Paved the way for obstruction of justice. I was watching greta last night who was pretty steady shes always so even, i should take a queue from her. But last night she was really angry. I stopped and watched. She said the president has taken us for a ride for 41 days. He just admitted he lied to america, he lied to the world 41 days ago. The lawyer in her just kept saying theres only one reason why he would do this, to intimidate a witness. To scare people. She said its witness intimidation, theres no other reason and thats something that and with all due respect to lindsey, he usually gets it right but this president could rise and fall on tweets like that. We should have put that on the list of destruct of tweets. Yeah, because it really is. Theres so many, though, its just so hard to choose five. Thats what michael said. The one tweet which may lead to Donald Trumps impeachment, obviously not a liberal guy. Good morning, its friday, june 23rd. Its friday. He was at the cutting room. His ep is released today. You can download it. Hes got an ep with four new songs out. Do you remember the movie almost famous, there were gaggles and gaggles of everything from teenage girls to Senior Citizens in cut off morning joe sleeves. The crowd loved it. Almost every song last night you wrote. What was really disturbing was one of the people in the cutoff shirts, donnie. And youre standing next to him and im sitting there it was cut off here. I was playing and had one of those baby gap tees. He was walking by, he said i love live music and he walks in and it was you. And he cut it into a half shirt. You were great. Really cool. Huge crowd. Lines. Long lines. Theres a line around the block. Is that for joe . And it was. Okay. Also with us nbc news capitol hill correspondent kasie hunt in washington. Hi, kasie. Lets talk really quickly. Will willie, lindsey said he wasnt going to you look at the tweets the responsible was a special counsel. She said if im his lawyer, im nervous about somebody looking and possibly intimidating a witness. Because theres no other reason that he would put out the quote. And comey didnt move and now muellers going to keep in on that. It was totally reckless at the time but it also just from a legal Strategic Point of view was dumb nm. Yell, no is there anyone else you can say, sir, for your own good . A bigger question, why lie . We all know he lies all the time but why lie about Something Like this that would everybody to go back thinking nexton, nixon, nixon . And why didnt he have the lawyer there saying listen, if you do that and you dont have tapes, youre setting yourself up for nor charge and thats intimidation of a witness in a federal probe. He is who he is. Hes a 70yearold guy fixedhis habits. He has been doing this all of his life, real estate deals playing around with facts, playing around with peoples lives. But, donnie, the risks are open higher. Cutting corners, in hes going p against the constitution, hes going up against the constituti constitution. If he cuts corners like this, its the russ federal charges attached possibly, to some of the thanksgiving hes doing if hes not careful. Because these not rel well and hes in the attached to reality. Joe, you mentioned couple weeks ago, we talked about during the campaign he would do some verbs things that morally are crept and you go, okay we know that comey knows what he said in that room, that was not going to rattle comey. Not on was it legally putting him in a very precarious situation, it was dumb. It was dumb. And comey said, lordy, i hope there are tapes. What he doesnt doesnt realize is that what hes doing now is causing the exact opposite reaction from the people hes fighting now. You push comey, you see what happens. You push mueller, you see what happens. Nowies going on this morning on tv talking brk you know, criticizing bob mueller. Lets do that. Mika, this is all very, very bad news for the president of the United States if he does win. Robert mueller, do you think he should recuse himself . He is good friend with james comey. Hes hired attorneys that have given moun dags to which very bothersome. But going to have to see him. Look, there has been no obstruction, theres been no collusion be about and virtually everybody agrees to that. Well have to see that i can say that the people that have been hired are all Hillary Clinton supporters. Well, of course youre talking about somebody who went to are Hillary Clinton came and that was back in 2010 that he was giving all of this money. He would be disqualifies himself. Again, with these stakes higher, this reminds me of the judgecurial fight earlier in the your loading and yous. And that is spend time, give money to democrats. Is will any possibility that republicans would stand by be a to be. I dont think so, joe. Look, that prrk to kind of try to measure what drpt any given day by how strongly people are willing it react to it. I have to tell you, bob mueller has gotten some of the strongest set of defenses from republicans that any person or issue that has come up. I think that there is not going to be very much tolerance for undermining or questioning his credibility. You have the Senate Judiciary committee now talking about potentially including obstruction in their investigation around this, and i think it centers on defending him. Look, this is in many republicans are asking how long will republicans stay with donald trump . What could donald trump do to lose their support . Attack bob mule are and then get rid of him, drpt will see his support on the hi ehave been rate. And this is a what he does. If hes up against something, he softens the argue et and tries to across the board republicans and ragging guy is unpeachable. He was smart not too fire hp pfr. All ryan said bob mueller should be alud if youre innocent, then youll be vindicated. When i begs the question, why do this man keep freaking out. This is how a guilty person acts. If somebody was investigating me, id say investigate, go ahead. Well, it could well be that he keeps hearing rumors and rumors keep getting passed to him that mook plane flynn is getting closer and closer and closer to cutting an immunity deal. Theres some talk hes already talking to the fbi. Yes, hes going quiet. Of institution in the Intelligence Community, congress, the judicial community, the media, the Republican Party, Democratic Party, everybody except russia he has picked a fight with. Its fascinating. Our german allies and nato allies and british allies, every single one. Except russia. He opinion picked a fight with china curing the campaign. Hes paid a and there will be all coops of dirty dealings with hugs hugss. Well, they blew up the chicken man last night. Who knew glrng he stretched as best he could to federal budget to find a parallel and i believe ffs north korea. I cant wait to here what krasy hunt, in the yesterday and tookle will time before they were met with internal recess tans frmt. No, no. Im going to actual will channel greta but you can read become the dk at this timeor prks or someone who not well. Very few options. Everythings they so far, though. I think its more like hogans heros than anything else. Well, we have a Sergeant Schultz and we have a clink. Judiciary committees work. It all works. Every single time. Every single time. Meekia the institutions have held. The courts have pushed back hard. The congress has even pushed back hard and checked him. You can go down the line and ill tell you, the one time that i thought this is spinning out of control, rod rosen stein stepped in at a tight al moment in this countrys history. Hes still making a mess with his country. Im being played for a tool, were going to appoint something in his body. Yes, were all disturbed by everything that we see but theins stuss hoding. Do you think rod has arental stuff in his office . He rets the stuff once a week so when he gets canned no, there as and so i walked in one time and his kid had colored something. I said whered you get that . And he goes, oh, well, when they fire me, i can just go like that. Rod rosenstein played donald trump for a patsy. I dont know if you guys get the sense from people who have been very disturbed at the beginning but now theres a calmness because this is the works. The great thing about what weve watched over the past several months is, wow, those fellas around 1776 when they were kind of in that room putting different pasties on the board i was there. They kind of knew what they were doing. I agree with mika. I dont think theyre comfortable yet. You kind of get a calm, wow, this thing works we have here, you know . It does work and the institutions have held. I think whats been so shocking andujari and jarring to most of us that followed this our entire lives and assumed the country would run in a certain way is so much of this country and the constitution depends on having a president that respects the tradition of this republic. Thank you. And loves the country. That puts the country first. Your comparison with Richard Nixon yesterday fell short in several ways. Richard nixon actually was a product of this country, the government. He fought in world war ii, he came home like all those other gis. He fought and the left didnt like him for it but he fought against communist influence in america and he dedicated himself. The money received more votes from americans than anybody else in American History and up know wh you know, when the Supreme Court said turn over the tapes, and everybody froze and said are were going to have a standoff here . Richard nixon, he understood. When the Supreme Court says it, you do it. He turned over the tapes, knowing that it would destroy his presidency, because he understood the importance of the constitution and at the end of the day, he understood the importance of the office. He was an incredibly flawed individual but he had a certain level of respect for the government, for the constitution and the way it applies to the government. There is not that here. Just ahead we will dig into the Senate Republican well speak with republican senator rand paul who has deep reservations. And former Homeland Security secretary jeh johnson is here for an exclusive interview fresh off his testimony on capitol hill. And the chairman of the congress an black congress on why his group rejected an invitation to meet with mr. Trump. First, bill karins why this was a convenience store. In the middle of the store there were a couple of rows of glass bottles that were unbroken and untouched. This is from cindy. Memphis, by the way, in the next hour or two, worst weather so far in the country. All the way become up here towards so heres the timing of it. Theres umbrellas and storms through d. C. And the rain continues through kentucky, through west virginia. Early tomorrow morning, heavy rains through the mid atlantic. And then it will clear out for a pretty decent day behind it. Its still very hot from texas all the way through the west. Were spreading that heat to the Pacific Northwest this coming weekend. Youre going o get on and off showers up the mid atlantic. Well be right back. La, right as i was stepping into the tee box mentioned a tip a pro gave her. No. Yep. Did it help . It completely ruined my game. Well, the truth is, that advice was never meant for you. I like you. You want to show me your swing . Its too soon. Get advice thats right for you. Investment Management Services from td ameritrade. A mihappy birthday, sweetie oh, millies. Trick or treat were so glad to have you here. 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Through the Tuition Assistance program, every day mcdonalds helps more people go to college. Its part of our commitment to being americas best first job. Im not going to cut Social Security like every other republican and im not going to cut medicare or medicaid. And if if they wouldnt, they wouldnt know what to do. They doesnt know whent know w is. I do. And bill, you tweeted the gop bills raise deductibles, cuts coverage and slashes medicaid. He cant even now make up husbahis mind. He praises the republicans and then calls the bill mean. He goes go ahead, go ahead, and said it a little mean for me. They need to spend more money. Joining us is associate editor of the Washington Post and msnbc political analyst Eugene Robinson and editor at large at the Weekly Standard bill krystal. What was that . You guys get that way. Youre saying hold off on voting for this bill. Lets see what the Congressional Budget Office says and why dont you read the damn bill before voting on it . If there was such a republican mantra in tween and not unreasonably because there were all kind of problems with blake that might have been averted. And how could they do this behind closed doors when all they did, starting with Mitch Mcconnell and every republican and we did it, too, how can they go behind the scenes and do a bill that nobody even reads, not even their own members. Theres a reason theres a Committee System and theres something called a committee that has jurisdiction over health care and they argue about this stuff, what deductibles go up or not . Has anyone made the case for this bill . No. Zero. So donald trump said the house bill was too main ever. Do you think mcconnell will put it on the floor for a vote before july 4 snt. No. Theres zero percent that mcconnell will let it go without knowing, theres four guys who are still not there. Hes not going to put them through a horrible series of votes where youre going to look mean to every group but he had to do it. What do i know. Were unlikely to see a vote on this. Kasie hunt, explain the thinking. Im not sure i agree with bill on that. One of my longtime friends is writing in the Washington Post this morning that this is a put up or shut up moment. Mcconnell is saying he doesnt want to deal with health care the rest of the sum i. It go there was no press conference for me to go to yesterday. So he let it is go next week. But that means a vote on the floor, right, if they dont vote on it . Just pull it, pull it. Mitch mcconnell, who is the smartest guy us this puttingout out to put the issue of health care behind us i do think if they really truly believe if they dont rote vote to pass something, theyre going to be in a lot more trouble. If he does put this i think theyre on track to put this on the floor by the end of the week. And it may do it that they do it without 50 boats. So if they put it on the house floor and they have the vote, its the circle of life. The conservatives can vote against it