just saying outrageous or incindiary things will get you a lot of kudos and drive your numbers up but it is not going to win us the white house and the respect of people on either side of the aisle that we have to bring together to overcome the extraordinary challenges we have. look, i think this president has been an extraordinary failure. i think this president has taken on a job way over his head. but i don't think he is an evil or bad person. i just think he is an uninformed, inexperienced person that doesn't know what it takes to get an economy to work. >> good morning. it's tuesday, december 13th. >> good morning. >> welcome to "morning joe." with us onset we have msnbc contributor mike barnicle. "time" magazine's senior political analyst mark halperin and the managing editor of "fortune" magazine. very good group this morning. how are we doing? >> doing okay. >> ducky. >> so, all right. we're a little -- yeah. >> so, interesting things happening with td polls. >> yeah. >> a little slippage on gingrich's part. >> a little slippage. >> and the right strikes back. it's nice to not be alone out there. some other people now are really starting to go after him. and, also, you're looking at what is pretty fascinating stuff. a tumultuous year for this economy and, yet, some stocks did very well. andy is here to tell us exactly who did the best. do you think next year is going to be okay? >> it's going to be okay. how good is okay? >> i don't know. >> how good does it have to be to hit okay? we'll muddle through. >> okay these days, 2% growth is okay. 3% is really good. >> we'll be okay. that's about it. >> okay. >> okay. what's happening? you've been up to new hampshire. you're hanging with the kids on the street corners. >> i was. spent the day there yesterday. >> singing du-op. what are they telling you in between songs? >> it's very unsettled. the voting is in three weeks but it feels more like we're a couple months out. and yet we have a big engagement between romney and gingrich yesterday. i think either of them could win iowa and either of them could win new hampshire and that's exciting. >> that is exciting. you know, ron paul staying steady in polls, and, mike barnicle, if newt gingrich were self-aware, that's sort of like saying if we could actually mine rocks on the moon -- >> that's not something that is going to happen. >> if newt gingrich were self-aware, he would realize that he darted to the lead about three weeks early. it's kind of like when you -- you're a cleveland browns fan of the 1990s and you went ahead in the playoffs with a minute left. >> yeah. >> and you had to give the ball back, you should have taken the lead about 45 seconds -- i think we'll see a drip, drip, drip of support away from gingrich, not necessarily all towards romney but back towards michele bachmann and rick santorum and some of the other conservative candidates and of course ron paul. >> i don't know where it's going to -- where that support is going to go. i agree he may have peaked three weeks too early. i think the largest story anecdotally, pick it up, and mark alluded to it, is the amount of indecision there is out there among primary voters. they just -- you ask them, you know, who are you going to go for? i kind of like gingrich or i kind of like romney but they don't nail it down. nobody is saying, i love this guy. either one. gingrich or romney. that's kind of interesting. >> gingrich has got to figure out the expectations game a little bit because he has such big leads in polls over the last few days that if he ends up winning some of these narrowly it may not give him the decisive blow against romney that he needs. he still needs to win quick. winning a long contest can be very hard. >> so we were talking, mika, with a romney supporter the other night. somebody pretty high up in the organization. and they said something that if they'd said it on air we would have laughed at them but i actually believe it that if romney -- a big if -- can turn things around, what has happened over the past two weeks would be the best thing that could ever have happened to him because expectations have crashed for mitt romney. they crashed in iowa. they've crashed in new hampshire, south carolina, and florida. across the country. if newt comes down to earth, which he will, and mitt creeps up a little bit, the expectations are pretty darned good. >> one thing that's different between them that could complicate things and i mean this in all seriousness. >> okay. >> i do. >> okay. >> is that newt has -- he loves himself a lot. >> he does. >> that does help. >> he really -- it is -- i have never seen anything like it. he is the most unself-aware i have ever seen on the political scene ever. ever. >> that's saying a lot considering who she sits next to. >> considering we're talking about politics. >> yeah. >> and who i sit next to. >> well, he is a student of history. >> no, it's amazing. his self-adulation. it's what it