Manager, jim messina and former rnc spokesperson tim miller. Plus, our friend Andrew Weissmann joins me to dig into what the former president could do with the Justice Department if he wins back the white house. Also today, a oneonone conversation with the u. S. Surgeon general. Doctor vivek murthy thieves here to discuss loneliness, social media, and Mental Health around the holidays. And later, the Exit Interview. Congresswoman anna eshoo as she was leaving congress after more than three decades. I will ask her what she learned and what concerns are most about what comes next. So it is the Holiday Season, the time for reflection, the chance to take stock of the year that is coming to a close, into really put this moment into perspective, and one of the things im thinking about right now, roughly ten months out from what might be the most consequential election of our lifetime is how every poll, and even every election, is really a reflection of a moment in time. Let me explain what i mean by that. If voters were to head to the polls tomorrow to vote in the 2024 general election, then the issues that would be front and center would be things like a lack of enthusiasm among young voters for President Biden, and fears among democrats that people wont show up to the polls. The domestic impact of the war raging between israel and hamas. The threat of a second trump term to Abortion Rights, to democracy, to the rule of law. The fact that most americans feel the economy is getting worse, even as its actually getting better, and despite what the data tells them, or the teflon like nature of donald trump, who is yet to be scarred by any of the ones against him. Like when the state Supreme Court through his Ballot Eligibility in the question, raising big constitutional questions that have never been asked or answered before, and yet his allies and rivals alike still largely rushed to his defense. But voters will of course not head to the polls tomorrow, it is christmas. They will in ten months, and ten months is a long time from now. Remember, back in the 2008 election, the iraq War International security dominate the headlines for months, then the Stock Market Crashed, and the economy was far and away the most driving issue that fall. I mean, examples show that it dominated voters concerns at historic levels. And let me tell, you i was working on the Obama Campaign for the whole time. The prediction, that never would have been the prediction ten months in advance. For all of that in 2020, when covid 19 completely upended the president ial election. Ten months out, they had yet to be a single diagnosed case in the United States. So previous elections have certainly taught us that there can be issues that were not at all on the radar that became dominant on election day. Issues the bubble up late and change the course of history. So as we have a brief pause now for the holidays, it is worth taking a moment to consider, what issues are people not talking about, or they havent even happened yet . They could win the electorate as we look ahead to the next ten months . Joining me now are the Perfect People to answer that exact question. Jim marceno is the Campaign Manager for Barack Obamas 2012 election campaign, and tim miller is the editor at large for the bulwark and former Communications Director for jeb bush 2016 campaign. So jim, about you both Down Memory Lane there little bit, but you have both a lot of president ial works in campaigns and i want to start with you. I, mean obama, you are the manager of obamas reelection campaign. What is on your mind right now that democrats are not talking about that they should be. Let me start there. Yeah, thanks jen. This is a nice psychological session to talk about all of those things. And they shouldnt be, but there things that really concern, me and the biggest thing is the possibility of a third party. These thirdparty ballots, jen, you know these numbers. We win arizona by 11,000 votes, we win georgia by 10,000 votes in the midwest states, they were super close, and we just cannot peel off voters in these numbers. Some of the numbers are really scary, and i think people flirting with thirdparty ballots dont understand that they are playing exactly into Donald Trumps hands here. That is one of the things that keeps me up at night. You know it doesnt keep me up at night, jen . The polls. If you are my mom or my motherinlaw calling me every day about the polls, you know, everyone need to take a deep breath and realize that joe biden has led or been tied in 15 recent national polls, including leading in ten of them. So you and i at the biggest believers that pulling this far out does not matter at all, its lets worry about things that we can actually control like third party ballot access. Yeah, thats a good one, and predictions are so addictive, but its all about a moment time. So tim, let me bring the same questions to you. What should people be talking about more that they arent and what should they be freaking out about less . And were not going to have a Stock Market Crash or a pandemic going down the pike. I want a little dark there, but its important to remember. Think about the bad things that are going to happen