because its too liberal and the moderates can vote against it because its too harsh and they can all go back to l district and say, yes, i wanted to erepeal obamacare but this bill and then tick it down in the district and say, well, go back and try it again later. Gene robinson, the mistake here is theyre putting these bills out that are getting i think in our lestest pbc from republicans, oh, that vote wont follow you. Im sitting here today because i got elected to congress because a democrat in my District Voted for bill clinton as tax increase had 1993 in the House Resolution but didnt vote for it at the end and thought he was going to get away with that. But i spent a your ought this is going to follow these republicans for the rest of their lives and theyre stupid if they dont think it is, even if it doesnt pass. Theyre kind of stum with there i hope its domed because they did promise for almost the last eight years thatter that going to repeal and replace, repeel and replace be a the pb prrngs and in the end you voted against it. Yet, if they pass this thing, it is a giant millstone around the neck of the Republican Party. Its very dangerous to own the Health Care Issue and to do this with it is even more dangerous. Of the four senators that came out who said they are nos right now, the argument is it doesnt go far enough well talk to him in a moment. But then you have the dean heller camp that says i cant go back with this prol of burr staj theyre staying cant sort of the dean heller and rob portman camp . Reporter its basically obamacare. Theyve accepted that people who cant quite afford insurance and are medicaid are going to get federal help to buy insurance. Thats what has rand paul so angry. I do think theres a private perception that rand paul might be the only hard no of this group four but that he may just be ungettable. And as you point out, the challenge on the other side is dean heller is the senator from nevada, hes probably the on seriously vulnerable, but its really about dean heller and nevada could potentially lose a seat in 2018. Theyd like to able to let dean heller go for this reason, it would make deep cuts for those on the Medicaid Expansion. It phases this in over a longer before the, the one person who said, yes, i am wholeheartedly embracing this. The other one was the no. So does this ditch this is the whether or not they walk the plank for this president and this bill that could have devastating consequences. You have a about peace in the morning programs. Democrats must start thinking lowly. Our practiced what he tweets. Because of his his and youll. The democrats should be riding height rye now, shouldnt they . An, and opinion federal budget dprrk. Ive been preaching this since the election, that what the democrats need to do is congratulations local, congratulations local and just forget about trying to be a National Party only by winning the presidency every four years, which has been the democratic its not working. Theyve got to win City Council Elections and state Legislature Elections and governorships and county commissioners. Theyve got to have more of a grass roots structure that then builds living back one yrk its got to work that way. It cant work from top down because in the end, thats a hollow victory. Have a lentle frorn unless you have instruct why are beneath you ands that not going to come yp. The biggest problem, bill, and we know it as republicans, who the democrats easy to beat. Can that can. Dan twoted something out. If you want to live in born georgia about sfwrrk lives in the didnt is nobodys attacking nancy pelosi. People attacked oneill. You got somebody that has lived in that detective for 350 years and youre going to you saw back in 1994, you saw what we did back then when they tried to change our schools. You get somebody from the district and tip oneill understood all all politics local. I talked with one republican who involved in the super pac in that interest, the dazed ander that nervous about the republicans for if nancy pelosi says im going to required after possible with i sigh about the remember things . Its not the same it vote for a care that passes as well if nothing happens, if it fals, if mcconnell puts it up for a vote, as casey suggests or if sfwrrks its a very different brrn. Were going talk about this when we go be. Tip and theres a great letter in the New York Times and ill read it to you. I want to talk to about mad woot oo. Thank you, spes us that i never played ball. Were back in just a moment. baby crying fly me to the moon elegant music and let me play bell rings deartheres no other way to say this. Its over. Ive found a permanent escape from monotony. Together, we are perfectly balanced. Our senses awake. Our hearts racing as one. I know this is sudden, but they say. If you love something set it free. See you around, giulia you have the white house, the house, republicans have the house and the senate but you have these senators that are not on board. Theyre also four good guys and theyre four friends of mine. I think theyll probably get there. Well have to see. Lets ask one of them. Senator rand paul of kentucky, thanks for being on the show this morning. Thanks for having me. Whats the likelihood you can be moved from the no column to the yes column. At the end chris murphy said you would cave into republicans. I want the bill to look pore like a repeal bill. I promised people i was going to repeal it. You can buy insurance after your sick and added regulation such that healthy bnt didnt want to buy because it was too expensive. And you can still buy when youre sick but were going to subsidize by dumping a bunch of federal monies into the Health Care System. I dont think the taxpayers should give them any money. I really ammo posed to to the idea of giving your. Yeah, i could have used that could couple beak aids ago. Let me pass it on to you, instead of a actually puts together a bill that moves the Health Care System toward free markets because right knew health care is extraordinarily expensiv expensive. We spend more money per patient in america on health care than any country in the planet. We dont get the results and in large part we dont get the results because the free market is kept outside the door of every hospital, of every doctors office, of every testing facility. Youre exactly right. I can summarize the Health Care Cost condition tomb excepts so a very sophisticated lidder, a contact lenses, same way wp medicare fixed prices, medicaid fixed prices and even private insurance, no consumer shops for price. Theres a little bit of competition of what prices that come forward but not really with the consumer involved. All right. Mike . Senator, i want to read a letter to you. From martin platt of new york city. It reads i would propose supporting this bill if only as well as all members of the cabinet and all ftd. We currently have blaik. Were mandate no, i dont really want it because i want to be allowed to choose inexpensein was to legalize flnks theres 12 regulations in blake. Were replacing two of them. I ionprn is that many states wep fwchl and on the left they that i will be allnice to chat with you. The other side of the ill is redisbug health. But the reality according to the sen it haver about sfrernl that is a fiscal reality . F frb. Some of the le er and people to try to have partisan result. The top 10 , those who make more than 200,000 pay 66 of the income tax. So if you have a flat tax and eight math problem in that if you mack but we also have a gradually over im we it and befory 735,000 pay 4 of the income tax. Its disingenuous to say this is a tax cut to for the rich. All bin prn prn so any time you have a tax cut, even if you make it equal across the board and its not like were choosing people that have investment income. It just happens this was a tax increase that was placed on the wealthy. When it comes off, it will be a t tax, it will always benefit those who pay more in taxes. As you know, the medicaid expanse is widely used in your state, it popular in your state. Maybe theyll have a tad so once you give someone a ben if the like that be covered by a expanse i think we should had the Federal Reserve has a printesing press, this 3,500 billion dollar debt every year. So saying the federal government is and wa condition prn were just going to send it to the federal government. But if the states to pay for Medicaid Expansion, states would have fwrorks do we raise taxes with the os pabt sfurk if we want othe medicaid, pangswe might loose it happens o those people . This frn flrnl sfwrrchlt still propping up the Insurance Companies. The buying pools, where you can enjoy an association, drive prices down. They absolutely hate it, because they think it might eat into their profit. They love sort of prive taatizi their 15 billion a year profit but socializing their losses the in the individual market. I have absolutely no sympathy for the Insurance Companies to be bailed out by the taxpayer. That 15 billion in profit, thats where the risk should come from. Thats where when we have to absorb risk when people get sick should come out of their pocket, not the taxpayers pocket. Senator rand paul, thank you so much for being on this morning. Thank you, senator. Just ahead, well hear from republican senator bill cassidy who has his own concerns about the plan. And as we go to break, President Trump tries to apply pressure to democrats. Tweeting this morning, ive helped pass and signed 38 legislative bills 37 of them were to change the names of post offices. And also to get 24 karat fake gold plating around the corner of those post offices. Branded water, no . Mostly with no democratic support and gotten rid of massive amounts soft regulations. Nice nice thank you, mr. President. Think again. This is the new new york. We are building new airports all across the state. New roads and bridges. New mass transit. New business friendly environment. New lower taxes. And new University Partnerships to grow the businesses of tomorrow today. Learn more at esd. Ny. Gov when this bell rings. It starts a chain reaction. Thats heard throughout the connected business world. 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Coming up, well reveal new reporting from the Washington Post that moments the from now about how the Obama White House learned about the depths of Vladimir Putins role in our elections. Plus, after being dragged through the mud in the Georgia Special election and being questioned by members of her own party, nancy pelosi says she is worth the trouble. And we have an exclusive interview with former Homeland Security secretary, jeh johnson. Mika, ive got to tell you, the nancy pelosi thing, its like a know your value moment. More women ought to have what shes having. Morning joe is back in just a moment. Look closely. Hidden in every swing, every chip, and every putt, is data that can make the difference between winning and losing. The microsoft cloud helps the pga tour turn countless points of data into insights that transform their business and will enhance the game for players and fans. The microsoft cloud turns information into insight. For her compassion and care. He spent decades fighting to give families a second chance. But to help others, they first had to protect themselves. I have afib. Even for a nurse, its complicated. And it puts me at higher risk of stroke. That would be devastating. I had to learn all i could to help protect myself. Once i got the facts, my doctor and i chose xarelto®. Xarelto®. To help keep me protected. Oncedaily xarelto®, a latestgeneration blood thinner. Significantly lowers the risk of stroke in people with afib not caused by a heart valve problem. It has similar effectiveness to warfarin. Xarelto® works differently. Warfarin interferes with at least 6 bloodclotting factors. Xarelto® is selective, targeting just one critical factor interacting with less of your bodys natural bloodclotting function. For afib patients wellmanaged on warfarin, there is limited information on how xarelto® compares in reducing the risk of stroke. Dont stop taking xarelto® without talking to your doctor, as this may increase risk of stroke. While taking, you may bruise more easily, or take longer for bleeding to stop. It may increase your risk of bleeding if you take certain medicines. Xarelto® can cause serious, and in rare cases, fatal bleeding. Get help right away for unexpected bleeding, unusual bruising, or tingling. If youve had spinal anesthesia, watch for back pain or any nerve or musclerelated signs or symptoms. Do not take xarelto® if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. Tell your doctor before all planned medical or dental procedures. And before starting xarelto®about any conditions, such as kidney, liver, or bleeding problems. Its important to learn all you can. To help protect yourself from a stroke. Talk to your doctor about xarelto®. Theres more to know™. Looking for a hotel that fits. Your budget . Tripadvisor now searches over 200 sites to find you the hotel you want at the lowest price. Grazie, gino find a price that fits. Tripadvisor. Rumor confirmed. Theyre playing. What . We gotta go. Where . San francisco. When . Friday. We gotta go. [ tires screech ] any airline. Any hotel. Any time. Go where you want, when you want with no blackout dates. [ muffled music coming from club. Blue monday by new order. Cheers. ] how does it feel the travel rewards credit card from bank of america. Its travel, better connected. Democrats have lost 60 seats over the past six years, so why should you keep your job . Do you want me to sing my praises . Is that what youre saying . Why should i . Well, im a master legislator. Im a strategic, politically astute leader. They will always make a senator. Senator reid was a target. Senator daschle was a target. Tip oneil was a target, but i think im worth the trouble, frankly. Okay, i love that. That was just awesome. Welcome back to morning joe. Everybody, every woman should take a page out of that book. Dont flinch when youre asked to say what your value is. Just go right there and nail it and list it and take your time. Its friday, june 23rd. With us, we have msnbc contributor, mike barnicle. Donny deutsch is still with us. Do you have a problem with that . Kind of. Why . Once and for all, what is the problem . You being here . You need a lot. No, i just need to defend myself when im mocked no, theres more. Its a whole thing. I think the problem is donny just cares too much. No. I care about people. I care about small