takes at times. >> churchill and de gaulle. you name it. >> not necessarily a criticism. it could be effective. following a number of polls showing newt gingrich opening up a wide margin in iowa two new surveys are out this morning that indicate his lead could be starting to slip. the american research group is out with a new poll showing gingrich now with a five-point lead over ron paul and mitt romney. that's nearly within the poll's margin of error. while the university of iowa survey of likely caucus goers shows gingrich with a ten-point lead over romney an adviser to the poll says the results show gingrich's support may be starting to slide as it has with previous front-runners. the poll adviser says gingrich has minimal staff and grass roots organization in iowa and may be unable to turn out as many supporters as other candidates did, will on january 3rd. and there was that issue. >> you look, mark, at this poll, a ten-point gingrich lead. the other poll shows a five-point gingrich lead. and in iowa and you say that some of the romney people get a sense that some of the numbers may be slipping again just like they did with herman cain and just like they did with rick perry and michele bachmann and with every front-runner. >> one of my favorite concepts in politics is natural hyping. at the end of the race people with big poll leads generally -- gingrich isn't going to win florida by 35 points no matter what happens. so we're seeing that tightening now. it is an expectations game. it doesn't make any sense but you can point to examples. bob dole won the iowa caucuses in 1996, crippled him by going into new hampshire. he won by a narrower margin. on caucus night the entrance poll tightened and it made it look like he was losing the lead. this could help him because if it's tighter and he ends up winning a win will be a win. >> andy, there are laws of politics like there are laws of physi physics. and until somebody breaks those laws, then i'm going to keep believing the laws. and in iowa and new hampshire these early states you have to organize. newt hasn't organized. he hasn't spent a lot of time in new hampshire, in iowa. i just -- on caucus night i think it's going to be very tight. >> one thing i thought was very interesting, i saw a poll in new hampshire that indicated even as newt was coming up, because this was in late november, he didn't run as strongly against obama as mitt romney did. and, you know, that's a pretty critical issue. in other words, ultimately you're going to be running against the big guy. >> right. >> if you don't have faith you can beat the big guy, that really undermines your candidacy and that could come back to haunt him. people really think that mitt is more presidential than newt gingrich is, which i can see them thinking. then what are they going to really think when push comes to shove on that election night? >> all right. some interesting things were happening pertaining to this. within hours of those new poll numbers several conservative figures from the right began striking back against gingrich. among them executive editor of "the weekly standard" fred barnes who expresses concern at the former speaker's new line of attack on mitt romney. newt gingrich has adopted an antifree market argument, a favorite of the political left, to criticize mitt romney. gingrich accused his rival of making money by bankrupting companies and laying off employees in his years at bain capital but bain capital was engaged in the rough and tumble of free market capitalism, thus gingrich's criticism, coming from a conservative, was surprising. his attack echoes the criticism of romney by the late senator ted kennedy in 1994. romney ran against kennedy when the senator sought re-election in '94. kennedy won, aided by brutal, unfair tv ads, criticizing romney for killing jobs. >> well, fred barnes, who was one of the conservatives that actually defended gingrich last week when others were starting to come out, fred barnes uncovers a sad truth about newt gingrich, which is he will say whatever he has to say at the time something has to be said to make a point, to take a cheap shot. and here he did sound like ted kennedy, just like he sounded like ted kennedy when he called paul ryan a right wing radical, just like he sounded like barack obama when he supported the $7 trillion medicare drug benefit scheme. i mean, newt is -- when conservatives lash out at those who are critical of newt gingrich, it is farce because he is not a conservative. he's never been a conservative. and here he is actually criticizing mitt romney for being a free market capitalist. >> well, there is so much to say. look, at the same time, romney is criticizing gingrich for wanting to eliminate capital gains taxes on everyone including the wealthy. so romney has done the same thing. he's attacked from the populist economic left on gingrich. it's a principal distinction for romney and for gingrich, too. this is a weakness