freaking out a little bit there. Look, you mentioned some of the young voters. I think that this is over baked right now. I think theres plenty to worry about, particularly if you care deeply about the region, theres a lot of tragedy happened and israel and gaza right now, but the idea that this is going to be top of mind issue next november, i think is really quite unlikely, and i think that a lot of these young voters have not even really engage about what Donald Trumps policies look like. There i think i agree with jim. A Third Party Candidate running on some antiwar platform directly appeals to young voters is more concerning to if there is a twoway. I will put my hat on as a former republican, the growth of people and thinking a lot about. I think theyre a lot of conversations right now about whether nikki haley can make a surge in new hampshire, and whether republican primary can be up ended. I think thats not going to happen. The republican primary is over, but i do think that one thing that people arent talking about is that i dont think theres any reason that nikki haley is going to do the right thing and a post on trump next year, but some of the people to vote for them in this primary very well might, and what could democrats do, look at the Biden Campaign do to try to pull off maybe 20 of the people that pulled out from nikki haley in the next few months . Those are gettable voters, and a lot of folks arent thinking about that because theyre thinking about them in the context of the republican primary right now. So maybe the halle vote, let me take what time just said right there, and for you jim messina, your big advocate for President Biden being reelected for the campaign, but what is the one thing, this is all a game, not again, but a former therapy for you and not so much politics and what do you think they were doing in january . Was it going after that haley vote . Is it Something Else . Its going straight donald trump and driving the change, driving the message, driving the contrast between candidates. Jim, you and i went through this in 2012. Rock obama had to talk about his record and say, this is what i have done. Thats exactly what joe biden is doing. We were behind in the polls the whole time until we drove a contrast with mitt romney. The minute that we drove that contrast, we started moving in the polls. And so my beginning of the year which is a straight contrast between donald trump and joe biden. Tim is really right about one thing. Joe biden is going to be the nominee, and voters havent figure that out yet, but that oh, we want different candidates. We are where we are, and were going to do straight biden versus trump ballot, and the more the Biden Campaign can drive, that the better their poll numbers will be. So tim, you and i have talked before on the show, on your podcast, that your frustration the democrats dont seem to sing off of the same song sheet. Jim messina and i can tell you that its a big umbrella party, thats not always how it works. But is that the thing you wish democrats were doing more, and if so, what do you think as somebody who has worked in republican politics for so long. Is the effective message that you would like to hear them to kind of win over some of those swing voters or moderate republicans who arent going to support trump . I would like to see somebody out there banging the hammer. Maybe messina can do it. I think thats not his nature. Thats why we like joe biden, that is why he was elected, because he was going to unite the country. He could do somebody out there driving this contrast for him, that is one thing id like to see from the democrats next year. And i discussed the haley vote. I think that this is one, how can we bring some of these new Ex Republicans off the sidelines. Im kind of burned, here but can we win over mike pence may be to not vote, not vote for trump . Or Chris Christie . Who can be recruited to be a surrogate from that world. And i also think that reaching out to the blue collar obama trump voters, this gets lost a lot of time in the conversation. I think you can feel some of those pokes back on the abortion issue. Whenever people talk about abortion, its always about women and young voters. It could also work with some of these noncollege men that are not ready to be dads, yet and i think that really trying to drive that message and trumps margin down there is another thing i like to see how democrats next year. And just peeling off of that, and again far away, but what would be the biggest driver to help President Biden. Do you still think it is abortion and Abortion Rights . As a democracy, is it a combination . Is it Something Else . I think its abortion, and the voters that time was just talking about, i am obsessed with these obama trump voters, and when you look at how to peel them off, especially in the three midwestern states, it really is abortion. It really is for the first time in modern memory, the Republican Party is taking away a fundamental right from voters, in the palpable anger about that, i think people like Gretchen Whitmer have had amazing messages about this, tying the economy to this issue as well. Its not just about abortion. It is an economic