animals. A specific group of people. You do care about a specific group of a Certain Group of people whose got the same he takes all the oxygen out of the room. Theres a demo for donny. You know, for me, good people. Its great for me to be on with him, he takes all the abuse i normally take. I got you next. Thats okay. In my def, people understand the good i have done. This is what i mean. Youre cringe worthy. The only reason im nice to you, bill kristol, youre a dad to the most amazing. And i would never cross her. Kasie hunt in washington, as well. Just ahead todays washington to turn over any tapes to the house intel committee. Did anyone think there were tapes . I believe i said on this show, there are no tapes, hes being a child pretending the there are tapes to try to scare people. The only problem is, fbi director comey was saying, good god, let there be tapes, thats incredible. Of course there are no tapes. The president tweeted with all the recently reported electronic surveillance intercepts, unmasking, and illegal leaking of information, i have no idea whether there are tapes or recordings of my conversations with james comey. But i did not make and do not have any such recordings. The ap explains the Snowball Effect of the president s original tapes tweet. Quote, it triggered a series of consequences, each weightier than the last. Comey has suggested that the tweet prompted him to ask an associate to leak damaging information to the media. The resulting news reports built pressure on a Top Justice Department official to appoint an independent prosecutor to oversee the russia investigation. That special counsel is now reportedly investigating trumps own actions in a probe that could dog his presidency for the foreseeable future. When you look at it that way, joe, im thinking that list of selfdestructive tweets, this one should be at the top. We got to go back. Actually, a bright young writer said there was one tweet that would lead to Donald Trumps impeachment, he said it would actually be the tape tweet. Insofar as it led to the special prosecutor. Why did donald trump want Jeff Sessions as attorney general. He regards him highly. He wanted a loyal attorney general who would not appoint a special prosecutor and he ended up, through a series of events, beginning with his idiotic one on one dinner with james comey one week into his president and everything that followed with a special prosecutor and a very serious one. Weve been saying this morning, it was ant very smart strategy. Legally, donald trump was on fox a few minutes ago, answering the question of whether or not this was a good idea to tweet out about potential tapes. I didnt tape him. You never know whats happening when you see that the Obama Administration and perhaps longer than that, was doing all of this unmasking and surveillance and you read all about it. And ive been reading about it for the last couple of months, about the seriousness of the and horrible situation with surveillance all over the place. And youve been hearing the word unmasking, a word youve probably never heard before. You never know whats out there, but i didnt tape and i dont have any tape and i didnt tape. But when he found out that i, you know, that there may be tapes out there, whether its governmental tapes or anything else and who knows, i think his story may have changed. I mean, youll have to take a look at that, because then he has to tell what actually took place at the events. And my story didnt change. My story was always a straight story. My story was always the truth. But youll have to determine for yourself whether or not his story changed. But i did not tape. It was a smart way to make sure he stayed honest in those hearings . Well, it wasnt it wasnt very stupid, i can tell you that. Joe it wasnt very stupid. Joe, i have to tell you, we talk a lot about this. When i see this, about 13, 14 words in, im not hearing any words, because its incoherent. That was an old man babbling. Babbling also, hes saying theres surveillance all over the place. Hes president of the United States. Where was the followup . If parts of the u. S. Government are illegally surveilling people, he should do something about it. And it is unbelievably irresponsible to just throw this out there, which cooks into every rightwing and leftwing Conspiracy Theory about surveillance. He just said in his rambling answer i really didnt catch anything. He just rambled. And im sure theres going to be a follow up. So alex, can you cue that tape . Where the anchors jump in and question him on this. Heres the tape. I didnt tape him. You never know whats happening when you see that the Obama Administration and perhaps longer than that was doing all of this unmasking and surveillance and you read all about it and ive been reading about it for the last couple of months, about the seriousness of the and horrible situation with surveillance all over the place and youve been hearing the word unmasking, a word you probably never heard before. So you never know whats out there, but i didnt tape. And i dont have any tapes, and i didnt tape. But when he found out that i you know, that there may be tapes out there, whether its governmental tapes or anything else, and who knows, i think his story may have changed. I mean, youll have to take a look at that. Because they n he has to tell wt actually took place at the events. And my story didnt change. My story was always a straighttory. My story was always the truth. But youll have to determine for yourself whether or not his story changed. But i did not tape. It was a smart way to make sure he stayed honest in those hearings. Well, it wasnt uh, it wasnt very stupid, i can tell you that. So then he admits in that answer to the followup question that it was sort of strategic. It was a smart way to keep mueller on his tones. Which, by the way, that is what he just did at the end, and the reporter called him out on it, saying, thats a smart way to keep him honest. That is intimidating a witness, right . Well, not if he well, theres that, but theres another larger point here. Hes the president of the United States. Lets remember that. Hes the president of the United States. He said, there may be tapes out there, government tapes, who knows. He is the president of the United States. He should find out. Again, for legal purposes, and well go back again to what greta had said last night, if you are intimidating a witness and its a, quote, smart way to keep a witness honest, by lying about taping him and letting that lie hang out there for 41 days and having your press office not respond for 41 days to try to intimidate comey, guarantee you muellers looking at that this morning. I think i mean, he wasnt trying to intimidate comey, because comey was there. He knows what happened. A contemporaneous memoranda. Thats whats kind of nuts. I thought about it, is there a possible method to this madness. Are there other people who had meetings in the oval office with donald trump who might be intimidated by the notion there might be tapes. Lets make this up. Mike flynn had a conversation, mike flynn said something that might be selfincrimatory. What he said there is crazy. Theres nothing rational. That is our commander in chief and he babbled and made no sense. Forget tapes, not tapes. Thats the frightening part. That is a man that if you just watched him, you would go, he doesnt seem to be all there. Im not being glib. And that was a friendly environment, to say the least. Mrs. Continenti should have her students diagram that sentence. Theyre on summer vacation. Students and teacher are happy about that. I think she should do some summer reading. So, willie, even the tweets are becoming a bit, um concerning . Well, theyve always been a little all over the place. I dont know if becoming is the right word. There is Something Else to point out here. And if it were anybody else, it would sound absurd and trivial. But i think there is something to it. Remember when he tweeted about president obama potentially wiretapping him. He put wiretapped in quotes. And later, he said, i put it in quotes, wiretapping can mean anything. Thats the oldfashioned way sean spicer reiterated that way from the press room. Here, he put tapes in quotes. H he can lob out these wild accusations and escape from there later. I am launching a Nuclear Weapon against korea. That wasnt in quotes, he meant that part. But these are more serious, because now hes implicating himself. And when he goes out and talks about it again, hes putting more fuel on the fire for bob mueller. Moments ago, the Washington Post posted a story with the headline, obamas secret struggle to punish russia for putins election assault. According to the reporting, u. S. Intel had sourcing deep inside moscow, reporting even capturing president Vladimir Putins direct instructions to damage Hillary Clintons chances to have winning and help elect donald trump. Joining us now from washington to help break all this down, one of the authors of that report, National Security correspondent for the Washington Post, craig miller. Thank you for being on. Tell us more about what you found out and what youre reporting on this morning. So what weve done here is tried to assemble as comprehensive a story as we can about the Obama Administrations handling of the russian interference in the election last year. And we uncovered a lot of new information. That the cia came to the white house at the very beginning of august with explosive intelligence on putins own directions surrounding the operations. At that early stage, you know, coming right out of july, right out of the conventions, the agency had already gotten intel saying is that putin was running this operation and that its objective was to hurt Hillary Clinton and to help donald trump. The story goes on from there and it covers in extensive detail the ensuing five months and the Obama Administrations sort of repeated hesitation to respond to this. But it also reveals a couple other things that obama did do that have never been disclosed. He also approved a covert cia, nsa, a u. S. Cyber command operation, which envisions which involves placing digital devices across, across parts of russias infrastructure that could be detonated if there were an escalating Cyber Exchange with moscow. So hes sort of laying, preparing the battle field for a future cyber war. Greg, i apologize. We havent i havent read the story in full. Its only just posted moment ago. Mikes a slow reader. But within the story, sources and methods, cia is very obviously, you know, trying to keep you from finding out sources and methods, but sources and methods within the kremlin. Can you address that . Did they have sources within the kremlin . I can you know, so, if you we did have extensive conversations with the cia and other agencies before we went to print with this story. And so there is a lot of information or some information, i should say, that we have withheld, because it would expose sources and methods and thats not our objective here. But what we can say is, yes, they had sourcing deep within the russian government that spoke to putins direct involvement in this operation. In fact, had his own putins very specific instructions to the russian government,s to russian intelligence services, about the direction and the purpose of this operation. Greg, its willie geist, what was the hesitation you referred to a minute ago by the Obama Administration to respond to this . Obviously, if it was an operation targeting the candidate that president obama wanted elected to preserve his legacy, why wouldnt they do more . Yeah, i mean, i think that ends up actually, weirdly, turning back on them. And they become sort of paralyzed by concern that they would be accused of what you just said, of playing politics, of inserting themselves, of inserting the white house into this volatile election last season. Theyre worried that acting too aggressively would be perceived as putting the thumb on the scales in an effort to help Hillary Clinton. And would actually sort of serve moscows ends, to some degree, by discrediting the outcome or leaving some doubt among American Voters about the judgme legitimacy of the election. Greg, bill kristol here. Were people pat the head of the Intelligence Agency or parts of it who wanted a more aggressive response from the agency or the dni . Thats a great question. What the story also goes into is the extensive monthslong debate over how to respond. And the various measures that were proposed and pushed by senior officials in the Obama Administration that never really got anywhere. There were proposals for sectorwide economic sanctions that would take a serious dent out of russias economy. There were proposals for Cyber Retaliation that would take down parts of Russian Networks or infrastructure for short amounts of time. And there were even ideas floated at some points of moving a u. S. Naval Carrier Group into the baltic sea, just as a show of resolve. Obviously, none of that ever happened. None of that ever happened. Im im just, at this point, i cant understand how the president doesnt even address the issue. Did you report on that . Were there other people in the white house who counseled the president not to do that . What was the interagency debate like . It must have been very interesting . Youll see in our story, we have many of those officials on the record. We have white house chief of staff, Denis Mcdonough on the record. We have National Security adviser, susan rice on the record. We have another National Security official, ben rhodes, on the record. We did a lot of interviews and we have a lot of details about those debates and why this played out the way that it did. Any cabinet members on the record, greg . Well, i think that youre making me think right now. Actually, i guess we dont. I cant tell you i wouldnt conclude from that that we didnt talk to cabinet members or that we didnt attempt to talk to cabinet members. I mean, jeh johnson was actually testifying just this week publicly about some of this stuff. About the debates about trying to protect the election infrastructure, as the election approached. But we had conversations with, as we say nz our story, with more than three dozen officials from the Obama Administration and current administration, ranging from the highest levels of government to the middle ranks where a lot of these debates took place. Gregg miller, thank you very much. Speaking of, up next, well bring in former Homeland Security secretary, jeh johnson, to get his take on this breaking story. Caskasie hunt, final thought fo you this block. I know youre taking off. Just listening to greg miller. The one piece of this story im just reading through, he was talking about covert actions, things they could detonate in russias infrastructure from a cyber perspective and its going to be up to President Trump to decide whether or not to use that. It strikes me, this is going to put a lot more pressure we were talking earlier about how the president doesnt seem to be willing to take on russia the way hes taken on some of these other institutions. This will raise serious issues about what he does next. Wibill kristol, thank you, a well. And up next, jeh johnson joins us for an exclusive interview. Youre watching morning joe. Well be right back. Welcome to holiday inn whether for big meetings or little getaways, there are always smiles ahead at holiday inn. For her compassion and care. He spent decades fighting to give families a second chance. But to help others, they first had to protect themselves. I have afib. Even for a nurse, its complicated. And it puts me at higher risk of stroke. That would be devastating. I had to learn all i could to help protect myself. Once i got the facts, my doctor and i chose xarelto®. Xarelto®. To help keep me protected. Oncedaily xarelto®, a latestgeneration blood thinner. Significantly lowers the risk of stroke in people with afib not caused by a heart valve problem. It has similar effectiveness to warfarin. Xarelto® works differently. Warfarin interferes with at least 6 bloodclotting factors. 