romney has in the general election and with a lot of populist republicans, a lot of tea party republicans, they don't like the fact that -- they don't like the fact, the way mitt romney made money. it's not a crazy political argument and, substantively, there is some sense to it. >> mark barnicle, it is one of the things that even democratic ceos going to the white house are offended by. it's a fact that barack obama has no idea how the free market works. sometimes when he turns and looks at them and says why can't you just hire people? can you go out and hire people? no. mitt romney started something at bain capital where he looked at companies that weren't going to survive, staples was one of them, and he said okay. how do we make these companies stronger? you know how he did it? not by government mandate. by saying how will this company be stronger in the free market so we can prosper and hire more people down the road? should newt and the president get together and talk economics? >> romney and a guy by the name of tom stemberg created staples. the interesting thing about the reference to ted kennedy in 1994 campaign is the point of vulnerability of romney's candidacy in 1994 is exposed in one particular tv ad by a company that bain bought in ohio and closed in indiana -- i knew it was the midwest someplace -- remains the same point of vulnerability for romney today. >> he better get used to it if he is the candidate in the general election. >> and, by the way, guess what. the way you answer that, the way you answer that attack is by saying damn right i did. you know why i did? i did it not so those people would be laid off and thrown out in the streets in midwestern towns but because we wanted to build companies that would go. they were going to be fired sooner or later. those companies were going down. they would close. so whether they were out on the street, the day that i put them on the street or six months later, they would have been out of work. instead, i created companies that grew, that could rehire them and could be around to hire their children, that could grow those communities. >> you might be able to win that argument on a debate exchange and you might be able to win it silver tongd devil against mitt romney, against newt gingrich in iowa and south carolina. but i think that fight in south carolina and iowa, given the unemployment rate, i'm not sure gingrich couldn't win that argument in a republican primary. >> mitt romney better -- >> he better be able -- >> mitt romney is a slow learner, mika, on a lot of issues. he better figure this one out and he better, instead of backing away from it, charge in full steam and defend capitalism. >> one second. one second. >> defend capitalism, defend the free market, defend what he did at bain capital as actually something that created staples. i mean, can you imagine how many people staples has employed and how many of these other companies he created have employed? >> well, i think romney is getting it. i think he is. i've got two stories for you. one which is a gimmick, this radio host offering the money. but romney asking for the money back. you want michael savage? >> yes. >> conservative radio host michael savage posted on his website last night newt gingrich is unelectable. mitt romney is the only candidate with a chance of defeating obama and there is nothing more important than for that to happen for the health, safety, and security of the united states. therefore i am offering newt gingrich $1 million to drop out of the presidential race. that's a good gimmick. >> gingrich will take money. >> yeah. >> maybe a million three. >> he had a million three from -- >> i want to get -- somebody has done something really good and effective and i think it'll define the two. >> wait a second. >> fine. you do it. i won't. >> glenn beck last week had newt on and he asked newt the type of questions that conservatives need answers to. then yesterday glenn beck said something that i guarantee you a lot of small government conservatives, like me, have thought. and that is, if i have to choose between barack obama and newt gingrich, a guy that george will said would have been a marvelous marxist and who is the opposite of being a small government conservative, if ron paul is running as a third-party candidate i'm going to give him a long look because i can't vote for the two guys who worship at the altar of big government in their own separate ways. and that's the problem with the newt gingrich candidacy. he is not a small government conservative. >> if you give wind to ron paul, that would just be all she wrote. >> yeah. i think ron paul with newt gingrich out there would get five, ten, 15% and that would re-elect barack obama. newt gingrich re-elects barack obama under any scenario. >> okay. so here is how romney is pushing back against gingrich, suggesting the former house speaker should return the $1.6 million his firm was paid for advising mortgage