumps side. Whats your gut on how that dynamic plays out . A couple of Different Things occurred to me after reading the piece last night, mika. One was that there was an immediate round of nitpicking on twitter about the piece, about romneys motives. What we cant sit here every day and bemoan the fact that the vast majority, almost all of the Republican Party and the senate and in the house refuse to speak out against this president s many transgressions and truth. Thats right. And duplicity and things like that. We cant do that and nitpick someone when they finally stand up and do speak out as mitt romney did. Now, one of the things to understand about mitt romney is and i know, mika, you know this because you know his wife and you know him pretty well. This kind of a boy scout element to mitt romney and ive got to assume that he sat there and watched the president s behavior for these many, many months, he didnt want to inject himself between donald trump and the voters in utah. But now is his time. What he wrote in the Washington Post, thats who mitt romney is. And i wonder if America Needs a boy scott right now. I would say theres a hunger for someone with a moral compass, for someone who will say it in realtime. No one will take that away from mitt romney, not even republicans who are sitting there holding the bag. Its not working for them any more. Look where we are. So were going to dig into that more. Still ahead on morning joe, well get the latest on the president s syria policy, why hes now pumping the breaks for his push for an immediate u. S. Withdraw. Plus, an update on senator Elizabeth Warrens budding White House Campaign and what donald trump has to say about it. Where the democratic contender is holding her first stop since launching an Exploratory Committee. But first, to bill karins for a check on the forecast. Were starting the same way we just ended 2018 with another big rain storm with a little bit of snow. We havent seen many snowstorms this winter so far. January is typically the coldest, snowiest month of the year in many locations in our country. So right now, the