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Its important to learn all you can. To help protect yourself from a stroke. Talk to your doctor about xarelto®. Theres more to know™. Isaac hou has mastered gravity defying moves to amaze his audience. Great show. Here you go. Now hes added a new routine. Making depositing a check seem so effortless. Easy to use chase technology, for whatever youre trying to master. Isaac, are you ready . Yeah. Chase. So you can. My question for you, sir, just to be abundantly clear, will the russians be back . I think we have to assume for all the reasons that have been discussed here that the russians will be back, and possibly other state actors and possibly other bad cyber actors. Fair to assume you are concerned, if not worried, about 16 and 18 elections and all others Going Forward . Yes. That is former Homeland Security secretary, jeh johnson, testifying earlier this week before the house intelligence committee. And secretary johnson joins us now. Secretary, good to see you this morning. Good morning. The administration source, live and in person. Glad to have you. Well ask you about your testimony in a minute, but we want to talk about the story that was just broken by the Washington Post, greg miller joining us a few minutes ago, talking about the Obama Administrations response to Cyber Attacks from the russian governments intrusion into our election process. And that the Obama Administration decided it was better not to put its thumb on the scale, not to retaliate in an effective way. Can you confirm that . Well, greg is right in the following respect. The decision to make attribution on october 7th was a very big decision. Because we were in the midst of a very overheated campaign with one of the candidates saying the result is going to be rigged. But at the end of the day, after a lot of consideration, we decided that we had to tell the american voting public, the American Public, what we knew was going on, before the election. The analogy that i used as a corporate lawyer, if im issuing a public stock and i know theres a very powerful actor out there manipulating the price of that public stock, i have an obligation to tell the investing public. And at the end of the day, that was the prevailing point of view, though there were a lot of very special considerations. This was an unprecedented move by the administration to point the finger at a super power in the midst of an election. Were you in the camp earlier on that thought the United States should have done more about it and not stayed out of it, in terms of a response to russia . I and others believe very strongly that we had to tell the American Public what we knew. That was not an easy decision. Given the rhetoric of the campaign, given the fact that in National Security, we typically stay out of elections, we stay out of campaigns, but with the intelligence, which was overwhelming, we felt an obligation to tell the public on october 7th. Now, frankly, the larger issue here is when we when jim clapper and i issued that statement, we all thought this was going to be big news, full banner, but it was the same day as the access hollywood video, so it was literally below the fold news that day. Obviously, theres no question, 17 intelligence agencies have said there was meddling. Is there any whys . Thats obviously the milliondollar question. But in your intelligence, is there any why this was happening . Well, the why is as far as for trump, versus hillary. In the public intelligence that was released january 6th, and the motive seems to have ranged from wanting to undermine the credibility of our election, wanting to undermine the credibility of the clinton presidency, to favoring donald trump. Why favoring why . We know that. But was there any intelligence, why they wanted to favor donald trump . Well, you would have to look at the public reporting, but the more important issue here, frankly, was that there was a very powerful foreign actor trying to put his thumb on the scale of our democracy. The question now for us, which is why i was voluntarily willing to go down to washington this week and testify is, what are we going to do about it . What next . Our election infrastructure in this country is exposed. There are vulnerabilities that came to light last year. So what are we going to do about that for 18, for 20 . And frankly, the current administration, the current president through his rhetoric is kind of sending the signals that this is something that will be tolerated. And so, you know, powerful actors like the russians, they look at what they think will happen if they do something, and weve got to make this kind of behavior cost prohibitive. On october 7thed, y e, you a clapper issued the statement, the warning about russia was up to. But they come across the bridging in langley about devastating information about a foreign power literally declaring some kind of warfare, cyber warfare against the United States. What took so long . Well, i would disagree that it took long. Well, you it was a mobilizing picture that john brennan and others presented to us, and there was a point in late summer, early fall when the picture became crystal clear. At that point, we felt we had to tell the American Public what was going on, and that involves a lot of things. Youve got to think about whether youre compromising sources and methods by doing that. Youve got to think about the effect of injecting ourselves into the campaign. Youve got to think about and anticipate what the russian reaction will be. Youve got to think about the fact that one of the candidates is already saying the election is going to be rigged. And so, its not like waking up one morning and issuing a tweet. We thought very carefully at the National Security Council Level about what we needed to do. And tat the end of the day, we recognized we had to tell the American Public what was going on. I understand the hesitancy to you know, sources and methods, and disrupt whats going on over at the cia. But there have been anecdotal reports i have heard, i heard the anecdotal reports as early as right after labor day about american contacts, diplomatic contacts with russia, about what was going on. And it seems to me, it just seems to me, looking in from the outside, that two months is an awfully long time to really put your foot down. Well, i wouldnt say i wouldnt agree with the notion that two months before october 7th, we had a perfectly clear picture, comfortable enough to go public with it. It was an emerging picture that by late summer, early fall, was very clear and at that point, we had to decide. And we did decide to tell the public what we knew. And we did in pretty blunt terms that day. That statement that jim and i issued was frankly uncommonly blunt for an intelligence report. And unfortunately, it did not get the attention that it did. I remember thinking then that the cattle have all gone to the other end of the pasture because theyre covering access hollywood and other things. Stupid things like that. The administrations inability, failure to even address that this is happening. What does that tell you . I mean, isnt this an imminent threat to our there are a number of things we need to do to harden the cybersecurity of our election infrastructure. But first and foremost, actors like the russian government, other nation state actors have to know that bayer like this is cost prohibitive. Right. And whats being done . If the signal being sent from the administration in power is that this will be tolerated, we dont mind, then that obviously will factor into their thinking. So my hope is that the president himself will take this on, so that edon that we dont have to have another event like we had in 16. As of now, has he . And if not, is that the signal being sent . That this is okay, to russia . Is america signaling to russia this is okay . I have not heard from President Trump a strong statement of condemnation about the russian behavior and about what all of his Intelligence Community is telling him happened last year. And what we said publicly had happened last year. Were focusing on the trrump administration, but everything youre talking about, obviously, took place during your administration. During the Obama Administration. So i understand you went public on october the 7th, but were there any Counter Measures launched . Was there any retaliation, once you knew this was taking place, what did the Obama Administration do about it . We took a number of steps on october 29th, as you know. From my point of view, what was most important is that we take steps that were cybersecurity related, that would have the effect of undermining this type of effort in the future. So one of the things we did was to effectively unmask the russian actors that were involved, unmask their signatures, so that if others saw this signature in their systems, they would know what it was. But there were a number of steps taken on december 29th. Obviously, we were in the last days of the Obama Administration. And its up to the Trump Administration now to move that forward and build on that, to send the signal that intervening in our democracy will not be permitted. Prior to october 7th, the internal debate within the administration, were there hawks and doves . Were you a hawk or were you a dove . There are always hawks and dove s in any discussion like this. As there should be. There should be a robust debate among your seniormost advisers. And in this case, i there definitely was. I just know that i and others argued strongly that given what we know, given what we see, we have to tell the American Public before the election so that they know whats going on and they know who it is thats putting his thumb on the scale. With the benefit of almost a years hindsight now, do you wish that the Obama Administration had done more . If this reporting is true, you didnt want to put your thumb on the scale and appear to be meddling in the election on behalf of Hillary Clinton Hillary Clinton, do you think that was unwise . Do you think you should have done more . Well, we did go public with what we knew. Hindsight is if brilliant. With hindsight, i can tell you 20 things i should have done in National Security. But thats with the benefit of hindsight. I know that in the fall, we were very concerned about this. It was a front burner item. Lots of very good discussion about what we needed to do and at the end of the day, we took the unprecedented step of going public with the intelligence, so we could tell the American People what was going on. Do you think it had an impact on the outcome of the election. Thats for a pollster or a social scientist to figure out. But they intervened in our political process. And that shouldnt be permitted. It cant be permitted, Going Forward. Yeah. Trump blames the Obama Administration. Here we go. By the way, if russia was working so hard on the 2016 election, it all took place during the Obama Administration. Why didnt they stop them . We went public with what we saw at the time. We took a number of steps on december 29th in the last days of the administration. Now its up to this president and his administration to send the message, hes in charge. To send the message to russia and to other state actors that intervening in our democracy on behalf of any candidate, whether its a d or an r cannot be permitted. Zw all right. Former secretary jeh johnson, thank you so much for joining us exclusively this morning. Thank you. Thank you. Still ahead on morning joe do you think youll get the chance to see it and really read the whole thing to be able to yeah, totally. To be able to really say whether or not this is sfoir satisfactory. If i dont get to read it, i dont vote for it. That was senator bill cassidy earlier this week. Republicans want to vote on health care next week. Is that enough time for the senator to study the plan . Well ask him ahead on morning joe. When this bell rings. It starts a chain reaction. Thats heard throughout the connected business world. 