giant freddie mac. i like this. this should be effective. you have to explain to me why it wouldn't be. but gingrich was just as aggressive in his response. here we go again. slamming romney's career at venture capital firm bing capital while taking a shot at his debate wager this past weekend. >> i would just say that if governor romney would like to give back all the money he's earned from bankrupting and laying off employees over his years at beginning then i'll bet you $10 not $2,000 that he won't take the offer. >> by the way -- >> i like what i said before. >> newt gingrich said all the companies that mitt romney bankrupted as if men and governments bankrupt companies instead of markets bankrupting companies. if those companies were making a lot of money, then mitt romney would have said, you know what i'm going to do with those companies? i'm going to keep them in our stable because we'll make money. but newt gingrich believes that men bankrupt companies instead of free market. >> when he feels like it. but we brought up ron paul. you, though, want to go back to somebody else who you believe may run as an independent. >> i think if newt gingrich is the nominee, i think, you know, you'd think if you were a republican you'd be upset like michael savage and newt gingrich would lose the presidency. but with mitt romney you'll get a strong, centrist candidate in the race someone like michael bloomberg who will say in this field of gingrich, paul, obama, i can win, and that's all bloomberg has wanted all along, a chance to win. >> one of the more interesting dynamics of this republican primary, the longer it goes on and the closer it gets, at least interesting to me, is mitt romney is a very nice guy. whether he can summon the fire from within to really throw a punch at gingrich or any other opponent who is coming closer or exceeding i find it interesting. so far he hasn't and i don't know whether he is capable. >> i think he will. >> one of the problems is when i come on here and i start talking about free markets, or fighting mika who wants to raise taxes every day. >> well just on millionaires. >> i consciously and i get serious here, i have to work to maintain my cool, because i get so ticked off when people support things that i believe have failed for a hundred years. but mitt romney, when mitt romney loses his cool, it seems like he's got to go the opposite direction. he's got to conjure up those feelings. he should naturally be angry at newt gingrich for not only misrepresenting his record but being so ignorant when it comes to the power of free markets. >> he likes people and he sees the good in people. which is a great trait. >> does he have the passion? >> with all due respect does he have the passion? >> i don't think we search as strenuously always to find the good in people as mitt romney does. mitt romney is a seeker of goodness. >> i'm not a -- let's just stop here. >> he is a seeker of goodness. >> you are in your spare time. >> wait. >> seriously. >> he's saying i'm not a nice person. >> yeah. you are a nice person. >> i hold no grudges. >> all of us have this trait of we like to look for the good in people. romney more than almost anyone i know in politics really does try to find the good in other people. >> you know, there is an intensity to that. >> you can find the good in other people and still fight for free market, still fight for less taxes, still fight for balanced budgets and still call out people like newt gingrich who don't understand free markets, who sound like ted kennedy on the campaign trail, who support $7 trillion drug benefit plans. i mean, who is not a conservative at the end of the day. it drives me crazy looking at these republicans. it drives me crazy. >> he actually brings out the best in people, which is a different characteristic. maybe just by contrast. i have just noticed that for two days in a row now you're dressed like a human. you look good. >> you look nice. >> thank you. >> can you answer a question? my brother-in-law e-mailed and asked a couple nights ago about bart going into the starting rotation. is that going to happen? >> they'll take a look at him as a starter, yeah. >> but doesn't that blow a hole in the bull pen? >> are you kidding? we have bobby jenks. >> okay. >> coming up we'll bring in democratic senator debby stabenow and senator mike lee. also former campaign manager steve schmidt will be here and "the washington post" eugene robinson. next politico's top stories of the morning. first, let's go to bill karins with a check on the forecast. >> mika, i fully agree with mark. joe is definitely the darth vader of the show. >> oh, no. >> not what i said. >> fully agree. >> i disagree. i think that's funny coming from you. >> and kept away and locked away. yes. you can find good in me i guess. good morning, everyone. we are looking at temperatures that are very chilly out there especially in northern new england. bundle the kids up and your