choice, and i think driving that in the midwest would be the one thing that we have got to do, because i think if you look at both women in swing voters in these younger man, who i take it splitting, they both are movable on this issue. So tim, that is interesting, and Gretchen Whitmer also talks about it on a personal level, which i think is such a good lesson in the Kate Cox Story as well. So tim, we just saw this ruling in colorado this week disqualifying trump in the ballot in the state. But theres going to be of course a lot of focus on what the courts will do, but just on the politics, you are not a lawyer that i am tracking. But how do you think this affects trump in the long run . They are already trying to with this up. What do you think the best kind of argument is for the Biden Campaign, for their efforts to with this up on the trump side. The Everything Lights Trump narrative, i think in the shortterm, it clearly does help him in the primary. This rallying around the orange man defense that happens among the republican base, but the primary is already over in my estimation, and side of that matters that much. But what about the swing herbs that weve been talking about . How can democrats and how can never trumpers and how can we reach these voters and make the case to them that, okay, whatever you think about a ruling in the colorado Supreme Court, do we really want india to be president s been indicted in four different or stations that might be disqualified because he attempted insurrection . I mean we talked about january six, we talk about the stuff every day here. A lot of the swing voters havent been thinking about january six this much, and so i think that trying to peel off an additional percentage, a lot of these folks already moved, but it in additional percent of the College Educated swing vote by talking about this issue is meaningful. Jim messina, tim miller, u. S. Given up a lot to think about, jamal over during the Holiday Season. Maybe some direction for next year. I think you both so much for joining me this afternoon. And coming up next, new concerns about trumps plan if he takes back the white house. Andrew weissmann joins me to talk about what he could do with the Justice Department specifically. Trump that is. We are back after a quick break. Longacting Hiv Treatment you can get every other month. Its two injections from a healthcare provider. Now when i have people over, hiv pills arent on my mind. Dont receive cabenuva if youre allergic to its ingredients, or if youre taking certain medicines, which may interact with cabenuva. Serious side effects include allergic reactions, postinjection reactions, Liver Problems, and depression. If you have a rash and other allergic reaction symptoms, stop cabenuva and get medical help right away. Tell your doctor if you have Liver Problems or Mental Health concerns, and if you are pregnant, breastfeeding, or considering pregnancy. Some of the most common side effects include injectionsite reactions, fever, and tiredness. If you switch to cabenuva, attend all treatment appointments. It feels good to just live in the moment. 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By now, youre probably visionworks. See the difference. Pretty familiar with the numerous critical cases facing donald trump, and we will continue following all of them. But what is also important to follow is what donald trump plans to do if he takes back the white house. Trump has vowed to use the Justice Department to quote, go after joe biden, and basically anyone else who he perceives as a political enemy. And its not just rhetoric. There are plans being made right now to carry out trumps wishes. Project 2025 is a group of rightwing think tanks that have gathered together to draft Executive Orders that trump would sign immediately after taking office. Among them, invoking the insurrection act, which would authorize him to deploy the military to essentially serve as Long Parliament and put down any protest against him. Its pretty chilling stuff. When you consider a trump doj would essentially be used to enforce the dictatorial rhetoric were hearing from him more and more on the campaign trail. Joining me now is Andrew Weissmann, hes the former General Counsel of the fbi and a Senior Member of special counsel Robert Muellers team. You are also special. Andrew, thank you so much for joining me. [laughter] i think it is so important for people to think about how this would actually work, because you hear so much rhetoric, but you worked in the Department Of Justice. Youre very familiar with what can happen there. So when we envision trump being back in the white house, which i know its hard to put our minds there, but for a moment, how exactly could he direct the doj to go after people he perceives to be his enemies. This is such an important topic for people to really focus on what is going to happen, not what could happen, but what is going to happen. And the way that i look at it is lets look at what he did when he was the president. So first, if you are thinking that they are going to be investigations into corruption within his administration, that is a nonstarter. Why . Because he is not going to be ap