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Start searching for free now at ancestry. Com the its right now. Lver suites and houses on mars. Think about it. We can push buttons and make cars appear out of thin air. And find love anywhere. Hes cute. How . Because our phones have evolved. So isnt it time our networks did too . Introducing a new kind of network. Americas largest most reliable 4g lte and the most wifi hotspots. Call or click to take advantage of a limited time offer. Xfinity mobile. Joining us now from toronto, ontario, chief White House Correspondent for the New York Times, out with the new book, obama obama, the call of history, peter baker. Congratulations on the book. I want to ask you about your interview with Justin Trudeau and what we may have had to say with his relationship about donald trump. Obviously, very friendly with barack obama, they were out to dinner a few weeks ago. What about President Trump . How does he feel . It was interesting. He went out of his way to express nothing but positive feelings about President Trump, no matter all the differences they have on issues like trade, climate change, and other things. He had throughout the course of our hour interview on stage at the Rotman School here, he was really reluctant to take on in a direct way. His clear conclusion is he doesnt want to get in Donald Trumps grille and provoke a fight and its better for him to stay on a friendly side and m k manage these differences they have. But you havent seen so much contention in the u. S. canadian roup in years. The one quote you have from trudeau, the one thing ive learned is that President Trump does actually listen, and this is something we can work with. Do you get feeling he was just being diplomatic with his presentation or is there a real relationship there . Well, theres no question he was being zploediplomatic. He was looking for the best things that he could say. Theres some feeling on his part, at least he can get donald trump on the phone. We asked him about his conversations with president obama. He said, look, we had a phone call with president obama, there was always this big process that took weeks of consultations. With President Trump, hes able to basically just call and get him on pretty quickly. So in that sense, he has more access. But theres a reason, because, in fact, they have so many issues that theyre debating. And some of them are with canada and like other foreign leaders, hes trying to figure out, how do you manage one of the most mercurial and volatile men ever to sit in the oval office. So peter, obama the call of history out today, available in bookstores everywhere, online, just look it up, peter baker, buy it. The call of history, taking a look at president obama, taking your nobknowledge of him, havin covered him for years, what do you think is going through his mind with regard to past president s not interfering with current presidencies, how eager is, if he is, to jump in on whats going on . I have to think this is somewhat frustrating to him. Hes watching his successor come along and brick by brick, take a sledgehammer to his legacy. Just yesterday plan to repeal obamacare, just a week or so ago, President Trump said he was reversing at least part of his cuba policy. Weve seen the trade deal with asia thrown away, the paris climate accord. These are things that president obama is obviously unhappy that theyre being dismantled. At the same time, though, hes struggling with how public to be. He thinks, i think, if he speaks out too much, that he creates he puts himself in the position of being the enemy that President Trump might actually want. That President Trump is looking for somebody to, you know, attack against in a political sense and president obama doesnt want to give him that kind of target. But you did see him speak out yesterday. He put out a pretty stuff statement on facebook about the Senate Health care bill, the Republican Health care bill, said it was one of fundamental meanness and a massive transfer of wealth from the poor to the rich. And it was interesting to see him do that. Clearly, health care is one of the areas he still does feel very strongly and wants to defend his legacy. Peter, speaking of his legacy, obviously, a lot of his supporters, certainly, his president ial library will talk about the financial crisis and his response to it. Will talk about obamacare. Will talk about the raid on Osama Bin Laden and him making the call when so many others were warning him against it. But, how big of a role does syria play . How dark of a cloud does syria cast ton thon that legacy when have an historic refugee crisis, the worst since world war ii. You have chaos in syria. You have the rise of isis, which many in the Intel Community were predicting, if the United States left a vacuum there. And you have, of course, syria disintegrating and half a million or more killed. Yeah, absolutely. Thats on his record. And that has nothing to do with President Trump. You know, i think with the judgment of history comes, thats one of the things president obama is going to have to try to explain. Well see his memoir some day wing. But youre right, i think one of the failures, as many of his own advisers see, was their inability to shape that outcome to try to to mitigate that war, to bring an end to that war, to stop the killing, to stop these refugee flows. And fundamentally, it was a cautious approach taken by president obama. What he saw, much like your discussion just a few minutes ago, about the russian melding was, it could be made worse. And the last thing i want to do is make it worse. Dont do stupid stuff. Remember his mantra on foreign policy. But in the process of looking at all the downsides of the various possibilities they could have taken, it ends up leading to a sort of paralysis. And in the end, basically, not doing enough to are shape that outcome. And i think thats going to be something that historians look at, you know, a certain degree of jaundice in the future. Peter baker from the morning joe toronto bureau. Peter, thanks so much. The new book is obama the call of history. Up next, senator bill cassidy of louisiana joins us, along with tom brokaw of south dakota. Morning joe continues in a moment. Wiback like it could used to . Neutrogena hydro boost water gel. With hyaluronic acid it plumps skin cells with intense hydration and locks it in. For supple, hydrated skin. Hydro boost. From neutrogena finding the best hotel price is now a safe bet. Because tripadvisor searches over 200 booking sites so you save up to 30 on the hotel you want. Lock it in. Tripadvisor. The future isnt silver suits anits right now. S, think about it. We can push buttons and make cars appear out of thin air. Find love anywhere. Hes cute. And buy things from, well, everywhere. How . Because our phones have evolved. So isnt it time our networks did too . Introducing americas largest, most reliable 4g lte combined with the most wifi hotspots. Its a new kind of network. Xfinity mobile. We have republican senator bill cassidy of louisiana and tom brokaw. Senator, first, lets obviously, there are a lot of people in your state that depend on obamacare, that depend on medicaid, just like rand paul, we had on healearlier. Are you going to vote to repeal obamacare and to put this plan in place, that the Senate Unveiled yesterday . I have not finished reviewing the plan. Im on page 97 of 142. So ill be able to answer that before should you have probably been given access to that plan along with everybody else . If republicans are going to criticize barack obama for lack of transparency in 2009, shouldnt our party have been more transparent . Joe, im not going to defend the process. I dont think the process was the best. On the other hand, i can either curse the wind or put up a sail. So as much as i could, i tried to figure out what was in there, setting the stage for reading the bill. Ultimately, we have to make sure patients are taken care of in a way that the federal and state taxpayer can sustain. If we can take care of patients and at the same time sustainable for the federal and state taxpayer, it will be a good bill. From what youve read, what do you see . There are portions of it that are good reforms. Now, folks are going to complain. No one likes change, even from worst to better. But on the other hand, there are some reforms that will line the incentives between the patients, the state, and the federal government. Like what . I think the per beneficiary payment is a really very positive. Whats that . In laymans terms . So if you have one person, the federal government gives a certain amount of money of state for the care of that one person. The state then does the same thing with the Medicaid Managed Care company. It takes that chunk of money and it gives it to the insurance company. And you kind of align incentives so the federal government pays the state what the state then pays the managed care company to take care of the patient. If you do that, you take care of the patient, studies show that that patient gets better care. A big piece of this, senator, is Medicaid Expansion and its rollback. We asked rand paul about it in our last hour. How concerned are you . I understand the obligation it puts on states and the onus financially it puts on states, but how concerned are you about people who have now enjoyed that Medicaid Expansion for several years now, just taking it out from them and what happens to them . If that Medicaid Expansion goes away and if there is no coverage, thats a bad thing, willie. On the other hand, if they move from medicaidthing, if they mov medicaid to private insurance, that could be a good thing. For example the individual market is doing so poorly because there are so few people in the individual market. If we take those folks off of Medicaid Expansion, putting them in the individual market, it expands the risk pool and actually helps lower premiums for others who are in that pool. Is that definitely what happens to those people in you got to think of a family in indiana who is covered by that Medicaid Expansion. Wait a minute, i dont want this taken away if i dont know whats over the hill. Thats what im looking at, but the tax credits in the senate bill are far more generous than the tax credits in the house bill, so as that family moves over, we want to make sure there is not a big cliff, oh, are you on medicaid, you dont get a meal. Proprietary. If we make it you are on medicaid, but you move over into a generous cred nate allows to you kind of float on up, actually, thats going to be a better we dont know if that will happen. So back home, a lot of people call you doctor, because you are a doctor. What youve read and we heard about it so far, what does this do positively or negatively tore access to care and quality of care . Well, great questions, mike, for access to care, it will depend upon the formulas for the generosity of that credit for the lower income american. So let me reserve judgment until i finish saying that. And in terms of access to care, it could be positive. When folks are on medicaid, typically, there is only some doctors that see medicaid patients. When theyre on private insurance, there is a far broader panel of folks to see and so if as we move people to private insurance, they have greater access to doctors to specialists that could be a positive thing. Dont you expect as private Insurance Companies, however, will again raise the screen as the kind of people they want to take, even the direction of medicaid coming to them at this point . We seen that in obamacare. Theyre bailing out because its been too expensive and they have their hands on the thoughtments of power. I dont sister to tell you that. So the positive thing about this bill thats truly positive is that it attempts to lower private insurance rates immediately by giving certainty to the Insurance Companies in that insurance market. For example, we found the cost fair i sharing reduction payments, that have been a big source of contention, Insurance Companies have been raising rates because theyre not sure theyre getting those payments. Now they can set him down those rates. There is also 15 billion a year for the first two years to create socalled invisible high rick pools. If the Insurance Companies have high cost patients, aids, kidney failure, pros stated cancer, then there is 15ple to put in reinsurance pools so that can lower premiums by another 20 . There is a lot of money up front to try and lower premiums. Okay. They wrote a piece about how the democrats could start to save themselves, because their losing streak seems to continue. Your thoughts. I think the system is the most dysfunctional i have seen it in my lifetime in walk and across the country. We have two polarized parties at this point. No middle ground, no inclination to work on something. Like what will we do with health care in america. How important it is, how critical it is. We spent 3 trillion in the middle east so far. We are adding more people in afghanistan at the moment. To debate about that going on in congress an public hearings of any kind. This Health Care Bill, which was done behind closed doors in the United States senate was a complete defiance of what they said about obamacare. We need to have a role in all of this. So we have a system in which both parties are at opposite ends of the spectrum and theyre fought meeting in middle ground. Plet me ask you something, why do democrats keep losing since barack obama was elected. They lost a thousand legislative seats. Not just in red states, theyre losing in blue states, too. How have the democrats become so disconnected from the rank and file . Because they dont know who they are. Thats why i think. They dont have a central core of beliefs at this point. Theyre playing by a lot of the old rules. You got all these Party Divisions going on, before with Bernie Sanders, they got their fax, nancy pelosi, who has become the posterchild for the republicans put her up next to any candidate they have running with good reason. She is, you know, ive known her a long time. She had a really honorable early career, no question about it. Shes o for 3 in the congress in terms of democrats getting back in control again. Where are the younger democrats who have a different point of view because this is a Dynamic Society and a dynamic political system and it is changing constantly. Democrats are share playing by the old rules in my judgment. Theyre not raising the people who we ought to be hearing from. Two easy examples for me when Hillary Clinton was running, she took Bernie Sanders idea and said, im going to give free college to families with 125,000 or less. There is no free lunch. At the end of the four years you get a college education, you owe your country two years of public service. You put on civilian uniforms and help people in military uniforms of some fashion. There are government regulations out there. Look i lived a lot of my life in the american midwest. There are places there that have no application to the practicality of doing business out there. There was no discussion about that whatsoever. On the other hand, republicans are on a roll. They very corporate in terms of how they organize themselves, across the country and, you know, they have some views that i think are not in the best interests of the longterm of this country. But, you got to give them credit for how they are organized and how they are moving forward. Tom brokaw, thank you so much. Thank you, trust me. Ill be tweeted about. Thank you for being on the show. Senator, thank you so much. Still ahead, senator rand paul is sort of a group of four republican senators bucking the majority leader mcconnells Health Care Plan. Can they be brought in line with just minor changes . Well ask the kentucky senator. But first, the president s game of cat and mouse over recordings in the Oval Office Comes to an end. Just as we predicted it. But in its wake, did he leave himself open to a political price or even a legal one . Like witness intimidation. Thats ahead when morning joe comes right back. Liberty mutual stood with us when a fire destroyed everything in our living room. We replaced it all without touching our savings. Yeah, our insurance wont do that. No. You can leave worry behind when liberty stands with you™. Liberty mutual insurance. Depend silhouette active fit briefs, feature a thin design for complete comfort. They say move it or lose it and at my age, im moving more than ever. Because getting older is inevitable. But feeling older . Thats something i control. Get a free sample at depend. Com. Right. In. Your. Stomach watch this . Yikes, that ice cream was messing with you, wasnt it . Try lactaid, its real ice cream, without that annoying lactose. Lactaid. Its the milk that doesnt mess with you. Im not surprised. I dont know why he said there will be tapes in the first place. He will rise and fall like the rest of the party whether or not we produce results for the American People. I have come to conclude he will tweet when he wants to tweet t. Question is can we consolidate the ma jetma majorit majority now. President bush puts the rest what he tweeted himself, whether he secretly recorded ja imse comey. Lindsey graham saying the president wont rise and fall on his tweets. But that one tweet about possible tapes may have paved the way to a special counsel that is now investigating him for obstruction and justice and others are mentioning the notice of witness intimidation. It makes sense. I was watching greta last fight. She was savvy. Shes always so easy. I should rather take queue from her. Last night, she was really angry and she was angry because and i stopped and watched. The president has taken us for a ride for 41 days. Why is he doing this . He admitted he lied to america, he lied to the world 41 days ago. And you know the lawyer in her just kept saying, theres only one reason why he would do this. Yep. To intimidate a witness. Scare people. Its intwitness intimidation. There is no other reason, with all due respect to lindsay, she usually gets it right. This president could rise and fall on tweets like that. We should have put that on the listofdestructive tweets. Yeah. There are so many, though, it was so hard to choose. I know, thats what michael said, the one tweet which may lead to Donald Trumps impeachment, obviously, matthew, nada not a liberal guy. Good morning, everyone, its friday, june 23rd. Its friday. You were great last night. [ applause ] thank you very much. Donnys here. People dont know. He was at the cutting room. You can download it. Is that shameless . Im the promo guy. Johnny. He was there last night. Hes got an ep with four new songs out t. Thing that people dont understand. You remember the movie almost famous with all the groupie, i dont want to upset you. There were gaggles, gaggles and gaggles everything from teenage girls to Senior Citizens in cut off morning joe sleeveless shirts. You were on stage, you couldnt see it. I loved it the music in almost every song you wrote. What was really disturbing was one of the people in the cutoff shirts donny. Im sitting there. It was cut off over here. Sony red music, thank you, guys. As im playing, he gets a baby gap tees and the liftoff tee. It was an expression of the show, what he was wear. He was walking by. I love live music. He cut it into a half show. Which was great. You were great. Huge crowd. We thought it was a morning joe family thing. There was a line down the block s. That for joe . It was. Okay. Sounds good. Capitol hill correspondent casey hunt in washington. Lets talk really quick, lindsay said he wasnt going to rise an fall. You look at the tweets, the response for special counsel, as getta was saying somebody pretty much down the middle. She said, if im his lawyer, im nervous about looking. And possibly intimidating a witness. Because theres no other reason why he would put out the tweet, he better hope that theres not tapes. And comey didnt move. So now mueller will key in on that. It was totally reckless at the time. We all said so at the time. Also from a legal Strategic Point of view was dumb. And its another case where you wonder, is there not anyone next to him, sir, not for us, for your own good, for your own good, stop tweeting. Mike, for a bigger question. Why lie . Why totally out and out lie . We know he lies all the time. Why lie about Something Like this that would get people to go back thinking nixon, nixon, nixon. Why did he have the lawyer there saying listen if you do that and you dont have tapes, are you now setting yourself up for another charge. Thats intimidation of a witness in a federal probe. Its tough to keep him with him. Once again, we will go by the old standby, he is who he is. He is a 70yearold guy fixed in his habits. He has been doing this all of his life, real estate deals. Signing the deem, to short donny, the risks are so much higher. Thats the thing, donald trump has gotten away with this his entire life, cutting corners, intimidating people. He is thinking of going up not against bob mueller, the constitution, hes going up against the United States of america. Hes not fighting rosie. If he cuts corners like this, its not just him yelling and somebody yelling back, there are federal charges attached, possibly, to some of the things hes doing, if hes not careful. Because hes not well. Hes not attached to reality t. Other thing, joe, you mentioned this a couple weeks azbochlt we talked about the campaign, he would do some vicious things that morally were corrupt but you go okay, unfortunately, there is a logic to it. There was an end game. What was so bizarre about this beyond the legal ramifications is we all kind of know comey is a boy scout and hes the liar. So he knows, comey know what is he said in that room. That was not going to rattle comey. It was almost, not only was it legally putting him in a very precarious situation, it was dumb. It was dumb. Comey said, lordy, i hope there are tapes. What he doesnt real size what he is doing now is causing the exact opposite reaction from the people hes fighting now. Because you push comey, you see what happens. You push mueller, you see what happens. And now hes going on this morning on tv talking about, you know, criticizing bob mueller. Lets do that, micah, this is all very, very bad news for the president of the United States if he does it. Robert mueller, do you think he should recuse himself from this, because he is good friends with james comey, hes hired some attorneys that were a part of Hillary Clintons foundation that gave money to president obama and Hillary Clintons campaign, should le recuse himself . He is very, very good friends with comey, which is very bothersome. But he is also and well have to see. Were going to have to see in terms. Look, there has been no obstruction. There has been no collusion, there has been leaking by comey. But theres been no collusion, no obstruction and virtually everybody agrees to that. So well have to see. I can say that the people that have been hired are all Hillary Clinton supporters. Well, of course, you are talking about somebody who ent to Hillary Clintons came to his wedding. The guy that gave money to chuck schumer. For the 20th century, that was back in 2010 he was giving all of this money. Casey, this guy arguing he may have some people that contributed to democratic campaigns in the past and actually did rules done apply to him. Against the clintons, he would be disqualifying himself. Again, with these stakes higher, this reminds me of the judge curiel fight earlier in the year. You got a judge you dont like, so you Say Something racist about him. Here you got a judge you dont leak, so you accuse him of doing the very same thing you did, yourself, that is spend time, give money to democrats. Is there any possibility that republicans would stand bid and do nothing if bob mueller were fired . Reporter i dont think so, joe. Look, and thats an observation based on talking to members of congress on the hill. Ive started to kind of 345esh what donald trump measure what donald trump has said by how strongly people are willing to react to it. I have to tell you bob mueller has i think gotten some of the strongest set of defenses from republicans that any person or issue that has come up. I think that there is not going to be very much tolerance for undermining or questioning his credibility. You have the Senate Judiciary committee, construct grass isly and Dianne Feinstein talking about including obstruction of justice around this. I think it centers on defending him. Look, this is in many ways an attack on an institution. Potentially. And i think that might be the difference here for many in the Republican Party. You know, willie, we have been asking the question, a lot of people ask the question, how long will republicans say with donald trump, what can donald trump do to lose the support . I feel very comfortable in saying, this is what donald trump could do to lose the support. Attack bob mueller, then get rid of him. Donald trump will see his support on the hill evaporate. This is what he does, if hes up against something, he softens the target, he tries to undermine the person, but i agree with you, i think this is a ditch case. You saw the reaction when mueller was named special counsel across the board, republicans and democrats saying this guy is unimpeachable. Its not going to work in this case. It was smart to fire him. Even going after him, under mining his credibility is not a good strategy. Paul ryan said bob mueller should be able to continue this investigation. Donald trumps wife said let him do his job, if you are innocent, you will be vindicated. Which begs the question, why does this man keep freaking out . I mean, this is how a guilty person acts. Someone who is guilty doesnt freak out like there. If somebody were investigating me for colluding with russia in an investigation, i think investigate. Go ahead. Well, it could well be he keeps hearing rumors, rumors keep getting passed to him that mike flynn is getting closer and closer and closer to cutting an immunity deal. There is some talk she already talking to the fbi. Hes going quiet. You know whats interesting, donald trump has picked a fight with an institution. Every institution the Intelligence Community is, congress, the judicial community, the media, the Republican Party the Democratic Party. Everybody except russia he has picked a fight w. Its fascinating. By the way, german allies, our nato allies, british allies every single one. Except russia. He even picked a fight with china during the campaign. Hes picked a fight with every major player on the world stage and domestically except for Vladimir Putin and russia. What do you think is in the background there . We know, ill say it again, they can throw me off the air. Follow the money. There will be all kind of dirty dealings with russians with nefarious russians to keep his real estate business afloat. That is the end of this story. When they blew up the chicken man in philly. Bruce springsteen was sing about donald trump when he sang at atlantic city. Its bad for the country. This is unprecedented to have a president that behaves this way. Can anyone go back in history . You ask john means from yesterday. I tried. He went back to the floor. He stretched as best he could to nixon. Then we have to go outside the United States of america to find a biological. A parallel, i believe it was north korea. I cant wait to see what casey hunt waits to see what we have to say on air. Senate republicans rolled out their Health Care Bill yesterday. It took little time before they were met with internal resistance. Thats an inside voice saying what you said. No its not flu is want to be like greta. You can read books about how dictatorships happen, the development of very negative forces taking over. What you are seeing is either this happening right now or someone who is not well. Very few options. Very few options. I think its more like hogans heroes more than anything else. Its palpable. We have a Sergeant Schultz and we have a clink. Dont worry. Institution versus held worse every single time. Thats the damage. But the institutions have held t. Courts have pushed back hard. The congress has even pushed back hard and checked him. You can go down the line. Ill tell you, there is the one time i thought this is spinning out of control. Rod rosenstein, stepped in. At a vital moment in this countrys history and he stepped in, he said, you know what im being played. He is still making a mess in this country. Im being played for a fool. We will appoint somebody that can be independent. You got the man washington respects the most, bob mueller, the guy that got us through 9 11. So, yes, notice were all disturbed by everything that we see. But institutions are holding. You think rod has rental stuff in his office, like he rents the stuff by the week just so when he gets canned . Theres an executive at nbc who told me he never puts any pictures on the walls. Because he knows tv. So hes ready, hes ready any time and so i walked in one time and his kids, he put up had drawn, colored something. He stuck it up on the wall. I said, what about that . He goes, well, within they fire me, i can go like that. So now but i got to say, Rod Rosenstein played for a patsy against donald trump. Again, one more example of what donald trump doesnt understand. I dont know if you got the sense from people. People who have been disaster disturbed at the beginning. Now there is a calmness, this is the works t. Great thing about what weve watched over the past several months is, wow, those fellows around 1776 when they were kind of in that anteroom putting you know different pasties on the board, they kind of knew what they were doing. I dont think people are comfortable yet. Theyre worried about a lot of things they are doing. They are happy theyre getting help. This thing works we have here. You know. It does work, the institutions have held. I think whats been so shocking and jarring to most of us that have followed this our entire life and just assumed that the country would run in a certain way is so much of this country and the constitution depends on having a president that respects. Thank you. The tradition of this republic. That puts the country first. You know your comparison with Richard Nixon yesterday fell short in several ways. Richard nixon actually was a product of this country and the government. He fought in world war ii. He came home like all those other gis. He fought and the left didnt like him for it. He fought against the influence. He dead indicated himself. The man received more votes from americans than anybody else in American History you know what, when the Supreme Court, mike, you remember this very well. The Supreme Court said turn over the tapes and everybody froze and said, are we going to have a standoff here . Richard nixon. He understood when the Supreme Court says it, you do it. He turned over the tapes. Despite knowing it would destroy his presidency. Because he understood the importance of the constitution. Well, thats it. At the end of the day, he understood the importance of the office . He was a tragic he touric inyesterdayabi incredibly flawed figure. He had a certain respect for the government and the institution and the way it applies to the government. He turned over the tames, packed his bags and left. Still ahead on morning joe the masses against senates republicans. A concern about a Health Care Plan that cuts medicaid while others like senator rand paul are going to push for something that resembles an actual appeal of obamacare. Well have our interview with the Kentucky Republican in just a moment. You are watching morning joe. Well be right back. Security events every day. Ddos campaigns, ransomware, malware attacks. Actually, we just handled all the priority threats. You did that . We did that. Really. We analyzed millions of articles and reports. We can identify threats 50 faster. You can do that . We can do that. Then do that. Can we do that . We can do that. Can we do that . Were not professional athletes. But that doesnt mean were giving up. Im in this for me. For me. Along with diet and exercise, farxiga helps lower blood sugar in adults with type 2 diabetes. Lowering a1c by up to 1. 2 points. Do not take if allergic to farxiga. 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This is how i dress to get a mortgage. I just go to lendingtree. I calculate how much home i can afford. I get multiple offers to compare side by side. And the best part is. The banks come crawling to me. Everything you need to get a better mortgage. Clothing optional. Lendingtree, when banks compete, you win. Okay . Awkward. Whats the story behind Green Mountain coffee and fair trade . Lets take a flight to colombia. This is boris calvo. Boris grows mindblowing coffee. And because we pay him a fair price, he improves his farm and invest in his community to make even better coffee. All for a smoother tasting cup. Green mountain coffee. Joining us now from capitol hill, senator rand paul of kentucky. Good to have you on the show this morning. Thanks for having me. So senator, whats the likelihood you can be moved from the no column to the yes column . We had chris murphy last night saying at the end you wouldnt be a problem, you had caved into republicans. Well, you know, i want the bill to look more like a repeal bill. I didnt promise people i was going to replace it with a federal program or bailing out Insurance Companies. The fundamental flaw of obamacare was we said to people you can buy insurance after you are sick. And we also added regulations to insurance that increased the price of insurance such that Healthy People didnt want to buy it because it was too expensiv expensive. Those fundamental flaws still remain. The republican proposal is, okay, can you still buy insurance after you are sick, which led to the death spiral, led to the elevated premiums but were being to subsidize premiums by dumping a bunch of money into the Insurance Companies. My problem is, Insurance Companies already make 15 billion a year, i dont think the taxpayers should give them any money, so i really am opposed to the idea of giving Insurance Companies money and saying, will you lower your prices . I mean, we can do this for cars, few cars are expensive. We can have a new car stabilization fund. Yeah. I could use that. So let me ask you this, senator, and im going to pass it on to everybody else here. This is more of where we ought to be instead of a where we are or where we will be during this debate. But at what point do republicans or conservatives of all parties actually put together a bill that moves the Health Care System towards free markets . Because right now, the health care is extraordinarily expensive. We spend more money per patient in america on health care than any country on the planet. We dont get the results and, in large part, we dont get the results because the free market is kept outside the door of every hospital, of every doctors office, of every testing facility. Youre exactly right. I can summarize the Health Care Cost drama in one sentence if we dont address it. The one sentence is the reason capitalism doesnt work in health care is the consumer is disconnected from the product. Consumers do not make decisions based on price in health care except for a few exceptions. Lacics surgery, when you want to get surgery to get rid of glasses. Everybody asks a price. The average consumer calls four different doctors. Its a sophisticated Million Dollar laser. Yet the price was gone down by threequarter over 15 years. Contact lenses same way. When you conduct the consumer, the consumer cares about the price t. Consumer shops, competition works. Were not really doing that in health care. Most of healthcare has fixed prices. Medicare fixed prices. Medicaid fixed price also. And even private insurance, no consumer shops for price, theres a little bit of competition in what prices come forward, but fought really with the consumer involved. All right. Mike. Senator, i want to read a letter to you thats in the New York Times today written by a marter martin plaque from new york city, it reads, i would propose passing the Health Care Bill without amendment on the conditions all members of the house and senate be required to have Health Insurance as laid out by this plan and only by this plan for themselves, their wives, or husbands and their children. This would also apply to the president the Vice President and their families as well as all members of the cabinet and all federal employees. My question to you, sir, would you and your family sign up for the bill as proposed right now . Well, we currently have obamacare. Were mandated by law. Im not sure of the specifics of what will happen. My guess is this will be binding on us as well. No, i dont really want it because i want to be allowed to choose inexpensive insurance. In fact, one of the big replacement ideas i had was to legalize inexpensive insurance. But to get inexpensive insurance you have to repeal the regulations. Theres 12 regulations in obamacare. Were repealing two of them. We might be able to whittle the price down a little bit. I dont think prices will come down at all. You have to let people buy what they want. Theyre saying were giving waivers to states. What im hearing back is many states wont accept the waivers. On the left, they say, no, they will accept all the waivers, there will be no protection. From the right, im worried theyll accept no waivers and the price will be sky high to buy insurance. Senator rand palm, thank you. Coming up, chair of the Congressional Black Caucus Cedric Richmond. He says their concerns have fallen on deaf ears. He joins us live just ahead. [ music playing ] my business was built with passion. But i keep it growing by making every dollar count. Thats why i have the spark cash card from capital one. With it, i earn unlimited 2 cash back on all of my purchasing. 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For afib patients wellmanaged on warfarin, there is limited information on how xarelto® compares in reducing the risk of stroke. Dont stop taking xarelto® without talking to your doctor, as this may increase risk of stroke. While taking, you may bruise more easily, or take longer for bleeding to stop. It may increase your risk of bleeding if you take certain medicines. Xarelto® can cause serious, and in rare cases, fatal bleeding. Get help right away for unexpected bleeding, unusual bruising, or tingling. If youve had spinal anesthesia, watch for back pain or any nerve or musclerelated signs or symptoms. Do not take xarelto® if you have an artificial heart valve or abnormal bleeding. Tell your doctor before all planned medical or dental procedures. And before starting xarelto®about any conditions, such as kidney, liver, or bleeding problems. Its important to learn all you can. To help protect yourself from a stroke. Talk to your doctor about xarelto®. Theres more to know™. Welcome back to morning joe. 80s last month, german chancellor Angela Merkel suggested europe cannot rely on the United States anymore. Two weeks from today, germany will host the g20 summit in hamburg. Mr. Ambassador, good to have you are us today. A pleasure to be here. So on the eve of the next couple of weeks of the g20 summit, what is the state of the relationship, not just between germany and the United States, but between Angela Merkel and donald trump. She made that speech not that we cant go it alone, with you we cant rely on the United States like we have in the past. The two have a good working relationship. They have seen each other in washington. They are on the phone many, many times on all the international agenda. There are some disagreements with this administration, climate change, trade issues, but we have a strong relationship and the u. S. Is an allie of germany is of vital importance. So most important allie outside of europe, so we are mindful that we want to keep a very, very close relationship. What was your interpretation of that remark she made . She had said that before that you has europe has to rely on itself and take its fate in its own hands after brexit. But it was repeated in light of some of the disagreements that emerged in europe. And it was a reminder that europe has to play its own role also on the world stage. It was about brexit but also about donald trump . No, i think it was about you know the european transatlantic order. Europe has to do more on defense, has to look for itself, you know, when it comes to reforming the eu. We are about to do that with the new french president. We are embarking now on a new chapter of strengthening the european union. Mr. Ambassador, there are a lot of things going only in this country we talk about it a. Lot is very embarrassing. If i was at a dinner party if berlin, overall you cant make a blanket statement. As you talk to dozens and dozens of people, what is their perception of our president. We live it from win. One of the interesting thing any piece of news that emerges from here is sort of avidly consumed in germany. So the u. S. , everything that happens is page 1 material. In our country. And if europe. So the interest is intense. That testifys to that enormously important relationship between europe and i want to go back to the question. If i sat, once again, if i went to a dozener party with 20, 30 people the name donald trump came up. What would the reaction be . Its in the eye of the beholder i would say. I cannot say that trump is wildly popular in my country. There are, of course, supporters of him, but there are also many people who see him in a critical eye and, you know, the relationship with the u. S. Is also an issue now election campaign. So it is an important relationship and this, the presidency is for us an Important News step and a new chapter. We try to grapple with it. And this is underlining the importance of my job as an ambassador to explain to my fellow countrymen whats going on. So weve had an incredible acceleration and pace of events over the past couple of years. Youve had brexit with england, withdrawing from the continent. The election of macron you eluded to in france, the emergence of russia, putin trying to reestablish russia on the world stage as a major power. Germanys role seems to be more important, more critical to europe and to the world today than perhaps ever before. So Going Forward, you have elections coming up very quickly. What role will germany play in the world visavis the United States . Everybody used to wait for the United States to see what was going on. Do you get sense that thats no longer the case . Germanys role in the world Going Forward . We have an Important Role to play in europe. We are a mediumsize european power. Were not a world power. There i think we will lead together with france and together with our partners in europe to push forward new chapter in european union, strengthen it. And we are in a good moment, the momentum is good. Germany has a successful economy. We have a good run. So we are ready to lead in europe. We also are mindful of the world order. I mean, nato is an important issue for us, the g20 is upcoming and there the chancellor plays a role as host in hamburg. But i would not overstate our leadership roam. It cannot be a leadership role of a world power. We have medium size power. With regard to the german elections, is germany, to your knowledge, taking any defensive measures against potential Cyber Attacks . Yeah, we are. Ve have learn it is lesson from others. We are aware our Domestic Agency just said there is an increasing evidence of interference in our domestic scene. People are aware of it. Thats a good defense. We are also working on technical resilience cyber measures. And i think we are well positioned to combat those efforts to interfere in our political process emanating from russia. It is from russia the evidence you have . The evolution is always hard. You know, who does it . Is it private citizens or those organizations or something . But there is evidence that there is an increasing desire to meddle with our domestic politics. All right. Ambassador, thank you so much for your time. Good to talk to you. Still a pleasure. President trump says it would be quote sad day for republicans if nancy pelosi were to step down as minority leader. Thats ahead on morning joe. [ music playing ]. Times up, insufficient were on prenatal care. Es. And administrative paperwork. Your days of drowning people are numbered. Same goes for you, budget overruns. And rising costs, wipe that smile off your face. Were coming for you, too. For those who wont rest until the world is healthier, neither will we. Optum. How well gets done. 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Yeah first of all, i hope she doesnt step down. I think it will be a very, very sad day for republicans if she steps down. Id be very disappointed if she did. Id like to keep her right where she is, our record is extraordinary against her. They are right now obstructionist. All they want to do is try and obstruct. I think theyd do much better as a party if they got along with us, if they called us and said lets work on health care toke, lets work on tax cuts together and tax reform. Lets work on infrastructure together. We can do it together. I honestly think theyd do better at the polls. I think the American Public is tired of obstructionists. And i honestly believe that. And when i say that, boy, would the people love to see two parties getting together and coming up with the perfect Health Care Plan. There was a the president of the United States speaking this morning on fox news, in the early part of that comment he was talking of course about nancy pelosi, joining us from capitol hill, chairman of the black caucus democratic congressman Cedric Richmond of louisiana. Congressman, great to have you with us this morning. We have reports led by your colleague Kathleen Rice of new york, yesterday held at her office, discussing a possible change of leadership at the top of the Democratic Party. Reports are you attended that meeting. Is that true, number one . And number two, were you talking about change in leadership . I did attend that meeting. I think most of that meeting was a family discussion and as every good family discussion, you should keep most of it inhouse. Was the overarching theme of it all, was it called in the wake of the loss in georgia, john ossoff and south carolina, was the idea, should we make a clang in our party and do something differently . Well the theme of it was how do we get back to a majority so we can implement the policies that affect the people that we represent and how to make this country a more perfect union. How to provide more economic opportunity. How to lift incomes from where they are now. That was the gist of the conversation. Some people in there wanted to see a clang in leadership. Some wanted to talk about how do we get back to the majority. That was the gist of it . From where you are sitting, congressman, nancy pelosi doing an effective job as leader. I think and i we heard the comments by the president. I put Nancy Pelosis record up against Donald Trumps record any day. She ushered in the Affordable Care act, which provided health care to millions and millions of americans, 430,000 in louisiana through Medicaid Expansion. So she has a great body of work. I dont think we should ever let people forget that. So you support her remaining as leader . I think shes done a great job and her body of work speaks for itself. So she should stay then . We have to figure out a way to get back to the majority that is the most Crucial Point of where we are now. So she should stay as leader, congressman . I am chair of the National Black caucus. I will do what my member dictates. I think my membership has strong support for nancy pelosi. Donny deutsche. I like nancy pelosi, im a big fan, but the harsh reality of the Georgia Election is that the ads when they used her as a posterchild for lack of a better word of whats wrong with the Democratic Party worked, were some of the most effective ads. My concern would be and its not fair. I love your reaction to this, is that because shes been there, it would be like using Hillary Clinton at this point. She is an easy tool, an easy target to with one blanket say, oh, this is the old guard. This is whats wrong. That in and of itself, how do you overcome that where a fresh face does not give you the Opposition Party the ability to do that . Thats my concern. Its not fair. How do you overcome from that a branding point of view . Well, i think that you use that in the south. Im from the south. And i represent district in louisiana and i think that there are a number of things you can do in the south that are easy that doesnt make it right. Can you always have subtle hints of racism or sexism and other things and it will be effective to some extent. Unfortunately. So i dont think it makes it right. I think its the reality we live in. We have to do a better job as democrats of talking about what we believe in what we stands for and what our track record is. And i think that you also can anticipate what people use against you and take it off the table very early. So i think both races were incredibly difficult races to win. But we did. And we won it, too. We kind of expected to, so every loss hurts and we have to physical out how to go back and win. Hey, congressman, its our understanding that the that your caucus rejected the opportunity to go to the white house and meet with President Trump. Whats the reasoning behind that . Well, look, i attended inauguration on behalf of the Congressional Black Caucus. The executive board went to meet with the president. In fact, weve presented him with 130page document that outlined our priorities, our suggestions for minority communities, poor communities, Rural Communities all across america. Weve sent him eight different letters expressing concerns or suggestions. We have not had a response to the 130page policy doubt. We have not had a response to the eight letters weve sent. We have not had a response to the budget we submitted to him. The question becomes, why are we meeting . We have not had a response to anything yet. So the fact that it would be a substantive meeting, we just doubt it. Given the isolation of the white house and the isolation of any president , including this president , why not take the opportunity to go down to the white house and rattle the tea cups down there about just those issues . Well, we did that. And the commitment that was made in that meeting was that and we know the role of the president and we respect it. What we asked him was that he make cabinet secretaries available so we can meet with them to talk about our issues and other things. So we went to the white house. We respect the role of the president , even if the president doesnt respect that role, and we left him with a policy document and heres a copy of what we gave him. So we have yet to get a response to that. So our views havent changed. So few want to know what we stand for, our ideas, just go back and read the document that we left you with. To go down, 49 members of the Congressional Black Caucus to drive down to the white house to have a social gathering, because thats what it would be, just would not be productive. And my membership decided its not something they were interested in doing. Congressman, very quickly, update on congressman Scalise Health . I went to visit steve on tuesday, he was up. He was smiling and we were joking. I can tell you one thing that he realizes he is lucky to be alive and that he was praying very heavily during those moments to just see his family, his wife and his daughter and son again and it was a real moment and a precious moment to be able talk to him. Then we went back to our unusual bantering about the baseball game and the fact that they cant win without him. At least in his mind. So, so hes doing well and his spirits are up and of course everybody in louisiana and across the country are praying for him. Thats goods news, thank you very much for joining us. We appreciate it. This morning, flash flooding in still a major concern across parts of the country due to tropical depression cindy, heres bill karins, weatherman of the year to tell us about that. A oneman contest. The storm, itself, is going to wing itself out saturday afternoon. Right now, were getting the worst of the area over the memphis area and the arkansas an mississippi river, too. North of greenville. 30 Million People at risk of flash flooding today. You can see the track of the storm, watch out louisiana, lexington, cincinnati, charleston, pittsburgh included. Out west, we have this incredible heat weigh e wave, 49 people under heat watches or advisories from dallas forth worth, seattle is getting into the mix. Not today in the northwest. Over the weekend, portland, oregon hitting 100 degrees. 113 in phoenix a. Heat but the like 110. Saturday, Early Morning rain, could be heavy for a short period of time around new york city, southern new england. But that exits. Afternoon will be dry. Beautiful weather in the great lakes and ohio valley and a typical afternoon showers and storms. Heat building up in the west, 116 in phoenix. Theyve been under an excessive t heat warning for a week straight and that goes through the weekend. Theres that 92 in seattle on sunday. Thats pretty rarefied air. They dont get that hot all that often. Mike, once again, Tropical Storm is just about done and the weekend will improve. All right, bill. Thanks very much. We have some sad news to report this morning. Legendary and thats really what we mean here, legendary new york reporter Gabe Pressman has died. A new york icon and pioneering reporter, pressmans local broadcast career spanned six decades. Hes credited with being the First Television reporter in new york and called nbc 4 new york home for more than half a century. Pressman literally invented the craft of street reporting and went on to win numerous awards including 11 emmys for his peerless record of investigative reporting in politics and social issues. The legendary newsman also served in world war ii as a combat naval officer. The new york city native was 93 years old. Gabe pressman, news 4, new york. Isaac hou has mastered gravity defying moves to amaze his audience. Great show. Here you go. Now hes added a new routine. Making depositing a check seem so effortless. Easy to use chase technology, for whatever youre trying to master. Isaac, are you ready . Yeah. Chase. So you can. Looking for a hotel that fits. Your budget . Tripadvisor now searches over 200 sites to find you the hotel you want at the lowest price. Grazie, gino find a price that fits. Tripadvisor. When this guy got a flat tire in the middle of the night, so he got home safe. Yeah, my dad says our insurance doesnt have that. What . you can leave worry behind when liberty stands with you™. Liberty mutual insurance. So weve been talking for months now about joes performances at prohibition. Now, thanks to sony, he has an ep that is out today. Sony and red music. And you can download his first ep. Its five songs. He wrote them. Change the line. Last night he debuted at the cutting room. Wasnt it fun . It was incredible. It was incredible. I thought the white album changed my life. Notice the height of the hair. Yeah. Almost as good as the music. It actually you download this, you lp to this weekend, it actually reverses, i didnt know this happened stop, stop. Ben was very nice and all the kids in the room. Put a package together. Joes been writing songs for decades an heres now the story. Let me ask you this. Can conservatives rock . I dont know. Do we have any evidence of it . I dont consider myself a musician and i dont consider myself a singer. Im a songwriter. And a producer and arranger. But i learned how to play piano because my mom made me learn how to play piano. Then i learned how to play guitar because i wanted to play in a band. Then i learned how to play bass. Nobody wants to play bass. But i never sat there going, man, i got to really work on my craft as a xwi tguitarist or pi. Its not wa i care about. Its all about song writing. I, ive been looking inside and im mystified but what i see this is the most unrock star story ever and it has the worst beginning for anybody that wants to be a rock star. I turned 50. I was thinking i need to get these so long as down before i die. So i started recording songs and at the end of the year, my friends and alooked back and we recorded 50 songs. So what i decided to do was lets do something that i never did. Lets Start Playing live. Lets play these sons live. Lets see what works, see what doesnt work. Still i believe and it started working. Lets fall in love personal question. Yes. You ever written a song about Mika Brzezinski . Yeah, i have, actually. Ive never really written personal love songs. I just never did. I wrote it and i called her up and said, hey, you know, were going to play were going out and playing tonight. This is the first time the bands going to play. It would be great if you could come out and play. And so we were, like, clashing. I said you really need to come out. And she was like, no, no. Say youre sorry. So after that, i called her up and said, okay, mika, listen. I wrote a song for you. Im not going to brag oh, what the hell look at me beg baby, please oh, baby, please but it worked. And thats also me sort of making fun of myself. Oh, what the hell, look at me beg. Okay. So. The four songs other than mystified. Im going to put out an ep every month. Im going to put out five this month and four the next and four the next and im going to keep going over three or four years, put out 200 songs because its the most important thing in my life. Outside of my kids and my family, my songs are the most important thing in my life. Never once, even when i won like 80 of the vote did i go, yay, this is this validates who i am. I never thought that. I just thought, okay, well, i ran, i won, now i have to go to washington. This is the core of who i am and so ive just got to see it through because the most joy i ever got in my life outside of my family sl listening to music. And theres not a close second. Hey, there. Im stephanie ruhle. This morning, lets make a deal. At least four republicans say they will not vote for their partys Health Care Bill. And even more are firmly undecided. I can not support a bill that is going to result in tens of millions of people losing their Health Insurance. President trump throws his weight behind the bill. Can they actually get the votes . Also four good guys. I think theyll probably get there. Plus the art of the bluff. President trump comes clean. There are no tapes as he takes a new shot at the special counsel. Very good friends with comey, which is very bothersome. We have so much to go through. We begin with the fight within the Republican Party to get to
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